Document gbJa1aR571zO3dR91Zr54KxxQ

FILE NAME Quebec Asbestos Mining Association QAMA DATE 1950 Nov 7 DOC QAMA084 DOCUMENT DESCRIPTION Minutes of Discussion Held at Saranac Lake with Attendee List CONFIDENT AL MINUTES OF DISCUSSION HELD AT SARANAC LAKE ON HOVERGER 7 1950 FILE COPY ~ Notice , ot L " Those present were ot A. J. Lanza D. - Ivan Sabourin - 1. J. Vorwald D. J. P. Woodard The Saranac Laboratory's Proposal of SeptemberSeptember 21 1950 to the Quebec Mining Association stated the problem a51 Asbestos The specific problam ascertaina a = we ome mm ee to oe ~~ . is to way, f ship exists between the whether or not a relation- \ pulmonary cancer inhalation of asbestos dust and primary * Qe pulmonary oem - . sw ote - ee report proposed This a program for trying to get an answer to this The program consisted of two phases problem 1. Epidemiological investigation 2. Eoxfpearniimmeanltsal investigations i.e.i.e. dusting and checking The report to the Quebec Asbestos Mining Association on Pulmonary dated September 25 1950 which was accepted in principle Pulmonary Cancer by the Q. A. at their recent meeting generally followed but in M. A. , Proposal A committes of the Q. A. M. A. brief Saranac Laboratory's Sabourin presented this report at this rececomposedncotmpmoeseedtionfg Mears Foater and Following and a discussion with Mr. A. R. Fisher it was left that Mosers Woodard Sabourin and Doctors Vorvald and Lenza would review the Saranas to clear up any questions that might be and Proposal at as to what is recomended from here open arrive arrive at a conclusion it would teke and how much it wouldocnositncluding who would do what how long That was the purpose of this meeting HN HN I. Range Progres - Epidemiological Survey The range program was to consist of a epidemic- _ logical survey to determine the incidence carefully conducted to asbestos dust incidence of cancer mong people exposed as compared with the incidence among those not exposed 1. Discussions 1. Dr. Varwald's comments were as follows &. We should learn the incidenceincidence of cancer mong those exposed to asbestos dust and among those not exposed by PRODUCED JM " 1871 1 A careful study of the rays of people employed in the asbestos industry 2 ( A study of the rays made of the general population by the mobile units of the Provincial Health those not Department of exposed study of mortem data on the at death insofar as such presence information of cancer It was pointed out that in the Provinmceayitbeisavtahielable .. practice not to list omncar as a when it is so that information cause of death even of much help to us on this may not be 2. Dr. Lansa ocumented a. The one important point is that i.e. one who can take the we get an expert spidemiologist job over do it correctly and adequately and come up with the correct answer Dr. Lanza agrees it is important that a to handle the job In case Canadian to chosen can do uced the job adequately who a Canadian carnot be found someone from the U. S. can then de 3. Mr. Sabourin suggested~- Accordingly a, That prior consultation with and a appropriate Canadian authorities request for their suggestions on cortain phases of the program would get their tacit backing and that this materially strengthen the base of the would Mr. Sabourin agreed to review the program also to matter with Dr. Vidal and touch arrange so that Dr. Vorwald will be able to be in Dr. easily with the Dean of the Vorvald will do so as may be McGill Medical School decided between the ar of them By this two would know of the arrangement Dr. Vidal and the McGill Dean be sought in choosipnrgograanmabalned their halp and suggestions would first part of the epidemiologist to carry out the program vho might be considered Having decided on the individuals for the job it would then be to up Saranac to make final arrangements b In addition to the Miss Ross has spidmiologist been a statistician is needed worked suggested as an assistant This can be out by Dr. Varwald and Mr. Saboruin in line situation and the wishes of the Q. A. M. A. with the 4. It was the understanding also that and it was the consensus that ray consultants would be needed preliminary screening of Doctors Smith and Cartier could do rays which would leave Saranac only PRODUCED JM JMDOC- JMDOC-JMDOC- JMDOC- 1872 1872 the job of studying those which would be sent to Seranno It was pointed out that the two company doctors should not be se used in any fashion that might lead anyone to question the objectivity of the study and this Seranac can determine B. Conclusions 1. Doctors Smith and Cartier will screen rays then Saranao will make the final study on the rays that have been screened out for them 2. An epidemiologist will be chosen as outlined above Saranac will make the approach with a view toward making final arrange ments with the man who has been tentatively chosen 3. The epidemiological report as first made will go to Saranas suggest Dr. Lanza will evaluate the report in this form and best use of the report revisions that might be made and other such matters There should be discussion between Saranas the under- writing organizations and others interested us to the timeliness and propristy of the use of the material developed by this report It is important that the report be available only to the under- writing companies and not made generally available until it has been