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STATE OF ALABAMA IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF CALHOUN COUNTY MARS HILL MISSIONARY BAPTIST CHURCH, et al., Plaintiffs, CIVIL ACTION NUMBER versus CV-96-243 MONSANTO COMPANY, et al., Defendants. / DEPOSITION OF BLAKE HAMILTON The deposition of BLAKE HAMILTON was taken before Deborah Salers Garrett, Certified Shorthand Reporter, Registered Professional Reporter, as Commissioner, commencing at 10:00 a.m. on March 20, 1998, by the Plaintiffs, at the law offices of Merrill, Porch, Dillon & Fite, Suite 500, 1000 Quintard Avenue, Anniston, Alabama, pursuant to the stipulations set forth herein. Regional Reporting Service, Inc. 755 Walnut Street Gadsden, Alabama 35901-0755 2 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034184 APPEARANCES For the Plaintiffs: CHARLES CUNNINGHAM, Esq. Morrissey Building, Suite 200 304 West Liberty Street Louisville, Kentucky 40202 DONALD W. STEWART, Esq. MR. TAYLOR STEWART STEWART & SMITH 1131 Leighton Avenue Anniston, Alabama 36201 For the Defendants: WILLIAM G. COX, III, Esq. ADAM PECK, Esq. LIGHTFOOT, FRANKLIN & WHITE 300 Financial Center 505 North 20th Street Birmingham, Alabama 35203 ARTHUR F. FITE, III, Esq. MERRILL, PORCH, DILLON & FITE P. O. Box 580 Anniston, Alabama 36202 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 3 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034185 INDEX Stipulations Reporter's Certificate Page 4 195 EXAMINATIONS Witness: BLAKE HAMILTON By Mr. Cunningham Page 6 EXHIBITS Plaintiffs' Marked One 194 Offered 194 No other exhibits were marked for identification, offered or attached as exhibits hereto. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034186 4 STIPULATIONS IT IS STIPULATED AND AGREED by the parties, through their respective counsel, that the deposition of BLAKE HAMILTON may be taken before Deborah Salers Garrett, CSR, RPR, as Commissioner and Notary Public, Alabama at Large, at Anniston, Alabama, on March 20, 1998, at 10:00 a.m. IT IS STIPULATED AND AGREED that the signature to and reading of the deposition by the witness is waived, the deposition to have the same force and effect as if full compliance were had with all laws and rules of Court relating to the taking of depositions. IT IS STIPULATED AND AGREED that it shall not be necessary for any objections to be made by counsel to any questions except as to form or leading questions and that counsel may make objections and assign grounds at the time of trial or at the time said deposition is offered in evidence or prior thereto. IT IS STIPULATED AND AGREED that notice of filing by the Commissioner is waived. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034187 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 5 STATE OF ALABAMA, ANNISTON, MARCH 20, 1998 BLAKE HAMILTON, after having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows: MR. COX: Charlie, for the record, I know you guys' admissions for pro hoc have just been recently filed and a hearing is set. We don't have a problem with you taking the deposition today even though you are not yet admitted. We assume there is going to be nothing to prevent you from being admitted down the road. MR. CUNNINGHAM: I certainly hope not. MR. COX: But in between now and the time, we may have some folks that we want to either take or defend depositions MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034188 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 6 that are not admitted but will be ultimately. If we can just have the same agreement on the record that it is not a problem if we have somebody that is not admitted in the State of Alabama to either defend or take a deposition down the road, we will proceed. MR. CUNNINGHAM: Absolutely. EXAMINATION BY MR. CUNNINGHAM: Q. Mr. Hamilton, I'm going to ask you some questions today. My name is Charlie Cunningham. We are here to try and find out what factual knowledge you may have to aid all of us in understanding the issues that are being resolved in this litigation. If I ask you something that doesn't make sense to you, please do not MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034189 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 7 assume that I know what I'm talking about because chances are I don't. Another thing that is a bad habit of mine is I'll cut you off in the middle of an answer because something will spring to my mind. And by all means, if you feel you need to complete that answer, we want to do that. The bottom line is this lady needs to be able to take down what you say so that when we read it a month or a year or a decade from now, it reads accurately. A. Thank you. Q. Start off with some easy ones. What is your name and address, please? A. My name is Blake Edward Hamilton. We currently -- we, I and my wife -- currently reside at 18 Edgefield Way, Anniston, Alabama, 36207. I'm not real familiar -- the ZIP code is not firmly set in my mind, but that is the right one. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034190 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 8 Q. And how long have you lived in Anniston, Alabama? A. We moved here on May 22nd, 1997. Q. Okay. And before that where did you reside? A. We resided in -- Well, it is a greater suburb of Pensacola, Florida. It was called Cantonment, Florida. The address there was -- Q. That's okay. How long did you reside in Pensacola? A. Since -- We moved there in August of 1989. Q. And before that what community did you live in? A. We lived in the city of Friendswood, Texas, a suburb between Houston and Galveston. Q. Okay. And when did you move to Friendswood? A. We moved to Friendswood in May of 1974. Q. Okay. And I'll go back one more spot. Before Friendswood where did you reside? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034191 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 9 A. We resided in Knoxville, Tennessee. Q. For purposes of picking a jury, it sounds like I don't have to worry too much about winding up with a lot of Blake Hamilton relatives in the Calhoun County jury pool. Is that a safe assumption? A. Charlie, I do a lot of genealogy work on my family, and I have yet to find a Hamilton in Alabama that was a part of my family. There are a lot of Hamiltons, but not anyone in my family. Q. And I didn't mean to suggest that I would be worried if I did. Now, let's talk about education. Where did you graduate high school? A. I lived in -- My family lived in Kingsville, Texas, and the high school there was H. M. King High School. I attended -- At that time, tenth grade was high school, so tenth through twelfth. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034192 Q. And where did you graduate college? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 10 A. I graduated college from what was called Texas A and I University, also located in Kingsville, Texas. Q. And what was your degree in? A. I got a bachelor of science in chemical engineering. It would have been January 1970. Q. Have you done any postgraduate education in the formal university setting? A. I have not attended any university for formal course work. I've done seminars and things, but no credit type works toward my masters. Q. That's my next question. I assume you have done some continuing education of some form over the years? A. Yes. From time to time as part of my career path and plans, I did attend some classes. Yes. Q. Were these typically classes that were put together by your employer, or would they typically be something that some MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034193 independent institution would hold or a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 11 mixture? A. Probably best characterized, Charlie, as a mixture. There was some in-house training within Monsanto and then also a few, not many, but some, external developed seminars, classes. Q. Okay. Are you a PE? A. No. I did not get professional registration. Q. Let's go to employment history, and let's work from the time that you graduated from Texas A and I in 1970. Just tell me what sort of things you have done for a living since that time. A. Okay. I started working for Union Carbide in Houston in January of'70 at what was called then their engineering center in Houston. So I was a process engineer. From there I transferred sometime in 1972 to Oak Ridge, Tennessee. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034194 Q. Still with Union Carbide? A. Yes. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 12 Q. I presume this was at a manufacturing facility in Houston? A. No, it was not. It was strictly an engineering center where we did the typical process engineer design for some of the Union Carbide facilities. Q. If somebody wanted to put a new reactor vessel on line, you would do the drawings and calculations on the size of the pipes and feed stock rates and that sort of stuff? A. We do the typical process flow sheets, material balances, some preliminary design work for processes that would be going into facilities. Yes. Q. Okay. So then you went to -- Still with Union Carbide up in Tennessee? A. That's correct. Union Carbide was the primary contractor, I think was the term, for -- at that time known as the Atomic Energy Commission. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034195 Q. Okay. A. And again -- So this was my first REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 13 plant-located work assignment. Again, doing process technical engineering for the facility there, and was there until May of 1974, at which time I terminated my employment with Union Carbide, relocated to Friendswood, and began to work for Monsanto at their Chocolate Bayou plant in Alvin, Texas. And the initial assignment in Alvin was, again, process engineering. Specifically it was called process technology department, and worked in that assignment for a year and a half, something like that. Q. May I safely assume that your leaving Union Carbide and going with Monsanto was something you chose to do? A. That's correct, Charlie. I had reached a point where the kind of assignments that I could see coming just didn't MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034196 appear to be what I was interested in, so I looked for another opportunity. Q. Okay. What sort of things -- Was this a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 14 manufacturing facility in Alvin, there on Chocolate Bayou? A. Yes. Q. What sort of things were they making in 74? A. My responsibilities -- We can start there and then talk about others. We had a facility -- a manufacturing facility that produced phenol and acetone. Additionally to that we produced acrylonitrile, something called soft alkylbenzene, ethylene, and other hydrocarbons from a cracking -- an oil-base cracking operation. Q. Is that pretty much all the stuff at Alvin was taking petroleum and breaking it down into these kinds of chemicals? A. That's right. We got crude oil distillates primarily from Louisiana gas fields that we cracked and did other MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034197 steps and operations with to sell and produce for other customers. Q. And were you still basically in the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 15 process design mode? Was that really where your responsibilities lay? A. My initial year and a half to two years was in the process technology, doing trouble shooting, process optimizations, some expansions, de-bottlenecking, design work specifically. Q. I'm assuming that was a mature facility in the sense it had been up and running for a good period of time? A. Yeah. Chocolate Bayou started up in 1961 as I recall, 1961 or'62. I think it was '61. Q. Go on then if you would, please, and tell me how your position with Monsanto changed over the years. A. Sure. I made a career change from process engineering into what was called manufacturing at that time, sometime, MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034198 say, a year and a half to two years after my initial assignment at the Chocolate Bayou plant, specifically because I had worked in the engineering REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 16 design for a phenol, acetone plant. The offer was to become a manufacturing engineer in the phenol, acetone manufacturing operation. So I did that for several years; moved from there to engineering, kind of a project manager over a major agricultural product that was produced there to put in a large expansion. Q. And would that have been at one of these other locations, in Pensacola, or was this still -- A. No. This is still at the Bayou. Q. Okay. A. Then was given the opportunity to supervise -- this would have been early '80s probably or late 70s, early '80s probably -- my first opportunity to do some management of an engineering group, MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034199 technical group, in support of some units there; and from there moved into a manufacturing supervisor overseeing this soft alkylbenzene that I mentioned REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 17 earlier. I had some other units, expanded my responsibility, but still a manufacturing supervisor there. And that led to 1989, then, when I was offered a general superintendent role, which is what it was called, again just broader management responsibilities for manufacturing at the Pensacola facility. So we moved in August of 1989, where I assumed the role of general superintendent of nylon intermediates at Pensacola and was in that assignment -- The name changed to facilitator, but the role of being a member of the plant manager's staff continued until 1997, at which time I came to Anniston as the site manager for the -- still at that MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034200 time Monsanto manufacturing site, where I currently work now as site manager for Solutia at the Anniston site. Q. Am I correct in understanding that if we looked at the organizational hierarchy REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 18 for Solutia you would be at the top of that chart? A. In September -- Well, prior to that, when we knew we were going to spin off, the entire organization made some organizational changes, creating a matrix organization with a movement of plant manager to a, quote, site manager, and many other positions across the organization that traditionally reported to the plant manager having a strong functional line to business managers and shared service managers in St. Louis, dotted line to the site manager. So while I have the accountability for Solutia at the Anniston site, the direct reporting relationship is different than it would have been pre MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034201 1997. So when you say I'm at the top of the organization chart, yes, I am, but there are a lot of dotted line reportings and then hard lines for many of the other people there to St. Louis. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 19 Q. Okay. That sounds like Internet to me. I just know everybody is connected and somehow they all can talk to each other. A. Absolutely, and need to talk to each other. Yes. Q. I wanted to ask you very briefly a couple of financial questions. Do you own stock in Solutia? A. We have a savings, investment plan that started in Monsanto and now as Solutia that as we invested money -- It was a matching fund in the form of stock. So I have access to stock of both Solutia and Monsanto through that plan. I can't just go grab it. It is there for when I retire, but indirectly I own stock there. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034202 Q. You are in a fund that holds the stock? A. Solutia and Monsanto stock, that's correct, a 401-k plan to be specific. Q. Do you receive a bonus that is tied to the financial success of Solutia? A. As a member of a grade level series REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 20 management, I do get -- I have the opportunity to earn an incentive bonus at the end of each year, depending on how well the organization has done. Q. Okay. Let me talk to you briefly about your preparation for today. And I neither want to know or am entitled to know about conversations you have had with any of your attorneys to get ready for today. But if you have talked to other people, I would like to know who those people were and what they chatted about. A. I'm sorry? Q. If you talked to anybody to get ready for today, if you went down the hall and sat down in front of somebody and said MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034203 catch me up to date on this or that or, hey, you know, you are at dinner with one of your colleagues and said I'm going to be deposed by some yahoo from Kentucky -- A. I talked to lots of people about the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 21 fact I was going to be deposed today, and I was not looking forward to it. In fact I was going to struggle with my one motto of having fun every day, and you are making it difficult for me to say that today, but I'm going to find it somewhere. But to say I briefed myself with specifics about this -- Q. No reason to think that you would have. A. No, no. I mean, I looked -- Q. Because I'm really -- A. -- at my own list of things just to say, hey, is there anything I need to think about today, but did not talk to anybody. Q. I want your own personal knowledge MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034204 anyway, so that's going to make things easier for us. What about documents or any other items that you might have looked at by way of review? Anything that you can recall thinking I had better go read this or look up this before I sit down REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 22 and start talking about this stuff? A. I did. I did look at some things. Q. What documents do you recall looking at? A. I looked at my cost sheets for -- cost sheets for the Anniston site, just from a general sense, just seeing if there was anything there that I might need to pull up based on questions and the 1998 budget that we have in place today for the Anniston manufacturing facility. Q. Okay. A. And I - MR. COX: I sent you the deposition notice. A. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The fax, I got -- MR. COX: Just for the record, MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034205 when I got it in, I just turned around and faxed it to Blake so he could look at it. A. I didn't read that today, but I did look at that. Q. Sometime in the prior week or two? A. Yes. And I did review one -- a pamphlet REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 23 that we have had in our foyer of the plant there that talks about the Anniston history. I frankly just looked at that to see what it might refresh in my background on what I have heard about the history of this operation and the changing, evolving businesses that have come in, just a short pamphlet there at the plant. Q. Okay. I'm going to presume as you testify today that you are telling me stuff that you know of your own independent knowledge. But to the extent you are relying upon this sort of stuff or something that someone told you MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034206 in the past, just let us know so we can understand where it is coming from for you. Okay? A. (Witness nods head affirmatively.) Q. Now, I presume you didn't see anything in that pamphlet, for example, that was inconsistent with your own perception of the history of the plant from being REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 24 there, seeing things, anything that was surprising to you? I'm going to put it that way. A. The page I read about the history of the plant was pretty simple. So no, there was nothing there that I recall of a surprise. It was more a refreshing of my memory. Q. Okay. Well, to the best you can in a fairly short time, tell me what your responsibilities are as the site manager for the Solutia Anniston facility. A. As I said earlier, I have the accountability -- Solutia uses something called a distinction between MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034207 responsibilities and accountabilities. Q. Okay. A. And I would characterize me having the "A" or accountability for the operations of the Anniston facility and its responsibility -- or its continuing relationship with the community, I will say, interaction with the community. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 25 Q. Okay. A. And there are others then on the staff and in the plant who have the responsibility for managing and doing the specific activities that make up and lead up to that accountability. So specifically I have accountability for the businesses that are operated and engaged from that plant from manufacturing standpoints back to the vendor and to the customer. I have the accountability for providing leadership to the site leadership team, which is -- if you want MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034208 to talk about a hierarchy, it is the group of managers or leaders that I look to to responsibly run and operate the plant. So my role and accountability is to kind of coach them, develop them, have frequent contacts with them so that we are aligning our operations, our performance, our goals with the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 26 enterprise, Solutia's goals. And thirdly, an external focus I have the accountability for, and that is developing communications within the community in the context of identifying priorities within the community and seeing where those priorities merge with Solutia's and seeing if there are opportunities to work either with hours in doing things in the community or in some cases some contributions and also identifying issues in the community that we as a site and operating entity here need to work with and address. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034209 Q. It is my sense from listening to you that there is a set of goals or targets or Solutia corporate framework of here is what we are trying to accomplish. And within that framework you are expected to be consistent and you are accountable for making sure that the local plant is consistent with those goals which might in some cases be REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 27 economic and in other cases be community relations related? A. There are some strategic perspectives that come down from the enterprise to all the operating and business arms of Solutia, and those tend to be longer term focused. Our role is on a shorter term, as well as long term, of how do we assure ourselves of aligning the businesses and operations toward those strategic perspectives. Q. When it comes to spending money, do you, again within a certain framework, have MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034210 some discretion in terms of how capital expenditures or community relations expenditures would be spent, or do you have someone you answer to at a certain level, or is it fluid? A. Solutia is new, so I'll speak about Solutia for 1998 -- Q. Okay. A. -- to speak to that specifically. In our budgeting process, which we did in REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 28 late 1997, we reviewed our budgeted operating expected rates, expected raw material usage, energy usage, costs, head count, et cetera. And from that changes were made, but we reached an agreement with the corporation then on what that operating budget would be. And now we have the freedom, to use that word. We can operate within that budget without going back and getting further approval from that. Q. Okay. A. Capital, we again present a capital MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034211 budget. A lot of conversation changes that take place there, but it is on the capital plan list. But capital is different. We then -- As we develop a project, it is taken to St. Louis for review and ultimate approval or disapproval. So there is no guarantee on capital. Contributions, the third entity you mentioned, again there is a 1998 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 29 budget process separate from our operating budget, where each plant manager, site manager within a region -- I'm in region one -- come present our arguments for programs, projects, activities we would like to support and have funds for. And within that region a decision -- The total dollars were set by St. Louis. We agree on which site receives which of those funds. So now I have the authorization to request from St. Louis a check in those amounts as we MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034212 are ready to initiate those programs and activities. Q. And how many other sites are in region one? A. The number -- Pensacola, Florida; Foley, Alabama; Decatur, Alabama; Augusta, Georgia; and Greenwood, South Carolina. So there are five plus Anniston, so six total. Q. Do you know if Anniston has been allotted less than a sixth, roughly a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 30 sixth, or more than a sixth of region one's expenditures or budgeted expenditures for these sort of external outreach efforts for the coming year? A. Anniston's percentage of the total for our region is less than one-sixth of the total for our region one. Q. Okay. And I'm going to guess that you don't have one clearly delineated immediate supervisor in St. Louis based on this matrix type organization. But is there someone in St. Louis or MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034213 wherever, for lack of a simpler or better way of putting it, who is kind of your boss? A. Strangely enough, Charlie, I do have a boss, a boss, not multiple. I'm in what is called operations excellence. All site managers are part of that. And every site manager, including the Anniston facility, is accountable to Dennis Cavner, who is the operational excellence vice president. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 31 Q. Okay. Now, let me take you in the opposite direction. And working just with the folks you have here in Anniston, how many employees do y'all have just in total head count? A. It is a dynamic as people retire and we hire. But we have at Anniston something close to eighty-eight permanent employees, Charlie. It may change one or two in any given month, but that is about where we are. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034214 Q. And again, this may be an oversimplification or a dated way of looking at it. But how many of those would be what are traditionally considered blue collar as opposed to white collar positions? MR. COX: Would it be hourly wage versus salary? Is that a better distinction? A. We have wage row, which are the hourly, nonexempt, traditional nonexempt, clerical, technical, and then exempt. I REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 32 want to guess probably fifty wage row, probably have nine or ten nonexempt, and then the rest would be exempt. What is that -- Q. Twenty-five to thirty? A. Exempt. Q. Now, that strikes me as a somewhat -- I don't want to say top heavy, but you have a significant number of people in the exempt status vis-a-vis -- or the ratio to hourly wage type people. What MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034215 sort of positions are these twenty-five to thirty exempt people filling? Obviously your slot would be one of those. A. I have various leaders for each of -- Well, I have an operations superintendent, for instance, and he has several area supervisors, maintenance supervisors, laboratory chemists, shipping supervisor, accounting or accountant. Q. Okay. And I take it all of these people REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 33 would report to you through some chain of command and possibly even, as you were saying for instance, the lab supervisor perhaps has somebody in St. Louis in the lab department there that they also communicate with on a regular basis? A. The lab supervisor does not report to an entity in St. Louis. Q. The accountant maybe? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034216 A. Yes. The accountant has a controller function that is a hard line to that group. Q. Okay. A. And as you say, most of the folks at the site would have a reporting relationship through a site leader to St. Louis but a dotted line into my accountability. Q. Okay. Now, are there people working there who have been sent down from St. Louis as part of this remediation? I'm thinking of Alan Faust, who I have met and who I perceive to be here -- and he REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 34 is a Monsanto or maybe a Solutia employee, but outside the normal realm of what you have going on. Am I right or wrong about that? A. Specially Alan Faust is part of -- part of the ESH -- environmental, safety, and health -- organization in St. Louis, and within that specific remediation group that is within the ESH department. So his reporting relationship is back to MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034217 St. Louis to a remediation director, I think is the title. So, yes, he is a Solutia employee. He has been relocated to Anniston for an indeterminate period of time on leading the remediation effort. But it is not part of the manufacturing or operations of that site. Q. Does he have a dotted line to you where he keeps you posted, or to a certain extent is what he is doing here independent of you? A. He has no reporting relationship to me, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 35 but he certainly -- We have an understanding that because of my accountability within the site and within the community around the operations of our site that we need to talk about issues that do come up in remediation, that they do so so that I'm at least knowledgeable of those, where it makes sense. And I talk to him about MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034218 our current operations so that he is equally aware of things that we have going on. Oftentimes there could be interferences in terms of scheduling people, as a good example. It is important we don't have people showing up at the same workplace thinking they are going to work on their job only to find there is another group working. So we need to have some communications. Q. Okay. The number you gave me of about eighty permanent employees, that head count I'm assuming didn't include Alan? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 36 A. No. I don't count him. I don't count Alan as part of our head count. Whether my numbers were eighty-seven, eighty-eight, eighty-five, I don't know. But he is not part of it. Q. Eighty-eight is maybe what you are allotted in the plant system, and you may not have exactly those on a given day but that's your target, so to speak? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034219 A. That's correct. Q. Do you know if there are other people like Alan who may be down here in Anniston who are somehow employed by Solutia or Monsanto like he is but again are not part of your ongoing manufacturing operations setup? A. There are no Solutia employees located at the site. There certainly are Solutia employees that periodically come to Anniston, and that would be true of people coming to visit the operations side of the house as well as there are people who come and have their primary REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 37 focus for remediation but are not located here. Q. Now, let me ask you about the physical acreage that the site is located on. Am I correct in understanding that that is owned by Monsanto or Solutia? A. The operating site for the Anniston facility and its landfills are owned by MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034220 Solutia. And we have additional purchased properties that were traditionally outside of the fence and outside of the fence line, and they also now belong to Solutia. Q. Stated differently, there is no acreage that you all are operating on or that you have permanently stored waste on that is actually deeded to some other entity. Is that an accurate statement? A. Charles, to the best of my knowledge, we own all of the land that we operate or have stored things on permanently. There have been -- I don't know the qualifications. There have been and are REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 38 occasionally shipments of solids to a landfill operation outside of our operations, and that is permanent too. Q. Right. And I'm not alluding to those. A. Okay. Q. The one thing -- I do know at one point in time some land had been deeded to the power company, but it is my sense that MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034221 got deeded back, the west end landfill, part of the west end landfill, and I'm sure this is all before your time. A. Yes. I've heard of that incident and heard, you know, in terms of us deeding it to them and having to I believe purchase it back. But I don't have any knowledge of it, specifically have not seen any deeds nor paperwork. Now, we do still have right-of-way up on Coldwater Mountain, the land we own, that both the power company and BellSouth have right-of-ways. We own it. Q. Okay. And I had seen a photograph not REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 39 that old, as I understand it, a fence on the landfill, keep out, and indicating all three of those entities as being owners of the landfill, was my sense. But your understanding is they simply had right-of-way easements through that acreage? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034222 A. I know on Coldwater Mountain, which is to the south, across 202, both the power company, Alabama Power, and I believe BellSouth have right-of-ways going through our properties. Now, they may own properties beyond our acreage. I don't have knowledge. But through our properties they have right-of-way easements, guarantees, is my understanding. Q. Okay. Are you aware of any waste that is in these landfills, the west end landfill or the one on Coldwater Mountain that wasn't generated at the Monsanto facility, that the source of it was the ongoing operations in Anniston? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 40 A. Charles, I have no knowledge of what went into those landfills. I really can't comment about all that went in there nor who put it there. But it is on Solutia property now. We own its content and liability. But I don't know who might have, if anyone had put MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034223 anything in. Q. Okay. Do you know what the average rainfall is in Anniston? A. Right now, too much. You are coming at a bad time, all kind of flooding. El Nino is a alive and well. But to give you numbers, I'm not familiar with it. No, sir. Sorry. Q. And if I ask you what the average temperature range is down here, is that anything you could quantify? A. I could say it is more pleasant than further north, but I couldn't give you specifics. I haven't been here a year yet, so I can't even give you a full year yet. Come back in two months, and REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 41 maybe I can. Q. What about wind direction? Do you have any sense for which way the wind blows at your facility? A. If there is a dominant wind direction, I haven't noted it yet, Charles, no. I'm MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034224 still trying to remember which direction is which from the plant there. Q. Let's talk for a minute about community communications. It sounds like you're certainly in the loop on that from what you have told me about your responsibilities and the present thinking of Solutia. Am I correct that you all communicate with the community in multiple ways? MR. COX: Object to the form. Q. For instance -- MR. COX: Do you need some water? THE WITNESS: No. Q. Don't you all occasionally have print media, you know, newspaper ads or stuff that you communicate to the community REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 42 with? Is that something you occasionally do? A. We would -- We do have an occasional article, more likely a picture with a short description that gets into The Anniston Star that would discuss more MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034225 around what we are doing in the philanthropic area of the community. Q. I think I saw something where you were paving -- I want to say it was a school yard or a church yard or something recently that made The Star. A. We worked with County Commissioner Eli Henderson in the paving of the band's parking lot at our adopted school, Wellborn High School. Each of the schools in Calhoun County have an adopted industrial or business partner, and Wellborn High School is ours. So, yes, we were working with the commissioner to secure some funds to help pay that. Q. Okay. Do you ever do tours of the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 43 facility for the community? A. We have invited on occasion either individuals or groups to come to the facility and tour and have done that with very small numbers of people but MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034226 have not had any large numbers to come. But we do make that offering when we are speaking to groups. Q. And I presume it is not like Wednesdays at two we do the tour. It is something you do on an as-needed or ad hoc basis? A. What we do, Charlie, is -- Again, we are a small site with resources that have other jobs to perform anyway. And so we don't want to get locked into always doing it at a certain time. But as we can have the opportunity to get people from the community that would come and want to come, we will schedule a very brief tour just to give them an opportunity to see and hear the story and get close to it. Q. I had the sense that you said that if REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 44 you were out speaking the offer would be made. Do you have people from the plant who go out and do community discussions, go to groups and say here is what we are doing over there, that sort of thing? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034227 A. There is no permanent assignment of anyone in the Anniston plant to be part of a speaking tour or any specific approach. I encourage both -- all of our employees to be ambassadors in the community, to keep them informed of our operations so that they can speak factually about what we are doing. And what typically happens is that myself and some members of the leadership team who are members of civic organizations, et cetera, will occasionally have the opportunity to speak and will do so. Q. Just give me the most recent example you can recall of yourself getting up in front of a group of people and talking. A. Okay. I was invited to go speak to a Rotary Club in Oxford, Alabama, six REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 45 weeks ago or so and specifically was asked to come and talk on that day about Solutia and its direction as it related to what is the stock price going to do, MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034228 people interested in the financial performance and holdings. So I spoke to that group about our operation here and Solutia in general. Q. Would I be safe in assuming that there are a fair number of folks in Calhoun County -- which would take in Oxford, would it not -- who have perhaps a 401-k plan like yourself from having worked here over the years and therefore might have an interest in the stock price of Solutia? MR. COX: If you know. A. I was just going to say that current employees, as of September 1, 1997 -- their 401-k contained Solutia and Monsanto as part of the spinoff. Prior to that date employees, retirees would only have Monsanto stock. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 46 Q. Okay. A. So if they own Solutia stock, it would be because they specifically went out and purchased Solutia stock. So as a MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034229 401-k, it would be unusual for people outside the current Solutia employees to have Solutia stock in a 401-k. Q. One other form of communication. I know from back in Louisville there is a cluster of chemical industry in a part of town that is called Rubbertown because they make a lot of neoprene there. But they have a radio system set up that if somebody has a release, there is a channel that comes on and kind of reports to the community what is going on. Do you have anything like that or even sirens perhaps in a different kind of way that assist you in notifying the community if something is going on? A. Within the Anniston facility, we have a phone system that we use to sound a series of blasts, horn blasts, if there REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 47 were a significant release, an injury that we needed somebody -- a responder to attend, a fire, or any unusual MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034230 incident for which you want to have people respond to a location within the site, nothing that addresses an outside warning specifically. If we needed to make contact within the community, we would use the 911 and make contact with the appropriate authorities to help us in that communication. Q. Okay. Do you all have a public relations firm that you work with? A. Within Solutia each region has a public relations contact that works with the individual sites and/or any other sales office, et cetera. Specific in Alabama there is a firm, and I can't remember -- The contact is a gentleman named Steve Bradley. I know he -- The name Bradley -- Q. Is in the title? A. -- is in the title, but I don't know. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 48 Q. Do you remember what community they are based in. A. Birmingham, and apparently a satellite MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034231 in Montgomery. But Birmingham is his office. Q. Do you know who the regional public relations contact is? A. It would be Beth Russert with Kevin Cahill kind of -- I'll say backup, or for Alabama specifically Kevin is. We have three plants in Alabama. But Beth is the region one contact. Beth Russert is the regional contact. Kevin Cahill is a contact within the public relations group for all of Alabama. Q. Beth Russert, then, is a Solutia employee? A. She and Kevin Cahill are Solutia employees in St. Louis. Q. Do you know from looking at the budget or the cost sheets that you described earlier -- Is there a line item for Mr. Bradley's firm for this year? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 49 A. No. His contract and expenses flow to St. Louis. It is a corporate account. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034232 I have never seen it nor do I know what it contains. Q. Have you had occasion to talk to Mr. Bradley and request his assistance in anything relating to the remediation work that has been done here in Anniston? A. I have had occasion to speak with Steve on I think three occasions, and only on one of those did we talk about remediation at all. And that was just a tour of the facility as part of his meeting the other sites in Alabama. And in that case nor in any of the other two did I ask any specific or make any request of him. It was more of an on-boarding, awareness, bringing him up to speed. Q. What about -- As far as Mr. Cahill is concerned, have you worked with him with regards to public communications dealing REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 50 with the situation with the PCBs here in Anniston? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034233 A. Worked with him? I've only known Kevin two months, three months. Our contact has been around -- Our conversations have been around where are we with remediation, again, a tour so he could see the work we were doing, a tour of the operations, meeting people in the plant, working with him as we contact any other outside or external parties that we want to also make offers to tour and see the plant. He has been a help in that. He has done nothing yet specifically to help me on a PCB issue, as you said there. I have used him to help me in drafting a letter at times, but that has been it. Q. Would I be safe in assuming that you have not personally had any direct communications with the Mars Hill Missionary Baptist Church or any of the deacons or the minister? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 51 A. I have not talked -- To the best of my MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034234 knowledge, I have not talked with the pastor nor the deacons. I have not approached the membership at large. I did meet with three women who claimed to be members of Mars Hill. Q. Who were they? A. Cassandra Roberts, her mother, who I don't recall the name, and another woman, who I again apologize, I don't remember name. Q. Do you remember what her relationship was to Ms. Roberts at all? A. No. Friends I presume, but I don't know. Q. When did that meeting take place? A. I met with these three ladies sometime in June of 1997. It was a Saturday morning, the beginning of my vacation. I could go find my calendar and tell you when it was. It was mid June, a Saturday morning. Q. Did they approach you, I presume, as REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 52 opposed to you contacting them? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034235 A. I initiated no contact with the three. Q. And did they come to your -- to the plant there and talk with you? A. No. We me in a Shoney's Restaurant on Quintard, I guess that is called still, which is on the north side of Anniston. Q. Is that close to your home? A. No, it is not. Q. Close to their home? A. I don't know. I do not know where they live. Q. They picked the spot? A. Charles, I'm not even sure of that. Q. How did you wind -- A. Alan Faust and I met with them. And Alan -- I told him what my plans were. I said, "If you can do it on a Saturday morning early enough, I can meet, and then I will postpone my vacation." And he told me we would be meeting at Shoney's that morning. Q. And what was the substance of the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 53 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034236 conversation? MR. COX: With Alan or with -- MR. CUNNINGHAM: No, no. Q. To the extent Alan was talking, I would like to know that, but in the meeting with the five of you at Shoney's. A. Okay. We introduced ourselves to each other. I had never met any of these women, other than Alan, who I had met obviously. So we sat at a table, ordered a beverage. And then as I recall Cassandra began the conversation once we got past the introductions. And it was along the specific line of has Monsanto -- because at that time we had not changed to Solutia -- has Monsanto made a proposal to relocate Mars Hill Baptist Church and build another church or not. I had not been a part of any conversation to that end, but Alan was able to say, "Yes. We have in the past met with your church attorneys and pastor and deacon or REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 54 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034237 deacons" -- I don't remember. And she produced a document that was several pages in length, said, "Was this the proposal?" I looked at it. I frankly had never seen it before, so I couldn't comment. And Alan saw it and looked over the pages and said this was -- "This contains the proposal that we made, we, Monsanto, made to your attorney and pastor and deacons." And she said, "I thought so." She said, "Can you -- Can you tell us what you would do for us in terms of a church relocation?" And Alan had a poster board that was a description of another church, the new Bethel Baptist Church that detailed both the architectural drawing and some details about functionality of such a church, and used that to describe the new Bethel Baptist Church, the kinds of support, choir robes, music instruments, et cetera, and said we would be willing REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 55 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034238 still to -- and would like to relocate your church and build a church comparable to the new Bethel Baptist Church. The lady whose name -- not Cassandra's mother, but the other one, broke in as I recall and said, "What if we wanted a church bus?" And both Alan and I kind of looked at each other and didn't know how to respond initially. She said, you know, "We need a church bus. What if we were willing to reuse our books, our choir robes, other furniture? Could you then take the monies that you would have used for those things and purchase a church bus?" And our response at that point then was we would certainly consider that, could not commit, but certainly did not say no to it at that time, but said we would certainly consider such an arrangement. Cassandra then picked up the conversation again and showed us another REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 56 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034239 document. This was a letter -- really a petition but a lengthy letter with a number of signatures on the document that she said were members of Mars Hill Baptist Church. And the content of that document was -- first of all, very eloquent, but was directed at the pastor of Mars Hill Baptist and the deacons, but primarily the pastor, saying that we want to change attorneys or go ahead and pursue accepting the proposal to relocate our church. And she announced that this letter had either been delivered or was about to be delivered to the pastor with the stipulation that he would have a certain amount of time to respond to it, and if he did not respond, the membership that had signed it, the letters or names that were affixed to it, it would indicate that they would fire him. And that was her plan. She then said I intend to have a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 57 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034240 meeting at the church, following or at the beginning of one of the services -- I don't recall which -- at which time I intend to confront the pastor specifically with the question of has Monsanto made a proposal to relocate our church and build a replacement church comparable to new Bethel Baptist. And if he said no to that, she would have copies of this proposal that she had somehow obtained and pass it out to the members that were present and confront the pastor at the time in what she said would have been a lie then. Q. If he had said there had been no proposal, she would have been prepared to show that wasn't the case? A. Right. If he said no to her claim or her question of have you received a proposal from Monsanto or attorneys representing Monsanto and he said no, then she was going to show it. Q. Okay. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034241 58 A. I don't know that we -- I don't remember much more than that of the conversation, perhaps clarifying questions about what we were doing at new Bethel and again our reaffirmation that we were very willing to build a comparable church, relocate their facility, take ownership of the land, remediate it, and indemnify them from any further environmental activity, and exchanged pleasantries in the form of goodbye and Cassandra saying she was going to go take it down to the church, that she was ready. And I left to go on vacation. Q. And would that be the only conversation then that you had with Cassandra Roberts or anyone else purporting to be members of the church? A. To the best of my knowledge, I have not talked to any other members, at least not knowingly. They did not identify themselves as Mars Hill members. Q. Did you pass along information about MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034242 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 59 this meeting to anyone? MR. PECK: Obviously, Blake, if you passed along the information to your attorneys, that would be a privileged communication, which I instruct you not to convey. And I don't think Charlie is seeking that, but he is asking you about conversations. MR. CUNNINGHAM: No, no. MR. PECK: Also, I should tell you that in Alabama you have a privilege of communication with your wife. You can choose to do with that what you want. But you have the right not to communicate communications with your wife. A. I wish I could say something. But I did ask before I took the job whether I MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034243 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 60 could talk to my wife, because she was nervous about that. I was told that she was not a part of it. I said good, I have a friend there I can always talk with. But to answer your question, Alan and I talked briefly after the meeting, how did you feel the meeting had gone, any surprises, you know, both kind of bouncing it off one another, you know. We both felt that we had had an opportunity to at least present this proposal that we were still making, Monsanto was, to the church, to these three women. And they had heard it. You know, I hope it will go beyond this, but we had no next steps. It was strictly in their hands, so I left. And I had no further conversations with anyone other than my wife after that time. Q. I assume that when you had this meeting you knew there was litigation pending MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034244 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 61 between Monsanto and various different plaintiffs and groups of plaintiffs. Is that a fair statement? A. I was aware there were a number of litigations, a number of different suits, a number of different attorneys involved in other cases, yes. Which specifically they were, I don't know. But, yes, I knew there were other cases. Q. Did you have a conversation with anyone before the meeting to see if it was okay for you to talk to this person? Did you clear this with anyone? MR. PECK: Well, again, the same instruction applies. Communications with counsel are privileged. I don't know if you had them or not. But you should not disclose any communications you had with counsel. Q. You know, I don't want to know what you asked and what they said, but just did MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034245 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 62 you have a conversation before going to this meeting with the attorney for your employer? A. I did not, no. I talked only with Alan Faust. (A break was taken.) (Mr. Donald Stewart entered the deposition proceedings.) Q. Okay. A. Charles, you asked what transpired in the conversation there at Shoney's, and there was at least one other thing that took place at the beginning of the meeting, as I recall it. After we introduced ourselves, Alan or I one -- I don't remember which because we had both talked about it before we got there -- that we needed to make sure -- He had made a request to them that we would meet as long as no one meeting with us was a client of Donald Stewart's. So before we began the meeting, since I didn't know these three women from MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034246 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 63 anyone else and I -- We made certain in asking the question of are any of you represented by the attorney Donald Stewart, because we can't have this meeting if you are present and are currently represented by him. And they told us that they were not. And in fact, prior to that meeting, when Alan and I talked about it, he related to me that -- in some conversation with Cassandra on the phone about this, also explained it to her at that time. And there had been someone who was going to meet with us who was a current client, but he or she would not meet with us. So we just checked it one more time before the meeting began to make certain of that. Q. Okay. So it was your understanding if they were represented by a lawyer and were suing Monsanto, other than it being Don Stewart, it was okay for you to meet MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034247 with them? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 64 A. I was told by Alan that we needed to make certain that no one represented by Donald Stewart was in this meeting with us. And that was the extent of what we asked when we met with them, the extent I knew about the representation. Q. You remember that being covered from the get-go? A. Yes, somewhere in the introductions. One of us -- Because I wanted to make sure I was on legal ground, and Alan had already told me he needed to establish that. So I wanted to make sure we got that covered quick so there would be no second-guessing by anyone about us misrepresenting who we were or them who they were. Q. Call me crazy, but if I wanted to make sure I was on good legal ground, I would talk to a lawyer. A. You are a lawyer. Maybe you think like a lawyer. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034248 Q. I try to. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 65 A. I trusted Alan's advice. He said we needed to make sure. I said all right, let's find out. One of us needs to make certain of that. Q. I guess I'm curious as to why you would have even been involved in that meeting. Are you the person who makes decisions about what various neighbors would be offered by way of relocation or remediation or compensation? Is that part of your accountability? A. That has not come up as an issue for me to deal with. It would not, I think, be a typical decision that I would make. But in the context of representing the site and being accountable for everything around the operation of the site, I'd like to know what is going on. And so Alan was, I think, to that extent keeping me informed of what was going on, you know, had invited me to attend MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034249 this meeting as the site representative for Solutia -- for Monsanto at that time REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 66 with this group. Q. And you hadn't been there very long, I guess, when this took place? A. Two weeks, three weeks maybe at most. Q. All right. And I presume you hadn't had any other communication with people in that intervening two or three weeks about what was going on there and Monsanto's efforts to remediate or relocate people. A. I'm certain that Alan and I had some conversations about our efforts to build new Bethel because we would have toured the new Bethel Church. What was there was just under construction at that time. And I certainly toured the remediation work up on the south side of the plant as well as on the grounds that we had purchased on the east side there. So he and I would have had some conversations about current remediation MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034250 activity as we toured and saw those facilities. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 67 Q. If I gave you a name of a Ms. Tignor, would that ring a bell as one of the other two ladies? A. I recognize the name. Whether it is in context of that meeting or something else, I can't say, Charles. I'm sorry. Q. That's all right. A. I have heard that name before. I don't know if it was a Miss or Mrs., but I have heard the Tignor. Q. Okay. MR. STEWART: It may be Mister, Charles. Q. All right. Let's talk about -- THE WITNESS: Are youMR. COX: Off the record. (Discussion held off record.) Q. All right. Let's talk about something that should be easy, basically what you make there at the plant presently. What MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034251 are the products or intermediates that you all manufacture? A. We have two businesses, a Therminol REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 68 business, which is a series of heat transfer fluids that are used in industrial applications primarily, and a material called PNP or para-nitrophenol, which goes into the manufacture of acetaminophen, which is an aspirin substitute. There are several smaller end uses for both of those, and within the Therminols, there is a series of Therminol 55, 66, 75, HB 40. Q. Are you all making all the Therminol products there, or do you make some sort of components and then ship it and somebody else adds and mixes until you get the various different Therminols? A. We do some of both. Q. Okay. And what is the principal component of Therminol? A. Again, it varies, but I'd say the bulk of it is made up of something called MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034252 biphenyl. There are many different types of Therminols, so there could be other constituents. Polyphenyls I REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 69 should say. Q. Okay. Is it fair to say that the Therminol that you make is going to have biphenyl or polyphenyl in it? That is what your real process is, making polyphenyl? A. Yes. Now, we blend other things at the site that would not have it. But things that we are actually producing by the operations are polyphenyl based. Q. And the PNP you are -- that is just a molecule that you are manufacturing, and that goes to someone else who take that chemical molecule in large quantities and turns it into, with other things, acetaminophen? A. That's correct. Q. Does it have applications aside from the end product of acetaminophen? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034253 A. Yes, it does. Q. But that in a percentage sense is the vast majority of where it goes? A. That's correct. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 70 (Mr. Arthur Fite entered the deposition proceedings.) Q. And what sort of feed stocks do y'all utilize to generate the biphenyl and PNP? A. What kind of feed stocks? Q. What chemicals are you bringing in to convert to these two? A. We MR. COX: Let me interject. I'm not going to interrupt this whole discussion, but as you get into processes, some of the stuff is going to be trade secrets. If we can have an agreement that if there are portions of the deposition afterward that we need to declare as MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034254 confidential, I won't interrupt. MR. CUNNINGHAM: All right. I doubt I will get to that, but REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 71 I have no problem with that. Sure. A. For PNP it is primarily para-nitrochloralbenzene and caustic sulfuric acid. The Therminol families, polyphenyls in particular, it is primarily benzene. Q. And I take it you and I could agree that those products have a certain toxicity for humans? A. All of those products would have a material safety data sheet that would detail whatever health or toxicity issues have been defined by governmental authorities and agents, and they would vary depending on what we looked at, what hazards were associated with those. Q. Are you of the opinion or do you know if MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034255 benzene has been determined to be a human carcinogen by various entities that look into such things? A. I'm aware there have been a number of studies on benzene and other aromatics. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 72 What the specific health results of that are, I couldn't cite for you. I'm not a health expert. But I could certainly look at the material safety data sheet and at least to the extent it defines or quantified that, we could agree on what it said. Q. But you are not familiar with, again, to take one example, the benzene that is coming in the plant, what the MSDS says about benzene? A. No. We are required because it is a regulated chemical to meet certain standards with regards to exposure and to establish administrative and engineering controls around the safe handling of benzene. But what the specifics of that are, I look to my MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034256 staff and other trained folks in that specific area to manage and assure that we are meeting all the regulatory standards that are in place. Q. Do you have any idea how much benzene REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 73 y'all buy either in dollar amounts or volume amounts in a year? A. I could bracket it. I couldn't give you a specific. Q. That's fine. A. It is probably on the order of seven million pounds to twenty million pounds a year. Q. Okay. Now, what kind of hours are y'all running typically out there right now? A. Operation of the facility is intended to run three hundred sixty-five days, twenty-four hours a day. Q. And is that fairly typical in the chemical industry, that starting up and shutting down equipment like this is not something you want to do if you can MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034257 avoid it, that it's better to just keep it operating as long as that is feasible? A. The units and their efficiencies are always optimized by continuous sustained operation. So to the extent that REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 74 chemical plants I have been associated with, you certainly want to minimize downtime or do it on a planned basis. We have to use inventories as buffers. Q. Do you know if this is the only Monsanto facility that generates or manufactures PNP? A. First of all, we are not Monsanto. Q. I'm sorry. A. So I don't know what Monsanto is doing right now about PNP. But within Solutia we are the only manufacturing facility, to the best of my knowledge. Q. Do you have any domestic competitors outside of Solutia who are making PNP? A. Charles, I don't think we have competitors in PNP. We certainly have MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034258 competitors in the acetaminophen market. I'm not certain that they all use the same starting raw materials for that. Q. All right. Let me -- Does Solutia make the finished acetaminophen product? A. We make PNP only and sell it to REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 75 customers. Q. And certainly your customers have competitors who, perhaps through different methodology, are making the same end drug? A. That's right, or it is imported. Q. Okay. Are there foreign manufacturers of PNP, then? A. Yes. There are companies that are outside the United States that produce PNP. Q. Give me an example or two if you know them. A. I know there is one in Mexico that produces it. I couldn't tell you the name of the company. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMONOQ34259 Q. As to Therminol, I know you told me some of the particular lines in the Therminol family are actually made at other Solutia facilities. Was I correct? A. There are some made at other Solutia facilities, yes. Q. To your knowledge are you the only REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 76 Solutia facility making the biphenyl or polyphenyl base for those fluids? A. It is my understanding that a plant in Newport, England -- I'm not sure if it is England or Wales, but within Great Britain -- the Newport plant also produces polyphenyls. I don't think there are other plants in Solutia that produce the polyphenyls. Q. Would I be correct in assuming there are competing heat transfer fluids out there in the market domestically manufactured which are not based on a polyphenyl or biphenyl chemistry? A. There are other competitors that make various heat transfer products, some of MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034260 which are polyphenyl based, some of which are not. And the issue is making certain you can cover the breadth of temperature applications. Some of those competitive products will not perform at some of the temperatures and process applications that polyphenyls will REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 77 perform. Q. So there are applications where it is really the gold standard, I take it, for heat transfer fluids? A. And again I don't have an exhaustive knowledge of the Therminol or heat transfer markets, but it is my understanding that some of the polyphenyls perform better at certain applications and process conditions. Q. And to be fair, you have been here in Anniston less than a year? A. Yes, late May, May 22nd. Q. And I don't recall what you told me y'all made in Pensacola. Maybe I didn't MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034261 ask you. What sort of things did you make in Pensacola? A. Lots of things. I'll start broadly, and then you can tell me how deeply you want to pore. We make nylon 66 chemical intermediates that ultimately end up making a nylon 66 polymer that either is spun into a textile grade fiber or is REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 78 sold as the polymer form in pellets or chips for other applications. Q. Okay. Y'all didn't generate the nylon fiber, but you generated the two -- As I understand, nylon is just like two components that go together, the polymers? A. No. We would make it either up to the form of a polymer and either sell the polymer or either spin it into the fiber. Q. So you did do some spinning? A. Yes. Q. And what would you say the gross receipts are for the Anniston Solutia MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034262 plant presently? Is that even accounted for on a plant basis as opposed to a division basis or product basis? A. No. With the out-spin in September, we were told that -- by our corporate key executives that due to the -- what's the word -- the need to keep insider information -- keep us from being -- REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 79 receiving insider information, that we -- and I'm talking across the site, everyone but the top key executives would not be able to have profitability and income type statements. We would certainly know our own costs, and as we received information that we shared with the street on a quarterly basis, we could see that. But there was a need to withhold information on profitability and income from us. So I do not have that information. Q. Let's try to get it in a more simplified form. Is there a unit price for your MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034263 PNP? Is it pretty steady, or does it fluctuate greatly? A. There is a contract for PNP, but I do not know what the unit price on a revenue basis is in that contract. Q. Do you have a target that you try to achieve in terms of per unit cost? A. We have a total cost that we -- performance variance that we are REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 80 managing to versus the budget or standard. I don't tend to focus on unit costs but rather on gross costs, total dollars, making sure we are managing within or below the total costs we are budgeted. Q. Do you know how much PNP you are trying to make in a given year? A. Roughly. It is a variable depending on customer demands changing, but some idea of that. Q. What is your target or your -- A. It is around eighteen or nineteen million pounds. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034264 Q. And I've seen some documents related to PCBs, which of course is before your time at this place. But in terms of the margins, markups, how much of the cost they were trying to sell it for, do you have any idea in your own mind in an accounting sense what kind of a markup or a margin you have on the PNP? A. Margin on the PNP? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 81 Q. Yes. A. It is very small, I know, on PNP. I do not remember the -- Well, I don't have the percent, but we would like to at least make the return on capital to cover the cost of capital, and in PNP we are not doing that. Q. Okay. You are not making the Solutia-wide target for return on capital investment? A. For PNP, that's correct. Q. What is the Solutia target for return on investment? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034265 A. It is a variable depending on interest rates and all those things, but it is on the order of thirteen to seventeen percent. Q. In most of the businesses I have seen ten to twenty as the target they work towards, and you are saying you aren't hitting that yet with PNP? A. That's correct. We have a long-range plan to improve the business, but it is REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 82 not there today. Q. Let's go to what I think is a more pleasant subject. Let's talk about Therminol. Are you making your target investment on the Therminol? A. As a gross business, the Therminol, as I said, has two operating sites for the polyphenyls, and within the total gross business, I would say we do make our targets there. Q. And do you have, again, a ball park idea of how much Therminol product you are generating here in Anniston? I realize MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034266 it is a number of different grades, and some of it is going to other places, but how many pounds or gallons are you pumping out in a year's time? A. A range is going to be ten to thirty million pounds. Some of the terminals are moved internally. Q. Okay. Let me talk to you for a moment about the relationship between the facility out there and any of various REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 83 several governmental entities. I know when I got to take a tour there was a trailer that was set up there that -- I can't remember what it said, but it left me with the distinct impression that there was some type of cooperative education program perhaps going on. A. Inside the fence? Q. Yes. A. Yeah. There is a -- I can only presume the trailer you are referring to. There is a trailer that is on loan from the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034267 Alabama State -- Q. Some kind of education training -- A. Some type of -- Yeah, organization. It is on loan. It is available to industry for which there is training or education of new employees. The emphasis is on trying to make it available where you have new employees coming in, keeping the economy at least growing in the sense that you have new people coming to work. So we have been able to use it REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 84 for our new hire training. Q. And this organization, whatever it was, we took a picture of it, so I can look it up. They make that trailer available at their cost for you to use to train new workers is your understanding? A. My understanding from my training team leader, who manages the training, is that is the case, that the state has agreed to loan it to us for the new employees only, and when that is over, it is returned. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034268 Q. Has it been there as long as you have been here? A. I think so. I think that's the case. Q. Okay. Are you aware of any other sort of assistance, be it the federal government or state government or a local governmental entity, provided to Solutia in any context? A. I'm not aware of anything that we had received either tangible property or people resources that have come there, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 85 no. Q. Let me give you a couple of examples. And I don't know, but Kentucky may be totally different. But sometimes they will float a bond issue for capital expenditure. Are you aware of any sort of govemmentally backed investment bonds that have been utilized at the facility? A. Charles, I'm not familiar nor aware of any that have been. It has not been MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034269 brought to my attention since I have been there. Q. Okay. You mentioned that you all have a high school assigned to you in the sense that apparently all the local high schools have some industrial partner, so to speak, that works with them in various ways. What sort of things do y'all do with Wellborn High School? A. Since I've been there we have, as I mentioned, worked with the county in the paving of the band parking lot there at REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 86 the high school itself and have made a donation to the school specifically supporting their SGA trip to Washington D.C. as part of a week learning about government there and for their science department, to be used for some, you know, specific project that they might want to develop or do for a science project. Q. Another example of some things I have seen government do for industry is abate MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034270 various taxes conditioned upon so much economic development for jobs created or retained. Are you aware of any sort of tax abatement or subsidy or rebate that is in existence there at your facility? A. No. I'm not aware of any assistance or abatement either from city, county, state, federal, Charles, no. Q. Okay. I was -- When I took the tour last summer, it did not strike me as a particularly noisy facility. In your experience of having worked in several REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 87 chemical plants, would you feel the same way, that there doesn't seem to be a big noise problem with your site? A. Compared to the two locations with Solutia that I've worked, I have not walked in an area that required hearing protection because of decibel ratings exceeding any requirements that the government would have on those. Q. And looking at it from the perspective MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034271 of the neighbors and whether or not they would ever be put on notice that something like a PCB outfall was existent -- wouldn't hear it necessarily, and there is not much you would see in that regard, isn't that true, in terms of visual signs that something might be going on, releases from the facility? MR. PECK: Object to the form of the question. MR. COX: Go ahead. MR. PECK: I objected to the form REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 88 of the question. You can answer it. Q. Let me put it in a more precise form. You took a tour when you got here. I think you said Alan took you around and showed you the remediation efforts. I take it you didn't see anything that you could see and say, yeah, there are PCBs sitting there in that back yard or that ditch. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034272 A. As we toured from the automobile, I saw nothing that indicated a contamination other than the movement of earth and Alan's explanation of what was going on there as a substance or need for. Q. And I presume you didn't smell anything that would have to you, as an experienced chemical plant engineer, would have said something smells odd over here and maybe something is going on? A. In the context of the tour I did not detect the odor of chemical operations, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 89 chemicals, no. Q. Let me talk to you briefly about the present waste streams that you have at your facility. I presume that you have an ongoing effort to try to minimize those waste streams. A. Monsanto and now Solutia certainly has a commitment to always improve the overall efficiencies of our operation, including MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034273 the utilization of raw materials and energy sources which would get at, then, a reduction in the emissions of various streams. Q. What are the principal waste streams that you have at this time that you are aware of? A. We make a liquid waste that we treat and discharge into the Anniston Sewer Authority. And we monitor that. I again look to my environmental operations supervisor to understand the parameters for that and communicate and educate our folks that we meet it. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 90 There is a storm water discharge that leaves the plant property, and again there are regulations around that that we meet based on stated standards that the state has given us that we have accepted. We have a boiler, and it also has a gaseous emission that we operate to and confirm that it meets, again, the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034274 requirements the state has set for us. Those are the only ones that come to mind. There may be others, Charles, but again I look to my professional environmental leader or supervisor. Q. That is my next question. Who might that person be? A. Robert Jones is my environmental supervisor, and he is the one who is knowledgeable about the standards and regulations and permit requirements and works with our operating staff and myself to make sure, if there are any changes, that we understand them, are REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 91 aware, change any operating procedures that are necessary. Q. And I may be presuming too much, but I'm assuming from the fact that his title includes the word "supervisor" that there are people yet under him. A. There are a technician who has an environmental focus and a technician who MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034275 has a safety focus that work for Robert. Q. Okay. And I don't need to talk much about the safety person. What about -- MR. STEWART: Did you get both their names? Q. What are their names? A. Jerry Hopper and Fran Byrd. Q. Jerry is environmental, and Fran is safety? A. That's correct. Q. Now, do you know how long Mr. Jones has been at this facility? A. Robert, I think, has been in Anniston on the order of eight to nine years, from what I recall, Charles, about that. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 92 Q. And who would he be reporting to primarily? A. Again, functionally he reports now, under the new organization, since early last year, to Max McComb in St. Louis who has overall ESH coordination for region one. Q. Okay. And to the extent he has someone MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034276 he is reporting to in Anniston, that person would be who? A. Me. There is a dotted line there. Q. A dotted arrow now? A. He and I work together, but he is reporting hard line to Max. Q. Got you. Do you know what Mr. Jones' training or education is for his particular position? A. I know he has a BS in chemical engineering. What additional training beyond that, I am not knowledgeable enough to speak on. Q. What about Mr. Hopper? Do you know what sort of training he has? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 93 A. I know the kind of training we all get each year in terms of annual training, but specific focus training as an environmental technician, I do not. Q. Well, tell me what you know about what you all get every year. What does that consist of in the environmental realm? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034277 I don't need to know what y'all learn about minimum wage law and stuff like that, but what you get every year on environmental. A. Environmental would be small in terms of annual requirements there. But some conversation for those that are involved in emergency response is an example. So there might be some training in what is your procedure again on the response. Q. And you all I presume maintain a document that -- a binder perhaps with, as far as emergency response protocol, here is what we do if something happens, a plan? A. There is an emergency control plan that REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 94 the site has. Q. And that deals, I take it, in part with releases? For instance, if you had a benzene release, not something planned, just a release, then this document would kind of dictate here is what we do about that? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034278 A. It would not speak specifically to benzene, but it would speak to a kind of scenario and how we would respond. Q. And I take it -- You told me about your waste streams, and there was a liquid waste stream we talked about and a storm water, which is not necessarily a waste but a discharge you have, and your stack gas, which is a permitted release. Then I take it perhaps you also would have emissions that is not necessarily a waste but that some of your product is going to get away such as benzene. You have a permit to be allowed to release a certain amount of that in a given year? A. I am not qualified to answer that. I REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 95 don't personally have knowledge of anything that specifically speaks to that. Robert and others would manage that for us. Q. Now, there wasn't any mention of a solid waste stream. To your best knowledge MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034279 you don't currently generate a solid waste as part of your manufacturing process? A. Not in the sense of any -- Q. Ongoing -- A. -- consistent ongoing. I mean, there are rags, sample bottles, but nothing that I know of or can think of that would constitute a regular waste stream, quote, from the plant. Q. Got you. Aside from Mr. Jones and Mr. Hopper, do you know of any other people on staff whose time is substantially devoted to environmental compliance and control? A. Our operators are all trained to operate the facility within certain parameters, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 96 to meet our operating guidelines. So to that extent they are engaged in assuring that we operate within those limits. But specifically engaged in environmental control, compliance, and the letter of the regulations, I think MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034280 those are the two that primarily look over that for us and with us. Q. Okay. And do you have any role in the paperwork that is generated regarding your environmental control and compliance and your waste disposal kind of stuff? A. If there are certifications that are sent to the state or any other authorities, they would be brought to my attention for signature as the site accountable party. Q. But I take it in many respects, if not in all respects, you are relying upon Mr. Jones and the people above and below him in that area that what you are signing is accurate? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 97 A. That's correct. I look to them to have the expertise. I make certain we have a conversation around, is everything here consistent within the stated practice and standards and permit requirements, MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034281 anything we should have further conversation on. And based on that, I will sign it then. Q. And you take that seriously? It is not a pro forma thing for you, I trust, when you sign those documents? A. I do, yes. Q. And you would take it very seriously if someone in the organization got you to sign something that turned out not to be accurate? A. I want to make certain that everything we report to the best of our knowledge and the best of our intent and within the analytical accuracy of the methods that are available correctly represents what we are sending out. MR. CUNNINGHAM: This might be a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 98 good stopping place if you want to break. (A lunch break was taken until 1:00 p.m.) (Mr. Adam Peck left the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034282 deposition proceedings.) Q. Mr. Hamilton, taking up where we left off, you told me about your waste streams. I presume since you don't have a solid waste stream other than some intermittent type stuff that you do not presently landfill anything on site on your property there. A. That's correct. That's my understanding, that we do not. Q. And what little bit you intermittently generate is sent to some off-site third party commercial landfill? A. Again, that's my understanding, yes, collect them and large operators take them off. Q. Do you even know what facility that might be? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 99 A. No, I do not. Q. Have you ever met a government, for lack after a better word, field person from say the federal EPA or the state MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034283 equivalent, ADEM? A. I have met an individual that I believe was a field engineer. There were two people that came into the plant to introduce a new engineer to Robert Jones. As part of that, Robert brought them down to my office just to meet me out of courtesy. I think they would be what I would say field engineers. MR. COX: Was your question limited to Anniston? I'm sorry. MR. CUNNINGHAM: Yes. Q. It is really not part of your day-to-day responsibilities, I presume, if these people show up for them to talk to you? A. That's correct. They come in contact usually with Robert Jones and Jerry Hopper. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 100 Q. Do you have any idea how often the plant gets visited and -- A. No, I do not. I know they have been there on a couple of occasions since I MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034284 have been there. Q. And again, I don't know how much opportunity you have had to get out and, for lack of another word, mingle with the folks there at your plant, but who would be the folks with the most seniority there? Do you think there is anybody there still working who was working there at that plant in the '60s and 70s? A. Twenty-seven and more years ago? I believe there would be some employees there who have worked for thirty years, yeah. Q. Do you have a name just off the top of your head of somebody who in your mind is an old-timer there at the plant and been there a long while? A. Jerry Brown is an individual that comes REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 101 to mind. Q. What does Jerry do there presently? What is his title? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034285 A. He is a technical supervisor, I think is what is on the door. But he is kind of a special technologist for the site there. Q. Okay. As opposed to someone with an engineering background, he is from a technology or technical training background? A. He has an engineering background, even an advanced degree, if I'm not mistaken. Q. What about somebody in the -- I forget the -- rage -- A. Wage row? Q. As you described it, somebody at that level that you think may have been there for a long time? A. I can think of one in maintenance, Tim Matson. MR. STEWART: How do you spell that? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 102 THE WITNESS: I'm not sure, Donald. I think M-a-t-s-o-n, but I'm not sure. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034286 Q. Okay. Have you been introduced to maybe any retirees from here in the community, old-timers, people that worked in the plant historically? A. I have met some retirees at a banquet that was held, yes. Q. Do they have a -- I don't know -- an organization, a club, somewhere they get together on a regular basis, people that worked in the plant historically? A. Not to the best of my knowledge. There is no formal organization. Q. Was this banquet that you alluded to something that was held for the purpose of bringing those people together with current workers or just happenstance that you all were at the same affair and met? A. This was something that had been scheduled. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 103 Q. For the purpose of bringing older retired workers together with the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034287 current work force? A. It was to recognize something called quarter century members in the current organization, those that had achieved twenty-five years. Q. Is that what it is called, quarter century club? A. Well, quarter century banquet is what the title was, term was. Q. Might there be -- When do you think that banquet occurred, to the nearest month or season? A. Sometime in the fourth quarter of 1997. Q. Have you had quarter century banquets at the other Solutia facilities where you have worked? A. I don't recall anything called that, but it -- we have had occasions where we would get together with people who had achieved long term service awards. Q. Well, if somebody was interested in REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 104 seeing who's been out there for twenty-five years or more, how would we MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034288 go about finding that list of names? Is this something -- Would this banquet have had an attendees' list? Would there have been an honor roll or something like that prepared as part and parcel of that get-together? A. Charlie, there was an agenda for the banquet, and it may have had the names of those receiving their service awards on it. Q. And just as rough as you can give it to me, how many people do you think were honored at that particular banquet? Are we talking a handful, dozen -- A. A handful. Q. Okay. Let me ask you quickly about record keeping there at the facility. Do you have a person who is the records tsar, if you will, or is it scattered among a number of different folks? A. It is scattered among many different REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 105 folks. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034289 Q. There is not one person where I guess particularly in your case, being new, if there was something you wanted, you have learned I can go to this person and, by golly, they can find what I need? A. Depending on the subject matter, I know who typically would have access or knowledge about that particular subject matter on my staff. Q. And if we were, as we are, particularly interested in environmental matters, would Mr. Jones be the person you would think of, or is there someone else for those kind of records you would turn to? A. I would go to Robert Jones, who I entrusted to be my environmental manager, supervisor. Q. Okay. Let me ask you about wells on the site. Are you aware of any wells located on the property that Solutia owns here in Anniston? MR. COX: Are you talking about REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 106 production wells or MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034290 monitoring wells or any kind -- MR. CUNNINGHAM: All different kinds. Q. I'm aware of some monitoring wells in a couple of different locations. Are you familiar with the fact there are monitoring wells there? A. I am familiar with the fact we do have some monitoring wells on the property. Q. And there are also some wells that are designed to capture, called pump and treat. They pull out liquid, and it is run through your treatment system. Is that something you are aware of? A. Yes, I am aware. Q. Have you any particular knowledge about these wells other than the fact you know they are out there and roughly what they are doing? A. I know they are there and they either monitor or they pump through the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 107 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034291 biological treatment gathering system there. Q. To your knowledge has there ever been any sort of deep well injection facility there at the site? A. I have no knowledge of that having taken place at the Anniston facility. Q. You do know what that is, though, I take it? A. Yes. I am familiar with deep well treatment or disposal. Q. Disposal. What is the source of drinking water at the plant? MR. COX: If you know. A. I don't think I have ever asked that question. Q. Okay. Well, if you're thirsty along about two o'clock at the plant and staying off soda pop, what does the water come in, a water fountain, a cooler? A. We have a water fountain in the admin hall there, a couple of them, and a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 108 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034292 kitchen facility in the admin hall where we make coffee and a sink there, so I can get water out of any of those. Q. So as far as you know it is just a domestic water source, municipal water? A. I know it is domestic water brought into the plant. I don't know its source beyond that. Q. Do you know if y'all do any particular filtration on that as to drinking water? A. I do not know about any filtration. It may or may not be done, Charles. Q. What about process water? I assume in your manufacturing operations you need process water. A. We would use process water and cooling water to make up -- Q. And do you know what the source of that water is? A. I do not. Q. Do you all do any testing of water there at the facility that you know of? A. What kind of water? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 109 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034293 Q. Be it your process water, drinking water, or even water effluents like storm water? I know you have the treatment facility. A. I know of no tests we do on incoming water. I know that we test, again, the storm water and process waste water that would get to the treatment basin per the standards and permits. Q. And do you know if that is done in house there in Anniston as opposed to being collected and then shipped to either some other Solutia or other third party for tests or analysis? A. I know some outside agency does some testing. Whether we do testing also, I don't know. Q. Okay. I do not recall seeing any ponds or lagoons at your facility last summer when I was there. Do you know of any that are -- A. No ponds. Now lagoons, depends on how you -- We have a collection basin that REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 110 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034294 might be a lagoon in somebody's definition, but no -- not what I would associate as a pond or lagoon. Q. Now, I know you have some landfills that you are not presently using but that you have used historically. Are you familiar with the locations of the landfills there at the site? A. I've been told where some were. I don't have any personal knowledge of it, but I have been told where there were some operating landfills in the past. Q. Could I ask you, please, to take this -- And this is the most recent aerial we got. Ifyoujust -- A. Where is 202? MR. COX: Off the record. (Discussion held off record.) A. Assuming this is now 202 -- Q. Right. That would keep going straight as opposed to turning. A. Anyway, I was told that there were a couple of cells immediately across the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. Ill MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034295 road south of our facility and adjacent to a fence that runs along 202 there, so this general area here (indicating). Q. I'm going to hand you a salmon colored crayon here that I pilfered from the Stewart law office this morning. MR. STEWART: Out of the children's play box that Charlie got into. Q. If you could just draw the location to the best of your understanding -- MR. COX: With the understanding that he wasn't there and this is based on what he understands? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Absolutely. A. If somebody would point out to me in trying to figure out again where 202 is. Q. In fact, if you like, we can try to draw in, kind of on the presumption that 202 would be this blue line, if that helps you. A. Then my understanding is that there were REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034296 112 landfills somewhere in here (indicating). MR. COX: Why don't you color that in a little bit, Blake? A. Well, the coloring is easy. It is trying to reference it to what I have been told. Q. I'm going to put a little north arrow on here. I'm going to draw it upside-down. But in fact would the orientation of north be in the direction I have indicated? A. That is what we would call plant north, probably not magnetic north. Q. You have in salmon drawn what I would call the south end landfill. Also I have heard people talk about a west end landfill. To the extent you have any knowledge of there having been a west end landfill -- Let me start off with do you have any knowledge of there -- A. Again, an area has been pointed out to me. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034297 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 113 Q. And again, to the best of your ability, could you show me again in salmon what area you understand to be the west end landfill on this particular map? A. It is a adjacent to 202. If this is now 202, it is adjacent. I can't tell -- MR. COX: To orient you, Blake, that is the small substation that is outside the fence on the western boundary of the property (indicating). A. Okay. I would say it is something like that (indicating). Q. Okay. MR. COX: Again, that is his understanding. MR. CUNNINGHAM: I understand. The electrodes will not charge up if we find out that is not exactly right. Q. And may I safely assume that you have no independent knowledge about the contents of what is in those landfills? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034298 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 114 A. I have never seen a manifesto or manifest or any paperwork saying what is or is not in there. Q. And similarly, I presume you have no particular knowledge about the construction of those, be it on the bottom or on the top, for that matter, as far as what engineering may have been involved? A. I have no knowledge of what was put in place prior to their use nor after their use, only what's been done on the south end landfill in the last ten months I have been here, which there has been some movement of dirt and liner. Q. Let me ask you now about USTs, underground storage tanks. Are you aware of any USTs at the facility? MR. COX: Currently or ever? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Currently. A. I have no knowledge of any being there. I don't recall ever seeing any paperwork that said we had one. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034299 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 115 Q. That's not a trick question. I didn't think there were, but I thought I would inquire. Do you in your operation facility occasionally as you are manufacturing biphenyl or polyphenyl, Therminol, or PNP just wind up with a bad batch, that something goes wrong in the process and you have a chemical that doesn't meet your specifications and you have to do something with it? A. I have knowledge that we have made some PNP that was not exactly within our specification for a customer. I can't recall there being an occurrence that was brought to my attention, at least, of a Therminol or polyphenyl. Q. Was this something that was discovered when it got to the customer and they analyzed it and tried to use it and it wasn't working, or something that you all caught basically before it left the site? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034300 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 116 A. We caught it upon production and before it ever got ready to go to a customer. Q. And what did you do with that? A. In the case of the PNP, we reworked it to -- in this case, we were able to. In some cases -- Well, we were able to rework it in this case. I don't know about other cases. Q. Well, then, that's the only case you know about here at this site? A. At the Anniston plant. Q. You have had, I assume, like in Pensacola or Texas occasions where stuff went bad and you couldn't rework it, that it was a lost cause? A. I have personal knowledge of some materials that were reworked at first avenue, and some cases -- MR. COX: I'm sorry, first avenue? THE WITNESS: After rejection of a material. First avenue is really your own make off spec. Once it is made and MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034301 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 117 there is a rejection by analytical results, rework it where possible. There have been occasions where the material was -- we were able by permit to bum as a fuel and recover the energy and heat value of that material as a last resort, if there were permit requirements. If we had a treatment system, we could discharge it into the treatment system and biologically -- had the approved methodology in place, we could treat it. Q. The treatment you have here in Anniston for liquid effluents, as I understand it, is a biological treatment, is it not? A. It is an equalization sun treatment for pH control and some biological MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034302 treatment. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 118 Q. And that means there are live microscopic organisms in there changing the chemical composition of the effluents? A. I'm not steeped in microbes and organisms, but, yes, there are some sort of bugs in there that microbically eat away at the chemicals. Q. Tell me what kind of laboratory you have in house there in Anniston, please. A. In the lab we have several GCLC analytical tools to test the chemical -- primarily an organic chemical testing facility. We have a heat stability testing lab for the Therminol to test for its stability under heat exposures for duration, which is one of the tests our customers are looking for, and some wet lab capability, but very small, very limited. Q. Okay. What about on -- You say you have several GCLC pieces of equipment. Do MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034303 they tend to be dedicated, like you have REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 119 one that is set up basically to run, let's say, your process for PNP and another one is kind of dedicated in terms of its hardware and calibration to your Therminol operations, or do you know? A. I really do not know, Charles. Again, I look to my laboratory and analytical folks to manage that. I don't know. Q. Have you seen in the budget or your cost sheets a line item for outside laboratory work? Have you any concept of how much if at all you expend on that? A. I have seen a line item for outside laboratory work. I don't recall the magnitude. Again it was very small relative to the total site. Q. Okay. What about resources available to you corporately, other master Solutia laboratories or whatever? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034304 A. Within Solutia we do not, as far as I know, have corporate research, corporate REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 120 analytical labs set up. We would go outside Solutia, or if there were another plant, we might tap in there. Q. Which leads me to a question. You talked about I think it was your first postgraduate job with Union Carbide. You were at an engineering center, where my sense was you did design work for a number of Union Carbide facilities. A. That's correct. Q. I don't know. Is Houston home base for Union Carbide? A. No. West Virginia, Charleston, West Virginia. Q. I see why they book people to go to Houston. Is everything you get in the way of support from Solutia in St. Louis, or are there other parts of the Solutia family that aid you in what you do? And if so, who and what and where? A. St. Louis is the hub for most of Solutia MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034305 resourcing with a shared service organization that is now part of Solutia REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 121 in the spinoff. We have eliminated some jobs at the Anniston facility such that we now rely on some other sites to provide some capability for us. Specifically you asked about purchasing. For instance we get some backup from Decatur, Alabama. Computer maintenance, resourcing, we get some of that from Pensacola. That's all I can think of right now specifically. Q. Taking the other side of the coin, is there something that Anniston provides to other Solutia entities in the way of support, be it just your region one cohorts or company-wide? A. Nothing on a routine basis, but we -- We do help one another if there are special issues that come up that somebody may have a resource that would be helpful. For instance, we have provided some MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034306 safety expertise because of our VPP recognition. (Mr. Taylor Stewart entered REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 122 the deposition proceedings.) Q. The VPP designation is an OSHA commendation or recognition, is it not, for a particularly safe workplace? A. Yes. Voluntary personnel protection. VPP is OSHA's voluntary personnel protection program. Q. And I presume that that aspect of your work actually also falls within Mr. Jones' ambit, so the speak? A. That's correct. Robert has the safety as well as environmental. Q. And Fran Byrd would work with him in that regard? A. Fran is the technician in safety, correct. Q. Does Mr. Jones have any other substantial responsibilities aside from the health and environmental and the safety, anything else on his plate? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034307 A. Specific responsibilities are only for environmental safety and health, but he wears other hats from time to time as we REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 123 might need a resource. But no, no, that's it. Q. I know you told me about how you do some monitoring of your waste effluents particularly for your storm water discharge permit. What about monitoring of air? Do you know if y'all have any routine sampling that takes place there in the community or right on the site of the air? A. I have no personal knowledge of any routine air sampling per se, Charles. MR. STEWART: Can we have the question read back? (Requested portion of record read.) Q. I'm going to bet that as a degreed chemical engineer you understand what the concept of vapor pressure is. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034308 A. I'm familiar with vapor pressure. It has been a long time since I worked an equation. Q. And I'm not going to ask you work it. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 124 Just quickly for the jury's benefit, what is your understanding of the concept of vapor pressure, and what is the significance of it for someone like yourself who operates a chemical plant? A. The more volatile or the more -- the greater tendency a liquid has to become vapor or gaseous elevates its vapor pressure, its ability to, under temperature or even ambient -- under temperature to evolve a gas that can create a pressure in a contained environment. Q. To a certain extent a chemical under a given pressure, given temperature, is going to try to maintain a certain gaseous phase concentration? A. I'm not sure I follow that entirely -- Q. If you have some liquid at a given MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034309 temperature and pressure, it is going to have a certain amount of it come off as a vapor? MR. COX: Object to the form. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 125 A. There will be an equilibrium that is established between the liquid and the gas. Q. That is a better way of saying it. That is why I'm asking and you are saying the answers. Do you know what the air quality -- what the air quality is like in the Anniston area? I don't want to be obtuse. Back home where I'm from in Louisville we are what is called a nonattainment district in the EPA's eyes on ozone and on hydrocarbons. They don't like our numbers, and they are taking a dim view of people who want to start new businesses that would make it even worse. Do you know how you all sit here in Anniston in that particular concept? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034310 A. Wow. I'm familiar with the term nonattainment. I know certain areas in Alabama are in that. I don't recall having heard Anniston or Calhoun County as being in it. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 126 Q. And I know you have only been here less than a year, but from the time you have been here, have you perceived any particular atmospheric circumstances with the location of your plant that impact odor or how you operate or anything like that? MR. COX: Object to the form. Go ahead and answer it if you understand it. A. I'm not aware of anything atmospheric other than electrical storms that can disrupt power, but nothing else I'm aware of that would be of effect on our operating conditions. Q. Do you all do any open burning there at the facility? A. Define open burning for me, Charles. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034311 Q. Well, let me segregate from that, for instance, flares. I know some chemical manufacturing processes will generate a flare. I want to take that separately. I'm talking about putting something out REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 127 on the ground and putting a match to it and burning it. A. I'm not aware of us having done that during the time I've been there, no, and wouldn't expect us to. Q. What about flares? Do y'all have any flares in your process? A. We have a device that bums hydrogen gas occasionally when there is excess. Whether that is permitted as a flare or some other device -- I will be honest -- I don't know what its stated name is. But for me it would be considered a flare. Q. Okay. And when you say hydrogen gas, is this pure H2, or is it hydrogen sulfide, or do you know? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034312 A. It is not hydrogen sulfide. It would be hydrogen and some nitrogen and oxygen. Q. You started with Union Carbide in 1970. Am I correct in assuming you never actually worked around PCBs to any extent? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 128 A. That's correct. I've never been involved in manufacturing it, and to the best of my knowledge, I have never even seen it. Q. Okay. Are you at all familiar with the levels or even where PCBs have been found around the plant? Is that something you have gotten immersed in? A. I have been told of some areas in a ditch that contains some levels of PCBs. Q. Okay. I'm going to hand you at this time my lemon crayon and ask you to identify for me in that rather yellow shade the area that you are aware of where you understand there are some PCBs in the community. A. Okay. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034313 MR. COX: Which community are you talking about, anything outside the plant site? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Right, right. A. Where is old Bethel on here? MR. COX: Right here (indicating). REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 129 In fact, somebody has drawn in the ditch line, it looks like. MR. CUNNINGHAM: Yeah. That was what we have. We will put new Bethel on there as another landmark. MR. COX: Old. New is up here somewhere. Off the record. (Discussion held off record.) A. And I don't remember where the ditch -- I just remember this part of the ditch, somewhere in here (indicating). Q. And then somewhere between that yellow -- Where did you understand it came from, or did you have any understanding MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034314 of where it came from? MR. COX: Where the ditch came from or -- MR. CUNNINGHAM: No, the PCBs in the ditch. Q. Let me start in kind of a micro sense. Whose PCBs were they in your REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 130 understanding or if have any knowledge? MR. COX: Object to the form. A. I was -- I was made aware that we -- we, Monsanto, had done some sampling along a ditch, but I don't believe the ditch was even there when I went out there. But it was in some degree of destruction when I went out there, earth moving. But there were some PCBs found and samples taken along the ditch. That was the basis for identifying where we needed to do the remediation, the covering and capping of that material in place, and that the source of the PCBs was not identified, but presuming had come from the old landfill area. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034315 Q. Okay. Moving right along, do you do any routine medical monitoring or health screening of the folks who work there at the Solutia facility in Anniston? A. I have personal knowledge that we do physicals on some frequent basis, Charles. I don't know how the setting REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 131 up of schedules is done. I know that Robert, again, and our HR is involved in the frequency for each employee. But I don't know of specifics other than the stated physicals that are on some regular basis. Q. Do you yourself get a routine physical as part of being there at the facility? A. As part of a Solutia employee, I got it at Anniston as well as other locations. Q. So you have had one in the time since you have been here? A. Yes. Q. I don't need to know or am probably not entitled to know the results. But just MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034316 give me an idea of what that physical consisted of. A. For me -- Again, it may be-- MR. COX: Just talk on personally. Q. We understand it may be different for other types of workers. A. Obviously blood pressure, temperature, those kind of things, looking in the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 132 ears, the nose, the "finger wave" and the cough, chest x-ray, some blood work and for cholesterol, lipids and all those things, reflexes, tapping, feeling around for lumps and things such as that, eyesight test, hearing test, breathing pressure, you know. Q. Respiratory function. A. See how much air volume per time. That I think about covers it. Q. Is that something that was conducted by a medical doctor or by a technician or nurse? A. By a doctor and his nurse. Q. And was this a Monsanto employee who MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034317 came to you, or did you go to them, or was it a third party? A. It was a third party. Q. Here in Anniston? A. Yes. Q. Was it a case of you had a list of what you needed and you went to your personal physician and had it done, or were you REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 133 directed to a particular medical doctor who would do the Solutia examination? A. We had a regular doctor in Anniston who -- I think it was all done at the plant site, as I recall. Either he or his nurse were at the plant site, and I went to see him. Q. Okay. And as far as you know, is this what is generally called, in my town anyway, the company doctor, the person who does the medical work for Solutia here in Anniston? A. He does at least much of the medical. The physicals are done here by him at MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034318 the plant. How much other he does, I don't know. He does that. Q. And what was the name of this doctor? A. I'll missay his first name. Kishin Gehi. Q. Do you know what his specialty in the practice of medicine is? A. I have seen it. I think it was occupational medicine, but I'm not REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 134 certain of that. I know he does have it on his card or something. Q. Okay. And again, if we wanted to try to find out more about what Solutia does for the other employees, the person who would be up on that would be Robert? A. For medical information? Q. Yes. A. It would either be -- Robert would certainly be a good contact. Q. And who else might be in the loop on that? A. Lamar Freeman, the HR leader, because as you said while ago, some of it is MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034319 private, personal stuff. Q. Sure. Have you ever to your knowledge been involved in a epidemiologic type investigation that Monsanto or Solutia has conducted where they tried to look at a group of their employees and their health? Are you aware of your particular circumstances ever being looked at from that perspective? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 135 A. Within Monsanto, no. Q. Now, we are going to teach you a little bit about depositions. When you say within Monsanto, no, that leads people like me to think of outside Monsanto. A. Yes. Q. What was that? A. I would call it epidemiological with Cinion Carbide. And since I left there I got a phone call ten years ago that was stated as a follow-up to some involvement around exposure -- possible exposure to radiation from uranium MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034320 hexifloride. They were doing a survey of all former employees that ever worked in Oak Ridge. So I was asked questions on the phone for that. Q. Okay. Have you had any accidental releases, unintended releases of chemicals or waste from the plant since you have been there? A. I have no knowledge of unintended releases that got outside the fence REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 136 property. Q. Okay. Are you aware of one where there was a release, but as far as you knew it hadn't gotten off-site? A. Yes. Q. Tell me about that, please. A. I don't remember the particulars, but there have been -- on PNP we had an agitator seal fail, and some -- I think it was caustic mediums escaped to the ground. And it was contained and kept it there and cleaned it up. And most recently we had a valve that somebody MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034321 was working on, inadvertently opened by the mechanic, and some hot water, again, PNP, mostly water as I recall, that released to the ground. We report all of those. Q. I was going to ask that. You understand there is some measure of a reporting requirement for that even if it doesn't get off-site? A. There is a protocol for us to, you know, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 137 document and maintain information about releases. Q. Okay. Again, just the mere fact that you kept it from getting off-site doesn't prohibit -- doesn't change the fact that you need to tell certain authorities about certain kinds of releases. You understand that? A. That's correct. Q. And you take that requirement seriously, I presume? A. Yes, we do. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034322 Q. And isn't it essentially unavoidable in the operation of a facility like that that you are going to have occasional releases? A. Well, I couldn't make an over generalization like that, Charles. Q. Have you ever been at a place where they went a year or two and didn't have an occasional release? A. There have certainly been occasions where the operating units within that REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 138 site go that long or longer. To say as a site had there been an occasion for two years that nothing was released, I don't have enough data to say that. I couldn't say that for certain one way or the other. Q. It hasn't caused you great alarm that you had a couple of events in the PNP section, has it? A. I wouldn't characterize it as alarm. It gives me cause to make sure I ask questions, that we understand the cause MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034323 and nature of the event so that we identify the root cause and correct it. Q. With a goal of minimizing, at least, if not eliminating these kind of things? A. We want to minimize and eliminate releases or incidents in general. Q. Have you been involved in any effort to either identify or negotiate with any third parties that Solutia may feel was somehow responsible for the contamination that the remediation had REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 139 been directed towards? A. You are going to have to ask that again. That is getting deep on me. Q. I think I understand it, but I'm not even sure of that. You are aware there is a lot of remediation being done around your plant site. A. Yes. Q. What I'm trying to ascertain is whether there is some entity other than Monsanto or Solutia that you're aware of that you MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034324 all have been looking to thinking that they bear or it bears some responsibility for what happened and should be helping to foot the bill. A. Since I have been there, I have not encountered an occasion where it was brought to my attention that some other party was paying for any of the remediation or should pay for the remediation that we have done. Q. Okay. What would you say is your role if any in the remediation work? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 140 A. Role, my personal role? Q. Exactly. A. Again, I view it as I have an accountability to both Solutia and the community for what goes on both in terms of the people that are involved in it, that they be safety focused and minded, that the work gets done as we have committed to the agencies involved and to the community that we have said we were going to do certain things for and MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034325 with. But I look, again, to Alan Faust to have the responsibility for making it happen. So it is an overseer umbrella for the accountability of it. Q. Is it safe to say that he would be your eyes and ears with respect to how that is being accomplished? A. He certainly would have that responsibility. There would be others that also have that responsibility as eyes and ears, but I look to him to take care, make it happen. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 141 Q. By way of example, I trust you haven't spent a lot of time walking up on the south end landfill and eyeballing what is going on or telling people let's go over and do that or do this? A. I have not told people to do that. I have walked up there. Q. Weekly, monthly? A. Oh, no. I tour all the remediation work at least monthly, sometimes twice a MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034326 month. I have walked out on it maybe five times, you know, a handful of times. Q. Okay. And again, in terms of guidance or directions or managing this project, you have comparatively little input as opposed to accountability? A. I have not negotiated or signed any contracts with vendors or contractors doing the work, but have viewed my role as being accountable and overseer for it. So I want to know what is going on because I get questions from others. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 142 Q. If somebody wanted to know how much dirt should we put down here or dig up there, you are not the person who is going to give that direction? A. That's correct. I don't -- If I were to be asked that, I would send them to Alan Faust. Q. Okay. Now, given that when we talked about the staffing there and the fact that Alan is in from St. Louis and the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034327 corporate EHS department but is the only full time corporate guy down here, it looks like a lot of stuff is happening. I assume you all have relied upon third parties to do a lot of the work. Is that correct? A. The work has certainly been done by non-Solutia employees. As far as moving dirt and liners it has been contracted out. Q. In fact, aside from oversight or management has any of the work actually been done by Solutia employees? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 143 A. I really am not qualified to answer that. Q. Let me put it differently. Are you aware of any Solutia employees who have actually been out physically doing things as part of the remediation? A. I have no knowledge of Solutia employees doing the actual remediation work, no. Q. Are you even aware of the names of some MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034328 of the prime contractors who have been doing this work? A. Only one name comes to mind. There have been several, but only one comes to mind. Q. What would that be? A. Golder. I think that's the right name. There are others I'm sure, but I just don't know them by name. Q. You mentioned when you were giving me your role in the remediation about part of your accountability was to ensure that these folks were safety focused or oriented. I forget your exact words. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 144 What do you do to do that? For instance, with Golder what have you done to make yourself feel comfortable that these folks are safety oriented and are doing what you have represented to the community will be done? A. We have a program called CMR that speaks to an initial training that's to be given to all vendors, contractors MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034329 on-site, and certain requirements that they have in terms of their historical safety performance before they come on-site. So they would have received an initial orientation to our plant of the kind of operations we have there, the things we do, what some of the permitting processes might be to work on a specific job in the plant properties. And then the expectations I have given to Alan specifically then were to make sure that within the contractor group that there is the opportunity to them at least on a weekly basis to have, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 145 my term, a toolbox safety conversation that starts the week off, where their supervisor would sit down and talk about something in the safety area just to get their focus and attention on the fact that they need to work safely in the plant. That's the kind of things I'm talking about. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034330 Q. So there are some real concrete things you all do to try to implement those goals? A. There are some things that we would do. Q. Okay. And would I be safe in assuming you would not likely tolerate someone deviating from these goals you have in safety and getting things done in the way you have represented they are going to be done? A. We have some expectations around safety, personnel safety and working within the plant properties in particular that we would expect them to live up to and work up to. And if we were to observe or if REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 146 there are reports of deviation, we would have conversation. Q. Have you in fact been informed of any deviations that have occurred during the remediation process? A. There was an occasion where it was brought to my attention that we may not have reviewed a material safety data MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034331 sheet with one contractor group. I forget how I got knowledge of that, but somebody came to me with that. I got Alan immediately and said, look, make sure -- And we made known to the contractors the fact that they are entitled to look at material safety data sheets and if not, let's make sure they all know that. That's the only occasion I have personal knowledge of where there was a chance of a deviation. I don't know if it was there or not. Q. Okay. And that was more that maybe you all hadn't put something in place that you had hoped for in terms of putting REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 147 them on notice of something? A. Word got back to us somehow that one member of their contractor group had not felt like he had been adequately given information about materials that were handled, and we wanted to make sure that he knew, as well as all contractors MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034332 knew, they had access to material safety data sheets. Q. Was there a particular material in question that stands out? A. Nothing that was given to me. Q. It was an abstract proposition that this person hadn't seen the MSDS? A. He didn't tell us who the individual was, but we wanted to follow up on it. Q. In terms of contractors not carrying through, anything that you are aware of where they didn't follow the expectations y'all had for them in the written requirements that you had for them? A. Nothing has been brought to my REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 148 attention, Charles. Q. Have y'all had any surprises? Again I'm putting this in the context of your comparatively short tenure here as you have gone out and done this remediation work. A. Any surprises? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034333 Q. To give you an example, something that you've -- A. Every day is a surprise in my business. Q. You put something in place that you feel has a capacity of this much dirt, this big a pipe, this large of a retention basin, and you get it up and running and realize this sucker just isn't going to do the job. You go out and are digging dirt and find something you haven't expected to find digging dirt there, something you thought was going to perform a particular task and it just isn't happening. Or has it all been very smooth and as expected? A. I was told of two things that I would REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 149 call a surprise. Q. That's my term. A. I'm not sure they were surprises. But one was a design condition that once the contractor was attempting to fit it together and it didn't work as had been MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034334 stated. This was in the large pipelines. I think they were forty-two-inch pipes that were coming together in a concrete box, conveyance of water from the Coldwater Mountain. And they do -- As part of that attachment to the box, there is some sort of pressure test run. And the initial tests did not pass, and so the contractor ended up taking some extra time to come up with a fit that would work to give a seal on those boxes. And the other occasion, again, which I was told about -- I did not see it, but was told -- was that in one area of digging in a ditch along 202 a -- something odorous was found or observed REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 150 or smelled. And so work was stopped, and people were brought in, people being Alan, Robert Jones, to look at it and see what if anything was there and what needed to be done with it. I frankly don't know what the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034335 final decision of that was, but I know it was something that shut down the work for a day or so while we were trying to assess what this was if anything. Nothing other than those two stand out in my mind as something that caused a slowdown of the work or change in remediation plans that has been brought to my attention. Q. The pipes meeting at the junction box and maybe not meeting is of less interest than this stuff found in the ditch at 202 and work being shut down for a while. Do you have any subsequent understanding of what the substance was determined to be or was it even determined what it was, if you know? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 151 A. No. I don't recall the outcome of that. I know they took care of it. Whether they found something or whether they determined there was nothing there, I can't say, Charles. I don't recall more MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034336 circumstances than that. It is just one day that stood out. Q. And your knowledge about that is derived from a conversation with Alan Faust, or there was some other source? A. Either Alan or Robert one that just brought it to my attention. Q. And I presume that is something you would want to know? A. Yes, yes. Q. Do you know if anybody was hurt, hospitalized? A. I know that no one was hurt. Q. Okay. Are you aware of anybody having been hurt, whether it be just through some mechanical injury or toxic injury or whatever while working on this remediation project in your tenure? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 152 A. I do not recall anyone being hurt or injured. It was not brought to my attention that they were. Q. Okay. Is there a protocol in place if somebody is out digging dirt out there MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034337 and they come across something out there that smells wrong to them, looks wrong to them, the blade of the bulldozer starts evaporating, in a worst case scenario, what they are supposed to do? Take my down that path, if you would, please. A. Presumably if that were work being done by a contractor -- I don't know where you are referring. But if it were being done by one of our contractor groups -- Q. Who else would be doing it? A. Well, you said earthwork. We do earthwork in our plant too. Q. Okay. Good point. A. But if it were being done by a contractor and there was something observed or a concern or any kind of a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 153 question -- doesn't have to be real, just a question they have -- we expect them to contact their supervisor. And their supervisor will work with -- in MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034338 the case of remediation specific, to get with Alan Faust, work their way up there. That is not to say that if they aren't satisfied that through their supervision they are being heard, they can come to Alan Faust directly if they so choose. So that is kind of -- In terms of remediation, Alan represents Solutia for the first contact within that organization. They could certainly come to me or Robert Jones, but particularly with Alan, and he could come to us. Q. And I'm going to guess from what you have told me so far today in terms of deciding what to do with such a situation, Alan would be the person with the expertise and who would actually REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 154 make the decision on the grounds, so to speak, of what we are going to do. A. Not necessarily. If it were something that could in fact be relative to our MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034339 operating permits, relationship with ADEM or any of the regulatory or permitting requirements, Robert Jones is really the one that acts on that. So if it were something wrong with the bulldozer or if there is a safety problem, generally Alan would handle that. If it were an area that could be a permit issue, he would need to work with Robert specifically on that. Q. And now we get back to reporting requirements in the sense we have talked about before. If you find certain kind of things, you would have the duty to report to ADEM or EPA or something about that compound? A. We have regulatory and permit requirements that we want to abide by. And to the extent that we find something REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 155 that questions that or raises an issue around our compliance with that, we would then talk with the agency. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034340 Q. Okay. And again, you take that requirement very seriously, I trust? A. I have an accountability for that site, and I want to make sure that within the regulatory requirements, permit requirements, to the best of our ability and the best of our capability we are going to abide by it. Q. Do you know if any sort of report was made with respect to the incident there along 202? MR. COX: Report to whom? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Anyone outside the contractor group and Solutia. A. I can't be certain of that, Charles, whether that precipitated or not. I don't recall. Q. I've seen some reports that were made to ADEM back in the '70s where the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 156 information that Monsanto conveyed to ADEM was treated as confidential. It is now being conveyed to the public, but at MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034341 the time it was kept confidential. Are you aware of any information that has been provided to ADEM regarding the remediation that is being treated as confidential and would not be known to somebody like me if I showed up down in Montgomery and started looking through the file? A. I have no knowledge of anything that is being kept from you that was given to ADEM, no. I have no knowledge of any. Q. Okay. Well, I guess -- If we talk to Alan Faust on Monday, as we are presently planning to, he could probably give us more enlightenment about this stuff that came up in the ditch? A. Right. There was an odor. I don't know if anything came up. There was an odor. I remember a contractor group working that had a concern about an odor, so REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 157 there was a gathering out there to check it out. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034342 Q. And no one has told you about them finding anything else, be it pools of liquid, barrels, boxes, anything else out there as they have been digging and such? A. I have no knowledge of anything unusual or other surprises, your term earlier, being found. Q. Hidden treasure is what I have written down in my outline. A. Hidden treasure, treasure for you, maybe. Q. And you would agree with me that it would be very important for a corporation to keep people advised if they found things like that and to comply with these reporting requirements? A. Whenever we find anything that is a surprise, whether it is real or turns out to be nothing, we expect people to REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 158 bring it to our attention so we can investigate it. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034343 Q. In fact, it is my understanding that there are even certain criminal sanctions for people who don't make certain reporting requirements in the environmental realm. Are you likewise of the impression that it can even be a criminal act not to report certain things? A. Yes. When I sign my statements to ADEM, I do so with the knowledge that I can be criminally charged if we falsified anything. Q. Let's talk about the retention basin -- that is what I call it -- that is just east of the church, settling basin. A. By 202, again? Q. Right. Again, it is going to be just east. It doesn't even show up in this picture because it didn't exist back when this was taken. But you know what I'm talking about? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 159 A. I'm familiar with an earthen pond that MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034344 is adjacent to 202 and Mars Hill Church, yes. Q. What is your understanding of what that serves, what purpose it is there for? A. I think it wasn't even operational for a while. But now that it is, there are waters that convey off -- There is a berm above the remediated area on Coldwater Mountain. My understanding is that the waters that convey off the land immediately below the berm to 202 are gathered and brought over and into the first pond. And the water is collected there and traversed in such a way that if there are any sediments that come from this remediated area, that sediment will settle into the pond prior to the discharge of the water from those ponds. Q. And in theory capture or settle out potential contamination in that sediment? A. If there were anything that attached REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 160 itself to the sediments that would be MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034345 conveyed, this would give an opportunity for it to settle. Q. Are you aware of any analyses that have been performed since it has gone on line or become operational of the sediments that may be depositing in the pond? A. I have no knowledge that any were taken or that they have been analyzed. I have not seen any results. Q. Do you have an understanding of how long that pond is envisioned to be operational? A. It has been built as a permanent part of this overall conveyance of water from the lower confines of Coldwater Mountain here. Q. Are you familiar with the compound parathion? A. I'm familiar with the name parathion and the fact it was an insecticide, I believe. Q. Are you aware it was manufactured at REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 161 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034346 your site? A. I have read that parathion was produced in Anniston. Q. Is there any parathion in the landfills there? A. I have no knowledge that it is, Charles. You know, I have no knowledge. Q. Let me talk about the area that's being remediated basically aside from the landfill cells. Am I correct in my perception as I drove around that you are also remediating a lot of other areas, a lot of acreage? MR. COX: East of the plant, the former property purchase program area? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Yes. MR. COX: That's the easiest way to describe it. MR. CUNNINGHAM: That's easy for you to say. Q. Are you aware that is happening? A. Yes. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 162 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034347 Q. What is your understanding of what is actually being done in those areas? A. It really had to do with the ditch. I can't remember the full details of it. But they conveyed water through this area east of the plant, at times conveyed some level of PCB. And in heavy rains apparently was some flooding of that area, and so sediment was on either side of its banks. And the work specifically then was two-fold. One was to cover those areas that had or potentially had PCBs as defined by some analytical sampling that was done in the areas, and hold in place while we removed the waters from running above ground on that to either a conveyance into the pond we talked about or through large pipes crossed the grounds but now covered in the form of a berm to a collected outfall near Tenth Street. So it is one of capping the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 163 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034348 identified areas of PCBs or suspected areas and conveyance of waters through pipe so it didn't flow across those lands. Q. Am I correct, then, in understanding that you haven't actually hauled away PCB contaminated soil but rather have covered it and attempted to minimize the amount of water that might flow through that? MR. COX: You are again talking only about on the east side? MR. CUNNINGHAM: If you are doing it somewhere else, I would love to know about that too. But that is the focus of my inquiry. A. I have no personal knowledge of dirt with PCBs in it being removed and hauled someplace. Q. Again, I'm sure Mr. Faust will be able to elaborate in much greater detail than you, but I'm obviously interested in REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 164 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034349 your perception as well. I'm going to give you my last crayon, so you know I'm on the last lap here. This one is orchid. I'll ask you in the orchid color just to show me what area you understand this part of the remediation is being conducted on. MR. COX: The cap and contain? MR. CUNNINGHAM: The cap and contain, thank you. A. You have the pond here, so that is not included. And the old Bethel Church is still there. Are you talking about work that has been done, going -- Q. Both, been done and going be done as far as you know. I'm trying to get an idea of the geographic scale of this particular phase of things. A. There is a property over here that is not included. I can't tell where it is. MR. COX: Ms. Jackson's properties are right there on Sixth Street. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 165 MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034350 Q. If you want to just do the big conglomeration, you can tell me about the areas that for whatever reason are not involved. That is not a real sharp crayon. This has to be a blunt. A. Access to that street to Mars Hill, this is where our box is over here. I don't want to get the ice house and other things. I can't tell where it is -- It is right in there (indicating). MR. STEWART: Y'all haven't bought that yet. A. That is Bethel. We are going to do Bethel. We haven't done the removal of that yet, but it will be done. The pond is in here somewhere, and we have left the Mars Hill Church and the road there, love to be able to relocate that and do that as well. Q. Okay. If you would just kind of color that in, please. MR. COX: There were a few properties in the mix that REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034351 166 haven't been part of the remedy yet. So if he colors over a property that is still out there -- MR. CUNNINGHAM: That I understand. This is just giving me some understanding of his understanding. A. This is 202. Now, that is on that side. Was that all you wanted, this area east of the plant? Q. Is there someplace west of the plant or north or south? A. We have done some in this area of our plant properties. Q. Kind of between the plant itself and the landfill? A. Yeah. There is a triangle there. Q. Let me just get you to put your initials there on that. Okay. Now, are you aware of any -- You said you weren't aware of them hauling dirt off. Are you aware of any MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034352 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 167 properties where you didn't buy the property but just came in and cleaned it up where the home owner could continue to live there or the business owner as the case may be? A. Ask that again. You changed it on me. Q. I said home owner, but I don't mean to limit it to residential properties. Are you aware of property where as opposed to buying it and it doing this cap and contain you have just come in and cleaned it up, taken the PCBs off the property? A. I don't recall us having done that, Charles. Q. Is that because you won't do it or it just hasn't come up? A. I'm just not aware of -- We would remediate, if there were evidence or a need for it, current requirement to remediate, if we had the approval of the property owner and under the direction of ADEM. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034353 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 168 Q. And I take it that ADEM to a great extent is relying on you or Solutia to address this problem to take action to minimize the exposure of the community to these PCBs. A. ADEM is the overseer for this effort, and we work with them, in concurrence or partnership with them to make sure we are living up to whatever the requirements are. Q. What is your sense of how much oversight there is? By way of comparison, there is a case I worked in Kentucky where the State of Kentucky had what they called an on-site coordinator, and he was literally down there all day, every day, and that was his job. What is your understanding of the nature of the presence, physical presence of a live, warm human body for ADEM at this remediation effort? A. I have no personal knowledge of an ADEM visit for remediation, specific. That MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034354 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 169 may have taken place. I have no knowledge. Q. You haven't met someone who was introduced as here is the person who is down here all the time? A. I have not met an ADEM employee that was there specifically for the remediation. Q. Is it fair for me to characterize this as a situation where ADEM is basically trusting Solutia to do what it says it will do? In other words, you talk about on paper what you are going to do and then they trust you to do that? A. It has been a mutual effort here where they have made contacts, have reviewed the proposal, have as I understand been on-site in the past and for which now we review each step that we take with them, their appropriate entity within ADEM, to say here is where we are as the status. But I wouldn't say they are just removed entirely from it. Q. Okay. Are you at all knowledgeable MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034355 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 170 about the money that is being expended in this effort? A. I'm aware that money is obviously being spent. I see it out there every day just in the heads I see and the liner. So I know it is being spent, but it is being managed at a corporate level. So I don't have access to the total dollars. Q. Do you even have any bits and pieces of the puzzle in the sense of knowing that a particular contractor is getting paid Y or it is costing us so many dollars per square foot or square mile to do whatever? A. I don't have any of that information. Q. Do you know what sort of precautions the contractors and their employees are taking to control the risks they face from exposure to chemicals as they do this remediation? A. I don't have any specific knowledge of the details of training nor MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034356 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 171 communication that was given, only as I said earlier, information relative to safe operations of equipment and making certain they follow certain safety expectations and have available MSDSs of any materials we are producing and using in our plant. Q. To be less obtuse about it, I have read health and safety chapters of work plans that seem to discuss particular kinds of protective clothing, restrictions on eating and smoking in certain areas, requirements for cleaning when leaving areas and such. Is that consistent with your understanding, that those type of requirements have been put on the contractors by Solutia as part and parcel of this remediation effort? A. I don't have information relative to that specific, Charles, whether they were or were not. Q. Have you ever observed anybody out there MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034357 working wearing what you perceived to be REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 172 something other than typical labor garb for the Anniston area? A. Hard hats, gloves, safety shoes. Q. Have you ever noticed anybody using a respirator or some sort of device to -- that would be an air screen of some sort? A. I have not seen a respirator being worn while touring or observing any of the work during remediation. Q. Do you have any personal knowledge or opinion regarding what is or isn't a safe level of exposure to PCB for humans? MR. COX: Object to the form. A. I have not read nor observed what is the actual requirement, but would expect that if someone were to have knowledge of PCB contact that they would follow the stated health practices to be found in the MSDS. Q. Okay. Are you familiar with the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034358 Monsanto pledge? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 173 A. Yes, yes. I am familiar with it. Q. And for the jury's benefit, what is your understanding of the Monsanto pledge and its contents and how it impacts on what you do on a day-to-day or month-to-month basis? MR. COX: That is three questions. Make sure you answer all three. Q. What is your understanding of the content -- Let's be even more basic. Is that a comparable Solutia pledge? A. There is a Solutia pledge that was issued or announced within the last two or three weeks. Q. Okay. MR. COX: For the record, we are working on producing that in an ongoing effort to give you things as they become available. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034359 Q. Have you had a chance to read that pledge? REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 174 A. Yes, I've read it. Q. How does it compare with the Monsanto pledge, if you are comfortable comparing the two? A. The distinct difference in the two is -- Again, the Monsanto pledge was written in 1990, and the Solutia pledge is of 1998 origin. Monsanto's pledge talks about sustainability, agricultural sustainability as being the goal -- a goal for the seven part challenge. Solutia's pledge talks about eco-efficiencies and its realm of sustainability. It differentiates, again, that we want to identify or want to work on how to improve our use of raw materials to get more product per raw material and reduce the use of energy. And the end result is a lessening or reduction in the overall emissions that would result from the operations. So MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034360 eco-efficiencies versus sustainability. Others parts of the Solutia REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 175 pledge, the focus is again on operating safe facilities, commitment to the public, to be open for people coming into the plant and talking to us, us to them, and encouragement of our employees to be involved in environmental issues -- I'll say issues; that's not the term used -- but encouragement for our employees to be active in environmental. Q. Proactive on this kind of thing? A. Yeah. That's -- And a commitment, as I said earlier, through the eco-efficiencies to work toward reductions in our waste. Q. And again, as I have asked on several other issues, may I safely assume that you as the site manager take that seriously? It is a big part of what you are doing there? A. That is a large part of my role, to at MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034361 least make people aware of this and begin to develop our plans for support for the direction the enterprise has set REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 176 for us. Q. Is that pledge something that is shared with -- Obviously I presume it goes further than you. How far down the chain does it go, and how is it disseminated to those folks? MR. COX: You are talking Solutia now? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Yes. Q. It may be that it hasn't had a chance to be disseminated. But in the real world, how do you take something like that -- eco-efficiency is a new word to me. But it sounds good. How do you actually put that into practice? A. The simple part is distributing the paperwork in such a way that everybody has access to see, has access to it. That is one part of it. And we are doing that now. The second part is what MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034362 we speak to, is how do you help people understand what that means to me on my daily job. Frankly, that is not a REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 177 one-time thing. That's ongoing in conversation, cultural change that I and my leadership and others across the plant will have to work on daily to create the awareness and understanding of what that means to me out here in this job I'm working on today. As you say, eco-efficiency, I don't fully understand that yet. Directionally I understand. Q. Do you attend a church? A. Yes, I do. Q. What is your church here in town? A. Greenbrier Road Baptist. Both my wife and I attend there. Q. Is that the nearest Baptist church to your home? A. No. Q. So there are other factors that play in MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034363 your decision to go to that particular church? A. That's correct. MR. STEWART: Charlie, off the REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 178 record. (Discussion held off record.) Q. Is that a Southern Baptist church affiliate? A. Yes. Q. Have you ever been deposed before? A. Thought I was, but, no, I have not been. MR. COX: You need to explain that one. Q. That's what I was going to say. You either have to say no or be ready for that follow-up. What happened to you before that you thought was a deposition but now realize wasn't? A. Oh, I thought I was going be deposed, and it turned out I was not. Q. Okay. Ever been involved in litigation with Monsanto or Solutia beyond what's going on here at Anniston? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034364 MR. COX: Involved -- MR. CUNNINGHAM: I realize it is broad, but it is because I have no way other than to REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 179 make it broad and see if anything comes to his mind. A. No. Q. Electrodes are not going come out and zap you. MR. COX: No. I was just concerned about such a broad term. A. No. I'm not aware of any -- I have never before deposed, and I'm not aware of anything right now that I have been or will be. Q. Okay. Let me talk briefly about the training you do have with respect to pollution laws. You told me that gets some play in your in-house stuff and that you have occasionally gone to external continuing education. Do you MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034365 ever recall an external seminar that dealt with pollution laws, compliance therewith, what have you? A. No. I have never attended a course or seminar on environmental law. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 180 Q. Do you recall some in-house Monsanto function that was totally devoted to that sort of issue as opposed to being one element of the review? A. Nothing comes to mind where I attended anything like that, Charles. Q. If I threw some acronyms out like RCRA and CIRCLA, would you understand what those are acronyms for? A. Yes, yes, I recognize the acronym. Q. What does RCRA deal with? A. Resource Conservation Recovery Act. Q. And CIRCLA? MR. COX: I think his question -- Q. Just concept-wise. I'm not sure I know the words. I'm just trying to see what it deals with as you understand it. A. They have to do with a definition or MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034366 requirements, stipulation that has been established by the EPA relative to certain chemicals and their hazardous or toxicity nature. So it is a reference to both a chemical by name or a group of REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 181 chemicals and some characteristics they have and sometimes an association with how they have been handled in the past and now you're responsible for whatever effects there might be there. Q. Okay. Do you recall receiving written materials, again internally within Monsanto or Solutia, that deal with environmental stuff, guidelines, handbooks, something that you have sitting in your office that you reach up and pull down if you have a question? A. Nothing comes to mind. I would go find Robert Jones. Q. I see. You have a two-legged resource? A. It changes so fast that I would go get him to keep me current if there were a MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034367 question come up. Q. Are you aware of anyone in Monsanto or Solutia who has been somehow sanctioned over what has happened here, these contaminants being off-site? A. Explain sanctioned. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 182 Q. Reprimanded, economically had their salary or pension somehow cut or eliminated, just through some written or verbal, you know, you screwed up here, anything like that? A. I have no knowledge of anything like that having happened by Monsanto or Solutia. Q. You have told me about the kind of expertise that is available to you all with the ESH department in St. Louis. Would I be -- And you have mentioned that there are some labs you all use, outside labs. What about technical, scientific expertise? Am I safe in assuming Monsanto has a fair number of qualified scientists and technical MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034368 people within the company? Solutia, I'm sorry. A. Monsanto has lots of them. Q. What about Solutia? A. Much fewer. Q. Okay. Can you give me a rough idea of REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 183 how many people came with Solutia with this kind of this technical expertise versus what you had when it was Monsanto? MR. COX: In ES and H or everything? MR. CUNNINGHAM: Everything. A. The total of Solutia population employees is about eighty-eight hundred, as stated in public records. Q. As opposed to how many -- A. I think Monsanto total was on the order of thirty-five thousand. Now they are less by that eighty-eight hundred. MR. CUNNINGHAM: Let's take a break. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034369 (A break was taken.) Q. We talked about that quarter century banquet. If we wanted to find out who was involved in that, set it up, who was being honored, what would be the best way to do that? Who should we talk to, or what documents should we try to get REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 184 our mitts on? A. Susan Gardener, an administrative assistant, set the banquet up and sent out invitations. MR. COX: For the record, if there is an agenda or any indication of who the twenty-five year honorees are, I will be happy to give that to y'all on an informal basis. MR. CIJNNINGHAM: Because it seems those would be the people most likely to know what happened in the past out there. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034370 Q. My sense today has been that when it comes to contact with ADEM or making decisions about the remediation efforts and compliance, the three names I keep hearing are Alan Faust, Robert Jones, and I guess -- Well, his name hasn't come up, but this Jerry Hopper who is REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 185 the environmental technician, would be the three principal individuals? A. Yeah. And I'm not--1 don't have personal knowledge that Jerry would interface with ADEM. I would say it has been Robert primarily and Alan to a lesser extent. Q. Jerry Brown, who is Jerry Brown? A. We mentioned him earlier. He is the technologist or technical supervisor on-site. Q. Would he have any role in that particular sphere? A. Only if it were in the past maybe. Nothing since I have been there. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034371 MR. STEWART: What is the most recent -- can you ask what is the most recent time he has been involved? MR. COX: If you know. THE WITNESS: I don't know. MR. CUNNINGHAM: Sometime before May of'97. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 186 Q. I don't mean to pry but -- A. Now I recognize a question when it goes to that "but." Q. For purposes again of looking at potential jurors, do you belong to any particular clubs or organizations here in the Calhoun County area that you attend on a regular basis? A. Yes. Q. What would those be? A. I attend the -- what is called the noon Rotary Club of Anniston. Q. Okay. A. I attend infrequently, but attend, something called COUL, C-O-U-L. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034372 Q. Is that an acronym for something? MR. STEWART: I know what is it, Charlie. A. I am part of the Chamber Of Commerce's education, business, industry committee and a part of Leadership Calhoun County, which is a subset of the Chamber work. I think that's it on a regular basis. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 187 Q. We talked at one point about golf. Do you play golf somewhere regularly? A. We -- Solutia now will have a golf league, so we will play together at Pine Hill Golf Course. Q. But you are not a member of a particular place? A. No. I don't play golf very well, so you would have to give me a lot of strokes. Q. You have not seen me putt. Let me show you two pieces of paper that your lawyer was kind enough to provide us today in response to our deposition notice that you may or may MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034373 not be able to give us any insight into. Let's start with the shorter one, the one with less writing, and ask you if you recognize that piece of paper. A. No. Q. Don't think you have ever seen it before? A. I know I haven't seen this one before. Q. Okay. It is addressed or it would REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 188 appear to be a phone message log to an Alan. Do you know any Alans at the plant aside from Alan Faust? A. Yes, several. Q. How many other Alans would there be? A. At least two others. Q. What are their -- A. Alan Rutherford and Alan Robertson. Q. Would either of those individuals have any involvement with the litigation or remediation with the PCBs in the Anniston area? A. Not to the best of my knowledge. Q. This would appear to log a call from an MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034374 Adrian Frederick. Does that name ring a bell to you as possibly one of the other two ladies along with Cassandra Roberts that you met at the Shoney's in June? MR. STEWART: That is not a lady, Charlie. A. No. I didn't meet with him or her, and I have no knowledge of that name. MR. STEWART: That is a man. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 189 MR. COX: For the record, those weren't necessary produced in response to the deposition notice. We think we produced it before, but we couldn't find it in all the paper. These are some of Alan's notes, Alan Faust's notes, if that helps. We think we produced them before, but to be safe -- MR. WRIGHT: I don't remember seeing those. Charlie may MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034375 have. Q. Taking this second piece of paper, ever seen that before? A. No. Q. Do you remember Mr. Faust taking any notes when you had your meeting at Shoney's? A. I don't remember him making any notes. Q. Do you remember making any yourself? A. No. I know I did not. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 190 Q. Did you before leaving on vacation or when you got back make any kind of memo to yourself? A. No. No, I did not. Q. Have you ever seen this piece of paper before, do you think? A. No, not that I recall. And I think I would remember it. But no, I do not. Q. There is a phone number at the top. Is that familiar to you at all? A. Yeah. Q. What is that phone number? A. That is mine, my home phone. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034376 Q. 855 A. I think it is 835. Q. -- 9676 is your home phone number? A. I think that's it, yes. I sometimes forget it, but yes. Q. Do you remember perhaps getting a call from Alan Faust where he discussed the things that are noted or referenced in that particular document? A. Let me read it then and see. REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 191 Q. Okay. A. Okay. I'm sorry. Now would you ask me the question again about it? Q. Yes. Do you have a recollection of speaking with Mr. Faust about the kinds of things that are outlined in that document? A. He and I had a conversation the morning after our meeting. Q. That would have been Sunday? A. No. Excuse me. The morning right after this meeting that Saturday before I left MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034377 town. Looking back on the meeting now, I'm getting ready to leave town. We want a church, that was a statement that one of the participants there said three or four times, that all we want is a church. So I -- That is a statement that could have been made there. I do recognize that statement. That's the only piece I see that rings a bell with -- I remember from our conversation that statement being made, REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 192 and it is in quotes, I see. But I don't recognize the other information. And he did bring a poster to the meeting. Q. The first thing on here says turner card. Almost like psychological imaging, what is the first thing that comes to your mind when you read turner card, or does anything come to your mind? A. Robin and Robert Turner from Pensacola. Q. Shelby Dean? A. He is an architect. Shelby Dean is the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034378 name of an architect here in town that I believe did the architect work for new Bethel. Q. Pavement, any idea -- It even has an asterisk beside it. A. No, no. I don't know what that is. Q. Goals, contract, APCO easement. That is all caps, A-P-C-O, easement slash letter. Any idea what an APCO easement letter would be? A. I have seen Alabama Power Company REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 193 written that way before, but I don't know -- I don't know if that is what that refers to. Q. Next line says Mars Hill, Melanie, 237-4688, T-i-e-g-m-a MR. STEWART: Tignor. Q. Tignor. Again, does that name -- A. You mentioned a Ms. or Mrs. Tignor. I said I recognize that name. I recognize Melanie. Whether they went together, I can't be sure, but I do recognize it. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034379 Q. Does that phone number look familiar to you at all? A. No. It is not a number that is familiar to me. Q. Is that an Anniston exchange, 237? A. I don't know. Q. Okay. A. It is not mine nor the plant's. Beyond that I can't comment. Q. Oxford Kawanis. I know you mentioned you spoke to the Oxford Rotary Club. Did you ever speak to the Oxford Kawanis REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 194 Club? A. No. Q. Any idea why Alan would make a notation about the Oxford Kawanis Club? A. No. I have no knowledge of anybody in our plant being a member of it. Q. DOT bond, do you have any knowledge about some sort of DOT bond? A. No, I don't have any information. Q. It says judge to fire Stewart. Any idea what that is about? MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034380 A. I didn't -- I don't know a Stewart that works for the judge. MR. CUNNINGHAM: Thank you, sir. (Plaintiffs' Exhibit Number One was marked for identification, offered, and attached as an exhibit hereto.) (The deposition concluded at 3:30 p.m.) REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. 195 I do hereby certify that the witness whose attached deposition was taken before me was by me first duly cautioned and sworn to tell nothing but the truth in the cause aforesaid; that the testimony contained herein was by me reduced to writing in the presence of said witnesses by means of stenography and afterwards transcribed by means of computer aided transcription. The foregoing is a true and accurate transcript of the whole of the MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034381 testimony given by said witness, as aforesaid. I do further certify that I am not connected by blood or marriage with any of the parties or their attorneys or agents and that I am not an employee of any of them, nor interested in the matter of controversy. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand and affixed my notarial seal at Gadsden, Alabama, County of Etowah, this 3rd day of April 1998. Deborah Salers Garrett Certified Shorthand Reporter Registered Professional Reporter Notary Public, Alabama-at-Large My Commission expires: 3-7-2001 REGIONAL REPORTING SERVICE, INC. MARS HILL 03-20-1998 Hamilton, Blake.PRT.txt[8/22/2017 3:12:26 PM] HARTOLDMON0034382