Document np71KkM7JrVnJY3r85Jz8NKY8

FOR 41 EAST 42ND STREET, NEW YORK. N. Y. 10017, 697-3100 HILL KNOHLTON, INC. PROGRAM iRONQLi DATE January 28, 1972 it SO PM s t a t io ^nbc,,T7 (n e c TELEVISION NETWORK) c it y New York SEGMENT ON LEAL POISONING GARRICK UTLEY* Last year soma c this animals in New York's Staten I aland Zoo wars poisoned. A few died, others, inclvdir.c Vi - i.3 rA ! :.o: y l .2 poisoning ?ras a mystery The isos iaskei doctors at Now York 3!sales 1 College to solve it. VJh&tavsr the P'iisjen i^as, it came frrs* the environment, and it was strong aniregh to Pie permanent dassag* to the black leopard's p.trvous ay tan. Bleed tests shewed that the poison was lead. Jo C-SCTCSs The blood levels of the; great cats were very high Hi Is ad extent,, in the toxic range. UTLEYs This aews w so startling that, the doctors expanded their steady to other animals living in otrsdeor sage*; in other city seese DOCTOR: f>% found also at th Brens: Zoo that the great ;tS3, eleven at of fowrfcssn ss I zmiim.bar, were- very high in termj of their bleed lead. a & K&ftt According te Dr. Chew, uhc? w'v sent samples to? the level5 are eo high b6cddn*t believer tho animals were alive. ECC-rORs The sane is trea of vary limited work that ws did at the Central Park Zoo. Thors0s one monkey that came in here vitSi a lung condition, but upon autopsy after the animal died, wa found that animal had very high lead levels in the vital organs. so y( EMIL DOLSNSKI^ Recently we thought it was related to lead in paint, and we did base analyses done on paint, and we_ foaag, that some of the p&rnts: ware rnceect nicner unani acceptable leva Is fm New York City. tvs are more concerned, though, in the case of animals like the lions, which we have here, because there -is no contact at all with paint materials. Yet they're LIA-76156 OFFICE8 IN: NEW YORK DETROIT LOS ANGELES WASHINGTON. D. C. * NEW ENGLAND CHICAGO 2- - still running at levels which would indicate a chronic toxicity problem, DR. RALPH STEKI'R: >7 ktvte reason to believe that it car ta inly cosies frc-m the erwircr.ra-mf, irom the air. Because other wise the soil arour.i! ths sco would not he accumulating as much lead as they presently have. The normal amount of lead in the earth's crust is only about ten to fifteen parts per million. And when you conaider that: the soil at the Central Park Eco had ever five hundred parti? per million, that answers your question UTLEYs Ths load pniaonint; th~ ;;co ania-ale cornea from leaded gasoline. Automobiles put tvo hundred thousand tons of tcxIS lead into our urban environment every year, It's tco much fer the animals to feekst B0LE113XXs 1 don't s-ss where us car. honestly continue to show- large cats outdoors nn-j r-ora. As las as any new enclosure.? that we make, X tSiink we're- going to hate tc build indoor er.cic`lures with - filtered air systons. DR. DENNXS cnhOTIH; Thsss are chert rous conditions, not only for ths animals who ara living in ths confinement of the sco, but for th people who are also living in the close neigh borhood r who com there just as visitors. MANs It sss:as that ail ycuag' living things ar most saE:ooptibl to lead. And that babies being bora today have high lead levels. And this is an ominous sign, because they5re starting out with & high lead level. And we know thi.t lead accumulates over a lifetime, and therefore by the time they reach an ecuIt age they my very well bs in trouble. WILLIAM Fc RYAN? Four hsmdred thousand children in this country are afflicted with load poisoning. That is a tremendous number of children. That's a serious problem. There are more eases of lead poisoning among children today than there were cases of polio in this^eountry before th Sulk vaccine. SENATOR EDWARD KENNEDY? There ere scores, I believe it5s even in the hundreds of children that are dying of lead poison ing, but haven't been diagnosed as such. Split's widespread in the urban centers, in the older cantors of our country. And wa know very well that something can be done to prevent it. UTLEY: The air inner city children breathe is heavily contaminated with lead. But the major source of lead poisoning in the slums is peeling paint from fialapidated buildings. When these buildings were constructed, it wa;s common to use lead^ based paints n inside walls. Now that paiat is flaking off. LIA-76157 -3- Childrsn like to eat the paint chips, The result is illnessP brain damage, and even death, WOMAN: The baby, ha had it bat. enough where he had to go in tha hospital this year for it., Every time I look around there's one getting lead poisoning. And I'm afraid