Document wgzwKLBRrbGK3bERzx83owEqD

CEBTSF1ED COPY SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA FOR THE COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES TRANSWESTERN PIPELINE COMPANY PLAINTIFF, VS MONSANTO COMPANY AND DOES 1 THROUGH 200, INCLUSIVE, DEFENDANTS ) ) CASE NO. ) BC 026 959 ) ) ) DEPOSITION OF: THOMAS M. BISTLINE THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 26, 1991 9:10 A.M. OUR FILE NO. 13728DF REPORTED BY DIANE KENDY C.S.R. NO. 4851 DAVID FELDMAN & ASSOCIATES/USA/LTD. 400 South Beverly Drive, Suite 306 Beverly Hills, CA 90212 213-556-0232 WATER PCB-00038075 1 SUPERIOR COURT OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA 2 FOR THE COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES 3 4 TRANSWESTERN PIPELINE COMPANY, ) . 5 PLAINTIFF, ) CASE NO. 6 VS. ) BC 026 959 7 MONSANTO COMPANY AND DOES ) 8 1 THROUGH 20 0 , INCLUSIVE, ) 9 DEFENDANTS. ) 10 11 12 13 14 DEPOSITION OF: 15 THOMAS M. BISTLINE 16 THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 26, 1991 17 9:10 A.M. 18 19 20 21 22 23 OUR FILE NO. 13728DF 24 REPORTED BY DIANE KENDY 25 C.S.R. NO. 4851 1 WATER PCB-l 1 DEPOSITION OF THOMAS M. BISTLINE, THE WITNESS , 2 TAKEN ON BEHALF OF THE PLAINTIFF, AT 9:10 A . M . , 3 THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 26 , 1991 , AT 725 SOUTH 4 FIGUEROA STREETLOS ANGELES , CALIFORNIA, BEFORE 5 DIANE KENDY, C.S.R. NO. 4851, PURSUANT TO NOTICE 6 AND STIPULATION. 7 8 APPEARANCES OF COUNSEL 9 10 FOR PLAINTIFF: 11 SHEARMAN & STERLING 12 BY: DANA K. WELCH, ESQ. 13 555 CALIFORNIA STREET 14 SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA 94104 15 16 FOR DEFENDANT: 17 BRONSON, BRONSON & MC KINNON 18 BY: CHARLES F. PREUSS, ESQ. 19 505 MONTGOMERY STREET 20 SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA 94111-2514 21 22 ALSO PRESENT: 23 JOSEPH M. GRANT 24 25 WATER PCB-i 1 INDEX 2 WITNESS EXAMINATION PAGE 3 THOMAS M. BISTLINE 4_ BY MS. WELCH 4 5 (P.M. SESSION) 131 6 7 EXHIBITS 8 9 NO . PAGE DESCRIPTION 10 1 5 AMENDED NOTICE OF DEPOSITION 11 2 26 BUSINESS WEEK ARTICLE 12 3 41 NOTICE OF DEPOSITION 13 4 55 RESPONSE OF MONSANTO 14 5 57 VERIFICATION 15 16 QUESTIONS INSTRUCTED BY COUNSEL NOT TO ANSWER 17 PAGE LINE 18 19 19 19 50 10 20 55 16 21 55 24 22 56 3 23 65 8 24 174 19 25 3 WATER PCB-l 1 LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA; 2 THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 26, 1991 , 9:10 A.M. 3 4_ THOMAS M. BISTLINE, 5 HAVING BEEN FIRST DULY SWORN, WAS 6 EXAMINED AND TESTIFIED AS FOLLOWS: 7 8 EXAMINATION 9 BY MS. WELCH: 10 Q. GOOD MORNING, MR. BISTLINE. MY NAME 11 IS DANA WELCH, AND I REPRESENT THE PLAINTIFF IN 12 THIS ACTION, TRANSWESTERN PIPELINE COMPANY. 13 ARE YOU REPRESENTED BY COUNSEL HERE 14 TODAY? 15 A. YES, MA'AM, I AM. 16 Q. AND COULD YOU PLEASE IDENTIFY YOUR 17 COUNSEL. 18 A. MR. PREUSS. 19 MS. WELCH: AND MR. PREUSS, YOU ARE 20 FROM THE BRONSON, BRONSON & MC KINNON FIRM IN 21 SAN FRANCISCO. 22 MR. PREUSS: I AM. 23 MS. WELCH: ALL RIGHT. 24 Q. MR. BISTLINE, COULD YOUPLEASE, FOR 25 THE RECORD, STATE YOUR NAME. 4 WATER PCB-i 1 A. MY NAME IS THOMAS M. BI STLINE. 2 Q. AND YOUR ADDRESS? 3 A. HOME ADDRESS? 4 Q. FIRST, BUSINESS. 5 A. MY BUSINESS ADDRESS IS 800 NORTH 6 LINDBERGH BOULEVARD, ST. LOUIS, MISSOURI. 7 Q. AND YOUR HOME ADDRESS? 8 A. IS 15182 ISLEVIEW, I-S-L-E-V-I-E-W, 9 DRIVE IN CHESTERFIELD, MISSOURI. 10 Q AND YOUR BUSINESS PHONE NUMBER? 11 A IS ( 314 ) 694-2989 . 12 Q HOME PHONE? 13 A (314 ) 532-9264 . 14 Q WHERE DO YOU WORK, MR. BISTLINE? 15 A MONSANTO COMPANY. 16 Q IN ST. LOUIS? 17 A YES . 18 Q AND HOW LONG HAVE YOU WORKED THERE? 19 A APPROXIMATELY NINE AND A HALF YEARS 20 MS. WELCH: I'D LIKE TO HAVE THE 21 COURT REPORTER MARK AS EXHIBIT NO. 1 THIS AMENDED 22 NOTICE OF DEPOSITION AND PRODUCTION OF 23 DOCUMENTS. 24 (THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO WAS 25 MARKED BY THE C.S.R. AS PLAINTIFF'S WATER PCB-00038 1 EXHIBIT 1 FOR IDENTIFICATION AND 2 ATTACHED TO AND MADE A PART OF THIS 3 DEPOSITION.) 4 BY MS. WELCH: 5 Q. MR. BISTLINE, ARE YOU HERE PURSUANT 6 TO THIS NOTICE OF DEPOSITION? 7 A. YES. 8 Q. AND HAVE YOU TAKEN A LOOK AT THIS 9 NOTICE OF DEPOSITION? 10 A. I DON'T KNOW THAT I HAVE LOOKED AT 11 THIS PARTICULAR DOCUMENT, NO. 12 Q. COULD YOU PLEASE TURN TO PAGE 10 OF 13 THE AMENDED NOTICE OF DEPOSITION. 14 A. YES. 15 Q. DID YOU BRING ANY DOCUMENTS WITH YOU 16 HERE TO THIS DEPOSITION? 17 A. NO, I DID NOT. 18 Q. DID YOU REVIEW ANYDOCUMENTS IN 19 PREPARATION FOR THIS DEPOSITION? 20 A. YES, I DID. 21 Q. COULD YOU IDENTIFY THOSE DOCUMENTS. 22 A. I REVIEWED THE INITIALNOTICE FOR 23 PRODUCTION OF DOCUMENTS THAT TRANSWESTERN SERVED 24 ON MONSANTO SOMETIME AGO, MONSANTO'S RESPONSE TO 25 THAT REQUEST, ALSO THE INTERROGATORIES AND 6 WATER PCB-l 1 RESPONSES TO THOSE INTERROGATORIES. 2 I REVIEWED CORRESPONDENCE BETWEEN 3 MR. PREUSS AND COUNSEL FOR TRANSWESTERN IN THIS 4 CASE, AND ALSO MEMORANDUM, MEMORANDA ACTUALLY, 5 PREPARED BY COUNSEL TO ME IN THIS CASE. 6 Q. MEMORANDA PREPARED BY MR. PREUSS TO 7 YOU. 8 A. BY PERSONS IN MR. PREUSS'S OFFICE 9 AND BY OTHER COUNSEL IN THIS CASE, AS WELL. 10 Q. AND COULD YOU IDENTIFY THAT 11 MEMORANDA. 12 A. THERE WERE, IN FACT, TWO MEMORANDA. 13 Q. DESCRIBE THE FIRST ONE. 14 A. WELL, THEY WERE BOTH REALLY ON THE 15 SAME TOPIC, AND THAT WAS GENERALLY THE RESPONSE 16 OF MONSANTO TO DISCOVERY REQUESTS IN THIS MATTER, 17 HOW THOSE RESPONSES WERE FORMULATED. 18 . AND I GUESS THAT BASICALLY DISCOVERS 19 IT -- OR COVERS IT, EXCUSE ME. 20 Q. DO YOU HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS HERE 21 WITH YOU TODAY? 22 A. NO, I DON'T. 23 Q. WILL YOU BE PRODUCING THOSE 24 DOCUMENTS TO US? 25 A. NO, I WILL NOT. 7 WATER PCB-l 1 Q WHY NOT? 2 A. THEY ARE ATTORNEY PRODUCT AND 3 ATTORNEY-CLIENT COMMUNICATIONS. 4_ BY ."THOSE DOCUMENTS" I ASSUME YOU 5 MEAN THE MEMORANDA THAT I WAS REFERRING TO. 6 Q. I DO. I BELIEVE WE HAVE THE REST OF 7 THE DOCUMENTS. 8 A. RIGHT. 9 Q. I WOULD LIKE TO TALK A LITTLE BIT 10 ABOUT YOUR POSITION AT MONSANTO. 11 ARE YOU THE PERSON AT MONSANTO WHO 12 IS THE MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT WHERE MONSANTO 13 KEEPS AND RETAINS ITS DOCUMENTS PERTAINING TO 14 PCB'S? 15 A. YES, I AM. 16 Q. IS THERE ANYONE ELSE WHO WOULD BE 17 THAT KNOWLEDGEABLE? 18 A. SEVERAL OTHER PEOPLE, YES. 19 Q. COULD YOU IDENTIFY THOSE PEOPLE. 20 A. MEMBERS OF MY STAFF AT MONSANTO, THE 21 OTHER ATTORNEY AT MONSANTO WHO, WITH ME, IS 22 RESPONSIBLE FOR PCB CASES, AND VARIOUS OUTSIDE 23 PEOPLE WHO REPRESENT MONSANTO CASES. 24 Q. STARTING WITH MEMBERS OF YOURSTAFF, 25 WOULD YOU IDENTIFY THEM BY NAME. 8 WATER PCB-l 1 A. ALL OP THEM? 2 Q. (NODS HEAD.) 3 A. THERE ARE QUITE A FEW. I WILL 4 IDENTIFY AS MANY AS I CAN RECALL AT THIS TIME. 5 Q. PLEASE. 6 A. THERE ARE TWO LEGAL ASSISTANTS WHO 7 WORK FOR ME, MRS. JOSEPHINE NIBLOCK, 8 N-i-b-L-O-C-K, AND MRS. ANN CLARK. 9 THERE ARE A NUMBER OF CLERICAL 10 PEOPLE, ALL OF WHOSE NAMES I CAN'T RECALL AT THIS 11 TIME, MEMBERS OF MY STAFF. JOHN LEE. 12 MR. GRANT: I'M SORRY? 13 THE WITNESS: JOHN LEE. 14 THERE ARE FOUR OR FIVE CLERICAL 15 PEOPLE, ALL OF WHOSE NAMES I CAN'T RECALL. 16 BY MS. WELCH: 17 Q. THE NEXT CATEGORY YOU MENTIONED WERE 18 ATTORNEYS WHO WORKED ON PCB MATTERS AT MONSANTO. 19 A. WITH ME, YES. 20 Q. WOULD YOU IDENTIFY THEM. 21 A. MICHAEL NEWPORT. 22 Q. ANYONE ELSE? 23 A. MR. NEWPORT IS THE ONLY OTHER LAWYER 24 ON MONSANTO'S LEGAL STAFF. 25 OTHER LAWYERS ON MONSANTO'S LEGAL 9 WATER PCB-00038 1 STAFF MIGHT HAVE INCIDENTAL KNOWLEDGE ABOUT HOW 2 DOCUMENTS ARE KEPT, BUT IT WOULD NOT BE 3 NECESSARILY WITHIN THEIR SCOPE OF DUTY TO HAVE 4 HLHAT KNOWLEDGE . 5 Q. WHICH OUTSIDE LAW FIRMS WORK ON PCB 6 MATTERS, BESIDES BRONSON, BRONSON? 7 A. A GREAT MANY. WE HAVE LAW FIRMS 8 RETAINED IN MANY STATES WHO WORK ON PCB MATTERS 9 FOR ME. I DON'T - 10 MR. PREUSS: YOU DON'T EXPECT HIM TO 11 LIST EVERY LAW FIRM. 12 MS. WELCH: WELL, PERHAPS WE CAN 13 LIMIT IT IN TERMS OF LITIGATION THAT MONSANTO IS 14 INVOLVED IN. 15 MR. PREUSS: WE WILL PROCEED ON A 16 QUESTION-BY-QUESTION BASIS. 17 BY MS. WELCH: 18 Q. HAVE YOU EVER HAD YOUR DEPOSITION 19 TAKEN BEFORE AS A CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS? 20 A. YES, MA'AM. 21 Q. AND COULD YOU IDENTIFY THE 22 PROCEEDINGS IN WHICH YOU HAVE HAD YOUR DEPOSITION 23 TAKEN AS A CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS. - 24 A. THERE HAVE BEEN APPROXIMATELY FIVE 25 OR SIX. 10 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. PLEASE IDENTIFY EACH ONE. 2 A. I DON'T KNOW THAT I CAN RECALL ALL 3 OP THEM. 4_ A CASE STYLED ANLAND VERSUS ALCOA, 5 WHICH IS PENDING IN FEDERAL COURT IN NEW JERSEY. 6 MR. GRANT: WOULD YOU SPELL THAT. 7 THE WITNESS % A-N-L-A-N-D. 8 BY MS. WELCH: 9 Q. AND WHEN WAS THAT DEPOSITION TAKEN? 10 A. I BELIEVE IN '87, BEST OF MY 11 RECOLLECTION. 12 I HAD MY DEPOSITION TAKEN IN THE 13 SUPERFUND LITIGATION INVOLVING THE NEW BEDFORD 14 HARBOR. 15 I HAD MY DEPOSITION TAKEN -- 16 Q. EXCUSE ME. WHAT WAS THE NAME OF THE 17 LITIGATION? 18 A. I DON'T RECALL THE CAPTION OF THE 19 LITIGATION. MONSANTO WAS NOT A PARTY TO THAT 20 CASE, AND I DON'T, AS I SIT HERE, RECALL. 21 Q. WAS MONSANTO A PARTY TO THE ANLAND 22 VERSUS ALCOA LITIGATION? 23 A. AT THE TIME MY DEPOSITION WAS TAKEN, 24 NO. WE HAVE SINCE BEEN MADE A THIRD PARTY 25 DEFENDANT IN THIS CASE. 11 WATER PCB-i 1 Q. WHEN WAS THE SUPERFUND LITIGATION 2 DEPOSITION TAKEN, APPROXIMATELY? 3 A. 1986 , TO THE BEST OF MY 4 RECOLLECTION. 5 Q. ALL RIGHT. 6 A. AGAIN, I HAD MY DEPOSITION TAKEN IN 7 1989 , IN RE PAOLI, PCB LITIGATION. 8 Q. WOULD YOU SPELL THAT, PLEASE. 9 A o P-A-O-L-I. 10 I BELIEVE THAT WAS 1989. 11 Q. AND WAS MONSANTO A PARTY TO THAT 12 CASE? 13 MONSANTO WAS A PARTY TO THAT CASE, 14 YES . 15 Q. AND WHAT IS THE VENUE? 16 A. VENUE IS BOTH FEDERAL COURT AND 17 STATE COURT IN PHILADELPHIA, PENNSYLVANIA. 18 AND THIS PAST SUMMER I HAD MY 19 DEPOSITION TAKEN IN A PROCEEDING VENUED IN 20 PITTSBURGH, CAPTION OF WHICH I CAN'T RECALL AT 21 THE MOMENT. BUT WE WERE NOT A PARTY TO THAT 22 CASE. I JUST DON'T RECALL THE STYLE OF THAT CASE 23 AT THIS MOMENT. 24 Q. AND THAT WAS THIS PAST SUMMER? 25 A. THAT WAS THIS PAST SUMMER, 1991 . 12 WATER PCB-i 1 THERE MAY HAVE BEEN OTHER CASES IN 2 WHICH MY DEPOSITION WAS TAKEN AS CUSTODIAN OP 3 RECORDS. THOSE ARE THE ONES I RECALL AS I SIT 4 HERE. . 5 Q. ALL RIGHT. I AM GOING TO BRIEFLY 6 RUN OVER THE RULES FOR YOU, ALTHOUGH YOU ARE 7 PROBABLY FAMILIAR WITH THEM, JUST TO REFRESH YOUR 8 RECOLLECTION. 9 I AM SURE YOU ARE AWARE THAT EVEN 10 THOUGH THIS IS AN INFORMAL SETTING, YOU ARE UNDER 11 OATH AND YOU ARE OBLIGATED TO TELL THE TRUTH, 12 JUST AS IF YOU WERE TESTIFYING IN COURT. 13 A. YES, MA'AM. 14 Q. I WILL ATTEMPT TO BE AS CLEAR AND 15 CONCISE AS I CAN WITH MY QUESTIONING. BUT IF YOU 16 DO NOT UNDERSTAND ANY QUESTION, PLEASE TELL ME, 17 AND I WILL ATTEMPT TO REPHRASE IT. 18 . THE COURT REPORTER CAN ONLY TAKE 19 DOWN ONE PERSON SPEAKING AT A TIME - 20 A. AS WE HAVE ALREADY FOUND OUT. 21 Q. -- AND WE WILL TRY TO HELP HER TO 22 THE EXTENT THAT WE CAN. 23 AND OF COURSE YOU WILL HAVE THE 24 OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW YOUR TRANSCRIPT WHEN IT HAS 25 BEEN TRANSCRIBED. IF YOU NEED TO MAKE ANY 13 WATER PCB-l 1 CHANGES, YOU MAY DO SO BUT PLEASE REMEMBER THAT 2 YOU MAY BE ASKED ABOUT TiiOSE CHANGES AT THE TIME 3 OP TRIAL. 4_ A, I UNDERSTAND. 5 Q. ALL RIGHT. I'D LIKE TO ASK YOU A 6 LITTLE BIT ABOUT YOUR BACKGROUND. 7 WHAT IS YOUR EXACT POSITION AT 8 MONSANTO? 9 A. MY EXACT POSITION AT MONSANTO IS 10 ASSISTANT GENERAL COUNSEL LITIGATION. 11 Q. SO YOU ARE AN ATTORNEY. 12 A. YES, MA'AM. 13 Q. HOW LONG HAVE YOU HAD THIS POSITION 14 AT MONSANTO? 15 A. THE PRECISE TITLE I HAVE HAD FOR 16 ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF. 17 Q. AND WHAT WAS YOUR POSITION BEFORE 18 THAT? 19 A. PRIOR TO THAT MY TITLE WAS 20 LITIGATION COUNSEL. 21 Q. AND HOW LONG DID YOU HAVE THAT 22 POSITION? 23 A. ABOUT FOUR YEARS. 24 Q. AND PRIOR TO THAT? 25 A. I WAS ASSISTANT LITIGATION COUNSEL. 14 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. AND DID THAT ACCOUNT FOR THE 2 REMAINDER OF YOUR TIME AT MONSANTO? 3 A. NO. FOR THE FIRST YEARS OF MY 4 EMPLOYMENT AT MONSANTO MY TITLE WAS LITIGATION 5 ATTORNEY. 6 Q. WHO DO YOU REPORT TO? 7 A. THE ASSOCIATE GENERAL COUNSEL FOR 8 LITIGATION, MR. ROBERT BERENDT, B-E-R-E-N-D-T. 9 Q. WHAT ARE YOUR DUTIES AS ASSISTANT 10 GENERAL COUNSEL? 11 A. BROADLY, TO MANAGE LITIGATED MATTERS 12 IN WHICH MONSANTO COMPANY IS INVOLVED. 13 Q. WHO WAS YOUR PREDECESSOR IN THIS 14 POSITION? 15 A. MR. BERENDT HAD THE TITLE SEVERAL 16 YEARS AGO. 17 BUT AS FAR AS THE PREDECESSOR GOES, 18 I AM STRUGGLING, BECAUSE I'VE BEEN DOING WHAT I 19 DO ON THE CASES THAT I AM RESPONSIBLE FOR, FOR 20 THE MOST PART, SINCE THE CASES WERE FILED AGAINST 21 MONSANTO VERY EARLY ON. 22 AND IN THAT SENSE, I GUESS I HAD NO 23 PREDECESSORS. 24 Q. ARE YOU THE PERSON WHO IS MOST 25 KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT CLAIMS AGAINST MONSANTO 15 WATER PCB-i 1 ARISING OUT OF PCB'S? 2 A. AT THIS POINT, YES. 3 Q. WHEN YOU SAY "AT THIS POINT," WHO 4 WOULD HAVE BEEN MOST KNOWLEDGEABLE PRIOR TO YOUR 5 TENURE? 6 A. I SUPPOSE THE PERSON WHO WAS 7 RESPONSIBLE FOR PCB LITIGATION. THAT WOULD HAVE 8 BEEN MR. JOSEPH NASSIF. 9 Q. PLEASE SPELL HIS NAME. 10 A. N-A-S-S-I-F. 11 Q. FOR WHAT TIME PERIOD WAS HE 12 RESPONSIBLE FOR PCB LITIGATION? 13 A. APPROXIMATELY 1982 TO 1985. 14 Q. DO YOU KNOW WHO WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR 15 PCB LITIGATION BEFORE HIM? 16 A. IF I CAN REMEMBER THE FELLOW'S 17 NAME. I CAN'T RECALL HIS NAME RIGHT NOW. IT 18 WILL COME TO ME, BUT I DON'T RECALL AT THE 19 MOMENT. 20 Q. PERHAPS WE WILL ASK AGAIN A LITTLE 21 BIT LATER. 22 WHAT ARE YOUR RESPONSIBILITIES WITH 23 RESPECT TO PCB LITIGATION? 24 A. THEY ARE AS I DESCRIBED. BROADLY, 25 TO MANAGE THE DEFENSE OF MONSANTO IN THOSE CASES. 16 WATER PCB-i 1 Q. ARE YOU RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY OTHER 2 LITIGATION AT MONSANTO? 3 A. OH, YES. 4 _ Q. COULD YOU BRIEFLY DESCRIBE THE OTHER 5 LITIGATION. 6 A. WELL, I AM RESPONSIBLE FOR CASES 7 INVOLVING PRODUCTS OF MONSANTO OTHER THAN PCB'S, 8 AND I AM RESPONSIBLE FOR CERTAIN LITIGATION 9 ARISING OUT OF CLAIMS OF INJURY FROM EXPOSURE TO 10 SUBSTANCES PRESENT AT HAZARDOUS WASTE SITES . 11 Q. APPROXIMATELY WHAT PERCENTAGE OF 12 YOUR TIME DOES PCB LITIGATION CONSUME? 13 A. OH, 50 TO 60 PERCENT. 14 Q. IS THERE ANY NATIONAL COORDINATING 15 CENTER OR CLEARING HOUSE FOR CLAIMS ARISING OUT 16 OF THE USE OF PCB? 17 MR. PREUSS: OBJECTION AS AMBIGUOUS. 18 BY MS. WELCH: 19 Q. YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION, IF YOU 20 UNDERSTAND IT. 21 MR. PREUSS: YOU MEAN IN GENERAL OR 22 AT MONSANTO? 23 MS. WELCH: I WILL RESTATE THE 24 QUESTION. 25 Q. IS THERE ANY NATIONAL COORDINATING 17 WATER PCB-l 1 CENTER OR CLEARING HOUSE FOR CLAIMS ARISING OUT 2 OF THE USE OF PCB? 3 A. ARE YOU RESTRICTING THIS TO MONSANTO 4 OR DO YOU JUST MEAN -5 Q. LET'S START GENERALLY. IS THERE A 6 NATIONAL COORDINATING CENTER FOR CLAIMS ARISING 7 OUT OF THE USE OF PCB? 8 A. I AM NOT AWARE OF THAT . 9 Q. HOW ABOUT FOR MONSANTO? 10 A. I AM THE NATIONAL COORDINATING 11 CENTER FOR CLAIMS ARISING OUT OF THE USE OF PCB 12 INVOLVING MONSANTO. 13 Q. AND SO ALL CLAIMS ARISING OUT OF PCB 14 LITIGATION COME TO YOU. 15 A. IF THEY INVOLVE MONSANTO, YES. 16 Q. SINCE 1972 HAS MONSANTO EVER BEEN A 17 PARTY TO ANY OTHER LAWSUITS ARISING OUT OF THE 18 USE OF PCB? 19 A. OH, YES. 20 Q. COULD YOU PLEASE, ONE BY ONE, TO THE 21 EXTENT THAT YOU RECALL, DESCRIBE THOSE LAWSUITS. 22 MR. PREUSS: WELL, I AM GOING TO 23 OBJECT. 24 FIRST, IT'S FAR AFIELD FROM HIS 25 RESPONSIBILITY TODAY AS CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS, AS 18 WATER PCB-l 1 TO ALL CASES 2 FURTHERMORE, THERE ARE NUMEROUS 3 CASES OVER THE YEARS HE HAS SPENT AT MONSANTO. 4 YOU WANT HIM TO RUN OVER HIS RECOLLECTION OF ALL 5 THE CASES THAT HE MAY HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN? 6 MS. WELCH: WELL, LET'S START WITH 7 AS MANY AS HE CAN REMEMBER. 8 MR. PREUSS: WELL, WHAT'S THE 9 REVELANCE OF ALL LITIGATION AT A CUSTODIAN OF 10 RECORDS DEPOSITION? 11 MS. WELCH: THE RELEVANCY IS THAT 12 THERE MAY BE DOCUMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN PRODUCED IN 13 THOSE LAWSUITS THAT WE MAY BE ENTITLED TO FIND. 14 MR. PREUSS: WHY DON'T YOU ASK THOSE 15 QUESTIONS. 16 MS. WELCH: I AM GOING TO START BY 17 FINDING OUT WHAT LITIGATION HE KNOWS ABOUT, AND 18 THEN ANY DOCUMENTS THAT MAY BE RELEVANT. 19 Q. SO PLEASE ANSWER THE QUESTION. 20 STARTING WITH THE PRESENT, WHAT LAWSUITS IS 21 MONSANTO CURRENTLY INVOLVED IN THAT ARISE OUT OF 22 THE USE OF PCB ? 23 A. IT WOULD BE LITERALLY IMPOSSIBLE FOR 24 ME TO SIT HERE AND ENUMERATE ALL OF THOSE CASES . 25 Q. WELL, LET'S START WITH WHAT YOU 19 WATER PCB-i 1 RECALL IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE A COMPLETE LIST, 2 BUT LET'S START WITH WHAT YOU RECALL. 3 MR . PREUSS: WELL, I AM GOING TO 4 INSTRUCT HIM NOT TO ANSWER. 5 IF YOU WANT TO ASK HIM ABOUT 6 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE PRODUCED IN OTHER LITIGATION, 7 THAT MAY BE RELEVANT. 8 BUT I WILL NOT PERMIT YOU TO ASK HIM 9 WILLY-NILLY TO GIVE YOU A LIST OF ALL THE 10 LAWSUITS OF MONSANTO. 11 MS. WELCH: ON WHAT BASIS ARE YOU 12 INSTRUCTING HIM NOT TO ANSWER THE QUESTION? 13 MR. PREUSS: ON THE BASIS IT'S NOT 14 RELEVANT. 15 MS. WELCH: WELL, THAT'S NOT A 16 PROPER OBJECTION IN CALIFORNIA. THE ONLY PROPER 17 OBJECTION IN CALIFORNIA IS ATTORNEY-CLIENT 18 PRIVILEGE. 19 MR. PREUSS: WELL, I HAVE GIVEN THE 20 INSTRUCTION. 21 MS. WELCH: LET'S MARK THAT FOR THE 22 RECORD, PLEASE. 23 Q. CAN YOU TELL ME IN WHAT OTHER 24 LITIGATION MONSANTO HAS PRODUCED DOCUMENTS ABOUT 25 PCB . 20 WATER PCB-l 1 A. I COULD NOT FROM MEMORY ENUMERATE 2 ALL THE CASES IN WHICH WE HAVE, NO, MA'AM. THAT 3 WOULD HAVE BEEN QUITE A FEW. 4_ Q. COULD YOU GIVE ME ONE THAT YOU 5 RECALL, FOR EXAMPLE, THE CASES WHEN I ASKED YOU 6 ABOUT YOUR TESTIMONY AS CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS. 7 A. YES, MA'AM. 8 Q. ANLAND VERSUS ALCOA -- 9 A. YES, MA'AM. 10 Q. -- DID YOU PRODUCE ANY MONSANTO 11 DOCUMENTS? 12 A. YES, MA'AM. 13 Q. AND WHAT PCB RELATED PRODUCT DID 14 THAT INVOLVE? 15 A. TO MY RECOLLECTION, THERE WERE TWO 16 PRODUCTS INVOLVED, TWO HYDRAULIC FLUIDS THAT 17 MONSANTO SOLD TO THE ALCOA COMPANY, PYDRAUL F-9, 18 P-Y-D-R-A-U-L, AND PYDRAUL 312. 19 Q. AND WHERE ARE THOSE DOCUMENTS 20 STORED? 21 A. WHICH DOCUMENTS? 22 Q. THE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE PRODUCED 23 PURSUANT TO ANY REQUESTS THAT WERE ISSUED IN THIS 24 LITIGATION 25 A . WELL, RIGHT NOW THAT'S WITH OUTSIDE 21 WATER PCB-l 1 COUNSEL. 2 Q. WHO ARE THE OUTSIDE COUNSEL IN THAT 3 CASE? 4_ A. THE LAW FIRM OF PITNEY, PARTON, KITT 5 & ZUCH, IN MORRISTOWN, NEW JERSEY. 6 Q. DOES MONSANTO HAVE A SET OF THOSE 7 DOCUMENTS IN ST. LOUIS OR ANYWHERE ELSE? 8 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT 9 WITHOUT ASKING MY STAFF WHETHER WE HAVE A SET OF 10 THOSE DOCUMENTS SEGREGATED IN A SPECIFIC PLACE IN 11 ST. LOUIS. 12 Q. WHO ON YOUR STAFF WOULD KNOW THAT? 13 A. PROBABLY MISS NIBLOCK. 14 I ' D BETTER SAY "MRS. " IF I SAY 15 "MISS" ON THE TRANSCRIPT, SHE OBJECTS TO THAT. 16 Q. I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT. 17 IS THAT A LAWSUIT THAT IS CURRENTLY 18 PENDING? 19 A . YES, MA'AM. 20 Q. NEXT WAS THE SUPERFUND LITIGATION, 21 TO WHICH YOU WERE NOT A PARTY. WAS THERE A 22 PRODUCTION? 23 A. THE BEDFORD HARBOR CASE? 24 Q. YES . 25 A . THOSE DOCUMENTS, I BELIEVE, ARE WITH 22 WATER PCB-00038 1 COUNSEL IN MASSACHUSETTS, THAT ARE INVOLVED IN 2 ANOTHER CASE FOR MONSANTO. 3 Q. AND WHAT IS THE OTHER CASE FOR 4 MONSANTO THAT YOU ARE INVOLVED WITH? 5 A. THE STYLE OF THE CASE IS HURLEY, 6 H-U-R-L-E-Y, VERSUS MONSANTO, I BELIEVE. 7 Q. ALL RIGHT. AND WHAT PRODUCT DOES 8 THE SUPERFUND LITIGATION INVOLVE? 9 A. THAT INVOLVED PRIMARILY A PRODUCT 10 CALLED AROCLOR, A-R-O-C-L-O-R, 1242, WHICH WAS 11 USED AS A DIELECTRIC FLUID IN THE MANUFACTURE OF 12 ELECTRICAL EQUIPMENT. 13 Q. IS THAT THE SAME PRODUCT THAT'S 14 INVOLVED IN HURLEY VERSUS MONSANTO? 15 A. AROCLOR 1242 IS INVOLVED IN THE 16 HURLEY CASE. THERE MAY BE OTHER PCB PRODUCTS 17 INVOLVED THERE, AS WELL, POSSIBLY. I'D HAVE TO 18 REVIEW THE FILE TO DETERMINE THAT. 19 Q. WHAT'S THE NAME OF THE LAW FIRM? 20 A. HALE & DOR IN MASSACHUSETTS. 21 Q. AND DOES MONSANTO RETAIN A SET OF 22 THOSE DOCUMENTS, AS WELL? 23 A. I DON'T KNOW. AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW 24 WHETHER WE HAVE A SET OF THOSE DOCUMENTS 25 SEGREGATED IN A SPECIFIC LOCATION. 23 WATER PCB-l 1Q 2 PERSON? AND YOU WOULD HAVE TO ASK THE SAME 3 A. SHE WOULD BE THE ONE I 'D ASK TO FIND 4 OUT. I DON'T KNOW WHETHER SHE KNOWS FROM MEMORY. 5 Q. HOW ABOUT IN RE PAOLI IN 6 PHILADELPHIA, DID YOU PRODUCE SOME DOCUMENTS IN 7 THAT LITIGATION? 8 A. YES, MA'AM. 9 Q. WHO HAS THOSE DOCUMENTS? 10 A. THOSE DOCUMENTS, I BELIEVE, WE HAVE 11 A SET OF IN ST. LOUIS. 12 Q. WHAT PRODUCT DID THAT INVOLVE? 13 A. PCB'S USED AS DIELECTRIC FLUIDS, 14 PROBABLY AROCLORS 1222 , 1254 , AND 1260 . 15 Q. HOW ABOUT THE ONE IN PITTSBURGH 16 WHICH YOU TESTIFIED IN THIS SUMMER? 17 A. THAT WAS A HYDRAULIC FLUID CASE. 18 THE PRODUCT INVOLVED THERE, I THINK, WAS PYDRAUL 19 312 . 20 Q. TO THE BEST OF YOUR RECOLLECTION, 21 WHAT WAS THE QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS THAT WAS 22 PRODUCED IN THE ANLAND LITIGATION? 23 A. AT THE TIME OF MY DEPOSITION IN 1986 24 IT WAS NOT A VERY SIGNIFICANT QUANTITY, BECAUSE 25 THE DISCOVERY REQUESTS WERE FAIRLY LIMITED. I 24 WATER PCB-l 1 WOULD SAY PERHAPS 2000 PAGES 2 Q. TO THE BEST OF YOUR RECOLLECTION, 3 WHAT WAS THE QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS THAT WAS 4 PRODUCED IN THE SUPERFUND LITIGATION? . 5 A. THE SUPERFUND LITIGATION, I DON ' T 6 RECALL HOW MANY DOCUMENTS WERE PRODUCED. 7 Q. THE IN RE PAOLI LITIGATION? 8 A. LARGE NUMBERS OF DOCUMENTS WERE 9 PRODUCED IN THAT CASE. 10 Q. APPROXIMATELY. 11 A. POSSIBLY AS MANY AS 150,000 PAGES. 12 Q. THE PITTSBURGH LITIGATION? 13 A. THAT WAS A VERY SMALL NUMBER OF 14 DOCUMENTS AS I RECALL, FEWER THAN 200 PAGES. 15 Q. DO WE HAVE ANY OF THESE DOCUMENTS 16 THAT WERE PRODUCED IN THESE O.HER LITIGATIONS? 17 A. OFFHAND, I DON'T KNOW. 18 Q. DID YOU SEARCH THE FILES OF 19 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE PRODUCED IN THESE OTHER 20 LITIGATIONS WHEN YOU RECEIVED OUR DOCUMENT 21 REQUEST? 22 A. I DID NOT GO TO FILES SPECIFICALLY 23 SET ASIDE THAT CONTAIN DOCUMENTS PRODUCED IN 24 THESE OTHER CASES, TO LOOK FOR DOCUMENTS TO 25 RESPOND TO YOUR DEMAND, NO, MA'AM, I DID NOT. 25 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. ALL RIGHT. WILL YOU PLEASE PRODUCE 2 THOSE DOCUMENTS TO US. 3 A. NO, MA'AM. 4_ Q. ON WHAT BASIS ARE YOU WITHHOLDING 5 THOSE DOCUMENTS? 