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John Woodyard 1 1 IN THE COMMONWEALTH COURT OF PENNSYLVANIA 2 PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF NO. 284 M.D. 1990 GENERAL SERVICES, 3 PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, PENNSYLVANIA 4 PUBLIC UTILITY COMMISSION PENNSYLVANIA EMERGENCY, opv '' ^ I if 5 MANAGEMENT AGENCY AND PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF 6 STATE Plaintiffs 7 vs . 8 UNITED STATES MINERAL 9 PRODUCTS COMPANY, CERTAINTEED CORPORATION 10 COURTAULDS AEROSPACE, INC. CHEMREX, INC., PHILIPS 11 ELECTRONICS NORTH AMERICA CORPORATION, ADVANCE 12 TRANSFORMER COMPANY & MONSANTO COMPANY, 13 Defendants 14 *** 15 w Monday, January ^4), 2000 16 *** 17 18 19 20 21 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES 22 15th Floor 1880 John F. Kennedy Boulevard 23 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 (215) 988-9191 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060298 John Woodyard 2 1 *** 2 3 Oral deposition of JOHN P. WOODYARD, 4 P.E., taken pursuant to notice, held at the Offices 5 of White and Williams, One Liberty Place, 1650 6 Market Street, 18th Floor, Philadelphia, 7 Pennsylvania 19103, beginning at 10:00 a.m., on the 8 above date, before Deborah L. Reyers ,. a 9 Professional Reporter, Commissioner of Deeds, in 10 and for the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania. 11 12 13 APPEARANCES : 14 HUMPHREY, FARRINGTON & MC CLAIN, P.C. 15 BY: KENNETH B. MC CLAIN, ESQUIRE JAMES A. ZIEGLAR, ESQUIRE 16 221 West Lexington, Suite 400 Independence, MI 64051 17 (816) 836-5050 Representing the Plaintiffs 18 THOMAS W. HENDERSON, ESQUIRE 19 Suite 3975, One Oxford Circle 301 Grant Avenue 20 Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania 15219 Representing the Plaintiffs 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060299 John Woodyard 3 1 APPEARANCE S (Continued.) 2 WHITE AND WILLIAMS 3 BY: THOMAS M. GOUTMAN, ESQUIRE One Liberty Place, 18th Floor 4 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19102 (215) 864-7000 5 Attorneys for Defendant Monsanto Corporation 6 MONTGOMERY, MC CRACKEN, WALKER & RHOADS, LLP 7 BY: DAVID D. LANGFITT, ESQUIRE 123 South Broad Street 8 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19109 (215) 772-7452 9 Attorneys for Defendant Courtaulds Aerospace, Inc. 10 DANAHER, TEDFORD, LAGNESE & NEAL 11 BY: KENNETH R. NEAL, ESQUIRE 700 Capitol Place 12 21 Oak Street Hartford, CT 06106 13 Attorneys for Defendant U.S. Mineral Products 14 HOYLE, MORRIS & KERR 15 BY: SUSAN HERSCHEL, ESQUIRE 1650 Market Stret, Suite 4900 16 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19103 (215) 981-9700 17 Attorneys for Defendant Certainteed Corporation 18 19 20 ALSO PRESENT: Timothy Peck, Esquire 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060300 John Woodyard 4 1 INDEX 2 Testimony of: JOHN P. WOODYARD, P.E. 3 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7, 164 4 BY MR. NEAL: 144 5 6 7 8 EXHIBITS 9 EXHIBIT NUMBER DESCRIPTION PAGE MARKE D 10 Woodyard 1 G-B Duct Literature 38 11 Bates Stamped CT-00078 12 through CT-00083 13 Woodyard 2 Fabrication Instructions 38 14 for Rectangular Duct 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060301 John Woodyard 5 1 DEPOSITION SUPPORT INDEX 2 3 Direction to Witness Not to Answer 4 Page Line Page Line Page Line 5 NONE 6 7 8 Request for Production of Documents 9 Page Line Page Line Page Line 10 NONE 11 12 Stipulations 13 Page Line Page Line Page Line 14 6 15 Question Marked 16 Page Line Page Line Page Line 17 NONE 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060302 John Woodyard 6 1 MR. GOUTMAN: For the r ecor d , 2 David Langfitt, couns el f or the Cou rtaulds 3 called and is on his way . Give n th e 4 weather conditions, I thi nk we shou Id 5 proceed since we all migh t want to ge t 6 home earlier, rather than later 7 (Whereupon a disc us sion was held 8 off the record.) 9 *** 10 THE COURT REPORTER: Usual 11 at ion s? 12 MS . HERSCHEL: Yes, read and sign 13 MR . GOUTMAN: Read and sign. 14 MR . MC CLAIN: That means he' s 15 going to have to read and sign b efore he 16 takes the stand, so ma ybe that's tomorrow, 17 maybe that's the next day . 18 * * 19 (It is hereby stipulated by and 20 among counsel for the respective parties 2 1 that sealing, filing and certification are 22 waived; and that all objections, except as 23 to the form of the question, are reserved 24 until the time of trial.) ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060303 John Woodyard 7 1 kkk 2 JOHN P. WOODYARD, P.E., after 3 having been duly sworn according to law, 4 was examined and testified as follows: 5 kkk 6 EXAMINATION 7 kkk 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. Mr. Woodyard, my name is Ken Me Clain. 10 And we've seen each other in the Court before. 11 I'm here to take your deposition on this 12 supplemental report that you prepared on December 13 7th of 1999. 14 Do you have a copy of that with 15 you ? 16 A. Yes, I do. 17 Q. Have you prepared any further reports 18 since the time of this supplemental record on 19 December 7th? 20 A. No, I have not. 2 1 Q. Has anyone asked you to perform any 22 further work since the time of this report? 23 A. No . 2 4 Q. Have you done any? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060304 John Woodyard 8 1 A. No. 2 Q- Mr. Woodyard, I looked at your C.V. that 3 you had accompanied with your first report. And 4 I have a couple questions regarding the 5 supplemental report and your background. 6 What is your background in 7 chemistry? Can you provide it to me? Do you 8 have any background in chemistry? 9 A. I've had several courses -- college level 10 courses in chemistry, as well as physics. 11 Q. As an undergrad? 12 A. Correct. 13 Q. Your Master's, I saw, was in mechanical 14 engineering; is that right? 15 A. That's true. 16 Q. Were there any chemistry courses in 17 completing your Master's? 18 A. In a matter of speaking, yes. Actually, 19 my Master's was focused on environmental back 20 when you could not get an environmental degree. 21 So a lot of my course work related to topics like 22 air sampling, air chemistry, waste water 23 treatment, all of which have something to do with 24 chemistry, so it's embedded pretty much in the ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060305 John Woodyard 9 1 course work. 2 Q- Do you consider yourself,, an expert in 3 chemis try ? 4 A. Yes, I do. 5 Q- What specific then course work would you 6 point to that gives you the expertise in 7 chemis try ? 8 A. All the work I just mentioned, the 9 specific chemistry courses, included course work 10 in organic chemistry. 11 Q. And how many courses in organic chemistry 12 did you have? 13 A. One full semester. 14 Q. One undergraduate course in organic 15 chemistry? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. And what other chemistry courses did you 18 have, besides organic chemistry? Any? 19 A. I mentioned I had several. The course 20 preceding that was physical chemistry, which is 21 much broader and, of course, the chemistry 22 components of the other environmental courses 23 that I took. 24 Q. Describe those in more detail, if you can. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060306 John Woodyard 10 1 I know that you have described that there were 2 some. But can you tell us exactly what it was in 3 those other courses? Which courses did you take 4 that had a chemistry component and what aspect of 5 chemistry did you study in taking those courses, 6 if you can tell us? 7 A. I had a course in thermodynamics that 8 focused, in large part, on combustion. 9 Combustion is, basical ly , a chemis try course, in 10 and of itse If, dealing with how things burn, how 11 to control combustion, what happened i f you burn 12 certain materials. 13 I also took course work in air 14 pollution control, in air emission testing, an 15 entire semester course in air emission testi ng , 16 including doing a variety of different types o f 17 testing techniques, all of which is pretty much 18 lab chemistry in the field. 19 Q. So what did that cover? What specifically 20 did you learn in that course that - 2 1 A. How to sample for gases, particulates, 22 both ambient testing as well as stack testing on 23 power plants and the like. 2 4 Q. And what techniques did you utilize? Can ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060307 John Woodyard 11 1 you tell us? Did you use a gas chromatograph as 2 an example in that course work? 3 A. Gas chromatographs are the tools used to 4 analyze the samples. 5 Q 6 A. Yes. The air polution monitoring or measuring 7 course work related to the collection of the 8 samples. 9 Q. So you learned techniques of collection of 10 samples ? 11 A. 12 Q. That's correct. What techniques did you learn then? Can 13 you tell us? 14 A. Different types of particlecollection 15 devices that could be used for sampling, 16 different types of gas or vapor devices that 17 could be used for sampling. 18 Q. Tell us about those, specifically. Can 19 you? What were the precise techniques that you 20 learned in your course work? 2 1 A. I can't remember exact names. We're 22 talking about different types of fiber filters, 23 paper filters. Different types of gas sorbents, 24 bubbling devices which entails putting the gas ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060308 John Woodyard 12 1 through a water bath, instead of through a 2 sorbent of some type. 3 Q- So these would be collection devices, 4 typically used had by industrial hygienists? 5 Would that be a good handle to put on these? 6 A. The collection devices or equipment is 7 applicable to many diferent things. And the 8 principles are part of the course, understanding 9 how filters are used to collect particles and how 10 different types of materials are used to collect 11 gases and so forth. 12 Q. And those would, typically, be used by an 13 industrial hygienist of some type in the field? 14 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 15 THE WITNESS: They could be used 16 by industrial hygienists. They could be 17 used by engineers, like myself, in tuning 18 up a power plant, for example. They apply 19 broadly. The same techniques are used for 20 a lot of different purposes. 21 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 22 Q. And are you an industrial hygienist? 23 A. No, I'm not. 24 Q. Ever sat for the certified industrial ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060309 John Woodyard 13 1 hygienist exam? 2 A. No, I have not. 3 Q. Do you collect samples, such as that, that 4 you've talked about in the field? Do you 5 actually collect samples on your own, Mr. 6 Woodyard? 7 A. Personally, I haven't done it in a while. 8 But I have done it, yes. 9 Q. How many times have you done it? 10 A. Dozens. 11 Q. How many years ago was the last time you 12 did it? 13 A. Perhaps, ten. 14 Q. And this was in relation to tuning up a 15 power plant as you mentioned? 16 A. No. It would have been in relation to a 17 clean-up in some fashion. 18 Q. Of PCBs ? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. And so you took dozens of samples 21 regarding PCBs? 22 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to the 23 form of the question. 24 THE WITNESS: Yes. PCBs and, ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060310 John Woodyard 14 1 perhaps, other contaminants that might be 2 present. 3 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 4 Q. Were these bulk or white samples? I mean, 5 excuse me. Air or white samples? 6 A. Both. 7 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. Both? 10 A. (Witness nods.) 11 Q. Was this on a particular project or more 12 than one? 13 A. It would have been more than one. 14 Q. How many? 15 A. I don't know. Many projects. 16 Q. I saw in your Resume a listing of a number 17 of projects. 18 Did any of them involve clean-up 19 of a high-rise building? 20 A. Yes, they did. 2 1 Q. 22 Which ones? MR. GOUTMAN: Do you want to show 23 him his Resume? 24 MR. MC CLAIN: Sure. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060311 John Woodyard 15 1 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 Q- Mr. Woodyard, I'm showing you a C.V. that 3 was provided on one of the depositions this one 4 is highlighted. I don't know the significance of 5 the highlighting. 6 But, if you'll look at that, and 7 tell me which of those projects involved work in 8 high-rise buildings. 9 A. The project for Florida Power and Light 10 involved a high-rise building, the project 11 involving the CERCLA, C-E.-R-C-L-A, project in E PA 12 Region 7. The project for the City of Austin 13 Electric Utility; the project for the Northwest 14 Lumber Company; the project for the City of New 15 York, Bureau of Water Supply. I believe the 16 project at an operating electrical component 17 facility. The project involving a specialty 18 chemical plant. Several of the projects I've 19 listed under this emergency spill and fire 20 response, category one for Owens-Illinois; 2 1 another for Pennsylvania Power and Light, the 22 electrical equipment work for the State of 23 California. There are also a number that aren't 24 listed here. This is not a complete list, nor ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060312 John Woodyard 16 1 was it intended to be. A bank building in 2 downtown Chattanooga, Tennessee. A GE Aerospace 3 facility here in Philadelphia. I believe it was 4 a high-rise. An apartment building in Reims, 5 R-E-I-M-S, France. 6 7 of. There may be others I can't think There were also several, I think, litigation 8 support projects I worked on involving buildings 9 that may or may not be high-rises, like the State 10 of New Mexico Transportation Building, the San 11 Francisco, One Market Plaza Project. I can't 12 think of others. Perhaps, as we go along. 13 Q. Let me ask you: What was your role in the 14 State of New Mexico case? 15 A. I worked as an expert, representing the 16 Public Service Company of New Mexico. 17 Q. They were the defendant in the case? 18 A. I also represented General Electric. They 19 were defendants in separate aspects of the same 20 case . 2 1 Q. Both were defendants? 22 A. Correct. 23 Q. In the One Market Plaza case, what was 24 your role in that case? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060313 John Woodyard 17 1 A. I was working, I believe, on behalf of one 2 of the contractors involved in the clean-up. 3 Q- At that point, the contractor was a 4 defendant? 5 A. I believe so. 6 Q. Being sued for an inadequate clean-up? 7 A. No, not at all. I think there were simply 8 some disputes over charges associated with the 9 project. 10 Q. In the bank building, who did you 11 represent? 12 MR. GOUTMAN: I don't know what 13 you mean by "represent". 14 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 15 Q. Who were you retained by? 16 A. My client was the building owner. 17 Q. What was the nature of the litigation? 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. It 19 hasn't been established that there was 20 litigation. 21 THE WITNESS: The first two that 22 we talked about a moment ago, Sante Fe and 23 San Francisco were litigation or an 24 arbitration. These are actual spills ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060314 John Woodyard 18 1 where clean -up wa s involved. 2 BY MR . MC CLAIN: 3 Q. So you were re tai ned by the building owner 4 in reg ard to the b ank bu ilding ? 5 A. Yes. That' s cor r ect. 6 Q- How big was the b uilding ? 7 A. I believe ten sto ries , 15 stories. 8 Someth ing in that neighb orhood. 9 Q- Were white sample s taken in the building? 10 A . Yes , they were. 11 Q. What levels were found in the building? 12 A. The levels in the building were found to 13 be low background levels that were not attributed 14 to the fire that h ad occ urred. 15 Q. And did you presc ribe a level of clean-up 16 f o r th at building? 17 A . Yes, I did. 18 Q. And what level of clean-up did you 19 prescribe for that building? 20 A. The targets were the EPA Spill Policy 21 standard of ten micrograms for the occupied 22 space. And there were also standards set for 23 dioxin furan. 24 Q. And what were those? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060315 John Woodyard 19 1 A. I can't recall, exactly. 2 Q- If they were a background, was there any 3 clean-up then performed? 4 A. Only on minimal amount in the vicinity of 5 the transformer that failed. 6 Q- Were any levels greater than one found 7 throughout the building? 8 MR. GOUTMAN: "One", what? 9 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 10 Q. One microgram per one hundred cubic 11 centimeters ? 12 MR. GOUTMAN: Are you talking 13 about air surface? 14 MR. MC CLAIN: Centimeters. 15 MR. ZIEGLAR: Square centimeters. 16 THE WITNESS: I don't recall. 17 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 18 Q. What about the GE Aerospace building? 19 MS. HERSCHEL: What about it? 20 Objection to form. 2 1 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 22 Q. Tell me about it. What was your role 23 there? Who were you retained by? 24 A. Our client on that project was GE ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060316 John Woodyard 20 1 Aerospace. They were in the process of 2 renovating or selling their facility and had 3 identified PCB contamination in the building 4 somewhere and expanded the investigation to make 5 sure that the building was safe for transfer and 6 reoccupancy. 7 Q. Can you tell me, in regard to that, did 8 you prescribe a clean-up level in regard to that 9 building? 10 A. Yes, I believe so. 11 Q. What was it? 12 A. Ten micrograms perhundred square 13 centimeters. 14 Q. Was that the level the building was 15 cleaned to? 16 A . I believe so. 17 Q. Was it cleaned beyond that on any other 18 levels ? 19 A. I don't think so. 20 Q. And GE didn't prescribe a more stringent 21 clean-up in that building? 22 A . 23 Q. 24 A. No . How many stories was it? I don't recall exactly. It's a large ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060317 John Woodyard 21 1 complex. 2 Q- Do you remember, after you were involved, 3 if GE did additional clean-up? 4 A. No, I don't. 5 Q- Do you know whether GE, upon transfer of 6 that building, was sued because of an inadequate 7 clean-up? 8 A. No . 9 Q. What about the apartment building in 10 Reims ? 11 MR. GOUTMAN: What about it? 12 Could you ask a specific question? 13 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 14 Q. What was your role in that building? 15 A. I was retained by the French government 16 through their utility to help prepare a clean-up 17 plan for a PCB transformer fire that occurred in 18 the building, in the basement. 19 Q. What levels of PCBs were measured in the 20 building? 21 A. PCB levels were fairly high. It was a PCB 22 transformer that had failed. I don't recall the 23 exact numbers. But I'm sure it was well above 24 ten micrograms per hundred square centimeters. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60318 John Woodyard 22 1 Q- What level clean-up did you prescribe in 2 that instance? 3 A. I believe it was ten micrograms for PCBs. 4 There was also dioxin furan compounds present and 5 there were separate clean-up levels for that. 6 Q- What about the Penn Power and Light 7 Building, how many stories was that? 8 A. I believe it was on the order of six or 9 seven stories. 10 Q. And what was the nature of the project 11 there ? 12 A. There had been, again, a transfo rmer fire 13 that had released PCBs in the basement to other 14 parts o f the building. 15 Q. And what levels were measured in the 16 building? 17 A. Levels in the basement area well in excess 18 of the ten microgram standard. Throughout the 19 building, there was, perhaps, some levels above 20 that. 2 1 Q. Did you prescribe a clean-up level in that 22 building? 23 A. Yes, we did. 24 Q. What did you prescribe? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060319 John Woodyard 23 1 A. Ten micrograms for PCBs. 2 Q- What about Owens-Illinois? 3 A. Owens-Illinois involved a transformer fire 4 in a glass bottle manufacturing plant in 5 California. 6 Q. And what was your role in that incident? 7 A. My role was to help develop and implement 8 a clean-up plan for the PCBs that were released 9 and, in this case, the dioxens and furans that 10 were formed. 11 Q. And what was the clean-up standard applied 12 in that situation? 13 A. The surface standard for PCBs, I believe, 14 was ten micrograms for a hundred square 15 centimeters. 16 Q. What was the standards you employed for 17 air? 18 A. There was no air standard for clean-up. 19 Q. Was this a multi-storybuilding? 20 A. 2 1 Q. 22 A. Yes, sir. How many stories? I'm guessing, it was 75 to a hundred feet 23 high. We didn't measure it. 24 Q. So between seven and ten stories, ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060320 John Woodyard 24 1 that ? 2 MR. GOUTMAN: 3 THE WITNESS: 4 MR. GOUTMAN: 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: Objection. I don't know Objection. 6 Q- You mentioned a specialty chemical plant 7 that you were involved in with a multi-story 8 building. Where was that plant? 9 A. That plant was in New Jersey. 10 Q. And what was the name of it? 11 A. The owner -- I don't know if the plant 12 itself had a name. The owner was Avon Products 13 Q. Was there an office building attached to 14 that or a high-rise building? 15 A. There was a high-rise, I think, a six or 16 seven story building that was part of the main 17 structure where the contamination had been 18 identified. 19 Q. 20 Was it an office structure or what was it? MS. HERSCHEL: Six, seven stories. 2 1 THE WITNESS: Yeah. The 22 multi-story portion of the building was 23 mixed use, warehouses, shops. No 24 manufacturing. There may have been ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060321 John Woodyard 25 1 offices in there. 2 BY MR. MC CLAIN: I don't recall. 3 Q. And what was your role in regard to that 4 Avon Products building? 5 A. My role was to develop and implement a 6 clean-up plan for the plant property. 7 Q. And what was the clean-up surface level 8 standard adopted there? 9 A. The surface standard there, I believe, was E Pft' 4&n 10 p-ar-tiera 1 ar micrograms per hundred square 11 centimeters. 12 MR. GOUTMAN: Ken, what's the 13 relevance of what the standards were on 14 these products, in terms of this 15 supplemental report? He doesn't discuss 16 clean-up levels in his report. 17 MR. MC CLAIN: That's true. 18 However, he says that his opinions are 19 based on his education, training and 20 experience as well as his knowledge. And 21 I'll trying to plumb just what experience 22 he would have had from any of these 23 projects that would have been formed about 24 tape and duct work. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060322 John Woodyard 26 1 MR. GOUTMAN: You haven't asked 2 him about tape and duct work in any of the 3 material. You're asking him about 4 clean-up levels. 5 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm going to go 6 through these various facilities and then 7 I'm going to ask him a question about that 8 subj ect. 9 MR. GOUTMAN: I'm asking what the 10 relevance of the clean-up levels of these 11 projects pertain to his report. 12 MR. MC CLAIN: I don't know what. 13 I'm taking a discovery deposition. On the 14 basis of his statement that his opinions 15 are based upon his experience. 16 MR. GOUTMAN: I understand that. 17 I think that the Judge ordered that you 18 can take a deposition about the 19 supplemental expert report and these 20 questions have no relation to that, so I 21 object. 22 MR. MC CLAIN: Well, we'll be done 23 with these fairly quickly. 24 BY MR. MC CLAIN: ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060323 John Woodyard 27 1 Q- Tell me about this operating electrical 2 facility, what was that facility? A power plant? 3 A. No. It was a manufacturing facility that 4 made capacitors that were used in light ballasts. 5 Q. And what was your role in that j ob 6 A. My roll was to de velop a clean- up 7 the plant. 8 Q. And did you adapt a level of clean-up for 9 surfaces in that plant? 10 A. Yes. I believe it was ten micrograms in 11 that case as well. 12 Q. What about the project. Bureau of Water 13 Supply, was that a multi-story building? 14 A. Yes, it was. 15 Q. What was your role there? 16 A. To develop a cle an-up plan for the inside 17 o f the building. 18 Q. 19 A. And what was the level adopted there ? I believe it was also ten micro grams for 20 PCB . 2 1 Q- What about Northwest Lumber Company, a 22 multi- s tory building? 23 A. Yes , sir. 24 Q. What was your role? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060324 John Woodyard 28 1 A. To develop a clean-up plan. 2 Q. And can you tell me what the clean-up 3 level prescribed there was? 4 A. Again, I believe for PCBs, it was ten 5 micrograms. 6 Q- Austin Electric utility, a multi-story 7 building? 8 A. Yes, sir. 9 Q- An office building or another type of 10 building? 11 A. It was a mixed use facility. 12 power plant, shop and office. It was a 13 Q. And can you tell, at the Austin Electric 14 Utility, did you develop a clean-up plan? 15 A . Yes . 16 Q. And what level was prescribed there? 17 A. I believe it was ten micrograms per 18 hundred square centimeters there as well. 19 Q. The CERCLA site, what is that? 20 A. That is actually two high-rise buildings 2 1 in Kansas City that, at one time, had been used 22 by a PCB service company to store drums and 23 electrical equipment. It has since been 24 converted to other uses and now is being cleaned ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060325 John Woodyard 29 1 up or will shortly. 2 Q. And what levels have been prescribed for 3 the clean-up? 4 A. The targe t leve 1 has b een ten micrograms 5 in di;s cus s ions with E PA. The final clean-up 6 le vel has not been establishe d on that project, 7 Q. Has a diffe rent c lean - up level been 8 di S CU!s sed? 9 A. No . No . 10 Q. The EPA has n ' t su gge s t ed to you a lower 11 cl ean--up 1 evel be appr op r i a te 12 A. No , they have n o t 13 Q- The use of this b ui ldi ng is -- where is 14 th is ]auild ing, in the Bo ttoms -- in the river, 15 Bo ttoms ? 16 A. I think one o f th em i s , if I remember 17 CO r retztly . I don ' t kn ow the local terminology 18 f o r the pa rts of town. It' s close to the Hyatt. 19 About a mi le from downto wn . And there's another 20 bu ild:Lng o n the Kansas s ide a s well that was use d 2 1 al so :for s torage - - supp lemen tal storage for the 22 op era-tor ten or 20 yea r s ago . 23 Q- And the use of th i s bu ilding is going to 24 be , what? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060326 John Woodyard 30 1 A. It is currently being used for a variety 2 of purposes. There's offices there. There's 3 print shops. There's other light industrial 4 activities in the buildings. They're being 5 considered for redevelopment at this time. 6 Q. They're being considered for loft 7 apartments ? 8 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. 9 THE WITNESS: That may be. There 10 have been newspaper articles that have 11 described a number of potential uses 12 because the area is older and quaint and 13 being redeveloped for por-oonal uses . 14 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 15 Q. Has the EPA recommended the NIOSH level in 16 regard to a resdential use at that site to you. 17 Mr. Woo dyard? 18 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 19 THE WITNESS: No, sir. 20 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 21 Q. Florida Power and Light. What was that 22 job? 23 A. Florida Power and Light again was clean-up 24 of a multi-story building following an electrical ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060327 John Woodyard 31 1 equipment fire. 2 Q- And how many stories is that building? 3 A- Perhaps, four or five. It was an office 4 arrangement and a high bay facility, so I don't 5 recall the exact height. 6 Q- No recollection of how many stories. More 7 than five? Less than five? 8 A. I think it was around five, for discussion 9 purposes. 10 Q. And what was the clean-up level that was 11 adopted there? 12 A. The clean-up level for PCBs, I believe, 13 was also ten micrograms. 14 Q. Now, in any project, whether you've 15 mentioned them or not, have you mentioned the 16 NIOSH level as a clean-up standard? 17 A. No, sir. 18 Q. On any of the other jobs that you've 19 worked on, has the NIOSH standard been use 20 utilized to clean-up any of these buildings? 2 1 A. The only time the NIOSH standard has been 22 used on projects I've been involved in is when 23 there has been a transformer fire. There are 24 dioxins and furans present and that has driven ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060328 John Woodyard 32 1 the PCB level lower as a -- what we call a 2 surrogate test. 3 Q. And where has that been? 4 A. I think that was the case in Sante Fe and 5 San Francisco, are the two that come to mind 6 immediately. I don't recall if that was the case 7 in some of these other incidents. 8 Q- It could have been in some of these other 9 incidents as well? 10 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 11 THE WITNESS: It would have only 12 occurred in situations where there had 13 been an operating electrical equipment 14 fire, where the byproducts were formed. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. You mentioned a couple of these where that 17 was the case. There was an electrical fire in 18 the Reims' apartment building. You mentioned 19 that one? 20 A . 21 Q. 22 A. 23 24 Yes, sir. And was the Bank Building such a scenario? Yes . MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. What do you mean "such a scenario?" ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060329 John Woodyard 33 1 MR. MC CLAIN: They had a fire. 2 MR. GOUTMAN: A transformer fire 3 fire? 4 MR. MC CLAIN: Um-hum. 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 6 Q. And Owens-Illinois, another plant as well? 7 A. Yes 8 Q. Do you know whether or not, in tho se 9 instan ces , the NIOSH level was the prescr ibed 10 level for the clean-up? 11 A. In all of those situations, there was 12 testing done to determine if dioxins and furans 13 were present from the equipment fire. In some 14 parts of those buildings, I believe it was 15 identified or detected at levels, indicating that 16 there had been some PCB destru c tion or dioxin 17 formation. And that was used to dri ve the risk 18 asses sment which, in turn, was used to create, 19 perhaps, a lower standard on some of those floors 20 in some locations. 2 1 Q. So, on some of those, you do have a 22 recollection that the level was set at the NIOSH 23 level; do you not? 24 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060330 John Woodyard 34 1 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. 2 THE WITNESS: No, I don't recall 3 exactly. But that's the protocol we 4 practicing in the industry have always 5 used . 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q- When you find dioxins and furans? 8 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 9 THE WITNESS: That's correct. 10 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 11 Q12 Now, let me ask you this -- MR. GOUTMAN: I'm objecting. You 13 said when he found dioxins it was after 14 the transformer fire. 15 MR. MC CLAIN: He didn't say that 16 you . 17 MR. GOUTMAN: Is that what you 18 meant, Mr. Woodyard? 19 MR. MC CLAIN: You can ask him 20 whatever questions you want when I'm done 21 MR. GOUTMAN: Is that what you 22 meant? 23 MR. MC ClA-^-Nf I mean after a 24 transformer fire which is the context ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060331 John Woodyard 35 1 we're talking. 2 H fYU. I ask that that colloquy be 3 stricken. It's inappropriate. 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q. Now, the question I want to ask that 6 relates, specifically: In any of these buildings 7 that you've been involved in, have you examined 8 the issue of PCBs and the relationship to 9 ductboard in duct work? That's a bad question. 10 MS. HERSCHEL: Yes. 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q. In any of these buildings, have you 13 examined the issue of PCBs use and application in 14 ductboard used for HVAC installation in 15 buildings? 16 A. No. I don't believe so. 17 Q. Have you had any experience in regard to 18 the manufacturer of ductboard ducting systems? 19 A. Yes, I have . 20 Q. In what regard? 2 1 A. I spent my college summers making duct 22 work -- working in a company that fabricated it 23 and sold duct products to ventilation 24 contractors. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060332 John Woodyard 36 1 Q. Which companies did you work for during 2 the summer? 3 A. A company by the name of Dunphey-Smith 4 Company in North Jersey. 5 Q. And were they a local manufacturer of duct 6 systems ? 7 A. No. They were a local supplier of 8 ventilation -- ventilation supplies to 9 contractors. And their products included 10 fiberglass ductboard as well as fabricating metal 11 ductboard for specific projects. It was a custom 12 shop. And I worked both in the shop and in 13 handling the supplies. 14 Q. And in that work, did you actually 15 fabricate fiberglass ductboard? 16 A. Not that I can recall. 17 Q- Did you ever u se heat s en s i ti ve tape in 18 your work at that job ? 19 A. Not that I can recall, sp ec if ically. 20 Q. Did you ever w atch any in di vi duals utilize 21 fiber glass ductboard and heat se ns i t ive tape? 22 A. I may have. 23 Q24 A. Do you recall? Not specifical ly, no. ESQUIRE DE POSITION SERVI CES TOWOLDMON0060333 John Woodyard 37 1 Q- So you wouldn't consider yourself an 2 expert in the application of thermal tape and 3 fiberglass ductboard, would you? 4 A. Yes, I would. I've reviewed a number of 5 documents from Certainteed that describe exactly 6 how the duct is fabricated and how the tape is 7 applied. 8 Q. So based upon those documents, you 9 consider yourself to be an expert? 10 A . Yes, sir. 11 Q. Have you brought those documents with you? 12 A. Yes. I have through - 13 MR. MC CLAIN: Could we have them. 14 which ones he actually reviewed? 15 MS. HERSCHEL: Yes . 16 MR. MC CLAIN: They're 17 specification documents . I meant to get 18 these ordered in piles, but no secretary 19 this morning. So these are all the same, 20 two sets of specification documents. 21 MR. MC CLAIN: Are these for me? 22 MS. HERSCHEL: No. One is for the 23 court reporter and for everybody else. 24 MR. MC CLAIN: That's what I mean. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060334 John Woodyard 38 1 They're for using here? 2 MS. HERSCHEL: Yes. In that 3 sense, they are for you, Mr. Me Clain. 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q. Mr. Woodyard, I'm going to hand you what 6 we'll ask the court reporter to mark Woodyard 1 7 and 2, which are documents that Miss Herschel 8 provided to me. 9 (Whereupon Exhibit Herschel 1 and 10 2 were marked for identification.) 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q13 Mr. Woodyard, we've marked as - MR. GOUTMAN: Hold on a second. 14 I'm sorry. 15 MS. HERSCHEL: Do you want 16 everything at once? These are the ones 17 that deal with fabrication of the 18 duetboard. 19 MR. GOUTMAN: I thought Ken asked 20 for the documents that he reviewed that 21 form a basis for this test. 22 MS. HERSCHEL: Do you want them 23 all at once, Ken? 24 MR. MC CLAIN: May as well. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060335 John Woodyard 39 1 Let's not confuse the record. 2 What we marked before as Exhibit 1 is 3 marked already at Certainteed -- DCT 4 Exhibit 11. And the other one is marked 5 already as DCT 49. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q. I'm going to hand you what I've been 8 provided as DCT 38 and ask, is that a document 9 that you also reviewed? 10 A. Yes, sir. 11 Q. I'm going to hand you DCT 32. 12 Is this a document you reviewed? 13 A. Yes, sir. 14 Q. I'm going to hand you DCT 88. Is that a 15 document you also reviewed? 16 A. Yes, sir. 17 MR. GOUTMAN: That's what? 18 MS. HERSCHEL: DCT 88. What did 19 you say? 20 MR. GOUTMAN: You said 38 and I 21 think it's 138. 22 MR. MC CLAIN: No. I said 88. 23 MR. GOUTMAN: I'm sorry. 24 MR. MC CLAIN: DCT 8 8 . The one ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060336 John Woodyard 40 1 before that was 32. The one before that 2 was2 - 3 MS . HERS CHE L : No , the one before 4 that -- no, you're right. I' m sorry. 5 MR. MC CLAIN: And the one before 6 that was DCT 38. So 38 and 88 are 7 different exhibits. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. The next one is DCT 95. Did you review 10 that one ? 11 A. Yes 12 Q- DCT 105. Did you review that one? 13 A. 14 Q. Yes DCT 113. Did you review that one? 15 A. Yes 16 Q. DCT 23. Did you review this one? 17 A. Two copies, yes. 18 Q. DCT 104? 19 A. Yes 20 Q. DCT 20? 21 A. Yes 22 Q. DCT 137 is the last one that I have. 23 you also review that one? Did 24 A . Yes ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60337 John Woodyard 41 1 Q. Now, did you have these in your possession 2 or were they provided to you by one of the 3 lawyers here? 4 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 5 Go ahead. 6 THE WITNESS: I had copies of 7 these documents a year or two ago. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. But you didn't utilize them in rendering 10 your opinions in this case? 11 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection, vague. 12 Which report are you referring to? 13 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm just wondering 14 what use he made of these. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. Were these utilized for both your original 17 report and your supplemental report? 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 19 THE WITNESS: I reviewed these 20 before I prepared by original expert 2 1 report. I don't recall relying on them, 22 except for background information, in 23 developing that report. I relied on them 2 4 specifically in developing this one. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060338 John Woodyard 42 1 MR. GOUTMAN: "This one", meaning 2 what? 3 THE WITNESS: 4 supplemental report. 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: "This" meaning the 6 Q. You've mentioned that the first two 7 documents, as I understood it, were the ones that 8 gave you expertise in heat tape. Did I get that 9 right? 10 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to the 11 form . 12 MS. HERSCHEL: Object to the form. 13 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 14 Q. That is DCT 11 and DCT 49. 15 A. They gave me expertise in how 16 Certainteed's products was fabricated in the 17 field. 18 Q. And so was there anything else, other than 19 your experience with Dunphey and Smith? Was that 20 it? 2 1 A. 22 Q. Close enough. Anything besides these two documents and 23 your work with Dunphey and Smith that makes you 24 an expert in heat sealing tape? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060339 John Woodyard 43 1 MR . GOUTMAN: Objection to the 2 form of the question . 3 THE WITNESS: Nothing, other than 4 just common uses of heat sensitive 5 applications , like lettering on football 6 jerseys and things like that. 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q. So you've done that, too? You applied 9 letters to football jerseys? 10 A. Actually, in my case, I have a six year 11 old daughter. It was to her Indian princess vest 12 to show what she tribe she was a part of. 13 Q. So you did this with a home iron and heat 14 sensitive lettering? 15 A. That's correct. 16 Q. So that gave you expertise to render an 17 opinion in this case? 18 A. No. It just reinforced what I had learned 19 from reading these documents. 20 Q. So this was a recent experience that you 2 1 had? 22 A. 23 Q. That's correct. And it was after you wrote your report? 24 A. I don't recall. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060340 John Woodyard 44 1 Q. Was it at or about the time that you wrote 2 your report ? 3 A. It could have been. It's possible. But 4 it's not the only time I've ever applied heat 5 sens itive things to clothing, for example. 6 Q Tell me about those. 7 A. I wish I could remember them all. 8 Q. Tell me any ones that you can remember. 9 A. Dating back to ironing patches on to jeans 10 when I was in college. Any number of situations 11 like that . 12 Q. So it's the work that you did at Dunphey 13 and Smith, these two documents and the experience 14 with your daughter's Indian princess costume, 15 iron ing patches on jeans. Anything else that 16 make s you an expert in heat sensitive tape? 17 A. No, nothing I can recall. 18 Q- By the way, have you actually been to the 19 Gust in-Bacon plant in Kansas City? 20 A. 2 1 Q22 23 24 No , I have not. Certainteed plant? MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the form. I don't think Gustin-Bacon exists there anymore. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060341 John Woodyard 45 1 MR. MC CLAIN: There is a 2 Certainteed plant; is there not? 3 MS. HERSCHEL: I think there is. 4 There was. 5 MR. MC CLAIN: The last time they 6 were still there. Plastics manufacturing, 7 I think. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. Now, what in these two documents, 10 specifically, do you rely upon to tell you the 11 about use of heat ceiling tape? Can you show me, 12 that is, in exhibits. First start with Exhibit 13 DCT 11. Just tell me the paragraph that formed 14 your opinion in this regard. 15 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. I don't 16 think the witness should limit himself to 17 a paragraph. And I think the witness 18 already said he used this document to 19 inform him on the fabrication of the 20 ductboards. And you are continuing to say 21 he used it for some other purpose. And I 22 think the witness' testimony speaks for 23 itself. 24 BY MR. MC CLAIN: ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060342 John Woodyard 46 1 Q- You tell me does this tell you anything 2 about heat ceiling tape? 3 A. It told me about how heat ec-ili tape is 4 applied in the fabrication of duct work. 5 Q. 6 A. Show me where that is. On the last page, CT 83, the top paragraph 7 reads all duct work shall be fiberglass duct with 8 aluminum casing as manufactured by Gustin-Bacon 9 Manufacturing Company. Duct shall be fabricated 10 and assembled as per manufacturer's instructions. 11 All joints shall be sealed by use of two inch 12 Mactac tape as manufactured by Morgan Adhesive. 13 The tape's joint shall be permanently heat sealed 14 by use of approved heat sealing tool as specified 15 by Gustin-Bacon. 16 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 17 Q. So that's the sample specification that's 18 attached at page 83 which has given you 19 expertise, at least in part, in heat sealing 20 tape; is that right? That information that you 2 1 just read to me? 22 A. That text, coupled with the drawings that 23 are in this. 24 Q. Show me the drawings that you rely upon. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060343 John Woodyard 47 1 A. On CT 81, there is a series of cartoons 2 that explain how the duct is prepared for 3 folding, how the heat sealing tape is applied 4 along the access of the duct and then how the 5 joints are prepared for assembly when you join 6 two ducts together. 7 Q- On this last page, anything else in this 8 document that you rely upon? 9 A. There is information in my expert report 10 relative to how this material was applied. There 11 is a sizing and packaging chart on that diagram 12 that shows the different sizes of board, 13 thickness and weight, et cetera. And that was 14 included in my report as well. 15 Q. Do you know in the design -- in the 16 considerations number five on this document that 17 was provided to me, where it says, right there on 18 the last page, on page 83, number five, air 19 temperature within G-B duct should not be excess 20 of 250 degrees Farenheit height. 2 1 Do you see that? 22 A . Yes, sir. 23 Q- Do you know why that was? Why that design 24 consideration was placed in that brochure? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060344 John Woodyard 48 1 A. No, I don't. Given that the performance 2 specification allows for heating and testing of 3 the duct at much higher temperatures, I assume 4 itself just a precaution. 5 Q- A prcaution for what? 6 A. To make sure like a speeding limit that, 7 if you say, don't use 250 degrees, that somebody 8 won't use 500 degrees in that same duct work. 9 Q. What would happen if you did? 10 A. I don't know. Nobody tests the duct at 11 500 degrees, but three, 400 degrees, it works 12 great. 13 Q. For how long? 14 A. Certainly 30, 40 years, based on what I 15 saw in the T and S building. 16 Q. So you believe that, within the T and S 17 building that temperatures in excess of three, 18 hundred to four hundred degrees were obtained? 19 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 20 MS . HERS CHE L : Obj ection. 2 1 THE WITNESS: Not at all. Your 22 question was whether or not I believe that 23 how long I thought the duct would last in 24 so many words. And I told you that I had ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060345 John Woodyard 49 1 seen the duct. I had seen testimony about 2 the duct that says it was working just 3 fine and intact. 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q. You said that the duct work was heated at 6 between -- I think your number was between three 7 hundred and four hundred degrees and it did just 8 fine. Words to that effect. 9 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 10 That's misleading. 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q. 13 A. What did you say in that rega rd? What I said was that , as part o f the 14 qu ality control testng, the duct was heated to 15 350 degrees. As part of manufacture, it was 16 dried and cured at temperatures up to four 17 hundred degrees. 18 Q. How long did that occur? How long was the 19 curing process and how long was the heating 20 process. Break them down if the number is 2 1 different? 22 A. The quality control test was for 72 hours. 23 The heating, for curing purposes, for drying was 24 done at a rate, I believe, of 20 feet per minute ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060346 John Woodyard 50 1 and we have a ten foot board. So I would say at 2 least 30 seconds. 3 Q- So in regard to heating it for -- when you 4 were respondin g - - when you said it worked great 5 for 30 years, i t didn't work great at 3 0 ye ar s at 6 three hundred to four hundred degrees heat; am I 7 right? 8 MR. GOUTMAN: We'll stipulate to 9 that. The duct was never exposed to that 10 temperature in the building. 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q. Is that whatyou're telling me? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. So you don't know what length of time the 15 duct work would have held up at three hundred to 16 four hundred degrees, am I right, beyond 72 17 hours ? 18 A. No. My experience in the T and S building 19 was that it never got above 85, more like 60 to 20 75 degrees. 21 Q. I'm not askingyou aboutanything about 22 that right now. You didn't opine on that in your 23 report, did you, in either report? 24 MS. HERSCHEL: Opine on what? Now ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060347 John Woodyard 51 1 I'm confused. 2 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 3 Q4 A. The temperature of the duct work. I'm pretty sure I did. Do you want a 5 specific citation? 6 Q- Can you hand me that back, my copy of the 7 report. On what page? 8 MR. ZIEGLAR: 28, 29. 9 THE WITNESS: The last paragraph 10 on page 28, although it's not quite that 11 specific does refer to only slightly 12 elevated temperatures common to the 13 ventilated duct work versus the extremely 14 high temperatures. In Ewing's report 15 which were lower than any temperatures 16 we're talking about here. 17 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 18 Q. Now, anything else besides these two 19 documents which -- the next document is DCT 49 20 and the -- what about this document gave you 21 expertise about the heat sealing tape? 22 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form of 23 the question. 24 THE WITNESS: This document also ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060348 John Woodyard 52 1 contains different versions of the same - 2 the cartoons explaining how to prepare and 3 fabricate the duct work. One of the 4 differences in this document on page CT 5 211, second line from the bottom, the far 6 right, it talks about heat sealing, 7 specifically, saying, that to heat seal, 8 you run the heat sealing tool over the 9 entire tape surface, making sure the heat 10 seat application is uniform and thorough. 11 This will activate the tape to volcanize 12 it to the aluminum jacket. 13 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 14 Q. Is there any estimate of the time needed 15 to do that in any of these documents? 16 A. Not specifically. The word "run" stuck 17 with me as a pretty good indication that it was a 18 relatively quick application, much like ironing 19 at home and ironing those patches on that that I 20 talked about. 2 1 Q. So it' s on the basis of ironing y 22 patches that you get an time e stimate? 23 MR. GOUTMAN: Obj ection . 24 MS. HERSCHEL: Obj ection. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060349 John Woodyard 53 1 THE WITNESS: It's on the basis of 2 the use of the term "run". 3 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 4 Q. So you never saw it applied in the field? 5 A. Not that I can recall. 6 Q. You never talked to anybody that applied 7 it in the field? 8 A. "It" being the heat sealing tape. 9 Q. Yes. 10 A. No, not that I can recall. 11 Q. You don't know what it means as 12 Gustin-Bacon intended to make sure the heat seal 13 is uniform and thorough; am I right? 14 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 15 MS. HERSCHEL: Did you hear the 16 question or did I talk over it? 17 THE WITNESS: The question was - 18 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 19 Q. Why were those words included; do you 20 know? Do you know why Gustin-Bacon felt it was 21 necessary to include those instructions in regard 22 to heat sealing the joints? 23 A. I didn't ask that question specifically, 24 no . ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060350 John Woodyard 54 1 Q- Now, there was some questions I started 2 out with about your chemical background that we 3 got side-tracked all this way. 4 Have you ever had training in, 5 other than entry level chemistry courses in 6 microscopy? 7 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 8 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. 9 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 10 Q. Have you had any courses specifically in 11 microscopy? 12 A. I've had courses in which on microscopy 13 was involved. Yes. 14 Q. Optical microscopy? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Anything inregards toelectron 17 microscopy? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Have you had training in that regard? 20 MR. GOUTMAN: Training, as opposed 2 1 to formal education? What do you mean? 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. What is yourexperience with optical 24 microscopy? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060351 John Woodyard 55 1 A. I used optical microscopy, typically, in 2 biology courses. 3 Q- So you used a microscope, like we might 4 use in a college level biology course? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Anything else that you did with an optical 7 microscope? 8 A. Yes. I've also used optical microscopes 9 in looking at a number of structural material 10 samples, different types of metal, for example. 11 Q. When? 12 A. In undergraduate and graduate school. 13 Q. Do you commonly use a microscope in 14 performing your work? 15 A. Not commonly. Occasionally. 16 Q. And when was the last time you used an 17 optical microscope? 18 A. I don't recall. 19 Q. Sometime ago? 20 A. 2 1 Q. It was sometime ago. What about an electron microscope, did you 22 use one in college? 23 MR. GOUTMAN: What does this have 24 to do with his supplemental report? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060352 John Woodyard 56 1 MR. MC CLAIN: I believe it goes 2 to his expertise to render the opinions 3 he's rendering? 4 MR. GOUTMAN: What opinions 5 related in his report to microscopy? 6 MR. MC CLAIN: I believe that the 7 opinions that he talked about were any 8 measurable levels of PCB that were 9 released from the glue matrix during the 10 installation requires the expertise in 11 microscopy. How in the world else would 12 he know those things? 13 MR. GOUTMAN: Okay. I object 14 because you don't use microscopy to detect 15 PCBs. But in any event, I don't see the 16 relevance of this at all . And you haven't 17 explained it. Do you in tend to dwell on 18 this ? 19 MR. MC CLAIN: I intend to ask all 20 the questions I can think of on this 21 subject. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. Go ahead, Mr. Woodyard. What experience 24 have you had with electron microscopy? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060353 John Woodyard 57 1 MR. GOUTMAN: I object unless -- 2 and instruct the witness not to answer, 3 unless you can lay a foundation that this 4 microscopy had something to do with the 5 measurement of PCBs in the ductboard. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q. Mr . Woodyard,, did you have you ever -- are 8 you going to follow your counsel' s instruction in 9 that regar d? 10 A. Yes , sir. 11 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm not being 12 provided with the opportunity that I 13 thought I was to take this exam. You, of 14 course, were given great leeway with 15 Mr. Ewing, so I'm disappointed that you've 16 decided to instruct my carefully thought 17 out questions. 18 MR. GOUTMAN: I've asked you to 19 lay the proper foundation. 20 MR. MC CLAIN: I have. I don't 21 need to do that for a deposition and you 22 know it. 23 MR. GOUTMAN: I think you have to 24 explain the relevancy to the narrow area ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060354 John Woodyard 58 1 of inquiry that this report covers and 2 that is the supplemental report. And I've 3 asked you to explain the relevancy of 4 microscopy to this supplemental report. 5 You've explained it and I've said that has 6 nothing to do with this. I'm asking you 7 to lay a foundation for that witness. 8 MR. MC CLAIN: You're the 9 arbitrator of what's relevant and what's 10 not, is that right, in regard to discovery 11 in this case? 12 MR. GOUTMAN: No, I think the 13 Judge is the arbitrator. 14 MR. MC CLAIN: And so if you want 15 to bother him with this kind of pollution, 16 we can call him up and talk to him about 17 it. I don't think he'd appreciate it. 18 MR. GOUTMAN: If you'd like to 19 call him, please do so. All I'm asking 20 you to do is lay a foundation. 21 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 22 Q. Are you going to follow his instructions 23 to you, Mr. Woodyard? 24 A. Yes, sir. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060355 John Woodyard 59 1 Q- Mr. Woodyard, have you used gas 2 chromatography in your work? 3 A. I used gas chromatography routinely to run 4 PCB samples in my projects. 5 Q. Are you trained to do that? 6 A. In a matter of speaking, yes. I'm 7 familiar with gas chromatographs. And I've been 8 walked through the lab and shown exactly how the 9 equipment worked. 10 Q. Can you read them? Gas chromatographs. 11 Can you read them? 12 A. I can interpret gas chromatographs, sure. 13 Q. What training have you received to be able 14 to interpret gas chromatographs? 15 A. Again, experience working with chemists 16 who trainedme on the differences between 17 different PCB Aroclors, for example. 18 Q. Explain the training that you received in 19 that regard. 20 A. I've worked with chemists for 20 years on 2 1 PCB clean-ups who have shown me time after time 22 chromatographs on the basis for making the 23 determination that they made, as to what PCB 24 levels and what types of PCBs were present. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060356 John Woodyard 60 1 Q- Tell me when, who and what you were told 2 about PCB gas chromatographs. 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. He said 4 it's happened time and time and time 5 again. After 20 years? 6 MR. MC CLAIN: Yeah. 7 THE WITNESS: I have worked on 8 over a hundred PCB clean-ups. And I have 9 been provided for data packages for 10 probably every one of those that included, 11 in most cases, a gas chromatograph as part 12 of the data package and had those 13 explained to me by probably a hundred 14 chemists, directly or indirectly. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. Were you asked for your opinion on those 17 chromatographs or did they simply explain to you 18 to you how they reached their opinions? 19 A. Typically, they were explained to me how 20 they reached their opinions. 2 1 Q. So you were simply informed about their 22 opinion and told how they reached their opinions; 23 is that correct? 24 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060357 John Woodyard 61 1 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. 2 THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. Could 3 you repeat your question, please? 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q. Have you ever written a report, 6 Mr. Woodyard, that says this is my opinion about 7 whether or not PCBs are here in the type of 8 Ao-r^-i-Ora? exists on these gas chroma togrpahs ? Have 9 you ever done that? 10 A. Yes. I look at PCB sources in just about 11 every situation I get involved in. And 12 understanding the data and trying to interpret 13 the data, questioning the analyst on these issues 14 is routine. 15 Q. So could you point me to a report where 16 you have rendered an opinion that this is a gas 17 chromatograph which demons tra te s PCBs are present 18 and the type of PCBs that are present? 19 A. I can't think of a report where I would 20 have written that. 21 Q. So you've never done that in a written 22 report, as far as you can recall? 23 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. Go 24 ahead. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060358 John Woodyard 62 1 THE WITNESS: Not that I can 2 recall, no. 3 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 4 Q- Typically, you would rely upon expert 5 chemists to render such opinions; am I right? 