reviewed with and by the companies 4 Saranac Laboratory is responsible for the program 8 Saranac is to make the final arrangement with the epidemiologist and others to make the study and is also responsible to head up and supervise the study b The program should be started as soon as it is possible to do 80 0 It was estimated that the job could be done in six months if a qualified epidemiologist can be obtained vho can devote a reasonable length of time to the study It is desirable that the job be done in six months and therefore the person hired for the job should be impressed with the fact that the study should be pushed and conclusions reached promptly d While the original program stated a possible cost of 4,000 it was stated in the discussion that the cost might run between 4,000 and 6,000 it being thought however that 5,000 would be adequate II Range Progra - A research program of perhaps two years duration in two parts | 1 The transplanting of asbestos and embryonic tissue into animals originally suggested to be under the guidance of Dr. Lanza and his group . : | PRJOMDUC8E3 D | MOOC 1873 om, 2 Utilizing the facilities at the Trudeau Laboratory as in the past and subjecting animals to high asbestos dust conditions A Discussion 1. Er Lania said that he is not prepared to carry out & formal project as mentioned in 1 above that Dr. William Smith along with Dr. Sutherland associated with him is doing some of this with finely ground asbestos as well as with some other materials 2. Dr. Varvald gave the following information about part 2 of the program which of course is given in more detail in the Saranno Laboratory's Proposal of September 21 19501 & Set up a program consisting of 300 animals to be subjected to asbestos and 300 control animals b The program is likely to last for two years 0 It would probably take two months to get enough of the right kind of animals and get under way d Quoting Dr. Verwald We hope to show or prove that cancer incidence is not increased among those animals even if dusted It was mentioned that such results are on the basis of animal experimentation the results are strictly speaking true only of animals and it should be realized that the same resulta might or might not hold true in the cese of humANS 3. It was agreed that while the range program is going on Saranac vould provide each four months a progress report on the work There was some question as to how complete a progress report should be and it was agreed that a progress report might well be of no more than two typewritten pages to show in concise formi a, The work that has been scmpleted up to that time b Now the work is progressing at the moment 8, What the future work looks like , L.e. as to when completion may be expected and whether or not the program is ahead of schedule ar behind schedule and by how much d What general conclusions there are if any at the moment ' without giving detailed data on the work 4. The present idea is that the year program can be undertaken at an estimated cost as shown in Sarenac's Proposal of September 21 1950 of 16,000 for the first you and 10,000 for the second Juar ee eee ( oe B. Conclusionst 1. Sufficiently clear data has been shown under A Discussion above to show the way in which the program would progress and the consensus was that the program should be undertakon as promptly as possible in line with the points brought out in the discussion III Other Phaces of the Range Program A. Discussion EY 1. In the Proposal to the Q. A. M. A. four suggestions were made | S. That the various companios making up the Association ses that there is more publicity than in the past about the knowledge of this problem and about some of the many favorable aspects that do exist but which are unknown to most people The purpose of this is to combat the adverse and often wmarranted preudo facts that are put out by others Dr. Smith and Dr. Cartier should be kept advised by in the Q. A. M. A. and the asbestos industry of any ments that may become known to them others develop- . b That our doctors occasionally make talks or lectures at medical schools in the general area C. That we see that our doctors get adequate affiliation with research centers such as Sarmac and other organizations 10 that they will get all available information on this and other such subjects d That the companies in the asbestos industry consider the formation of en Institute for Industrial Chest Diseases with other mining associations In doing this it was mentioned that the help of Dr. Gregoire of Rosemount Sanatorium Dr. Burke of the Laurentian and others be sought B. Conclusions ar CU 1. It was agreed that the first three a b and a above should be done it being understood of course that judgment must be used in the degree of participation of our doctors under b and c the group However it was the consensus of that the asbestos industry would do well to avoid identifying itself at this time with other mining associations d above so far as chest diseases are concarned It was pointed out that the problems of the asbestos industry are minor as compared with those of many other mining industries and that such affiliation might tend to identify the asbestos industry with the problems of other mining industries It was felt that this should be held in abeyance A. R. Fisher L. C. Hart Oo | PRODUCED JM - 83 November 14 1950 UMDOC 1875