6 A. I'LL DEFER TO COUNSEL ON THAT ONE. 7 IF YOU WANT ME TO STATE MY OPINION, 8 TWO THINGS. 9 FIRST OF ALL, THE DOCUMENTS PRODUCED 10 IN THOSE CASES ARE NOT NECESSARILY RELEVANT HERE, 11 NUMBER ONE. 12 NUMBER TWO, THEY WEREN'T ASKED FOR 13 HERE. I HAD NO REASON TO SEARCH FOR THOSE 14 DOCUMENT COLLECTIONS TO DETERMINE WHAT DOCUMENTS 15 WERE APPROPRIATE TO BE PRODUCED HERE. 16 DO YOU WANT TO SAY ANYTHING ELSE? 17 MR. PREUSS: I THINK YOU SAID IT. 18 MS . WELCH: I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE 19 THIS EXHIBIT MARKED AS EXHIBIT NO. 2. 20 (THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO WAS 21 MARKED BY THE C.S.R. AS PLAINTIFF'S 22 EXHIBIT 2 FOR IDENTIFICATION AND 23 ATTACHED TO AND MADE A PART OF THIS 24 DEPOSITION.) 25 BY MS. WELCH: 26 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. HAVE YOU SEEN THIS ARTICLE BEFORE? 2 A. YES, I HAVE. 3 Q. IN WHAT CONTEXT DID YOU SEE THAT 4 ARTICLE? 5 A. IT WAS SENT TO ME AFTER IT APPEARED 6 IN "BUSINESS WEEK." 7 Q. HAVE YOU READ THE ARTICLE BEFORE? 8 A. YES, MA'AM. 9 Q. DO YOU NEED A FEW MINUTES TO REVIEW 10 THE ARTICLE, OR ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH IT? 11 A. IF YOU HAVE SPECIFIC QUESTIONS. 12 Q. I DO HAVE SPECIFIC QUESTIONS. 13 A. IF YOU'LL GIVE ME A MOMENT TO READ 14 IT THEN, I WOULD APPRECIATE IT. I'D LIKE A FEW 15 MOMENTS TO SCAN THE ARTICLE. 16 MR. PREUSS: I WILL TELL YOU, 17 THOUGH, IF YOU ARE GOING TO GET THIS FAR AFIELD 18 WITH QUESTIONS THAT DON'T RELATE TO PRODUCTION IN 19 HIS ROLE AS CUSTODIAN, I AM GOING TO INSTRUCT HIM 20 NOT TO ANSWER. 21 MS. WELCH: WE ARE NOT. WE ARE 22 GOING TO STAY WITH THE CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS 23 DEPOSITION. 24 MR. PREUSS: WELL, WE WILL SEE. 25 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD.) 27 WATER PCB-l 1 BY MS. WELCH 2 Q. I AM REALLY GOING TO ASK TWO 3 QUESTIONS ABOUT IT AS THEY PERTAIN TO DOCUMENTS . 4_ A. FINE . 5 Q. TURN YOUR ATTENTION TO THE SECOND 6 PAGE. IT S NOT A FULL PARAGRAPH, BUT THE END OF 7 THE FIRST PARAGRAPH ON THE SECOND PAGE. 8 A. YES . 9 Q. THE QUOTE IS: 10 "SAYS MONSANTO ATTORNEY 11 BISTLINE: 'WE HAVE DISCLOSED WHAT 12 WE KNEW WHEN KNEW IT.'" 13 DID YOU MAKE THAT STATEMENT TO THE 14 PERSON WHO INTERVIEWED YOU FOR THIS ARTICLE? 15 A. YES, MA'AM, I DID. 16 Q. COULD YOU TELL ME WHETHER THOSE 17 DISCLOSURES INCLUDED ANY DOCUMENTS. 18 A. THAT STATEMENT WAS A GENERAL 19 STATEMENT RESPONDING TO THE QUESTION, OR TO THE 20 ALLEGATION, THAT MONSANTO HAD CONCEALED KNOWLEDGE 21 IT HAD RELATING TO THE HEALTH OR ENVIRONMENTAL 22 EFFECTS OF PCB'S. 23 MY RESPONSE WAS THAT MONSANTO HAD - 24 DISCLOSED ITS KNOWLEDGE OF THOSE HEALTH AND 25 ENVIRONMENTAL EFFECTS, ASSUMING THAT WE HAD THAT 28 WATER PCB-l 1 KNOWLEDGE 2 THAT DISCLOSURE MAY IN SOME 3 CIRCUMSTANCES HAVE INVOLVED DOCUMENTS, BUT IT DID 4 NOT INVOLVE IT IN ALL INSTANCES. 5 Q. WERE YOU REFERRING TO ANY OTHER 6 DOCUMENTS IN WHICH THOSE DISCLOSURES WERE MADE? 7 A. NO PARTICULAR DOCUMENTS, MA'AM. 8 BUT THE CONTROVERSY RELATING TO PCB 9 AND ITS ENVIRONMENTAL AND HEALTH EFFECTS HAS BEEN 10 ONE THAT HAS BEEN CERTAINLY IN THE PUBLIC 11 ATTENTION SINCE THE EARLY 1970'S. 12 Q. AS YOU SIT HERE, DO YOU RECALL ANY 13 DOCUMENTS IN WHICH THESE DISCLOSURES WERE MADE? 14 A. I THINK A GREAT MANY OF THE KIND OF 15 DOCUMENTS, FOR EXAMPLE, LABELS WHICH WERE PLACED 16 ON MONSANTO PRODUCTS, TECHNICAL BULLETINS WHICH 17 ACCOMPANIED MONSANTO'S PRODUCTS, COOPERATION THAT 18 SCIENTISTS AND OTHERS AT MONSANTO HAD GIVEN 19 RESEARCHERS AND THE GOVERNMENT, CERTAIN REPORTS 20 THAT -- TOXICOLOGY REPORTS THAT WERE DONE AT 21 MONSANTO'S REQUEST, CORRESPONDENCE WITH CUSTOMERS 22 FROM TIME TO TIME. 23 Q. WHERE ARE THOSE DOCUMENTS LOCATED? 24 A. MOST OF THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE IN 25 ST. LOUIS, IN MY CUSTODY. 29 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. DO YOU HAVE A STORAGE FACILITY AT 2 ST. LOUIS WHERE THESE DOCUMENTS ARE KEPT? 3 A r YES. 4_ Q. AND IT'S IN YOUR BUILDING? 5 A. IT'S NOT IN MY BUILDING, BUT IT'S IN 6 THE SAME LOCATION. 7 Q. ARE THERE INDEXES THAT EXIST ABOUT 8 THESE DOCUMENTS? 9 A. NOT INDEXES AS SUCH, NO. 10 Q. WHAT CATALOGUES EXIST THAT HELP YOU 11 HAVE ACCESS TO THESE DOCUMENTS? 12 A. WELL, IT'S NOT A WRITTEN CATALOGUE, 13 MA'AM. WE HAVE A COMPUTERIZED LITIGATION SUPPORT 14 SYSTEM, WHICH PERMITS US ACCESS TO THOSE 15 DOCUMENTS. 16 Q. HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS EVER BEEN 17 PRODUCED IN LITIGATION? 18 A. SOME OF THOSE DOCUMENTS, AS 19 APPROPRIATE. 20 Q. HAVE THEY BEEN PRODUCED TO US? 21 A. SOME OF THOSE DOCUMENTS, YES. 22 Q. WHICH ONES OF THOSE DOCUMENTS HAVE 23 BEEN PRODUCED? 24 MR. PREUSS: YOU HAVE THEM. 25 BY MS. WELCH: 30 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU WITHHOLD 2 CERTAIN OF THOSE DOCUMENTS? 3 A. IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO REFER TO A 4 SPECIFIC QUESTION. . 5 Q. I WANT TO KNOW, GENERALLY, ON WHAT 6 BASIS DID YOU DECIDE TO WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS. 7 A. I WILL ANSWER THE QUESTION IN THIS 8 WAY, MA'AM. THE RESPONSE WE MADE TO THE 9 DISCOVERY REQUESTS POSED BY THE PLAINTIFF IN THIS 10 CASE WERE APPROPRIATE, AND WE WILL STAND BY THEM. 11 MR. PREUSS: WE ARE FURTHER 12 ASSERTING THAT DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD BASED UPON 13 THE GENERAL JACKSON LIMITATION PLACED ON THE 14 RESPONSES THEMSELVES. 15 BY MS. WELCH: 16 Q. APPROXIMATELY HOW MANY PAGES OF 17 DOCUMENTS ARE THERE IN THE DOCUMENTS THAT WE HAVE 18 BEEN REFERRING TO? 19 MR. PREUSS: COULD YOU CLARIFY WHICH 20 DOCUMENTS, THOSE THAT WERE PRODUCED HERE OR THOSE 21 THAT ARE SOME OTHER PLACE? 22 BY MS. WELCH: 23 Q. I AM QUESTIONING YOU IN TERMS OF THE 24 DOCUMENTS YOU ARE REFERRING TO IN OUR DISCUSSION 25 ABOUT DISCLOSURES, THAT ARE IN ST. LOUIS. 31 WATER PCB-l 1 A I AM NOT SURE I COULD QUANTIFY THAT 2 PRECISELY. THERE ARE MANY NUMBERS OF DOCUMENTS 3 WHICH WOULD BE INVOLVED IN THAT SPECIFIC TOPIC. 4_ THEY ARE PART OF A LARGER COLLECTION 5 OF DOCUMENTS WHICH RELATE TO MONSANTO'S BUSINESS 6 OF MANUFACTURING, PRODUCING, AND SELLING PCB'S. 7 Q. AND APPROXIMATELY HOW MANY PAGES OF 8 DOCUMENTS DOES THAT INVOLVE? 9 A. THE ENTIRE COLLECTION OF DOCUMENTS? 10 Q. YES . 11 A. APPROXIMATELY ONE MILLION PAGES. 12 Q. AND WHAT PERCENTAGE OF PAGES ABOUT 13 DISCLOSURES DID YOU PRODUCE TO US, COMPARED TO 14 THE NUMBER OF PAGES YOU HAVE IN GENERAL? DO YOU 15 HAVE ANY IDEA? 16 A. I COULDN'T ESTIMATE THAT RIGHT NOW. 17 Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO GO TO ANOTHER 18 POINT IN THIS ARTICLE, PAGE 3 IN THIS ARTICLE, 19 THE PARAGRAPH THAT BEGINS WITH: 20 "MONSANTO WAS WORRIED ABOUT 21 SUITS AS FAR BACK AS 1972." 22 A RIGHT 23 Q PLEASE READ THAT PARAGRAPH. 24 A UM-HUM 25 YES, MA'AM 32 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. ARE YOU AWARE WHETHER MONSANTO EVER 2 HAD TEXAS EASTERN SIGN A WAIVER AGREEMENT? 3 A. ONLY BY EXAMINING DOCUMENTS. 4_ Q. DOES MONSANTO HAVE A DOCUMENT THAT 5 IS AN EXECUTED WAIVER AGREEMENT BY TEXAS EASTERN? 6 A. NO, MA'AM. 7 Q. DOES IT HAVE A DRAFT OF A WAIVER 8 AGREEMENT? 9 A. I DON'T RECALL WHETHER WE HAVE A 10 DRAFT OF A WAIVER AGREEMENT OR NOT. 11 Q. ARE THERE ANY DOCUMENTS THAT REFER, 12 OR REFLECT, OR RELATE TO A WAIVER AGREEMENT WITH 13 TEXAS EASTERN? 14 A. I BELIEVE THERE ARE, YES. 15 Q. DO WE HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS? 16 A. I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT THE COLLECTION 17 OF DOCUMENTS TO BE PRODUCED. I DON'T RECALL 18 OFFHAND. 19 Q. IF WE DO NOT HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS, I 20 WOULD LIKE TO REQUEST THAT YOU PRODUCE THEM TO 21 US . 22 A. WE WILL TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION 23 AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME. 24 Q. DOES MONSANTO HAVE A DOCUMENT 25 RETENTION SYSTEM? 33 WATER PCB-l 1 A YES, WE DO 2 Q. CAN YOU DESCRIBE THE SYSTEM TO ME. 3 A. IT'S A VERY COMPLICATED SYSTEM . IT, 4 N GENERAL, PROSCRIBES THE LENGTH OF TIME FOR 5 WHICH DOCUMENTS SHOULD BE RETAINED, DEPENDING 6 UPON THE NATURE OF THE DOCUMENT AND THE BUSINESS 7 OR OTHER PURPOSE. 8 Q. LET'S FOCUS IN ON PCB-RELATED 9 DOCUMENTS,THE LENGTH OF TIME THAT A PCB-RELATED 10 DOCUMENT SHOULD BE RETAINED. 11 A. THERE IS NO RETENTION PERIOD FOR PCB 12 DOCUMENTS. THOSE DOCUMENTS HAVE BEEN TAKEN OUT 13 OF THE RECORD RETENTION SYSTEM AT MONSANTO, AND 14 THEY ARE PLACED IN MY CUSTODY. 15 MY INSTRUCTION IS THAT NO DOCUMENTS 16 RELATING TO PCB'S ARE TO BE DESTROYED. 17 Q. WHEN WAS THAT INSTRUCTION FIRST 18 GIVEN? 19 A. FIRST GIVEN? 20 Q. YES. NOT NECESSARILY BY YOU, BUT BY 21 SOMEBODY AT MONSANTO. 22 A. I UNDERSTAND THAT. I BELIEVE AROUND 23 1971 . 24 Q. HOW ABOUT PRIOR TO 1971, WHAT WAS 25 THE DOCUMENT RETENTION POLICY RELATING TO PCB'S? 34 WATER PCB-l 1 A. AGAIN, IT WOULD HAVE DEPENDED UPON 2 THE NATURE OF THE DOCUMENT INVOLVED. THERE WAS 3 NO POLICY SPECIFIC TO DOCUMENTS RELATED TO PCB'S. 4-- Q. HOW ABOUT DOCUMENTS IN GENERAL PRIOR 5 TO 1971? 6 A. AGAIN, THAT WOULD DEPEND ON THE 7 NATURE OF THE DOCUMENTS. 8 MONSANTO IS A LARGE COMPANY. WE 9 HAVE MANY FACETS TO OUR BUSINESS AND MANY 10 DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOCUMENTS THAT ARE GENERATED 11 FOR DIFFERENT PURPOSES. 12 AND DEPENDING UPON THE TYPE OF 13 DOCUMENT INVOLVED, THE DOCUMENT WOULD BE RETAINED 14 FOR AS SHORT AS ONE YEAR, OR AS LONG AS NEVER 15 HAVING A DESTRUCTION PERIOD SET FOR IT. 16 Q. LET'S START WITH DOCUMENTS THAT 17 PERTAIN TO SCIENTIFIC STUDIES, FOR INSTANCE, 18 HEALTH HAZARDS. 19 HOW LONG WOULD THOSE DOCUMENTS HAVE 20 BEEN RETAINED BEFORE 1971? 21 A. THOSE DOCUMENTS WOULD HAVE BEEN 22 RETAINED AS LONG AS THE PRODUCT WAS BEING 23 PRODUCED, AND THEREAFTER AT THE DISCRETION OF THE 24 MEDICAL DIRECTOR. 25 Q. SO YOU BELIEVE THAT MONSANTO 35 WATER PCB-l 1 RETAINED ALL DOCUMENTS FROM THE TIME PCB PRODUCTS 2 WERE FIRST PRODUCED UNTIL 1971, AS THEY RELATE TO 3 THE HEALTH HAZARD QUESTION. 4_ A. THAT WAS CERTAINLY THE INTENT. 5 NOW, WHETHER EVERY LAST DOCUMENT 6 WAS, IN FACT, RETAINED I COULDN'T TELL YOU. 7 THAT'S NOT A POLICY, BY THE WAY, 8 RESTRICTED TO PCB'S. THAT'S A GENERAL POLICY 9 WITH RESPECT TO MONSANTO PRODUCTS. 10 Q. HOW ABOUT DOCUMENTS THAT PERTAIN TO 11 THE SALE OF PRODUCTS, HOW LONG WERE THOSE 12 RETAINED PRIOR TO 1971? 13 A. THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN AGAIN VARIED, 14 DEPENDING UPON THE TYPE OF DOCUMENT INVOLVED. 15 SALES INVOICES OR SALES CONTRACTS 16 WOULD HAVE HAD A RELATIVELY SHORT LIFE SPAN, AND 17 I DON'T KNOW PRECISELY HOW LONG, MAYBE AS SHORT 18 AS TWO OR THREE YEARS. 19 OTHER DOCUMENTS REFLECTING SALES, 20 FOR EXAMPLE, SUMMER REPORTS OF THE TYPE THAT 21 BURKE PRODUCED IN THIS LITIGATION, WOULD HAVE HAD 22 A SIGNIFICANTLY LONGER LIFE SPAN, MAYBE AS MUCH 23 AS TEN OR 12 YEARS. 24 AGAIN, I AM NOT CERTAIN OF THE 25 SPECIFIC TIME, BUT DIFFERENT TYPES OF DOCUMENTS 36 WATER PCB-i 1 HAD DIFFERENT RETENTION PERIODS. 2 Q. HOW ABOUT DOCUMENTS PERTAINING TO 3 THE DEVELOPMENT OF A PRODUCT? 4 A. DEPENDING UPON THE TYPE OF DOCUMENT, 5 THE RETENTION PERIOD FOR THOSE TYPES WOULD 6 GENERALLY BE THE LIFE OF THE PRODUCT. 7 IN THE CASE OF SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH 8 REPORTS, I BELIEVE THAT THOSE KINDS OF DOCUMENTS 9 DON'T HAVE A RETENTION PERIOD. THEY ARE TO BE 10 RETAINED FOREVER. 11 Q. SO AS YOU SIT HERE TODAY, YOU 12 BELIEVE THAT MONSANTO HAS KEPT ALL DOCUMENTS THAT 13 PERTAIN TO DEVELOPMENT OF PCB-RELATED PRODUCTS, 14 AND HAS NEVER DESTROYED THOSE DOCUMENTS. 15 A. I CAN'T REPRESENT TO YOU THAT NONE 16 OF THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE EVER DESTROYED. 17 WHAT I CAN SAY IS THAT, IN GENERAL, 18 DOCUMENTS RELATING TO THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE 19 PRODUCT ARE RETAINED DURING THE LIFE OF A 20 PRODUCT. THEREFORE, THOSE DOCUMENTS SHOULD NOT 21 HAVE BEEN DESTROYED. 22 BUT WHETHER WE HAVE EVERY PIECE OF 23 PAPER, I OBVIOUSLY COULD NOT MAKE ANY SORT OF 24 GUARANTEE ABOUT THAT. 25 Q. I WOULD LIKE TO FOCUS ON 1971, WHEN 37 WATER PCB-l 1 YOU FIRST GAVE THE INSTRUCTIONS THAT NO 2 PCB-RELATED DOCUMENTS WERE TO BE DESTROYED. 3 WHO DID THAT INSTRUCTION GO OUT TO? 4_ A. THAT WENT OUT TO THOSE INVOLVED IN 5 THE PRODUCTION AND SALE OF PCB'S, AS WELL AS THE 6 MEDICAL AND TOXICOLOGY STAFF. 7 Q. WAS THAT AN ORAL INSTRUCTION? 8 A. I'M NOT SURE WHETHER IT WAS ORAL OR 9 WRITTEN. 10 Q. ARE YOU AWARE WHETHER THERE IS A 11 WRITTEN DOCUMENT THAT STATES THAT? 12 A. I'M NOT AWARE OF WHETHER THERE IS 13 ONE DATED 1971 OR NOT. 14 Q. ARE THERE OTHERS THAT STATE THAT NO 15 PCB-RELATED DOCUMENTS ARE TO BE DESTROYED? 16 A. I BELIEVE THERE ARE, YES. 17 Q. DO WE HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS? 18 A. I DON'T BELIEVE SO. 19 MS. WELCH: COULD WE GET THOSE 20 DOCUMENTS. 21 MR. PREUSS: MAKE A REQUEST, AND WE 22 WILL CONSIDER IT. 23 MS. WELCH: I AM MAKING THE REQUEST 24 ON THE RECORD. 25 THE WITNESS: WE WILL CONSIDER IT. 38 WATER PCB-l 1 MR. PREUSSs WE WILL CONSIDER IT. 2 BY MS. WELCH: 3 Q. IN 1971 DID ALL PREVIOUS PCB-RELATED 4 DOCUMENTS COME TO YOUR FACILITY? I MEAN YOUR 5 OFFICE. 6 A. I'M NOT CERTAIN WHETHER THEY WERE 7 COLLECTED AND PLACED IN THE CUSTODY OF INSIDE 8 COUNSEL, OR WHETHER OUTSIDE COUNSEL TOOK CONTROL 9 OF THOSE DOCUMENTS. 10 Q. SUBSEQUENT TO THAT TIME DID ALL 11 PCB-RELATED DOCUMENTS COME TO YOUR OFFICE? 12 A. YES. 13 Q. AND IS THAT WHERE ALL PCB-RELATED 14 DOCUMENTS ARE CURRENTLY CENTERED? 15 A. YES. 16 Q. DID YOU SEARCH THERE IN RESPONSE TO 17 OUR DOCUMENT REQUEST? 18 A. MEMBERS OF MY STAFF SEARCHED, YES. 19 MS. WELCH: ANY TIME YOU WANT TO 20 TAKE A BREAK, BY THE WAY, EITHER MS. COURT 21 REPORTER OR MR. BISTLINE, PLEASE TELL ME. 22 THE WITNESS: THANK YOU. 23 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD.) 24 BY MS. WELCH: 25 Q. WELL, JUST ONE MORE ON DOCUMENT 39 WATER PCB-l 1 RETENTION. 2 WHAT HAPPENS TO DOCUMENTS THAT ARE 3 PRODUCED TODAY, FOR INSTANCE ABOUT PCB'S, WHERE 4 0 THOSE DOCUMENTS GO? 5 MR. PREUSS: YOU MEAN OTHER THAN THE 6 OTHER SIDE THAT ASKS FOR THEM? 7 MS. WELCH: INTERNAL MONSANTO 8 DOCUMENTS. 9 THE WITNESS: I DON'T THINK THEY GO 10 ANYWHERE. IN SOME CASES A SET OF DOCUMENTS IS 11 RETAINED. 12 IN OTHER CASES WE WOULD RECORD WHICH 13 DOCUMENTS WERE PRODUCED AND, FOR SPACE REASONS, 14 DESTROY THE COPIES THAT REMAIN, BUT WOULD NOT 15 DESTROY AN ARCHIVE COPY OF A DOCUMENT, OBVIOUSLY. 16 BY MS. WELCH; 17 Q. DO YOU SEE ALL DOCUMENTS, OR DOES 18 YOUR OFFICE SEE ALL DOCUMENTS, THAT RELATE TO 19 PCB 1 S THAT ARE CREATED WITHIN MONSANTO? 20 A. DO WE SEE ALL DOCUMENTS? WE ARE IN 21 POSSESSION OF ALL OF THE DOCUMENTS THAT WE ARE 22 AWARE OF THAT RELATE TO PCB1S WITHIN MONSANTO, 23 EXCEPT FOR THOSE VERY, VERY FEW WHICH ARE . 24 CURRENTLY BEING CREATED AND WHICH WE OBTAIN ON A 25 PERIODIC BASIS. 40 WATER PCB-0003S 1 Q. BUT THERE ARE SOME SORT OF 2 INSTRUCTIONS AT MONSANTO FOR ANY PERSONNEL THAT 3 CREATE DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO PCB'S TO COME TO 4 YOUR OFFICE. 5 A. YES . 6 Q. AND IS THAT A WRITTEN INSTRUCTION? 7 A. I DON'T KNOW THAT I HAVE EVER 8 WRITTEN IT DOWN. I KNOW THE PLAYERS INVOLVED, 9 AND WE PERIODICALLY GO TO THEIR OFFICES AND 10 COLLECT THOSE DOCUMENTS, AND INCORPORATE THEM 11 INTO OUR ARCHIVE. 12 MS. WELCH: I WOULD LIKE TO 13 INTRODUCE EXHIBIT 3. THIS IS A NOTICE OF 14 DEPOSITIONS AND PRODUCTION OF DOCUMENTS. WILL 15 YOU PLEASE MARK THIS AS EXHIBIT 3. 16 (THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO WAS 17 MARKED BY THE C.S.R. AS PLAINTIFF'S 18 EXHIBIT 3 FOR IDENTIFICATION AND 19 ATTACHED TO AND MADE A PART OF THIS 20 DEPOSITION.) 21 BY MS. WELCH: 22 Q. MR. BISTLINE, THIS IS THE ORIGINAL 23 DOCUMENT REQUEST THAT TRANSWESTERN SENT TO 24 MONSANTO, SERVED ON MONSANTO, SENT ON MAY 21, 25 1991 . 41 WATER PCB-l 1 HAVE YOU EVER SEEN THIS REQUEST 2 BEFORE? 3 A. YES f MA' AM. 4 Q. WHEN DID YOU FIRST SEE IT? 5 A. SHORTLY AFTER IT WAS SERVED ON 6 MONSANTO. 7 Q. DO YOU RECALL APPROXIMATELY WHEN 8 THAT WAS? 9 A. THE PRECISE DATE, NO, MA'AM, HOWEVER 10 LONG IT TOOK TO TRANSMIT IT. 11 Q. WHO SHOWED THIS REQUEST TO YOU? 12 A. I BELIEVE IT CAME EITHER BY FAX OR 13 THROUGH THE MAIL FROM MR. PREUSS. 14 Q. AND WERE ALL DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 15 PRODUCED BY MONSANTO DOCUMENTS THAT WERE KEPT IN 16 THE ORDINARY COURSE OF BUSINESS? 17 A. NOT ALL OF THEM, NO. 18 CERTAIN SALES SUMMARIES WERE 19 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE CREATED BY MY STAFF, SIMPLY 20 BECAUSE THE UNDERLYING REPORTS WERE DIFFICULT TO 21 INTERPRET, AND IT'S EASIER FOR US TO PREPARE THE 22 SUMMARY AND ENCLOSE THE UNDERLYING DOCUMENTS, 23 THAN IT IS TO HAVE TO EXPLAIN THEM LATER. 24 Q. WERE THE SUMMARIES PREPARED IN 25 RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST OR PREVIOUSLY? 42 WATER PCB-l 1 A. NO, THEY WERE PREPARED IN RESPONSE 2 TO THIS REQUEST. 3 Q. WHERE DID YOU CONDUCT THE DOCUMENT 4 SEARCH IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST? 5 A. IN ST. LOUIS, IN THE DOCUMENT 6 ARCHIVE. 7 Q. DID YOU ENGAGE IN A COMPUTER SEARCH 8 OR IN AN ACTUAL HARD COPY SEARCH? 9 A. BOTH. 10 Q. DID YOU SEND OUT ANY MEMORANDUM TO 11 MONSANTO EMPLOYEES WITH RESPECT TO THIS DOCUMENT 12 REQUEST? 13 A. NOT THAT I RECALL. 14 Q. DID YOU SPEAK TO ANY MONSANTO 15 EMPLOYEES WITH RESPECT TO THE REQUEST? 16 A. I MAY HAVE. I MAY HAVE, BUT I DON'T 17 RECALL SPECIFICALLY. 18 Q. DO YOU RECALL ANY INDIVIDUALS WHO 19 YOU MAY HAVE SPOKEN TO? 20 A. YES. I MAY HAVE SPOKEN TO DR. JOHN 21 CRADDOCK, C-R-A-D-D-O-C-K, AND DR. ROBERT KALEY, 22 K-A-L-E"Y. 23 Q. WHO IS DR. CRADDOCK? 24 A. DR. CRADDOCK IS A MONSANTO 25 EMPLOYEE. HIS SPECIFIC TITLE I CAN'T RECALL AT 43 WATER PCB-l 1 THE MOMENT 2 I BELIEVE JOHN VERIFIED THE 3 RESPONSE, SIGNED THE CORPORATE VERIFICATION FOR 4 MONSANTO, SO HIS' TITLE WOULD BE IDENTIFIED ON 5 THAT DOCUMENT. 6 Q. CAN YOU DESCRIBE TO ME WHAT THE 7 CONTENTS OF YOUR DISCUSSIONS WERE. 8 A. NO, MA'AM. 9 Q. WHY WOULD YOU HAVE SPOKEN TO 10 DR. CRADDOCK ABOUT THE DOCUMENT REQUEST? 11 A. TO OBTAIN HIS INSIGHT INTO THE 12 RELATIONSHIP OF TEXAS EASTERN WITH THE 13 ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY, AND DISCUSSIONS 14 THAT HE MIGHT HAVE HAD WITH PERSONNEL AT TEXAS 15 EASTERN. 16 Q. WHY DID YOU GO TO HIM TO ASK THESE 17 QUESTIONS? 18 A. DR. CRADDOCK IS A VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE 19 PERSON ABOUT PCB'S AND THE REGULATORY PROCESSES 20 WITH RESPECT TO PCB'S. 21 HE IS A MEMBER OF A GROUP THAT IS 22 CALLED THE CONSENSUS GROUP, WHICH IS COMPOSED OF 23 REPRESENTATIVES OF THE CHEMICAL MANUFACTURERS 24 ASSOCIATION, CERTAIN ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS WITHIN 25 THE ENVIRONMENTAL DEFENSE FUND AND ENVIRONMENTAL 44 WATER PCB-l 1 PROTECTION AGENCY, WHO HAVE WORKED FOR QUITE A 2 LONG PERIOD OF TIME TO ESTABLISH APPROPRIATE 3 LEVELS FOR PCB CLEANUPS OR CLEANUPS OF VARIOUS 4 CONTAMINATED PCB'S. 5 AND DR. CRADDOCK, I BELIEVE, IS ALSO 6 THE ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR RESEARCH, I BELIEVE, 7 FOR THE EASTERN GAS ASSOCIATION. 8 Q. DID YOU ASK HIM WHETHER HE HAD ANY 9 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST? 10 A. I DON'T RECALL WHETHER I DID OR 11 NOT. IF HE HAD DOCUMENTS, THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN 12 OBTAINED FROM HIM. 13 Q. OBTAINED PREVIOUS TO THIS REQUEST? 14 A. YES. 15 Q. AND PUT INWHATEVER YOUR FACILITY IS 16 FOR PCB-RELATED DOCUMENTS. 17 A. YES. 18 Q. YOU SPOKE TO HIMFOR SUBSTANTIVE 19 DISCUSSION. 20 A. YES, THAT'S CORRECT. 21 Q. HOW ABOUT DR. KALEY? 22 A. YES , DR. KALEY, FOR MUCH OF THE SAME 23 REASONS. HE IS VERY KNOWLEDGE ABOUT PCB'S, BUT 24 FROM MORE OF A SCIENTIFIC PERSPECTIVE. 25 DR. KALEY IS AN ANALYTICAL CHEMIST, 45 WATER PCB-00038 1 AND IS EXTREMELY KNOWLEDGEABLE ON THE SCIENTIFIC 2 LITERATURE WITH RESPECT TO PCB ' S . 3 Q. AND DID YOU ASK HIM WHETHER HE HAD 4 ANY DOCUMENTS IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST? 5 A. I DON'T RECALL. BUT AGAIN, IF HE 6 HAD, THEY WOULD HAVE BEEN OBTAINED BY MY STAFF. 7 Q. PREVIOUS TO THE DOCUMENT REQUEST. 8 A. PREVIOUS TO THE DOCUMENT REQUEST. 9 Q. WHO HEADED THE SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS 10 FOR THIS REQUEST? 11 A. I'M NOT QUITE SURE WHAT YOU MEAN. 12 Q. WHO WAS IN CHARGE OF THE SEARCH? 13 A. FROM A PRACTICAL VIEWPOINT, IT WOULD 14 HAVE BEEN ONE OF MY PARALEGALS. I'M NOT SURE 15 WHETHER IT WAS MRS. NIBLOCK OR ANOTHER PARALEGAL 16 WHO RECENTLY LEFT MONSANTO'S EMPLOY, 17 MRS. HURLEY. I JUST CAN'T RECALL WHICH OF THOSE 18 TWO MAY HAVE ACTUALLY CONDUCTED THE SEARCH AND 19 SUPERVISED THE RETRIEVAL. 20 Q. DID THEY SUPERVISE IT PURSUANT TO 21 YOUR INSTRUCTION? 22 A. YES, MA'AM. 23 Q. AND HOW MANY INDIVIDUALS WERE - 24 INVOLVED IN THE DOCUMENT SEARCH? 25 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. 46 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. CAN YOU GIVE ME AN APPROXIMATION. 2 A. PERHAPS AS MANY AS FOUR OR FIVE. 3 Q. NORMALLY, WHEN YOU RECEIVE A 4 DOCUMENT REQUEST IN LITIGATION, HOW MANY 5 INDIVIDUALS ARE INVOLVED IN THE SEARCH? 6 A. WELL, DEPENDS UPON THE NATURE AND 7 SCOPE OF THE REQUEST. USUALLY, TWO TO TEN. 8 AGAIN, IT WOULD DEPEND ON WHAT WE WERE ASKED TO 9 PRODUCE. 10 Q. IN THE PAOLI LITIGATION DO YOU 11 RECALL HOW MANY INDIVIDUALS WERE INVOLVED? 12 A. PROBABLY JUST ABOUT EVERYBODY. 13 Q. SO YOU USE YOUR OWN PEOPLE; YOU DO 14 NOT HIRE OUTSIDE PEOPLE. 15 A. OUTSIDE COUNSEL WERE INVOLVED. 16 Q. ARE YOU REFERRING TO THE PAOLI 17 LITIGATION? 18 YES . 19 Q. HOW ABOUT FOR THE ANLAND LITIGATION, 20 DID OUTSIDE COUNSEL ASSIST YOU IN THE SEARCH? 21 A. IN THE REVIEW OF DOCUMENTS, YES. 22 Q. SO OUTSIDE COUNSEL CAME TO ST. LOUIS 23 AND REVIEWED THE DOCUMENTS. 24 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 25 Q. AND ALL OF THE PEOPLE WHO WERE 47 WATER PCB-0003S 1 INVOLVED IN THE SEARCH, WHETHER IT BE VIA 2 COMPUTER OR HARD COPY, WERE MEMBERS OP YOUR 3 STAFF; IS THAT CORRECT? 4-- A. THAT'S CORRECT. 5 Q. ALL RIGHT. HOW MANY DOCUMENTS DID 6 YOU OR YOUR SEARCHERS REVIEW? 7 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT . 8 Q. CAN YOU GIVE ME AN APPROXIMATION. 9 A. AS FAR AS THE SEARCHERS GO, NO, 10 MA'AM, I CAN'T. 11 Q. HOW MANY BOXES OF DOCUMENTS DID YOU 12 REVIEW? 13 A. I DON'T KNOW THAT. 14 Q. WHAT WERE THEY REVIEWED IN TERMS OF? 15 A. THE BULK OF DOCUMENTS WERE REVIEWED 16 IN TERMS OF BOXES. IT'S A LITTLE DIFFICULT TO 17 DESRIBE HOW IT'S ORGANIZED WITHOUT TRENCHING ON 18 THE WORK PRODUCT PRIVILEGE. 19 MR. PREUSS: WELL, TO THE EXTENT 20 THAT THAT CALLS FOR YOUR WORK PRODUCT OR 21 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE, I WILL INSTRUCT YOU 22 NOT TO ANSWER. 