that one time one cf them might get it, and it might be a little bit too late. UTLEY: Norman Britt suffered r.evere brain damage sight years ago from lead paint. Ha will never ba normal. MR. BRITT: And Norman was eating it. i\nd all of a sudden, you know, he got kind cf sick. So the doctor said he had lead poisoning. He like this the reat of his life? he'll never, yen know, never grow out of it. JACK HEWIELD: What j o tit frustrating about this is that .a few months ago I spoke to the load poit ning Kings County hospital in Brooklyn, to parents whose children had been lead poisoned. When I was there 1 looked at the admissi .one record for Kings County Hospital, "here had been thirty admis sions for lead poisoning in one month? and of tha thirty, fif teen ware ren-oigonlngs. which is a guarantee of permanent brain damage,, DR. MICHAEL KLEIN: You don't replace brain cells. Ones a brain cell has been destroyed, ha:? swollen, and burst, and been destroyed it is never replaced again. MR. BRITT: He told me h had lead poisoning. I hadn't ever heard of lead poisoning, so I didn't know what it was, until, you know, he started having these seizures. UTLEY: What are these seizures like? BRITT: Well, some kind of change. Like one time he had, like, he*d just go round and round. And tha next he changed like he wanted to climb the wall. '$hen something was close to him, he'd grab. And, boy, I had a time trying to pry him loose from it. UTLEY: This is where NOrman Britt was poisoned, the s Iv a o of Rochester, New York. But Rochester did something about it. A neighborhood group called SPAN, and the University of Rochaste: Medical School joined forces to find out how bad the lead prob lem is. The first thing they did was test slum houses for lead paint. Two SPAN workers showed ms how they did the survey. They LIA-76158 -4- also told me that part of the problem is that young children like the taste of lead paint. HAN: It tastes vary svsst. And that: 3 the trouble, the kids under six, after they taste it, they keep up, and keep eating, and that's it, they get poisoned. UTLEY; How many houses do you try to see a day? WOMAN; About ton t.o fifteen !:nses. UTLEY; Now in this house there has been lead poisoning, is that correct? WOMAN; Yes, the Welters' chiid got lead poisoning in this house, right upstairs. UTLEY; Hew leng ago did that htppan? WOMAN; Well, they just found out about it a few weeks ago* J- UTLEY; How serious was the load poisoning in a house like this? How strong was the lead content? WOMAN; The lead content was -.strong enough to kill. UTLEY; The SPAN people took paint samples from placea young children could reach. Than we tried a simple chemical test. Now this is come of the pain; from inside this house. WOMAN: Yes. UTLEY; And you give it the tist... WOMAN: Four a little bit of the solution on it, if it turns black... UTLEY: It turned dark. And a child that lived in this house has gotten lead poisoning from this lead content paint. WOMAN; Rightc MAN: That's correct. UTLEY; The slum children themselves were tested for lead in their blood. The results were shocking. DR. BARRY BLESS: Over a third of the children in the random sample in Rochester, which is a good, valid random sample. LIA-76159 -5- are in danger of being lead poisoned, because they do have .levels abgve fifty. There are people v;ho believe that it may be the cause"of some of the specific learning disabilities that vs're now seeing. There are people vho believe that it may be related to behavioral problems. There are many people who believe that the very high proportion of children vho are retarded, who we never have a reason or diagnosis to explain their retardation, may in fact be attributable to lead poisoning. UTLEY: Slum children can eat 1 sad paint and show no out ward signs of damage. Scientists disagree over how much lead it takes to hurt a child. Some feel it takes very little. NAOMI CHAMBERLAIN: The fact that we cannot prove that low levels of lead are dangerous does not mean that it isn't true. Wa can also not prove that it is not dangerous. And just as for years and years and years, nobody has really cared that children were being maimed, retarded and crippled, and dying, or maybe behavior problems, or reading problems - and it happens to people who can least afford to have it happen. Predominately the kind we're talking about happens to poor kids, who already have two thousand strikes against them. And so you say that because I cannot prove, then let us wait, and objectively let somebody eise's child become a sta tistic. That infuriates me. It's tlia worst kind of mass muti lation o UTLEY: No one knows how many children over the years have been poisoned by lead, have been crippled mentally for life. Because those children are mostly poor, black, and ignored. But now even white middle class kids are suffering from lead poisoning, and we know v;hat it can do. And even though we know what it can do, lead is still pre sent in dangerous amounts in too much of the paint we use in our homes, and in too much of the ceramic dishware wa eat from. We'll look at those two areas in a moment. 