6 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. That 7 wasn't his testimony. I object. 8 THE WITNESS: Typically, I use 9 chemistry laboratories and analysts to do 10 the analytical work for me. 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q. Has there ever been a situation where you 13 have not used an analytical chemical laboratory 14 and their analysts to run gas chromatographs? 15 A. To run the equipment itself? 16 Q. Yes, sir . 17 A. No. I think I've always used laboratory 18 to do that for me. 19 Q. Have you ever not received a analytical 20 interpretation of those gas chromatographs from 2 1 the laboratory which you sent the samples to? 22 A. As far as I can recall, I've always 23 requested and received an interpretation. 24 Q. And have you ever not transmitted that ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060359 John Woodyard 63 1 interpretation of the laboratory to your client 2 that you can recall? 3 A- No. I've always transmitted an 4 interpretation of the data to the client. 5 Q. And you have never then, given them a 6 different interpretation than you were provided 7 to the laboratory regarding the gas 8 chromatographs which were produced by the 9 laboratory; am I right? 10 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 11 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 12 THE WITNESS: In situations where 13 I take issue with the analytical results 14 for some reason, I will always take that 15 issue up with the analyst. So what the 16 client sees is the end result of that 17 discussion or interaction. Not every 18 iteration of what the lab generates. 19 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 20 Q. But the lab generates the report. You 21 don't; am I right? 22 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. 23 MR. GOUTMAN: What report are we 24 talking about? Objection. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060360 John Woodyard 64 1 MR. MC CLAIN: A report on gas 2 chromatographs, results of PCB analysis. 3 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 4 Q- You told me that you can't recall in 5 writing, producing your analytical results to a 6 gas chromatograph. Am I right about that? 7 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 8 THE WITNESS: We've used the term 9 report in two different contexts here, one 10 relates to the data generated from the 11 laboratory, the other a report to my 12 client on interpretation of the results. 13 I have not, as I said before, generated a 14 lab report directly from the gas 15 chromatograph to interpret the data. I 16 have generated hundreds of reports to 17 clients where I've taken the result of 18 discussion with the laboratory and 19 interpreted that for the benefit of 20 forwarding a clean-up. 21 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 22 Q. Well, let me just make sure I have an 23 understanding. 24 Have you ever, in a written ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060361 John Woodyard 65 1 report, differed with the laboratory analysis 2 provided to you by the analytical chemists 3 regarding the type or quantity of Aorclor found 4 at a PCB clean-up site? 5 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q. That you can recall? 8 A. There have been a number of occasions 9 where I have pointed out to a client that it was 10 not clear exactly what type of A&relor, for 11 example, or what level was there and the reasons 12 for that. So in some cases, yes. I have taken 13 issue with the laboratory results. 14 Q. And have you provided your own 15 interpretation of the laboratory results to your 16 client where you found the data reported by the 17 laboratory not to be clear? 18 A. Yes . 19 Q. Can you cite me to a report, such as that 20 Tell me which one -- in what report you did that 2 1 A. I can't recall one, offhand. I'm sorry. 22 Q. Could you provide me one? 23 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 24 Discovery is over. ______________________________________________________________________________________ ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060362 John Woodyard 66 1 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm trying to find 2 out whether he's an expert and his 3 assertion that he has done this, may go to 4 his expertise. And to the extent that you 5 won't provide me that data, I think, goes 6 to what I'm here to discover. And so if 7 you choose not to give it to me, then I 8 will have no choice but to ask the Judge 9 for it or to move that he be excluded on 10 this subject. Because, you know, he can't 11 remember the report that it's in. He's 12 somewhat vague about what he did. I'd 13 like to know what it was. 14 MR. GOUTMAN: The witness has 15 testified that he has been doing this for 16 over 20 years, has done it over a hundred 17 times. And a request like this the day 18 before he's supposed to take the witness 19 stand is unreasonable in addition to which 20 the discovery ended a year and a half ago. 2 1 MR. MC CLAIN: Since this is the 22 only day I've been given to depose him 23 and - 24 MR. GOUTMAN: Ken, I think our ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060363 John Woodyard 67 1 positions are clear. Why don't we just 2 get on with it. Because I think the back 3 and forth is not going to move this 4 forward. 5 MR. MC CLAIN: It may not move it 6 forward, but it let's you know clearly 7 that I'd like that report. And I'll ask 8 the Court for it in the morning, if you 9 can't see your way clear to find it or 10 tell me that it doesn't exist. Because, 11 frankly, my suspicion is, is that the 12 witness' recollection on this would 13 different from the written word. That's 14 my belief. 15 MR. GOUTMAN: That's really 16 insulting. 17 MR. MC CLAIN: It's not insulting. 18 I'm giving you the basis I'm making the 19 reque s t. 20 MR. GOUTMAN: Excuse me. You are 21 calling this witness a liar. 22 MR. MC CLAIN: No , sir. I'm not 23 MR. GOUTMAN: Why don ' t you ask 24 the next question bee ause we ' re not ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060364 John Woodyard 68 1 getting anywhere. 2 MR. MC CLAIN: What I'm saying is, 3 I'd like to see what the witness is 4 referring to so I can frame the question 5 based upon what is actually written. 6 MR. GOUTMAN: Next question. 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q- Do you consider yourself to be a material 9 scientist, Mr. Woodyard? 10 A. A material scientist? 11 MR. GOUTMAN: 12 BY MR. MC CLAIN: Objection. 13 Q. Yes. 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. And inwhat fashion do youconsider 16 yourself to be a material scientist? 17 A. Based first, on course work in college 18 relative to material sciences, construction 19 materials, properties and materials for 20 construction and other uses. I've also taught 21 graduate level courses in metallurgy, plastics 22 and material science at the University of 23 Illinois. 24 Q. And whatcourses,specifically, were ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060365 John Woodyard 69 1 those; do you remember? 2 A- The course at the time was entitled 3 Mechanical Engineering 234, I believe. And it 4 dealt specifically with heat treatment of 5 different types of materials, metal as well as 6 strengths of materials, such as metals and 7 plastics. 8 Q. And when did you teach this course? 9 A. 1974 and 1975. 10 Q. And was that when you were getting your 11 Master's degree? 12 A. That's correct. 13 Q. Were these undergraduatecourses? 14 A. 15 Q. Yes, ME 235 is an undergraduate course. Any work since that time in the field of 16 material science? 17 A. 18 Q. I'm not clear on what you mean. Have you taught any courses in material 19 sciences since then? 20 A. 21 q. No, I have not. Have you done actual bench chemistry work 22 in material science since that time? 23 A. I don't know. It's a broad the term is 24 a very broad term. And I don't I mean what ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060366 John Woodyard 70 1 we're talking about here, in some respe ct, is 2 material science. We're talk about phy sical 3 property, chemical properties of materi als . 4 Q- Outside of the litigation realm, have you 5 done it for your clients or have you re lied upon 6 other laboratories? 7 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 8 THE WITNESS: Other laboratories 9 to do testing? 10 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 11 Q. Materials failure testing, heat, heating 12 of elements, et cetera. 13 MR. GOUTMAN: Objectin to form. 14 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 15 Q. Have you done it yourself or relied upon 16 laboratories to do that work? 17 MR. GOUTMAN: Don't answer the 18 question phrased. Objection to the 19 question. I don't know what you mean by 20 "et cetera". 21 THE WITNESS: Nor do I. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. Mr. Woodyard, what work have you done 24 since graduate school in testing and analyzing ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060367 John Woodyard 71 1 the materials subject to heat? 2 A. I've done a lot of work related to 3 analyzing material subject to heat. 4 Q. What, specifically, in regard to PCBs have 5 you done? 6 A. Every project that I've worked on here 7 involving transformer fires, for example results 8 in the movement of PCBs. It results in the 9 creation of combustion by-products under some 10 conditions. 11 Q. So you've taken samples at those sites; is 12 that right? 13 A . Yes, sir. 14 Q. And sent them to laboratories for 15 analysis; is that true? 16 A . Yes, sir. 17 Q. Anything else that you've done in regard 18 to those events that you've just told me about ? 19 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. What do 20 you mean by "what else have you done in 21 regard to those events?" 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. Did you analyze the samples? 24 A. Did I do the lab work? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060368 John Woodyard 72 1 Q. Yes . 2 A. No, I did not . 3 Q- Any other PCB heat related work that 4 you ''ve done ? 5 A. I've been involved for ten years in a 6 research project for the gas indu stry to look 7 the behavior of small amounts of PCB in gas 8 pipelines. 9 Q. 10 A. And you've written about those? Yes, I have. It's in my Resume. 11 Q. And the work that you've done there, has 12 shown that PCBs released in part of the system 13 can been transferred many miles away in a gaseous 14 state; isn't that true? 15 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 16 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 17 THE WITNESS: No. Actually, in 18 the context of your other question, what 19 our research showed conclusively was that, 20 the movement of PCBs over many, many miles 21 of pipelines was entirely as a liquid. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. But you demonstrated that it moved many 24 many miles in pipeline; am I right? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060369 John Woodyard 73 1 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 2 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 3 THE WITNESS: That wasn't our 4 objective, no. We were simply testing 5 physical properties of PCBs in a gas 6 environment, a high pressure, low pressure 7 gas environment. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. You demonstrated in your experiment or you 10 observed that PCBs were transferred over many 11 miles; did you not? 12 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form of 13 the question. 14 THE WITNESS: No, we did not. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. Have you ever performed any experiments 17 with heating PCBs and testing whether or not they 18 will off-gas under heating conditions -- heat 19 conditions ? 20 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 21 It's overbroad. 22 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 23 form. 24 BY MR. MC CLAIN: ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060370 John Woodyard 74 1 Q. Have you ever done an experiment like 2 that? 3 A. Well, off-gassing has a specific meaning 4 in the building products business. If you're 5 asking if I've done any testing to see what the 6 vapor pressure of PCBs would be, for example. 7 Q. Yes. 8 A. We did some of that testing in our gas 9 industry research, yes. 10 Q. Did you do any for this case? 11 A. No, I did not. 12 Q. Have you ever done any test to determine 13 off-gassing from fiberglass ductboard, wherein 14 PCBs were applied to an adhesive? 15 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to the 16 form of the question. 17 THE WITNESS: No, I have not. 18 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 19 Q- You mentioned Mr. Ewing's report before 20 and you reviewed that, I take it? 21 A . 22 Q- Yes, I did. You were never asked to perform such a 23 test in this case; am I right? 24 A . No , I was not. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060371 John Woodyard 75 1 Q. You never performed such a test in regard 2 to heat sealing tape, did you? 3 A. 4 Q- No, I did not. In regard to -- your report mentions vapor 5 pressure. 6 MS. HERSCHEL: You mean 7 supplemental report? 8 MR. MC CLAIN: Yeah. 9 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 10 Q. Men tions PCB vapor pressure. What source 11 of informa tion do you rely upon for the vapor 12 pressure o f PCBs ? 13 A. I c an't recall the specific reference 14 book. But I have several that I would have 15 consulted. 16 Q. Wou Id you rely upon Doctor Erickson's book 17 in regard to vapor pressure from PCBs? 18 A. Tha t would have been one of the sources, 19 yes . 20 Q. Did you review any literature about the 21 performance of adhesives before rendering your 22 report? 23 MS. HERSCHEL: Other than the 24 documents you already have? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060372 John Woodyard 76 1 MR. MC CLAIN: Um-hum. 2 THE WITNESS: Not that I can 3 recall, no. 4 BY MS. HERSCHEL: 5 Q- Are you familiar with any literature on 6 adhesives ? 7 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. 8 too broad. Overbroad. 9 BY MR. MC CLAIN: That's 10 Q. Do you recall any articles on adhesives 11 th at you reviewed in your career? 12 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 13 Go ahead. 14 THE WITNESS: No, I can't recall. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. I take it, you've never written about the 17 performance of adhesives, at least there's 18 nothing listed on your C.V.? 19 A. No. I don't believe I have. 20 Q. You mentioned this literature from 21 Certainteed. Let's look at the rest of these 22 documents and you tell me what you took from 23 these documents, if you could. 24 MR. GOUTMAN: Which one are we ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060373 John Woodyard 77 1 looking at now? 2 MR. MC CLAIN: DCT 38. 3 THE WITNESS: 38 included a 4 specification for adhesive to be used in 5 fabricating the duct work or ductboard. 6 Included in that specification is a test 7 for temperature resistance which, I 8 believe, is on CT 183, item E. Litle E at 9 the top. It states that "there shall be 10 no failure of the adhesive bond when 11 tested at 350 degrees F for 72 hours 12 according to tests described in G-B ST-67. 13 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 14 Q. So you relied upon this document; is that 15 right? 16 A. Yes, I did. 17 Q. This was provided to you by counsel; is 18 that r ight -- 19 A. Yes , sir. 20 Q. 21 -- for you to rely upon? MS. HERSCHEL : Objection to form. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. 24 A. Is that right? I'm sorry. I missed the question. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060374 John Woodyard 78 1 Q- As you understood it, it was for you to 2 rely upon? 3 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 4 THE WITNESS: It was for me to 5 review in developing my expert report. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q. And you did rely upon it in rendering your 8 report it? 9 A. Yes , I did. 10 Q. It's true, isn't it, that this document 11 refers to ftorolor 1254 as being the Aorole-r used 12 in the adhesive? 13 A. That's true. Yes. 14 Q. Was A-e-ruiXo-r 1254 used in the adhesive in 15 this duct work, as far as you know? 16 MR . GOUTMAN: In the duct work in 17 the T&S Building? 18 MR. MC CLAIN: Yes. 19 THE WITNESS: No, it was not. 20 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 1 Q. Does Acrrtrie^ 1254 have a different vapor 22 pressure than AbTrc-toir 1262? 23 A . 24 Q. Yes, it does. Do you know whether or not Certainteed ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060375 John Woodyard 79 1 ever used Aorclo-g- 1254 in the manufacture of its 2 ductboard? 3 MS . HERSCHEL: Other than what it 4 says in the document. His person 5 knowledge, are you asking? 6 MR . MC CLAIN: No. 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q. Do you know whether or not, in fact, that 9 was a Ao-rc 1 or that was utilized by Certainteed in 10 its duct work? 11 A. I believe s o, based on the information I 12 was provided. Yes 13 Q. Now, in reg ard to DCT 32, what did you 14 rely upon in this document ? 15 A. Again, this document makes reference to 16 the temperature re sistance standard, in this case 17 using three hundre d degrees as the testing 18 temperature. But again, it's a resistance to 19 failure of the bon d between the adhesive and the 20 foil . 21 Q. And this on e was -- the length of this 22 test, as you under stood it, was how long? 23 A. 7 2 hours . 24 Q. And the uti lization you make of this ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060376 John Woodyard 80 1 document is, what? 2 A. Is that -- 3 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 4 Go ahead. 5 THE WITNESS: The importance of 6 this document to my opinions is, again, 7 that it provides for temperature 8 resistance specifications for yet another 9 adhesive later on in the history of 10 manufacturing of these products at 11 Certainteed. 12 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 13 Q. Looking at DCT 88 - 14 MS. HERSCHEL: Is that the next 15 one or last one? 16 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm looking at the 17 next document. 18 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 19 Q. DCT 88. What use did you make of this 20 document? 21 A. Likewise, this is a 1965 document. It ifC 22 again references the temperature resistant 23 standard and the test used to measure that 24 standard, in this case being three days at 350 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060377 John Woodyard 81 1 degrees F. 2 Q. What does it mean when it says "failed 3 foil of 19 pounds, average of three adhesive 4 strength"? 5 A. I believe that would be just a strength 6 test where they were. Some weight is applied to 7 try to remove the adhesive from the foil. 8 Q. So would 19 pounds of resistance get 9 pulled apart, essentially? Is that how you would 10 read it? 11 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 12 THE WITNESS: With 19 pounds of 13 weight applied to some measure - 14 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 15 Q. 19 pounds of force. That would be a 16 better use of the term, right? 17 A. Yes. Thank you. 18 Q. DCT 95. What's the use you made of this 19 document? 20 A. Again, this is another document. This one 2 1 dated 1962 for another adhesive where the te- . . 22 temperature resistary standard is again 23 referenced and the test, in this case, is again 24 72 hours of exposure at 350 degrees F. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060378 John Woodyard 82 1 Q- Do you know what Ao-3?-cior was utiized in 2 this adhesive? 3 A. I don't recall. 4 Q. And do you know then -- I take it, you 5 don't know what vapor pressure the Aore-3rcrr in 6 this adhesive would have? 7 A. No. Because I don't know what the Aorclo-r> 8 is . 9 Q. Exhibit 103. What use did you make of 10 this document? 11 A. This is a 1963 document referencing yet 12 another adhesive and, again, citing the 13 temperature resistan^ standard of 350 degrees at 14 72 hours. 15 Q. And, once again, the Aorcl-or is not 16 specified? 17 A. No, it's not. 18 Q. The previous question about vaporpressure 19 would apply to this document as well? You don't 20 know what vapor pressure on this adhesive is? 2 1 A. 22 Q. That's correct. Exhibit 113. Thesame questions. Is this 23 document any different from the last one or just 2 4 another test? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060379 John Woodyard 83 1 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 2 THE WITNESS: This document 3 references another adhesive blend dated 4 1964. It references the same temperature 5 resistance standard I used before. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q But you don't know what the formulation of 8 that adhesive was? 9 A. Not offhand, no. 10 Q Or the vaporpressure? 11 A. No, sir. 12 Q. What use did you make of DCT 23? 13 A. The documents we've just been going 14 through refer to the quality control testing that 15 was done on the duct to insure that the adhesive, 16 indeed, adhered to the foil. This document talks 17 instead about the production process that was 18 associated with actually curing the adhesive on 19 the ductboard. 20 Q. And this is where you got the idea that it 21 would run through the process and take I can't 22 remember what time you put on it. What was the 23 time ? 24 A. I believe the production rate for this ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060380 John Woodyard 84 1 material or heating rate was 20 feet per minute. 2 And I believe that's cited somewhere in these 3 documents. 4 MS. HERSCHEL: There's a second 5 document that relathe to this. 6 THE WITNESS: Excuse me. At the 7 bottom of 115 reference is made to 25 feet 8 per minute. And up, above in the third 9 paragraph, it references 20 feet per 10 minute, so I've used the 20 number. 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q. Which one has the 20 number? 13 A. CT 115, paragraph three. It shows a 20 14 foot per minute oven speed, as they call it. And 15 the last paragraph in that same -- on that same 16 page references a test at 25 feet per minute. 17 Q. And from that, you determined that the 18 average drawing speed was, what? 19 A. What I determined referencing your earlier 20 question is, that the average piece of duct would 2 1 be exposed to this temperature for 30 seconds at 22 20 feet per minute. 23 Q. Okay. Any other use you made of this 2 4 document? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060381 John Woodyard 85 1 A. This document, along with, I believe DCT 2 137, described the actual heating temperatures 3 themselves as used in the curing process. CT 115 4 sites two hundred degrees as the curing 5 temperature used in this particular test of 6 drying. 7 DCT 137 sites yet, another series 8 of tests, between two hundred and four hundred, 9 to determine the appropriate temperature for 10 actual production, in that range again, from two 11 hundred to 4 hundred degrees which is cited in my 12 report. 13 Q. Look at DCT 20. What use did you make of 14 that document? 15 MS. HERSCHEL: Hold on a second, 16 please. 17 THE WITNESS: DCT 20 is yet 18 another memorandum regarding the drying 19 temperature that was to be used in 20 production and, again, it references a 2 1 temperature of up to four hundred degrees. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. And what about DCT 104? And is that the 24 only use you made of that document? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060382 John Woodyard 86 1 A. Yes. I believe so. 2 Q3 A. What about Exhibit 104? I believe 104 is another in that series of 4 laboratory reports that cited the temperature 5 resistant standard 350 degrees at 72 hours for 6 the adhesive and foil. 7 Q- Once again, you can't tell which AiC1or 8 was utilized here? 9 A. No, not specifically for this one. No. 10 Q- Or whether any Aorcbor was used at all? 11 A. I believe I have other documentation that 12 identified different A r dors used in different 13 blends. I did not use that as the basis for this 14 supplemental report. 15 Q. So sitting here, you can't tell us which t-'' 16 Aqr-Glor was used or whether any Aorolor w as used 17 in the documents that I've b een provided; am I 18 right? 19 MR. GOUTMAN: Obj ection. 20 MS. HERSCHEL: Obj ection. 2 1 THE WITNESS: No. From my review 22 of other documents, I believe every 23 example I've provided you here was an 24 Ao-r-e-Hro-a? containing adhesive. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060383 John Woodyard 87 1 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 Q- But you don't have any documents to show 3 that with you? 4 A. No, I don't. 5 Q- Have you ever seen one of these irons that 6 they depict in the cartoons? 7 A. Only the version or versions that I see in 8 the pictures in the literature. 9 Q- So you've never measured the temperature 10 that one actually achieves on the iron; am I 11 right? 12 A. No, I have not. 13 Q. It's true, is it not, that at room 14 temperature Aqto1or 1262 will vaporize? 15 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 16 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 17 Q. 18 19 Isn't that true? about MR. GOUTMAN: Are you talking Cou.cJ^' just a cup of Aoro 1 o~r 1262? 20 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 1 Q. In Doctor Erickson's book, does he provide 22 values for vaporization of Ar>Vc 1 o-r 1262 at room 23 temperature ? 24 A. I believe he does. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060384 John Woodyard 88 1 Q. So Ao-r^-io-r 1262 will vaporize at room 2 temperature; will it not? 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Again, we're talking 4 about just a cup of pure Acur-cl-or 1262? Is 5 that the question. 6 MR. MC CLAIN: You tell me. I'm 7 asking -- I don't need the interruption. 8 I'm asking the question. If the witness 9 has any question - 10 MR. GOUTMAN: I'm instructing him 11 not to answer because I don't understand 12 the meaning of the question. 13 Are you talking about a cup of 14 Ao-ae-e-lo-ar 1262 - 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. Under what conditions does -- well, does 17 it change? Does A-o-r-ci-e-r 12 62 not vaporize 18 because it's put in glue? 19 A. Aorclo-r 1262 doesn't vaporize without the 20 glue. It has almost no vapor pressure. So 21 adding it to the glue simply reinforces the bond 22 and further impedes it from any chance of 23 evaporating. 24 Q. So it's your testimony that in Doctor ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060385 John Woodyard 89 1 Erickson's book, he posits that there's no vapor 2 pressure from AtTFeie-r 1226? 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. He said 4 virtually no vapor pressure. 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 6 Q. Is that your testimon 7 A. No My testimony was that there was 8 virtually no vapor pressure for Ao-re-1 o-r 1262. 9 Q. Have you calculated how much Aorolot 1262 10 would vaporize from the duct work at room 11 temperature? Have you done that? 12 A. No, I have not. 13 Q. You could do that, couldn't you? 14 A. Yes, I could. 15 Q. You talked about in your supplemental 16 report, the heat sealing tape was only two inche s 17 wide . 18 Have you attempted to calculate 19 the total square inches of heat sealing tape 20 applied on the ductboard during the installation 21 process ? 22 A. 23 Q. No, I have not. You could do that, too, couldn't you? 24 A . Yes, I could. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060386 John Woodyard 90 1 Q- Let's try to do that together, shall we? 2 Got a pen? 3 The ductboard, by your 4 calculation, in your report was ten feet by four 5 feet wide; am I right? 6 A. Yes, sir. 7 Q- And the ductboard was folded in to a 8 rectangle and the sealing tape was used to seal 9 the open side; am I right? 10 A. It was used to seal the joints between 11 duct sections. 12 Q. The open side of the duct, right? 13 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 14 BY MR. MC CLAIN 15 Q. If you 1 ook at the di agram, it sh ow s yo 16 how i t was ma de ; do es it not ? I f you lo ok b ac 17 at Exh ibi t 73 - - or I mean DCT 1 1? 18 A . Yes I ' m famil iar wi th i t . 19 Q- As i t' s fold ed on the di a gram, th e he at 20 sea lin g tape se al s the open side ; does i t no t? 21 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form 22 THE WITNESS: It seals the joint 23 after you fold the duct over the four 24 sides, yes. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060387 John Woodyard 91 1 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 Q. We're using different terminology. But it 3 seals the duct on one side; am I right? 4 A. Yes. That's correct. 5 Q. And this is done every ten foot length of 6 duetbo ard; is that correct? 7 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. Isn't that true according to the 10 specif ications ? 11 A. The tape is applied along the long Srcces~s 12 to the duct which is, approximately, ten feet. 13 Q. So how would we then go about making the 14 calcul ation of the square inches of heat sealing 15 tape a long a ten inch length of duetboard. Would 16 we tak e ten feet, times 12 inches per foot, times 17 a two inch width to make that calculation? 