Document Znwm8OmKJ7aO9a2RE2wLpmj7

M V , r s f if tfr IM THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF WEST VIRGINIA CHARLESTON, WEST VIRGINIA JAMES M. ADKINS, Administrator of the Estate of Ralph E. Adkins, Deceased, et al, Plaintiffs, vs. MONSANTO COMPANY, a Delaware Corporation, i Defendant. ) ) ) ) ) ) ) No. 81-3098 ) ) ) ) ) Deposition of ROBERT C. ISHAX taken on behalf of THE PLAINTIFFS. Reporter: H. Joy Springer J ames M ay R eporting S ervice C ER TIFIED SH O R TH AN D REPORTERS H .R .2 - BOX 65 EDWARDSVILLE. ILLINOIS 62025 '' usui. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 'VJ.VV? F.IT - 22 23 Vi 24 vF 25 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF WEST VIRGINIA CHARLESTON, .WEST VIRGINIA JAMES M. ADKINS, Administrator of the Estate of Ralph E. Adkins, Deceased, et al, Plaintiffs, MONSANTO COMFANY, a Delaware Corporation, Defendant. ) ) ) ) ) ) ) No. 81-2098 ) ) ) ) ) APPEARANCES: Paul L. Pratt, Esq., Messrs. Bowles, McDavid, Graff & Love, by P. Michael Pleska, Esq., For the Plaintiffs; For the Defendant. IT IS STIPULATED AND AGREED by and between counsel for the plaintiffs and counsel for the defendant that the deposition of R03ERT C. ISHAM may be taken pursuant to Rule 26(a) of the Federal Rules of Civil Pro cedure, on behalf of the plaintiffs, on June. 30, 1983, at V 'S .' the Radisson Hotel, Room 215, 9th Street and Convention Plaza, St. Louis, Missouri, before M. JOY SPRINGER, a Notary Public within and for the County of Madison, State of JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 i Illinois; that the issuance of notice and dedimus is t 2 waived, and that this deposition may he taken with:.the same *3 . 'iir>.:- '.Av.`;*>VN......' * \ ' >!; 6 force and effect as if all Federal rules cmd.'statutory : I* *. requirements had been complied with. - IT IS FURTHER STIPULATED AND AGREED'that any and all objections to all or any part of this deposition 7 except objections as to. form of the questions asked or 8 answers given, are hereby reserved and may be raised on the 9 trial of this cause; and that the signature of the deponent 10 is not waived. 11 12 * 13 14 * 15 ROBERT C. ISKAV * 16 produced, sworn and examined on behalf of the plaintiffs, 17 deposes and says as follows: 18 19 20 BY MR. PRATT: EXAMINATION - a^ASV--* 'iisr , A f< -- 23 (Whereupon the reporter marked Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #160 (?fonsanto,s I fD. yV>r #8322866 and 8 3 2 2 8 6 7 ), cons Isting;.-of"two | ' vI1s 24 25 pages; Plaintiff!s Deposition'Exhibit #l6l (Monsanto's I.D. # 2 3 6 18 2 through 236186, *i J A M E S M AY R E P O R T IN G S E R V IC E *t 1 2 '3 -M0f. ,, .i 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .21. ?' 23 N i 24 ' >' 25 inclusive), consisting of five pages; Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #162 (Monsanto's I.D. #8322358); Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #163 (Monsanto's I.D. #8326208 through 8326211, inclusive), consisting of four pages; Plain- tiff's Deposition Exhibit #16*1 (Monsanto's I.D. #83262*10 and 83262*11), consisting of two pages; Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #165 (Monsanto's I.D. #8322873 and 832287^0 , con- sisting of two pages; Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #166 (Monsanto's I.D. #832 306*1), con- sisting of one page; Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #167 (Monsanto's I.D. *8331253 through 8331259, Inclusive, and 8331262 through 8331271, inclusive), consisting of seventeen pages; Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #168 (Monsanto's I.D. #8331262), consisting of one pages; and Plaintiff's Deposition Exhibit #169 (Monsanto's I.D. #231857 through 231860, inclusive), consisting of four pages.) Q Tell us your name, will you, please? A. Robert C. Isham, 253 Heather Creat Drive, Chesterfield, Missouri, 63017. - :LV And how old a man are you, sir? A. I'm forty-four. , JAM ES MAY REPO RTING SERVICE . 3 Q Okay. You would have graduated from high In what year? A. 1957. * *m*mm*"J>* Q Okay. Following that did you go to college? A. I did. To the Pennsylvania State University received a degree in business psychology. Q Okay. You would have graduated what year, then? .A. 1961. Q All right. Following that what did you do? A.