6 ** UTLEY: Paint which is applied to interiors where children can get at it is not supposed to contain more than one percent lead. But there is a good deal of paint on the market available today in this country, which has more than that one percent lead content. It's been discovered here at the New York City Health Department Laboratory. And the man in charge of the program is Dr. Vincent Guinea, the head of the Bureau of Lead Poison Control. LIA-76160 -6- Dr. Guinea, what put you on to this problem? DR. VINCENT GUINEE: The sanitarians from the Health Depart ment have been checking paints for interior use periodically*. And over the last several months we found that rather large numbers of paints labelled as for use in interior surface, and therefore presumably without much lead, were turning up. And in some of our surveys we found that from ten to twenty percent of cans labelled "for interior usa,'1 and sometimes even labelled "for use on children's toys, and playpens, and children's rooms'5 were found to have lead contents five, fen psrcent. The paint companies have fcsen working under a voluntary standard since 1955. They, of course, have supposedly been operating under our current health code, which was in 1959. But many of the paint companies have slipped up, especially in certain colors of oranges, yellows and greens. UTLEY: What is the consumer going to do now? GUINEEs A doctor friend of mins asked me this question about two weeks ago. Ee said, 11 Look, I've seen the press releases about the fact that paint can have lead in it, although the label doesn't say anything about it., I want to paint my child's room, I'd like to use bright colors. Which paint should I use?" And I had to say frankly I could not guarantee any parti cular brand or color of paint. The only thing I could say was that, if you take colors that are not red, or yellow, orange or green, you take the most recently made can of paint from the biggest company in the country, it's less likely that you'll have lead in it. But there's no guarantees on any can of paint right now. UTLEY: The paint industry say si it stopped using lead in paints for inside use thirty years ago. Here is the way a spokesman for the major paint makers put it, in testimony before a Congressional committee. "There is no longer any purpose in using white lead pigments in paints intended for interior use, since batter white leadfree pigments for this purpose now are available at lower cost." The industry told Congress that it voluntarily stopped making leaded paints for household use. Modern interior paint is not a major cause of lead poisoning in properly maintained homes, according to the industry. Writer Jack Newfield and Congressman Ryan, who have been crusading against leaded paints for years, have petitioned the LIA-76161 PDA - the Food and Drug Administration - to outlaw lead in household paints. To outlaw it, simply and totally. So far, though, the FDA's approach has been to require only warning labels on paint with more than a small trace of lead. But labels on cans aren't of any help years later, when the paint starts to flake on the walls. Wi5 used to think that lead poisoning was exclusively a ghetto problem, something that middle class people just didn't have to worry about. After all, how many of us have paint flaking on cur walls. But now we're discovering there are a lot of other ways to get lead poisoning. Pencils, the kind children chew on whan doing schoolwork, often were painted with leaded paint. Now the pencil makers ssy they've stopped niakir.g them that way. But a lot of these old pencils are still around. And just this week ths FDA told people across this country to get rid of two hundred thousand ceramic bowls given away in a soup company promotion. It turns cut the glaze on the bowls contains dangerous amounts of lead. This is Mrs. David Augustine and her son Philip, who live in a comfortable suburb near Rochester. They found out about lead poisoning ths hard way. MSS. DAVID AUGUSTINEs About two years ago Philip began to show symptoms of vomiting, he began