Document v67bnMkN0LL90Kx69B4DY9vLb

FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT 2 NORTHERN DISTRICT OF ALABAMA 3 EASTERN DIVISION 4 5 WALTER OWENS, et al., ) 6 Plaintiffs, ) 7 8 vs. ) ) CIVIL ACTION NO. 9 ) CV-P-440-E 10 MONSANTO COMPANY, ) 11 Defendant. ) 12 13 DEPOSITION OF: JIM PINKSTON 14 15 In accordance with Rule 5 (d) of The 16 Alabama Rules of Civil Procedure, as Amended, 17 effective May 15,1988,1, TAMMY JENNINGS 18 GREGORY, am hereby delivering to MR. LARRY WRIGHT 19 the original transcript of the oral testimony 20 taken on the 1st day of December, 1999, along 21 with exhibits. 22 Please be advised that this is the same and 23 not retained by the court reporter, nor filed OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036383 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 2 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 with the Court. 2 The deposition of Jim Pinkston was taken 3 before Tammy R. Jennings Gregory, commencing at 4 1:10 P.M. on the 1st day of December, 1999, by 5 the Plaintiffs, at the law offices of Fite & 6 Miller, Anniston, Alabama pursuant to the 7 stipulations set forth herein. 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036384 22 23 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 3 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 APPEARANCES 2 3 Appearing For The Plaintiffs: 4 MITHOFF & JACKS, LLP 5 By: Larry Wright, Esquire 6 111 Congress Avenue, Suite 1010 7 Austin, Texas 78701 8 9 Appearing For The Defendant: 10 SMITH, HELMS, MULLISS & MOORE 11 By: Michael E. Kelly Esquire 12 300 North Greene Street 13 Suite 1400 14 Greensboro, North Carolina 27401 15 16 Also Present: 17 Russell Wills, Videographer 18 19 Court Reporter: OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036385 20 Tammy R. Jennings Gregory 21 22 23 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 4 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 INDEX 2 3 Witness: Jim Pinkston 4 Stipulations...........................page 5 5 Examination by Mr. Wright............. page 7 6 Reporter's Certificate................ page 22 7 8 9 10 11 EXHIBITS 12 13 (No exhibit were marked for identification, 14 admitted, or attached as exhibits hereto.) 15 16 17 OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036386 18 19 20 21 22 23 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 5 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 STIPULATIONS 2 3 IT IS STIPULATED AND AGREED by and 4 between the parties through their respective 5 counsel that the deposition of Jim Pinkston may 6 be taken before Tammy R. Jennings Gregory, at the 7 law offices of Fite & Miller, Anniston, Alabama 8 on the 1st day of December, 1999. 9 10 11 IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED that 12 the signature to and the reading of the 13 deposition by the witness is waived, the 14 deposition to have the same force and effect as 15 if full compliance had been had with all laws and OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036387 16 rules of court relating to the taking of 17 depositions. 18 19 20 IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED that 21 it shall not be necessary for any objections to 22 be made by counsel to any questions, except as to 23 form or leading questions, and that counsel for 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 6 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 the parties may make objections and assign 2 grounds at the time of trial or at the time said 3 deposition is offered in evidence or prior 4 thereto. 5 6 7 IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED that 8 the notice of filing of the deposition is waived. 9 10 11 12 13 OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036388 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 7 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 STATE OF ALABAMA, CITY OF ANNISTON, 2 DECEMBER 1, 1999, 3 1:10PM., 4 5 JIM PINKSTON, 6 having been first duly sworn, was examined and 7 testified as follows: 8 9 COURT REPORTER: Usual stipulations 10 okay? 11 MR. WRIGHT: Usual stipulations. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036389 12 MR. KELLY: Yes. 13 14 EXAMINATION BY MR. WRIGHT: 15 Q. Good afternoon, Mr. Pinkston. Thank you for 16 coming down. 17 My understanding is you've never 18 given a deposition? 19 A. No. 20 Q. You did have an opportunity to talk with Mr. 21 Kelly briefly before the deposition, I 22 assume? 23 A. Right. 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 8 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 Q. Okay. You understand that we're taking 2 testimony that can be used in a case that's 3 pending by some residents of Anniston against 4 Monsanto? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Okay. And do you understand that the 7 testimony you're giving today carries the 8 same force and effect as if you were sitting 9 in front of the judge and jury at the OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036390 10 courthouse? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Let me just get two agreements from you, if I 13 can. One is: Is that if I ask you a 14 question that you don't understand, you stop 15 me and ask me to rephrase it, and I'll be 16 glad to do that. Okay? 17 A. Okay. 18 Q. And the second thing is: If you would, 19 answer out loud verbally so that she can 20 write the answers down. Okay? 21 A. Okay. 22 Q. Now, if you forget, like everybody does, if 23 you forget to answer out loud, I might go 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 9 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 like this (indicating) and point at our court 2 reporter, and that's a signal to you that you 3 didn't answer out loud and you need to make a 4 verbal response. Okay? 5 A. Okay. 6 Q. When did you go to work for Monsanto? 7 A. March the 1st, '65. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036391 8 Q. And what was your first job? 9 A. I started out in the PNP department. 10 Q. What were you doing there? What was your job 11 there? 12 A. Well, just as an operator. 13 Q. Okay. And how long did you stay in the PNP 14 department? 15 A. I stayed through the summer of '65. 16 Q. Okay. Then where did you go? 17 A. I went to the aroclor department in the fall, 18 sometime in the fall of '65. 19 Q. As an operator? 20 A. As an operator. 21 Q. And how long did you stay in the aroclor 22 department? 23 A. I stayed until it shut down, and I believe in 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 10 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 '72. They announced it in'71, the latter 2 part. But sometime in '72 it shut down. 3 Q. That's what the documents seem to indicate is 4 maybe May of '72; does that sound about 5 right? OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036392 6 A. Probably. 7 Q. And then where did you go? 8 A. I went back to the PNP department. 9 Q. And did you stay there until you retired? 10 A. No, I stayed there probably'77. I went to 11 shipping for two years. 12 Q. And how long were you there? 13 A. For about two years in shipping. Went back 14 to PNP for about a year. 15 Q. Then where did you go? 16 A. Then I went to maintenance for four or five 17 year, and about '85,1 came back to PNP and 18 stayed until I retired. 19 Q. PNP was your home away from home? 20 A. Home away from home. 21 Q. When did you retire? 22 A. December the 1st of'94. 23 Q. When you went to work in the aroclor 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 11 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 department, who was your supervisor? 2 A. Tom Lackey was my foreman and -- Tom Lackey 3 and Mr. Williams was the foremans, and I OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036393 4 believe Bernard Stevens was the supervisor. 5 Q. What do you remember hearing about why the 6 aroclor plant was going to shut down? 7 A. Vaguely all I remember about it was something 8 about bird eggs wouldn't hatch or something 9 that they -- 10 Q. Okay. When do you think you heard that? 11 A. Well, it was probably in the latter part of 12 '71. 13 Q. Very shortly before the shutdown was 14 announced? 15 A. Right. 16 Q. Do you remember how the shutdown was 17 announced? 18 A. I sure don't. All I remember is I'd just 19 bought a new car, and they announced they 20 were going to shut it down. 21 Q. And that made you nervous? 22 A. Made me nervous. 23 Q. Do you remember when y'all quit making liquid 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 12 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 aroclors? OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036394 2 A. I guess we made it right on up until about 3 the time of the shutdown. 4 Q. Okay. You don't remember there being a 5 cutoff for one very much before you cut off 6 the solid? 7 A. I don't remember. 8 Q. What sources of spills and leaks do you 9 remember from your time in the aroclor 10 department? 11 A. Well, it was a couple times a spill would be 12 a tank that run over pumping from one to the 13 other. 14 Q. Okay. What else? 15 A. Of course, you had pumps with seals around 16 them, but we had drip pans plus a bucket 17 under that. Very little got out, you know, 18 very little spill from the pumps, but I do 19 recall a couple timesa tank getting run 20 over. 21 Q. Okay. What other leaks besides the pumps do 22 you recall? 23 A. Well, around the drumming station, sometimes 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 13 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036395 1 when they'd be drumming out a drum, 2 occasionally a drum might get overfilled for 3 some reason. 