18 A. Yes. That's correct. 19 MR. GOUTMAN: Just a second. 20 Excuse me. 2 1 MS. HERSCHEL: Mr. Me Clain, we 22 have an objection to your having the 23 witness do a calculation here. He is not 24 going to present this calculation. If you ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060388 John Woodyard 92 1 have an expert somewhere who's going to 2 present the calculation, fine. But this 3 witness is not going to present this 4 calculation. 5 MR. MC CLAIN: Are you instructing 6 him not to do the calculation? 7 MS. HERSCHEL: I am. I don't want 8 to have him do it off the top of his head 9 as he sits here. 10 MR. MC CLAIN: We need to get the 11 Court on the phone then because he says in 12 his report that, because it's only a two 13 inch piece of tape, that there wouldn't be 14 any release, even if you assume that it's 15 at 250 degrees Farenheit. 16 MS. HERSCHEL: Which is what Mr. 17 Kominsky posited. 18 MR. MC CLAIN: Mr. Kominsky didn't 19 reach that conclusion. And in fact, I 20 think that if we do the calculation, we 2 1 can find out how much material we're 22 looking at. And I think taht I have a 23 right to ask the witness about that. 24 MS. HERSCHEL: And I'm instructing ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060389 John Woodyard 93 1 the witness not to answer on the grounds 2 that it's not a calculation he's done for 3 his report. It's not a calculation he's 4 going to do. And I don't want him sitting 5 here doing it off the top of his head. If 6 you've got that calculation, fine. 7 MR. MC CLAIN: He's told me that 8 he ' s capable of doing it. 9 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 10 Q. You 're capable, aren't you? You're a 11 scientist, aren't you, Mr. Woodyard? 12 MS. HERSCHEL: You mean can he 13 add, multiply, subtract and divide? 14 MR. MC CLAIN: Yeah. Absolutely. 15 And he knows what these dimensions are. 16 He supplies them in his report. 17 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 18 Q. Isn't that true, Mr. Woodyard? 19 MS. HERSCHEL: Same instruction, 20 Mr. Woodyard. I don't think that it is 21 proper for Mr. Me Clain to ask you to do 22 this. And I don't think it's your 23 responsibility to create expert data for 24 Mr. Me Clain. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060390 John Woodyard 94 1 MR. MC CLAIN: Let's call the 2 Judge then, because this is important. 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Call him. 4 *** 5 (Whereupon a brief break was 6 taken.) 7 (Whereupon a discussion was held 8 off the record.) 9 MR. GOUTMAN: This should be on 10 the record. 11 MS. HERSCHEL: Yes, Your Honor. 12 As a general matter, he would. He would 13 certainly be answer that question -- be 14 able to answer that question. The only 15 thing I don't want to ask him to do and I 16 don't think it's fair to do it is, to try 17 to come up with a specific number. 18 Obviously, there were lots of feet of tape 19 in that building. 20 THE COURT: I understand that. 21 MS. HERSCHEL: Your Honor, maybe 22 we have a compromise here. 23 MR. MC CLAIN: If Miss Herschel 24 will stipulate that there are over two ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060391 John Woodyard 95 1 million square inches of duct tape in that 2 building, then we don't have to ask the 3 witness about. 4 THE COURT: I think before we get 5 in to that, we're getting in to another 6 area of examination when we talk about the 7 linear feet. 8 The question that I'm concerned 9 about is the one I just posited, as to 10 whether or not the fact that there is a 11 considerable length of running feet, does 12 that change his views on the emission of 13 PCBs into the atmosphere? 14 MS. HERSCHEL: It would not. Your 15 Honor. 16 THE COURT: That's the question. 17 But I don't know that he answered that 18 question. 19 MS. HERSCHEL: I would certainly 20 not object to that question, Your Honor. 21 MR. MC CLAIN: He didn't, Your 22 Honor. But even if he were to say, no, it 23 wouldn't effect it, I think to challenge 24 his opinion, the number of square inches ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060392 John Woodyard 96 1 is relevant. 2 MS. HERSCHEL: Then let Mr. Me 3 Clain to calculate that for him. Your 4 Honor. I don't think Mr. Woodyard can 5 barely be asked to do that. 6 MR. MC CLAIN: Your Honor, the 7 court allowed this supplemental report 8 which is only a page and a half with no 9 back up provided, with no cites to any 10 outside sources. I'm being handed the 11 documents here. I'm allowed to ask him 12 questions and the court can rule tomorrow 13 whether they're relevant. 14 THE COURT: He has indicated that 15 this tape applied the duct work. The duct 16 work is what had the PCBs in it, as I 17 understand it. 18 MS. HERSCHEL: The duct work has 19 PCBs in glue that attach the foil to the 20 fiberglass, as Your Honor knows. 21 THE COURT: What I'm saying is 22 that, the question is, when the heat is 23 applied to this duct tape does that emit 24 PCBs into the atmospher? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060393 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 John Woodyard 97 MS. HERSCHEL: Correct. Mr. Kominsky posited that it did and, in fact, he's the one who put in a length of duct in the building and Mr. Woodyard is responding to that, based on the procedure that was used with the sealing iron and the properties of PCBs and the nature of the glue. THE COURT: To the court, the question involved is, would this change, regardless of the number of running feet that this duct tape was applied to over the PCB containing duct work? MS. HERSCHEL: Correct. And that would be a fair question, Your Honor. THE COURT: And, if that's the case at this point, unless the plaintiff wants to come in to challenge that which is -- may be an opening for the plaintiff to do. I'm not going that far at this point. But the only question that we have here is, whether or not his opinion would change. Now, you can challenge that by an ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060394 John Woodyard 98 1 expert if one would be admissible at this 2 point, because it's new matter. I don't 3 know. But the point is, I think having 4 the calculations then, is drifting from 5 the issue and becoming instead of factual, 6 sensational by using the number of running 7 feet of tape. 8 And to that extent, the Court 9 would sustain the objection as to the fact 10 that -- as to the specific calculations. 11 Now, as I say, you can posit the 12 question as to the facts that there are 13 significant number of running feet. And 14 I'm not putting the words in your mouth as 15 to how to phrase the question and ask him 16 whether that would change his opinion and, 17 certainly, you can cross-examine him in 18 that fashion. But to do the specific 19 calculation now at the time of the 20 deposition, I think puts an undue twist on 2 1 the subject matter for which the discovery 22 is intended. 23 MR. GOUTMAN: Your Honor, I 24 noticed you used the word drift. Is that ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060395 John Woodyard 99 1 because of the weather outside? 2 THE COURT: Maybe that has a 3 subconcious affect. And we're seeing what 4 happening with these drifts. 5 MR. GOUTMAN: Your Honor, on 6 another issue, does the Court know whether 7 we will be sitting tomorrow? 8 THE COURT: I was hoping that we 9 had a chance to talk because I ' m much 10 concerned about tomorrow and the fact that 11 we're getting more sn ow this week, 12 according to the Weather Bureau. I'm sure 13 you've had the chance to listen to the 14 weather channels. 15 MS. HERSCHEL: The roads in Jersey 16 are awful, Your Honor. 17 THE COURT: Yes. And as I say, 18 I'm concerned about the fact that we're 19 due for one, if not two days more of snow 20 flurries or snow accumulation. I have no 2 1 way of knowing. And I'm concerned because 22 of getting the jury in, could be most 23 dif ficult. 24 MR. GOUTMAN: I guess, Your Honor, ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060396 John Woodyard 100 1 it would be my preference is to try to go 2 ahead becaus e we have an expert in town , 3 but I share your concern about the jurors 4 So we ' 11 go whatever way the court wants 5 to on that. 6 THE COURT: I kn ow that eac h of 7 you have been put out and you've been made 8 to stay over and, of course, mother nature 9 has her own view points on how things 10 should occur. 11 MR. GOUTMAN: Mother nature 12 usually has the last word , Your Honor. 13 THE COURT: I agre e with you. And 14 what I would hate to do i s keep all of you 15 in town, not that we don ' t enjoy your 16 company, but keep you all in town when 17 there may be a window opening to get back 18 to your various hometowns. 19 MR. GOUTMAN: Is the court 20 suggesting that we recess for the week? 2 1 THE COURT: I'm posing that as a 22 question for counsel to consider. You 23 don't have to make up your mind right now. 24 MR. MC CLAIN: What does the court ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060397 John Woodyard 101 1 want to do about tomorrow? What I mean 2 take us one step at a time. I don't know 3 what the rest of the week will bring. 4 THE COURT: I think tomorrow is 5 going to be even worse navigating because 6 this weather will have a chance to freeze. 7 And I don't know how easy it will be for 8 people taking public transportation to get 9 out and I visualize the jury. And we know 10 that composition and does it appear to you 11 that they would be able to easily navigate 12 the weather conditions to get to the 13 court? I don't know. 14 How was it coming in for each of 15 you ? Me Cl ain, you're in Center City. 16 MR . MC CLAIN: Yeah. I was here 17 so I just w alked over. 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Yeah. I'm in Cente; 19 City 20 THE COURT: Is Henderson there? 21 MR . GOUTMAN: No. He's not here 22 yet. 23 MS . HERS CHE L : He's in Pittsburgh 24 MR. GOUTMAN: He's in Pittsburgh. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060398 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 John Woodyard 102 THE COURT: I always admired him. MS . HERS CHE L : We don't have any jurors from Jersey, Your Honor. But, as I said, my husband drove me into the High-Speed Line. And it was tough going. THE COURT: That's what I'm concerned about. And if you work until four o'clock and it freezes over all over again, I'm really thinking about recessing for the week. But I don't want to impose it on you if you think that that would be inappropriate. MR. GOUTMAN: If I could just suggest, could we call the Court back in about ten minutes after we have a chance the exchange views on this? THE COURT: Talk it among yourselves. MR. GOUTMAN: Very good. We'll call you back in about ten minutes and we're sorry for disturbing your peaceful -- THE COURT: You're not disturbing me. I'm glad that you called because I ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060399 John Woodyard 103 1 wanted to talk to you and pose these 2 questions to you. 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Very well. We'll 4 call you right back as soon as we can 5 figure out what would be the best course 6 of action from our perspective. 7 MR. GOUTMAN: Thank you, Your 8 Honor. 9 THE COURT: 10 BY MR. MC CLAIN: Thank you. Good-bye. 11 Q. Mr. Woodyard, have you made an estimate of 12 how many square inches of tape there are in the 13 building? 14 A. No, I have not. 15 Q. Would you agree that there was a 16 substantial amount of tape in the building? 17 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 18 THE WITNESS: I don't know. What 19 does "substantial amount" mean? 20 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 1 Q. Over two million square inches of tape in 22 the installation of the duct work. 23 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 24 THE WITNESS: I don't know. I ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060400 John Woodyard 104 1 haven't done the calculation. 2 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 3 Q. 4 5 6 And you could do the calculation? MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. THE WITNESS: Yeah, given some other information. 7 BY MR. MCCLAIN: 8 Q. If there were over two million in square 9 inches of tape in the building, would it impact 10 your opinion in regard to the release of PCBs 11 from this duct work system? 12 A. No. 13 Q. So you don't believe that even applying 14 heat of over 250 degrees to two million square 15 inches of tape throughout this building, would 16 release significant amounts of PCBs; is that 17 correct? 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. Assumes 19 fact not in evidence. You can ask him. 20 THE WITNESS: Could I have the 2 1 question again. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. It's your opinion that, if you applied an 24 iron at over 250 degrees Farenheit to over two ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060401 John Woodyard 105 1 million square inches of this duct work, that it 2 would not release a substantial amount of PCBs. 3 Is that your testimony? 4 MR . GOUTMAN: S ame objection. 5 MS . HERS CHE L : S ame obj ection. 6 THE WITNESS: That' s correct. 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q. At what temperature do you believe that 9 PCBs would be released from this duct work, Mr. 10 Woodyard? 11 A. I don't have any experimental results I 12 would rely on for the PCBs in the adhesive 13 material. So I can't say in this context where 14 we have the ductboard. 15 Q. Now, you did review Mr. Ewing's work? 16 A. Yes, I did. 17 Q. You could have done an experiment of your 18 own, could you not have? Could you have done 19 your own experiment? 20 A. I don't know. There's no standard tests 2 1 that can be used for this particular experiment. 22 Q. So you don't think you are qualified to 23 have run an experiment? 2 4 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. That ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060402 John Woodyard 106 1 wasn't his testimony. 2 THE WITNESS: That's a different 3 question. If there were a standard, I 4 believe I would be qualified to run it. 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 6 Q- Do you believe that it's necessary in 7 order to run a valid scientific experiment, to 8 have a standard available from someone else? 9 MS. HERSCHEL: Mr. Me Clain, this 10 is way outside of the very - 11 MR. MC CLAIN: No. He said he 12 reviewed Mr. Ewing's testimony. 13 MS. HERSCHEL: And that was a 14 question that was way outside the contours 15 of what the Judge said this deposition 16 could be about. 17 MR. MC CLAIN: It's about his 18 supplemental report. 19 MS. HERSCHEL: It's not about his 20 supplemental report. Show me where 2 1 it's -- 22 MR. MC CLAIN: It's about his 23 supplemental report and I don't need these 24 interruptions in regard to my questions. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060403 John Woodyard 107 1 MS. HERSCHEL: But we have a right 2 to insist that you take a deposition 3 within the bounds that the Judge said. 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q- Isn't it true, Mr. Woodyard, that based 6 upon Mr. Ewing's test, PCBs were released above a 7 hundred degrees Farenheit? That's true, isn't 8 it? 9 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. Where in 10 the report is that reference? Where does 11 he reference Ewing's testimony? 12 MR. MC CLAIN: That's in his 13 previous report. 14 MR. GOUTMAN: We're not here to 15 talk about his previous work. 16 MR. MC CLAIN: It is about his 17 education, training and experience as well 18 as my knowledge about the T&S Building and 19 review of documents and two site visits 20 that he bases his opinion on in this case. 2 1 MS. HERSCHEL: You're going to say 22 any question you want to ask him under the 23 sun fall under that report. 24 MR. MC CLAIN: No. I'm asking him ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060404 John Woodyard 108 1 about this heat tape right now and try to 2 explore the basis of why he doe sn't 3 believe that a 250 Farenhei t heated iron 4 would release PCBs from thi s duct work? 5 MS. HERSCHEL: Ask him that. 6 MR. GOUTMAN: Is th ere a question 9 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q. Yes. That's the question s ince she said 9 that's the one she wants me to ask . Go ahead. 10 A . Repeat it, please - 11 Q. Why don't you bel ieve that at 250 degrees 12 Farenheit, PCBs would be released from this duct 13 work ? 14 A. Because the PCBs we re bound in th e gl ue 15 bond. They were locked in They would not 16 vaporize and enter the b ui Id ing space. 17 Q. And what data do yo u rely upon to rea ch 18 that conclusion? Can yo u ci te me some s tudy t 19 some test? 20 A. For example, goin g ba ck to Mr. E w ing ' s 21 testimony, he, himself, s t at ed having do ne s ome 22 of these tests, albeit i nc or rectly, th at PCB s 23 would not have been rele as ed or measur ed in tha 24 building based on room t empe rature expiO s ure . ESQUIRE DEPOS ITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060405 John Woodyard 109 1 Q* We're not talking about room temperature, 2 sir. My question was 250 degrees Farenheit. At 3 250 degrees Farenheit, you believe, do you not, 4 that PCBs would be released from this ductboard? 5 MR. GOUTMAN: 6 THE WITNESS: 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: Objection. No, I don't. 8 Q- So even heating it to 250 degrees, you 9 don't believe that it would release PCBs? 10 A. No . 11 Q- And I asked you what data do you rely upon 12 in reaching that conclusion? Can you give that 13 to me ? 14 A. Mr. Ewing's test at lower temperatures 15 showed that PCBs would not be released at room 16 temperature, which tells me that -- or reconfirms 17 my opinion that, if even a molecule of PCBs 18 somehow escaped from that adhesive, it would 19 immediately attached to the fiberglass and stayed 20 within the ductboard. At any temperature up to 2 1 conceivably the boiling temperature of PCBs which 22 is in excess of 800 degrees. 23 Q. How is it then that PCBs were driven off 24 at a hundred degrees Farenheit in Mr. Ewing's ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060406 John Woodyard 110 1 test? 2 MR. GOUTMAN: Obj ection. 3 MS . HERS CHE L : Objection to form, 4 MR. GOUTMAN: I instruct the 5 witness not to answer 6 MR. MC CLAIN: He sard he relied 7 upon Mr. Ewing's finding in reach ing his 8 conclusi on . 9 MR . GOUTMAN: You've misstated his 10 finding. 11 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 12 Q. What do you understand Mr. Ewing's 13 findings to be, at what temperature? Mr. Goutman 14 is taking issue wi th the temperature that PCBs 15 were driven off. 16 MR. GOUTMAN: You're asking him to 17 repeat the information in Ewing's report? 18 MR. MC CLAIN: If he recalls what 19 temperature Mr. Ewing heated the duct work 20 to . 21 THE WITNESS: Mr. Ewing conducted 22 tests that, in no way, simulated how the 23 duct work i s constructed into that 24 building. So his experiment was flawed ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060407 John Woodyard 111 1 and that's not what I'm relying on. 2 I just stated that his testimony 3 was that, based on the results of his 4 tests, you would not find PCBs in the 5 building based on room temperature 6 exposure of the duct work. 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q- We're not talking about room temperature, 9 sir. I said at 250 degrees Farenheit. At that 10 temperature, what data do you have that no PCBs 11 would be driven off from this duct work? What 12 data ? Any? 13 A. There's no evidence that any was driven 14 off by the duct wo rk . 15 Q. Sir , answer my question. Is there any 16 data that you rely upon, any test that has been 17 done ? Anything in Doctor Erickson' s book? What 18 is it that gives y ou this opinion, sir? 19 MS . HERSCHEL: Other than what he 20 says in his supplemental rep ort? 21 MR. MC CLAIN: Yes. 22 MR. GOUTMAN: Excuse me. Can you 23 please keep your voice down? You're now 24 yelling at the witness. And I don't think ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060408 John Woodyard 112 1 that's appropriate. 2 MR. MC CLAIN: Oh, give me a 3 break. 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q- Can you answer my question? 6 A. I said the boiling point of PCBs is well 7 in excess of eight hundred degrees. That's the 8 temperature at which PCBs might want to become a 9 vapor. Up to that point, it's locked in the glue 10 matrix. It's stable. It's not going to go 11 anywhere. 12 Q. What test data do you rely upon in 13 reaching that conclusion? 14 MR. GOUTMAN: He just said it. 15 Other than that you mean? 16 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 17 Q. Yeah. Other than what the boiling 18 temperature of PCBs are? 19 A. There was no test performed on the duct at 20 250 degrees. 21 Q. 22 A. And you don't have any data? I just cited to you the sciences behind my 2 3 paper. 24 Q. Even though you recognize in Doctor ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060409 John Woodyard 113 1 Erickson's book that PCBs will vaporize at room 2 temperature; am I right? 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Pure PCBs we're 4 talking now, as opposed to PCBs in glue? 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 6 Q. Is it your testimony that placi ng the PCBs 7 in glue completely immobilizes them an d s ubj ect s 8 them to no vaporiz ation? Is that your te s timon y? 9 A. Yes , sir. No significant vapor i z a tion . 10 Q- Wha t do you mean by "no signifi can t 11 vapo rizati on"? At what rate will it v apo rize 12 from glue ? Do you have any data on th at? 13 A. 14 Q. No , I don't No tests th at you performed? 15 A. 16 Q. No , I don't And so the only data that you h ave is on 17 pure PCBs ; is that correct? 18 A. The only re ference material cit ati ons th at 19 you would argue wo uld be relevant are the PCB 20 vapo rizati on rates . But those do not apply to 2 1 the glue . 22 Q. Let 's go to the tests that you have cite d 23 in r egard to the glue, the heating of the duct 24 work ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60410 John Woodyard 114 1 Did anyone measure whether PCBs 2 were driven off at those temperature, between two 3 hundred and four hundred degrees? 4 A. No . 5 Q- So based upon that data, you can't tell us 6 whether or not PCBs were driven off during that 7 process; am I right? 8 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 9 form . 10 THE WITNESS: The test was to show 11 the continued integrity of the glue as 12 applied to put the fiberglass against the 13 foil. If the PCBs were driven off, the 14 whole duct would have deteriorated. 15 Obviously, it didn't. That's the whole 16 point of the dwlmidjn l~. 17 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 18 Q. And any PCBs that were driven off would 19 have caused the glue to fail after 72 hours. Is 20 that your testimony? 21 A. The glue is the plasticizer. It was 22 designed to keep the glue together. I mean the 23 PCBs are the plasticizer. They're designed to 24 keep the glue together. If they left this ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60411 John Woodyard 115 1 adhesive material, the adhesive would 2 deteriorate, the du ct would come apart 3 not see that happen - We did 4 Q. How would we determi ne wh ether i t wou Id 5 deteriorate? What would we phy s ically s ee i n 6 regard to this glue ? 7 A. We would see delamin at ion . We wo uld see 8 evidence that the duct was comin g apar t. 9 Q. The glue wou Id become har d? 10 A. Not necessar ily, no . 11 Q- That would b e one si gn th at the PCBs wou Id 12 be driven off; am I right? 13 A. No. That's not true 14 Q. So if the gl ue becomes ha rd, th at doe sn ' t 15 mean that the plast icizers have left i t? Is th at 16 your testimony? 17 A. No . 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Are we ta Ik ing abo u t 19 plasticizers or PCBs ? Ar e you ch angi ng 20 the question here on the witne s s? 21 MR. MC CLAIN : No . The w i tne! s s 22 said that the PCBs were added as 23 plasticizer. 24 BY MR. MC CLAIN: ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60412 John Woodyard 116 1 Q. Am I right? 2 A. Yes . 3 MR. GOUTMAN: Has that been 4 established that that was the only 5 plasticizer. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIM 7 S' That is the plasticizer in this mastic; 8 isn't that true? 9 A. That's correct. 10 Q- Is it's true, is it not, that one of the 11 goals of the plasticizer is to keep it pliant? 12 A. Yes. Flexible is the word I would use. 13 Q. And when it becomes hard, it's no longer 14 flexible, is it? 15 A. No longer as flexible. I don't have test 16 data to say otherwise. 17 Q. And so you would not view it that if it's 18 hard as opposed to pliant or flexible, that any 19 PCBs have been driven off; is that true? 20 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 2 1 form of the question. There's no evidence 22 in this case that the glue in the 23 ductboard was brittle. 24 MR. MC CLAIN: Review ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60413 John Woodyard 117 1 Mr. Kominsky1s testimony. 2 MS. HERSCHEL: It's not there, Mr. 3 Me Clain. 4 MR. MC CLAIN: It is, too. Go 5 ahead. 6 THE WITNESS: The adhesive, as it 7 was manufactured and applied, was only 60 8 percent or so solids. There was a lot of 9 other material in there that would come 10 off in this evaporation that you're 11 talking about. That has anything to do 12 with PCBs. The PCBs stayed there. Water 13 evaporated. Other sollvents that were 14 included in these constituents. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. What tests did you perform to determine 17 that the PCBs had stayed in the glue? Any? Did 18 you perform any tests? 19 A. No. I relied on the tests that were done 20 by Certainteed to show that the integrity was 21 maintained. 22 Q. And those tests did not measure the 23 amounts of PCBs, both before and after the test, 24 did they? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60414 John Woodyard 118 1 A. 2 Not to not to my knowledge, no. (Whereupon a brief break was 3 taken.) 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q- Do you know how many PCBs would have been 6 driven off before there would have been a loss of 7 performance of the glue? 8 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 9 THE WITNESS: No, I do not. 10 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 11 Q. In your report, you say that absent the 12 fire, there would have been no vaporization of 13 the glue between a temperature -- between room 14 temperature and the temperature of a fire, at 15 what point will the glue vaporize, do you know? 16 MR. GOUTMAN: PCBs in the glue 17 mastic ? 18 MR. MC CLAIN: Yeah. 19 THE WITNESS: As I said, the 20 boiling point of the PCBs is in excess of 21 800 degrees. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. So are you saying that until it boils no, 24 PCBs will vaporize from the glue? Is that your ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60415 John Woodyard 119 1 opinion? 2 A. My opinion is that no appreciable amount 3 of PCBs will ever leave the glue, until it's 4 de s troyed. 5 Q- Even at the boiling p o in t ? 6 A. The boiling point is a point at which the 7 glue is destroyed. 8 Q- By "appreciable", wha t do you mean? How 9 much PCBs is released before it's appreciable in 10 your view? 11 A. As my report says, it did not result on 12 any concentration of PCBs cartcra/j--in the building 13 surfaces which is a measurement based statement. 14 So there's no measureable PCBs leaving that duct 15 work . 16 Q. No measureable meaning, nothing above the 17 NIOSH level? 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 19 THE WITNESS: No. It has nothing 20 to do with the NIOSH level. We're talking 2 1 molecules even leaving the adhesive. And 22 as I've said, that would be trapped by the 23 fiberglass. 24 BY MR. MC CLAIN: ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060416 John Woodyard 120 1 Q- Does the fiberglass increase or decrease 2 the surface area of PCB containing material 3 subject to vaporization? 4 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 5 Go ahead. 6 THE WITNESS: I don't know that it 7 would make a difference. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. If PCBs are vaporized on to the 10 fiberglass, does that not increase the surface 11 area of PCB containing material available to the 12 air stream in the building? 13 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection 14 THE WITNESS: No. That ' s not 15 true . 16 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 17 Q. Is it not true that the fibergl ass has a 18 greater surface area than the fibergla s s 19 ductboard? 20 A. But you're not claiming the fib erglass is 2 1 evaporating. You're claiming the PCBs are 22 evaporating. 23 Q. And reabsorbing on to the fiber glass in 24 your scenario; am I right? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60417 John Woodyard 121 1 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 2 MS. HERSCHEL: That's what you 3 said . 4 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 5 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. l/J'. 