falling down for no apparent reason, he could not stand to be at any height without saying ha was going to fall down, "Hold on to me." And over a period f time stopped eating everything. He had had brain tests scheduled, and the pediatrician told me that they were looking for the possibility of a brain tumor. And, of course, I rather lost control at that time. They took some more blood tests, and when the report came back it was stated that there was a large amount of lead in his blood. DR, JAMES SATREs We tasted his toys, we tested the paint, we looked what we thought ware conventional sources. It turned out that Philip had been drinking his orange juice every day from a ceramic lined vessel, made in a local ceramic class, which had, by actual test, a very significantly high lead release. And he had actually been drinking his lead with his orange juice, practically every day, for a period of about three months, MRS. AUGUSTINEs Xsra just thankful, thank God, that every thing worked out, because it could have been much worse, We're supposed to be intelligent people, and yet here was a casa of LIA-76162 8" - something that 2 had never been close to, I had never known anything about lead poisoning. So consequently I didn't have any idea what the symptoms were. UTLEY: A Canadian child who drank from this pitcher was not as lucky as Philip. Ke died from lead poisoning. Hand crafted ceramic ware often is dangerously high in lead. But even some mass produced pieces can be potentially dangerous. It is possible to test ceramics for lead. In Rochester the comity health department tests dishes for local citizens. And we bought some pieces in New York gift shops to be tested there. Most of them were Mexican imports, which often have a very high lead content. They should be safe to eat and drink out of, shouldn't they? DR0 MARGARET RATDEURN: Well, if the glaze isn't fired sufficiently high, at a sufficiently high temperature.- they may very well leak lead when acid is added. And that's what we're doing here. UTLEY: In other words, if it hasn't boon baked hot enough. RATKBURN: Right. UTLEY: Are most ef these problems with American produced ceramic were, or that which is imported? RATKBURN: Well, there's problems with both, actually. Wa have in our own testing here, most of the problem has been from the imported. But we do have a positive piece made right here in Rochester: we have another positive from California; and one from Maine. UTLEY: Mr. Gordon, what kind of a test are you running, what are you looking for? GORDON: This is essentially a presumptive test for lead. It is one which was devised and developed by the FDA. If lead is present in this solution, we get an immediate transformation of color to red. If it is negative, it retains somewhat of its green color and nature. UTLEY: Let's run the experiment now on one of these say this one, for example. GORDON: All right, we have already added acidic acid to this particular sample here. Now we take a few cc's of the LIA-76163 "9" acidic acid. Presumably it leaks the lead out. Next we add the dithyozone solution, which you notice iss green in color. Then we shake it, and immediately get a chearry red color, which indicates that lead is present in this piece of ware. UTLEY: Can you tell how much lead is present? Does that mean it5a at a danger level, if it turn:; red? GORDON: Yes, the dithyozone solution is so standardised that it gives the lower limits that are recommended by the PDA. UTLEY: Is it possibly to tell which type of ceramic ware is likely to have a high lead content? RATHBURN: No. UTLEY: There's no way a parson at home can judge tc RAT3BURN: Ho0 The only way you can judge it is to test its UTLEY: Ws just ran a test on this, Mr, Gordeon, and how did it turn out? GORDON: This is a negative test, cn this piece of pottery here ,, UTILEY: Now we're going to test on this mug. This is the kind of a mug, or a jug, from which you would drink orange juice, or soft drinks. RATHBORNs Coffee or tea. UTLEY: Cofee or tea. I have one in my own house. Let's see how it turns out. What does that mean? GORDON: Now this is a borderline case. UTLEY: It's neither red, nor... GORDON: It's neither red, nor is it green. But this is one which we consider a borderline. UTLEY: Is there any regulation in this country which over sees and controls the minimum standards of glazing for ceramic ware and pottery? regulating up to seven parts per million, bleaching out lead, LIA-76164  10" UTLSY: And,it has to pass t % Yeah. UTLSY: But w-e don't havs th WOMAN: We con't have it yet UTLSY: That5 s another sort GORDON: No, 2 would