23 BY MS. WELCH: 24 Q. I AM CERTAINLY NOT ASKING YOU TO 25 VIOLATE THE PRIVILEGE. 48 WATER PCB-l 1 I JUST WANT A FACTUAL RECOUNT OF 2 WHAT YOU PHYSICALLY DID WHEN YOU GOT THE DOCUMENT 3 REQUEST. SO TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN ANSWER THAT 4 WITHOUT TELLING ME ANYTHING THAT'S PRIVILEGED, 5 PLEASE DO. 6 A. RIGHT. 7 I HAVE A QUESTION FOR COUNSEL THAT 8 I'D LIKE TO CONFER WITH HIM ON. 9 Q. GO RIGHT HEAD. IS THIS AN 10 APPROPRIATE TIME TO TAKE A BREAK? 11 A. YES, IT WOULD BE A GOOD TIME. 12 MS. WELCH : OFF THE RECORD. 13 (RECESS TAKEN.) 14 MS. WELCH: WE ARE BACK ON THE 15 RECORD. 16 Q. I BELIEVE THAT I HAD ASKED YOU TO 17 RECOUNT FOR ME HOW YOU PHYSICALLY BEGAN IN THE 18 SEARCH AFTER YOU RECEIVED THE DOCUMENT REQUEST. 19 A. THE DOCUMENTS WERE REVIEWED AFTER 20 THE COMPUTER SEARCH, BUT THE PHYSICAL MANNER IN 21 WHICH THAT WAS DONE REALLY RELATES TO HOW WE ARE 22 ORGANIZED AT MONSANTO. 23 MR. PREUSS: WE ARE GOING TO ASSERT 24 THE PRIVILEGE OF WORK PRODUCT AND 25 ATTORNEY-CLIENT. 49 WATER PCB-l 1 THE WITNESS I CAN ASSURE YOU THAT 2 WE CONDUCTED A THOROUGH SEARCH OF ALL OF THE 3 DOCUMENTS AVAILABLE TO US, ALL OF THE DOCUMENTS 4 THAT WE HAVE IN OUR POSSESSION, AND THAT THE 5 DOCUMENT PRODUCTION THAT WE MADE, THE PARAMETERS 6 ARE FULLY SET OUT IN OUR RESPONSE. 7 BUT PHYSICALLY HOW WE DID IT IS WORK 8 PRODUCT. 9 BY MS. WELCH: 10 Q. DID YOU FIRST GO TO THE COMPUTER 11 FILE AND SEARCH ON THE COMPUTER FILE FOR 12 DOCUMENTS THAT MIGHT BE RESPONSIVE TO OUR 13 REQUEST? 14 MR. PREUSS: I AM GOING TO INSTRUCT 15 HIM NOT TO ANSWER ON THE BASIS OF WORK PRODUCT 16 AND ATTORNEY-CLIENT. 17 BY MS. WELCH: 18 Q. HOW LONG DID THE DOCUMENT SEARCH 19 TAKE? 20 A. THE PROCESS EXTENDED OVER A PERIOD, 21 I BELIEVE, OF ABOUT TWO WEEKS. 22 Q. HOW MANY HOURS DURING THAT TWO 23 WEEKS? 24 A. I WOULD HAVE TO GO BACK AND COMPUTE 25 THAT . 50 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. APPROXIMATELY. 2 A. I DON'T KNOW OFFHAND. I HATE TO 3 HAZARD A GUESS. I JUST -- I'D HAVE TO GO BACK 4 AND EXAMINE THE FILE. I JUST DON'T KNOW. 5 Q. I BELIEVE I ASKED THAT QUESTION 6 BEFORE, BUT I DON'T BELIEVE I RECEIVED AN ANSWER. 7 DO YOU, AS YOU SIT HERE TODAY, 8 RECALL HOW MANY BOXES OF DOCUMENTS YOU REVIEWED? 9 A. NO, MA'AM. 10 Q. DURING WHAT TIME PERIOD WAS THE 11 DOCUMENT SEARCH CONDUCTED? 12 A. IF I CAN LOOK AT OURRESPONSE, I 13 COULD GIVE YOU A BETTER IDEA. 14 MR. PREUSS: DO YOU WANT HIM TO LOOK 15 AT IT? 16 MS. WELCH: YES, PLEASE. 17 THE WITNESS: WHAT'S THE DATE OF OUR 18 RESPONSE? IT WOULD HAVE OCCURRED, INITIAL REVIEW 19 OF THE DOCUMENTS, SHORTLY AFTER WE RECEIVED THE 20 DOCUMENT DEMAND. 21 AND THEN THE FINAL REVIEW AND 22 DETERMINATION OF WHICH DOCUMENTS WOULD BE 23 PRODUCED WAS CONDUCTED IN EARLY TO MID JUNE, I 24 BELIEVE. 25 BY MS. WELCH: 51 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY RECOLLECTION OF WHAT 2 PERCENTAGE OF YOUR STAFF'S TIME WAS TAKEN UP 3 DURING THOSE TWO WEEKS IN SEARCHING FOR 4 DOCUMENTS? 5 A. NO, I DON'T. 6 Q. IS THERE ANYBODY WHO WOULD KNOW 7 THAT, BESIDES YOU? 8 A. WELL, IF I ASKED SOMEONE TO FIND 9 OUT, BUT I DON'T BELIEVE THAT ANYONE KNOWS THAT 10 ANSWER RIGHT NOW WITHOUT HAVING TO DO RESEARCH ON 11 IT. 12 Q. ARE THERE TIME RECORDS THAT ARE KEPT 13 IN TERMS OF WHAT TASKS PEOPLE PERFORM? 14 A. YES. 15 MS. WELCH: I'D LIKE, ON THE RECORD, 16 TO REQUEST THAT YOUR COUNSEL, IN WRITING, TELL US 17 WHAT KIND OF TIME WAS PUT INTO SEARCHING FOR 18 DOCUMENTS RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST. 19 MR. PREUSS: YOUR REQUEST IS NOTED. 20 BY MS. WELCH: 21 Q. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE, WOULD ALL 22 DOCUMENTS RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST BE LOCATED 23 IN THE FACILITY THAT YOU IDENTIFIED? 24 A. TO MY KNOWLEDGE, YES. 25 Q. AND WOULD THAT BE TRUE FOR ANY 52 WATER PCB-l 1 PCB-RELATED LITIGATION, YOU WOULD DO THE SAME 2 THING? 3 A. FOR THE MOST PART. I MEAN IT WOULD 4 DEPEND ON THE REQUEST. BUT AS LONG AS THE 5 REQUEST IS RELATED TO PCB'S, THE ANSWER WOULD BE 6 YES . 7 Q. IN TERMS OF FACILITIES THAT HAVE 8 MANUFACTURED PCB'S SINCE 1938 , DO ANY OF THOSE 9 STILL HAVE PCB-RELATED DOCUMENTS? 10 A. YOU MEAN MONSANTO FACILITIES? 11 Q. YES. 12 A. THERE MAY BE PCB-RELATED DOCUMENTS, 13 BUT COPIES OF THOSE OR ORIGINALS OF THOSE WOULD 14 BE IN MY CUSTODY. 15 Q. AND YOU ARE CERTAIN OF THAT. 16 A. YES . 17 Q. HOW ARE YOU CERTAIN OF THAT? 18 A. BECAUSE WE HAVE LOOKED. 19 Q. WHEN HAVE YOU LOOKED? 20 A. SEVERAL TIMES. 21 Q. IN WHAT CONTEXT? 22 A. IN THE CONTEXT INITIALLY OF 23 RESPONDING TO DISCOVERY REQUESTS AND LITIGATION 24 THAT AROSE IN THE 1970'S. 25 Q. WHAT WAS THE FIRST LITIGATION THAT 53 WATER PCB-0003S 1 AROSE, THAT YOU SEARCHED? 2 A. I DON'T RECALL THE NAME OP THE CASE 3 OR THE STYLE OF THE CASE SPECIFICALLY, BUT IT 4 INVOLVED AN INCIDENT OF FISH MEAL CONTAMINATION 5 IN 1971 IN NORTH CAROLINA. 6 Q. WAS MONSANTO A PARTY TO THAT 7 LITIGATION? 8 A. YES, MA'AM. 9 Q. AND WHAT WAS THE VENUE OF THAT 10 LITIGATION? 11 A. I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT WAS STATE OR 12 FEDERAL COURT IN NORTH CAROLINA, BUT IT WAS A 13 COURT IN NORTH CAROLINA. 14 Q. IS THAT LITIGATION STILL PENDING? 15 A. NO. 16 Q. AND WHEN WAS IT SETTLED OR OTHERWISE 17 RESOLVED? 18 A. LONG BEFORE MY TIME AT MONSANTO. 19 Q. WHEN WAS THE FIRST TIME YOU WERE 20 INVOLVED IN SEARCHING FOR DOCUMENTS ABOUT 21 PCB-RELATED PRODUCTS? 22 A. IN 1985, WHEN I ASSUMED 23 RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE LITIGATION. 24 Q. AND AT THAT POINT HAD ALL DOCUMENTS 25 BEEN CENTRALIZED IN ST. LOUIS? 54 WATER PCB-l 1 A YES 2 Q. AND YOU ARE CERTAIN OF THAT. 3 A. YES. 4 MS. WELCH: I WOULD LIKE TO 5 INTRODUCE AS EXHIBIT 4 YOUR DOCUMENT RESPONSE. 6 PLEASE MARK THIS AS EXHIBIT 4. 7 (THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO WAS 8 MARKED BY THE C.S.R. AS PLAINTIFF'S 9 EXHIBIT 4 FOR IDENTIFICATION AND 10 ATTACHED TO AND MADE A PART OF THIS 11 DEPOSITION.) 12 BY MS. WELCH: 13 Q. BUT BEFORE WE GO TO THAT, I HAVE ONE 14 OR TWO MORE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE ACTUAL PHYSICAL 15 SEARCH. 16 YOU SAID THAT YOU LOOKED AT COMPUTER 17 ARCHIVES BEFORE YOU DID A HARD COPY SEARCH. DID 18 YOU LOOK AT ANY OTHER ELECTRONIC DATA FOR YOUR 19 SEARCH? 20 MR. PREUSS: I WILL INSTRUCT HIM NOT 21 TO ANSWER BASED ON WORK PRODUCT AND 22 ATTORNEY-CLIENT. 23 BY MS. WELCH: 24 Q. DID YOU SEARCH ANY WORD PROCESSING 25 PROGRAM? 55 WATER PCB-l 1 MR. PREUSS: SAME INSTRUCTION. 2 BY MS. WELCH: 3 DID YOU SEARCH ANY HARD OR SOFT 4 DISK? 5 MR. PREUSS: SAME INSTRUCTION. 6 BY MS. WELCH: 7 Q. LET'S TURN TO THE DOCUMENT. HAVE 8 YOU SEEN THIS RESPONSE PREVIOUSLY? 9 A. YES . 10 Q. DID YOU PARTICIPATE IN THE DRAFTING 11 OF THIS RESPONSE? 12 A. YES, MA'AM. 13 Q. WHO ELSE PARTICIPATED IN THE 14 DRAFTING OF THIS RESPONSE? 15 COUNSEL FOR MONSANTO. 16 Q. AND THAT'S MR. PREUSS HERE 17 A. YES . 18 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER OUTSIDE COUNSEL 19 WHO PARTICIPATED? 20 A. MR. ZIMMER AT THE BRONSON FIRM. 21 PERHAPS OTHERS AT THE BRONSON FIRM, THAT I AM NOT 22 AWARE OF. 23 Q. DID YOU REVIEW THE RESPONSE BEFORE 24 IT WENT OUT? 25 A. YES . 56 WATER PCB-l 1 Q AND YOU BELIEVE IT TO BE ACCURATE 2 A. YES. 3 MS. WELCH: WE ARE GOING TO RETURN 4 TO THIS EXHIBIT, BUT I JUST WANT TO INTRODUCE 5 THIS DOCUMENT FIRST. PLEASE MARK THIS, AS 6 EXHIBIT 5, I BELIEVE. 7 MR. GRANT: 4 OR 5? 8 THE REPORTER: EXHIBIT 5. 9 (THE DOCUMENT REFERRED TO WAS 10 MARKED BY THE C.S.R. AS PLAINTIFF'S 11 EXHIBIT 5 FOR IDENTIFICATION AND 12 ATTACHED TO AND MADE A PART OF THIS 13 DEPOSITION.) 14 BY MS. WELCH: 15 Q. HAVE YOU SEEN THIS DOCUMENT BEFORE? 16 A. YES, MA'AM. 17 Q. AND IS DR. CRADDOCK IN A POSITION TO 18 VERIFY THE RESPONSES TO THE DOCUMENT REQUEST? 19 A. YES, HE IS AUTHORIZED TO DO THAT. 20 Q. ALL RIGHT. THE NEXT LINE OF 21 QUESTIONS REFERS TO THIS DOCUMENT RESPONSE, SO 22 PLEASE FEEL FREE TO REFER TO IT AS I ASK THE 23 QUESTIONS. 24 IN THE PROCESS OF SEARCHING FOR 25 DOCUMENTS, DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS 57 WATER PCB-l 1 ON THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE PROTECTED BY THE 2 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE OR WORK PRODUCT 3 PRIVILEGE? 4_ A. YES. 5 Q. WHAT QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS WERE 6 EXCLUDED ON THAT BASIS? 7 A. I BELIEVE ONLY ONE DOCUMENT WAS 8 FULLY EXCLUDED, AND PARTS OF A COUPLE OF OTHERS, 9 MAYBE TWO OR THREE OTHERS. 10 Q. AND DID YOU REDACT THOSE DOCUMENTS? 11 A. YES, WE DID. 12 Q. AND HAVE YOU PREPARED A PRIVILEGE 13 LOG? 14 MR. PREUSS: WE HAVE. AND COUNSEL, 15 I WOULD LIKE TO GIVE YOU A COPY OF THAT RIGHT 16 NOW, TRANSWESTERN PIPELINES VERSUS MONSANTO, LOG 17 OF DOCUMENTS REDACTED OR NOT PRODUCED ON THE 18 GROUNDS OF ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE. 19 MS. WELCH: ALL RIGHT. 20 Q. SUBJECT TO SIGNING OF A PROTECTIVE 21 ORDER, WILL YOU BE PRODUCING MORE DOCUMENTS? 22 A. IF A PROTECTIVE ORDER IS SIGNED, 23 YES, THERE ARE OTHER DOCUMENTS THAT WILL BE - 24 PRODUCED. 25 Q. WHAT QUANTITY? 58 WATER PCB-l 1 A. I'M NOT SURE PHYSICALLY HOW BIG, BUT 2 THEY ARE STANDARD MANUFACTURING PRODUCT MANUALS 3 RELATING TO THE PRODUCTS THAT WE SOLD TO TEXAS 4 EASTERN AND TRANSWESTERN. 5 Q. ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS? 6 A. I BELIEVE THOSE ARE THE ONLY 7 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE EXCLUDED ON THE BASIS OF 8 CONFIDENTIALITY. 9 OTHER DOCUMENTS WERE REDACTED ON THE 10 BASIS OF CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION, PRINCIPALLY 11 THE NAMES OF CUSTOMERS OF MONSANTO THAT WERE 12 REVEALED ON THOSE DOCUMENTS. THAT INFORMATION 13 WAS ALSO REDACTED FROM THOSE DOCUMENTS ON THE 14 BASIS OF CONFIDENTIALITY. 15 Q. WILL WE BE SUPPLIED WITH THAT 16 INFORMATION ONCE A PROTECTIVE ORDER IS SIGNED? 17 A. IF YOU REQUEST IT, YES. 18 Q. ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 19 WITHHELD BECAUSE THE PROTECTIVE ORDER HAD NOT 20 BEEN SIGNED? 21 A . I BELIEVE THAT'S ALL. 22 Q. WHEN WILL WE GET THOSE DOCUMENTS 23 AFTER THE PROTECTIVE ORDER IS SIGNED? 24 A. RELATIVELY QUICKLY. THERE IS NO 25 REASON, THAT I AM AWARE OF, THAT IT WOULD INVOLVE 59 WATER PCB-l 1 ANY SIGNIFICANT DELAY. 2 Q. A WEEK PERHAPS? 3 MR. PREUSS: WE WILL MOVE WITH DUE 4 DISPATCH. . 5 THE WITNESS: SOMETHING ON THAT 6 ORDER. 7 BY MS. WELCH: 8 Q. IN THE PROCESS OF SEARCHING FOR 9 DOCUMENTS, DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS 10 ON THE BASIS THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE IN THE 11 PUBLIC DOMAIN? 12 A. YES, WE DID. 13 Q. HOW DO YOU DEFINE "PUBLIC DOMAIN"? 14 A. IN THIS CASE THOSE DOCUMENTS WOULD 15 BE ONES WHICH APPEARED IN PEER REVIEW, SCIENTIFIC 16 LITERATURE , AND DOCUMENTS WHICH ARE PUBLISHED, 17 GOVERNMENT DOCUMENTS, WHICH ARE EQUALLY 18 ACCESSIBLE TO TRANSWESTERN AS THEY ARE TO 19 MONSANTO. 20 Q. DO THOSE DOCUMENTS EXIST IN YOUR 21 STORAGE FACILITY AT ST. LOUIS? 22 A. SOME OF THEM. 23 Q. WHERE DO OTHERSEXIST? 24 - A. IN THE PEER REVIEW, SCIENTIFIC 25 LITERATURE, AND IN THE FILES OF THE U.S. 60 WATER PCB-l 1 GOVERNMENT 2 Q. APPROXIMATELY WHAT QUANTITY OF 3 DOCUMENTS DID YOU EXCLUDE FROM THE PRODUCTION ON 4 JRHIS BASIS? 5 A. I DON'T KNOW THE QUANTITY. 6 IT WAS NOT A PROCESS OF SAYING, YOU 7 KNOW, WE HAVE ALL OF THESE DOCUMENTS THAT WE ARE 8 EXCLUDING ON THE BASIS OF PUBLIC DOMAIN. 9 RATHER, IT WAS A CATEGORY OF 10 DETERMINATION. IN OTHER WORDS, WE DECIDED WHICH 11 DOCUMENTS WOULD NOT BE SEARCHED FOR AND PRODUCED 12 IN RESPONSE TO THIS DOCUMENT REQUEST, SINCE THEY 13 WERE EQUALLY AVAILABLE TO TRANSWESTERN. 14 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS, OTHER 15 THAN THOSE YOU ENUMERATED, THAT ARE DOCUMENTS 16 WITHIN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN, THAT YOU EXCLUDED FROM 17 PRODUCTION? 18 A. THOSE ARE ALL I RECALL AT THE 19 MOMENT. I BELIEVE THAT'S ALL. 20 Q. WILL YOU PRODUCE THOSE DOCUMENTS TO 21 US NOW. 22 A. NO, MA'AM. 23 Q. IN THE PROCESS OF SEARCHING FOR 24 DOCUMENTS, DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS 25 OF ANY OTHER PARTY TO THIS ACTION? 61 WATER PCB-l 1 A. NO. WE PRODUCED ALL DOCUMENTS THAT 2 RELATED TO TRANSWESTERN. 3 Q. I WOULD LIKE TO REFER TO PAGE 2, TO 4 GENERAL OBJECTION NO. 4. WILL YOU PLEASE REVIEW 5 THAT . 6 A. YES . 7 Q. I WOULD JUST LIKE TO CONFIRM THAT NO 8 DOCUMENTS HAVE BEEN WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS. 9 A. TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO DOCUMENTS HAVE 10 BEEN WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS. 11 Q. IN THE PROCESS OF SEARCHING FOR 12 DOCUMENTS, DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS 13 THAT HAD BEEN CREATED AFTER 1977? 14 A. I BELIEVE SO, YES. 15 Q. DO THOSE DOCUMENTS EXIST? 16 A. DOCUMENTS CREATED AFTER 1977 DO 17 EXIST, YES. 18 Q. APPROXIMATELY WHAT IS THE QUANTITY 19 OF THOSE DOCUMENTS? 20 A. I COULD NOT ESTIMATE THAT FOR YOU AS 21 I SIT HERE. 22 Q. IS IT A LARGE PERCENTAGE OF THE 23 MILLION DOCUMENTS YOU DESCRIBED? 24 _ A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY 25 "LARGE . " IT'S A LARGE NUMBER OF DOCUMENTS, BUT 62 WATER PCB 1 IN TERMS OF HOW MANY OUT OF A MILLION I DON'T 2 KNOW. 3 Q. ARE THOSE DOCUMENTS ALSO CENTRALIZED 4 _IN ST. LOUIS AT YOUR STORAGE FACILITY? 5 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT THEY RELATE TO 6 MONSANTO'S PCB BUSINESS, YES. 7 Q. WHY DID YOU EXCLUDE THOSE DOCUMENTS? 8 A. I BELIEVE ON THE BASIS OF 9 RELEVANCE. MONSANTO CEASED ITS PRODUCTION OF 10 PCB'S IN 1977. 11 Q. BUT THERE ARE DOCUMENTS THAT EXIST, 12 THAT HAVE BEEN CREATED SINCE 1977. 13 A. YES. 14 Q. CAN YOU PLEASE CONFIRM TO ME THAT NO 15 DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED TO TRANSWESTERN WERE 16 EXCLUDED FROM PRODUCTION. 17 A. TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, ALL 18 DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO TRANSWESTERN WERE 19 PRODUCED. WE DIDN'T HAVE VERY MUCH. 20 Q. WHAT ABOUT DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED TO 21 TEXAS EASTERN, WERE ALL OF THOSE DOCUMENTS 22 PRODUCED TO US? 23 A. WE PRODUCED TO YOU ALL DOCUMENTS 24 -WHICH HAD TO DO WITH OUR DEALINGS WITH TEXAS 25 EASTERN. THERE MAY HAVE BEEN DOCUMENTS IN THE 63 WATER PCB-l 1 ARCHIVES THAT, ONE WAY OR ANOTHER, WEREN'T 2 PRODUCED. 3 Q. ON WHAT BASIS? 4 A. I WOULD HAVE TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT 5 EACH ONE TO TELL YOU SPECIFICALLY, BUT IN GENERAL 6 IT WAS BASED ON RELEVANCE. 7 Q. WERE THOSE DOCUMENTS NOT PRODUCED - 8 (WITNESS CONFERS WITH HIS COUNSEL. ) 9 THE WITNESS: ALSO, THERE WERE 10 DOCUMENTS THAT -- AND I KNOW YOU ARE AWARE OF 11 THIS -- THAT ARE COVERED BY PROTECTIVE ORDER IN 12 THE TEXAS EASTERN INSURANCE LITIGATION. 13 BY MS. WELCH: 14 Q. I AM GOING TO GET TO THAT. 15 WAS THAT THE PRIMARY BASIS THAT 16 THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD? 17 A. THOSE FEW DOCUMENTS, YES. 18 Q. HOW MANY DOCUMENTS ARE THERE THAT 19 WERE WITHHELD, APPROXIMATELY? 20 A. TO MY RECOLLECTION, A FEW OF THEM, 21 TEN . 22 Q. IS THERE ANY OTHER BASIS THEY WERE 23 WITHHELD, OTHER THAN THEY WERE PROTECTED BY THE 24 -PHILADELPHIA PROTECTIVE ORDER? 25 A. THOSE PARTICULAR DOCUMENTS, NO. 64 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. AND ARE THERE ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS 2 THAT RELATE, REFER, OR PERTAIN TO TEXAS EASTERN 3 THAT WERE WITHHELD ON ANY OTHER BASIS, OTHER THAN 4 5REY ARE PROTECTED BY THE PROTECTIVE ORDER? 5 A. YES. 6 Q. ON WHAT BASIS? 7 A. RELEVANCE. 8 Q. ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT WE SHOULD 9 TAKE YOUR WORD ABOUT WHAT IS RELEVANT TO THE 10 CASE? 11 MR. PREUSS: OBJECTION; 12 ARGUMENTATIVE. . 13 I WILL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. 14 BY MS. WELCH: 15 Q. YOU CAN GO AHEAD. 16 MR. PREUSS: I INSTRUCTED HIM NOT 17 TO. 18 MS. WELCH: AGAIN, MR. PREUSS, AS I 19 AM SURE YOU KNOW, UNDER CALIFORNIA LAW THE ONLY 20 BASIS TO INSTRUCT IS THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT 21 PRIVILEGE. 22 MR. PREUSS: JUST RESTATE THE 23 QUESTION, AND WE WILL MOVE ON. 24 "BY MS . WELCH: 25 Q. HOW WERE THESE DOCUMENTS NOT 65 WATER PCB-l 1 RELEVANT? 2 A. WELL, MISS WELCH, SIMPLY BECAUSE A 3 DOCUMENT HAD IN IT THE NAME TEXAS EASTERN DIDN'T 4 MEAN THAT IT WAS. RESPONSIVE TO ANY OF THE 5 CATEGORIES OF DEMANDS THAT YOU MADE HERE. 6 Q. WELL, WHAT WENT INTO THE 7 DETERMINATION OF WHAT WAS RELEVANT AND WHAT WAS 8 NOT RELEVANT? 9 A. THAT WOULD DEPEND UPON A 10 DEMAND-BY-DEMAND EXAMINATION OF THE REQUEST. 11 Q. I AM SPECIFICALLY REFERRING TO THE 12 TEXAS EASTERN DOCUMENTS. 13 A. WHAT I AM TELLING YOU IS THAT THERE 14 WAS NO OVERALL GENERAL DETERMINATION THAT I COULD 15 STATE TO YOU WITH RESPECT TO TEXAS EASTERN 16 DOCUMENTS. 17 WE PROCEEDED TO ANSWER THIS 18 DISCOVERY REQUEST BY EXAMINING EACH REQUEST , AND 19 DETERMINING WHAT DOCUMENTS WERE RESPONSIVE WITHIN 20 THE PARAMETERS THAT WE SET. 21 AS WE STATED IN THE RESPONSE, 22 DOCUMENTS THAT DID NOT FALL WITHIN THOSE 23 PARAMETERS WERE NOT PRODUCED, BECAUSE THEY WERE 24 -NOT RELEVANT. 25 Q. AND APPROXIMATELY WHAT QUANTITY OF 66 WATER PCB-l 1 DOCUMENTS THAT REFER, RELATE, OR PERTAIN TO TEXAS 2 EASTERN WERE WITHHELD ON THE BASIS OF YOUR 3 DETERMINATION OF RELEVANCY? 4 A. I DON'T KNOW THE NUMBER OF THOSE 5 DOCUMENTS. 6 Q. FEWER THAN FIVE? 7 A. I DON'T KNOW. 8 Q . WHO WOULD KNOW? 9 A. I DON'T THINK ANYONE AT THIS POINT 10 HAS THAT KNOWLEDGE IN HIS OR HER MIND. 11 Q. ARE THOSE DOCUMENTS SEGREGATED AT 12 THIS POINT? 13 A. NO. 14 Q. SO THOSE DOCUMENTS THAT YOU 15 DETERMINED TO EXCLUDE FROM THIS DOCUMENT REQUEST 16 PRODUCTION ARE NOT SEGREGATED ANYWHERE. 17 A. WE DETERMINED WHICH DOCUMENTS WOULD 18 BE RELEVANT WITHIN THE PAREMETER OF OUR RESPONSE, 19 AND WE EXAMINED AND PRODUCED THOSE. 20 Q. WELL, OBVIOUSLY YOU KNOWABOUT A 21 SECRET SET OF DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE, REFER, OR 22 PERTAIN TO TEXAS EASTERN. YOU REFERRED TO TEN 23 DOCUMENTS. 24 AND I AM ASKING WHERE ARE THOSE 25 DOCUMENTS? 67 WATER PCB-l 1 MR. PREUSS: TEN DOCUMENTS? 2 MS. WELCH: YES. 3 THE WITNESS: THOSE TEN DOCUMENTS 4 ARE IN ST. LOUIS. 5 BY MS. WELCH: 6 Q. WERE THEY PUT BACK INTO THE GENERAL 7 DOCUMENT POOL, OR ARE THEY SEGREGATED? 8 A. I THINK WE PROBABLY HAVE A FILE. 9 THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE APPENDICED TO DR. HATTON'S 10 DEPOSITION. THAT WAS THE TEXAS EASTERN INSURANCE 11 LITIGATION. 12 Q. EACH ONE OF THOSE TEN DOCUMENTS IS 13 APPENDICED TO THAT? 14 A. YES. 15 ^ Q. LET'S TALK ABOUT OUR PROTECTIVE 16 ORDER, THAT'S COVERED BY OBJECTION NO. 12. 17 HAVE YOU SOUGHT OUT COUNSEL FOR 18 TEXAS EASTERN WITH RESPECT TO THE PROTECTIVE 19 ORDER, TO REQUEST THAT YOU BE ENABLED TO PRODUCE 20 THOSE DOCUMENTS TO US? 21 A. I DID NOT, BUT ONE OF THE LAWYERS 22 THAT WORKS WITH ME ON THE LITIGATION ACTUALLY DID 23 CALL WASHINGTON D.C., AND WAS ADVISED BY THAT . 24 -COUNSEL, WHOSE NAME I CAN'T RECALL AT THE MOMENT, 25 THAT TEXAS EASTERN WAS NOT WILLING TO WAIVE THE 68 WATER PCB-l 1 PROTECTIVE ORDER TO PERMIT US TO PRODUCE THOSE 2 DOCUMENTS. 3 Q. AND IS THE QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS ANY 4 LARGER THAN THAT GROUP OF TEN? 5 A. THE WHAT? 6 Q. WHAT IS THE QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS? 7 A. WELL, THAT'S WHAT I AM TRYING TO 8 FIGURE OUT. I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU ARE TALKING 9 ABOUT, WHAT GROUP OF DOCUMENTS YOU ARE REFERRING 10 TO RIGHT NOW. 11 THE TEN DOCUMENTS THAT I WAS 12 REFERRING TO ARE THE EXHIBITS WHICH WERE 13 INTRODUCED AT DR. HATTON'S DEPOSITION, AS TO 14 WHICH HE TESTIFIED. 15 THAT DEPOSITION AND THOSE EXHIBITS 16 ARE COVERED BY THE PROTECTIVE ORDER IN THE TEXAS 17 EASTERN INSURANCE LITIGATION. THOSE ARE THE ONLY 18 DOCUMENTS THAT ARE COVERED BY THAT PROTECTIVE 19 ORDER. 20 Q. THAT'S WHAT I ASKED, REFERRING TO 21 OBJECTION NO. 12. 22 A. RIGHT. 23 Q. IS THERE ANY GREATER SET OF 24 -DOCUMENTS THAT THIS OBJECTION REFERS TO, OTHER 25 THAN THOSE TEN DOCUMENTS? 69 WATER PCB-l 1 A NO, MA'AM 2 Q. WERE ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS PRODUCED IN 3 THAT LITIGATION, PRODUCED BY MONSANTO? 4-- 5 A Q. ASIDE FROM THOSE TEN DOCUMENTS? YES . 6 A. WELL, YES. 7 BUT THE TEN DOCUMENTS THAT I AM 8 REFERRING TO ARE NOT ALL MONSANTO DOCUMENTS. 9 SOME OF THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE TEXAS EASTERN 10 DOCUMENTS. 11 Q. I SEE. WHAT QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS 12 WAS PRODUCED, AS A WHOLE, IN THIS LITIGATION? 13 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. 14 I'D HAVE TO GO BACK AND LOOK AT OUR FILE. 15 Q. DOES THE PROTECTIVE ORDER COVER 16 THOSE OTHER DOCUMENTS? 17 A. LET ME EXPLAIN IT. 18 IN THIS CASE I WOULD NOT OBJECT, ON 19 THE BASIS OF THE TEXAS EASTERN PROTECTIVE ORDER, 20 TO PRODUCING IN RESPONSE TO THIS DEMAND DOCUMENTS 21 WHICH WERE WITHIN THAT SET, BUT WHICH WERE 22 ALREADY IN MONSANTO'S POSSESSION PRIOR TO BEING 23 PRODUCED IN THAT CASE. 24 - THE TEN DOCUMENTS THAT I REFER TO 25 ARE DOCUMENTS THAT I DID NOT HAVE OTHERWISE IN 70 WATER PCB-l 1 THE MONSANTO PCB DOCUMENT ARCHIVES THOSE 2 DOCUMENTS CAME FROM TEXAS EASTERN. 3 AND THEREFORE, I FELT THAT I COULD 4 NOT, CONSISTENT WITH MY OBLIGATION UNDER THAT 5 PROTECTIVE ORDER, PRODUCE THOSE DOCUMENTS. 6 BUT I HAVE NOT WITHHELD ANY 7 DOCUMENTS THAT OTHERWISE APPEAR IN THE MONSANTO 8 ARCHIVE. 9 Q. SO THE DOCUMENTS THAT YOU ARE 10 REFERRING TO IN THIS OBJECTION NO. 12 ARE TEXAS 11 EASTERN DOCUMENTS THAT MONSANTO ONLY HAS IN ITS 12 POSSESSION BECAUSE THEY WERE PRODUCED IN THE 13 COURSE OF LITIGATION. 14 A. MOST OF THOSE DOCUMENTS, YES. 15 THERE ARE ONE OR TWO DOCUMENTS THERE 16 WHICH ARE MONSANTO DOCUMENTS, THAT I DON'T 17 OTHERWISE HAVE, THAT I SAW FOR THE FIRST TIME -- 18 THAT MONSANTO SAW FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THE 19 COURSE OF DR. HATTON'S DEPOSITION. THERE ARE ONE 20 OR TWO OF THOSE. 21 Q. WHERE DO THOSE COME FROM? 22 A. I ASSUME THEY CAME FROM TEXAS 23 EASTERN FILES. 24 - Q. AND DO WE HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS? 25 A. I DON'T KNOW. THEY WERE NOT 71 WATER PCB-i 1 PRODUCED BY MONSANTO IN RESPONSE TO YOUR 2 DISCOVERY REQUEST. 3 Q. BECAUSE OF OBJECTION NO. 12. 4_ A. BECAUSE OF OBJECTION NO. 12. 5 Q. ALL RIGHT. ARE YOU PREPARED TO 6 PRODUCE THOSE DOCUMENTS WHICH ARE MONSANTO 7 DOCUMENTS AT THIS TIME? 8 A. NOT ABSENT RELIEF FROM THE 9 PROTECTIVE ORDER. I WILL NOT PUT MONSANTO IN 10 VIOLATION OF THAT PROTECTIVE ORDER. 11 MS. WELCH: OFF THE RECORD. 12 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD.) 13 BY MS. WELCH: 14 Q. IN THE PROCESS OF SEARCHING FOR 15 DOCUMENTS, DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS 16 RELATING TO PRODUCTS THAT CONTAIN PCB'S OTHER 17 THAN MSC-153, OS-81, TURBINOL 123, OR PYDRAUL, 18 p-Y-D-R-A-U-L, AC? 19 A. LET ME MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND YOUR 20 QUESTION. DID WE SELL PRODUCTS OTHER THAN THOSE 21 YOU ENUMERATED? 