- I was commissioned in the U. S. Coast Guard and served in the Coast Guard for three years, at which tir.e I separated and Joined Monsanto in 1965. Q 1965? A. Yes. ft Okay. What did you do in the Coast Guard, what was your Job, MOS? A. I was a line officer and assigned to a boo camp , a receiving center which I was involved in personnel and classification work. Okay. Where would that have been? .A. In Cane May, New Jersey, .y - $ was the year? When you came to work in Monsanto -- what -vV**t * A. 1965. JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 4 What was your first Job? 2 A I was a copyrlghter. 3 Q Okay. In what department? A In the Corporate Advertising department. > 5 Q What did that involve? 6 A It involved writing catalogue copy for a V 7 products catalogue. 8 a Okay. How long were you in that position? 9 A Approximately seven months,. 10 Q. And what new position did you get then? 11 A My next Job was an advertising supervisor 12 In the Organic Chemicals Division. 13 Q And how long were you in that Job? 14 A Approximately two years. 15 Q That would get us up to what? About 1968? 16 A Approximately. 17 Q What I'm trying to get at, Mr. Isham, is 18 Just a chronology of your Jobs and what you did. What was 19 your next Job? 20 a ' Advertising Research Manager in the a,;*-:^-2*1-*v ^r^r 9t \ * S *i"\*\ *\*v 23 Corporate Advertising Department. - - ***. ir * Q What were your duties there?. *''<*i"'Vr-' A I was to measure and evaluate'ipublic opinion 24 and the effectiveness of advertising campaigns. 25 Cl Okay. How long were you in that position? JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE t A i 2 -V 3 | 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 **-*.*' ' -^i. 24 25 A. Approximately two years. a That would get us up to about 1970? A. Yes. G And what became your position then? A I became Manager of Chemicals Advertising and Sales Promotion in the Corporate Advertising Department. G Okay. And what were your duties and responsibilities there? A I was responsible for all chemicals adver tised and sales promotion and merchandising. G How long were you in that job? A ' Approximately two years. G That would get us up to about -- A -- 1972. G What position did you have during that time? A 1972 I was appointed Director of Advertising for Monsanto Industrial Chemicals Company. As such I was responsible for all advertising programs of this operating unit of Monsanto. G Okay. And how long were you in MIC? A I received additional responsibilities in 1977 when I picked up the public relations function, and my *`7^ '- title was amended to Director, Advertising/and Public Relations, Monsanto Industrial Chemicals Company.' G Okay. And what was your Job there at that JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE -------- 1 point, *77? 2 . A. I was responsible for all advertising nd 3 public relations program of this operating unit at Monsanto, * *V.V?i : `.V. '" % : Q Okay, Now, how long were ypu in that Job, *. 5 sir? 6 A. Until January 1st, 1983, at which time I was \ 7 appointed Advertising and Marketing Information Director in 8 the Corporate Advertising Department. 9 Q. What are your responsibilities now? 10 A. I am responsible for coordinating inter 11 national advertising and supervising a marketing information 12 center that provides information on our products to customers 13 as well as individual's consolidated sales statistics to our 14 executive management. 15 Q Now, during the '60's, say, from *65 to '70, 16 did you do any of the type work you do, which v;as adver 17 tising and supervision of Organic Chemicals Division, any 18 work involving the manufacture of 2,*1,5 ? at Nitro? 19 A. No. 20 0, During the period 1970 to 1972 when you were 2 1 Manager of Chemical Advertising, I believe, did you do any ?v- 2 work Involving any of the chemicals being made at Nitro? V . 0 : , ^ - , 23 A. "Yes. '"*J^ VI"^ ` 24 Q Which ones? , 1\* *. 25 A Rubber chemicals. JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE V- 4. - V . - . . .... 5 6 7 8 9 10 n 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 .21 \~ > .