con side; UTLSY: This is the kind of ! storing vegetable v,t or fruit PATHBURNs Salads. UTLEY: Salads. Araln, this 2 ein a.nipoireea d o w l , zno Kina many tourists bring beck fror. Mexico. But :: imagine a similar typ-s of eerassi-s wars it' ales hand-eraftnsd in many parts o:c the United 8tatns. That has tarred rac. right a'/ay, A, GORDONS That5 n definitely positive UTLEY? It's definitely positive with a lead content* GORDONi With a high lead content, extremely high lead sontent. DTLSi! These pieces of dishiT&re, which ve picked up in a gift store in New York, the results are that this one is okay* These two are borderline. Wouldn't want to be too sure that what you're drinking r atisg of them wouldn't harm you. And these three are all positive, they all contain lead, and they can poison you if you drink or eat too much out of it which has been kept too long in it, if what it was was acidic. There are the kinds of things which we all have at home. 2 know I do, and perhaps many people watching this program do, too. So, doctor, what does it mean in practical terms for a person at home who uses this for storing food? Is it a danger? RATHBURN: Yes, don't! DTLSYs Don't. The problem with lead simply is that it's so useful for industry for so many productss as an additive to paint to make colors brighter, to glass to make potter;? ware shine. And to gasoline to raise the octane level cheaply. LIA-76165 Lead h sssr.ee a / " ccrlc: end'1 ..:.. ,n it eh: ctr.iCi i chid.d sate it, end in a.: It CC'.' J nod basn glU: t" r -! hat tor: JV; Jh. Br c. Cv.aJ\m V J', -. * o W ' Ln ,'-v cniina t: sc-.v :tli5.;- z> f :cer ','} ' .1 mine -id \h : tal;< th k-V J. w.-: i* uil iOi-.::; :l .':.:: run ..... . ^ '.:. ".to .` '.. jJ:. .bust ion Igia';:. cau / ,*r ^ - , ,V KttSt d.;:; : ml Lace t.Le air ' ;-u t x~ X '. .the o v e i: i'TLE'fs .rad a: i r.o frcn l-sadoi. gasoirrs burned by e-ar s and tr;u - m L: ' --. " <'' orLliarn Caiafcra.ia hii a so joany cars. it also las 11.0; j . O' < S' ;, at lead rrjcr':.z:n.- lie mount of aJi u-ili.' .,-'. r. la 2 ':c .1:.'.:;: 2. it liicreacinr' be a '-: . or a ::.% :'aa Li ;.ro '.a :aL"i" at a; : '-a 2. t^CvTiTc. I^-OhI'C C:lc:\'.' i :y - ,.ie ry ' * > - ~ ^ - rim in tli caimt cf 2.oad *' r: ^"a*5 ^ -: ** of(1.. and. .-. a ar I/.. X.'-: 1 Air pollution cu l_:;rities ia California 2u.."."i consantraced rrsntly on other lorrm el oonbend Tutors eh i lor. leu oan:t ies lend in lio air.- ana i ay; : . : :: K3NLC3DY: iml or _t; a the ai it- and hr a just as tkse a rear antra there is c ks&vy rorrcntralicEu r_n_i_L' .: _ iono_ thing xhish I'r bsun nnx'rrrs of until raXahively recently, And it s rat shear wist has to b dona, ILELLTE OFFICIAL; heat g f as. agent in the air i.53 abarrbad and retained in the tie ena s of the omul alien hare to a rnash larger sstsni than ejlrswaors* because fcf..a 1-svels or : lead are higher here. And tlisrs is a bfozhgaigicJLtiflestt nt era though it any &*st ml pc-ieule sick. Bat there s s assess;, & alteration. in body ehsrsistryf thick wt think ia undesirable. GTLSrs litre is to arch lead spewiag into tax California air that it ie orea affecting the Sacifi.c Ocean. Scientists at th Ssrlpps Coeasegraphic lastituto at La Jolla discovered that their creels analyse of the chcuistry of saa crater were changed by lead sattlisig into tbs ocesin That caused Dr, T, J chow f Scr&pps to start nrsasuring lead throughout the est'irc-naent. Es5s- still doing it, And his work is often eitsd by theas who wont to ban laadad easellas. Dr, Chow dissovsred tharsfis even load in rain wstar.'^SHncing it very close to th federal Ganger level for lead content in drinking water. LIA-76166 -12- He has been measuring the lead consent of the air around San Diego for five years. The level.3 are often dangerously above California state standards. ----------------- Dr. Chov says airborne lead Lr> the most dangerous of aii,, Half of the lead you breathe is absorbed by the lungs. The body has better defenses against lead contamination coming from food and drink. These filters show there is less lead in the air where there are not many automobiles. The worst areas are downtown districts and suburban areas near freeways. The dust from tb two places contains as much lead a:; the ore from a lead mine. DR. CLARE PATTERSON: 2 am convinced - 2 v/ouldn'fc be here if I weren't - that really millions of youngsters each year are being* their minds and their nc.