22 Q. THAT'S CORRECT. 23 A. YES, WE DID. 24 ~ Q. COULD YOU TELL ME WHAT OTHER 25 TURBINOL PRODUCTS MONSANTO SOLD THAT CONTAIN 72 WATER PCB-l 1 PCS ' S 2 A. WITHOUT REFERRING TO BROCHURES THAT 3 LIST THOSE DOCUMENTS -- 4~ 5 Q. A. I ASKED YOU FOR PRODUCTS. I'M SORRY, I MISSPOKE. 6 WITHOUT REFERRING TO BROCHURES THAT 7 LIST THOSE PRODUCTS, I COULD NOT ENUMERATE THOSE 8 PRODUCTS FROM MEMORY. I WOULD HAVE TO REFER TO 9 PRODUCT CATEGORY LISTS. 10 Q. DO WE HAVE A PRODUCT BROCHURE? 11 A. I DON'T KNOW. YOU HAVE A BROCHURE 12 FOR TURBINOL 153. 13 Q. I AM CONCERNED WITH BROCHURES THAT 14 LIST OTHER TURBINOL PRODUCTS. 15 A. AS I SIT HERE, WITHOUT LOOKING , I 16 DON'T KNOW WHETHER SUCH A BROCHURE WAS PRODUCED. 17 Q. DOES SUCH A BROCHURE EXIST? 18 A. I BELIEVE WE HAVE ONE, YES. 19 Q. COULD WE HAVE THAT DOCUMENT. 20 A. I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THAT. IF YOU 21 DON'T HAVE IT, I WILL MAKE IT AVAILABLE. 22 MS. WELCH: AFTER THE DEPOSITIONS 23 TODAY, PERHAPS WE CAN HAVE A MEETING AND DISCUSS 24 "ANY OUTSTANDING MATTERS THAT OCCUR IN THE COURSE 25 OF EITHER DEPOSITION. 73 WATER PCB-l 1 MR . PREUSS: SURE. WE ARE SUPPOSED 2 TO HAVE A MEETING ANYWAY. 3 MS. WELCH: YES, WE ARE. 4 Q. IS THERE A BROCHURE THAT CONTAINS A 5 LIST OF ALL PRODUCTS THAT MONSANTO SOLD THAT 6 CONTAIN PCB'S? 7 A. NO SINGLE BROCHURE. 8 Q. IS THERE A SERIES OF BROCHURES OR IS 9 THERE A NUMBER OF BROCHURES THAT CONTAIN THAT 10 INFORMATION? 11 A. THERE ARE A NUMBER OF BROCHURES 12 WHICH, IF ASSEMBLED, WOULD GIVE THAT INFORMATION. 13 Q. COULD WE HAVE THAT DOCUMENT. 14 A. I WILL TAKE THAT REQUEST UNDER 15 ADVISEMEANT. 16 Q. NOW, GOING BACK TO THE QUESTION OF 17 WHETHER YOU EXCLUDED DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO 18 PRODUCTS OTHER THAN THOSE WE JUST ENUMERATED, DID 19 YOU EXCLUDE ANY THAT RELATE TO OTHER PRODUCTS? 20 A. YES, MA'AM. 21 Q. AND ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU EXCLUDE 22 THOSE? 23 A. THOSE PRODUCTS WERE NOT SOLD TO 24 -TEXAS EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN. 25 Q. WILL YOU PRODUCE THOSE DOCUMENTS TO 74 WATER PCB-l 1 US AT THIS TIME. 2 A. NO, MA'AM. 3 Q. WHAT QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS DOES THAT 4 INVOLVE, APPROXIMATELY? 5 A. A GREAT, GREAT MANY. WE ARE TALKING 6 ABOUT HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PAGES OF DOCUMENTS 7 POTENTIALLY RESPONSIVE TO THE DEMAND THAT YOU 8 HAVE MADE HERE, WHICH ENCOMPASS ALL PCB'S 9 PRODUCTS. 10 Q. HOW ABOUT TURBINOL PRODUCTS, WHAT 11 QUANTITY OF PRODUCTS ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? 12 A. I WOULD HAVE TO ASK MY STAFF. I 13 DON'T KNOW. 14 Q. AGAIN, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT I WOULD 15 REQUEST THAT YOU ASK THE STAFF. 16 A. WE WILL CONSIDER THAT. 17 Q. IN THE SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS, DID 18 YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS BECAUSE THE 19 TERM, QUOTE, "TURBINOL OR OTHER PCB-CONTAINING 20 GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS VAGUE? 21 A. NO, NOT SPECIFICALLY ON THAT 22 GROUND. QUITE FRANKLY, WE WERE A LITTLE CONFUSED 23 BY THAT. 24 - WE DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER PCB PRODUCT 25 THAT WAS USED AS A GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANT, 75 WATER PCB-0003! 1 OTHER THAN THOSE THREE. 2 Q. HOW ABOUT THE BROCHURES THAT DISCUSS 3 OTHER TURBINOL PRODUCTS, ARE THERE BROCHURES THAT 4 DISCUSS OTHER TURBINOL PRODUCTS? 5 A. I'D HAVE TO LOOK AND SEE. I DON'T 6 KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. 7 TURBINOL 153 IS THE ONE THAT WE ARE 8 AWARE OF, THAT WAS USED AS A GAS COMPRESSOR 9 LUBRICANT. 10 Q. WERE THERE ANY OTHER TURBINOLS THAT 11 WERE SOLD TO ANY OTHER PIPELINES, BESIDES 12 TRANSWESTERN, THAT YOU ARE AWARE OF? 13 A. WOULD YOU RESTATE THAT. 14 Q. WERE THERE ANY OTHER TURBINOLS 15 CONTAINING PCB'S THAT WERE SOLD TO PIPELINES, 16 BESIDES TRANSWESTERN? 17 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. 18 Q. WHO WOULD KNOW THAT? 19 A. IT COULD BE DETERMINED FROM MONSANTO 20 RECORDS. 21 Q. DO WE HAVE THOSE RECORDS? 22 A. NO, MA'AM. 23 Q. COULD WE GET THOSE RECORDS. 24 A. NOT AT PRESENT. 25 Q. WHY NOT? 76 WATER PCB-l 1 A. WELL, I WOULD DECLINE TO PRODUCE 2 THEM TO YOU AT THIS POINT. 3 Q. ON WHAT GROUND? 4~ A. ON THE GROUNDS OF RELEVANCE AND THE 5 FACT THAT SALES TO OTHER CUSTOMERS SIMPLY HAVE 6 NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS CASE. 7 Q. WELL, YOU STATED THAT YOU HAD SOME 8 CONFUSION ABOUT WHAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 9 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" MEANT. 10 DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 11 THAT BASIS? 12 A. NO, MA'AM. 13 Q. ALL RIGHT . IN THE SEARCH FOR 14 DOCUMENTS, DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE ANY 15 DOCUMENTS RELATING TO ANY OTHER CUSTOMERS OR 16 PERSONS, BESIDES PLAINTIFF? 17 A. AS A GENERAL MATTER, WE DID NOT 18 PRODUCE DOCUMENTS RELATING TO SALES TO OTHER 19 CUSTOMERS, THAT'S CORRECT. 20 Q. DID YOU PRODUCE DOCUMENTS RELATING 21 TO TEXAS EASTERN? 22 A. WE DID. 23 Q. ALL DOCUMENTS BESIDES THOSE THAT YOU 24 DESCRIBED. 25 A. ALL DOCUMENTS THAT WERE RELEVANT AND 77 WATER PCB-l 1 RESPONSIVE TO THE DEMAND, YES, I DID. 2 AS I SAID BEFORE, WE DID NOT PRODUCE 3 IN RESPONSE TO DISCOVERY REQUESTS EVERY DOCUMENT 4 WJTHIN OUR ARCHIVE THAT MAKES MENTION OF TEXAS 5 EASTERN. 6 Q. BUT YOU TESTIFIED EARLIER THAT THAT 7 QUANTITY WAS TEN OR LESS. 8 A. NO, MA'AM. I TESTIFIED EARLIER THAT 9 THE NUMBER OF DOCUMENTS THAT WERE WITHHELD ON THE 10 BASIS OF THE PROTECTIVE ORDER WERE TEN OR LESS, 11 AND THOSE TEN WERE THE ONLY DOCUMENTS THAT WE HAD 12 WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS. 13 Q. ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU EXCLUDE OTHER 14 DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO TEXAS EASTERN? 15 A. LACK OF RELEVANCE AND NOT RESPONSIVE 16 TO THE DEMAND. 17 Q. HOW DID YOU DETERMINE WHETHER A 18 DOCUMENT WAS RELEVANT OR RESPONSIVE TO A DEMAND? 19 A. AS I STATED, OUR THEN GENERAL 20 METHODS IN PRODUCING DOCUMENTS IN THE ACTION WAS 21 DETERMINED BY THE PARAMETERS FOR THE SEARCH THAT 22 WOULD BE PRODUCING DOCUMENTS POTENTIALLY 23 RESPONSIVE WITHIN THE PARAMETERS THAT WE SET FOR 24 THE SEARCH, AND RESPONSIVE DOCUMENTS WERE 25 PRODUCED. 78 WATER PCB-l 1 WE DID NOT CONDUCT A SEARCH WHICH 2 WOULD HAVE ENCOMPASSED THE REVIEW OF EV^RY SINGLE 3 DOCUMENT THAT MAY HAVE MENTIONED TEXAS EASTERN. 4 Q. ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU EXCLUDE 5 DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED TO OTHER CUSTOMERS? 6 A. PRIMARILY, LACK OF RELEVANCE. 7 Q. AND AGAIN, I WILL ASK THE QUESTION. 8 ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU DETERMINE RELEVANCE OF A 9 DOCUMENT THAT RELATED TO OTHER CUSTOMERS? 10 A. I'M NOT SURE I UNDERSTAND THE 11 QUESTION. 12 Q. WELL, IT'S A VERY SIMPLE QUESTION. 13 HOW DID YOU DETERMINE THAT DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED 14 TO OTHER CUSTOMERS WERE NOT RELEVANT TO THIS 15 DOCUMENT REQUEST? 16 A. WELL, FROM EXAMINING, FIRST OF ALL , 17 THE DOCUMENT DEMAND. 18 AND SECOND OF ALL, IT'S OUR POSITION 19 IN THIS CASE THAT THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE NOT 20 RELEVANT. 21 Q. THAT'S RESTATING A CONCLUSION. 22 ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU DETERMINE, DID 23 YOU CONTEND, THEY ARE NOT RELEVANT? 24 A. BECAUSE WHAT IS RELEVANT IS WHAT HAS 25 TO DO WITH TEXAS EASTERN, AND FROM TRANSWESTERN 79 WATER PCB-l 1 IN THIS CASE, NOT WHAT HAS TO DO WITH MONSANTO, 2 MONSANTO'S OTHER CUSTOMERS FOR OTHER PRODUCTS. 3 Q. ALL RIGHT. DID YOU EVER CONSIDER 4 THAT WHAT WAS RELEVANT TO THIS CASE FROM THE 5 DOCUMENT REQUEST WAS DOCUMENTS THAT PERTAIN TO 6 PCB-CONTAINING PRODUCTS? 7 A. I BELIEVE THAT'S FAR TOO BROAD. 8 Q. I WANT TO TURN TO OBJECTION NO. 10 . 9 A. YES. 10 Q. DID YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDEDOCUMENTS 11 ON THE BASIS OF OBJECTION NO. 10? 12 A. I DON'T BELIEVE SO. 13 Q. HOW ABOUT OBJECTION 11, DID YOUR 14 SEARCHERS EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS ON THE BASIS OF 15 OBJECTION NO. 11? 16 A. THAT WAS AN ADDITIONALREASON FOR 17 EXCLUDING DOCUMENTS WHICH RELATED TO OTHER PCB 18 PRODUCTS AND OTHER CUSTOMERS OF MONSANTO FOR PCB 19 PRODUCTS. 20 AS I SAID BEFORE, THERE ARE 21 LITERALLY HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PAGES OF SUCH 22 DOCUMENTS. 23 Q. SO TWO CATEGORIES OF DOCUMENTS THAT 24 -WERE WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS ARE OTHER CUSTOMERS 25 AND OTHER PRODUCTS. , 80 WATER PCB-l 1 A PRIMARILY 2 Q. WHAT SECONDLY? 3 A. I CAN'T THINK RIGHT NOW OF ANY OTHER 4 CATEGORIES OF DOCUMENTS THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN 5 WITHHELD ON - 6 WELL, YES, THERE IS. THERE IS THE 7 PUBLIC DOMAIN DOCUMENTS, ALSO. 8 AGAIN, THE SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE 9 RELATING TO PCB'S IS LARGE, VERY LARGE, AND IT 10 WOULD HAVE BEEN EXCEEDINGLY BURDENSOME TO REQUIRE 11 MONSANTO TO PRODUCE ALL OF THAT INFORMATION. 12 Q. SO WE HAVE CUSTOMER, PRODUCT, AND 13 SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE. 14 WAS ANYTHING ELSE WITHHELD ON THE 15 GROUND OF THIS OBJECTION? 16 A. NOT THAT I RECALL AT THE MOMENT, 17 MA'AM. 18 Q. IN YOUR SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS, DID 19 YOUR SEARCHERS EXCLUDE ANY DOCUMENTS FOR THE 20 REASONS THAT ARE ARTICULATED IN OBJECTION NO. 13? 21 A. YES . 22 Q. WHAT WAS THAT CATEGORY OF DOCUMENTS? 23 A. THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE PRIMARILY 24 HDOCUMENTS THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN IN OUR POSSESSION 25 OR IN THE POSSESSION OF OUR OUTSIDE COUNSEL AS 81 WATER PCB-l 1 THE RESULT OF DISCOVERY IN OTHER CASES. 2 THESE WOULD NOT BE DOCUMENTS WHICH 3 RELATE TO MONSANTO'S BUSINESS OF MANUFACTURING 4 AND SELLING PCB'S, BUT WITH RESPECT TO OTHER _ 5 ENTITIES. 6 Q NON-MONSANTO ENTITIES. 7 A. NON-MONSANTO ENTITIES. 8 Q. AND ARE THOSE DOCUMENTS KEPT 9 SEGREGATED IN ST. LOUIS? 10 A. VERY FEW OF THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE. 11 Q. ARE THEY KEPT AT OUTSIDE COUNSEL? 12 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 13 Q. AND ARE THEY DOCUMENTS THAT MONSANTO 14 DID NOT PRODUCE, BUT OTHER PARTIES HAVE PRODUCED? 15 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 16 MS. WELCH: WHY DON'T WE BREAK UNTIL 17 11:00 0'CLOCK. 18 (RECESS TAKEN.) 19 MS. WELCH: BACK ON THE RECORD. 20 Q. RETURNING AGAIN TO EXHIBIT 4, WHICH 21 IS THE RESPONSE OF MONSANTO COMPANY TO 22 PLAINTIFF'S DOCUMENT REQUEST. 23 A. YES. 24 ~ Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO PAGE 5 25 OF THAT RESPONSE, MR. BISTLINE. 82 WATER PCB-l 1 A. YES. 2 Q. THE FOLLOWING SERIES OF QUESTIONS 3 RELATE TO THE RESPONSE TO QUESTION NO. 1. 4_ WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THESE 5 DOCUMENTS? 6 A. IN OUR PCB DOCUMENT ARCHIVE. 7 Q. DID YOU DO A SEARCH ON THE COMPUTER, 8 AND THEN A HARD SEARCH, AS WELL? 9 A. YES. 10 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 11 ON ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 12 A. NO. 13 Q. IS THERE ANYWHERE ELSE THAT 14 DOCUMENTS THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST 15 WOULD BE, BESIDES IN YOUR ARCHIVE? 16 A. NOTTHAT I AM AWARE OF. 17 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 18 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 19 RELEVANT? 20 A. NO, WE DIDN'T WITHHOLD ANY 21 DOCUMENTS, IF YOU LOOK AT OUR RESPONSE. IF WE 22 HAD WITHHELD DOCUMENTS, IT WOULD BE NOTED. 23 Q. SO NO DOCUMENTS WEREWITHHELD THAT 24 -ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST. 25 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 83 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO REQUEST 2 NO. 2, AND ALL OF THE FOLLOWING QUESTIONS RELATE 3 TO THAT SPECIFIC REQUEST. 4_ AGAIN, I MIGHT ASK YOU WHERE DID YOU 5 SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO 6 REQUEST NO. 2? 7 A. THE MONSANTO PCB ARCHIVE. 8 Q. AND THAT IS THE SAME AS THE EARLIER 9 RESPONSE. 10 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 11 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 12 EXIST, WHICH ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST, THAT 13 EXIST ANYWHERE ELSE, BESIDES THE ARCHIVE? 14 A. NO, MA'AM. 15 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 16 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE IN RESPONSE TO 17 THIS REQUEST? 18 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 19 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 20 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 21 RELEVANT? 22 A. ONLY TO THIS EXTENT, AND THAT IS TO 23 THE EXTENT THAT IT IS OVERLY BROAD RELATING TO 24 ANY COMMUNICATION BETWEEN MONSANTO AND TEXAS 25 EASTERN, AND WOULD SEEK TO INCLUDE ANY DOCUMENT 84 WATER PCB-l 1 IN ANY MONSANTO ARCHIVE THAT PERTAINS TO TEXAS 2 EASTERN IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. 3 THAT WE PRODUCED -- SEARCHED FOR AND 4 PRODUCED ALL DOCUMENTS THAT WE COULD FIND THAT 5 RELATED TO COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSANTO AND 6 TEXAS EASTERN INVOLVING PCB'S. 7 Q. WELL, INDEED, THAT IS WHAT THE 8 REQUEST CALLS FOR. IT CALLS FOR ALL 9 COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN THESE TWO ENTITIES THAT 10 RELATE TO OR INVOLVE PCB'S IN ANY WAY, DIRECTLY 11 OR INDIRECTLY. 12 CAN YOU REPRESENT - 13 A. AND IT IS THE CONCERN WE HAVE ABOUT 14 THE PHRASE "RELATING TO OR INVOLVING" AND THE 15 PHRASE "DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY" THAT CAUSES MY 16 CONCERN. 17 Q. ALL RIGHT. WHAT QUANTITY OF 18 DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD BASED ON THAT CONCERN? 19 A. AGAIN, THIS WAS NOT APPROACHED ON 20 THE BASIS OF EXCLUDING DOCUMENTS. WE LOOKED AT 21 WHAT DOCUMENTS WE FELT WERE FAIRLY RESPONSIVE TO 22 THE DEMAND, AND PRODUCED THOSE DOCUMENTS. WE 23 DIDN'T SEEK TO EXCLUDE. 24 _ Q. HOW DID YOU DETERMINE WHETHER A 25 DOCUMENT THAT REPRESENTED A COMMUNICATION BETWEEN 85 WATER PCB-l 1 MONSANTO AND TEXAS EASTERN WAS NOT RESPONSIVE TO 2 THIS REQUEST OR WAS NOT -- EXCUSE ME, LET ME 3 REPHRASE THAT -- WAS NOT RELEVANT TO THE REQUEST? 4~ MR. PREUSS: ASSUMING HE DID. _ 5 BY MS. WELCH: 6 Q. BASED ON WHAT YOU JUST TOLD ME. 7 A. THE WAY IT WAS APPROACHED WAS NOT, 8 AGAIN, EXCLUDING, BUT LOOKING AT DOCUMENTS WHICH 9 WE FELT WERE LIKELY TO BE RESPONSIVE, POTENTIALLY 10 RESPONSIVE, AND PRODUCING THOSE. 11 AGAIN, AS I SAID BEFORE, AS A BROAD 12 GENERAL MATTER, WE PRODUCED DOCUMENTS WHICH 13 REFLECTED, OR CONTAINED, OR RELATED TO 14 COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSANTO AND TEXAS EASTERN 15 RELATING TO PCB. 16 WE DID NOT ATTEMPT TO REVIEW AND 17 PRODUCE EVERY DOCUMENT THAT WE HAD IN THE 18 COLLECTION THAT MAY HAVE MENTIONED TEXAS EASTERN. 19 Q. WHAT KINDS OF OTHER DOCUMENTS EXIST 20 THAT REFLECT OR RELATE TO COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN 21 TEXAS EASTERN AND MONSANTO, THAT WERE NOT 22 PRODUCED? 23 A. NONE THAT I AM AWARE OF. 24 Q. SO ARE WE TALKING ABOUT SOPHISTRY OR 25 ABOUT AN ACTUAL QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS? 86 WATER PCB-l 1 A. IT MAY BE MORE SEMANTICS THAN AN 2 ACTUAL DISPUTE, AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED. AND AS 3 FAR AS I KNOW, ANY DOCUMENT THAT REFLECTS OR 4 RELATES TO COMMUNICATIONS ABOUT PCB'S BETWEEN 5 MONSANTO AND TEXAS EASTERN HAS BEEN PRODUCED. 6 Q. HOW ABOUT DOCUMENTS THAT REFLECT 7 PCB'S DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY? 8 A. I AM NOT SURE WHAT YOU MEAN BY 9 "REFLECT PCB'S DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY." 10 Q. WELL, FOR EXAMPLE, ARE THERE 11 COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN TEXAS EASTERN AND MONSANTO 12 THAT HAVE NOT BEEN PRODUCED? 13 A. TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO. 14 Q. ALL RIGHT. THEN IN OTHER WORDS, NO 15 DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD ON THE BASIS OF RELEVANCY 16 IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST. 17 A. I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENT 18 REFLECTING COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSANTO AND 19 TEXAS EASTERN, THAT HAD TO DO WITH PCB'S, THAT 20 HAS BEEN WITHHELD. 21 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS IN 22 RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST ON THE BASIS THAT THERE 23 WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 24 - A. I DON'T THINK SO. 25 Q. DO YOU KNOW? I DON'T WANT YOU TO 87 WATER PCB-l 1 GUESS. 2 A. MY RECOLLECTION IS THAT THERE IS 3 NOT. 4 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS IN 5 RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST BECAUSE THOSE DOCUMENTS 6 WERE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 7 A. ONCE AGAIN, IF A DOCUMENT WAS OF A 8 TYPE TO OBJECT TO, IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN, FOR 9 EXAMPLE, PUBLISHED SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE OR A 10 GOVERNMENT DOCUMENT, WE DIDN'T NECESSARILY REVIEW 11 IT TO SEE WHETHER IT FIT WITHIN ANY PARTICULAR 12 REQUEST HERE. 13 THAT WAS A CATEGORICAL DECISION THAT 14 WAS MADE AT THE OUTSET, THAT WE WEREN'T GOING TO 15 PRODUCE THOSE DOCUMENTS BECAUSE THEY WERE EQUALLY 16 AVAILABLE TO YOU AS THEY WERE TO US. 17 Q. WHY DID YOU MAKE THE ASSUMPTION THAT 18 THEY WERE EQUALLY AVAILABLE TO US, IF YOU HAVE AN 19 ARCHIVE REPRESENTING PCB PRODUCTS? 20 A. I DON'T HAVE A COMPLETE COLLECTION 21 OF PUBLIC DOMAIN DOCUMENTS RELATING TO PCB'S . 22 Q. DO YOU HAVE SOME PUBLIC DOMAIN 23 DOCUMENTS? 24 _ A. THERE ARE DOCUMENTS WITHIN THAT 25 ARCHIVE THAT ARE GENERALLY AVAILABLE, YES, 88 WATER PCB-00035 1 SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE, SOME GOVERNMENT DOCUMENTS 2 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD THOSE DOCUMENTS ON 3 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE EQUALLY AVAILABLE TO US? 4_ A. THAT IS CORRECT. . 5 Q. WHAT QUANTITY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? 6 A. I DON'T KNOW. 7 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS, 8 AGAIN WITH REFERENCE TO REQUEST NO. 2, BECAUSE 9 THEY INVOLVED THE PRACTICES OR PROCEDURES OF 10 OTHER PARTIES TO THE ACTION? 11 A. NO, MA'AM. 12 Q. I BELIEVE THAT YOU ANSWERED IN THE 13 GENERAL OBJECTION THAT NO DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD 14 ON THE BASIS OF THAT OBJECTION, SO I AM JUST 15 CONFIRMING THAT AT THIS TIME. 16 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 17 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS IN 18 RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST ON THE BASIS THAT THEY 19 WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED AFTER 1977 ? 20 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 21 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 22 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 23 REQUEST? 24 - A. NO . 25 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 89 WATER PCB-l 1 RELATED TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OC-81, MCS-153, 2 TURBINOL 153 , OR PYDRAUL AC? AGAIN, WITH 3 REFERENCE TO REQUEST NO. 2. 4 __ A. NOT. THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO. 5 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS, 6 AGAIN WITHRESPECT TO REQUEST NO. 2, ON THE 7 GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 8 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 9 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 10 A. NO, MA'AM. 11 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 12 THE GROUND THAT THEY SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 13 CUSTOMERS OR PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 14 A. I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 15 WERE WITHHELD ON THAT GROUND. 16 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 17 THE GROUND THAT ANY PROTECTIVE ORDER PROHIBITS 18 MONSANTO FROM DISCLOSING SUCH DOCUMENTS? 19 A. I WOULD HAVE TO LOOK BACK AT THOSE 20 PARTICULAR DOCUMENTS TO DETERMINE WHETHER THOSE 21 DOCUMENTS FALL WITHIN THE SCOPE OF THIS. 22 BUT I BELIEVE THAT TWO DOCUMENTS 23 THAT ARE MONSANTO DOCUMENTS, THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE 24 -PREVIOUSLY, ARE COMMUNICATIONS FROM MONSANTO TO 25 TEXAS EASTERN. BUT I'D HAVE TO CONFIRM THAT. 90 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. AND DID YOU DETERMINE THAT THE ONLY 2 WAY THAT YOU OBTAINED THOSE DOCUMENTS WAS THROUGH 3 THAT LITIGATION? 4_ A. THAT'S CORRECT. 5 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 6 THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO IN 7 THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS DURING THE TIME 8 WHEN MONSANTO WAS MANUFACTURING AND SELLING 9 PRODUCTS CONTAINING PCB'S? 10 A. NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO. 11 Q. WELL, EXCEPT THOSE TWO DOCUMENTS 12 WERE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE NOT KEPT WITHIN THE 13 REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS. WOULDN'T THEY FALL 14 WITHIN THAT CATEGORY, AS WELL? 15 A. WELL, WE DIDN'T HAVE THEM. THOSE 16 ARE NOT DOCUMENTS THAT WE HAD IN OUR POSSESSION 17 IN THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS. 18 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 19 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "COMMUNICATIONS" IS 20 OVERLY BROAD? 21 A. NO. 22 Q. HOW ABOUT ON THE GROUND THAT THE 23 TERM "COMMUNICATIONS" IS VAGUE? 24 - A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO. 25 Q. HOW ABOUT THAT THE TERM 91 WATER PCB-l 1 "COMMUNICATIONS" IS AMBIGUOUS? 2 A. I AM NOT AWARE OP ANY, NO. 3 Q. DID YOU REVIEW ANY OTHER CUSTOMER 4 FJLES FOR DOCUMENTS RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST, 5 OTHER THAN TEXAS EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN? 6 MR. PREUSS: JUST FOR THE RECORD, IT 7 ASKED FOR COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN TEXAS EASTERN, 8 AND NOT OTHER CUSTOMERS. 9 MS. WELCH: WELL, I AM REFERRING TO 10 YOUR OBJECTION HERE. THAT'S HOW I DRAFTED THIS 11 QUESTION. 12 "MONSANTO FURTHER OBJECTS TO 13 THIS REQUEST TO THE EXTENT THAT IT 14 WOULD REQUIRE MONSANTO TO REVIEW ALL 15 OF ITS FILES REGARDING OTHER 16 CUSTOMERS TO SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS 17 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST." 18 I DID NOT UNDERSTAND THIS 19 OBJECTION. 20 Q. HOWEVER, I HAVE ASKED A QUESTION. 