6 MR. M-C CLAIN-: If a molecule of 7 PCB leaves the surface of that glue and 8 attaches itself to a piece of fiberglass 9 directly adjacent to it, which is what 10 we're talking about here, there is now a 11 molecule of PCB on the fiberglass. There 12 is a molecule of PCB missing from the 13 adhesive. There's no increase. 14 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 15 Q. Is that molecule of PCBs, which is now 16 attached or resting on the fiberglass, available 17 for resuspension of the building? 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Resting? He didn't 19 say it was resting on top of the 20 fiberglass. He said it was within the 2 1 fiberglass. Object to the form of the 22 ques tion. 23 MS. HERSCHEL: Object to the form 24 THE WITNESS: That molecule is ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60418 John Woodyard 122 1 stuck to the fiberglass. It's, 2 essentially, part of the fiberglass. 3 at room temperature. It's not going 4 anywhere. 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: It's 6 Q- What about when it's heated above room 7 temperature ? 8 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 9 MS. HERSCHEL: I'm sorry. What 10 was the end of your question. I missed 11 it . 12 MR. MC CLAIN: When it's heated 13 above room temperature. 14 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form of 15 the question. 16 THE WITNESS: It wouldn't be 17 heated above room temperature. 18 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 19 Q. Is it not contained within the duct work? 20 A. Yes. But the evidence is that the duct 21 work carried air that was between 60, 75 degrees. 22 No more than 85. 23 Q. Are you an expert in temperature, 24 Mr. Woodyard? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60419 John Woodyard 123 1 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. I don't 2 know what an expert in temperature is. 3 MR. MC CLAIN: You put forward 4 this fellow DeChiara who you claimed was 5 an expert in temperature. 6 MR. MC CLAIN: Are you an expert 7 in temperature. 8 MR. GOUTMAN: I never put forth an 9 expert in temperature in my life. An 10 expert in HVAC system. 11 MR. MC CLAIN: And the temperature 12 obtained within the HVAC system, according 13 to you. 14 MR. GOUTMAN: Right. 15 MR. MC CLAIN: Are you an 16 expert -- 17 MR. GOUTMAN: As I recall, you had 18 a CIH testify as an expert in that field. 19 MR. MC CLAIN: Yes, I did. 20 MR. GOUTMAN: Is there a question? 2 1 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 22 Q. Are you an expe rt in the temperature of 23 air passing through du c t work? 24 A. Yes. I've had design courses in HVAC ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060420 John Woodyard 124 1 design before. 2 Q. And did you take any measurements in this 3 building o f the temperature in the building or 4 are you re lying up on the te stimony of others? 5 A. I' m relying on my re view of the 6 spec ificat ions for how the HVAC system is 7 supp osed t o work, how it wa s designed to work and 8 how , accor ding to Mr. Buhey (phonetic), it 9 cont inued to work throughou t the life of the 10 building. 11 Q. And where do you opi ne on that subject in 12 your repor t? In your first report? 13 MR. GOUTMAN: We've been through 14 thi s . 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. You 're sayi ng that that's contained in 17 your first report? 18 A. I' m saying that's my opinion. 19 MR . GOUTMAN: Page 2 8. 20 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 1 Q. At page 2 8. So that 's the opinion that 22 you ' re ren dering i n this ca se, is the one that's 23 cont ained on page 28 of you r first report? 24 MR . GOUTMAN: Objection. The ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60421 John Woodyard 125 1 opinion that he's rendering are the 2 opinions that you're soliciting in this 3 deposition. 4 MR. MC CLAIN: No. I am not 5 allowed to inquire on that first report 6 according to you, unless you're opening up 7 the whole deposition so I can inquire on 8 the first report. So you can't expand his 9 testimony into an area that he didn't 10 opine on in the first report. 11 MR. GOUTMAN .* You took that chance 12 when you asked him those questions. And I 13 think it's pretty clear from Mr. Jones 14 (phonetic) that if you inquire in the 15 matter of his deposition, it's fair game. 16 MR. MC CLAIN: No. It's not - 17 this is not a matter of gamesmanship where 18 you can try to slip in little things from 19 the first report, and then prevent me from 20 examining him on his first report. I 21 didn't ask him anything, except where in 22 your report does it say that. You cited 23 to page 28 and that's the opinions that 24 he'll be held to, I believe. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60422 John Woodyard 126 1 MR. GOUTMAN: Thank you, Your 2 Honor. 3 MR . MC CLAIN: I haven't asked him 4 anything beyond what's in his report. 5 MR . GOUTMAN: I think the 6 questions and answers are a matter of 7 record. 8 MR . ZIEGLAR: For the record, the 9 testimony was given by Mr. Goutman and not 10 the witness 11 MR . GOUTMAN: What testimony? 12 MR . ZIEGLAR : That it was at page 13 28. Whatever the reference was. 14 MR. GOUTMAN: That was from 15 earlier in the deposition, about an hour 16 ago . 17 MR. MC CLAIN: If a Court allows 18 him to wander into that, then we'll see 19 what has to be done about it. It may go 20 swimmingly for you as Mr. DeChiara did. 2 1 That's what the reports were. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. Anyway, back to the foil issue. And by 24 the way, Mr. DeChiara thought so. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060423 John Woodyard 127 1 In regard to the foil issue, you 2 mentioned that the foil somehow - 3 MS. HERSCHEL: You discussed his 4 testimony with our expert, didn't you, 5 Mr. Me Clain ? 6 MR. MC CLAIN: Mr. DeChiara walked 7 up to me in the middle of the courtroom 8 and told me what a great job I had done 9 three times, to Mr. Goutman's 10 consternation. 11 MR. GOUTMAN: I object to that. 12 BY MR. MC CLAIN 13 Q. The foil issue in regard to the report 14 you state that the foil somehow impacted this 15 or mediated the heating process within the du 16 work? 17 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to form. 19 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 20 Q. Do you recall that? 2 1 MR. GOUTMAN: What are you 22 referring to? 23 THE WITNESS: No. That's not 24 correct. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60424 John Woodyard 128 1 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 2 Q. It says in addition, there are two layers 3 of foil and one layering of heat sealing tape 4 between the iron and the PCB containing glue. 5 you see that? 6 A. Yes, I did. Do 7 Q. Would not the added layer of foil conduct 8 heat, Mr. Woodyard? Y' 9 A. Yes. Yes. The aluminum number is a good 10 heat conductor. But in answer to your question, 11 this isn't in here because it's intended to show 12 it's -- whether it's somehow slowed down heat 13 transfer. It's in this to illustrate that 14 there's a barrier on the other side of this heat 15 sealing process that would not allow PCBs to 16 excape through the foil. 17 Q. But it would increase the heat? Would it? 18 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form. 19 THE WITNESS: Not at all. The 20 heat conduction doesn't increase the heat. 21 It just doesn't resist it. 22 BY MR. MCCLAIN: 23 Q. So the heat conduction would continue, 24 even though there was an aluminum backing in ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060425 John Woodyard 129 1 regard to the duct; am I right? 2 A. Yeah. Two layers, ac tually. 3 Q- Now, Mr. Woodyard, le t me what experiments 4 do you have or data do you h ave to support the 5 last bullet point, assuming for the sake of 6 argument, that the 250 degre e temperature at the 7 PCB containing glue to which Mr. Kominsky 8 testified, released a few mo lecules of PCBs. 9 These PCBs would cool and co ndense immediately 10 under the fiberglass install ation? Do you have 11 any data or tests to demonst rate that? 12 A. Again, the evidence i n the case shows that 13 the air on the other side of i n at a 1 i-a. t i o n is at 14 or very close to room temper ature. This 15 fiberglass is an insulating material. Clearly, 16 as soon as that one molecule that we're talking 17 about leaves that mastic, as it should, it's 18 immediately going to get a much cooler surface, 19 condense and stay there permanently. 20 Q. Any data that you have to support that, 21 Mr. Woodyard? 22 MS. HERSCHEL: 23 at room temperature? 24 MR. MC CLAIN: That PCBs condense Or the idea that ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060426 John Woodyard 130 1 PCBs release what we condense on to 2 another surface and stay there. 3 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 4 Q- Do you have any data to support that idea? 5 A. I didn' t need to do an experiment. It' s 6 basic science as I just said. 7 Q. Do you have any data? 8 MR . GOUTMAN: I instruct the 9 witness not to answer. He answered the 10 question. You're not entitled to answer 11 twice. 12 MR. MC CLAIN: He didn't cite me 13 to any data. And I want to be sure that 14 he doesn't have any. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. Do you have any data to site me to that 17 opinion ? 18 MR. GOUTMAN: Instruct the witness 19 not to answer. He already answer that 20 question. He said it was basic science. 21 MR. MC CLAIN: Well, basic science 22 does not inform me as to what he's relying 23 upon . 24 MR. GOUTMAN: If you want to know ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60427 John Woodyard 131 1 what he means by basic science, why don't 2 you ask him that. Don't keep asking him 3 the same question hoping to get a 4 different answer. 5 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm not asking for 6 a different answer. 7 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 8 Q- I just want to know is there any data that 9 he cou Id cite me to. Cite me to your basic 10 s cienc e data that supports thi s opinion ? 11 A. Abaaeioj: 1262, by itself f is a sticky 12 resin, essentially a solid at room temperature. 13 And it is mixed with a bunch o f other material 14 into a material that solidifie s further and 15 attaches to the foil 16 Q. How is the 1262 utilized in the glue as a 17 sticky resin or as a liquified material; do you 18 know? 19 A. 20 It was used as a solid. MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to the 2 1 form . 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. It was used as a solid when it went into 24 the adhesive. Is that your testimony? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060428 John Woodyard 132 1 A. It's a solid when it's used and it's a 2 solid when it's done, except in the case of being 3 an additive, there were other solvents that were 4 used. Toluene to dissolve it. So that it could 5 be added and mixed, then the toluene is 6 dissolved. 7 Q. So it went into solution with the toluene; 8 i s that right? 9 A. 10 Q. I don't know that. Po s sibly. How is i t applied in -- how does is it 11 supposed to go into the mix to make the adhesive; 12 do you know? 13 A. As a -- I would assume as a liquid mixture 14 with toluene. 15 Q. Did that influence itsvapor pressure? 16 A. Absolutely not. 17 Q. So mixing 1262 with toluene does not in 18 any way change it's vapor pressure; is that 19 correct? 20 A. That's correct. 2 1 MS. HERSCHEL: Asked and answered. 22 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 23 Q. Does it change the waythat it vaporizes 2 4 if PCBs are suspended in toluene? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060429 John Woodyard 133 1 A. No. 2 Q. What would you rely upon to reach that 3 conclusion? Are there experiments or tests that 4 have been done to show that? 5 A. Again, it's basic science. Mixing two 6 chemicals like that has no effect on the vapor 7 pressure of either one. 8 Q. Does it effect its releasability. 9 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 10 form . 11 THE WITNESS: I've never heard 12 that term before. 13 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 14 Q. Have you read Docto r Erickson's book ? 15 A. No . I own it and I 've referred to i t. 16 Q. You ' ve never read i t? 17 A. Not in the way I re ad a novel, no . 18 MS. HERS CHE L: You mean from cover 19 to cover? 20 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 21 Q. So you don't know whether he's opined on 22 that subject of mixing PCBs with other solvents 23 and what effect that has on the releasability of 24 the PCBs; is that correct? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060430 John Woodyard 134 1 A. I don't know, offhand. 2 Q- You would rely upon his opinions in that 3 regard; would you not? 4 A. No, not necessarily. 5 Q. Are you more expert than Doctor Erickson 6 in regard to the chemical properties of PCBs? 7 A. I don't understand the "more expert". 8 It's basic science. I learned this in school. 9 Doctor Erickson, I'm sure, learned it in school. 10 Q. So you are as qualified as Doctor Erickson 11 to opine on the chemical properties of PCBs. Is 12 that your testimony? 13 A. No. I'm talking about your specific 14 question related to how toluene might have 15 somehow enhanced the vapor pressure of PCB. 16 Q. Come back to the question. 17 Do you or do you not rely upon 18 Doctor Erickson's book to render opinions about 19 the physical properties of PCBs? 20 A. 2 1 Q. Not typically, no. You don't -- and you don't find it to be 22 authoritative; is that correct? 23 A. I don't know. I probably not. I haven't 24 read the whole book. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060431 John Woodyard 135 1 Q- So Doctor Erickson, in your view, is not 2 an authoritative expert on PCBs; is that true ? 3 A. No. We're talking about his book. 4 Q- You don't find his book to be 5 authoritative; am I right? Is that your 6 testimony? 7 A. I have not read his wh ole book. 8 MR. GOUTMAN: Do you want to cite 9 hi m to a specific port ion ? 10 MR. MC CLAIN: No. I'm j u s t 11 as king because you- sto od up before the 12 ju ry and said this is the Bible. I want 13 to know whether this w itness -- 14 THE WITNESS; N o, he didn' t. 15 MS. HERSCHEL: Mr. Rue (ph onetic) 16 s a id that. 17 MR. GOUTMAN: Excuse me. If I can 18 ju st finish my stateme nt without 19 in terruption. 20 MR. MC CLAIN: Go ahead. 21 MR. GOUTMAN: If you want to show 22 him a book and ask him whether A, he ' s 23 familiar with that passage; and B, whether 24 he finds it authoritative, that's fine . ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60432 John Woodyard 136 1 But you can't ask a witness who's just 2 told you he hasn't the entire book, 3 whether everything in the book is 4 authoritative. 5 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 6 Q- Is it a standard work in the field of PCB 7 related research? 8 A. I'm sorry. I don't know what a standard 9 work is. 10 Q. So you don't find it to be authoritative 11 as a whole; am I right? 12 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 13 MR. MC CLAIN: Doctor Erickson's 14 book that has been shown to the jury - 15 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. 16 MR. MC CLAIN: -- by defense 17 counsel repeatedly. 18 MR. GOUTMAN: He said he hasn't 19 read the entire book. How could he 20 possibly answer that question? 21 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 22 Q. What books have you read on PCB related 23 analytical chemistry? Then tell me. 24 A. I probably have never read a book on PCB ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060433 John Woodyard 137 1 chemistry from cover to cover. And I've referred 2 to probably dozens of them as reference works, 3 just like Doctor Erickson. 4 Q- So do you refer to Doctor Erickson's book 5 as a reference work or not? 6 A. Yes, I do. 7 Q. And what other books do you find -- do you 8 refer to as reference works? 9 A. For PCB related issues? 10 Q. Yes. 11 A. There are many. I have files and so forth 12 all over my office about this. 13 Q. Just tell me which ones you recall. 14 A. I can't recall one specifically off the 15 top of my head. Some of it is also technical 16 articles from scientific journals where people 17 have done. 18 Q. Do you recall any other than Doctor 19 Erickson's book? 20 A. Not specifically. I'm sorry. 2 1 Q. So other than Doctor Erickson's book, you 22 can't cite us to any reference that you would 23 rely upon; is that correct? 24 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. It's ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060434 John Woodyard 138 1 been asked and answered. Don't answer the 2 question. You're not entitled to ask the 3 same question over and over again. 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q. 6 7 Is that true? MR. GOUTMAN: Don't answer the que s tion. 8 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 9 Q. Do you even rely upon your own works? 10 Would you find them to be authoritative? 11 A. As far as the first part of your question, 12 I, of course, go back to different papers and 13 other documents I've written as references. 14 Q. And you would find those to be 15 authoritative, wouldn't you? 16 A. Certainly, the portions I'd look at I 17 would depend upon, yes. 18 Q. You wrote them, didn't you? 19 A. Absolutely. 20 Q. What parts didn't you look at within your 2 1 own articles? 22 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection. Overly 23 broad. 24 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060435 John Woodyard 139 1 THE WITNE SS I don ' t kn ow . Are 2 we talking about a spe cif ic revi ew that 3 did or in general ? 4 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 5 Q. Are there any par t s o f your own art i cle s 6 th at aren' t authoritativ e , th at you don ' t rely 7 upon ? 8 A. No. I don't believe so. 9 Q. Tell me, Mr. Woodyard, does the surface 10 area influence the amount of PCBs that are 11 vaporized -- the surface area exposed containing 12 PCBs? 13 MR. GOUTMAN: Are you talking 14 about pure PCBs now? 15 MR. MC CLAIN: PCBs that are pure 16 and a mixture. It doesn't matter. 17 MR. GOUTMAN: I object. It's a 18 compound question. You said it doesn't 19 matter. 20 THE WITNESS: For pure PCBs, 2 1 vaporization rates are based on units of 22 surface area, that's correct. 23 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 24 Q. Do you believe that that changes when it's ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060436 John Woodyard 140 1 in solution or does that still -- that principle 2 of basic science still apply? 3 A. You're using the term in solution. What 4 we're talking about here is in solid, which is 5 not solution. 6 Q- It went into solution before it became a 7 solid; did it not? 8 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form 9 of the question. 10 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 11 Q. And it's a semi solid if it's in glue, 12 isn't it? 13 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 14 form of the question. 15 THE WITNESS: No. Apparently, 16 you've misunderstood. 17 What is true is that the material 18 was or may have been delivered for mixing 19 as a solution with toluene. It was then 20 mixed, the product was treated, the 21 toluene was driven off. It's a solid 22 material. 23 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 24 Q. And can you tell us whether or not the ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060437 John Woodyard 141 1 surface area that is exposed affects the 2 vaporization of even a solid material or not? 3 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to form 4 of the question. 5 MR. GOUTMAN: Vaporization of PCBs 6 in a solid material; is that right? Is 7 that the question? You're nodding your 8 head yes? 9 MR. MC CLAIN: Yes. 10 THE WITNESS: I don't know. It's 11 going to be a function of what the solid 12 material was. In this case, my opinion is 13 that it was locked in and that it's not 14 available for vaporization. 15 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 16 Q. Any -- no matter what the surface area of 17 the material that it's found in; is that true? 18 A. That's correct. 19 Q. So the surface area of a solid, you think 20 does not matter in regard to vaporization of 21 PCBs? That would be your testimony? 22 MR. GOUTMAN: Objection to the 23 form of the question. 24 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060438 John Woodyard 142 1 form. 2 MR. GOUTMAN: How is that question 3 different than the question you just 4 asked? 5 MR. MC CLAIN: I don't need this 6 colloquy back and forth. 7 MR. GOUTMAN: I don't need you to 8 sit here and ask the same question over 9 and over. 10 MR. MC CLAIN: I'm not asking the 11 same question. He was answering the 12 question. He was about to expand upon his 13 answer and you've interrupted him. Can 14 you read him the question back? 15 MR. GOUTMAN: Excuse me. You had 16 just asked the question same question you 17 had just asked. Now you've begun it 18 again. 19 (Whereupon the court reporter read 20 back the requested question.) 2 1 MR. MC CLAIN: That's the 22 que s tion. 23 THE WITNESS: And I answered that 24 before, by saying pure PCBs or other ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060439 John Woodyard 143 1 liquids, vaporization is often exposed as 2 a function of surface area, but not in a 3 solid material which is what the 1262 is, 4 not in a solid matrix we're talking about, 5 not in the glue. 6 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 7 Q- Tell me what principles of basic science 8 forms your opinion about that? Why would that 9 change, depending upon whether that was now a 10 solid as opposed to a pure liquid or pure PCBs? 11 A. 12 Q. Most solids don't evaporate. At all? 13 A. At any appreciable rate. It's not 14 measurable for most solids. It doesn't happen. 15 MR. GOUTMAN: This table has been 16 evaporating during this deposition. 17 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 18 Q. It does, as a matter of fact? Doesn't it? 19 Doesn't this table evaporate? Is there an 20 evaporation rate of even this table? 21 A. This table is made up of a lot of 22 different things. What part are you talking 23 about ? 24 Q. Let's talk about the varnish on the ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060440 John Woodyard 144 1 exterior of it. That evaporates, doesn't it? 2 A. It may. 3 Q- It has an evaporation rate? 4 A. I don't know. I'd have to look i t up . 5 It ' s a solid. 6 Q- And can you tell me whether or not in your 7 view then, PCBs found in solids wi 11 h ave any 8 evaporation rate or simply not an appreciable 9 one, to use your words? 10 A. I don't know. My opinion is, it has no 11 vaporization. 12 MR. MC CLAIN: No vaporization? 13 Okay. Doctor Erickson, that's all I have. 14 MS. HERSCHEL: Woodyard. 15 MR. MC CLAIN: Woodyard. 16 * * * 17 EXAMINATION 18 * * * 19 BY MR. NEAL 20 Q- You indicate in your repo r t tha t you had 21 two s i te vi sits to the Tran sport at ion and Safety 22 Buildi ng; i s that c orrect ? 23 A. 24 Q- My o riginal report? No . You're suppleme n t al report . On the ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60441 John Woodyard 145 1 first page, last sentence? 2 A. Yes, sir. You're correct. 3 Q. When was the first visit? 4 A. I'm sorry. I don't remember the exact 5 date. It was 1997, I believe. 6 Q. Do you remember what month what portion of 7 the year? 8 A. No, not off the top of my head. 9 sorry. I'm 10 Q- You don' know whether it was the early 11 par t o f the year or latter part o f the year ? 12 A. If I hazard a guess, it's summer or fall 13 Q. Okay. 14 1997? It's all right. But it was in 15 A. 16 Q. That's correct. And on the first visit, what were you 17 there for? 18 A. To tour the occupied floors of the 19 building -- what were termed the occupied floors 20 of the building. 2 1 Q. You were taken on a tour of the occupied 22 floors ? 23 A . Yes, sir. 24 Q. Were they occupied at the time? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60442 John Woodyard 146 1 A. No, they were not? 2 Q. Did you go above the ceiling? 3 A. Yes, I did. 4 Q. And how many places? 5 A. 6 Q- Two or three, perhaps. The same floor? Two or three different 7 floors ? 8 A. I don ' t recall. I th ink it was two or 9 th ree dif fere nt floors. 10 Q. And di d you have to wear any ki nd o f 11 pr o te ction ? 12 A. No . 13 Q. You j u st looked above the ce:Lli ng; is that 14 CO rre ct? You looked at the duct wo:trk ? 15 A. That's correct. 16 Q. And ho w long was that vis it? 17 A. It was for a day 18 Q. Other than going onto the fl<sor and 19 lo oki ng above the ceili ng, d id you do anything 20 el se with reg ards to yo ur vi sit? I ' m talking 21 ab out in 1997 22 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 23 form . 24 THE WITNESS: Do you have specific ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060443 John Woodyard 147 1 dates in mind? 2 BY MR. NEAL: 3 Q. Other than touring the f 1 oors themselves 4 and go ing up, above the flo r s on two or three 5 dif f er ent occasions, did yo u do anything else 6 bes i de s just tour the facil i ty ? 7 A. I, on several occasi ons t opened and 8 insp ec ted the floor troughs 9 Q Anything else? 10 A. Not that I can recal 1, un less you have a 11 part icular activity in mind 12 Q. No. That's why I'm ask in g you . I just 13 want ed to find out. 14 Did you do a ny te sting? 15 A. No. I did not take any s amples. 16 Q. Was it just you? 17 A. No . 18 Q. 19 A. Who else was there? There were several o the r construe tion 20 expe rt s with me. 21 Q. 22 A. Do you recall who they we re? I believe Mr. DeChia r a wa s one of them. I 23 don ' t remember the other names 24 Q- After that, when was th.e second v isit you ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60444 John Woodyard 148 1 made ? 2 A. Again, I don't recall. I think it was 3 later that year. 4 Q. What was the purpose of that visit? 5 A. The purpose was largely to inspect bags of 6 debris that were on the six fl oor . 7 Q. Who gave you that task? And by inspecting 8 bags o f debris, you mean just opening them up and 9 taking a look what' s inside? 10 A . Yes . If I recall, that material was 11 slated for removal at that point. And since it 12 was in sealed bags, we wanted to, at least, take 13 a look through and see what types o f material 14 were there. 15 Q. And they left it up to you for the dirty 16 work ? 17 A. And another individual. 18 Q. Did you take anything from the debris, any 19 samples of anything from the waste? 20 A. No, I did no t . 2 1 Q- How long wer e you there ? 22 A. In that case r hal f a day, probably an hour 23 on the six floor. 24 Q. Half a day, an ho ur on the sixth floor? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060445 John Woodyard 149 1 A. Half a day at the site at the building. 2 An hour actually in there doing bag opening, an 3 hour oo:r two. I al 4 floor, trying to 1 5 Q. So was the 6 floor -- that half 7 floor? 8 A. I'm not certain. We may h 9 fifth floor or another floor that 10 Q. 11 A. All on the contained floor I believe so. I believe so. 12 Q. You didn't do any testing other than 13 looking at what the debris that was in the 14 different bags, correct? 15 A. That's correct. 16 Q. Now, in your report on the first bullet 17 point, you indicated the process of sealing the 18 tape placed the iron over any several inch 19 section of the tape for a few seconds only. 20 What do you mean by "any several 21 inch section?" 22 q. It's Probably an awkward way of saying 23 that the iron was applied pretty much uniformly 24 to all the ducts and any particular section of ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060446 John Woodyard 150 1 duct would have only seen the iron for a few 2 seconds. 3 Q- We'll get to that. But as far as when 4 you're doing the actual heat sealing, they seal 5 the entire length of the tape; is that correct? 6 A. That's true. 7 Q. So when you say over any several inch 8 section, you don't mean by that, that it was just 9 sealing just a couple of inches? 10 A. No. On the contrary, I think the other 11 language that was in some of the Certainteed 12 exhibits referred to the thorough -- I forgot, 13 thorough and complete was, perhaps, the language. 14 It implied that it would be uniformly applied 15 across all the tape. 16 Q. So you mean by that, and I don't want to 17 put words in your mouth, that when the iron is 18 placed over any several inch section of the tape 19 for a few seconds only, it means running the 20 lenth of the tape over the sealing of the joint, 21 correct? 22 A. That was my intent, yes. As I said 23 was not worded as clearly as it might be . 24 Q. And am I correct that yo u te s t i f ied ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60447 John Woodyard 151 1 earlier that where you got this for a few seconds 2 only, you got that from one of the exhibits which 3 was CT 49, on page CT 00211. 4 A. Yes. That's correct. 5 Q. And in this particular incident, you 6 equated running the sealing tool over entire tape 7 to mean a few seconds? 8 A. Yes, sir. 9 Q. And by "a few seconds", what do you mean 10 in terms of time span? 11 A. A couple. To me that means one to two, 12 three seconds, perhaps. 