-rvous systems are being irre trievably damaged* forever, for thoir whole lives, by the lead that they're breathing. UTLEY: Dr. Clare Patterson of Cal Tech traveled to the Arctic and Antarctic ice caps to p:.rove how much the worldwide levels of lead have gone up. A thousand years of snow have been preserved here. Dr. Patterson said the increase in lead since 1S40 has been enormous, and he thinks it's essential to ban leaded gasoline at once. PATTERSON: The most significant source of lead, of course, is from leaded gasoline. It contributes about ninety--.ine percent of the lead in the air. And I might say that the lead in cities like New York, or Los Angeles, or Washington, D.C., any city, large city, the lead in that air ia about^ten thousand time*-- above natural levels. NEWFIELD: Congressman Ryan and Senator Kennedy introduced j legislation? after hearings, after struggle, after lobbying i the legislation was finally passed. Thirty million dollars / to prevent and treat lead poisoning was finally authorized by I Congress. And then the Nixon Administration wouldn't spend ' the money, even though Congress authorized it. KENNEDY: One of the most overworked words, of course, of our time is changing priorities. But this is where they ought to be changed. Here you can actually have a direct impact in stopping retardation, for example, and also in saving children83 lives. And ultimately saving the taxpayers from paying for institutionalizing children and others that are affected by it. LX&-76167 -13- iJErvFIELD; Thera are certain problems in this culture which me, and most, don't know the answer to. I don't know what you do about herein; 1 don't know how you get garbage out of the slums; 1 don't know what the policy should be for the Middle East. Lead poisoning is one of the few problems in this culture which is man-made, and we know what causes it, we know what the remedy is, and we just won't do it. PATTERSON: We're so close to classical lead poisoning that X, and other people like me, believe that we're being affected right now by the load that we're already absorbing. We're more irritable, we're lane rational,, It's affecting our central r,s.svus ?>ysfces,, -------- ' 5^Uvo if t BE 2E2N&IC2 S(JkL,kii5kE05.R; W are attempting to reproduce in the laboratory tbs tissparSments that man has unwittingly psrformed on himself since the beginning of the Industrial Revolu tion, which vis whan he began to dig up metals from the earth and spread the &2cmd through his environment# What happens is that the rats have & high mortality rata when they're young. You get & shortened longevity# And the older animals look ~ -they just <iort of loll around without any energy# They have runts, dead litters, and dead offspring, and they don't bread, they fail to bras3. And the mothers eat the young. There are ail kinds of things that happen. I think that this is certainly a warning. And rf we don't pay attention to it, we're stupid. UTLEYS We have had many warnings about the danger of lead in the atmosphere. A main source of it is lead-based gasoline. What are wa going to do about it? And whet is the government going to do about it? A man who cun answer this question is William Euekleh&us, the head of the Environmental Protection Agency. Mr# Ruckleshaus, how long have you been conducting studies on this problem? WILLIAM RUCKLEHAU3: Well, we've been conducting studies not our agency, but the agencies that we inherited from the National Air Pollution Control Administration - for years on the impact of lead, not only in the atmosphere, but also frem lead-based paint, and lead that you generally injest in foods, for many years. We still have huge gaps in our knowledge, as to the precise health impact, at what level, of the ingestion of lead, and where the total body burden of lead comes from. LIA-16168 1-3- DTLEY: 3ut in terms of gasoline, you are at least satisfied hat these is enough of a health problem to go ahead with this urogram. RUCKLEHAUS: Yea, vs are. Our information shows that the health effects in the atmosphere, above certain layers, can be serious.) Thera is coneiaaracre dispute over just what the impact on health is of lead in the atmoosspphheerree.. But we be- uieve there Is suffieiant -e- ,vidence WoJ. f aS4 UddeCleUt^el^rJioUuOs JLimlLl^apLaU cU t on human health of lead above certain levels in the atmosphere, that it ought to be regulated. And the way we think it can be regulated best is through regulating its existence in gasoline, and thereby reducing it from the emissions from the automobile. UTLEY What is the statu.: ; of the program new? It starts your agenoy, wh&re you draw guidelines, or concr 'bn proposals? RUCa LSHAUSs We will issue regulations which will regulate tine additives that are put in fuel., under Section 