21 A. IT STATES THAT WE DIDN'T UNDERTAKE 22 TO REVIEW ALL OF OUR CUSTOMER FILES TO DETERMINE 23 WHETHER THERE WAS IN THAT OTHER CUSTOMER'S FILE A 24 MENTION OF TEXAS EASTERN IN SOME FASHION. 25 Q. BUT TO THE BEST OF YOUR BELIEF, 92 WATER PCB-l 1 WOULD ALL COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSANTO AND 2 TEXAS EASTERN BE CONTAINED IN TEXAS EASTERN 3 FILES? 4_ A. YES. 5 Q. TURNING TO REQUEST NO. 3, AND ALL OF 6 THE FOLLOWING QUESTIONS RELATE TO REQUEST NO. 3. 7 AGAIN, I WILL ASK YOU WHERE DID YOU 8 CONDUCT A SEARCH FOR THESE DOCUMENTS? 9 A. IN THE SAME LOCATION AS THE OTHERS. 10 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANYWHERE ELSE THAT 11 THESE DOCUMENTS WOULD BE CONTAINED? 12 A. NO, MA'AM. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 14 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 15 A. I DIDN'T WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS AT 16 ALL, ON ANY BASIS, IN RESPONSE TO NO. 3. I 17 PRODUCED THE ONLY DOCUMENT THAT I HAVE. 18 Q. THERE WERE NO OTHER DOCUMENTS. 19 A. THAT'S CORRECT. THERE IS ONLY ONE 20 DOCUMENT. 21 Q. THERE WAS NO DOCUMENT THAT WAS 22 CREATED AFTER 1977. 23 A. NO, MA'AM. 24 - Q. TURNING TO REQUEST NO. 4, CAN YOU 25 CONFIRM FOR ME THAT THERE ARE NO DOCUMENTS THAT 93 WATER PCB-l .1 ARE RESPONSIVE TO REQUEST NO. 4 2 A. THAT'S CORRECT. WE HAVE DISCOVERED 3 NONE ON THE BASIS OF OUR SEARCH. 4 _ Q. ALL RIGHT. TURNING TO REQUEST 5 NO. 5., CAN YOU CONFIRM FOR ME THAT YOU DID NOT 6 WITHHOLD, ON ANY BASIS, DOCUMENTS THAT ARE 7 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST. 8 A. THAT IS CORRECT. 9 Q. THERE ARE NO DOCUMENTS THAT ARE 10 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST , THAT WERE CREATED 11 AFTER 1977. 12 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 13 Q. THERE ARE NO DOCUMENTS THAT ARE 14 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST, THAT REFER OR RELATE 15 TO OTHER CUSTOMERS. 16 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 17 Q. THERE ARE NO DOCUMENTS THAT ARE 18 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST, THAT REFER OR RELATE 19 TO OTHER PRODUCTS. 20 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF 21 Q. TURNING TO REQUEST NO. 6, ALL OF THE 22 FOLLOWING QUESTIONS PERTAIN TO REQUEST NO. 6. 23 A. YES, MA'AM. 24 - Q. AGAIN, WHERE DID YOU SEARCH? 25 A. IN THE MONSANTO PCB ARCHIVE. 94 WATER PCB-0003E 1 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANYWHERE ELSE, ANY 2 OTHER OFFICE, WHERE DOCUMENTS THAT ARE RESPONSIVE 3 TO THIS REQUEST WOULD BE CONTAINED? 4_ A. COPIES OF DOCUMENTS POTENTIALLY 5 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST, WOULD BE CONTAINED IN 6 THE OFFICES OF INDIVIDUALS OF MONSANTO WHO DEAL 7 WITH REGULATORY AGENCIES. ANY OF THOSE 8 DOCUMENTS, HOWEVER, THAT RELATE TO PCB'S WOULD 9 ALSO BE IN MY ARCHIVE. 10 Q. DID YOU SEARCH THOSE OTHER OFFICES? 11 A. THEY HAVE BEEN THE SUBJECT OF 12 PERIODIC SEARCHES. 13 Q. IS THERE A LIST OF WHO HAS COPIES OF 14 THOSE DOCUMENTS? 15 A. OTHER THAN THERE IS A LIST OF 16 INDIVIDUALS WHOSE OFFICES WERE SEARCHED, YES . 17 Q. WE MAY WANT TO DISCUSS THIS LATER, 18 BUT WE REQUEST TO SEE ALL COPIES, SIMPLY TO 19 ASCERTAIN WHO HAS COPIES OF THESE KINDS OF 20 DOCUMENTS. 21 A. I WOULD MOST LIKELY FIND THAT 22 REQUEST OBJECTIONABLE. 23 Q. WE WILL TALK ABOUT THAT AT OUR MEET 24 AND CONFER. 25 DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 95 WATER PCB-l 1 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE IN RESPONSE TO 2 THIS REQUEST? 3 A. NONE THAT I AM AWARE OF. 4 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 5 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THEY WERE NOT RELEVANT? 6 A. IN GENERAL, WE PRODUCED ALL OF THE 7 DOCUMENTS WE HAD THAT REFLECTED COMMUNICATIONS 8 WITH THE U.S. ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY . 9 BEYOND THAT, WE TOOK THE POSITION 10 THAT A FURTHER SEARCH FOR ANY COMMUNICATION 11 BETWEEN MONSANTO AND ANY CONCEIVABLE GOVERNMENT 12 ENTITY WAS BURDENSOME AND OPPRESSIVE, AND THE 13 REQUEST WAS OUTWEIGHED BY THAT BURDENSOMENESS. 14 Q. DO THOSE DOCUMENTS EXIST? 15 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT WE HAVE THEM. 16 Q. IN OTHER WORDS, THERE ARE DOCUMENTS 17 OR COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSONTO AND OTHER 18 AGENCIES, BESIDES THE EPA, THAT PERTAIN TO 19 PCB'S. 20 A. YES . 21 Q. AND DO THEY EXIST IN YOUR ARCHIVES? 22 A. YES . 23 Q. DID YOU SEARCH FOR THOSE DOCUMENTS 24 IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST? 25 A. AS I SAID BEFORE, WE DID NOT 96 WATER PCB-00032 1 UNDERTAKE A SPECIFIC SEARCH FOR THOSE DOCUMENTS. 2 WE EXCLUDED THEM AS A CATEGORY. 3 Q. WHAT AGENCIES ARE WE TALKING ABOUT? 4 A. I COULDN'T ENUMERATE THEM FOR YOU; 5 THERE ARE SO MANY. 6 Q. COULD YOU START AND GIVE ME A FEW. 7 A. THE FOOD AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION, 8 THE OCCUPATIONAL SAFETY AND HEALTH 9 ADMINISTRATION, THE NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF 10 OCCUPATIONAL SAFETY AND HEALTH, ANY OF THE STATE 11 ENVIRONMENTAL AUTHORITIES, REGULATORY 12 AUTHORITIES. 13 HOW MANY DO YOU WANT? 14 Q. THAT'S FINE. I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW 15 HOW YOU DETERMINED TO LIMIT THIS REQUEST JUST TO 16 THE EPA. 17 A. IT WAS OUR DETERMINATION THAT THOSE 18 COMMUNICATIONS WOULD CONTAIN MOST OF THE 19 SIGNIFICANT INFORMATION THAT WE HAD WITH THE 20 GOVERNMENT ON THE SUBJECT OF PCB'S. 21 Q. DID ANY OF THE OTHER COMMUNICATIONS, 22 TO OTHER GOVERNMENT AGENCIES, CONTAIN 23 COMMUNICATIONS ABOUT THE HAZARDS OF PCB'S? 24 - A. WELL, I FIND IT DIFFICULT TO RESPOND 25 TO THAT. COMMUNICATIONS WITH OTHER GOVERNMENT 97 WATER PCB-l 1 AGENCIES, FOR EXAMPLE THE FDA, MAY HAVE RELATED 2 TO THE PRESENCE OF PCB'S IN ENVIRONMENTAL 3 SAMPLES. 4 Q. HOW DID YOU DETERMINE THAT THE EPA 5 COMMUNICATIONS WERE THE ONLY SIGNIFICANT 6 COMMUNICATIONS WITH THE GOVERNMENT? 7 LET ME REPHRASE IT. I THINK YOU 8 STATED "MOST SIGNIFICANT." 9 A. SIMPLY BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THE FACT 10 IS. 11 Q. WHAT QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS ARE THERE 12 IN TERMS OF COMMUNICATIONS WITH OTHER 13 GOVERNMENTAL AGENCIES? 14 A. I DON'T HAVE AN ESTIMATE ON THAT. 15 IT WOULD BE A SIGNIFICANT EFFORT TO SEARCH THE 16 ARCHIVE AND RETRIEVE THOSE DOCUMENTS. 17 Q. HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS EVER BEEN 18 PRODUCED IN OTHER LITIGATION? 19 A. TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO. 20 Q. HAVE THEY EVER BEEN REQUESTED TO BE 21 PRODUCED? 22 A. I BELIEVE WE HAVE HAD SIMILAR 23 REQUESTS TO THIS, AND HAVE OBJECTED ON THE SAME 24 BASIS TO EACH SUCH REQUEST. 25 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 98 WATER PCB-l 1 THE BASIS THERE WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 2 A. NO, NOT IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST. 3 Q. IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST, DID YOU 4 WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BECAUSE THEY WERE IN THE 5 PUBLIC DOMAIN? 6 A. I DON'T BELIEVE SO, MISS WELCH, BUT 7 I'M NOT ALTOGETHER POSITIVE ON THAT. 8 I BELIEVE ALL DOCUMENTS THAT 9 REFLECTED COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSANTO AND THE 10 EPA HAVE BEEN PRODUCED. I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY 11 COMMUNICATION - 12 I HAVE DOCUMENTS OF THAT SORT THAT 13 HAVE BEEN WITHHELD ON PUBLIC DOMAIN GROUNDS. WE 14 HAVE OTHER EPA DOCUMENTS WITHIN THAT ARCHIVE THAT 15 WERE WITHHOLD ON PUBLIC DOMAIN GROUNDS, BUT THEY 16 ARE NOT COMMUNICATIVE DOCUMENTS. 17 Q. WHAT DOCUMENTS ARE THOSE? 18 A. EPA REPORTS OF ONE TYPE OR ANOTHER. 19 Q. CAN YOU GIVE ME SOME SAMPLES. 20 A. ONE THAT POPS TO MIND IMMEDIATELY IS 21 THE LATEST EPA DRINKING WATER CRITERIA DOCUMENT. 22 I BELIEVE IT'S A 1987 DOCUMENT, I THINK. 23 BUT IT'S DOCUMENTS OF THAT TYPE THAT 24 WE DIDN'T PRODUCE HERE. 25 Q. AND DO THOSE DOCUMENTS REFER OR 99 WATER PCB-l 1 RELATE TO FOB'S OR PCB-RELATED HAZARDS? 2 A. THOSE DOCUMENTS RELATE TO FOB, YES . 3 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 4 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE CREATED AFTER 1977? 5 A. NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO. 6 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 7 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 8 REQUEST? 9 A. NO, MA'AM. 10 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 11 RELATED TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OS-81, MCS-153, 12 TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL AC? 13 A. NO, MA'AM. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 16 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 17 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 18 A. NO, MA'AM. 19 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 20 THE GROUND THAT IT SEEKS INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 21 CUSTOMERS OR PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 22 A. NO, MA'AM. 23 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 24 THE GROUND THAT ANY PROTECTIVE ORDER PROHIBITS 25 MONSANTO FROM DISCLOSING THE DOCUMENT? 100 WATER PCB-0003 1 A. NO, MA'AM. 2 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLDANY DOCUMENTS ON 3 THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT IN THE REGULAR 4 COURSE OF BUSINESS? 5 A. NO. 6 Q. TURNING TO REQUEST NO. 7, WHERE DID 7 YOU SEARCH? 8 A. IN THE SAMELOCATION, MONSANTO'S PCB 9 ARCHIVE. 10 Q. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE, WOULD THESE 11 DOCUMENTS EXIST ANYWHERE ELSE? 12 A. NO, MA'AM. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 14 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 15 A. NO, MA'AM. 16 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 17 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 18 REVELANT? 19 A. NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE, NO. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 21 THE BASIS THAT THERE WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER IN 22 PLACE? 23 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO. 24 - Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 25 BECAUSE THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 101 WATER PCB-l 1 A. NO. 2 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 3 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED 4 AFTER 1977? 5 A. NO. 6 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANYDOCUMENTS THAT 7 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 8 REQUEST? 9 A. I AM AWARE OF DOCUMENTS THAT MAY 10 HAVE BEEN RESPONSIVE THAT MAY HAVE BEEN 11 DISCARDED, BUT WHEN THEY WERE I DON'T KNOW. 12 FOR EXAMPLE, WE DON'T HAVE ANYWHERE 13 NEAR A FULL COLLECTION OF SALES INVOICES, THAT 14 WOULD HAVE COVERED OR HAVE BEEN GENERATED AS A 15 RESULT OF SALES OF THESE PRODUCTS TO TEXAS 16 EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN. AND I ASSUME THOSE WERE 17 DISCARDED IN THE NORMAL COURSE OF BUSINESS. 18 Q. AND FOR WHAT PERIOD OF TIME WOULD 19 THEY HAVE BEEN KEPT BEFORE THEY WERE DISCARDED? 20 A. I BELIEVE TWO YEARS, BUT I'M NOT 21 POSITIVE. 22 Q. AND DO WE HAVE SUMMARIES OF THOSE 23 SALES? 24 A. YES. 25 Q. SO WE HAVE AN ACCOUNTING OF ALL 102 WATER PCB-l 1 SALES THAT OCCURRED. 2 A. TO THE BEST OF OUR RECORDS, YES. 3 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 4 RELATE TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN THOSE THAT I HAVE 5 'CONTINUALLY ENUMERATED? " 6 A. THOSE ARE THE ONLY PCB-CONTAINING 7 PRODUCTS THAT MONSANTO SOLD TO TEXAS EASTERN OR 8 TRANSWESTERN. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 10 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 11 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 12 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 13 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE GROUND THAT THEY SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 16 CUSTOMERS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 17 A. THERE MAY BE DOCUMENTS THAT MENTION 18 THE FACT THAT TEXAS EASTERN USED TURBINOL 153 AS 19 A GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANT, THAT REFER OR RELATE 20 TO, IN SOME SENSE, OUR SALES TO THEM, THAT HAVE 21 NOT BEEN PRODUCED. 22 BUT THOSE WOULD -- AGAIN, AS I HAVE 23 DESCRIBED TO YOU THE METHOD BY WHICH WE WENT 24 ABOUT SELECTING RELEVANT DOCUMENTS, WE WENT TO 25 THE PLACES WHERE WE BELIEVED COMMUNICATIONS AND 103 WATER PCB-l 1 RECORDS OF SALES TO TEXAS EASTERN WOULD BE LIKELY 2 TO BE FOUND, AND PRODUCED THOSE DOCUMENTS. 3 WE DID NOT ENGAGE IN A PAGE-BY-PAGE 4 SEARCH OF THE ARCHIVE, TO SEE IF WE -- TO LOOK 5 FOR EVERY DOCUMENT THAT MIGHT HAVE THE WORDS 6 "TEXAS EASTERN" PRINTED ON THEM. 7 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT QUANTITY 8 OF DOCUMENTS THIS WOULD BE? 9 A. NO. 10 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 11 THE GROUND OF ANY COMPROMISING OF THE PROTECTIVE 12 ORDER? 13 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO IN 16 THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 17 A. NO. 18 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 19 THE BASIS THAT THE PHRASE, QUOTE, "ALL DOCUMENTS 20 RELATING TO THE SALE" IS OVERLY BROAD? 21 A. YES. AND THAT WAS WHAT I REFERRED 22 TO PREVIOUSLY, THAT WE SIMPLY DID NOT UNDERTAKE A 23 PAGE-BY-PAGE REVIEW OF THE ARCHIVE, TO DETERMINE 24 WHETHER ANY OF THE DOCUMENTS THAT MIGHT MENTION 25 TEXAS EASTERN COULD BE CONSTRUED AS SOMEHOW 104 WATER PCB-l 1 RESPONSIVE. 2 WE WENT TO THOSE PLACES WITHIN THE 3 ARCHIVE THAT CONTAIN RECORDS OF SALES TO TEXAS 4 EASTERN AND COMMUNICATIONS WITH TEXAS EASTERN, 5 AND WE PRODUCED THOSE. 6 Q. IN THE ARCHIVE IS THERE A CERTAIN 7 PHYSICAL PLACE OR A CERTAIN FILE THAT RELATES TO 8 TEXAS EASTERN? 9 A. I BELIEVE THERE IS A 10 CUSTOMER-BY-CUSTOMER FILE. 11 Q. AND THAT IS PRIMARILY WHERE YOU 12 WENT - 13 A. THAT WAS ONE LOCATION OF SEARCH, 14 YES . 15 Q. WHAT OTHER LOCATION DID YOU SEARCH? 16 A. WELL, WE SEARCHED THE SALES RECORDS, 17 WHICH ARE NOT KEPT ON A CUSTOMER BASIS. IF YOU 18 WILL LOOK AT THE DOCUMENTS WE PRODUCED, I THINK 19 THE FOLDER 1, IT HAS THE SALES-RELATED 20 INFORMATION IN IT. 21 THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE NOT PART OF A 22 CUSTOMER FILE. THAT'S A COMPENDIUM OF SALES 23 INFORMATION. 24 - Q. SO YOU SEARCHED THE CUSTOMER FILE 25 AND THE SALES RECORD. IS THERE ANYWHERE ELSE 105 WATER PCB-0003! 1 THAT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN CONTAINED? 2 A. NOT THAT I CAN THINK OF OFFHAND. 3 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 4 RELATING TO THE SALES OF ANY OTHER PCB PRODUCTS, 5 OTHER THAN THOSE I HAVE ENUMERATED? 6 A. THOSE WERE THE ONLY PRODUCTS WE SOLD 7 TO TEXAS EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN. 8 Q. DID YOU PRODUCE ALL CONTRACTS THAT 9 EXIST? 10 A. I DON'T BELIEVE WE FOUND ANY 11 CONTRACTS. 12 Q. DID YOU SEARCH FOR THOSE CONTRACTS? 13 A. WELL, WE SEARCHED FOR DOCUMENTS THAT 14 WOULD HAVE PERTAINED TO SALES OF PCB-CONTAINING 15 PRODUCTS TO TEXAS EASTERN, AND OUR CUSTOMER FILES 16 WITH TEXAS EASTERN, AND IT WASN'T THERE. 17 I WOULDN'T KNOW WHERE ELSE TO LOOK. 18 Q. HOW ABOUT ALL INVOICES? 19 A. WE SEARCHED ALL OF OUR EXISTING 20 INVOICES FOR TEXAS EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN 21 RELATED SALES, AND WE PRODUCED WHAT WE HAD. 22 Q. WOULD THOSE HAVE BEEN IN THE 23 CUSTOMER FILE? 24 - A. NO, THOSE WERE SEPARATELY KEPT . 25 Q. IN THE SALES RECORDS. 106 WATER PCB-l 1 A. IN THE SALES RECORDS. 2 Q. HOW ABOUT THE BILLS OF SALE? 3 A. THOSE WOULD BE THE SAME PLACE. 4_ 5 Q. A. IN THE SALES RECORDS. RIGHT. . 6 Q. TURNING TO REQUEST NO. 8, WHERE DID 7 YOU SEARCH FOR THESE RECORDS? 8 A. WELL, WE HAVE PRODUCED NO DOCUMENTS 9 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST. 10 Q. NONE AT ALL? 11 A. NONE AT ALL. 12 Q. ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU WITHHOLD 13 DOCUMENTS? 14 A. WELL, IF YOU LOOK AT OUR RESPONSE, 15 THE BASES ARE ARTICULATED THERE. 16 Q. CAN YOU DESCRIBE, IN YOUR WORDS, 17 WHAT THE BASES ARE. 18 . A. BASICALLY, ONE OF RELEVANCE TO 19 THAT. OUR SALES TO OTHER CUSTOMERS ARE NOT 20 RELEVANT TO THE CLAIMS MADE BY TRANSWESTERN IN 21 THIS MATTER. 22 IT'S BURDENSOME, AND OPPRESSIVE, AND 23 NOT RELEVANT TO ASK US TO CONDUCT THAT SEARCH AND 24 PRODUCE THOSE RECORDS. 25 Q. SO YOU ARE STATING FOR THE RECORD 107 WATER PCB-l 1 THAT DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO OTHER PCB SALES, 2 OTHER PRODUCTS THAT CONTAIN PCB'S, ARE NOT 3 RELEVANT TO THIS LITIGATION. 4 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 5 Q. HOW DID YOU MAKE THAT DETERMINATION? 6 A. I'M NOT SURE I UNDERSTAND THE 7 QUESTION. 8 Q. HAD DID YOU DECIDE THAT THESE 9 DOCUMENTS WERE NOT RELEVANT? 10 A. WE LOOKED ATTHE COMPLAINT, AND 11 DETERMINED WHAT WE FELT WAS REASONABLE IN 12 RESPONSE HERE AND WHAT WASN'T. 13 AND THIS DID NOT APPEAR TO BE 14 REASONABLY RELEVANT OR RESPONSIVE. 15 Q. YOU DON'T BELIEVE THATDOCUMENTS 16 THAT RELATE TO OTHER PCB PRODUCTS WOULD LEAD TO 17 THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE? 18 A. NO, MA'AM. 19 Q. HAS THERE BEEN LITIGATION ABOUT 20 OTHER PCB PRODUCTS IN THE HISTORY OF MONSANTO? 21 A. YES. 22 Q. AND HAVE DOCUMENTS BEEN PRODUCED IN 23 THOSE LITIGATIONS? 24 - A. I BELIEVE WE HAVE DISCUSSED THAT 25 PREVIOUSLY. YES. 108 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO REQUEST 2 NO. 9 . 3 A. YES. 4 Q. WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THOSE 5 DOCUMENTS? 6 A. IN THE PCB ARCHIVE. 7 Q. ARE THERE PARTICULAR FILES IN WHICH 8 THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE CONTAINED? 9 A. THERE ARE MANY FILES. 10 Q. CAN YOU TELL ME WHICH ONES. 11 A. I CAN'T ENUMERATE THEM ALL FOR YOU, 12 NO. THERE IS A -- THERE ARE FILES WHICH 13 GENERALLY RELATE TO TURBINOL PRODUCTS, AND THOSE 14 FILES WERE REVIEWED, AS WELL AS FILES RELATING TO 15 THE CESSATION OF SALES OF PCB PRODUCTS. 16 Q. HOW ABOUT THE TEXAS EASTERN OR 17 TRANSWESTERN CUSTOMER FILES? 18 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT ANY DOCUMENT THAT 19 WAS NOT OTHERWISE PRODUCED IN RESPONSE TO A 20 PREVIOUS DISCOVERY DEMAND WOULD HAVE BEEN 21 RELEVANT TO THIS ONE, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN 22 PRODUCED. 23 BUT I BELIEVE THAT ALL OF OUR TEXAS 24 EASTERN AND TRANSWESTERN RELATED DOCUMENTS WOULD 25 ALREADY HAVE BEEN PRODUCED. 109 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 2 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 3 A. I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY. THERE MAY 4 HAVE BEEN INFORMATION REDACTED FROM A DOCUMENT 5 THAT WAS OTHERWISE PRODUCED ON THE BASIS OF 6 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE. 7 MS. WELCH: AND IS THAT REFLECTED IN 8 THE PRIVILEGE LOG? 9 MR. PREUSS: YES. 10 THE WITNESS: ANYTHING THAT WE 11 WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS WOULD BE REFLECTED IN THAT 12 LOG. 13 BY MS. WELCH: 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE NOT RELEVANT TO THIS 16 LITIGATION? 17 A. WE PRODUCED, IN RESPONSE TO THE 18 DEMAND, ALL DOCUMENTS THAT WE HAD THAT SPOKE TO 19 THE CESSATION OF SALES OF TURBINOL 153, OR 20 MCS-153, OR OS-81. ALL THOSE PRODUCTS WERE NO 21 LONGER BEING SOLD WHEN THE DECISION TO WITHDRAW 22 THESE PRODUCTS FROM THE MARKET WAS MADE. 23 Q. SO THERE IS - 24 (WITNESS CONFERS WITH HIS COUNSEL. ) 25 THE WITNESS: OR DOCUMENTS THAT 110 WATER PCB-l 1 REFLECT COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN TEXAS EASTERN AND 2 FROM TRANSWESTERN AND MONSANTO, THAT RELATE TO 3 THE CESSATION OF SALES. 4 BY MS. WELCH: 5 Q. SO AGAIN, THE QUESTION IS DID YOU 6 WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON THE BASIS OF 7 RELEVANCE. 8 A. IN RESPONSE TO THIS DEMAND, NO . 9 Q. THERE ARE NO OTHER DOCUMENTS THAT 10 RELATE TO THE CESSATION OF SALES OF TURBINOLS OR 11 OTHER PCB'S, OTHER THAN WHAT YOU PRODUCED TO US . 12 A. AS SUCH, NO. 13 THERE ARE DOCUMENTS WHICH RELATE 14 GENERALLY TO THE CESSATION OF SALES OF PCB 15 HYDRAULIC FLUIDS, OR PCB HEAT TRANSFER FLUIDS, OR 16 PRODUCTS OF THAT NATURE, THAT HAVE NOT BEEN 17 PRODUCED HERE. 18 Q. EARLIER YOU REFERRED TO A BROCHURE 19 THAT CONTAINED A LIST OR AN ENUMERATION OF THE 20 VARIOUS TURBINOL LUBRICANTS. 21 A. THERE IS A BROCHURE THAT WOULD 22 DESCRIBE THOSE, YES. 23 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER PCB PRODUCTS 24 DESCRIBED IN THERE, OTHER THAN THE PRODUCTS THAT 25 WERE SOLD TO TRANSWESTERN? Ill WATER PCB-i 1 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. I 2 WOULD HAVE TO REFER BACK TO THE PRODUCT 3 LITERATURE TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION. 4 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 5 THE BASIS THAT THERE IS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 6 A. NO. 7 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 8 BECAUSE THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE IN THE PUBLIC 9 DOMAIN? 10 A. NO. 11 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 12 THE BASIS THEY WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED AFTER 13 1977? 14 A. NO. 15 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 16 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 17 REQUEST? 18 A. NO, MA'AM, I AM NOT. 19 Q. I THINK YOU ANSWERED THEQUESTION 20 THAT I ASKED. THE QUESTION T JUST ASKED WAS DID 21 THAT RELATE TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OS-81 , 22 MCS-153 , TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL AC. 23 DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY OF THOSE 24 DOCUMENTS? 25 A. YES. 112 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT PRODUCTS THOSE 2 RELATED TO. 3 A. THERE ARE A GREAT NUMBER OF PRODUCTS 4 THAT THOSE RELATED TO. 5 Q. WOULD THEY COME WITHIN THIS 6 DESCRIPTION OF TURBINOLS OR OTHER PCB-CONTAINING 7 GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS? 8 A. NO. THERE ARE NO PRODUCTS OTHER 9 THAN TURBINOL 153, THAT WE ARE AWARE OF, THAT WAS 10 USED AS A GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANT. 11 MY STATEMENT IS THAT DOCUMENTS HAVE 12 NOT BEEN PRODUCED IN RESPONSE TO NO. 9 THAT 13 RELATE TO OTHER PCB-CONTAINING PRODUCTS. 14 Q. BUT THIS ASKED FOR DOCUMENTS 15 RELATING TO THE CESSATION OF SALES OF TURBINOL OR 16 OTHER PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 17 A. THAT IS CORRECT. 18 Q. THAT'S WHAT I AM TRYING TO 19 UNDERSTAND, WHETHER IN FACT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT 20 PRODUCTS THAT ARE TURBINOL OR OTHER 21 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 22 A. MY RESPONSE IS THAT DOCUMENTS THAT 23 RELATE TO OTHER PRODUCTS HAVE ^OT BEEN PRODUCED 24 HERE, BUT DOCUMENTS WHICH RELATE TO TURBINOL 153 25 AND GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS, WHICH WE DIDN'T . 