13 Q. So from one to three seconds? 14 A. If you want to tie it down, that's what I 15 meant by a few. 16 Q. I'm just trying to understand what you 17 mean by what you have in your report? 18 A. I understand it's not a very precise term. 19 Q. But other than what was contained in what 20 I just referred you to, which is DCT 49, there's 21 nothing else that you read that indicated how 22 long it should take to heat seal properly the 23 duct tape -- the sealing tape? 24 A. That's correct. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060448 John Woodyard 152 1 Q- Now, you in bullet point 3, you talked 2 about as part of the testing, that the ductboard 3 adhesive that these samples were heated up from 4 three hundred degrees Farenheit to 350 degrees 5 Farenheit in 72 hours; is that correct? 6 A. Yes, sir. 7 Q. What was the purpose for that and why was 8 that important to you? 9 If that's a compound question, 10 I'll ask the first one. 11 12 BY MR. NEAL: MR. GOUTMAN: That's okay. 13 Q. What was the purpose of doing that? 14 A. The purpose of this test is to guarantee 15 the integrity of the product. It's to make sure 16 that at least that temperature at that severe -- 17 extremely severe treatment, it doesn't come 18 apart. 19 Q. And I think you indicated, transfer one 20 that whatever that said, it was DCT 38, the 21 specification. 22 A. I don't recall the order. There were 23 several. 24 Q. Okay. You also referring to the lab ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60449 John Woodyard 153 1 reports -- the several lab reports? 2 A. Yeah. There were several lab reports. 3 There was a specification. 4 Q- Would you just pick out the first couple 5 of lab reports which are DCT 32 and, let's say, 6 88 . 7 8 A. 32 . Do you have both of those? 9 Q. 10 A . DCT 32 and DCT 88. Yes, I have them. 11 Q. This is, as you understand it, is a te s t 12 run or conducted by whom? 13 A. Who conducted this test? 14 A. The laboratory. 15 Q. For whom? 16 A. Gustin-Bacon. 17 Q- And Gustin-Bacon subjected to certain 18 conditions -- and do you see under determination? 19 I' m looking at the June 20, 1962 memo. 20 A. 2 1 Q- Okay . And it says tack time. What does tack 22 time mean? 23 A . I don't know. 24 Q- What does open time mean? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060450 John Woodyard 154 1 A. I don't know. 2 Q- It says plasticizer migration. Do you 3 know what they doing when they were testing for 4 that? 5 A. I asked the same question. It, apparently 6 these adhesives did not work well, specifically, 7 with vinyl or did not adhere well to vinyl. And 8 there was a test that they performed specific to 9 vinyl which is cited here to see how you per 10 formed for that particular application. 11 Q. And in the second DCT 88, again, they use 12 the same kind of language. We're talking about 13 tack time, open time, et cetera; is that correct? 14 A . Yes, sir. 15 Q. Again, it talks about plasticizer 16 migration. Do you have any idea now what that's 17 referring to? Was it referring to the same 18 thing ? 19 A. It's exactly the same test. 20 Q. One is June 20th, 1962. That was the 2 1 earlier memo and this is 10/19/65. 22 Do you know if they're still doing 23 it for vinyl, to see if it is adhesive with 24 vinyl? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060451 John Woodyard 155 1 A. Today? 2 Q- Yeah. 3 A. No, I don't know. 4 Q. Now, you indicated you asked about 5 plasticizer migration. 6 7 A. Who did you ask about that? Mrs. Herschel. 8 Q- But you didn't talk to anybody in 9 Certainteed? 10 A. No, I did not. 11 Q. Now, there's a second part of it, on the 12 third bullet. In addition during the 13 manufacturing process, the ductboard was heated 14 to between two hundred degrees Farenheit and four 15 hundred degrees Farenheit to dry the adhesive; is 16 that correct? 17 A . Yes, sir. 18 Q. What is the purpose of drying the 19 adhesive? 20 A. As we discussed earlier, it's blended as a 2 1 mix of liquid or semi liquid materials with about 22 a 60 percent solid content. So the drying 23 process is to remove water and presumably light 24 solvent like, like toluene which we discussed, ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060452 John Woodyard 156 1 and allow the material to solidify and set up, 2 again, the two materials itself holding the 3 fiberglass and the board. 4 Q. When the plasticizer is utilized is it in 5 its dry state or doesn't it contain at this 6 particular point the toluene and other solvents? 7 MR. GOUTMAN: I didn't understand 8 the question. What is utilized? 9 MR. NEAL: When the actual end 10 adhesive. 11 MS. HERSCHEL: 12 plasticizer. 13 BY MR. NEAL: You said 14 Q. When it's used as plasticizer. 15 MR. GOUTMAN: PCBs. 16 BY MR. NEAL: 17 Q. When the PCBs are used as a plasticizer in 18 the adhesive, is the adhesive, before it's 19 applied, in a solid state, a dry state? What 20 kind of state is it in? 21 A. I would assume it's somewhat fluid which 22 is why it's mixed with these other materials to 23 allow it to be spread and then it's dried in 24 these ovens at these temperatures for the time ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060453 John Woodyard 157 1 rate we talked about to remove water, to remove 2 solvents. 3 Q- Have you seen theplasticizerutilized in 4 duetboard? 5 A- Have I seen it applied to make this 6 happen? 7 Q- Yes. 8 A. No, I have not. 9 Q. Now, the next bullet point that you have 10 is, the evidence in this case is that the 11 rectangular duetboard had neither delaminated nor 12 suffered any significant damage in the more than 13 30 years that it was in the T&S Building. 14 What evidence are you referring 15 to? 16 A. First, my own inspection. Second, 17 testimony from Mr. Buhay about the condition of 18 the duetboard or duct work, in general, as well 19 as the report and testimony of Mr. Kominsky which 20 showed, among other things, photographic evidence 21 of the intact duetboard itself. 22 Q. How many photos are you talking about of 23 Mr. Kominsky's? 24 A. How many photos? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060454 John Woodyard 158 1 Q. You said there were photographs of the 2 ductboard? 3 A. Yes, sir. They were in his expert report, 4 if I recall. 5 Q. So what's contained in his expert report 6 are the photos that you looked at and indicated 7 that that is part of the evidence that this -- it 8 had part of the laminate; is that correct? 9 A. Yes, sir. 10 Q. And Mr. Buhay's testimony was the duct 11 work was in pretty good condition? 12 MS. HERSCHEL: Object to the form. 13 He didn't say it was in pretty good 14 condition. 15 THE WITNESS: I don 't recall his 16 exact words but he said it 17 MS . HERSCHEL: He s aid in good 18 condition. 19 BY MR. NEAL: 20 Q. And on his first visit is where you went 21 on up, above the ceiling and looked at the duct 22 work; is that correct? 23 A. Yeah. I found no reason to dispute any 24 testimony of the photographs I had seen. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060455 John Woodyard 159 1 Q- Now, the next bullet point you talked 2 about the PCBs in the adhesive were bound into 3 the matrix of the glue and except under extreme 4 changes of temperature, such as those created by 5 a fire, would have remaind there. 6 MS. HERSCHEL: Objection to the 7 form of the question. 8 THE WITNESS: Wha t I'm referring 9 to when I say that is, th e temperature it 10 would be exposed to in a fire situation. 11 BY MR. NEAL: 12 Q. So it would have to be a situation, such 13 as a fire which, in your opinion , would release 14 th e PCBs? 15 A . Yes, sir. 16 Q. And you got the second to the last bullet 17 po int you say that you don't bel ieve there are 18 an y measureable levels of PCBs r eleased from the gi19 ue matrix during the installat ion; is that 20 co rrect? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Is that based -- I got a little lost in 23 the earlier part of your testimony. You did not 24 conduct any testing in that regard, is that ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060456 John Woodyard 160 1 correct, of any kind of levels of PCBs under the 2 conditions of heat ceiling? You, personally. 3 A. You're referring to testing during the 4 application of it? 5 Q- To see if there were any measurable 6 releases of PCBs? 1 A. No. I did not do that type of testing. 8 Q- When you say measurable level, what do you 9 mean measurable? 10 A. Levels that could be measured by the types 11 of precise analytical and testing devices that 12 are available. 13 Q. So you say it would be below the level of 14 detection ? 15 A. Well below, yes. 16 Q. Do you believe there is some level that is 17 released? And I'm talking about release of PCBs? 18 A. No. I have no reason to believe there's 19 any PCBs released from there. 20 Q. Do you have any other evidence or basis 21 for making that statement, that you do not 22 believe there are any measurable levels of PCBs? 23 MS. HERSCHEL: Other than what's 24 in his report? ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060457 John Woodyard 161 1 BY MR. NEAL 2 Q. 3 A. Othe r than what's in your repor t? His report? My report? 4 Q. Your report? 5 A. Refe r r ing to this report. 6 Q. Refe r ring to your supplemental report. 7 That's all I'm talk ing about. 8 A. No . I think the bullets here p retty much 9 sum up why that's the case, 10 Q. And your last bullet point abou t -- even 11 if for the sake of argument 250 degree 12 temperature released a few molecules o f PCB 13 containing glue to which Mr. Kominsky testified 14 released a few molecules of PCBss, the se PCBs 15 would cool and condense immediately on to the 16 fiberglass insulation? 17 What do you mean by a f ew 18 molecules ? 19 A. Between one and three. I think is my 20 te s timony. 21 q. So is it's between one and three as it is 22 one and three seconds. It's one and three 23 molecules. That's about a molecule a second? 24 A. I'm referring to an extremely small ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060458 John Woodyard 162 1 number. 2 Q. 3 4 5 6 And the basis for that statement is, what? MR. GOUTMAN: What statement? MR. NEAL: The last bullet point. The statement that only a few molecules of PCBs would be released and would cool and 7 condense. 8 BY MR. NEAL: 9 Q- I think you talked about cool and condense 10 being basic science, I understand that. 11 MR. GOUTMAN: He says assuming a 12 few molecules. 13 MR. NEAL: I'm not arguing with 14 that. 15 BY MR. NEAL: 16 Q. In the last bullet point you state 17 assuming, for the sake of argument, there would 18 be a few molecules and that they would cool and 19 condense immediately; is that correct? 20 A. Yes. 2 1 Q. And I'm asking you is, what is the basis 2 2 for the basis that even assume a molecules would 23 be released? 24 MS. HERSCHEL: I truly don't ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060459 John Woodyard 163 1 understand that question. Would you 2 rephrase it? 3 BY MR. NEAL: 4 Q- I'm trying to understand what you mean 5 when you say, let's talk for the sake of argument 6 that 250 degree temperature releases some PCBs? 7 You say, in your opinion, there would be only a 8 few molecules. 9 MR. GOUTMAN: He's saying he's 10 assuming they would release a few 11 molecules. 12 BY MR. NEAL: 13 Q. What do you basis it on? 14 MR. GOUTMAN: It's an assumption. 15 BY MR. NEAL: 16 Q. You' re assuming that it's a few molecules 17 as opposed to a lot of molecules as opposed to 50 18 molecules ? I'1m trying to get at why you say only 19 a few molecules. You assume that only a few 20 molecules. Why would you not assume that only 21 ten or 15 molelcules could you also would be 22 released? 23 A. Because there no evidence that there were 24 any molecules release. That's my opinion. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060460 John Woodyard 164 1 Q- When you talk about condense, you mean 2 changing from a vapor state to a liquid state? 3 A. Yeah, or in this case a solid, sticky 4 resin. 5 MR. NEAL: I have no further 6 questions. 7 *** 8 EXAMINATION 9 *** 10 BY MR. MC CLAIN: 11 Q. You mentioned that the adhesive dries or 12 the document talks about the adhesive drying? Do 13 you remember that document? 14 A . Yes, sir. 15 Q. When the adhesive dries, are none of the 16 PCBs vaporized in the glue? Is that your 17 testimony? 18 A. Yes. That's correct. 19 MR. MC CLAIN: Okay. 20 MR. GOUTMAN: For the record, I 21 think when we were going back and forth on 22 an objection, I said something to the 23 effect that the ductboard never 24 experienced temperature to three hundred ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060461 John Woodyard 165 1 and foujr hundred degrees. Of course, I 2 meant under normal operating conditions. 3 And we all know during the ductboard what 4 occurred was a higher number -- higher 5 temperature during the fire. I just want 6 to clarify that because I want the record 7 to be complete. 8 *** 9 (Whereupon the deposition was 10 concluded at 1:45 p.m.) 11 * * * 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060462 John Woodyard 166 1 CERTIFICATE 2 I hereby certify that the witness 3 was duly sworn by me and that the 4 deposition is a true record of the 5 testimony given by the witness. 6 0 7 8 9 DEBORAH L. CASMER-REYERS* Commissioner of Deeds 10 Commonwealth of Pennsylvania My Commission expires 11 October 2, 2003 12 13 (The foregoing certification of 14 this transcript does not apply to any 15 reproduction of the same by any means, 16 unless under the direct control and/or 17 supervision of the certifying shorthand 18 reporter.) 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60463 John Woodyard 1 LAWYER'S NOTES 2 PAGE LINE 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES 167 TOWOLDMON0060464 John Woodyard 168 1 INSTRUCTIONS TO WITNESSES 2 Read your deposition over carefully. 3 is your right to read your deposition and make It 4 changes in form or substance. You should assign a 5 reason in the appropriate column on the errata 6 sheet for any change made. 7 After making any change in form or 8 substance which has been noted on the following 9 errata sheet along with the reason for any change, 10 sign your name on the errata sheet and date it. 11 Then sign your deposition at the end of 12 your testimony in the space provided. You are 13 signing it subject to the changes you have made in 14 the errata sheet, which will be attached to the 15 deposition before filing. You must sign it in 16 front of a witne s s. Have the witness sign in the 17 space provided. The witne ss need not be a notary 18 public. Any competent adult may w itnes s your 19 signature. 20 Return the original errata sheet and 21 transcript to the deposing attorney (attorney 22 asking questions) promptly! Court rules require 23 filing within 30 days after you receive the 24 deposition. ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060465 John Woodyard 1 ERRATA SHEET 2 PAGE LINE CHANGE 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES 169 TOWOLDMON0060466 John Woodyard 170 1 ACKNOWLEDGMENT OF DEPONENT 2 3 I, do hereby 4 certify that I have read the foregoing pages, 5 and that the same is a correct 6 transcription of the answers given by me to the 7 questions therein propounded, except for the 8 corrections or changes in form or substance, if 9 any, noted in the attached Errata Sheet. 10 11 12 DATE : 13 Subscribed and sworn to before me this 14 _____________ day of, 1 9 9_ . 15 My commission expires :_________________________________ 16 17 18 Notary Public 19 20 21 22 23 24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060467 John Woodyard 171 A able 59:13 94:14 101:11 about 11:18,22 13:4 17:22 19:13,18,19 19:22 21:9,11 22:6 23:2 25:23 26:2,3,7 26:18 27:1,12 27:2129:19 44:1,6 45:11 46:2,3 49:1 50:21,21 51:16,20,21 52:6,20 54:2 55:21 56:7 58:16 60:2,21 61:6,10 63:24 64:6 66:12 70:1,2 71:18 72:9 75:20 76:16 82:18 83:17 85:23 86:2 87:19 88:4,13 89:15 91:13 92:23 95:3,6,9 99:10 99:18 100:3 101:1102:7,9 102:15,20 106:16,17,19 106:22 107:15 107:16,18 108:1109:1 111:8 115:18 117:11 121:10 122:6 126:15 126:19 129:17 134:13,18 135:3 137:12 139:2,14 140:4 142:12 143:4,8,23,24 146:21152:2 154:12,15 155:4,6,21 157:l'l7,22 159:2160:17 161:7,10,23 162:9 164:1 164:12 above 2:8 21:23 22:19 50:19 84:8 107:6 119:16 122:6 122:13,17 146:2,13,19 147:4 158:21 absent 118:11 Absolutely 93:14 132:16 138:19 access 47:4 91:11 accompanied 8:3 according 7:3 77:12 91:9 99:12123:12 124:8125:6 accumulation 99:20 achieves 87:10 ACKNOWLE... 170:1 across 150:15 action 103:6 activate 52:11 activities 30:4 activity 147:11 actual 17:24 69:2185:2,10 150:4156:9 actually 8:18 13:5 28:20 36:14 37:14 43:1044:18 68:5 72:17 83:18 87:10 129:2 149:2 adapt 27:8 add 93:13 added 115:22 128:7 132:5 adding 88:21 addition 66:19 128:2155:12 additional 21:3 additive 132:3 adhere 154:7 adhered 83:16 adhesive 46:12 74:14 77:4,10 78:12,14 79:19 80:9 81:3,7,21 82:2 82:6,12,20 83:3,8,15,18 86:6,24 105:12 109:18 115:1,1 117:6 119:21121:13 131:24 132:11 152:3 154:23 155:15,19 156:10,18,18 159:2 164:11 164:12,15 adhesives 75:21 76:6,10,17 154:6 adjacent 121:9 admired 102:1 admissible 98:1 adopted 25:8 27:18 31:11 adult 168:18 ADVANCE 1:11 aerospace 1:10 3:916:219:18 20:1 affect 99:3 affects 141:1 after 7:2 21:2 34:13,23 43:23 59:21 60:5 90:23 102:15 114:19 117:23 147:24 168:7,23 again 22:12 28:4 30:23 59:15 60:5 79:15,18 80:6 80:22 81:20 81:22,23 82:12,15 85:10,20 86:7 88:3 102:9 104:21129:12 133:5 138:3 142:18 148:2 154:11,15 156:2 against 114:12 AGENCY 1:5 ago 13:1117:22 29:22 41:7 55:19,20 66:20 126:16 agree 100:13 103:15 ahead 41:5 56:23 61:24 76:13 80:4 100:2108:9 117:5 120:5 135:20 air 8:22,22 10:13,14,15 11:6 14:5 19:13 23:17 23:18 47:18 120:12 122:21 123:23 129:13 albeit 108:22 allow 128:15 156:1,23 allowed 96:7,11 125:5 allows 48:2 126:17 almost 88:20 along 16:12 47:4 85:1 91:11,15 168:9 already 39:3,5 45:18 75:24 130:19 although 51:10 aluminum 46:8 52:12128:9 128:24 always 34:4 62:17,22 63:3 63:14 102:1 ambient 10:22 AMERICA 1:11 among 6:20 102:17 157:20 amount 19:4 103:16,19 105:2 119:2 139:10 amounts 72:7 104:16 117:23 analysis 64:2 65:171:15 analyst 61:13 63:15 analysts 62:9 62:14 analytical 62:10,13,19 63:13 64:5 65:2 136:23 160:11 analyze 11:4 71:23 analyzing 70:24 71:3 and/or 166:16 another 15:21 28:9 29:19 33:6 80:8 81:20,21 82:12,24 83:3 85:7,18 86:3 95:5 99:6 130:2 148:17 149:9 answer 5:3 57:2 70:17 88:11 93:1 94:13,14 110:5 111:15 112:5 128:10 130:9,10,19 130:19 131:4 131:6 136:20 138:1,6 142:13 answered 95:17 130:9 132:21 138:1142:23 answering 142:11 answers 126:6 170:6 anybody 53:6 155:8 anymore 44:24 anyone 7:21 114:1 anything 42:18 42:2244:15 46:1 47:7 50:2151:18 54:1655:6 71:17111:17 117:11 125:21 126:4 146:19 147:5,9 148:18,19 Anyway 126:23 anywhere 68:1 112:11122:4 Aorclor 61:8 65:3,10 78:11 78:11,14,21 78:22 79:1,9 82:1,5,7,15 86:7,10,16,16 86:24 87:14 87:19,22 88:1 88:4,14,17,19 89:2,8,9 131:11 Aorclors 86:12 apart 81:9 115:2,8 152:18 apartment 16:4 21:9 32:18 apartments 30:7 apparently 140:15 154:5 appear 101:10 applicable 12:7 application 35:13 37:2 52:10,18 154:10 160:4 applications 43:5 applied 23:11 37:7 43:8 44:4 46:4 47:3,10 53:4,6 74:14 81:6,13 89:20 91:11 96:15 96:23 97:12 104:23 114:12 117:7 132:10 149:23 150:14 156:19 157:5 apply 12:18 82:19 113:20 140:2166:14 applying 104:13 appreciable 119:2,8,9 143:13 144:8 appreciate 58:17 appropriate 29:11 85:9 112:1 168:5 approved 46:14 approximately 91:12 arbitration 17:24 arbitrator 58:9 58:13 area 22:17 30:12 57:24 95:6 120:2,11 120:18 125:9 139:10,11,22 141:1,16,19 143:2 aren't 15:23 93:10,11 139:6 argue 113:19 arguing 162:13 argument 129:6 161:11 162:17 163:5 Aroclors 59:17 around 31:8 149:3 arrangement 31:4 articles 30:10 76:10 137:16 138:21 139:5 asked 7:21 26:1 38:19 57:18 58:3 60:16 74:22 96:5 109:11125:12 126:3 132:21 138:1142:4 142:16,17 154:5 155:4 asking 26:3,9 50:21 58:6,19 74:5 79:5 88:7 88:8 107:24 110:16 131:2 131:5 135:11 142:10 147:12 162:21168:22 aspect 10:4 aspects 16:19 assembled 46:10 assembly 47:5 assertion 66:3 assessment 33:18 assign 168:4 associated 17:8 83:18 assume 48:3 92:14 132:13 156:21 162:22 163:19,20 Assumes 104:18 assuming 129:5 162:11,17 163:10,16 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60468 John Woodyard 172 assumption 163:14 atmospher 96:24 atmosphere 95:13 attach 96:19 attached 24:13 46:18 109:19 121:16 168:14 170:9 attaches 121:8 131:15 attempted 89:18 attorney 168:21,21 Attorneys 3:5,9 3:13,17 attributed 18:13 Austin 15:12 28:6,13 authoritative 134:22 135:2 135:5,24 136:4,10 138:10,15 139:6 available 106:8 120:11121:16 141:14160:12 Avenue 2:19 average 81:3 84:18,20 Avon 24:12 25:4 away 72:13 awful 99:16 awkward 149:22 a.m 2:7 B B 2:15 4:8 135:23 back 8:19 44:9 51:6 67:2 90:16 96:9 100:17 102:14 102:20 103:4 108:20 126:23 134:16 138:12 142:6,14,20 164:21 background 8:576,8 18:13 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87:24 104:13 105:8 106:4,6 108:3,11 109:3,9 125:24 139:8 139:24 145:5 147:22 149:11 149:11159:17 160:16,18,22 below 160:13 160:15 bench 69:21 benefit 64:19 besides 9:18 42:22 51:18 147:6 best 103:5 better 81:16 158:16 between 23:24 49:6,6 59:16 79:19 85:8 90:10 114:2 118:13,13 122:21128:4 155:14 161:19 161:21 beyond 20:17 50:16 126:4 Bible 135:12 big 18:6 biology 55:2,4 blend 83:3 blended 155:20 blends 86:13 board 47:12 50:1156:3 boiling 109:21 112:6,17 118:20 119:5 119:6 boils 118:23 bond 77:10 79:19 88:21 108:15 book 75:14,16 87:21 89:1 111:17113:1 133:14 134:18 134:24 135:3 135:4,7,22 136:2,3,14,19 136:24 137:4 137:19,21 books 136:22 137:7 both 10:22 14:6 14:9 16:21 36:12 41:16 117:23 153:7 bother 58:15 bottle 23:4 bottom 52:5 84:7 Bottoms 29:14 29:15 Boulevard 1:22 bound 108:14 159:2 bounds 107:3 break 49:20 94:5 112:3 118:2 brief 94:5 118:2 bring 101:3 brittle 116:23 broad 3:7 69:23 69:24 76:8 138:23 broader 9:21 broadly 12:19 brochure 47:24 brought 37:11 bubbling 11:24 Buhay 157:17 Buhay's 158:10 Buhey 124:8 building 14:19 15:10 16:1,4 16:10 17:10 17:16 18:3,4,6 18:9,11,12,16 18:19 19:7,18 20:3,5,9,14,21 21:6,9,14,18 21:20 22:7,14 22:16,19,22 23:19 24:8,13 24:14,16,22 25:4 27:13,17 27:22 28:7,9 28:10 29:13 29:14,20,23 30:24 31:2 32:18,21 48:15,17 50:10,18 74:4 78:17 94:19 95:2 97:4 103:13,16 104:9,15 107:18 108:16 108:24 110:24 111:5 119:12 120:12 121:17 124:3,3,10 144:22 145:19 145:20 149:1 157:13 buildings 15:8 16:8 28:20 30:4 31:20 33:14 35:6,12 35:15 bulk 14:4 bullet 129:5 149:16 152:1 155:12157:9 159:1,16 161:10 162:4 162:16 bullets 161:8 bunch 131:13 Bureau 15:15 27:12 99:12 bum 10:10,11 business 74:4 byproducts 32:14 by-products 71:9 C C 2:13 3:1 166:1,1 calculate 89:18 96:3 calculated 89:9 calculation 90:4 91:14,17 91:23,24 92:2 92:4,6,20 93:2 93:3,6 98:19 104:1,3 calculations 98:4,10 California 15:23 23:5 caU 32:1 58:16 58:19 84:14 94:1,3 102:14 102:20 103:4 called 6:3 102:24 calling 67:21 capable 93:8,10 capacitors 27:4 Capitol 3:11 career 76:11 carefully 57:16 168:2 carried 122:21 cartoons 47:1 52:2 87:6 case 16:14,17 16:20,23,24 23:9 27:11 32:4,6,17 41:10 43:10 43:17 58:11 74:10,23 79:16 80:24 81:23 97:17 107:20 116:22 124:22 129:12 132:2141:12 148:22157:10 161:9 164:3 cases 60:11 65:12 casing 46:8 CASMER-RE... 166:9 category 15:20 caused 114:19 ceiling 45:11 46:2,3 146:2 146:13,19 158:21160:2 Center 101:15 101:18 centimeters 19:11,14,15 20:13 21:24 23:15 25:11 28:18 CERCLA 15:1128:19 certain 10:12 149:8 153:17 certainly 48:14 94:13 95:19 98:17 138:16 certainteed 1:9 3:17 37:5 39:3 44:21 45:2 76:2178:24 79:9 80:11 117:20 150:11 155:9 Certainteed's 42:16 certification 6:21166:13 certified 12:24 certify 166:2 170:4 certifying 166:17 cetera 47:13 70:12,20 119:12 154:13 challenge 95:23 97:18,24 chance 88:22 99:9,13 101:6 102:15 125:11 change 88:17 95:12 97:10 97:23 98:16 132:18,23 143:9 168:6,7 168:9 169:2 changes 139:24 159:4 168:4 168:13 170:8 changing 115:19 164:2 channels 99:14 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60469 John Woodyard 173 charges 17:8 chart 47:11 Chattanooga 16:2 chemical 15:18 24:6 54:2 62:13 70:3 134:6,11 chemicals 133:6 chemistry 8:7,8 8:10,16,22,24 9:3,7,9,10,11 9:15,17,18,20 9:2110:4,5,9 10:18 54:5 62:9 69:21 136:23 137:1 chemists 59:15 59:20 60:14 62:5 65:2 CHEMREX 1:10 choice 66:8 choose 66:7 chromatograph 11:1 60:11 61:17 64:6,15 chromatographs 11:3 59:7,10 59:12,14,22 60:2,17 62:14 62:20 63:8 64:2 chromatography 59:2,3 chromatogrpahs 61:8 CIH 123:18 Circle 2:19 citation 51:5 citations 113:18 cite 65:19 108:18130:12 131:9,9 135:8 137:22 cited 84:2 85:11 86:4 112:22 113:22125:22 154:9 cites 96:9 citing 82:12 City 15:12,14 28:21 44:19 101:15,19 claimed 123:4 claiming 120:20,21 clam 2:14,15 4:3 6:14 7:8,9 12:2114:3,8 14:24 15:1 17:14 18:2 19:9,14,17,21 21:13 24:5 25:2,17 26:5 26:12,22,24 30:14,20 32:15 33:1,4,5 34:6,10,15,19 34:23 35:4,11 37:13,16,21 37:24 38:3,4 38:11,24 39:6 39:22,24 40:5 40:8 41:8,13 41:15 42:5,13 43:7 45:1,5,8 45:2446:16 49:4,11 50:11 51:2,17 52:13 53:3,18 54:9 54:2256:1,6 56:19,22 57:6 57:11,20 58:8 58:14,21 60:6 60:15 61:4 62:3,11 63:19 64:1,3,21 65:6 66:1,21 67:5 67:17,22 68:2 68:7,12 70:10 70:14,22 71:2272:22 73:8,15,24 74:18 75:8,9 76:1,9,15 77:2 77:13,22 78:6 78:18,20 79:6 79:7 80:12,16 80:18 81:14 83:6 84:11 85:2287:1,16 87:2088:6,15 89:5 90:14 91:1,8,21 92:5 92:10,18 93:7 93:9,14,17,21 93:24 94:1,23 95:2196:3,6 100:24 101:15 101:16 103:10 103:20 104:2 104:7,22 105:7 106:5,9 106:11,17,22 107:4,12,16 107:24 108:7 109:7 110:6 110:11,18 111:7,21 112:2,4,16 113:5 114:17 115:21,24 116:6,24 117:3,4,15 118:4,10,18 118:22 119:24 120:8,16 121:6,14 122:5,12,18 123:3,6,11,15 123:19,21 124:15,20 125:4,16 126:3,17,22 127:5,6,12,19 128:1,22 129:24 130:3 130:12,15,21 131:5,7,22 132:22 133:13 133:20135:10 135:20 136:5 136:13,16,21 138:4,8 139:4 139:15,23 140:10,23 141:9,15 142:5,10,21 143:6,17 144:12,15 164:10,19 clarify 165:6 cleaned 20:15 20:17 28:24 clean-up 13:17 14:18 17:2,6 18:1,15,18 19:3 20:8,21 21:3,7,16 22:1 22:5,21 23:8 23:11,18 25:6 25:7,16 26:4 26:10 27:6,8 27:16 28:1,2 28:14 29:3,5,7 29:11 30:23 31:10,12,16 31:20 33:10 64:20 65:4 clean-ups 59:21 60:8 clear 65:10,17 67:1,9 69:17 125:13 clearly 67:6 129:15 150:23 client 17:16 19:24 63:1,4 63:16 64:12 65:9,16 clients 64:17 70:5 close 29:18 42:21129:14 clothing 44:5 collect 12:9,10 13:3,5 collection 11:7 11:9,14 12:3,6 college 8:9 35:21 44:10 55:4,22 68:17 colloquy 35:2 142:6 column 168:5 combustion 10:8,9,11 71:9 come 32:5 94:17 97:18 115:2117:9 134:16 152:17 coming 101:14 115:8 commission 1:4 166:10 170:15 Commissioner 2:9 166:9 common 43:4 51:12 commonly 55:13,15 commonwealth 1:12:10 166:10 companies 36:1 company 1:9 1:12,12 15:14 16:16 27:21 28:22 35:22 36:3,4 46:9 100:16 competent 168:18 complete 15:24 150:13 165:7 completely 113:7 completing 8:17 complex 21:1 component 10:4 15:16 components 9:22 composition 101:10 compound 139:18 152:9 compounds 22:4 compromise 94:22 conceivably 109:21 concentration 119:12 concern 100:3 concerned 95:8 99:10,18,21 102:7 concluded 165:10 conclusion 92:19 108:18 109:12 110:8 112:13 133:3 conclusively 72:19 condense 129:9 129:19,22 130:1 161:15 162:7,9,19 164:1 condition 157:17 158:11 158:14,18 conditions 6:4 71:10 73:18 73:19 88:16 101:12153:18 160:2 165:2 conduct 128:7 159:24 conducted 110:21153:12 153:13 conduction 128:20,23 conductor 128:10 confuse 39:1 confused 51:1 consider 9:2 37:1,9 68:8,15 100:22 considerable 95:11 consideration 47:24 considerations 47:16 considered 30:5 30:6 consternation 127:10 constituents 117:14 constructed 110:23 construction 68:18,20 147:19 consulted 75:15 contain 156:5 contained 122:19 124:16 124:23 149:10 151:19 158:5 containing 86:24 97:13 120:2,11 128:4 129:7 139:11161:13 contains 52:1 contaminants 14:1 contamination 20:3 24:17 content 155:22 context 34:24 72:18 105:13 contexts 64:9 continue 128:23 continued 3:1 114:11124:9 continuing 45:20 contours 106:14 contractor 17:3 contractors 17:2 35:24 36:9 contrary 150:10 control 10:11 10:14 49:14 49:22 83:14 166:16 converted 28:24 cool 129:9 161:15 162:6 162:9,18 cooler 129:18 copies 40:17 41:6 copy 7:14 51:6 corporation 1:9 1:11 3:5,17 correct 8:12 11:11 16:22 18:5 34:9 43:15,22 60:23 69:12 82:21 91:4,6 91:18 97:1,14 104:17 105:6 113:17 116:9 127:24 132:19 132:20 133:24 134:22 137:23 139:22 141:18 144:22 145:2 145:15 146:14 146:15149:14 149:15 150:5 150:21,24 151:4,24 152:5 154:13 155:16 158:8 158:22 159:20 160:1162:19 164:18 170:5 corrections 170:8 correctly 29:17 costume 44:14 counsel 6:2,20 77:17 100:22 136:17 counsel's 57:8 couple 8:4 32:16 150:9 151:11153:4 coupled 46:22 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060470 John Woodyard 174 course 8:219:1 9:5,9,14,19,21 10:7,9,13,15 10:20 11:2,7 11:20 12:8 55:4 57:14 68:17 69:2,8 69:14 100:8 103:5 138:12 165:1 courses 8:9,10 8:16 9:9,11,17 9:22 10:3,3,5 54:5,10,12 55:2 68:21,24 69:13,18 123:24 court 1:1 6:10 7:10 37:23 38:6 67:8 92:11 94:20 95:4,16 96:7 96:12,14,21 97:9,9,16 98:8 99:2,6,8,17 100:4,6,13,19 100:21,24 101:4,13,20 102:1,6,14,17 102:23 103:9 126:17 142:19 168:22 courtaulds 1:10 3:9 6:2 courtroom 127:7 cover 10:19 133:18,19 137:1,1 covers 58:1 CRACKEN 3:6 create 33:18 93:23 created 159:4 creation 71:9 cross-examine 98:17 CT 3:12 46:6 47:1 52:4 77:8 84:13 85:3 151:3,3 CT-00078 4:11 CT-00083 4:12 cubic 19:10 cup 87:19 88:4 88:13 cured 49:16 curing 49:19,23 83:18 85:3,4 currently 30:1 custom 36:11 C-E-R-C-L-A 15:11 C.V 8:2 15:2 76:18 D D 3:7 4:1 damage 149:4 157"l2 DANAHER 3:10 data 60:9,12 61:12,13 63:4 64:1045 65:16 66:5 93:23 