211 of the Clean A' r Acto Ke have two authorities to regulate additives in gasp] Lne, not only .Lead, but any other kind of additive. One is, if that additive creates a health hazard, we can regulate it. And in this case we think it does. Or if the additive, the regulation of the additive is necessary in order for the automotive companies to meat the 1975 standards. And both of these apply under Section `ill, and it*s under this authority that we will issue"regulations, generally regulating it is the fuel itself. CTLSYs Does this mean that yea are in favor of limiting le&d-bssed gasoline, or of banning it, as of a certain date? RUCKLEHAUSs Wall, our regulations have not as yet been issued. But the approach that wa're taking is to have at least one class, or one brand of gasoline generally available by 1975, and gradually phase out the uss of lead as an additive in gaso line. The pace at which it's phased out depends very greatly on how we view the impact, not only on health, but on the petro leum industry, and how beet this phasing process can work, so as to cause the least amount of economic dislocation to the countryo UTLEY? You say it means that by 1975 there will be a guaranteed lead free gasoline on the market available to everyone. l IA-76169 t 15 By what date would you like to set-, all lead-based gasoline removed from the market? RUCKLSHAOS: Wall; this iss one of the things we're still considering, at what pace v;e will phase lead out of gasoline completely. And there are arguments, and valid arguments that can be made for one phasing process; or another. And, really, before the regula tion finally comes out- it's too early for me to say exactly what form it will take. It will bs probably very shortly after 1975 that the lead as as additive is phscad cut completely of gasoline. OTL3Y: Many problem in. the environment field are finally acted oa by govcrnmsrst after a gre&t deal of public opinion has bean mobilised and articulated. Is that the case here? Or in the ease of l<sad is gasoline, is it acre due to scientific research? RUCXLESO-USS: If the public says that w2 want clean air, and ws want pure water, the go?rzsat vill respond to that legitimate public demand by providing clean air and clean water. But as to how they go about it, and what specific substances are taken out of the air go us to gleans;, or oat of the water e as to oaks it pur, it should bs left up to scientific deter mination, --------------------------- Because there's no reason to raspor.d tc public pressure to ressove a certain substans from the sir cs the water, if there is no public bonfit t ba gained thereby. And our decision t remove lead, or to phase it out of use as a gasoline additive is baaed on what we conceive to ba in the public interest, the protection of the public health, ana the insurance that thee standards can be asst by 1375. UTLSTj Do you ss any ergaaissd strong, or meaningful opposition to the removal of lead isom gasoline, either in industry, or from other sectors? Or is everybody for clean gasoline? RUCXLEHAUS: Ho, everybody's for clean gasoline, just as everybody's for clean water and clean air. But there are different degrees of fervor as to how strongly they believe that we ought to have clean air or clean water. DTLE^* Mr. Rucklehave plans ts abolish leaded gasoline shortly after 1975. Actually there is unleaded gasoline avail able today, but not many people are buying it. The petroleum industry began adding lead to gasoline in the 1920*s0 It was a cheap and easy way to increase octane levels, and lead has been added to most gasolines ever since. LIA-76170 * *i>'' lasS. 'wjri-i and that fcha ^aud in gs.zo2.ine cwentuslly <vao rleared i.wio the air. But there didn't ::aiv3 to ba that v:x\ny autc?.wh:LiS'S, ;. after all, there wss s.r; ni lot oil air. Ttsiight wa huv-a r-i.&.-i and h^avd a lot about leade what it e&n -5c ' 5 all sf ua, find what It c .2 ready is tragic-ally doing to asaas os children, Lsod is * natf field of dispute involving the fes^irentisat &ad pifoiis health-. arhere are -sana'-rts? on both iidas vi t-'iS ?;;; (. atjvs ntiscist i'O thy tS:i;V3.t ,v OtllS.ca a-s.i30SiS" tncr it >t TjT^Wi ^3T i&vd: vSX d-siy lit 'Vir stave sst c-ii stiitsh ScnewlsSge abatit VvvoLd !bs0 ihsta &>.'<& ss?i:ay area sphere research ttilssovy. ifcst i&p&rfcanfc is the study of lead /eve vis site high V si: svihUshv sva's fe*. ? ' si sh?/y vv .p-e-i ii so c-t*s.vd cvsAiy igsi-srsc Xv. doesn't h*va i-.ot Ah isr-tt gvobiLf&n eur 'ftsdern industrial .5 0 ht: -ih last* it id/ irjsu hvs is chir-s= Jiiiis tha ewidancs '.srtr and peasant dssigaro