113 WATER PCB-l 1 MAKE ANY OTHERS, AS FAR AS I AM AWARE OF, HAVE 2 NOT . 3 Q. I REALLY WANT TO PIN THIS DOWN, 4 BECAUSE IT'S MY CONFUSION. 5 IS YOUR TESTIMONY THAT THE ONLY 6 TURBINOL OR OTHER PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR 7 LUBRICANTS ARE CONTAINED IN THE FOLLOWING LIST OF 8 PRODUCTS: OS-81, MCS-153, TURBINOL 153, AND 9 PYDRAUL AC? 10 A. THAT'S NOT QUITE RIGHT. OS-81 , 11 MCS-153 , AND TURBINOL 153 ARE GAS COMPRESSOR 12 LUBRICANTS. 13 PYDRAUL AC IS A COMPRESSOR 14 LUBRICANT. BUT TO MY KNOWLEDGE, AND TO THE 15 EXTENT WE HAVE INFORMATION, AND I HAVE REVIEWED, 16 PYDRAUL AC WAS NOT DESIGNED NOR, TO OUR 17 KNOWLEDGE, WAS IT USED AS A GAS COMPRESSOR 18 LUBRICANT. 19 Q. PUTTING ASIDE - 20 A. BUT BECAUSE IT WAS SOLD TO TEXAS 21 EASTERN, WE INCLUDED IT IN THIS GROUP OF 22 DOCUMENTS. 23 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER PRODUCTS THAT 24 YOU CALL A "GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANT," OTHER THAN 25 IN THE ABOVE ENUMERATED LIST? 114 WATER PCB-i 1 A. NO. 2 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER PRODUCTS THAT 3 YOU WOULD CALL A "TURBINOL," OTHER THAN THIS 4 LIST? 5 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT. I 6 WOULD HAVE TO LOOK AT THE PRODUCT LTTERATURE TO 7 DETERMINE WHETHER THERE ARE TURBINOL PRODUCTS . I 8 BELIEVE THERE WERE; I AM NOT CERTAIN. 9 Q. AND YOU EXCLUDED THOSE DOCUMENTS 10 FROM THIS PRODUCTION, THAT IS RESPONSIVE TO THIS 11 REQUEST. 12 A. THAT IS CORRECT. 13 Q. ON WHAT BASIS DID YOU MAKE THAT 14 DETERMINATION? 15 A. WELL, FIRST OF ALL, RELEVANCE. 16 AND MY READING OF THE DEMAND IS THAT 17 THEY ARE NOT COMPREHENDED WITHIN THE DEMAND. 18 Q. THE DEMAND ACTUALLY ASKED FOR ALL 19 DOCUMENTS RELATING TO THE CESSATION OF SALE OF 20 TURBINOLS. 21 A. WELL, THE DEMAND IS FOR TURBINOL OR 22 OTHER PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 23 TAKING THOSE TWO TERMS TOGETHER, I 24 DETERMINED THAT IT WAS MY INTERPRETION THAT THIS 25 DEMAND -- THAT I WAS REQUESTED TO PRODUCE 115 WATER PCB-i 1 TURBINOL 153 OR OTHER PCB-CONTAINING GAS 2 COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 3 MS. WELCH: I MIGHT NOTE FOR THE 4 RECORD THAT THE WORD "OR" IS DISJUNCTIVE. IT 5 DOESN'T MEAN TO BE TAKEN TOGETHER. THE REQUEST 6 IS SPECIFICALLY FOR TURBINOL OR(OTHER ' 7 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 8 MR . PREUSS: THAT'S NOT A QUESTION. 9 BY MS. WELCH: 10 Q. SO YOUR RESPONSE, FOR THE RECORD, IS 11 THAT DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD THAT RELATED TO THE 12 CESSATION OF SALE OF TURBINOL OR OTHER 13 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 14 A. WE DID NOT PRODUCE DOCUMENTS OTHER 15 THAN THOSE RET. ATING TO TURBINOL 153, OTHER THAN 16 THOSE RELATING TO CESSATION OF SALE OF THAT 17 PRODUCT. 18 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 19 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 20 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 21 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 22 A. NO. 23 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS CM 24 THE GROUND THAT IT SEEKS INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 25 CUSTOMERS OR PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 116 WATER PCB-l 1 A MY RECOLLECTION IS THAT WE DID NOT 2 WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS ON THAT BASIS. WE MAY HAVE 3 REDACTED INFORMATION FROM SOME DOCUMENTS WHICH 4 RELATED TO OTHER CUSTOMERS. - 5 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 6 THE GROUND THAT ANY PROTECTIVE ORDER PROHIBITED 7 DISCLOSURE? 8 A. NO. 9 MR. PREUSS: JUST A MINUTE. 10 (WITNESS CONFERS WITH HIS COUNSEL.) 11 MS. WELCH: LET THE RECORD REFLECT 12 THAT THERE WAS A DISCUSSION BETWEEN MR. BISTLINE 13 AND HIS ATTORNEY. 14 MR. PREUSS: CERTAINLY. 15 THE WITNESS: WE WILL DO THAT 16 WHENEVER WE FEEL WE ARE REQUIRED TO. 17 MS. WELCH: ABSOLUTELY, AND I WILL 18 NOTE IT FOR THE RECORD. 19 THE WITNESS: I AM REMINDED THAT, IN 20 ADDITION, MONSANTO DID NOT PRODUCE IN RESPONSE TO 21 THIS DEMAND LETTERS TO OTHER CUSTOMERS RELATING 22 TO PYDRAUL AC, AND THERE WERE OTHER CUSTOMERS FOR 23 PYDRAUL AC, OTHER THAN TEXAS EASTERN. 24 HOWEVER, I WOULD NOTE THAT I WOULD 25 NOT CONSIDER PYDRAUL AC TO BE COMPREHENDED WITHIN 117 WATER PCB-l 1 9, TO OUR KNOWLEDGE, AS A GAS COMPRESSOR 2 LUBRICANT OR TURBINOL. 3 (WITNESS CONFERS WITH HIS COUNSEL.) 4 THE WITNESS; AND MOREOVER, IT WAS 5 IN THE SAME LETTER THAT WAS SENT TO TEXAS 6 EASTERN. ONLY THE ADDRESSEE WOULD HAVE BEEN 7 DIFFERENT. 8 BY MS. WELCH: 9 Q. SO THERE WERE OTHER CUSTOMERS FOR 10 PYDRAUL AC. 11 A. YES, MA'AM. 12 Q. AS WELL AS FOR OTHER TURBINOLS. 13 A. THAN TEXAS EASTERN, YES. 14 Q. WERE THE PRODUCTS OS-81, MCS-153 , 15 AND TURBINOL 153 JUST SOLD TO TEXAS EASTERN? 16 A. NO. THERE WERE OTHER CUSTOMERS FOR 17 TURBINOL 153. I'M NOT SURE ABOUT OS-81 OR 18 MCS-153. 19 Q. DID YOU PRODUCE DOCUMENTS THAT 20 RELATED TO OTHER CUSTOMERS' PURCHASE OF TURBINOL 21 153? 22 A. NO, MA'AM. 23 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 24 THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT IN THE REGULAR 25 COURSE OF BUSINESS? 118 WATER PCB-i 1 A. NO, MA'AM. 2 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 3 THE GROUND THAT THE PHRASE "CESSATION OF SALE" IS 4 OVERLY BROAD? . 5 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 6 Q. HOW ABOUT THAT THE PHRASE "CESSATION 7 OF SALE" IS VAGUE? 8 A. I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS 9 WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS. 10 Q. ON THE BASIS THAT THE TERM IS 11 AMBIGUOUS? 12 A. AGAIN, I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY 13 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS. 14 Q. ON THE BASIS THAT THE TERM IS 15 UNDEFINED? 16 A. I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 17 WERE WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS. 18 Q. ALL RIGHT. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY 19 DOCUMENTS ON THE GROUND THAT THE PHRASE "TURBINOL 20 OR OTHER PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR 21 LUBRICANTS" IS VAGUE? 22 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO. 23 Q. TURNING TO REQUEST NO. 10, THE 24 FOLLOWING QUESTIONS ALL PERTAIN TO REQUEST 25 NO. 10. 119 WATER PCB-l 1 WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THOSE 2 DOCUMENTS? 3 A. SAME LOCATION AS WE SEARCHED FOR THE 4 OTHERS, THE MONSANTO PCB ARCHIVE. 5 Q. ARE THERE ANY OTHER PARTICULAR FILES 6 THAT THESE DOCUMENTS WOULD BE CONTAINED IN? 7 A. IN GENERAL, THERE WOULD HAVE BEEN A 8 PRODUCT FILE THAT WOULD CONTAIN INFORMATION ON 9 THE MANUFACTURE OF TURBINOL, THAT WOULD BE LIKE 10 MANUFACTURING INFORMATION, THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN 11 RESEARCH TYPE REPORTS, THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN 12 GENERATED RELEVANT TO THIS PRODUCT. 13 SO THOSE ARE THE GENERAL AREAS THAT 14 WOULD HAVE BEEN SEARCHED. 15 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 16 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 17 A. NO, MA'AM, NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 18 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 19 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 20 RELEVANT? 21 A. AGAIN, I DON'T THINK THAT QUITE 22 COMPORTS WITH HOW WE WENT ABOUT THIS. 23 WE DETERMINED WHAT WE BELIEVED TO BE 24 THE TYPES OF DOCUMENTS AND THE AREAS THAT WOULD 25 YIELD RESPONSIVE INFORMATION. WE SEARCHED THOSE 120 WATER PCB-l 1 AND PRODUCED WHAT WE FOUND, THAT WAS RESPONSIVE 2 TO THE DEMAND. 3 Q. DID YOU FIND DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 4 RESPONSIVE, AND THEN DETERMINED THEY WERE NOT 5 RELEVANT? 6 A. THAT MAY HAVE BEEN DONE; I DON ' T 7 KNOW . 8 IT WAS MY STAFF THAT SEARCHED FOR 9 IT. AND IF THEY FOUND A DOCUMENT, I DIDN'T SAY , 10 "LET ME SEE, IS THAT RESPONSIVE BUT NOT 11 RELEVANT?" 12 NO, I DON'T BELIEVE WE WOULD HAVE 13 EXCLUDED DOCUMENTS ON THAT BASIS. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE BASIS THAT THERE WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 16 A. NO, MA'AM. 17 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD - 18 A. OH, WAIT A MINUTE. YES, NO 19 PROTECTIVE ORDER. THE SMP'S, THE STANDARD 20 MANUFACTURING PROCESS MANUALS. 21 Q. AND ARE YOU PREPARED TO PRODUCE 22 THOSE ONCE THERE IS A PROTECTIVE ORDER? 23 A. YES, MA'AM. 24 -- Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 25 BECAUSE THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 121 WATER PCB-l 1 A. NO, MA'AM. 2 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 3 THE BASIS THAT THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE PRODUCED OR 4 ^CREATED AFTER 1977? 5 A. NO, MA'AM. 6 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 7 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 8 REQUEST? 9 A. NO, MA'AM. 10 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 11 RELATED TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OS-81, MCS-153 , 12 TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL AC? 13 A. NO, THOSE ARE THE ONLY - 14 WELL, AGAIN, WE RESTRICTED OUR 15 PRODUCTION TO TURBINOL 153, AND OS-81, AND 16 MCS-153, BECAUSE THOSE ARE THE ONLY GAS 17 COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS THAT WE ARE AWARE OF. 18 AND WE PRODUCED PYDRAUL AC, BECAUSE 19 IT WAS SOLD TO TEXAS EASTERN. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 21 RELATED TO THE DESIGN, TESTING, AND MANUFACTURE 22 OF TURBINOLS? 23 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT THERE WERE 24 -DOCUMENTS RELATING TO OTHER TURBINOLS, YES. 25 Q. AND THOSE DOCUMENTS DO EXIST. 122 WATER PCB-l 1 A. AGAIN, AS I SAID, IF THERE ARE OTHER 2 TURBINOL PRODUCTS, THEN THEY PRESUMABLY HAD 3 DESIGN, TESTING, AND MANUFACTURE DOCUMENTS 4 -ASSOCIATED WITH THEM. 5 THOSE ARE NOT PRODUCED IF THEY DID 6 NOT RELATE TO TURBINOL 153 . 7 Q. DID THOSE PRODUCTS THAT WE CALLED 8 "TURBINOLS" CONTAIN PCB? 9 A. THEY MAY HAVE. AGAIN, I'D HAVE TO 10 LOOK AT THE PRODUCT LITERATURE. 11 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 12 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 13 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 14 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 15 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 16 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 17 THE GROUND THAT THEY SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 18 CUSTOMERS OR PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 19 A. WE DID NOT PRODUCE DOCUMENTS FROM 20 OTHER CUSTOMER FILES, THAT MAY HAVE RELATED TO 21 OTHER CUSTOMERS' USE OF THIS PRODUCT OF TURBINOL 22 153 . 23 I BELIEVE THAT WAS THE ONLY -- OR 24 T4CS-153, OR OS-81, OR PYRDAUL AC, BUT THAT'S NOT 25 A GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANT. 123 WATER PCB-l 1 Q BUT YOU TESTIFIED EARLIER THAT -2 MR. PREUSS: EXCUSE ME. 3 (WITNESS CONFERS WITH HIS COUNSEL.) 4 MS . WELCH: LET THE RECORD REFLECT 5 THAT THERE HAS BEEN A CONFERENCE BETWEEN THE 6 ATTORNEY AND THE CLIENT. 7 THE WITNESS: LET ME JUST ADD TO 8 THAT RESPONSE THAT I DON'T BELIEVE WE PRODUCED 9 DOCUMENTS OF THIS TYPE RELATING TO PYDRAUL AC, 10 BECAUSE IT IS NOT A TURBINOL GAS COMPRESSOR 11 LUBRICANT. 12 WE PRODUCED OTHER INFORMATION, 13 BECAUSE IT WAS A PRODUCT THAT WAS SOLD TO TEXAS 14 EASTERN. 15 BY MS. WELCH: 16 Q. I AM A LITTLE CONFUSED. YOU BELIEVE 17 TURBINOL 153 WAS SOLD TO OTHER CUSTOMERS? 18 . A. CORRECT. 19 Q. BUT THAT THE OTHER PRODUCTS WERE 20 NOT, TO THE BEST OF YOUR KNOWLEDGE. 21 A. I BELIEVE THAT'S CORRECT . 22 Q. SO IT WOULD SEEM THAT THERE WOULD BE 23 DOCUMENTS. 24 MR . PREUSS: EXCUSE ME, WITH THE 25 EXCEPTION OF PYDRAUL AC. 124 WATER PCB-l 1 MS. WELCH: THAT'S RIGHT. 2 Q. WHAT YOU ARE TELLING ME IS THAT YOU 3 DID NOT PRODUCE DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO 4 PYDRAUL AC. 5 A. CORRECT. 6 Q. YOU PRODUCEDDOCUMENTS THAT RELATE 7 THAT TURBINOL 153 ONLY TO THE EXTENT THAT IT 8 RELATED TO TEXAS EASTERN. 9 A. NO, MA'AM. 10 Q. WHY DON'T YOU CHARACTERIZE IT FOR 11 ME . 12 A. WHAT I SAID IS THAT WE PRODUCED 13 DOCUMENTS WHICH RELATED TO THE DESIGN, TESTING, 14 AND MANUFACTURE OF TURBINOL 153, AS WE SET FORTH 15 HERE, AS WE INTERPRETED THE TERM "DESIGN, 16 TESTING, AND MANUFACTURING," AND AS SET FORTH IN 17 THE RESPONSE. 18 WE DID NOT RESTRICT THAT ONLY TO 19 DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED ALSO TO TEXAS EASTERN. 20 WE PRODUCED DOCUMENTS THAT 21 REASONABLY REFLECT THE DESIGN, TESTING, AND 22 MANUFACTURE OF TURBINOL 53. 23 WHAT WE DID NOT DO WAS CONDUCT A 24 -SEARCH OF FILES OF ALL CUSTOMERS OTHER THAN TEXAS 25 EASTERN WHO MAY HAVE PURCHASED THE PRODUCT, TO 125 WATER PCB-i 1 DETERMINE WHETHER THERE WERE ANY SPECIFIC 2 DOCUMENTS RELATED TO THOSE CUSTOMERS THAT MAY 3 FALL WITHIN A BROAD READING OF NO. 10. 4 Q. DID YOU DISCOVER ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 5 RELATED TO THE DESIGN, TESTING, AND MANUFACTURE 6 OF THOSE PRODUCTS IN TEXAS EASTERN'S FILES? 7 A. I BELIEVE THERE MAY - 8 I AM GOING TO HAVE TO PASS ON THAT 9 ONE, AND JUST SAY I DON'T KNOW WITHOUT GOING BACK 10 AND EXAMINING THE TEXAS EASTERN RELATED 11 DOCUMENTS. I JUST DON'T HAVE AN ANSWER TO THAT 12 RIGHT NOW. 13 SOME OF THEM MAY BE CONSTRUED AS 14 RELATING TO PRODUCT DEVELOPMENT. 15 Q. THE PURPOSE OF MY QUESTION IS I AM 16 WONDERING WHETHER, IF THOSE DOCUMENTS EXIST IN 17 OTHER CUSTOMER FILES, WHETHER THEY ARE SEGREGATED 18 INTO DESIGN, TESTING, OR MANUFACTURING FILES. 19 A. I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE MANY, 20 IF ANY, FOR THIS REASON: AND THAT IS THAT THIS 21 IS A PRODUCT THAT WAS DEVELOPED AS MUCH BY TEXAS 22 EASTERN AS BY MONSANTO. THE EARLY PHASES OF THE 23 DEVELOPMENT OF THIS PRODUCT ARE THE RESULT OF 24 ^COLLABORATION BETWEEN THOSE TWO COMPANIES. 25 AND IT IS MY BEST INFORMATION AT 126 WATER PCB-l 1 THIS POINT THAT IN THE DESIGN, DEVELOPMENT, AND 2 EARLY MANUFACTURE STAGES OF THIS PRODUCT IT WAS A 3 ONE-CUSTOMER PRODUCT, AND IT WAS ONLY AFTER ITS 4 JLJSE HAD BEEN WELL IMPLEMENTED AND PROVEN BY TEXAS 5 EASTERN THAT OTHER CUSTOMERS PURCHASED THE 6 PRODUCT. 7 FURTHERMORE, SALES FOR OTHER 8 CUSTOMERS WERE NOT VERY GREAT, AS HIGH AS TEXAS 9 EASTERN WERE. 10 Q. 11 HERE . YOU ARE REFERRING TO TURBINOL 153 12 A. THAT'S CORRECT. BUT OS-81 AND 13 MCS-153 ARE REALLY PREDECESSOR TO TURBINOL 153 . 14 Q. BUT WE SPOKE EARLIER OF OTHER 15 TURBINOLS, THAT ARE SEPARATE FROM TURBINOL 153 . 16 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 17 Q. AND YOU HAVE NOT PRODUCED DOCUMENTS 18 ABOUT THE DESIGN, TESTING, OR MANUFACTURING OF 19 THOSE PRODUCTS. 20 A. THAT'S CORRECT. OTHER TURBINOLS ARE 21 NOT GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 22 AGAIN, THAT GOES BACK TO THE 23 CONSTRUCTION OF THIS PHRASE, "DESIGN, TESTING, 24 "AND MANUFACTURE OF TURBINOL OR OTHER 25 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS." WE 127 WATER PCB-i 1 ARE RESTRICTING IT ONLY TO PCB GAS COMPRESSOR 2 LUBRICANTS. 3 Q. WE CONTEND THAT THE REQUEST FAIRLY 4 ASKS FOR TURBINOL OR OTHER PCB-CONTAINING GAS 5 COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS. 6 BUT I THINK THAT MAY BE A MATTER FOR 7 THE COURT TO DECIDE AT A MOTION TO COMPEL. 8 A. FINE. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 10 THE GROUND THEY WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO IN THE 11 REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 12 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 14 THE GROUND THAT ANY PROTECTIVE ORDER PROHIBITS 15 MONSANTO FROM PRODUCING THOSE DOCUMENTS? 16 A. I WOULD HAVE TO EXAMINE THE EXHIBITS 17 TO DR. HATTON'S DEPOSITION, BUT I THINK THAT THE 18 POSSIBILITY EXISTS THAT INFORMATION IN THOSE 19 DOCUMENTS MAY RELATE TO THESE TOPICS. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 21 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THE TERM "DESIGN" IS OVERLY 22 BROAD, AMBIGUOUS, UNDEFINED, OR CAPABLE OF 23 VARIOUS INTERPRETATIONS? 24 -- A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 25 Q. THE SAME QUESTION IN TERMS OF THE 128 WATER PCB-l 1 TERM "TESTING It DID YOU UNDERSTAND THE TERM? 2 A. NOT THAT WE DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THE 3 TERM "TESTING," NO. WE PRODUCED THE DOCUMENTS AS 4 ME DEFINE THE TERM "TESTING." 5 Q. AND HOW DID YOU DEFINE THE TERM 6 "TESTING"? 7 A. AS SET FORTH IN OUR RESPONSE. 8 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 9 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THE TERM "MANUFACTURE" IS 10 OVERLY BROAD, AMBIGUOUS, UNDEFINED, OR CAPABLE OF 11 VARIOUS INTERPRETATIONS? 12 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 14 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 15 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 16 VAGUE? 17 A. NO, MA'AM. 18 Q. THAT IT'S UNDEFINABLE? 19 A. NO. 20 Q. AND AGAIN, JUST TO CONFIRM THAT YOU 21 WILL, ONCE THERE IS A PROTECTIVE ORDER ENTERED, 22 PRODUCE DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO THE STANDARD 23 MANUFACTURING PROCESS. 24 ~ A. YES. 25 MS . WELCH: I WOULD LIKE TO TAKE A 129 WATER PCB-l 1 LUNCH BREAK NOW, SO WE ARE OFF THE RECORD 2 (AT 12s 05 P.M. , THE 3 DEPOSITION OF THOMAS M. BISTLINE 4_ WAS ADJOURNED FOR NOON RECESS . ) 5 /// 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 /// 130 WATER PCB-l 1 (AT 1:20 P.M., THE 2 DEPOSITION OF THOMAS M. BISTLINE 3 WAS RECONVENED.) 4 5 MS. WELCH: BACK ON THE RECORD. 6 GOOD AFTERNOON. THIS IS THE 7 RESUMPTION OF THE DEPOSITION AFTER LUNCH. 8 9 EXAMINATION (CONTINUED) 10 BY MS. WELCH: 11 Q. AND OF COURSE, MR. BISTLINE, I DON ' T 12 NEED TO REMIND YOU THAT YOU ARE UNDER OATH, 13 SUBJECT TO THE VARIOUS INSTRUCTIONS WE TALKED 14 ABOUT AT THE BEGINNING OF THE DEPOSITION. 15 I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN AGAIN TO 16 EXHIBIT 4, AND IN PARTICULAR, ON PAGE 11, TO 17 DOCUMENT REQUEST NO. 11, AND TURN YOUR ATTENTION 18 TO THAT. 19 A. YES. 20 Q. WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THESE 21 DOCUMENTS? 22 A. THE SAME PLACE THAT WE SEARCHED FOR 23 THE OTHER DOCUMENTS, OUR PCB ARCHIVES. 24 -- Q. ARE THERE PARTICULAR FILES THAT 25 CONTAIN THESE DOCUMENTS? 131 WATER PCB-l 1 A. THE ONE REQUESTED IN NO. 11? 2 Q. YES. 3 A. WE HAVE FILES THAT CONTAIN 4 PROMOTIONAL, ADVERTISING LITERATURE, MARKETING 5 PLANS, AND LIKE INFORMATION, YES. 6 Q. DID YOU EXCLUDE DOCUMENTS ABOUT THE 7 SALE OF TURBINOL TO OTHER CUSTOMERS? 8 A. YES. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 10 ON ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 11 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, MISS WELCH. 12 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 13 ON THE ASSERTION THEY WERE NOT RELEVANT, OTHER 14 THAN SALES TO OTHER CUSTOMERS? 15 A. AGAIN, OUR PRODUCTION WAS GEARED TO 16 THE PRODUCTS NAMED IN THE RESPONSE, THAT IS, 17 OS-81, MCS-153, TURBINOL 153, AND PYDRAUL AC. IT 18 IS THOSE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE PRODUCED. 19 SO TO THE EXTENT OF OTHER TURBINOL 20 PRODUCTS, YES, THEY ARE EXCLUDED, AS WELL. 21 Q. HOW ABOUT TURBINOL 153 AS THEY WERE 22 SOLD TO OTHER CUSTOMERS, WERE THOSE ALSO 23 EXCLUDED? 24 -- A. INFORMATION RELATING TO SALES OF 25 THAT PRODUCT TO OTHER CUSTOMERS WAS EXCLUDED, 132 WATER PCB-l 1 YES . 2 Q. HOW ABOUT PYDRAUL AC? 3 A. YES, THAT WAS ALSO EXCLUDED. 4 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 5 THE BASIS THAT THERE WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 6 A. THERE WAS NOT IN RESPONSE TO THIS 7 REQUEST -- WELL, LET ME TAKE THAT BACK. 8 SUBJECT -- AGAIN, LOOKING AT THOSE 9 DOCUMENTS THAT ARE COVERED BY THE TEXAS DISTRICT 10 LITIGATION PROTECTIVE ORDER, I DON'T CLEARLY 11 CONTEND ALL DOCUMENTS. 12 SOME MAY RELATE TO, IN A BROAD 13 SENSE, MARKETING, TO THE EXTENT THAT THAT WOULD 14 ENCOMPASS DISCUSSIONS BETWEEN TEXAS EASTERN AND 15 MONSANTO WITH RESPECT TO TURBINOL 153. 16 Q. ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS THAT WOULD HAVE 17 BEEN WITHHELD BECAUSE OF THE PROTECTIVE ORDER? 18 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO. 19 Q. I THINK WHAT I WAS REFERRING TO IN 20 MY QUESTION IS A PROTECTIVE ORDER THAT MIGHT BE 21 ENTERED IN THIS CASE. 22 DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 23 THAT BASIS? . 24 -- A. I DON'T THINK. MY RECOLLECTION IS 25 THAT THERE WERE NO COMMERCIALLY SENSITIVE 133 WATER PCB-0003! 1 DOCUMENTS OR PROPRIETORY DOCUMENTS THAT WE WISHED 2 TO HAVE A PROTECTIVE ORDER FOR. 3 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 4 RESPONSIVE TO THE REQUEST BECAUSE THEY WERE IN 5 THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 6 A. NO 7 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 8 THE BASIS THEY WERE CREATED AFTER 1977? 9 A. NO 10 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 11 MIGHT HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO 12 THIS REQUEST? 13 A. NO, I AM NOT. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 15 RELATED TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OS-81, MCS-153 , 16 TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL AC? 17 A. I THINK I RELATED TO YOU THAT WE DID 18 NOT PRODUCE DOCUMENTS FOR TURBINOL PRODUCTS OTHER 19 THAN TURBINOL 153. 20 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT QUANTITY? 21 A. NO, MA'AM. 22 Q. HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS BEEN PRODUCED 23 IN OTHER LITIGATION PERTAINING TO OTHER 24 -TURBINOLS? 25 THEY MAY HAVE BEEN. I'D HAVE TO 134 WATER PCB-0003S 1 REVIEW, LOOK BACK AT THAT FILE. 2 Q. DO YOU HAVE A SPECIFIC RECOLLECTION 3 OF WHAT LITIGATION? 4_ A. POSSIBLY THE PAOLI LITIGATION. 5 Q. ANY OTHER LITIGATION? 6 A. I'D HAVE TO CHECK MY FILE AND BE 7 SURE . 8 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 9 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 10 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 11 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 12 A. NO. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 14 THE GROUND THAT THEY SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 15 CUSTOMERS? 16 A. WE DID NOT PRODUCE DOCUMENTS 17 RELATING TO SALES OF ANY OF THESE PRODUCTS TO 18 OTHER CUSTOMERS, OTHER THAN TEXAS EASTERN AND 19 TRANSWESTERN. 20 AND WE PRODUCED EVERYTHING WE HAD ON 21 THE OTHER -- TO THE OTHER ENTITIES WHICH WERE 22 NAMED IN THESE DISCOVERY REQUESTS, SO I DON'T 23 BELIEVE WE WITHHELD ANY INFORMATION. 24 ~ Q. BY "ENTITIES" ARE YOU REFERRING TO 25 INFORMATION RELATING TO THOSE ENTITIES? 