108:17 109:11111:10 111:12,16 112:12,21 113:1246 114:5 116:16 129:4,11,20 130:4,7,13,16 131:840 date 2:8 145:5 168:10 170:12 dated 81:21 83:3 dates 147:1 Dating 44:9 daughter 43:11 daughter's 44:14 david 3:7 6:2 day 6:17 66:17 66:22146:17 148:22,24 149:1,5,6,9 170:14 days 80:24 99:19 168:23 DCT 39:3,5,8 39:11,14,18 39:24 40:6,9 40:12,14,16 40:18,20,22 42:14,14 45:13 51:19 77:2 79:13 80:13,19 81:18 83:12 85:1,7,13,17 85:23 90:17 151:20 152:20 153:5,9,9 154:11 deal 38:17 dealing 10:10 dealt 69:4 dehnrah 2:8 166-9 debris 148:6,8 148:18 149:13 Decemher 7:12 7:19 r>pfhiaru 123-4 126:20 126:24 127:6 147-22 decided 57:16 decrease 120:1 37:5 Deeds 2:9 166:9 described 10:1 defendant 3:5,9 30:11 77:12 3:13,17 16:17 85:2 17:4114:16 DESCRIPTION defendants 4:9 1:13 16:19,21 design 47:15,23 defense 136:16 123:24 124:1 degree 8:20 designed 69:11129:6 114:22,23 161:11163:6 124:7 degrees 47:20 destroyed 48:7,8,11,11 119:4,7 48:18 49:7,15 destruction 49:17 50:6,16 33:16 50:20 77:11 detail 9:24 79:17 81:1,24 detect 56:14 82:13 85:4,11 detected 33:15 85:21 86:5 detection 92:15 104:14 160:14 104:24 107:7 deteriorate 108:11109:2 115:2,5 109:3,8,22,24 deteriorated 111:9 112:7 114:14 112:20 114:3 determination 118:21122:21 59:23 153:18 152:4,4 determine 155:14,15 33:12 74:12 165:1 85:9 115:4 delaminated 117:16 157:11 determined delamination 84:17,19 115:7 develop 23:7 delivered 25:5 27:6,16 140:18 28:1,14 demonstrate developing 129:11 41:23,24 78:5 demonstrated devices 11:15 72:23 73:9 11:16,24 12:3 demonstrates 12:6 160:11 61:17 diagram 47:11 DEPARTMENT 90:15,19 1:2,3,5 diferent 12:7 depend 138:17 differed 65:1 depending difference 143:9 120:7 depict 87:6 differences DEPONENT 52:4 59:16 170:1 different 10:16 depose 66:22 11:14,16,22 deposing 11:23 12:10 168:21 12:20 29:7 deposition 1:21 40:7 47:12 2:3 5:1 7:11 49:21 52:1 26:13,18 55:10 59:17 57:21 98:20 63:6 64:9 106:15 107:2 67:13 69:5 125:3,7,15 78:21 82:23 126:15 143:16 86:12,12 91:2 165:9 166:4 106:2 131:4,6 168:2,3,11,15 138:12 142:3 168:24 143:22 146:6 depositions 146:9 147:5 15:3 149:14 describe 9:24 difficult 99:23 dimensions 93:15 dioxens 23:9 dioxin 18:23 22:4 33:16 dioxins 31:24 33:12 34:7,13 direct 166:16 Direction 5:3 directly 60:14 64:14 121:9 dirty 148:15 disappointed 57:15 discover 66:6 discovery 26:13 58:10 65:24 66:20 98:21 discuss 25:15 discussed 29:8 127:3 155:20 155:24 discussion 6:7 31:8 63:17 64:18 94:7 discussions 29:5 dispute 158:23 disputes 17:8 dissolve 132:4 dissolved 132:6 disturbing 102:21,23 divide 93:13 Doctor 75:16 87:21 88:24 111:17 112:24 133:14134:5 134:9,10,18 135:1136:13 137:3,4,18,21 144:13 document 39:8 39:12,15 45:18 47:8,16 51:19,20,24 52:4 77:14 78:10 79:4,14 79:15 80:1,6 80:17,20,21 81:19,20 82:10,11,19 82:23 83:2,16 84:5,24 85:1 85:14,24 164:12,13 documentation 86:11 documents 5:8 37:5,8,11,17 37:20 38:7,20 41:7 42:7,22 43:19 44:13 45:9 51:19 52:15 75:24 76:22,23 83:13 84:3 86:17,22 87:2 96:11 107:19 138:13 doing 10:16 66:15 93:5,8 149:2 150:4 152:13 154:3 154:22 don 145:10 done 7:2413:7 13:8,9 26:22 33:12 34:20 43:8 49:24 61:9,21 66:3 66:16 69:21 70:5,15,23 71:2,5,17,20 72:4,11 74:1,5 74:12 83:15 89:11 91:5 93:2 104:1 105:17,18 108:21 111:17 117:19 126:19 127:8 132:2 133:4 137:17 down 49:20 111:23 128:12 151:14 downtown 16:2 29:19 dozens 13:10 13:20 137:2 drawing 84:18 drawings 46:22 46:24 dried 49:16 156:23 dries 164:11,15 drift 98:24 drifting 98:4 drifts 99:4 drive 33:17 driven 31:24 109:23 110:15 111:11,13 114:2,6,13,18 115:12 116:19 118:6 140:21 drove 102:4 drums 28:22 dry 155:15 156:5,19 drying 49:23 85:6,18 155:18,22 164:12 duct 4:10,14 25:24 26:2 35:9,21,23 36:5 37:6 46:4 46:7,7,9 47:2 47:4,19 48:3,8 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60471 John Woodyard 175 48:10,23 49:1 49:2,5,14 50:9 50:15 51:3,13 52:3 77:5 78:15,16 79:10 83:15 84:20 89:10 90:11,12,23 91:3,12 95:1 96:15,15,18 96:23 97:3,12 97:13 103:22 104:11105:1 105:9 108:4 108:12110:19 110:23 111:6 111:11,14 112:19 113:23 114:14115:2 115:8 119:14 122:19,20 123:23 127:15 129:1146:14 150:1151:23 157:18 158:10 158:21 ductboard 35:9 35:14,18 36:10,11,15 36:2137:3 38:18 57:5 74:13 77:5 79:2 83:19 89:20 90:3,7 91:6,15 105:14109:4 109:20116:23 120:19 152:2 155:13 157:4 157:11,18,21 158:2164:23 165:3 ductboards 45:20 ducting 35:18 ducts 47:6 149:24 due 99:19 duly 7:3 166:3 Dunphey 42:19 42:23 44:12 Dunphey-Smith 36:3 ' during 36:1 56:9 89:20 114:6 143:16 155:12 159:19 160:3 165:3,5 dwell 56:17 E E 2:13,13 3:1,1 4:1,8 77:8,8 166:1,1 each 7:10 100:6 101:14 equipment 12:6 earlier 6:6 15:22 28:23 84:19 126:15 31:1 32:13 151:1154:21 33:13 59:9 155:20159:23 62:15 early 145:10 Erickson 134:5 easily 101:11 134:9,10 easy 101:7 135:1 137:3 education 144:13 25:19 54:21 Erickson's 107:17 75:16 87:21 effect 49:8 89:1111:17 95:23 133:6,8 113:1133:14 133:23 164:23 134:18 136:13 eight 112:7 137:4,19,21 either 50:23 errata 168:5,9 133:7 168:10,14,20 Electric 15:13 169:1 170:9 16:18 28:6,13 escaped 109:18 electrical 15:16 esquire 1:21 15:22 27:1 2:15,15,18 3:3 28:23 30:24 3:7,11,15,20 32:13,17 essentially 81:9 electron 54:16 122:2131:12 55:21 56:24 established ELECTRONICS 17:19 29:6 1:11 116:4 elements 70:12 estimate 52:14 elevated 51:12 52:22 103:11 embedded 8:24 et 47:13 70:12 emergency 1:4 70:20154:13 15:19 evaporate emission 10:14 143:11,19 10:15 95:12 evaporated emit 96:23 117:13 employed evaporates 23:16 144:1 end 63:16 evaporating 122:10 156:9 88:23 120:21 168:11 120:22143:16 ended 66:20 evaporation engineering 117:10 143:20 8:14 69:3 144:3,8 engineers 12:17 even 92:14 enhanced 95:22101:5 134:15 104:13 109:8 eqjoy 100:15 109:17 112:24 enough 42:21 119:5,21 entails 11:24 128:24 138:9 enter 108:16 141:2143:20 entire 10:15 161:10 162:22 52:9 136:2,19 event 56:15 150:5 151:6 events 71:18,21 entirely 72:21 entitled 69:2 130:10138:2 entry 54:5 environment ever 12:24 36:17,20 44:4 54:4 57:7 61:5 61:9 62:12,19 62:24 64:24 73:6,7 73:16 74:1,12 environmental 79:1 87:5 8:19,20 9:22 119:3 EPA 15:11 every 60:10 18:20 29:5,10 61:11 63:17 30:15 71:6 86:22 equated 151:6 91:5 everybody 37:23 everything 38:16 136:3 evidence 104:19 111:13 115:8 116:21 122:20 129:12 157:10,14,20 158:7 160:20 163:23 Ewing 57:15 110:19,21 Ewing's 51:14 74:19 105:15 106:12 107:6 107:11108:20 109:14,24 110:7,12,17 exact 11:21 21:23 31:5 145:4 158:16 exactly 10:2 19:120:24 34:3 37:5 59:8 65:10154:19 exam 13:1 57:13 examination 7:6 95:6 144:17 164:8 examined 7:4 35:7,13 examining 125:20 example 11:2 12:18 44:5 55:10 59:17 65:11 71:7 74:6 86:23 108:20 excape 128:16 except 6:22 41:22125:21 132:2 159:3 170:7 excess 22:17 47:19 48:17 109:22 112:7 118:20 exchange 102:16 excluded 66:9 excuse 14:5 67:20 84:6 91:20 111:22 135:17 142:15 exhibit 4:9 38:9 39:2,4 45:12 82:9,22 86:2 90:17 exhibits 40:7 45:12 150:12 151:2 exist 67:10 exists 44:23 61:8 expand 125:8 142:12 expanded 20:4 experience 25:20,21 26:15 35:17 42:19 43:20 44:13 50:18 54:23 56:23 59:15 107:17 experienced 164:24 experiment 73:9 74:1 105:17,19,21 105:23 106:7 110:24 130:5 experimental 105:11 experiments 73:16 129:3 133:3 expert 9:2 16:15 26:19 37:2,9 41:20 42:24 44:16 47:9 62:4 66:2 78:5 92:1 93:23 98:1 100:2 122:23 123:2,5,6,9,10 123:16,18,22 127:4 134:5,7 135:2 158:3,5 expertise 9:6 42:8,15 43:16 46:19 51:21 56:2,10 66:4 experts 147:20 expires 166:10 170:15 explain 47:2 57:24 58:3 59:18 60:17 explained 56:17 58:5 60:13,19 explaining 52:2 explore 108:2 exposed 50:9 84:21 139:11 141:1143:1 159:10 exposure 81:24 108:24 111:6 extent 66:4 y8:8 exterior 144:1 extreme 159:3 extremely 51:13 152:17 161:24 F F 1:2277:11 81:1,24 166:1 fabricate 36:15 52:3 fabricated 35:22 37:6 42:16 46:9 fabricating 36:10 77:5 fabrication 4:13 38:17 45:19 46:4 facilities 26:6 facility 15:17 16:3 20:2 27:2 27:2,3 28:11 31:4 147:6 fact 79:8 92:19 95:10 97:2 98:9 99:10,18 104:19 143:18 facts 98:12 factual 98:5 fail 114:19 failed 19:5 21:22 81:2 failure 70:11 77:10 79:19 fair 94:16 97:15 125:15 fairly 21:21 26:23 fall 107:23 145:12 familiar 59:7 76:5 90:18 135:23 far 52:5 61:22 62:22 78:15 97:20 138:11 150:3 Farenheit 47:20 92:15 104:24 107:7 108:3,12 109:2,3,24 111:9 152:4,5 155:14,15 FARRINGTON 2:14 fashion 13:17 68:15 98:18 Fe 17:2232:4 feet 23:22 49:24 84:1,7,9 84:16,22 90:4 90:5 91:12,16 94:18 95:7,11 97:11 98:7,13 fellow 123:4 felt 53:20 few 129:8 149:19 150:1 150:19 151:1 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60472 John Woodyard 176 151:7,9,15 161:12,14,17 162:5,12,18 163:8,10,16 163:19,19 fiber 11:22 fiberglass 36:10,15,21 37:3 46:7 74:13 96:20 109:19 114:12 119:23 120:1 120:10,17,18 120:20,23 121:8,11,16 121:20,21 122:1,2 129:10,15 156:3 161:16 field 10:18 12:13 13:4 42:17 53:4,7 69:15 123:18 136:6 fifth 149:9 figure 103:5 files 137:11 filing 6:21 168:15,23 filters 11:22,23 12:9 final 29:5 find 34:7 66:1 67:9 92:21 111:4 134:21 135:4136:10 137:7 138:10 138:14 147:13 finding 110:7 110:10 findings 110:13 finds 135:24 fine 49:3,8 92:2 93:6 135:24 finish 135:18 fire 15:19 18:14 21:1722:12 23:3 31:1,23 32:14,17 33:1 33:2,3,13 34:14,24 118:12,14 149:4159:5 159:10,13 165:5 fires 71:7 first 8:3 17:21 42:6 45:12 68:17 124:12 124:17,23 125:5,8,10,19 125:20 138:11 145:1,3,16 149:16 152:10 153:4 157:16 158:20 five 31:3,7,7,8 47:16,18 flawed 110:24 flexible 116:12 116:14,15,18 floor 1:22 2:6 3:3 146:6,18 147:8148:6 148:23,24 149:4,6,7,9,9 floors 33:19 145:18,19,22 146:7,9 147:3 149:10 Florida 15:9 30:21,23 flors 147:4 fluid 156:21 flurries 99:20 focused 8:19 10:8 foil 79:20 81:3 81:7 83:16 86:6 96:19 114:13 126:23 127:1,2,13,14 128:3,7,16 131:15 fold 90:23 folded 90:7,19 folding 47:3 follow 57:8 58:22 following 30:24 168:8 follows 7:4 foot 50:1 84:14 91:5,16 football 43:5,9 force 81:15 foregoing 166:13 170:4 forgot 150:12 form 6:23 13:23 14:7 19:2030:18 32:23 33:24 38:2141:4,18 42:11,12 43:2 44:23 49:9 51:2253:14 63:10,11 64:7 65:5 70:7,13 72:16 73:1,2 73:12,20,23 74:16 76:12 77:21 78:3 80:3 81:11 83:1 87:15 90:13,21 91:7 103:17 104:4 110:3 114:9 116:21118:8 120:4 121:5 121:21,23 122:14 127:17 127:18 128:18 131:21133:10 140:8,14 141:3,23 142:1146:23 158:12159:7 168:4,7 170:8 formal 54:21 formation 33:17 formed 23:10 25:23 32:14 45:13 154:10 forms 143:8 formulation 83:7 forth 12:11 67:3 123:8 137:11142:6 164:21 forward 67:4,6 123:3 forwarding 64:20 foujr 165:1 found 18:11,12 19:6 34:13 65:3,16 141:17 144:7 158:23 foundation 57:3,19 58:7 58:20 four 31:3 48:18 49:7,16 50:6 50:16 85:8,21 90:4,23 102:8 114:3 155:14 frame 68:4 France 16:5 Francisco 16:1117:23 32:5 frankly 67:11 freeze 101:6 freezes 102:8 French 21:15 from 25:22 29:19 33:13 37:5 43:19 52:5 56:9 62:20 64:10 64:14 67:13 74:13 75:17 76:20,22 81:7 82:23 84:17 85:10 86:21 88:22 89:2,10 98:4 102:3 103:6 104:11 105:9 106:8 108:4,12 109:4,18 111:11113:12 118:24121:12 125:13,18,19 126:14 133:18 137:1,16 148:18,19 151:2,13 152:3 157:17 159:18 160:19 164:2 front 168:16 full 9:13 function 141:11 143:2 furan 18:23 22:4 furans 23:9 31:24 33:12 34:7 further 7:17,22 88:22 131:14 164:5 G game 125:15 gamesmanship 125:17 gas 11:1,3,16 11:23,24 59:1 59:3,7,10,12 59:14 60:2,11 61:8,16 62:14 62:20 63:7 64:1,6,14 72:6 72:7 73:5,7 74:8 gaseous 72:13 gases 10:21 12:11 gave 42:8,15 43:16 51:20 148:7 GE 16:2 19:18 19:24 20:20 21:3,5 general 1:2 16:18 94:12 139:3 157:18 generated 64:10,13,16 generates 63:18 63:20 getting 68:1 69:10 95:5 99:11,22 give 66:7 109:12 112:2 given 6:3 46:18 48:1 57:14 63:5 66:22 104:5 126:9 166:5 170:6 gives 9:6 111:18 giving 67:18 glad 102:24 glass 23:4 glue 56:9 88:18 88:20,21 96:19 97:8 108:14 112:9 113:4,7,12,21 113:23 114:11 114:19,21,22 114:24 115:6 115:9,14 116:22117:17 118:7,13,15 118:16,24 119:3,7 121:7 128:4 129:7 131:16 140:11 143:5 159:3 159:19 161:13 164:16 go 16:12 26:5 41:5 56:23 61:23 66:3 76:13 80:4 91:13 100:1,4 108:9 112:10 113:22 117:4 120:5 126:19 132:11 135:20 138:12146:2 goals 116:11 goes 56:1 66:5 going 6:15 26:5 26:7 29:23 38:5 39:7,11 39:14 57:8 58:22 67:3 83:13 91:24 92:1,3 93:4 97:20 101:5 102:5 107:21 108:20 112:10 122:3 129:18 141:11146:18 147:4 164:21 gone 149:8 good 12:5 52:17 102:19 128:9 158:11 158:13,17 Good-bye 103:9 goutman 3:3 6:1,13 12:14 13:22 14:22 17:12,18 19:8 19:12 21:11 24:2,4 25:12 26:1,9,16 32:10 33:2,24 34:8,12,17,21 38:13,19 39:17,20,23 41:11,18 42:1 42:10 43:1 45:15 48:19 50:8 51:22 52:23 54:7,20 55:23 56:4,13 57:1,18,23 58:12,18 60:3 60:24 61:23 62:6 63:10,23 64:7 65:23 66:14,24 67:15,20,23 68:6,11 70:13 70:17 71:19 72:15 73:1,12 73:20 74:15 76:24 78:16 86:19 87:15 87:18 88:3,10 89:3 91:19 94:3,9 98:23 99:5,24 100:11,19 101:18,21,24 102:13,19 103:3,7,17,23 104:18 105:4 105:24 107:9 107:14 108:6 109:5 110:2,4 110:9,13,16 111:22112:14 113:3 115:18 116:3 118:8 118:16 119:18 120:13 121:1 121:4,18 122:8,14 123:1,8,14,17 123:20 124:13 124:19,24 125:11126:1 126:5,9,11,14 127:11,18,21 130:8,18,24 131:20 135:8 135:17,21 136:12,15,18 137:24 138:6 138:22 139:13 139:17 141:5 141:22 142:2 142:7,15 143:15 152:11 156:7,15 162:3,11 163:9,14 164:20 Goutman's 127:9 government 21:15 graduate 55:12 68:21 70:24 Grant 2:19 great 48:12 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60473 John Woodyard 177 50:4,5 57:14 127:8 greater 19:6 120:18 grounds 93:1 guarantee 152:14 guess 99:24 145:12 guessing 23:22 Gustin-Bacon 44:19,23 46:8 46:15 53:12 53:20 153:16 153:17 G-B 4:10 47:19 77:12 H H 4:8 half 66:20 96:8 148:22,24 149:1,6 hand 38:5 39:7 39:11,14 51:6 handed 96:10 handle 12:5 handling 36:13 happen 48:9 115:3 143:14 157:6 happened 10:11 60:4 happening 99:4 hard 115:9,14 116:13,18 Hartford 3:12 hate 100:14 having 7:3 91:22 98:3 108:21 hazard 145:12 head 92:8 93:5 137:15 141:8 145:8 hear 53:15 heard 133:11 heat 36:17,21 42:8,24 43:4 43:13 44:4,16 45:1146:2,3 46:13,14,19 47:3 50:6 51:21 52:6,7,8 52:9 53:8,12 53:22 69:4 70:11 71:1,3 72:3 73:18 75:2 89:16,19 90:19 91:14 96:22 104:14 108:1128:3,8 128:10,12,14 128:17,20,20 128:23 150:4 151:22160:2 heated 49:5,14 108:3 110:19 122:6,12,17 152:3 155:13 heating 48:2 49:19,23 50:3 70:1173:17 73:18 84:1 85:2 109:8 113:23 127:15 height 31:5 47:20 held 2:4 6:7 50:15 94:7 125:24 help 21:16 23:7 henderson 2:18 101:20 her 43:11100:9 herschel 3:15 6:12 14:7 19:19 24:20 30:8,18 32:23 34:135:10 37:15,22 38:2 38:7,9,15,22 39:18 40:3 41:4 42:12 44:2245:3 48:20 49:9 50:24 52:24 53:14,15 54:8 61:163:11,22 65:5 70:7 72:1673:2,22 75:6,23 76:4,7 76:1277:21 78:3 79:3 80:3 80:14 81:11 83:1 84:4 85:15 86:20 90:13,21 91:7 91:21 92:7,16 92:24 93:12 93:19 94:11 94:21,23 95:14,19 96:2 96:18 97:1,14 99:15 101:23 102:2104:4 105:5 106:9 106:13,19 107:1,21 108:5 110:3 111:19 114:8 116:20 117:2 120:4 121:2,5 121:23 122:9 127:3,17 128:18 129:22 132:21133:9 133:18 135:15 138:24 140:8 140:13 141:3 141:24144:14 146:22 155:7 156:11 158:12 158:17 159:6 160:23 162:24 he'll 125:24 high 21:21 23:23 31:4 51:14 73:6 higher 48:3 165:4,4 highlighted 15:4 highlighting 15:5 high-rise 14:19 15:8,10 16:4 24:14,15 28:20 high-rises 16:9 High-Speed 102:5 him 14:23 26:2 26:3,7 34:19 45:19 58:15 58:16,16,19 66:22 88:10 92:6,8 93:4 94:3,15 96:3 96:11 98:15 98:17 102:1 104:19 107:22 107:24 108:5 110:16 125:12 125:20,21 126:3,18 131:2,2135:9 135:22,22 142:13,14 himself 45:16 108:21 history 80:9 Hold 38:13 85:15 holding 156:2 home 6:6 43:13 52:19 hometowns 100:18 Honor 94:11,21 95:15,20,22 96:4,6,20 97:15 98:23 99:5,16,24 100:12 102:3 103:8 126:2 hoping 99:8 131:3 hour 126:15 148:22,24 149:2,3 hours 49:22 50:17 77:11 79:23 81:24 82:14 86:5 114:19 152:5 HOYLE 3:14 HUMPHREY 2:14 hundred 19:10 20:12 21:24 23:14,22 25:10 28:18 48:18,18 49:7 49:7,17 50:6,6 50:15,16 60:8 60:13 66:16 79:17 85:4,8,8 85:11,11,21 107:7 109:24 112:7 114:3,3 152:4 155:14 155:15 164:24 165:1 hundreds 64:16 husband 102:4 HVAC 35:14 123:10,12,24 124:6 Hyatt 29:18 hygienist 12:13 12:22 13:1 hygienists 12:4 12:16 I idea 83:20 129:24 130:4 154:16 identification 38:10 identified 20:3 24:18 33:15 86:12 Illinois 68:23 illustrate 128:13 immediately 32:6 109:19 129:9,18 161:15 162:19 immobilizes 113:7 impact 104:9 impacted 127:14 impedes 88:22 implement 23:7 25:5 implied 150:14 importance 80:5 important 94:2 152:8 impose 102:10 inadequate 17:6 21:6 inappropriate 35:3 102:12 inc 1:10,10 3:9 inch 46:11 91:15,17 92:13 149:18 149:21150:7 150:18 inches 89:16,19 91:14,16 95:1 95:24 103:12 103:21104:9 104:15 105:1 150:9 incident 23:6 151:5 incidents 32:7,9 include 53:21 included 9:9 36:9 47:14 53:19 60:10 77:3,6 117:14 including 10:16 incorrectly 108:22 increase 120:1 120:10 121:13 128:17,20 indeed 83:16 Independence 2:16 INDEX 5:1 Indian 43:11 44:14 indicate 144:20 indicated 96:14 149:17 151:21 152:19 155:4 158:6 indicating 33:15 indication 52:17 indirectly 60:14 individual 148:17 individuals 36:20 industrial 12:4 12:13,16,22 12:24 30:3 industry 34:4 72:6 74:9 influence 132:15 139:10 inform 45:19 130:22 information 41:22 46:20 47:9 75:11 79:11104:6 110:17 informed 60:21 inquire 125:5,7 125:14 inquiry 58:1 inside 27:16 148:9 insist 107:2 inspect 148:5 inspected 147:8 inspecting 148:7 inspection 157:16 installation 35:14 56:10 89:20 103:22 129:10,13 159:19 instance 22:2 instances 33:9 instead 12:1 83:17 98:5 instruct 57:2,16 110:4 130:8 130:18 instructing 88:10 92:5,24 instruction 57:8 93:19 instructions 4:13 46:10 53:2158:22 168:1 insulating 129:15 insulation 161:16 insulting 67:16 67:17 insure 83:15 intact 49:3 157:21 integrity 114:11117:20 152:15 intend 56:17,19 intended 16:1 53:12 98:22 128:11 intent 150:22 interaction 63:17 interpret 59:12 59:14 61:12 64:15 interpretation 62:20,23 63:1 63:4,6 64:12 65:15 interpreted 64:19 interrupted 142:13 interruption 88:7 135:19 interruptions 106:24 investigation 20:4 involve 14:18 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60474 John Woodyard 178 involved 15:7 15:1017:2 18:121:2 23:3 24:7 31:22 35:7 54:13 61:11 72:5 97:10 149:5,6 Involving 15:11 15:17 16:8 71:7 iron 43:13 87:10 97:6 104:24 108:3 128:4 149:18 149:23 150:1 150:17 ironing 44:9,15 52:18,19,21 irons 87:5 issue 35:8,13 63:13,15 65:13 98:5 99:6 110:14 126:23 127:1 127:13 issues 61:13 137:9 item 77:8 iteration 63:18 J jacket 52:12 JAMES 2:15 January 1:15 jeans 44:9,15 Jersey 24:9 36:4 99:15 102:3 jerseys 43:6,9 job 27:5 30:22 36:18 127:8 jobs 31:18 john 1:22 2:3 4:2 7:2 join 47:5 joint 46:13 90:22 150:20 joints 46:11 ' 47:5 53:22 90:10 Jones 125:13 journals 137:16 Judge 26:17 58:13 66:8 94:2 106:15 107:3 June 153:19 154:20 jurors 100:3 ' 102:3 jury 99:22 101:9135:12 136:14 just 9:8 25:21 " 41:13 43:4,18 45:13 46:21 48:449:2,7 61:1064:22 67:1 71:18 81:5 82:23 83:13 87:19 88:4 91:19 95:9 101:17 102:13 111:2 112:14,22 128:21130:6 131:8135:10 135:18 136:1 137:3,13 142:3,16,17 146:13 147:6 147:12,16 148:8 150:8,9 151:16,20 153:4165:5 K Kansas 28:21 29:2044:19 keep 100:14,16 111:23 114:22 114:24 116:11 131:2 Ken 7:9 25:12 38:19,23 66:24 Kennedy 1:22 KENNETH 2:15 3:11 KERR 3:14 kind 58:15 146:10154:12 156:20160:1 know 10:1 14:1515:4 17:1221:5 24:3,11 26:12 29:17 33:8 47:15,23 48:1050:14 53:11,20,20 56:12 57:22 66:10,13 67:6 69:23 70:19 78:15,24 79:8 82:1,4,5,7,20 83:7 95:17 98:3 99:6 100:6 101:2,7 101:9,13 103:18,24 105:20 118:5 118:15 120:6 123:2 130:24 131:8,18 132:9,12 133:21 134:1 134:23 135:13 136:8 139:1 141:10 144:4 144:10145:10 153:23 154:1 154:3,22 155:3 165:3 knowing 99:21 knowledge 25:20 79:5 107:18 118:1 knows 93:15 96:20 Kominsky 92:17,18 97:2 129:7 157:19 161:13 Kominsky's 117:1 157:23 L L 2:8 166:9 lab 10:18 59:8 63:18,20 64:14 71:24 152:24 153:1 153:2,5 laboratories 62:9 70:6,8,16 71:14 laboratory 62:13,17,21 63:1,7,9 64:11 64:18 65:1,13 65:15,17 86:4 153:14 LAGNESE 3:10 laminate 158:8 langfitt 3:7 6:2 language 150:11,13 154:12 large 10:8 20:24 largely 148:5 last 13:1140:22 45:5 46:6 47:7 47:18 48:23 51:9 55:16 80:15 82:23 84:15 100:12 129:5 145:1 159:16 161:10 162:4,16 later 6:6 80:9 148:3 latter 145:11 law 7:3 lawyers 41:3 LAWYER'S 167:1 lay 57:3,19 58:7 58:20 layer 128:7 layering 128:3 layers 128:2 129:2 learn 10:20 11:12 learned 11:9,20 43:18 134:8,9 least 46:19 50:2 76:17 148:12 152:16 leave 119:3 leaves 121:7 129:17 leaving 119:14 119:21 leeway 57:14 left 114:24 115:15 148:15 length 50:14 79:2191:5,15 95:11 97:3 150:5 lenth 150:20 Less 31:7 let 16:13 34:11 64:22 96:2 129:3 lettering 43:5 43:14 letters 43:9 let's 39:1 67:6 76:21 90:1 94:1113:22 143:24 153:5 163:5 level 8:9 18:15 18:18 20:8,14 22:1,21 25:7 27:8,18 28:3 28:16 29:4,6,7 29:1130:15 31:10,12,16 32:1 33:9,10 33:22,23 54:5 55:4 65:11 68:21119:17 119:20 160:8 160:13,16 levels 18:11,12 18:13 19:6 20:18 21:19 21:21 22:5,15 22:17,19 25:16 26:4,10 29:2 33:15 56:8 59:24 159:18 160:1 160:10,22 Lexington 2:16 liar 67:21 Liberty 2:5 3:3 life 123:9 124:9 light 15:9,21 22:6 27:4 30:3 30:21,23 155:23 like 8:2110:23 12:17 16:9 24:143:5,6 44:1148:6 50:1952:18 55:3 58:18 66:13,17 67:7 68:3 74:1 133:6 137:3 155:24,24 Likewise 80:21 limit 45:16 48:6 line 5:4,4,4,9,9 5:9,13,13,13 5:16,16,16 52:5 102:5 167:2169:2 linear 95:7 liquid 72:21 132:13 143:10 155:21,21 164:2 liquids 143:1 liquified 131:17 list 15:24 listed 15:19,24 76:18 listen 99:13 listing 14:16 literature 4:10 75:20 76:5,20 87:8 litigation 16:7 17:17,20,23 70:4 Litle 77:8 little 125:18 159:22 LLP 3:6 local 29:17 36:5 36:7 locations 33:20 locked 108:15 112:9 141:13 loft 30:6 long 48:13,23 49:18,18,19 79:22 91:11 146:16 148:21 151:22 longer 116:13 116:15 look 15:6 61:10 72:6 76:21 85:13 90:15 90:16 138:16 138:20 144:4 148:9,13 149:4 looked 8:2 146:13,14 158:6,21 looking 55:9 77:1 80:13,16 92:22 146:19 149:13 153:19 loss 118:6 lost 159:22 lot 8:2112:20 71:2117:8 143:21 163:17 lots 94:18 low 18:13 73:6 lower 29:10 32:1 33:19 51:15 109:14 Lumber 15:14 27:21 M M 3:3 Mactac 46:12 made 27:4 41:14 59:23 81:18 84:7,23 85:24 90:16 100:7 103:11 143:21148:1 168:6,13 main 24:16 maintained 117:21 make 20:4 48:6 53:12 64:22 79:24 80:19 82:9 83:12 85:13 91:17 100:23 120:7 132:11152:15 157:5 168:3 makes 42:23 44:16 79:15 making 35:21 52:9 59:22 67:18 91:13 160:21168:7 MANAGEME... 1:5 manufacture 49:15 79:1 manufactured 46:8,12 117:7 manufacturer 35:18 36:5 manufacturer's 46:10 manufacturing 23:4 24:24 27:3 45:6 46:9 80:10 155:13 many 9:1112:7 13:9,1114:14 14:15 20:23 22:7 23:21 31:2,6 48:24 72:13,20,20 72:23,24 73:10 103:12 118:5 137:11 146:4 157:22 157:24 mark 38:6 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60475 John Woodyard 179 marked 4:9 5:15 38:10,12 39:2,3,4 Market 2:6 3:15 16:11,23 Master's 8:13 8:17,19 69:11 mastic 116:7 118:17 129:17 material 26:3 47:10 55:9 68:8,10,16,18 68:22 69:16 69:18,22 70:2 71:3 84:1 92:21105:13 113:18 115:1 117:9 120:2 120:11129:15 131:13,14,17 140:17,22 141:2,6,12,17 143:3 148:10 148:13 156:1 materials 10:12 12:10 68:19 68:19 69:5,6 70:3,11 71:1 155:21156:2 156:22 matrix 56:9 112:10143:4 159:3,19 matter 8:18 59:6 94:12 98:2,21 125:15,17 126:6 139:16 139:19 141:16 141:20 143:18 may 16:6,9,9 24:24 30:9 36:22 38:24 66:3 67:5 97:19 100:17 126:19 140:18 144:2149:8 168:18 maybe 6:16,17 94:21 99:2 me 2:14,15 3:6 4:3 6:14 7:8,9 12:2114:3,8 14:2415:1 17:14 18:2 19:9,14,17,21 21:13 24:5 25:2,17 26:5 26:12,22,24 30:14,20 32:15 33:1,4,5 34:6,10,15,19 34:23 35:4,11 37:13,16,21 37:24 38:3,4 38:11,2439:6 39:22,24 40:5 40:8 41:8,13 41:15 42:5,13 43:7 45:1,5,8 45:2446:16 49:4,11 50:11 51:2,17 52:13 53:3,18 54:9 54:2256:1,6 56:19,22 57:6 57:11,20 58:8 58:14,21 60:6 60:15 61:4 62:3,11 63:19 64:1,3,21 65:6 66:1,21 67:5 67:17,22 68:2 68:7,12 70:10 70:14,22 71:22 72:22 73:8,15,24 74:18 75:8,9 76:1,9,15 77:2 77:13,22 78:6 78:18,20 79:6 79:7 80:12,16 80:18 81:14 83:6 84:11 85:22 87:1,16 87:2088:6,15 89:5 90:14 91:1,8,21 92:5 92:10,18 93:7 93:9,14,17,21 93:2494:1,23 95:2196:2,6 100:24 101:15 101:16 103:10 103:20 104:2 104:7,22 105:7 106:5,9 106:11,17,22 107:4,12,16 107:24 108:7 109:7 110:6 110:11,18 111:7,21 112:2,4,16 113:5114:17 115:21,24 116:6,24 117:3,4,15 118:4,10,18 118:22 119:24 120:8,16 121:6,14 122:5,12,18 123:3,6,11,15 123:19,21 124:15,20 125:4,16 126:3,17,22 127:5,6,12,19 128:1,22 129:24130:3 130:12,15,21 131:5,7,22 132:22 133:13 133:20 135:10 135:20 136:5 136:13,16,21 138:4,8 139:4 139:15,23 140:10,23 141:9,15 142:5,10,21 143:6,17 144:12,15 164:10,19 mean 14:4 17:13 32:24 34:23 37:24 54:21 69:17 69:24 70:19 71:20 75:6 81:2 90:17 93:12 101:1 103:19 112:15 113:10 114:22 115:15 119:8 133:18 148:8 149:20 150:8 150:16 151:7 151:9,17 153:22,24 160:9 161:17 163:4 164:1 meaning 42:1,3 74:3 88:12 119:16 means 6:14 53:11131:1 150:19 151:11 166:15 meant 34:18,22 37:17 151:15 165:2 measurable 56:8 143:14 160:5,8,9,22 measure 23:23 80:23 81:13 114:1117:22 measureable 119:14,16 159:18 measured 21:19 22:15 87:9 108:23 160:10 measurement 57:5 119:13 measurements 124:2 measuring 11:6 mechanical 8:13 69:3 mediated 127:15 memo 153:19 154:21 memorandum 85:18 mentioned 9:8 9:19 13:15 24:6 31:15,15 32:16,18 42:6 74:19 76:20 127:2 164:11 mentions 75:4 75:10 metal 36:10 55:10 69:5 metallurgy 68:21 metals 69:6 Mexico 16:10 16:14,16 MI 2:16 microgram 19:10 22:18 micrograms 18:2120:12 21:24 22:3 23:1,14 25:10 27:10,19 28:5 28:17 29:4 31:13 microscope 55:3,7,13,17 55:21 microscopes 55:8 microscopy 54:6,11,12,14 54:17,24 55:1 56:5,11,14,24 57:4 58:4 middle 127:7 might 6:5 14:1 55:3 112:8 134:14 150:23 migration 154:2,16 155:5 mile 29:19 miles 72:13,20 72:24 73:11 million 95:1 103:21104:8 104:14 105:1 mind 32:5 100:23 147:1 147:11 mineral 1:8 3:13 minimal 19:4 minute 49:24 84:1,8,10,14 84:16,22 minutes 102:15 102:20 misleading 49:10 Miss 38:7 94:23 much 8:24 9:21 missed 77:24 10:17 48:3 122:10 52:18 89:9 missing 121:12 92:21 99:9 misstated 110:9 119:9 129:18 misunderstood 149:23 161:8 140:16 multiply 93:13 mix 132:11 multi-story 155:21 23:19 24:7,22 mixed 24:23 27:13,22 28:6 28:11131:13 30:24 132:5 140:20 must 168:15 156:22 myself 12:17 mixing 132:17 M.D 1:2 133:5,22 140:18 N mixture 132:13 N 2:13 3:1 4:1 139:16 name 7:9 24:10 molecule 24:12 36:3 109:17 121:6 168:10 121:11,12,15 names 11:21 121:24 129:16 147:23 161:23 narrow 57:24 molecules nature 17:17 119:21129:8 22:10 97:7 161:12,14,18 100:8,11 161:23 162:5 navigate 162:12,18,22 101:11 163:8,11,16 navigating 163:17,18,19 101:5 163:20,24 NEAL 3:10,11 molelcules 4:4 144:19 163:21 147:2 152:12 moment 17:22 156:9,13,16 Monday 1:15 158:19 159:11 monitoring 161:1162:4,8 11:6 162:13,15 monsanto 1:12 163:3,12,15 3:5 164:5 MONTGOME... necessarily 3:6 115:10 134:4 month 145:6 necessary more 9:24 53:21106:6 14:11,13 need 57:21 88:7 20:20 31:6 92:10 106:23 50:19 99:11 130:5 142:5,7 99:19 122:22 168:17 134:5,7 needed 52:14 157:12 neighborhood Morgan 46:12 18:8 morning 37:19 neither 157:11 67:8 never 50:9,19 MORRIS 3:14 53:4,6 61:21 most 60:11 63:5 74:22 99:22 143:11 75:176:16 143:14 87:9 123:8 mother 100:8 133:11,16 100:11 136:24 164:23 mouth 98:14 new 15:14 150:17 16:10,14,16 move 66:9 67:3 24:9 98:2 67:5 newspaper moved 72:23 30:10 movement 71:8 next 6:17 40:9 72:20 51:19 67:24 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60476 John Woodyard 180 68:6 80:14,17 157:9159:1 NIOSH 30:15 31:16,19,21 33:9,22 119:17,20 Nobody 48:10 nodding 141:7 nods 14:10 none 5:5,10,17 164:15 normal 165:2 north 1:1136:4 Northwest 15:13 27:21 notary 168:17 170:18 noted 168:8 170:9 NOTES 167:1 nothing 43:3 44:17 58:6 76:18 119:16 119:19 151:21 notice 2:4 noticed 98:24 novel 133:17 number 4:9 14:16 15:23 30:1137:4 44:10 47:16 47:18 49:6,20 55:9 65:8 84:10,12 94:17 95:24 97:1198:6,13 128:9 162:1 165:4 numbers 21:23 O Oak 3:12 object 26:21 42:12 56:13 57:1 62:7 95:20121:21 121:23 127:11 139:17 158:12 Objectin 70:13 objecting 34:12 objection 12:14 13:22 14:7 17:18 19:20 24:2,4 30:8,18 32:10,23 33:24 34:1,8 41:4,11,18 42:10 43:1 44:22 45:15 48:19,20 49:9 51:22 52:23 52:24 53:14 54:7,8 60:3,24 61:1,23 62:6 63:10,11,22 63:2464:7 65:5,23 68:11 70:7,18 71:19 72:15,16 73:1 73:2,12,20,22 74:15 76:7,12 77:21 78:3 80:3 81:11 83:1 86:19,20 87:15 89:3 90:13,21 91:7 91:2298:9 103:17,23 104:4,18 105:4,5,24 107:9109:5 110:2,3 114:8 116:20 118:8 119:18 120:4 120:13 121:1 121:4,5 122:8 122:14 123:1 124:24 127:17 127:18 128:18 131:20 133:9 136:12,15 137:24 138:22 138:24 140:8 140:13 141:3 141:22,24 146:22 159:6 164:22 objections 6:22 objective 73:4 observed 73:10 obtained 48:18 123:12 Obviously 94:18114:15 Occasionally 55:15 occasions 65:8 147:5,7 occupied 18:21 145:18,19,21 145:24 occur 49:18 100:10 occurred 18:14 21:17 32:12 165:4 October 166:11 off 6:8 92:8 93:5 94:8 109:23 110:15 111:11,14 114:2,6,13,18 115:12 116:19 117:10 118:6 137:14 140:21 145:8 offhand 65:21 83:9 134:1 office 24:13,19 28:9,12 31:3 137:12 offices 2:4 25:1 30:2 off-gas 73:18 off-gassing 74:3,13 often 143:1 Oh 112:2 okay 56:13 84:23 144:13 145:13 152:11 152:24153:20 164:19 old 43:11 older 30:12 once 38:16,23 82:15 86:7 one 2:5,19 3:3 9:13,14 14:12 14:13 15:3,3 15:2016:11 16:23 17:1 19:6,8,10,10 28:21 29:16 32:19 37:22 39:4,24 40:1,3 40:5,9,10,12 40:14,16,22 40:23 41:2,24 42:1 52:3 55:22 60:10 64:9 65:20,21 65:22 75:18 76:24 79:21 80:15,15 81:20 82:23 84:12 86:9 87:5,10 91:3 95:9 97:3 98:1 99:19 101:2 108:9115:11 116:10 124:22 128:3 129:16 133:7 137:14 144:9 147:22 151:2,11,13 152:10,19 154:20 161:19 161:21,22,22 ones 14:21 37:14 38:16 42:7 44:8 137:13 only 19:4 31:21 32:11 44:4 51:11 66:22 85:24 87:7 89:16 92:12 94:14 96:8 97:21113:16 113:18 116:4 117:7 149:19 150:1,19 151:2 162:5 163:7,18,19 163:20 onto 146:18 161:15 open 90:9,12,20 153:24154:13 opened 147:7 opening 97:19 100:17 125:6 148:8 149:2 operating 15:16 27:1 32:13 165:2 operator 29:22 opine 50:22,24 124:11125:10 134:11 opined 133:21 opinion 43:17 45:14 60:16 60:22 61:6,16 95:24 97:22 98:16 104:10 104:23 107:20 109:17 111:18 119:1,2 124:18,21 125:1 130:17 131:10 141:12 143:8 144:10 159:13 163:7 163:24 opinions 25:18 26:14 41:10 56:2,4,7 60:18 60:20,22 62:5 80:6 125:2,23 134:2,18 opportunity 57:12 opposed 54:20 113:4116:18 143:10 163:17 163:17 optical 54:14 54:23 55:1,6,8 55:17 