4 Q. Okay. What else do you remember? 5 A. I guess that would be about all would be your 6 pumps and maybe a tank occasionally get run 7 over around the drumming area. 8 Q. What about flanges? 9 A. Well, if a flange ever -- if maintenance ever 10 worked on a line, we always blowed them out 11 and pretty well had them -- for safety 12 reasons, you know, no liquid in them. 13 Q. Right. But the flange -- I mean, if it went 14 bad, it would leak before they fixed it 15 presumably? 16 A. Well, you didn't have too much of that. 17 Yeah, I guess it would drip. But most of 18 that stuff, if you had a leak at a flange, it 19 would just be a drip. 20 The stuff set up about the time it 21 got cold, most of it, especially on the 22 solids. 23 Q. Now, do you remember any changes in the 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 14 OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036396 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 operation between '65 and 72, or did it stay 2 pretty much the same? 3 A. Stayed pretty much the same as I recall. 4 Q. Can you think of any changes that were 5 instituted between '65 and 72? 6 A. No, not really. 7 Q. Now, the limestone pits down there, did you 8 ever go down to the limestone pits? 9 A. No, I can't say I did. 10 Q. Did you ever go to the chlorine plant? 11 A. I might have walked through it when I first 12 went to work there, but I never worked in it. 13 Q. Did you ever hear any of the -- I'm going to 14 say the older guys -- talking about the 15 project for the Chemical Core or the Army -- 16 A. No. 17 Q. -- over there? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Did you ever take samples from the ditches 20 around the plant? I know you took samples o 21 aroclor, but I'm talking about water samples 22 or soil samples from around the plant. 23 A. Not in that period of time. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036397 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 15 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 Q. Okay. Not during the aroclor period? 2 A. Not during the aroclor. 3 Q. When did you take samples? 4 A. Well, it was probably after '86 when I went 5 back to PNP. We kind of had to -- PNP run 6 waste treatment then and then we, you know, 7 we took samples of the water that went to it. 8 Q. When's the first time you heard about PCBs 9 being found off of Monsanto property? 10 A. I really can't say. I don't know. 11 Q. Was it before the aroclor plant shut down? 12 A. No, I'm sure I didn't hear it then. 13 Q. There's -- I've seen a couple documents that 14 talk about seeing globules of aroclor in the 15 water going to the limestone pits and coming 16 out of the limestone pits. Do you remember 17 seeing aroclor globules in the water? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Do you remember seeing them sample the air 20 for PCBs around the plant? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Were you there when they had the meeting OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036398 23about PCBs and health? Do you remember 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 16 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 anything like that? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Do you remember Monsanto -- anybody from 4 Monsanto -- ever saying anything about PCBs 5 and health? 6 A. Not in that time frame. 7 Q. What time frame did you hear about it? 8 A. Well, I'll say after about '85 or '86, they 9 got real particular with the biphenyl, which 10 they still make, and our benzene, and all 11 that was brought out then, you know. 12 Q. What did they tell you about PCBs and health? 13 A. Well, PCBs, I never did really hear much 14 about it, but they said the biphenyls was -- 15 what do you call it? -- can cause cancer. 16 I can't even say that word now. 17 But it was -- it had been found to cause it 18 in animals anyhow. 19 Q. Cancer and something else? 20 A. No, it's the same thing as -- well, heck. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036399 21 Q. Carcinoma? 22 A. Yeah, I guess that's what it was. 23 Q. And you're thinking that was talk about the 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 17 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 straight biphenyls and not polychlorinated 2 biphenyls? 3 A. Well, that was the first I'd heard about it. 4 I mean, that's the first it was -- I guess 5 any of the operators and all knew anything 6 about it. 7 Q. Okay. Who told you about it then? 8 A. Well, it was just -- 9 Q. -- talk around the plant? 10 A. Talk about the plant and be brought out in 11 safety meetings and whatever. 