135 WATER PCB-l 1 A. IF I MAY LOOK BACK. 2 SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA GAS, PACIFIC 3 LIGHTING AND GAS SUPPLY COMPANY r PACIFIC LIGHT 4 .AND SERVICE COMPANY. TO THE EXTENT THAT WE HAD 5 INFORMATION WITH RESPECT TO THOSE ENTITIES, IT 6 HAS BEEN PRODUCED. 7 Q. AND DID YOU WITHHOLD THE DOCUMENTS 8 THAT RELATED TO OTHER CUSTOMERS ON THE GROUND OF 9 RELEVANCY? 10 A. YES, MA'AM. 11 Q. AND WHAT WAS YOUR DETERMINATION 12 ABOUT THEIR RELEVANCY? 13 A. THAT THEY WERE NOT RELEVANT. 14 Q. WHY WERE THEY NOT RELEVANT? 15 A. BECAUSE THIS MATTER INVOLVES SALES 16 OF PRODUCTS TO TEXAS EASTERN, NOT THOSE OTHER 17 CUSTOMERS. 18 Q. DID YOU MAKE THAT DETERMINATION? 19 A. YES. 20 Q . DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 21 THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO IN 22 THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 23 A. NOT THAT I RECALL. 24 ~ Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 25 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THE TERM "DESIGN" IS OVERLY 136 WATER PCB-0003! 1 BROAD, AMBIGUOUS, UNDEFINED, OR VAGUE? 2 A. I DON ' T SEE THE "TERM" DESIGN list 3 HERE AT ALL. 4_ Q. EXC.USE ME. I ' M SORRY, YOU'RE 5 CORRECT. 6 I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO DOCUMENT 7 REQUEST NO. 12. 8 A. YES, MA'AM. 9 Q. WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THESE 10 DOCUMENTS? 11 A. IN THE SAME LOCATION AS ALL THE 12 OTHER REQUESTS. 13 Q. ARE THEY ISOLATED OR SEGREGATED IN 14 ANY PARTICULAR FILES? 15 A. CERTAIN ASPECTS OF THAT WOULD BE. 16 OTHERS WOULD BE SPREAD THROUGHOUT CUSTOMER FILES. 17 Q. AND WHICH CUSTOMER FILES DID YOU 18 LOOK IN? 19 A. WE LOOKED IN CUSTOMER FILES RELATING 20 TO TEXAS EASTERN, TRANSWESTERN. 21 AND AS I SAID BEFORE, ALL OF THE 22 INFORMATION ON THE THREE ENTITIES THAT I RECITED 23 EARLIER, ALL THAT INFORMATION HAS BEEN PRODUCED. 24 -- Q. DID YOU EXCLUDE SPECIFICALLY 25 TURBINOLS OTHER THAN TURBINOL 153 FROM THIS 137 WATER PCB-l 1 RESPONSE? 2 A. THAT'S CORRECT 3 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT QUANTITY 4 OF DOCUMENTS WERE EXCLUDED ON THAT BASIS? 5 A. NO, MA'AM, I DON'T. 6 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 7 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 8 A. NO, NOT ON THIS DEMAND. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 10 ON THE ASSERTION THEY WERE NOT RELEVANT, OTHER 11 THAN AS THEY PERTAIN TO OTHER PRODUCTS OR OTHER 12 CUSTOMERS? 13 A. NO, I THINK THAT COVERS THAT BASIS. 14 Q. SO THE ASSERTION OF IRRELEVANCY, 15 THAT HAS TO DO WITH OTHER CUSTOMERS AND OTHER 16 PRODUCTS. 17 A. YES 18 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 19 THE BASIS THAT THERE IS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER IN 20 THIS CASE? 21 A. I DON'T BELIEVE SO, NOT ON THIS ONE. 22 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 23 BECAUSE THEY ARE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 24 A. NO, MA'AM, NOT ON THIS ONE. 25 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 138 WATER PCB-00035 1 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED 2 AFTER 1977? 3 A. NO, MA'AM. 4 __ Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 5 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 6 REQUEST? 7 A. NO, MA'AM, I'M NOT. 8 Q. AND JUST TO CONFIRM THAT, YOU DID 9 WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED TO PRODUCTS OTHER 10 THAN OS-81, MCS-153, TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL 11 AC . 12 A. YES, TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU ARE 13 SEEKING DOCUMENTS RELATED TO OTHER TURBINOLS, 14 THAT'S CORRECT. 15 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 16 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 17 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 18 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 19 A. NO, MA'AM, I DON'T BELIEVE SO. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS IN 21 RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST ON THE GROUND THAT THEY 22 SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER CUSTOMERS OR 23 PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? . 24 - A. YES. 25 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT QUANTITY 139 WATER PCB-l 1 OF DOCUMENTS THAT INVOLVES? 2 A. NO, MA'AM, I DON'T, NOT 3 SPECIFICALLY. 4 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 5 THE GROUND THAT IS ASSERTED IN GENERAL OBJECTION 6 NO. 12, WHICH IS THE PROTECTIVE ORDER IN 7 PHILADELPHIA? 8 A. THOSE DOCUMENTS THAT DID NOT RELATE 9 TO TEXAS EASTERN'S USE OF TURBINOL 153, OR 10 MCS-153 , OR OS-81. 11 Q. THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE WITHHELD. 12 A. YES. I WAS PREVENTED BY THE 13 PROTECTIVE ORDER FROM PRODUCING THOSE DOCUMENTS . 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE GROUND THAT THOSE WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO 16 IN THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 17 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 18 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 19 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THE TERM "USE" IS OVERLY 20 BROAD? 21 A. NO, NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 22 AGAIN, WE DEFINED WHAT WE BELIEVED 23 WAS A REASONABLE CONSTITUENT, OUR INTERPRETATION 24 OF THE WORD "USE," AND USED THAT TO DEFINE THE 25 PARAMETERS OF RESPONSIVE DOCUMENTS. 140 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. AND I SEE BY YOUR DEFINITION THAT 2 YOU EXCLUDED PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OS-81, MCS-153 , 3 AND TURBINOL 153 IN YOUR DEFINITION OF "USE"; IS 4 THAT CORRECT? 5 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 6 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 7 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 8 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 9 VAGUE? 10 A. I THINK I ALREADY ANSWERED THAT, I 11 BELIEVE. NO. 12 Q. I DON'T THINK YOU ANSWERED IN 13 RESPONSE TO THIS. 14 AND YOU DID WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS 15 RELATING TO OTHER TURBINOLS; IS THAT CORRECT? 16 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 17 Q. IN RESPONSE TO THIS. 18 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 19 Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO DOCUMENT 20 REQUEST NO. 13. 21 A. YES. 22 Q. ALL OF THE FOLLOWING QUESTIONS 23 PERTAIN TO DOCUMENT REQUEST NO. 13. 24 - WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THOSE 25 DOCUMENTS? 141 WATER PCB-0003E 1 A. MONSANTO PCB DOCUMENT ARCHIVE. 2 Q. AND ARE THERE FILES THAT ARE 3 SEGREGATED, THAT RELATE TO THIS REQUEST? 4 A. THERE ARE FILES WITHIN THE ARCHIVE 5 THAT RELATE TO THIS, YES. 6 Q. CAN YOU JUST TELL ME WHAT THE TITLES 7 OF THOSE FILES WOULD BE. 8 A. I COULD NOT NAME THEM ALL FOR YOU. 9 Q. ARE THERE CUSTOMER FILES? 10 A. THERE MAY BE DOCUMENTS IN SPECIFIC 11 CUSTOMER FILES THAT RELATE TO THIS, YES. 12 Q. ARE THERE FILES THAT ARE LABELED 13 "DISCLOSURES" OR "HAZARDS"? 14 A. I'M NOT SURE WHAT THE LABELS ON THE 15 FILES ARE. 16 Q. ARE THERE FILES THAT ARE SEGREGATED, 17 THAT ARE ACTUALLY RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST? IN 18 OTHER WORDS, THEY JUST CONTAIN DOCUMENTS THAT ARE 19 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST. 20 A. I DON'T KNOW, I DON'T KNOW THE 21 ANSWER TO THAT. 22 Q. SO WHAT PARTICULAR FILES DID YOU 23 SEARCH FOR THIS REQUEST? 24 A. WE SEARCHED FILES RELATING TO 25 CUSTOMER NOTIFICATIONS, AND PRODUCT LABELING, 142 WATER PCB-l 1 PRODUCT PILES 2 Q. AND YOU PRODUCED ALL THOSE 3 DOCUMENTS. 4 A. WE PRODUCED DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 5 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST. 6 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 7 ON ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 8 A. NO, I DON'T BELIEVE SO. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 10 ON THE ASSERTION THEY WERE NOT RELEVANT? 11 A. WE WITHHELD DOCUMENTS WHICH WERE NOT 12 RELATED TO OS-81, MCS-153, AND TURBINOL 153. 13 Q. HOW ABOUT DOCUMENTS - 14 A. AND DOCUMENTS RELATED TO OTHER 15 CUSTOMERS. 16 Q. EVEN IF THEY BOUGHT THOSE PRODUCTS. 17 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 18 Q. AND HOW ABOUT OTHER TURBINOLS , DID 19 YOU WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS ABOUT THOSE? 20 A. I JUST SAID WE WITHHELD DOCUMENTS 21 THAT DID NOT RELATE TO THE THREE PRODUCTS, THAT 22 BEING -- 23 Q. YOU MEAN THE ONES YOU ENUMERATED. 24 A. YES. 25 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT QUANTITY 143 WATER PCB-l 1 OF DOCUMENTS ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS RESPONSE, 2 THAT YOU WITHHELD? 3 A. AS WE DEFINED THE REQUEST, WE 4 PRODUCED ALL RESPONSIVE DOCUMENTS. 5 Q. THE REQUEST IS FOR DOCUMENTS 6 RELATING TO MONSANTO'S DECISION TO NOTIFY ITS 7 CUSTOMERS IN ABOUT 1972 AND 1972 OF, AND I 8 EMPHASIZE, CERTAIN HAZARDOUS TURBINOLS AND PCS'So 9 SO THE REQUEST IS NOT DEFINED AS THE 10 WAY YOU DEFINE IT. 11 A. WELL, AS I SAID, AS I DEFINE THE 12 REQUEST, I PRODUCED THE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 13 RESPONSIVE. 14 Q. BUT YOU EXCLUDED PRODUCTS OTHER THAN 15 THOSE THAT YOU ENUMERATED. 16 A. OTHER THAN THOSE, THAT'S CORRECT. 17 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 18 THE BASIS THAT THERE WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 19 A. I DON'T BELIEVE SO. ON THIS ONE, 20 NO . 21 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 22 BECAUSE THEY WERE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 23 A. NO. 24 - Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 25 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED 144 WATER PCB-i 1 AFTER 1977? 2 A. NO 3 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 4 .HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 5 REQUEST? 6 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF, NO, MA'AM. 7 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 8 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 9 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 10 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 11 A. NO, MA'AM. 12 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 13 THE BASIS OF THE PHILADELPHIA PROTECTIVE ORDER? 14 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT THOSE DOCUMENTS 15 REFLECT COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN MONSANTO AND TEXAS 16 EASTERN ON THE REASONS WHY MONSANTO WAS 17 WITHDRAWING THIS PRODUCT FROM THE MARKET, THEY 18 MAY BE RESPONSIVE AND WOULD HAVE BEEN WITHHELD 19 FROM PRODUCTION BECAUSE OF THAT PROTECTIVE ORDER. 20 Q. AND AGAIN, THOSE RELATE TO THE 21 EXHIBITS TO THE DEPOSITION OF DR. HATTON. 22 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 23 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS OTHER 24 THAN THOSE ON THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT 25 BY MONSANTO IN THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 145 WATER PCB-l 1 A NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF 2 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 3 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THE TERM "CERTAIN HAZARDS" 4 IS ARGUMENTATIVE? 5 A. NO, MA'AM. 6 Q. THAT THE TERM IS VAGUE? 7 A. I DON'T RECALL ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 8 WERE EXCLUDED ON THAT BASIS. 9 Q. ON ANY BASIS OF CONFUSION ABOUT THE 10 WORDS "CERTAIN HAZARDS." 11 A. NO, NOT THE WAY WE HAVE DEFINED OUR 12 RESPONSE. 13 Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO REQUEST 14 NO. 14. 15 A. YES, MA'AM. 16 Q. WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THOSE 17 DOCUMENTS? 18 A. IN THE SAME PLACE, THE MONSANTO PCB 19 ARCHIVE. 20 Q. ARE THERE CERTAIN FILES WITHIN THOSE 21 ARCHIVES THAT PARTICULARLY HOLD DOCUMENTS THAT 22 ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST? 23 A. I WOULD LOOK IN THE FILES RELATING 24 ~~TO TOXICOLOGY, INDUSTRIAL HYGIENE, ANY FILES OF 25 COMPLAINTS OR QUESTIONS FROM CUSTOMERS. 146 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. ANY OTHER FILES? 2 A. RESEARCH FILES, POSSIBLY THE SPM'S 3 CONTAIN SOME INFORMATION ON TOXICITY AND SAFELY 4 HANDLING. 5 Q. AND THAT'S THE STANDARD PROCESS 6 MANUAL. 7 A. OF COURSE THE LABELS, BULLETINS, AND 8 BROCHURES, PRODUCT LITERATURE CONTAIN INFORMATION 9 ON THIS, AS WELL. 10 Q. DO WE HAVE THOSE DOCUMENTS? 11 A. YOU HAVE LABELS, BULLETINS AND 12 BROCHURES RELATING TO PRODUCTS THAT WERE SOLD TO 13 TEXAS EASTERN. 14 Q. AND THAT'S HOW YOU LIMITED THIS 15 REQUEST, JUST BY THE PRODUCTS THAT WERE SOLD TO 16 TEXAS EASTERN. 17 MR. PREUSS: AND TRANSWESTERN. 18 THE WITNESS: AND TRANSWESTERN. 19 BY MS. WELCH: 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANYDOCUMENTS BASED 21 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 22 A. NO, MA'AM. 23 Q. SO YOU WITHHELD DOCUMENTS BASED ON 24 ~THE ASSERTION THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT RELEVANT. 25 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 147 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. IF THEY PERTAIN TO PCB-CONTAINING 2 PRODUCTS THAT REFLECT ON HUMAN, ANIMAL, OR 3 AQUATIC HEALTH HAZARDS, BUT NOT PRODUCTS THAT 4 .WERE SOLD TO TRANSWESTERN. 5 A. WELL, I WOULD ARGUE WITH THE WORD 6 "HAZARDS." 7 BUT GENERALLY, INFORMATION RELATING 8 TO TOXICITY, AND SAFELY HANDLING, AND THINGS OF 9 THAT NATURE, WITH RESPECT TO OTHER PCB PRODUCTS, 10 WERE NOT PRODUCED. 11 Q. AND THE GROUND WAS THEY ARE JUST NOT 12 RELEVANT TO THIS LITIGATION. 13 A. THAT'S CORRECT, BECAUSE PCB'S ARE 14 NOT ALL ONE SUBSTANCE. THEY ARE A FAMILY OF 15 PRODUCTS -- OF SUBSTANCES AND OF PRODUCTS. 16 THIS IS A DIFFERENT 17 CHARACTERIZATION, AND WE PRODUCED WHAT WAS 18 RELEVANT TO THE PRODUCTS THAT WE SOLD TO TEXAS 19 EASTERN AND TRANSWESTERN. 20 Q. AND YOU MAINTAIN THAT THOSE 21 DOCUMENTS ABOUT RESEARCH INTO HAZARDS TO HUMAN, 22 ANIMAL, OR AQUATIC HEALTH THAT ARE ASSOCIATED 23 WITH PCB'S -- 24 -- A. OTHER THAN WHAT WAS SOLD TO TEXAS 25 EASTERN AND TRANSWESTERN. 148 WATER PCB-i 1 Q. -- ARE SIMPLY NOT RELEVANT. 2 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 3 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT QUANTITY 4 OF DOCUMENTS WE ARE TALKING ABOUT? 5 A. A LARGE QUANTITY, POTENTIALLY 6 HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF PAGES. 7 Q. AND WHAT ARE THE DATES OF THOSE 8 DOCUMENTS? 9 A. IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE FOR ME TO 10 RECALL THOSE DATES FOR YOU. 11 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA WHAT THE 12 EARLIEST DATES OF THE DOCUMENTS ARE? 13 A. THERE MAY BE SOME DOCUMENTS THAT 14 DATE FROM THE 1930'S. WE HAD INFORMATION 15 RELATING TO PCB PRODUCTS, THE TOXICITY AND SAFELY 16 HANDLING OF PCB PRODUCTS, FROM THE TIME WE BEGAN 17 SELLING THEM IN THE 1930'S. 18 Q. AND WHAT WOULD BE THE MOST RECENT 19 DATE? 20 A. I DON'T KNOW, I DON'T KNOW. 21 Q. ARE THERE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 22 CREATED AFTER 1977 IN EXISTENCE? 23 A. POSSIBLY. 24 _ Q. AND DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 25 ON THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE CREATED AFTER 1977? 149 WATER PCB-i 1 A. NOT IF THEY RELATE TO ONE OF THE 2 PRODUCTS THAT WERE ENUMERATED HERE. 3 Q. THAT WAS MY QUESTION. DID YOU 4 WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT WERE CREATED AFTER 5 1977 , IRRESPECTIVE OF PRODUCT. 6 A. I'M AFRAID I DON'T UNDERSTAND YOU. 7 LET ME SAY IT THIS WAY: IF A 8 DOCUMENT RELATED TO OS-81, OR MCS-153, OR 9 TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL AC, THE DOCUMENT WAS 10 PRODUCED, REGARDLESS OF ITS DATE. 11 OTHER DOCUMENTS MAY NOT HAVE BEEN, 12 BECAUSE THEY RELATE TO OTHER PRODUCTS. 13 Q. SO THAT WAS YOUR FIRST CUT. 14 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 15 Q. ONE OF THE GENERAL OBJECTIONS IS 16 THAT YOU WOULD NOT PRODUCE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE 17 CREATED SUBSEQUENT TO 1977; THAT'S WHY I ASKED 18 THAT QUESTION. 19 A . I UNDERSTAND. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 21 THE BASIS THAT THERE WAS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 22 A. NO . 23 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 24 ^RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST BECAUSE THEY WERE IN 25 THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 150 WATER PCB-l 1 A. ALL OP THE SCIENTIFIC PUBLISHED 2 LITERATURE THAT'S RELEVANT TO THESE PRODUCTS AND 3 THEIR COMPONENTS IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN WAS NOT 4 PRODUCED. 5 Q. DOES MONSANTO HAVE READY ACCESS TO 6 THOSE DOCUMENTS IN ITS ARCHIVES? 7 A. SOME OF THOSE DOCUMENTS PROBABLY. 8 Q. ARE THEY CATALOGUED? 9 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY 10 "CATALOGUED". 11 Q. ARE THEY ON ANY KIND OF COMPUTER 12 SYSTEM, CATALOGUE, OR INDEX? 13 A. WELL, THEY ARE. IF THEY WERE WITHIN 14 THE ARCHIVE, INFORMATION CONCERNING THOSE 15 DOCUMENTS IS AVAILABLE IN OUR COMPUTER LITIGATION 16 SUPPORT SYSTEM. 17 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 18 WERE DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 19 REQUEST? 20 A. NO, I AM NOT. 21 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 22 THE BASIS THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 23 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS - 24 -VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 25 A. NO, MA'AM. 151 WATER PCB-i 1 Q. AND YOU DID WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS ON 2 THE GROUND THAT THEY SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT 3 CUSTOMERS OR PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF. 4_ A. THAT'S CORRECT. 5 Q. DO ANY OF THESE DOCUMENTS RELATE TO 6 THE PROTECTIVE ORDER THAT WAS ENTERED IN 7 PHILADELPHIA? 8 A. I DON'T BELIEVE SO. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 10 WEREN'T KEPT BY MONSANTO IN THE REGULAR COURSE OF 11 BUSINESS? 12 A. NO. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 14 ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST ON THE GROUND THAT 15 THE REQUEST IS OVERBROAD? 16 A. YES . 17 Q. 18 REQUEST? WHAT IS THE OVERBREADTH OF THIS 19 A. AS I STATED BEFORE, IN THAT IT SEEKS 20 INFORMATION RELATING TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN WERE 21 SOLD TO TEXAS EASTERN AND TRANSWESTERN, IT IS, IN 22 MY OPINION, OVERBROAD. 23 24 ~ Q. A. HOW IS THE INFORMATION IRRELEVANT? AS I STATED BEFORE, PCB'S ARE NOT 25 ONE SUBSTANCE. THEY ARE A FAMILY OF SUBSTANCES 152 WATER PCB-l 1 AND PRODUCTS WITH DIFFERENT CHARACTERISTICS 2 Q. HOW IS THIS REQUEST NOT REASONABLY 3 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO DISCOVERABLE EVIDENCE? 4 A. FOR THE SAME REASONS THAT I HAVE 5 ALREADY STATED. 6 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 7 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "HAZARDS" IS OVERLY 8 BROAD, VAGUE, AMBIGUOUS, UNDEFINED, AND CAPABLE 9 OF VARIOUS INTERPRETATIONS? 10 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 11 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 12 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "AQUATIC HEALTH" IS 13 OVERLY BROAD, VAGUE, AMBIGUOUS, UNDEFINED, AND 14 CAPABLE OF VARIOUS INTERPRETATIONS? 15 A. NO, MA'AM, NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 16 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 17 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "HAZARDS" IS 18 ARGUMENTATIVE? 19 A. NO. . 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 21 THE GROUND THAT DOCUMENTS RELATED TO HUMAN, 22 ANIMAL, AND/OR AQUATIC HEALTH ARE NOT RELEVANT? 23 A. NOT ON THAT BASIS, NO. 24 ~ Q. ON WHAT BASIS THEN? 25 A. I'M SORRY? 153 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. SO IN OTHER WORDS, YOU ARE TELLING 2 ME THAT YOU PRODUCED ALL DOCUMENTS THAT RELATED 3 TO HUMAN, ANIMAL, AND/OR AQUATIC HEALTH. 4_ A. NO. I HAVE PRODUCED DOCUMENTS 5 RELATED TO HUMAN, ANIMAL, AND/OR AQUATIC HEALTH 6 WITH RESPECT TO THE THREE PRODUCTS. 7 Q. ONLY WITH RESPECT TO THE THREE 8 PRODUCTS, BUT NOT -- 9 A. I HAVE ALREADY TOLD YOU THAT. 10 Q. LET'S TURN TO REQUEST NO. 15, AND 11 ALL OF MY QUESTIONS RELATE TO THIS REQUEST. 12 WHERE DID YOU SEARCH FOR THESE 13 DOCUMENTS? 14 A. WITHIN THOSE FILES THAT CONTAIN THE 15 STUDIES CONDUCTED BY OR FOR MONSANTO. 16 Q. SO THERE ARE SPECIFIC SEGREGATED 17 FILES WITH STUDIES. 18 A. THAT CONTAIN MONSANTO SPONSORED 19 TOXICOLOGY STUDIES, YES. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 21 ON THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 22 A. NO, NOT IN RESPONSE TO THIS DEMAND, 23 NO. 24 ~ Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 25 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 154 WATER PCB-l 1 RELEVANT? 2 A. YES. 3 ONCE AGAIN, I PRODUCED COPIES OP 4 REPORTS OF TOXICOLOGICAL STUDIES CONDUCTED FOR 5 MONSANTO ON THREE PRODUCTS, TURBINOL 153, PYDRAUL 6 AC, AND THE AROCLORS WHICH ARE THE PCB 7 CONSTITUENTS OF THOSE PRODUCTS. 8 Q. ARE THERE TOXICOLOGICALSTUDIES THAT 9 RELATE TO OTHER PCB PRODUCTS, THAT YOU WITHHELD? 10 A. YES, MA'AM. 11 Q. AND WHAT IS THE QUANTITY OF THOSE 12 DOCUMENTS? 13 A. SEVERAL THOUSAND PAGES. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 15 THE BASIS THAT THERE IS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 16 A. NO. 17 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 18 BECAUSE THEY AREIN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 19 A. NO, NO. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 21 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED 22 AFTER 1977? 23 A. NO. 24 -- Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 25 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 155 WATER PCB-00031 1 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 2 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? 3 A. NO. 4 Q. AND YOU DID RESTRICT THE PRODUCTION 5 TO THE PRODUCTS THAT YOU HAVE MENTIONED; IS THAT 6 CORRECT? 7 A. THAT IS CORRECT. 8 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 9 SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER CUSTOMERS OR 10 PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 11 A. I DON'T UNDERSTANDTHAT. 12 MR. PREUSS: OTHER THAN TEXAS 13 EASTERN? 14 MS. WELCH: THAT'S RIGHT, AND 15 TRANSWESTERN. 16 THE WITNESS: I DID NOT CONDUCT A 17 SEARCH OF FILES RELATING TO CUSTOMERS OTHER THAN 18 TEXAS EASTERN, OR TRANSWESTERN, OR THE OTHER 19 ENTITIES THAT WERE EARLIER NAMED. 20 I DID PRODUCE ALL INFORMATION 21 CONCERNING THE THREE PRODUCTS THAT I MENTIONED, 22 IRRESPECTIVE OF THE CUSTOMER SOURCE OF THE 23 INFORMATION. 24 -- IF ANOTHER CUSTOMER WAS MENTIONED, 25 THE NAME OF THAT CUSTOMER WAS REDACTED. 156 WATER PCB-l 1 BY MS. WELCH: 2 Q. AS LONG AS IT WAS IN THE FILES THAT 3 WE TALKED ABOUT, THE TOXICOLOGY FILES. 