Oral 2:3 order 22:8 106:7 152:22 ordered 26:17 37:18 organic 9:10,11 9:14,18 original 41:16 41:20 144:23 168:20 other 7:10 9:17 9:22 10:3 14:1 20:17 22:13 28:24 30:3 31:18 32:7,8 39:4 42:18 43:3 45:21 54:5 64:11 68:20 70:6,8 72:3,18 75:23 79:3 84:23 86:11,22 104:6 111:19 112:15,17 117:9,13 128:14 129:13 131:13 132:3 133:22 137:7 137:18,21 138:13 142:24 146:18 147:3 147:19,23 149:12150:10 151:19 156:6 156:22157:20 160:20,23 161:2 others 16:6,12 124:4 otherwise 116:16 out 54:2 57:17 65:9 66:2 92:21100:7 101:9 103:5 147:13 153:4 outside 70:4 96:10 99:1 106:10,14 oven 84:14 ovens 156:24 over 17:8 52:8 53:16 60:8 65:24 66:16 66:16 72:20 73:10 90:23 94:24 97:12 100:8 101:17 102:8,8 103:21104:8 104:14,24,24 137:12 138:3 138:3 142:8,9 149:18 150:7 150:18,20 151:6 168:2 overbroad 73:21 76:8 Overly 138:22 ow 99:11 Owens-Illinois 15:20 23:2,3 33:6 own 13:5 65:14 100:9 105:18 105:19 133:15 138:9,21 139:5 157:16 owner 17:16 18:3 24:11,12 Oxford 2:19 o'clock 102:8 P P 2:3,13,13 3:1 3:14:2 7:2 package 60:12 packages 60:9 packaging 47:11 page 4:9 5:4,4,4 5:9,9,9,13,13 5:13,16,16,16 46:6,18 47:7 47:18,18 51:7 51:10 52:4 84:16 96:8 124:19,21,23 125:23 126:12 145:1151:3 167:2 169:2 pages 170:4 paper 11:23 112:23 papers 138:12 paragraph 45:13,17 46:6 51:9 84:9,13 84:15 part 10:8 12:8 24:16 43:12 46:19 49:13 49:15 60:11 72:12 122:2 138:11 143:22 145:11,11 152:2155:11 158:7,8 159:23 particle 11:14 particles 12:9 particular 14:11 25:10 85:5 105:21 147:11149:24 151:5 154:10 156:6 particulates 10:21 parties 6:20 parts 22:14 29:18 33:14 138:20 139:5 passage 135:23 passing 123:23 patches 44:9,15 52:19,22 PCB 20:3 21:17 21:21,21 27:20 28:22 32:1 33:16 56:8 59:4,17 59:21,23 60:2 60:8 61:10 64:2 65:4 72:3 72:7 75:10 97:13 113:19 120:2,11 121:7,11,12 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60477 John Woodyard 181 128:4 129:7 134:15 136:6 136:22,24 137:9 161:12 PCBs 13:18,21 13:24 21:19 22:3,13 23:1,8 23:13 28:4 31:12 35:8,13 56:15 57:5 59:24 61:7,17 61:18 71:4,8 72:12,20 73:5 73:10,17 74:6 74:14 75:12 75:17 95:13 96:16,19,24 97:7 104:10 104:16 105:2 105:9,12 107:6 108:4 108:12,14,22 109:4,9,15,17 109:21,23 110:14 111:4 111:10 112:6 112:8,18 113:1,3,4,6,17 114:1,6,13,18 114:23 115:11 115:19,22 116:19 117:12 117:12,17,23 118:5,16,20 118:24 119:3 119:9,12,14 120:9,21 121:15 128:15 129:8,9,22 130:1132:24 133:22,24 134:6,11,19 135:2 139:10 139:12,14,15 139:20141:5 141:21142:24 143:10 144:7 156:15,17 159:2,14,18 160:1,6,17,19 160:22 161:14 162:6 163:6 164:16 PCBss 161:14 peaceful 102:22 Peck 3:20 pen 90:2 Penn 22:6 Pennsylvania 1:1,2,3,3,4,5 1:23 2:7,10,20 3:4,8,16 15:21 166:10 people 101:8 137:16 per 19:10 20:12 21:24 25:10 28:17 46:10 49:24 84:1,8,9 84:14,16,22 91:16 154:9 percent 117:8 155:22 perform 7:21 74:22 117:16 117:18 performance 48:1 75:21 76:17 118:7 performed 19:3 73:16 75:1 112:19 113:14 154:8 performing 55:14 perhaps 13:13 14:116:12 22:19 31:3 33:19 146:5 150:13 151:12 permanently 46:13 129:19 person 79:4 personal 30:13 personally 13:7 160:2 perspective 103:6 pertain 26:11 Philadelphia 1:23 2:6 3:4,8 3:16 16:3 PHILIPS 1:10 phone 92:11 phonetic 124:8 125:14 135:15 photographic 157:20 photographs 158:1,24 photos 157:22 157:24 158:6 phrase 98:15 phrased 70:18 physical 9:20 70:2 73:5 134:19 physically 115:5 physics 8:10 pick 153:4 pictures 87:8 piece 84:20 92:13 121:8 piles 37:18 pipeline 72:24 pipelines 72:8 72:21 Pittsburgh 2:20 101:23,24 Place 2:5 3:3,11 placed 47:24 149:18 150:18 places 146:4 placing 113:6 plaintiff 97:17 97:19 Plaintiffs 1:6 2:17,20 plan 21:17 23:8 25:6 27:6,16 28:1,14 plant 12:18 13:15 15:18 23:4 24:6,8,9 24:11 25:6 27:2,7,9 28:12 33:6 44:19,21 45:2 plants 10:23 plasticizer 114:21,23 115:23 116:5 116:7,11 154:2,15 155:5 156:4 156:12,14,17 157:3 plasticizers 115:15,19 plastics 45:6 68:21 69:7 Plaza 16:11,23 please 58:19 61:3 85:16 108:10 111:23 pliant 116:11 116:18 plumb 25:21 point 9:6 17:3 61:15 97:17 97:21 98:2,3 112:6,9 114:16 118:15 118:20119:5 119:6,6 129:5 148:11149:17 152:1156:6 157:9 159:1 159:17 161:10 162:4,16 pointed 65:9 points 100:9 Policy 18:20 pollution 10:14 58:15 polution 11:6 portion 24:22 135:9 145:6 portions 138:16 pose 103:1 posing 100:21 posit 98:11 posited 92:17 95:9 97:2 positions 67:1 posits 89:1 possession 41:1 possible 44:3 possibly 132:9 136:20 potential 30:11 pounds 81:3,8 81:12,15 power 10:23 12:18 13:15 15:9,21 22:6 27:2 28:12 30:21,23 practicing 34:4 prcaution 48:5 precaution 48:4 preceding 9:20 precise 11:19 151:18 160:11 preference 100:1 prepare 21:16 52:2 prepared 7:12 7:1741:20 47:2,5 prescribe 18:15 18:19 20:8,20 22:1,21,24 prescribed 28:3 28:16 29:2 33:9 present 3:20 14:2 22:4 31:24 33:13 59:24 61:17 61:18 91:24 92:2,3 pressure 73:6,6 74:6 75:5,10 75:12,17 78:22 82:5,18 82:20 83:10 88:20 89:2,4,8 132:15,18 133:7 134:15 presumably 155:23 pretty 8:24 10:17 51:4 52:17 125:13 149:23 158:11 158:13 161:8 prevent 125:19 previous 82:18 107:13,15 princess 43:11 44:14 principle 140:1 principles 12:8 143:7 print 30:3 probably 60:10 60:13 134:23 136:24 137:2 148:22 149:22 procedure 97:5 proceed 6:5 process 20:1 49:19,20 83:17,21 85:3 89:21114:7 127:15 128:15 149:17 155:13 155:23 produced 63:8 producing 64:5 product 140:20 152:15 production 5:8 83:17,24 85:10,20 products 1:9 3:13 24:12 25:4,14 35:23 36:9 42:16 74:4 80:10 Professional 2:9 project 14:11 15:9,10,11,12 15:13,14,16 15:17 16:11 17:9 19:24 22:10 27:12 29:6 31:14 71:6 72:6 projects 14:15 14:1715:7,18 16:8 25:23 26:11 31:22 36:11 59:4 promptly 168:22 proper 57:19 93:21 properly 151:22 properties 68:19 70:3 73:5 97:7 134:6,11,19 property 25:6 70:3 propounded 170:7 protection 146:11 protocol 34:3 provide 8:7 65:22 66:5 87:21 provided 15:3 38:8 39:8 41:2 47:17 57:12 60:9 63:6 65:2 65:14 77:17 79:12 86:17 86:23 96:9 168:12,17 provides 80:7 public 1:4 16:16 101:8 168:18 170:18 pulled 81:9 pure 88:4 113:3 113:17 139:14 139:15,20 142:24 143:10 143:10 purpose 45:21 148:4,5 152:7 152:13,14 155:18 purposes 12:20 30:2 31:9 49:23 pursuant 2:4 put 12:5 83:22 88:18 97:3 100:7 114:12 123:3,8 150:17 puts 98:20 putting 11:24 98:14 P.C 2:14 P.E 2:4 4:2 7:2 p.m 165:10 ______ Q______ quaint 30:12 qualified 105:22 106:4 134:10 quality 49:14 49:22 83:14 quantity 65:3 question 5:15 6:23 13:23 21:12 26:7 35:5,9 43:2 48:22 51:23 53:16,17,23 61:3 67:24 68:4,6 70:18 70:19 72:18 73:13 74:16 77:24 82:18 84:20 88:5,8,9 88:12 94:13 94:14 95:8,16 95:18,20 96:22 97:10 97:15,21 98:12,15 100:22 104:21 106:3,14 107:22 108:6 108:8 109:2 111:15 112:5 115:20 116:21 121:22 122:10 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60478 John Woodyard 182 122:15 123:20 128:10130:10 130:20131:3 134:14,16 136:20 138:2 138:3,7,11 139:18 140:9 140:14 141:4 141:7,23 142:2,3,8,11 142:12,14,16 142:16,20,22 152:9 154:5 156:8 159:7 163:1 questioning 61:13 questions 8:4 26:2034:20 54:1 56:20 57:17 82:22 96:12 103:2 106:24 125:12 126:6 164:6 168:22 170:7 quick 52:18 quickly 26:23 quite 51:10 R R 2:13 3:1,11 166:1 range 85:10 rate 49:24 83:24 84:1 113:11143:13 143:20144:3 144:8 157:1 rates 113:20 139:21 rather 6:6 reabsorbing 120:23 reach 92:19 108:17 133:2 reached 60:18 60:20,22 reaching 109:12110:7 112:13 read 6:12,13,15 46:21 59:10 59:1181:10 133:14,16,17 134:24 135:7 136:19,22,24 142:1449 151:21168:2 168:3 170:4 reading 43:19 reads 46:7 really 67:15 102:9 149:5 realm 70:4 reason 63:14 158:23 160:18 168:5,9 reasons 65:11 recall 19:1,16 20:24 21:22 25:131:5 32:6 34:2 36:16,19 36:23 41:21 43:2444:17 53:5,10 55:18 61:22 62:2,22 63:2 64:4 65:7 65:2175:13 76:3,10,14 82:3 123:17 127:20 137:13 137:14,18 146:8 147:10 147:21148:2 148:10 152:22 158:4,15 recalls 110:18 receive 168:23 received 59:13 59:18 62:19 62:23 recent 43:20 recess 100:20 recessing 102:9 recognize 112:24 recollection 31:6 33:22 67:12 recommended 30:15 reconfirms 109:16 record 6:1,8 7:18 39:194:8 94:10126:7,8 164:20 165:6 166:4 rectangle 90:8 rectangular 4:14 157:11 redeveloped 30:13 redevelopment 30:5 refer 51:11 83:14 137:4,8 reference 75:13 79:15 84:7 107:10,11 113:18 126:13 137:2,5,8,22 referenced 81:23 references 80:22 83:3,4 84:9,16 85:20 138:13 referencing 82:11 84:19 referred 133:15 137:1150:12 151:20 referring 41:12 68:4 127:22 152:24 154:17 154:17 157:14 159:8 160:3 161:5,6,24 refers 78:11 regard 18:4 20:7,8 25:3 30:16 35:17 35:20 45:14 49:12 50:3 53:21 54:19 57:9 58:10 59:19 71:4,17 71:21 75:1,4 75:17 79:13 104:10 106:24 113:23 115:6 127:1,13 129:1134:3,6 141:20 159:24 regarding 8:4 13:21 63:7 65:3 85:18 regardless 97:11 regards 54:16 146:20 Region 15:12 Reims 16:4 21:10 32:18 reinforced 43:18 reinforces 88:21 related 8:21 11:7 56:5 71:2 72:3 134:14 136:7,22 137:9 relates 35:6 64:10 relathe 84:5 relation 13:14 13:16 26:20 relationship 35:8 relative 47:10 68:18 relatively 52:18 releasability 133:8,23 release 92:14 104:10,16 105:2 108:4 109:9 130:1 159:13 160:17 163:10,24 released 22:13 23:8 56:9 72:12 105:9 107:6 108:12 108:23 109:4 109:15 119:9 129:8 159:18 160:17,19 161:12,14 162:6,23 163:22 releases 160:6 163:6 relevance 25:13 26:10 56:16 relevancy 57:24 58:3 relevant 58:9 96:1,13 113:19 relied 41:23 70:5,15 77:14 110:6 117:19 rely 45:10 46:24 47:8 62:4 75:11,16 77:20 78:2,7 79:14 105:12 108:17 109:11 111:16 112:12 133:2 134:2 134:17 137:23 138:9 139:6 relying 41:21 111:1124:4,5 130:22 remaind 159:5 remember 11:2121:2 29:16 44:7,8 66:11 69:1 83:22 145:4,6 147:23 164:13 removal 148:11 remove 81:7 155:23 157:1 157:1 render 43:16 56:2 62:5 134:18 rendered 61:16 rendering 41:9 56:3 75:21 78:7 124:22 125:1 renovating 20:2 reoccupancy 20:6 repeat 61:3 108:10 110:17 repeatedly 136:17 rephrase 163:2 report 7:12,22 8:3,5 25:15,16 26:11,19 41:12,17,17 41:21,23 42:4 43:23 44:2 47:9,14 50:23 50:23 51:7,14 55:24 56:5 58:1,2,4 61:5 61:15,19,22 63:20,23 64:1 64:9,11,14 65:1,19,20 66:11 67:7 74:19 75:4,7 75:22 78:5,8 85:12 86:14 89:16 90:4 92:12 93:3,16 96:7 106:18 106:20,23 107:10,13,23 110:17 111:20 118:11119:11 124:12,12,17 124:23 125:5 125:8,10,19 125:20,22 126:4 127:13 144:20,23,24 149:16 151:17 157:19 158:3 158:5 160:24 161:2,3,3,4,5 161:6 reported 65:16 reporter 2:9 6:10 37:23 38:6 142:19 166:18 reports 7:17 64:16 86:4 126:21 153:1 153:1,2,5 represent 17:11 17:13 represented 16:18 representing 2:17,20 16:15 reproduction 166:15 request 5:8 66:17 67:19 requested 62:23 142:20 require 168:22 requires 56:10 resdential 30:16 research 72:6 72:19 74:9 136:7 reserved 6:23 resin 131:12,17 164:4 resist 128:21 resistance 77:7 79:16,18 80:8 81:8 83:5 resistant 80:22 81:22 82:13 86:5 respect 70:1 respective 6:20 responding 50:4 97:5 response 15:20 responsibility 93:23 rest 76:21 101:3 resting 121:16 121:18,19 result 63:16 64:17 119:11 results 63:13 64:2,5,12 65:13,15 71:7 71:8 105:11 111:3 Resume 14:16 14:23 72:10 resuspension 121:17 retained 17:15 18:3 19:23 21:15 Return 168:20 review 40:9,12 40:14,16,23 75:20 78:5 86:21 105:15 107:19 116:24 124:5 139:2 reviewed 37:4 37:14 38:20 39:9,12,15 41:19 74:20 76:11 106:12 Reyers 2:8 RHOADS 3:6 right 8:14 40:4 42:9 46:20 47:17 50:7,16 50:22 52:6 53:13 58:10 62:5 63:9,21 64:6 71:12 72:24 74:23 77:15,18,23 81:16 86:18 87:11 90:5,9 90:12 91:3 92:23 100:23 103:4 107:1 108:1113:2 114:7 115:12 116:1 120:24 123:14 129:1 132:8 135:5 136:11141:6 145:13 168:3 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60479 John Woodyard 183 risk 33:17 river 29:14 roads 99:15 role 16:13,24 19:22 21:14 23:6,7 25:3,5 27:5,15,24 roll 27:6 room 87:13,22 88:1 89:10 108:24 109:1 109:15 111:5 111:8 113:1 118:13 122:3 122:6,13,17 129:14,23 131:12 routine 61:14 routinely 59:3 Rue 135:15 rule 96:12 rules 168:22 run 52:8,16 53:2 59:3 62:14,15 83:21105:23 106:4,7 153:12 running 95:11 97:11 98:6,13 150:19 151:6 R-E-I-M-S 16:5 S S 2:13 3:14:8 48:15,16 50:18 safe 20:5 Safety 144:21 sake 129:5 161:11162:17 163:5 same 12:19 16:19 37:19 48:8 52:1 82:22 83:4 84:15,15 93:19 105:4,5 131:3 138:3 142:8,11,16 146:6 149:9 154:5,12,17 154:19 166:15 170:5 sample 10:21 46:17 samples 11:4,8 11:10 13:3,5 13:20 14:4'5 18:9 55:10 59:4 62:21 71:11,23 147:15 148:19 152:3 sampling 8:22 11:15,17 San 16:10 17:23 32:5 Sante 17:22 32:4 sat 12:24 saw 8:13 14:16 48:15 53:4 saying 52:7 68:2 96:21 118:23 124:16 124:18 142:24 149:22 163:9 says 25:18 47:17 49:2 61:6 79:4 81:2 92:11111:20 119:11128:2 153:21 154:2 162:11 scenario 32:21 32:24120:24 school 55:12 70:24134:8,9 science 68:22 69:16,22 70:2 130:6,20,21 131:1,10 133:5 134:8 140:2143:7 162:10 sciences 68:18 69:19112:22 scientific 106:7 137:16 scientist 68:9 68:10,16 93:11 seal 52:7 53:12 90:8,10 150:4 151:22 sealed 46:11,13 148:12 sealing 6:21 42:2446:14 46:19 47:3 51:2152:6,8 53:8,22 75:2 89:16,19 90:8 90:20 91:14 97:6 128:3,15 149:17 150:4 150:9,20 151:6,23 seals 90:20,22 91:3 seat 52:10 second 38:13 52:5 84:4 85:15 91:19 147:24 154:11 155:11 157:16 159:16 161:23 seconds 50:2 84:21149:19 150:2,19 151:1,7,9,12 151:13 161:22 secretary 37:18 section 149:19 149:21,24 150:8,18 sections 90:11 see 47:21 56:15 67:9 68:3 74:5 87:7 115:3,5,7 115:7126:18 128:5 148:13 153:18 154:9 154:23 160:5 seeing 99:3 seen 7:1049:1 49:1 87:5 150:1157:3,5 158:24 sees 63:16 selling 20:2 semester 9:13 10:15 semi 140:11 155:21 sensational 98:6 sense 38:3 sensitive 36:17 36:21 43:4,14 44:5,16 sent 62:21 71:14 sentence 145:1 separate 16:19 22:5 series 47:1 85:7 86:3 service 16:16 28:22 SERVICES 1:2 1:21 set 18:22 33:22 156:1 sets 37:20 seven 22:9 23:24 24:16 24:20 several 8:9 9:19 15:18 16:7 75:14 147:7 147:19 149:18 149:20 150:7 150:18 152:23 153:1,2 severe 152:16 152:17 share 100:3 sheet 168:6,9 168:10,14,20 169:1170:9 shop 28:12 36:12,12 shops 24:23 30:3 shorthand 166:17 shortly 29:1 show 14:22 43:12 45:11 46:5,24 87:2 106:20 114:10 117:20 128:11 133:4 135:21 showed 72:19 109:15 157:20 showing 15:2 shown 59:8,21 72:12 136:14 shows 47:12 84:13 90:15 129:12 side 29:20 90:9 90:12,20 91:3 128:14 129:13 sides 90:24 side-tracked 54:3 sign 6:12,13,15 115:11168:10 168:11,15,16 signature 168:19 significance 15:4 significant 98:13 104:16 113:9,10 157:12 signing 168:13 simply 17:7 60:17,21 73:4 88:21144:8 simulated 110:22 since 6:5 7:18 7:22 28:23 66:21 69:15 69:19,22 70:24 108:8 148:11 sir 23:20 27:23 28:8 30:19 31:17 32:20 37:10 39:10 39:13,16 47:22 57:10 58:24 62:16 67:22 71:13 71:16 77:19 83:11 90:6 109:2 111:9 111:15,18 113:9 145:2 145:23 151:8 152:6 154:14 155:17 158:3 158:9 159:15 164:14 sit 142:8 site 28:19 30:16 65:4 107:19 130:16 144:21 149:1 sites 71:11 85:4 85:7 sits 92:9 sitting 86:15 93:4 99:7 situation 23:12 61:11 62:12 159:10,12 situations 32:12 33:11 44:10 63:12 six 22:8 24:15 24:20 43:10 148:6,23 sixth 148:24 149:3,5,6 sizes 47:12 sizing 47:11 slated 148:11 slightly 51:11 slip 125:18 slowed 128:12 small 72:7 161:24 Smith 42:19,23 44:13 sn 99:11 snow 99:19,20 sold 35:23 soliciting 125:2 solid 131:12,19 131:23 132:1 132:2 140:4,7 140:11,21 141:2,6,11,19 143:3,4,10 144:5 155:22 156:19 164:3 solidifies 131:14 solidify 156:1 solids 117:8 143:11,14 144:7 sollvents 117:13 solution 132:7 140:1,3,5,6,19 solvent 155:24 solvents 132:3 133:22 156:6 157:2 some 10:2 12:2 12:13 13:17 17:8 22:19 32:7,8 33:13 33:16,19,20 33:21 45:21 54:1 63:14 65:12 70:1 71:9 74:8 81:6 81:13 104:5 108:18,19,21 137:15 150:11 160:16 163:6 somebody 48:7 somehow 109:18 127:2 127:14 128:12 134:15 someone 106:8 something 8:23 18:8 24:1 57:4 164:22 sometime 55:19 55:20 somewhat 66:12156:21 somewhere 20:4 84:2 92:1 soon 103:4 129:16 sorbent 12:2 sorbents 11:23 sorry 38:14 39:23 40:4 61:2 65:21 77:24 102:21 122:9 136:8 137:20 145:4 145:9 source 75:10 sources 61:10 75:18 96:10 South 3:7 space 18:22 108:16 168:12 168:17 span 151:10 speaking 8:18 59:6 speaks 45:22 specialty 15:17 24:6 specific 9:5,9 21:12 36:11 51:5,11 74:3 75:13 94:17 98:10,18 134:13 135:9 139:2146:24 154:8 specifically 10:19 11:18 35:6 36:19,24 41:24 45:10 52:7,16 53:23 54:10 68:24 69:4 71:4 86:9 137:14,20 154:6 specification 37:17,20 46:17 48:2 77:4,6 152:21 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060480 John Woodyard 184 153:3 specifications 80:8 91:10 124:6 specified 46:14 82:16 speed 84:14,18 speeding 48:6 spent 35:21 spill 15:19 18:20 spills 17:24 spread 156:23 square 19:15 20:12 21:24 23:14 25:10 28:18 89:19 91:14 95:1,24 103:12,21 104:8,14 105:1 stable 112:10 stack 10:22 Stamped 4:11 stand 6:16 66:19 standard 18:21 22:18 23:11 23:13,18 25:8 25:9 31:16,19 31:21 33:19 79:16 80:23 80:24 81:22 82:13 83:5 86:5 105:20 106:3,8 136:6 136:8 standards 18:22 23:16 25:13 start 45:12 started 54:1 state 1:6 15:22 16:9,14 72:14 127:14156:5 156:19,19,20 162:16 164:2 164:2 stated 108:21 111:2 statement 26:14 119:13 135:18 160:21 162:2,3,5 states 1:8 77:9 stay 100:8 129:19 130:2 stayed 109:19 117:12,17 step 101:2 sticky 131:11 131:17 164:3 still 45:6 140:1 140:2 154:22 stipulate 50:8 94:24 stipulated 6:19 stipulations 5:12 6:11 stood 135:11 storage 29:21 29:21 store 28:22 stories 18:7,7 20:23 22:7,9 23:21,24 24:20 31:2,6 story 24:16 stream 120:12 Street 2:6 3:7 3:12 strength 81:4,5 strengths 69:6 Stret 3:15 stricken 35:3 stringent 20:20 structural 55:9 structure 24:17 24:19 stuck 52:16 122:1 study 10:5 108:18 ST-67 77:12 subconcious 99:3 subject 26:8 56:2166:10 71:1,3 98:21 120:3 124:11 133:22 168:13 subjected 153:17 subjects 113:7 Subscribed 170:13 substance 168:4,8 170:8 substantial 103:16,19 105:2 subtract 93:13 sued 17:6 21:6 suffered 157:12 suggest 102:14 suggested 29:10 suggesting 100:20" Suite 2:16,19 3:15 sum 161:9 summer 36:2 145:12 summers 35:21 sun 107:23 supervision 166:17 supplemental 7:12,18 8:5 25:15 26:19 29:21 41:17 42:4 55:24 58:2,4 75:7 86:14 89:15 96:7 106:18 106:20,23 111:20 144:24 161:6 supplier 36:7 supplies 36:8 36:13 93:16 Supply 15:15 27:13 support 5:1 16:8 129:4,20 130:4 supports 131:10 supposed 66:18 124:7 132:11 sure 14:24 20:5 21:23 48:6 51:4 52:9 53:12 59:12 64:22 99:12 130:13 134:9 152:15 surface 19:13 23:13 25:7,9 52:9 120:2,10 120:18 121:7 129:18 130:2 139:9,11,22 141:1,16,19 143:2 surfaces 27:9 119:13 surrogate 32:2 SUSAN 3:15 suspended 132:24 suspicion 67:11 sustain 98:9 swimmingly 126:20 sworn 7:3 166:3 170:13 system 72:12 104:11123:10 123:12 124:6 systems 35:18 36:6 T T 4:8 48:15,16 50:18 166:1,1 table 143:15,19 143:20,21 tack 153:21,21 154:13 taht 92:22 take 7:1110:3 26:18 57:13 63:13,14 66:18 74:20 76:16 82:4 83:21 91:16 101:2 107:2 124:2 147:15 148:12,18 151:22 taken 2:4 18:9 64:17 65:12 71:11 94:6 118:3 145:21 takes 6:16 taking 10:5 26:13 101:8 110:14148:9 talk 53:16 58:16 70:2 95:6 99:9 102:17 103:1 107:15 143:24 155:8 163:5 164:1 talked 13:4 17:22 52:20 53:6 56:7 89:15 152:1 157:1 159:1 162:9 talking 11:22 19:12 35:1 51:16 63:24 70:1 87:18 88:3,13 109:1 111:8 113:4 115:18 117:11 119:20 121:10 129:16 134:13 135:3 139:2 139:13 140:4 143:4,22 146:20 154:12 157:22 160:17 161:7 talks 52:6 83:16 154:15 164:12 tape 25:24 26:2 36:17,21 37:2 37:6 42:8,24 44:16 45:11 46:2,3,12,20 47:3 51:21 52:9,11 53:8 75:2 89:16,19 90:8,20 91:11 91:15 92:13 94:18 95:1 96:15,23 97:12 98:7 103:12,16,21 104:9,15 108:1 128:3 149:18,19 150:5,15,18 150:20 151:6 151:23,23 tape's 46:13 target 29:4 targets 18:20 task 148:7 taught 68:20 69:18 teach 69:8 technical 137:15 techniques 10:17,24 11:9 11:12,19 12:19 TEDFORD 3:10 tell 10:2,6 11:1 11:13,18 15:7 19:22 20:7 27:1 28:2,13 44:6,8 45:10 45:13 46:1,1 60:1 65:20 67:10 76:22 86:7,15 88:6 114:5 136:23 137:13 139:9 140:24 143:7 144:6 telling 50:12 tells 109:16 temperature 47:19 50:10 51:3 77:7 79:16,18 80:7 80:22 81:22 82:13 83:4 84:21 85:5,9 85:19,21 86:4 87:9,14,23 88:2 89:11 105:8 108:24 109:1,16,20 109:21110:13 110:14,19 111:5,8,10 112:8,18 113:2 114:2 118:13,14,14 122:3,7,13,17 122:23 123:2 123:5,7,9,11 123:22 124:3 129:6,14,23 131:12 152:16 159:4,9 161:12 163:6 164:24 165:5 temperatures 48:3,17 49:16 51:12,14,15 85:2 109:14 156:24 ten 13:13 18:7 18:21 20:12 21:24 22:3,18 23:1,14,24 27:10,19 28:4 28:17 29:4,22 31:13 50:1 72:5 90:4 91:5 91:12,15,16 102:15,20 163:21 Tennessee 16:2 term 53:2 64:8 69:23,24 81:16 133:12 140:3 151:18 termed 145:19 terminology 29:17 91:2 terms 25:14 151:10 test 32:2 38:21 49:22 74:12 74:23 75:1 77:6 79:22 80:23 81:6,23 82:24 84:16 85:5 107:6 108:19 109:14 110:1111:16 112:12,19 114:10 116:15 117:23 152:14 153:11,13 154:8,19 tested 77:11 testified 7:4 66:15 129:8 150:24 161:13 testify 123:18 testimony 4:2 45:2249:1 62:7 88:24 89:6,7 105:3 106:1,12 107:11108:21 111:2 113:6,8 114:20 115:16 117:1124:4 125:9 126:9 126:11 127:4 131:24 134:12 135:6 141:21 157:17,19 158:10,24 159:23 161:20 164:17 166:5 168:12 testing 10:14,15 10:17,22,22 33:12 48:2 70:9,11,24 73:4,17 74:5,8 79:17 83:14 147:14 149:12 152:2 154:3 159:24 160:3 160:7,11 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60481 John Woodyard 185 testng 49:14 57:16126:24 tests 48:10 three 48:11,17 77:12 85:8 49:6 50:6,15 105:20 108:22 79:17 80:24 110:22111:4 81:3 84:13 113:14,22 127:9 146:5,6 117:16,18,19 146:9147:4 117:22 129:11 151:12,13 133:3 152:4161:19 text 46:22 161:21,22,22 Thank 81:17 164:24 103:7,9 126:1 through 4:12 their 20:2 21:16 12:1,1 21:16 36:9 60:18,20 26:6 37:12 60:21,22 59:8 83:14,21 62:14 123:23 124:13 themselves 85:3 128:16 148:13 147:3 thermal 37:2 throughout 19:7 22:18 thermodynamics 104:15 124:9 10:7 tie 151:14 thickness 47:13 time 6:24 7:18 thing 94:15 7:22 13:11 154:18 28:21 30:5 things 10:10 31:21 44:1,4 12:7 43:6 44:5 45:5 50:14 56:12 100:9 52:14,22 125:18 143:22 55:16 59:21 157:20 59:21 60:4,4,4 think 6:4 16:6,7 69:2,15,22 16:12 17:7 83:22,23 20:19 24:15 98:19101:2 26:17 29:16 145:24 151:10 31:8 32:4 153:21,22,24 39:2144:23 154:13,13 45:3,7,16,17 156:24 45:22 49:6 times 13:9 56:20 57:23 66:17 91:16 58:12,17 91:16127:9 61:19 62:17 Timothy 3:20 66:5,24 67:2 Today 155:1 92:20,22 together 47:6 93:20,22 90:1114:22 94:16 95:4,23 114:24 96:4 98:3,20 told 46:3 48:24 101:4102:11 60:1,22 64:4 105:22 111:24 71:18 93:7 125:13 126:5 127:8 136:2 141:19 146:8 toluene 132:4,5 148:2 150:10 132:7,14,17 152:19 161:8 132:24 134:14 161:19 162:9 140:19,21 164:21 155:24 156:6 thinking 102:9 tomorrow 6:16 third 84:8 96:1299:7,10 155:12 101:1,4 THOMAS 2:18 tool 46:14 52:8 3:3 151:6 thorough 52:10 tools 11:3 53:13 150:12 top 46:6 77:9 150:13 92:8 93:5 though 112:24 121:19 137:15 128:24 145:8 thought 38:19 topics 8:21 48:23 57:13 total 89:19 tough 102:5 tour 145:18,21 147:6 touring 147:3 town 29:18 100:2,15,16 trained 59:5 trainedme 59:16 training 25:19 54:4,19,20 59:13,18 107:17 transcript 166:14 168:21 transcription 170:6 transfer 20:5 21:5 128:13 152:19 transferred 72:13 73:10 transformer 1:12 19:5 21:17,22 22:12 23:3 31:23 33:2 34:14,24 71:7 transmitted 62:24 63:3 transportation 1:3 16:10 101:8 144:21 trapped 119:22 treated 140:20 treatment 8:23 69:4 152:17 trial 6:24 tribe 43:12 troughs 147:8 true 8:15 25:17 71:15 72:14 78:10,13 87:13,17 91:9 93:18 107:5,7 115:13 116:8 116:10,19 120:15,17 135:2138:5 140:17 141:17 150:6 166:4 truly 162:24 try 81:7 90:1 94:16 100:1 108:1125:18 trying 25:21 61:12 66:1 149:4 151:16 163:4,18 tuning 12:17 13:14 turn 33:18 twice 130:11 twist 98:20 two 17:21 28:20 32:5 37:20 40:17 41:7 42:6,22 44:13 45:9 46:11 47:6 51:18 64:9 85:4,8,10 89:16 91:17 92:12 94:24 99:19 103:21 104:8,14,24 107:19 114:2 128:2 129:2 133:5 144:21 146:5,6,8 147:4 149:3 151:11155:14 156:2 type 12:2,13 28:9 61:7,18 65:3,10 160:7 types 10:16 11:14,16,22 11:23 12:10 55:10 59:24 69:5 148:13 160:10 typically 12:4 12:12 55:1 60:19 62:4,8 134:20 T&S 78:17 107:18 157:13 U Urn-hum 33:4 76:1 under 15:19 71:9 73:18 88:16 107:22 107:23 129:10 153:18 159:3 160:1 165:2 166:16 undergrad 8:11 undergraduate 9:14 55:12 69:13,14 understand 26:16 88:11 94:20 96:17 110:12 134:7 151:16,18 153:11 156:7 162:10 163:1 163:4 understanding 12:8 61:12 64:23 understood 42:7 78:1 79:22 undue 98:20 uniform 52:10 53:13 uniformly utilized 31:20 149:23 150:14 41:16 79:9 UNITED 1:8 86:8 131:16 units 139:21 156:4,8 157:3 University U.S 3:13 68:22 unless 57:1,3 V 97:17 125:6 vague 41:11 147:10 166:16 66:12 unreasonable valid 106:7 66:19 values 87:22 until 6:24102:7 vapor 11:16 118:23 119:3 74:6 75:4,10 use 11:1 24:23 75:11,17 28:11 29:13 78:21 82:5,18 29:23 30:16 82:20 83:10 31:19 35:13 88:20 89:1,4,8 36:17 41:14 112:9 132:15 45:11 46:11 132:18 133:6 46:14 48:7,8 134:15 164:2 53:2 55:4,13 vaporization 55:22 56:14 87:22 113:8,9 62:8 80:19 113:11,20 81:16,18 82:9 83:12 84:23 118:12 120:3 139:21141:2 85:13,24 141:5,14,20 86:13 116:12 143:1144:11 144:9 154:11 144:12 used 11:3,15,17 vaporize 87:14 12:4,9,10,12 88:1,17,19 12:15,17,19 89:10 108:16 27:4 28:21 113:1,11 29:20 30:1 118:15,24 31:22 33:17 vaporized 33:18 34:5 120:9 139:11 35:14 45:18 164:16 45:21 55:1,3,8 vaporizes 55:16 59:1,3 132:23 62:13,17 64:8 variety 10:16 77:4 78:11,14 30:1 79:1 80:23 various 26:6 83:5 84:10 100:18 85:3,5,19 varnish 143:24 86:10,12,16 ventilated 86:16 90:8,10 51:13 97:6 98:24 ventilation 105:21131:19 35:23 36:8,8 131:23 132:1 version 87:7 132:4 156:14 versions 52:1 156:17 87:7 uses 28:24 versus 51:13 30:11,13 43:4 very 69:24 68:20 102:19 103:3 using 38:1 106:10 129:14 79:17 91:2 151:18 98:6 140:3 vest 43:11 Usual 6:10 vicinity 19:4 usually 100:12 view 100:9 utiized 82:1 116:17 119:10 utility 1:4 15:13 135:1 144:7 21:16 28:6,14 views 95:12 utilization 102:16 79:24 vinyl 154:7,7,9 utilize 10:24 154:23,24 36:20 41:9 virtually 89:4,8 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60482 John Woodyard 186 visit 145:3,16 146:16,20 147:24148:4 158:20 visits 107:19 144:21 visualize 101:9 voice 111:23 volcanize 52:11 vs 1:7 W W 2:18 waived 6:22 walked 59:8 101:17127:6 149:3 WALKER 3:6 wander 126:18 want 6:5 14:22 34:20 35:5 38:15,22 51:4 58:14 92:7 93:4 94:15 101:1102:10 107:22 112:8 130:13,24 131:8 135:8 135:12,21 150:16 151:14 165:5,6 wanted 103:1 147:13 148:12 wants 97:18 100:4 108:9 warehouses 24:23 wasn't 62:7 73:3 106:1 waste 8:22 148:19 was2 40:2 watch 36:20 water 8:22 12:1 15:15 27:12 117:12 155:23 157:1 way 6:3 44:18 54:3 67:9 99:21100:4 106:10,14 110:22 126:24 132:18,23 133:17 149:22 wear 146:10 weather 6:4 99:1,12,14 101:6,12 week 99:11 100:20 101:3 102:10 weight 47:13 81:6,13 well 8:10 10:22 21:23 22:17 25:2026:22 27:1128:18 29:2032:9 33:6 36:10 38:24 47:14 64:22 69:5 74:3 82:19 88:16 103:3 107:17 112:6 130:21154:6 154:7 157:18 160:15 went 131:23 132:7 140:6 158:20 were 8:16 10:1 11:19 14:4 16:7,17,19,21 17:7,15,23 18:3,9,10,11 18:12,13,20 18:22,24 19:2 19:6,23 20:1 21:2,19,21 22:5,15 23:8 23:10 24:7 25:13 27:4 32:1433:13 36:5,7 38:10 41:2,16 42:7 45:6 48:18 50:4 51:15 53:19 56:7,8 57:1459:24 60:1,16,19,21 63:6,8 68:24 69:10,13 73:4 73:10 74:14 74:22 81:6 94:18 95:22 104:8106:3 107:6 108:14 108:15 109:23 110:15 114:2 114:6,13,18 115:22 117:13 117:19 126:21 132:3,3 145:16,19,21 145:24 146:1 147:19,21 148:6,14,21 152:3,22 153:2154:3 158:1,3 159:2 160:5 163:23 164:21 West 2:16 we'll 26:22 38:6 50:8 100:4 102:19 103:3 126:18 150:3 we're 11:21 35:1 51:16 67:24 70:1,2 88:3 91:2 92:21 95:5 99:3,11,18 102:21107:14 109:1111:8 113:3 119:20 121:10 129:16 135:3 140:4 143:4 154:12 we've 7:10 38:12 64:8 83:13 124:13 while 13:7 white 2:5 3:2 14:4,5 18:9 whole 114:14 114:15 125:7 134:24135:7 136:11 wide 89:17 90:5 width 91:17 williams 2:5 3:2 window 100:17 wish 44:7 witness 5:3 12:15 13:24 14:10 17:21 19:16 24:3,21 30:9,19 32:11 34:2,9 41:6,19 42:3 43:3 45:16,17,22 48:21 51:9,24 53:1,17 57:2 58:7 60:7 61:2 62:1,8 63:12 64:8 66:14,18 67:12,21 68:3 70:8,21 72:17 73:3,14 74:17 76:2,14 77:3 78:4,19 80:5 81:12 83:2 84:6 85:17 86:21 88:8 90:22 91:23 92:3,23 93:1 95:3 103:18 103:24 104:5 104:20 105:6 106:2 109:6 110:5,21 111:24 114:10 115:20,21 117:6 118:9 118:19 119:19 120:6,14 121:24 122:16 126:10 127:23 128:19 130:9 130:18 133:11 135:13,14 136:1 139:1 139:20 140:15 141:10 142:23 146:24 158:15 159:8 166:2,5 168:16,16,17 168:18 WITNESSES 168:1 wondering 41:13 woodyard 2:3 4:2,10,13 7:2 7:9 8:2 13:6 15:2 30:17 34:18 38:5,6 38:12 56:23 57:7 58:23 59:1 61:6 68:9 70:23 93:11 93:18,20 96:4 97:4 103:11 105:10 107:5 122:24 128:8 129:3,21 139:9 144:14 144:15 word 52:16 67:13 98:24 100:12 116:12 worded 150:23 words 48:24 49:8 53:19 98:14 144:9 150:17 158:16 work 7:22 8:21 9:1,5,8,9 10:13 11:2,7 11:20 15:7,22 25:24 26:2 35:9,22 36:1 36:14,18 42:23 44:12 46:4,7 48:8 49:5 50:5,15 51:3,13 52:3 55:14 59:2 62:10 68:17 69:15,21 70:16,23 71:2 71:24 72:3,11 77:5 78:15,16 79:10 89:10 96:15,16,18 97:13 102:7 103:22 104:11 105:1,9,15 107:15 108:4 108:13 110:19 110:23 111:6 111:11,14 113:24 119:15 122:19,21 123:23 124:7 124:7,9 127:16 136:6 136:9 137:5 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80:13,19 153:6,9 154:11 9 95 40:9 81:18 981-9700 3:16 988-9191 1:23 4 4 85:11 40 48:14 400 2:16 48:11 49 39:5 42:14 51:19151:3 151:20 4900 3:15 5 50 163:17 500 48:8,11 6 6 5:14 60 50:19 117:7 122:21155:22 64051 2:16 187 ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMONOQ60484 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 i7 18 19 20 21 22 2^ -> 24 John Woodyard ERRATA SHEET PAGE LINE CHANGE (#' CS 7luj /He 169 //*/ __/<2l 4 23-Z>/ 3S" _J________ '35" //f __ /-____ /z-^ ___ * 'A~ sv\ v "ttpfr-'ltZ" 3* /3 9 i-/CSk72 3 vfe> _i_q?_____ CJ7^2y^; ^ A/ - . 1 sSfci/'/' ^/orJUi 63 7^ ' J*~7 _____ Si C1) !^$ 7 0 0 13 " -/ - // /*> ESQUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES /c* l / /2. TOWOLDMONOQ60485 John Woodyard 170 1 ACKNOWLEDGMENT OF DEPONENT 2 ,___ <SL 3 I/ { do hereby 4 certify that I have read th foregoing pages , 5 __________________ and that the same is a correct 6 transcription of the answers given by me to the 7 questions therein propounded, except for the 8 corrections or changes in form or substance, if 9 10 11 12 DATE: U'/fllOO 13 Subscribed and sworn to before me this 14 __________ day of _ __________________, 1 9 9_ . 15 My commission expires: __________________________ 16 17 18 Notary Public 19 20 21 22 Ar>m m-5j 24 ESOUIRE DEPOSITION SERVICES TOWOLDMON0060486