12 Q. Did they tell you that you needed to be 13 careful and not get it on you and not get it 14 in your mouth and stuff like that? 15 A. Yeah. That was after'80 though. 16 Q. As far as you know, was your blood ever 17 tested for PCB s? 18 A. No, it's never been tested. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036400 19 Q. Where do you live now? 20 A. Alexander. 21 Q. Where did you live when you were working at 22 Monsanto? 23 A. Well, I lived at Wellborn just down below the 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 18 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 plant until '87. 2 Q. Is that where you're from? 3 A. No, I'm from Albertville on Sand Mountain. 4 Q. Are there anymore questions you'd like for me 5 to ask you? 6 A. Whatever. 7 Q. I don't think I have anymore questions for 8 you. I appreciate you coming down. 9 I guess let me just ask kind of a 10 cleanup question. 11 Other than the bird eggs and then 12 this later discussion aboutcancer or 13 carcinoma, do you remember any other 14 discussion about the effects of PCBs or 15 environmental hazards oranything like that? 16 A. No. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036401 17 MR. KELLY: Let me obj ect to the 18 form for the record, because I don't think 19 that his discussion about what he heard in 20 the '80s had to do with PCBs, and I don't 21 believe he testified that it did. 22 Q. (By Mr. Wright) You think biphenyl causes 23 cancer? We need to amend our position to add 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 19 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 that if that's the case. 2 Do you know whether this talk about 3 cancer was limited only to unchlorinated 4 biphenyl, or did it include chlorinated 5 biphenyls? 6 A. Well, when they began talking about it, they 7 was real particular in handling benzene and 8 any of the products that was made on the 9 hill, you know, if you worked on a compressor 10 or whatever, you know. It was -- they got a 11 lot more particular with it. 12 Q. Right. 13 A. But that was in the '80s, I'd say. 14 Q. I know PCBs were used in transformers at OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036402 15 Anniston. Can you think of other places 16 where aroclors were used? 17 A. All I know is we shipped it for -- GE bought 18 a lot of it. 19 Q. Right. 20 A. A truck out of Roam, Georgia that got a load 21 every day, and, I guess, different ones 22 bought it. Sent out about a tank car full 23 pretty often. 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 20 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 Q. Did you use it -- or was it used in the 2 Anniston plant, for example, in heat 3 exchangers? Did y'all use aroclors? 4 A. They used what they call a therminol that 5 they -- it was aroclor that they heated, you 6 know, and used to -- 7 Q. Right. Where was that used? 8 A. Well, it was used in aroclor and some of the 9 other -- 10 Q. In the biphenyl department? 11 A. Well, the santowax, or whatever, I think they 12 had some of that. OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036403 13 Q. Did they continue using therminol after the 14 PCB plant shut down for some of those other 15 operations? 16 A. I believe they used some therminol, but now I 17 don't know whether it was aroclor or not or 18 something else, but they did have a therminol 19 -- what we call a therminol system heater. 20 Q. Other than any discussion you had with Mr. 21 Kelly, have you talked with anybody else 22 about any of the lawsuits against Monsanto? 23 A. No. 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 21 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 Q. I don't think I have any other questions. 2 Thank you for your time. 3 4 (Deposition concluded at 1:30 p.m.) 5 FURTHER THE DEPONENT SAITH NOT. 6 7 8 9 10 OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036404 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO 22 FOSHEE & TURNER COURT REPORTERS 1 CERTIFICATE 2 3 STATE OF ALABAMA ) 4 CALHOUN COUNTY ) 5 6 I HEREBY CERTIFY that the above and 7 foregoing transcript was taken down by me in 8 stenotype, and the questions and answers thereto OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036405 9 were transcribed by means of computer-aided 10 transcription, and that the foregoing represents 11 a true and correct transcript of the testimony 12 given by said witness. 13 I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am neither 14 of counsel, nor of any relation to the parties to 15 the action, nor am I anywise interested in the 16 result of said cause. 17 18 19 20 21 TAMMY R. JENNINGS GREGORY Notary Public, State of Alabama 22 MY COMMISSION EXPIRES: 9-12-2001 23 2001 PARK PLACE, SUITE 220 BIRMINGHAM, ALABAMA 35203 1-800-888-DEPO OWENS 05-15-1988 Pinkston, Jim.txt[8/22/2017 4:02:03 PM] HARTOLDMON0036406