4 A. WELL, ANY HEALTH INFORMATION, HEALTH 5 RELATED INFORMATION, ON ANY OF THESE PRODUCTS 6 WOULD HAVE BEEN CONTAINED WITHIN THE PRODUCT 7 FILES, REGARDLESS OF CUSTOMER ORIGIN OF THE 8 INFORMATION. 9 THAT INFORMATION ON THESE PRODUCTS 10 WAS PRODUCED, IF WE HAD IT. 11 Q. DO YOU HAVE FILES IN THE ARCHIVES OF 12 TURBINOL PRODUCTS, OR ARE THEY ISOLATED BY THE 13 SPECIFIC TURBINOL PRODUCT? 14 A. I'M NOT SURE PRECISELY HOW THEY ARE 15 KEPT . 16 Q. IS THERE ANYBODY WHO WOULD KNOW 17 THAT? 18 A. WELL, WE COULD DETERMINE THAT JUST 19 BY LOOKING AT THE FILE. 20 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS UNDER 21 THE PROTECTIVE ORDER, SPECIFICALLY THE 22 PHILADELPHIA PROTECTIVE ORDER, PROHIBITING YOU 23 FROM DISCLOSING THE DOCUMENTS? - 24 ~ A. NO. 25 Q. HOW ABOUT DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY 157 WATER PCB-0003! 1 DOCUMENTS THAT WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO IN THE 2 REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 3 A. NO. 4_ LET ME JUST SAY ONE MORE THING . I 5 SAID EARLIER THAT I DID NOT -- OR THAT WE DID NOT 6 DECLINE PRODUCTION OF DOCUMENTS ON THE BASIS OF 7 PUBLIC DOMAIN. 8 TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU INTERPRET 9 NO. 15 AS CALLING FOR SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE 10 PUBLISHED IN THE GENERALLY AVAILABLE SCIENTIFIC 11 LITERATURE, I DID NOT HAVE DOCUMENTS OF THAT TYPE 12 PRODUCED HERE. 13 I READ THIS DEMAND AS FOCUSING ON 14 STUDIES CONDUCTED BY MONSANTO OR OTHERS FOR 15 MONSANTO. 16 Q. FOR MONSANTO? 17 A. FOR MONSANTO. 18 SO IN OTHER WORDS, IF, FOR EXAMPLE, 19 A GOVERNMENT OR OTHER TOXICOLOGY LAB CONDUCTED ON 20 ITS OWN A TOXICOLOGY STUDY OF ONE OF THE 21 AROCLORS, THE COMPONENTS OF OS-81 AND MCS-153 , 22 AND THAT STUDY APPEARED IN THE PUBLISHED 23 LITERATURE, IT WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PRODUCED 24 -HERE . 25 I PRODUCED HERE THE STUDIES WHICH 158 WATER PCB-l 1 MONSANTO WAS CONNECTED WITH. 2 Q. SO YOU ARE SAYING A FAIR READING OF 3 THE REQUEST IS "ALL DOCUMENTS," ET CETERA, 4 J' CONDUCTED BY MONSANTO OR OTHERS," YOU INTERPRET 5 THAT TO BE MONSANTO OR OTHERS AT MONSANTO'S 6 REQUEST. 7 A. RIGHT. 8 Q. AND DO YOU HAVE IN THE ARCHIVES IN 9 ST. LOUIS OTHER DOCUMENTS THAT ARE AVAILABLE IN 10 THE PUBLIC DOMAIN, THAT YOU DIDN'T PRODUCE IN 11 RESPONSE? 12 A. I'M NOT SURE I FOLLOW THAT. 13 IF A DOCUMENT APPEARS IN THE 14 SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE, GENERALLY AVAILABLE IN THE 15 SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE, AS A GENERAL MATTER, WE 16 DID NOT RESPOND TO ANY DEMAND HERE. 17 Q. DESPITE THE FACT THAT IT IS SITTING 18 IN THE ARCHIVES IN ST. LOUIS. 19 A. WELL, A GREAT MANY DOCUMENTS ARE 20 SITTING IN THE ARCHIVES IN ST. LOUIS, YES . 21 Q. IN OTHER WORDS, I AM NOT ASKING 22 WHETHER YOU SEARCHED THE SCIENTIFIC LITERATURE" 23 THROUGHOUT THE UNITED STATES. I AM SIMPLY ASKING 24 -ABOUT THOSE DOCUMENTS IN YOUR CUSTODY, 25 POSSESSION, OR CONTROL IN ST. LOUIS. 159 WATER PCB-l 1 A. RIGHT. 2 Q. AND THE QUESTION IS, DID YOU 3 WITHHOLD DOCUMENTS THAT ARE IN ST. LOUIS ON THE 4 A SIS THAT THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE IN THE PUBLIC 5 DOMAIN. 6 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 7 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 8 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THIS REQUEST IS OVERBROAD? 9 A. YES, MA'AM. 10 Q. AND HOW IS THIS REQUEST OVERBROAD? 11 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT ITRELATES TO OR 12 SEEKS INFORMATION RELATING TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN 13 OS-81, MCS-153, TURBINOL 153, PYDRAUL AC, AND THE 14 AROCLORS CONTAINED IN THOSE PRODUCTS, IT IS 15 OVERBROAD SINCE THOSE SUBSTANCES WERE NOT SOLD TO 16 TEXAS EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN. 17 Q. SO AGAIN, ON THE BASIS OF LIMITING 18 IT TO CUSTOMERS AND PRODUCTS; THAT'S THE GROUND. 19 A. WELL, WE LIMITED IT TO PRODUCT. 20 IF YOU WILL RECALL, I HAVE ADVISED 21 YOU THAT WE PRODUCED INFORMATION RELATING TO 22 THESE PRODUCTS, THAT MAY HAVE HAD ITS GENESIS " 23 WITH CUSTOMERS OTHER THAN TEXAS EASTERN OR 24 -TRANSWESTERN, ALTHOUGH I PROBABLY DID HAVE 25 REDACTED THE NAMES OF THOSE CUSTOMERS. 160 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 2 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "HAZARDS" IS OVERLY 3 BROAD, VAGUE, AMBIGUOUS, UNDEFINED, OR CAPABLE OF 4 ^VARIOUS INTERPRETATIONS? 5 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 6 Q. HOW ABOUT THE TERM "AQUATIC HEALTH"? 7 A. I AM NOT SURE WE HAD ANY AQUATIC 8 STUDIES DONE. BUT IF WE DID, WE PRODUCED THEM. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 10 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "HAZARDS" IS 11 ARGUMENTATIVE? 12 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 14 RELATED TO HUMAN, ANIMAL, AND/OR AQUATIC HEALTH 15 AS NOT RELEVANT? 16 A. NO, MA'AM. 17 Q. AND AGAIN, YOUR INITIAL CUT WAS ON 18 THE BASIS OF PRODUCT. 19 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 20 Q. SO THE DOCUMENTS THAT YOU PRODUCED 21 IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST, AS IN YOUR RESPONSES 22 TO ALL OTHER REQUESTS, ARE LIMITED BY PRODUCT .' 23 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 24 -- Q. AND THEN BY CUSTOMER. 25 A. AS APPROPRIATE. 161 WATER PCB-l 1 Q. TURN TO REQUEST NO. 16, AND ALL THE 2 FOLLOWING QUESTIONS PERTAIN TO REQUEST NO. 16. 3 A. UM-HUM. 4 Q. WHERE WITHIN THE ST. LOUIS ARCHIVES 5 DID YOU SEARCH FOR THESE FILES? 6 A. WE LOOKED IN THE PRODUCT FILES FOR 7 MCS -- EXCUSE ME, FOR TURBINOL 153, OS-81, AS 8 WELL AS TEXAS EASTERN, TRANSWESTERN, AND THE 9 OTHER THREE COMPANIES WHOSE NAMES I'D HAVE TO GO 10 BACK AND READ RIGHT NOW, THE ONES EARLIER 11 REFERRED TO. 12 Q. SOCAL - 13 A. SOCALGAS, PACIFIC LIGHTINGSERVICE 14 COMPANY, AND PACIFIC GAS SUPPLY COMPANY, TO THE 15 EXTENT WE HAD INFORMATION ON ANY OF THOSE. 16 Q. DO ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS EXIST THAT 17 RELATE TO THE OPERATION OF NATURAL GAS PIPELINES 18 AND NATURAL GAS COMPRESSORS, AS TO IN ANY OTHER 19 CUSTOMER? 20 A. NOT THAT I AM AWARE OF. 21 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 22 ON ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? " 23 A. NO, MA'AM. 24 ~' Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS BASED 25 ON THE ASSERTION THAT THE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 162 WATER PCB-l 1 RELEVANT? 2 A. WELL, I DID NOT CONDUCT A SEARCH OF 3 MY ENTIRE ARCHIVE TO DETERMINE WHETHER SOMEWHERE 4 WE MIGHT HAVE SOME GAS COMPRESSOR, OTHER THAN THE 5 AREAS I HAVE ADVISED YOU. 6 Q. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE - 7 A. THOSE WERE THE MOST LIKELY AREAS. 8 Q. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE, ARE THERE ANY 9 OTHER AREAS WHERE THERE MIGHT BE INFORMATION 10 PERTAINING TO THIS SUBJECT? 11 A. IT IS POSSIBLE, ALTHOUGH I DON'T 12 KNOW HOW PROBABLE IT IS, BUT IT'S POSSIBLE. IT ' S 13 A THEORETICAL MATTER THAT THERE MIGHT BE SOME 14 INFORMATION IN INDIVIDUAL CUSTOMER FILES. 15 Q. CAN YOU NAME WHICH CUSTOMERS THOSE 16 ARE. 17 A. NOT OFFHAND. 18 Q. ARE THERE OTHER PIPELINESCUSTOMERS? 19 A. YES. 20 Q. AND MIGHT THATINFORMATION BE IN THE 21 OTHER PIPELINE CUSTOMER FILES? 22 A. IT ' S POSSIBLE, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF 23 IT IS. . 24 -- Q. ABOUT HOW MANY OTHER PIPELINE 25 CUSTOMERS ARE THERE? 163 WATER PCB-l 1 A OFFHAND, I COULDN'T TELL YOU MORE 2 THAN ONE, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY. 3 Q. IS IT LESS THAN 15? 4 A. I DON'T KNOW. 5 Q. IS IT MORE THAN 50? 6 A. I DOUBT IT, PERSONALLY. 7 Q. SO IT ' S BETWEEN ONE AND 25. 8 A. I DON'T KNOW. 9 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 10 ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST ON THE BASIS THAT 11 THERE IS NO PROTECTIVE ORDER? 12 A. NO. 13 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 14 BECAUSE THOSE DOCUMENTS ARE IN THE PUBLIC DOMAIN? 15 A. NO. 16 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 17 THE BASIS THAT THEY WERE PRODUCED OR CREATED 18 AFTER 1977? 19 A. NO. 20 Q. ARE YOU AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 21 HAVE BEEN DISCARDED, THAT ARE RESPONSIVE TO THIS 22 REQUEST? 23 A. NO, I'M NOT. 24 - Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS THAT ' 25 RELATE TO PRODUCTS OTHER THAN OS-81, MCS-153, 164 WATER PCB-l 1 TURBINOL 153, OR PYDRAUL AC? 2 A. I DID NOT HAVE A SEARCH CONDUCTED OP 3 FILES RELATING TO THOSE PRODUCTS, TO DETERMINE 4 -WHETHER INFORMATION RELATING TO THE OPERATION OF 5 NATURAL GAS PIPELINES AND GAS COMPRESSORS EXISTED 6 IN THOSE FILES. 7 IT WOULD BE VERY SURPRISING TO ME IF 8 THAT INFORMATION DID EXIST IN OTHER PRODUCT 9 FILES, HOWEVER. 10 Q. SO IN OTHER WORDS, YOU DON'T BELIEVE 11 THAT THERE ARE ANY OTHER DOCUMENTS IN OTHER 12 PRODUCT FILES RELATING TO THIS REQUEST. 13 A. I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THERE IS, 14 THAT'S CORRECT. 15 Q. I ASKED IF YOU DID NOT BELIEVE. 16 A. I DON'T BELIEVE -- I DON'T KNOW 17 WHETHER THERE IS. I DON'T BELIEVE IT'S LIKELY 18 THAT THERE IS, THAT THERE MAY BE. 19 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 20 THE GROUND THAT THE TERM "TURBINOL OR OTHER 21 PCB-CONTAINING GAS COMPRESSOR LUBRICANTS" IS 22 VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS? ` 23 A. NO, I DID NOT. 24 ~' Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 25 THE GROUND THAT THEY SEEK INFORMATION ABOUT OTHER 165 WATER PCB-l 1 CUSTOMERS OR PERSONS, OTHER THAN PLAINTIFF? 2 A. I DID NOT HAVE A SEARCH CONDUCTED OF 3 OTHER CUSTOMERS FILES, BECAUSE I BELIEVED ANY 4 INFORMATION CONTAINED IN THIS FILES WOULD NOT BE 5 RELEVANT HERE. 6 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 7 THE GROUND THAT THE PHILADELPHIA PROTECTIVE ORDER 8 GOVERNED THESE DOCUMENTS? 9 A. NO. 10 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS ON 11 THE GROUND THAT THEY WERE NOT KEPT BY MONSANTO IN 12 THE REGULAR COURSE OF BUSINESS? 13 A. NO. 14 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTSBASED 15 ON THE OBJECTION THAT THIS REQUEST IS OVERBROAD? 16 A. AGAIN, THE SEARCHES WERE FOCUSED IN 17 SPECIFIC AREAS, AND NOT OTHERS. 18 . AND TO THAT EXTENT, WE DID NOT 19 SEARCH OTHER CUSTOMER FILES, OTHER PRODUCT FILES 20 IN THAT AREA, BASED UPON OUR CONTENTION THAT TO 21 BE PUT TO SUCH A SEARCH WOULD BE OVERLY BROAD AND 22 UNDULY BURDENSOME. - 23 Q. DID YOU WITHHOLD ANY DOCUMENTS 24 -BECAUSE PLAINTIFF IS IN A BETTER POSITION TO HAVE 25 THE INFORMATION? 166 WATER PCB-l 1 A. I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY DOCUMENTS THAT 2 WE HAVE WITHHELD ON THAT BASIS, NO. 3 Q. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO TURN TO REQUEST 4 NO. 17. 5 WHERE IN THE ST. LOUIS ARCHIVES DID 6 YOU SEARCH FOR THESE DOCUMENTS? 7 A. MY RECOLLECTION IS THAT NO SPECIFIC 8 SEARCH WAS CONDUCTED IN RESPONSE TO THIS REQUEST. 9 Q. DOES THAT MEAN THAT YOU DID NOT 10 PRODUCE ANY DOCUMENTS, SPECIFIC DOCUMENTS? 11 A. I DON'T BELIEVE THERE ARE ANY 12 DOCUMENTS. SOME OF THE DOCUMENTS PRODUCED IN 13 RESPONSE TO OTHER REQUESTS MAY CONTAIN 14 INFORMATION RESPONSIVE TO 17. 15 Q. SO IN OTHER WORDS, THERE ARE NO 16 DOCUMENTS THAT RELATE TO ANY GAS COMPRESSOR 17 LUBRICANT NOT CONTAINING PCB'S. 18 A. NO, I DIDN'T SAY THAT. 19 Q. THERE ARE NO DOCUMENTS RELATING TO 20 THE DEVELOPMENT, DESIGN, TESTING, MANUFACTURE, 21 MARKETING, ADVERTISING, DISTRIBUTION, AND SALE 22 DURING THE RELEVANT PERIOD OF ANY GAS COMPRESSOR 23 LUBRICANT NOT CONTAINING PCB'S. 24 -- A. I DIDN'T SAY THAT, EITHER. 25 Q. WHY DON'T YOU TELL ME WHAT YOU DID 167 WATER PCB-l 1 SAY 2 A. WHAT OUR RESPONSE INDICATES IS THAT 3 WE UNDERTOOK NO SPECIFIC SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS 4 SPECIFICALLY RESPONSIVE TO THIS DEMAND. 5 HOWEVER, DOCUMENTS PRODUCED IN 6 RESPONSE TO OTHER DEMANDS MAY CONTAIN INFORMATION 7 RESPONSIVE TO 17. 8 Q. WHY DID YOU UNDERTAKE NO SPECIFIC 9 SEARCH FOR DOCUMENTS SPECIFICALLY RESPONSIVE TO 10 THIS DEMAND? 11 A. BECAUSE I FELT IT NOT TO BE 12 RELEVANT. 13 Q. ON WHAT GROUNDS IS IT NOT RELEVANT? 14 A. BECAUSE THIS LITIGATION CONCERNS 15 PRODUCTS THAT WERE SOLD BY MONSANTO TO TEXAS 16 EASTERN AND TRANSWESTERN. 17 Q. DO ANY DOCUMENTS EXIST THAT ARE 18 RESPONSIVE TO THIS REQUEST? 19 A. YES. 20 Q. AND WHAT QUANTITY OF DOCUMENTS ARE 21 THOSE? 22 A. OFFHAND, I DON'T KNOW. ' 23 Q. TURNING NOW FROM EXHIBIT 4, I HAVE 24 SOME GENERAL QUESTIONS TO ASK YOU. I HAVE A LIST 25 OF PEOPLE, WHO I AM INTERESTED IN FINDING OUT IF 168 WATER PCB-l 1 THEY STILL WORK AT MONSANTO, OR IF YOU CAN GIVE 2 ME ANY IDEA WHERE THEY ARE. 3 AND IF YOU CAN INDICATE JUST IF THEY 4 STILL WORK AT MONSANTO. AND IF THEY DON'T, IF 5 YOU CAN INDICATE WHERE WE MIGHT FIND WHERE THEY 6 LIVE OR WORK. IF THERE IS ANY HUMAN RESOURCES 7 CENTER AT MONSANTO, OR PENSION PLAN, HEALTH PLAN, 8 WHATEVER. 9 JACK T. GARRETT. 10 A. MR. GARRETT IS NOT CURRENTLY A 11 MONSANTO EMPLOYEE. 12 Q. DO YOU KNOW WHERE WE CAN CONTACT 13 HIM? 14 A. WELL, I WOULD STRENUOUSLY OBJECT TO 15 ANY CONTACTS, OTHER THAN THROUGH MR. PREUSS . 16 Q. WOULD MR. PREUSS BE ABLE TO PROVIDE 17 US WITH INFORMATION ABOUT WHERE MR. GARRETT IS? 18 MR. PREUSS: WELL, LET ME JUST STATE 19 THAT THIS REALLY GOES BEYOND THE SCOPE OF A 20 CUSTODIAN DEPOSITION. 21 IF YOU HAVE SOME REASONABLE GROUND 22 FOR WANTING TO KNOW WHETHER THEY ARE OR AREN'T' 23 EMPLOYEES, ET CETERA, YOU CAN GIVE ME A LIST OF . 24 THE PEOPLE. IF YOU WANT TO KNOW WHERE THEY ARE, 25 WE CAN GET THAT INFORMATION FOR YOU. 169 WATER PCB-l 1 MS. WELCH: WELL, MR . BISTLINE IS IN 2 CHARGE OF PCB-RELATED LITIGATION. ALL OF THESE 3 PEOPLE ARE PEOPLE WHO WERE INVOLVED, IN SOME 4 FACET OR IN SOME WAY, WITH THE DEVELOPMENT OR 5 RESEARCH IN TERMS OF PCB, AND HE MIGHT HAVE 6 KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THAT. 7 MR. PREUSS: WELL, HE MAY. 8 BUT THE PURPOSE OF THIS DEPOSITION 9 WAS NOT TO ANSWER THOSE KINDS OF QUESTIONS. IT 10 WAS TO RESPOND AS CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS TO 11 DOCUMENTS PRODUCED; AGREED? 12 MS. WELCH: THAT WAS THE NOTICE OF 13 DEPOSITION. 14 HOWEVER, IF HE COULD JUST INFORM ME 15 WHETHER THESE PEOPLE ARE STILL EMPLOYEES, IT 16 WOULD EXPEDITE THE PROCESS OF DISCOVERY GREATLY. 17 DO YOU HAVE ANY OBJECTION TO THAT, 18 JUST ANSWERING WHETHER THEY ARE STILL EMPLOYEES 19 OR NOT? 20 MR. PREUSS: WELL, I DON'T HAVE ANY 21 OBJECTION TO DOING THAT, PER SE, BUT WITH THE 22 CAVEAT THAT WE HAVE A STRENUOUS OBJECTION TO ANY 23 CONTACTING OF ANY EMPLOYEES. 24 -- MR. GRANT: THAT'S NOT GOING TO BE 25 DONE. THAT WAS JUST A MISSTATEMENT. NOBODY HERE 170 WATER PCB-l 1 HAS ANY INTENTION OF CALLING ANYBODY AT MONSANTO 2 DIRECTLY, ANY DEPARTMENT AT MONSANTO, OR ANYBODY 3 ELSE . 4 BY MS. WELCH: 5 Q. SO MR. GARRETT NO LONGER WORKS AT 6 MONSANTO. 7 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 8 Q. ALL RIGHT. 9 HOW ABOUT W.B. PAPAGEORGE? 10 A. MR. PAPAGEORGE IS RETIRED FROM 11 MONSANTO, AS WELL . 12 Q. HOW ABOUT DR. CRADDOCK? 13 A. DR. CRADDOCK IS CURRENTLY EMPLOYED 14 AT MONSANTO. 15 Q. DR. HATTON. 16 A. DR. HATTON IS RETIRED FROM MONSANTO. 17 Q. DR. POGUE, P-O-G-U-E. 18 A. I AM UNCERTAIN. I DON'T KNOW 19 WHETHER HE IS CURRENTLY EMPLOYED OR NOT. 20 Q. C.L. BRADFORD. 21 A. I AM NOT SURE WHETHER HE'S RETIRED 22 OR NOT. 23 Q. CARL L. CLAY. 24 A. I DON'T KNOW. 25 Q. JOHN G. FREDERIKSEN. 171 WATER PCB-l 1 A. I DON'T KNOW. 2 Q. D.W. STEGEN, S-T-E-G-E-N. 3 A. I DON'T KNOW. 4 Q. T.L. GOSSAGE, G-O-S-S-A-G-E. 5 A. MR. GOSSAGE IS NO LONGER EMPLOYED BY 6 MONSANTO. 7 Q. IS THERE ANY MEANS BY WHICH WE CAN 8 CONTACT THESE PEOPLE AND NOTICE THEM FOR 9 DEPOSITION, THAT YOU ARE AWARE OF? 10 MR. PREUSS: IF YOU HAVE A REQUEST 11 THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO TAKE UP WITH ME, I WILL 12 MAKE A REASONABLE INQUIRY AND ADVISE YOU AS TO 13 WHETHER THEY CAN BE. 14 MS. WELCH: SOME OF THESE PEOPLE ARE 15 FORMER EMPLOYEES AND MAY NO LONGER BE WITHIN THE 16 CONTROL OF MONSANTO. THAT'S WHY I'M ASKING . 17 THE WITNESS: I ASSUME THAT IF WE 18 ARE GIVEN AN APPROPRIATE REQUEST, WE WOULD 19 PROVIDE YOU WITH LAST-KNOWN ADDRESSES. IT'S 20 STANDARD PRACTICE. 21 MS. WELCH: OFF THE RECORD FOR A 22 MINUTE. . 23 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD.) 24 MS. WELCH: BACK ON THE RECORD. 25 Q. YOU TESTIFIED EARLIER THAT YOU WERE 172 WATER PCB-l 1 IN CHARGE OF PCB-RELATED LITIGATION FOR MONSANTO; 2 IS THAT CORRECT? 3 A. THAT'S CORRECT. 4 Q. COULD YOU GENERATE A LIST OF THE 5 PCB-RELATED LAWSUITS IN WHICH MONSANTO HAS BEEN A 6 PARTY. 7 A. ARE YOU ASKING ME IS IT POSSIBLE? 8 Q. FIRST, IS IT POSSIBLE? 9 A. YES, IT IS POSSIBLE. 10 Q. AND WILL YOU DO THAT. 11 A. NO, MA'AM, NOT WILLINGLY. 12 Q. WHY WOULD YOU NOT DO THAT? 13 A. I DON'T SEE THE RELEVANCE TO THIS 14 MATTER. 15 Q. THE NEXT QUESTION, I WANTED TO REFER 16 BACK TO EXHIBIT 2, THE "BUSINESS WEEK" ARTICLE, 17 AND IN PARTICULAR THE STATEMENT THAT YOU MADE, 18 THAT WE REFERRED TO BEFORE, THAT "WE DISCLOSED 19 WHAT WE KNEW WHEN WE KNEW IT." 20 A. YES, MA'AM. 21 Q. I WOULD LIKE TO ASK YOU IN TERMS OF 22 TEXAS EASTERN OR TRANSWESTERN, WHETHER YOU WERE 23 REFERRING TO CONTACTS WITH THOSE CORPORATIONS, AS 24 WELL, IN THAT STATEMENT? 25 MR. PREUSS: AGAIN, THIS IS BEYOND 173 WATER PCB-l 1 THE SCOPE OF THIS DEPOSITION. 2 I WILL PERMIT HIM TO ANSWER THAT 3 QUESTION. 4_ THE WITNESS: IN GENERAL, MY 5 RESPONSE IS THAT MONSANTO DISCLOSED PUBLICLY IT 6 KNOWLEDGE OF THE SAFE USE OF PCB'S, THAT THERE 7 WERE CONCERNS ABOUT PCB'S, ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERNS 8 WE HAD, BOTH PUBLICLY AND PRIVATELY, IN MATERIAL 9 THAT WAS SUPPLIED WITH THE PRODUCTS, LABELS, 10 TECHNICAL BROCHURES, AND DIRECT COMMUNICATIONS 11 WITH CUSTOMERS, WITH THE GOVERNMENT, WITH ANYBODY 12 WHO ASKED US. 13 BY MS. WELCH: 14 Q. AND DO WE HAVE DOCUMENTS THAT 15 REFLECT DISCLOSURES TO TEXAS EASTERN AND 16 TRANSWESTERN? 17 A. TO THE EXTENT THAT I WAS ABLE TO 18 FIND THEM IN THE FILES THAT WE HAVE, YES. 19 Q. AND MY FINAL QUESTION: HAS MONSANTO 20 EVER, IN CONNECTION WITH ANY LITIGATION, BEEN 21 SUBJECTED TO DISCOVERY SANCTIONS? 22 MR. PREUSS: I WILL OBJECT AS 23 IRRELEVANT. 24 -- INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. 25 MS. WELCH: YOUR INSTRUCTION IS ON 174 WATER PCB-l 1 THE GROUND OF ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE? 2 MR. PREUSS: SURE. 3 MS. WELCH: HOW IS THAT 4 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE, IF IT'S IN THE PUBLIC 5 DOMAIN. 6 MR. PREUSS: IT'S EASILY AVAILABLE 7 TO YOU. IT'S NOT RELEVANT TO THIS DEPOSITION. 8 MS. WELCH: WELL, YOU CAN'T INSTRUCT 9 ON RELEVANCY. 10 MR. PREUSS: WELL, I HAVE DONE IT. 11 BY MS. WELCH: 12 Q. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE CASE OF 13 SLAUGHTER VERSUS MONSANTO IN THE TEXAS DISTRICT 14 COURT? 15 A. YES, I AM. 16 Q. ARE YOU FAMILIARWITH THE FACT THAT 17 DISCOVERY SANCTIONS WERE LEVIED AGAINST MONSANTO 18 IN THAT CASE? 19 A. YES. 20 Q. CAN YOU TELL ME WHAT THE GROUNDS FOR 21 THE DISCOVERY SANCTIONS WERE. 22 A. I WASN'T INVOLVED IN THAT CASE AT 23 THAT TIME, SO IT WOULD JUST BE HEARSAY ON MY , 24 -PART . 25 Q. WERE YOU IN CHARGE OF THAT 175 WATER PCB-l 1 LITIGATION? 2 A. NOT AT THAT TIME, NO. 3 Q. IN 1989 YOU WERE NOT IN CHARGE OF 4 _THAT LITIGATION? 5 A. NO, MA'AM, I WAS NOT. 6 Q. WHO WAS IN CHARGE OF THAT 7 LITIGATION? 8 A. MR. BERENDT. 9 Q. TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU KNOW, DO YOU 10 KNOW WHY DISCOVERY SANCTIONS WERE LEVIED IN THAT 11 CASE? 12 MR. PREUSS: INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO 13 ANSWER, BASED ON ANY INFORMATION THAT YOU 14 OBTAINED THROUGH ATTORNEY DISCUSSIONS. 15 BY MS. WELCH: 16 Q. ARE YOU AWARE WHETHER IT WAS BECAUSE 17 OF REFUSAL TO PRODUCE RELEVANT INFORMATION, 18 NAMES, OR DOCUMENTS? 19 A. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IT WAS NOT 20 ON THAT BASIS. 21 Q. WHAT IS YOUR UNDERSTANDING? 22 A. MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IT WAS 23 BASED UPON CLAIMS THAT THOSE DOCUMENTS WERE NOT 24 PRODUCED; NOT THAT WE REFUSED TO PRODUCE THEM. 25 Q. WHAT IS THE DISTINCTION? 176 WATER PCB-l 1 A. IN MY MIND, THE DISTINCTION IS THAT 2 WE DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT THOSE DOCUMENTS AT THE TIME 3 THAT THE DISCLOSURE REQUEST WAS MADE. BUT HAD WE 4 KNOWN, WE WOULD HAVE PRODUCED THEM. 5 WHEN WE DISCOVERED THE DOCUMENTS, WE 6 DID PRODUCE THEM. 7 Q. THEN WHY WERE SANCTIONS LEVIED, IF 8 IT WAS AN HONEST ERROR? 9 MR. PREUSS: WELL, OBJECTION. CALLS 10 FOR SPECULATION AS TO WHAT WAS IN THE JUDGE'S 11 MIND THAT ISSUED THE SANCTIONS. 12 BY MS. WELCH: 13 Q. WELL, YOU CAN ANSWER. 14 A. OUR POSITION WAS THAT THE SANCTIONS 15 WERE IMPROPERLY IMPOSED. 16 MS. WELCH: IF WE CAN GO OFF THE 17 RECORD FOR JUST A SECOND. 18 (DISCUSSION HELD OFF THE RECORD.) 19 MS. WELCH: BACK ON THE RECORD. 20 I BELIEVE THAT COMPLETES THE 21 DEPOSITION OF THE CUSTODIAN OF RECORDS. 22 OF COURSE WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO 23 CONDUCT ANOTHER DEPOSITION AT ANOTHER TIME OF 24 MR. BISTLINE IN ANOTHER CAPACITY. 25 AND THE DEPOSITION IS COMPLETED. 177 WATER PCB-l 1 (WHEREUPON, AT 2 j15 P.M. , 2 THE DEPOSITION OF THOMAS M. BISTLINE 3 WAS ADJOURNED.) 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 178 WATER PCB-l 1 STATE OF CALIFORNIA ) 2 COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES ) SS. 3 4 5 I, THOMAS Mo BISTLINE, HEREBY 6 CERTIFY UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY UNDER THE LAWS 7 OF THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA THAT THE FOREGOING IS 8 TRUE AND CORRECT. 9 EXECUTED THIS__ ______________ DAY OF 10 __________________________________ , 1991, AT 11 , CALIFORNIA. 12 13 14 15 THOMAS M. BISTLINE 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 179 WATER PCB-l 1 STATE OF CALIFORNIA ) 2 COUNTY OF LOS ANGELES ) SS. 3 4 I, DIANE KENDY, C.S.R. NO. 4851, IN AND FOR 5 THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA, DO HEREBY CERTIFY: 6 THAT, PRIOR TO BEING EXAMINED, THE WITNESS 7 NAMED IN THE FOREGOING DEPOSITION, TO WIT, THOMAS 8 M. BISTLINE, WAS BY ME DULY SWORN TO TESTIFY THE 9 TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH; 10 THAT SAID DEPOSITION WAS TAKEN DOWN BY ME 11 IN SHORTHAND AT THE TIME AND PLACE THEREIN NAMED, 12 AND THEREAFTER REDUCED TO TYPEWRITING UNDER MY 13 DIRECTION, AND THE SAME IS A TRUE, CORRECT AND 14 COMPLETE TRANSCRIPT OF SAID PROCEEDINGS; 15 I FURTHER CERTIFY THAT I AM NOT INTERESTED 16 IN THE EVENT OF THE ACTION. 17 WITNESS MY HAND THIS * DAY OF 18 1991 19 20 21 CERTIFIED SHORTHAND 22 REPORTER FOR THE 23 STATE OF CALIFORNIA 24 25 WATER PCB-i 1 CORRECTION LIST 2 3 PAGE/LINE FROM TO 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 181 WATER PCB-00035