^2 2- A . . #\S 23 24 25 Q And do you know what chemicals would be involved? Would Niran be one? A. Niran? - Q. Yes. A. That is a product that we never advertised during that period of time, 1970 to 1972. vQ What products did you advertise that were made at Nitro? A. The products we advertised were promoted under a family umbrella rather than individual products, so we talked about Monsanto1s capabilities In the area of rubber chemicals, particularly accelerators, anti-degradants, regardless of where the products were produced. Q Actually, your marketthat you1re involved in is to other chemical companies, is it not, or other com panies? A. The primary market forrubberchemicals would be tire manufacturers and the industrial rubber products market, those non-tire production for rubber. Q Your advertisement at that time was not aimed at the general public? A. That's correct. From 1972 to *77 did any of .the advertising ;* V* . work you did -- I think you were Director of Advertising for Monsanto Industrial Chemicals Company, right, at that JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 point? 2 A. That's correct. 3 0, Did you do any advertising In regard tc 4 of the chemicals manufactured at Hitro? 5 A. Yes, the rubber chemicals. 6 Again, the rubber chemicals,okay. In 1977 7 tO\ '&3 where you would have been Director of Advertising 8 and Public Delations, MIC Company, now, you did have sera 9 advert isin r- involvement involvinr TM and dio.ir. at t". TO U -Ll-.t: ^ a ,* J W TT A We have a rubber Chemicals Division in the 12 Industrial Chemical Company, and that is the rrout- of T3 products that I was responsible for, 14 ?. However, you did, beginning in '7?, you 15 were given copies of pubi ic relations data 16 b T andi li c c- i ** cioxin and sc forth, isn't that 17 VrU, U a i V advertise 2,I`,5 T `Vi';- * 18 herb ielee. That's not a rubber chemical. I underst19 ca.n<*w . " Ti,*'1 * ^ w '-C Y v u .* -- J. i. 20 I 'm saying. You were river, copies of information that had 21 to do with 2,^,5 T and dioxin that was manufactured from 22 JJ9 to 1969, isn't that correct? 23 /- I don't remember specifically what youTre 24 talking about, I was certainly aware of the word '`dioxin. 25 I was not aware of 2,^,5 T in 1979. JAMES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 Q Okay. Well, let me ask you -- I mean,you 2 never heard of 2,4,5 T trichlorophenoxyacetic acid in '49, 3 . :*fat.., H; -"^r-.-vs at least, '48, at least, to *69? \\\S'*-?-'j* A. I'n now aware of it, but in .those days that was not a product in my group that I was responsible''for. 6 (1 All right. When did you learn that you were 7 manufacturing 2,4,5 T, or the Company was, during that 8 period of time? 9 A. I don!t remember. 10 Q, When did you learn that the 2,4,5 T that was n being manufactured contained elements of dioxin? 12 A. I don't remember the exact time. 13 Q Can you give us a ballpark figure? 14 A. Again, that was an area of the Company that 15 I did not work in, so I don't remember a date when I became 16 aware of it. 17 Q Why would you receive documents involving 18 Monsanto Health Study Task Force? 19 A. Under our organization each of the.directors 20 of public relations is responsible for certain plants. My responsibility included the Hitro, West Virginia, plant. . i?*fttnm'y ` 23 There was a-task force that was appointed that copies me in on their activities; although, I was not a..member of that 24 task force. ' 25 Q Did you ever participate in any of their JAM ES MAY REPO RTING SERVICE 1 1 meetings? 2 A. ::o. 3 C. Would you have read the carbon copies of 4 those documents that were sent to you? 5 A. Yes, I would have read those documents. 6 C Would you have in any wav corresponded with 7 other members of this group or. what you read? 8 A. I car.'t think cf a specific exar.r.le . tut I'm. 9 sure we -did discus: it. 10 C Okay- Vhat v,*as the ourrose, if you know . c f 11 the Y.onsente Health St uby lack Forer ? 12 A. Since I wasn't on the c o m ittee, 1 dcr.'t 13 know. 1 car. only speculate on what I 've heard. 14 r You never part ideated in any of the 15 meetings, then, I yuers? 16 A. That's correct, that I'm aware of. 17 o Let ms hand you some documents , Plaintiff's 18 Exhibit *360 through 1ft (Vcr.sar.to's I.F. *:?22f 5, 23'lf?, 19 8322356, 83262o S, 8326211c, 3-22873, 8 3 2 3 0 ft, 6331253, 20 5331262, 231857, respectively), and as!: you tc take a lock 21 at them. "22 Plaintiffs Exhibits lf-0 through 1 6 9 , with two 23 exceptions, and'I'll point those out in a minute, show you 24 as receiving a copy of them, right? 25 A. That's correct. * JAM ES MAY REPO RTING SERVICE \ '1 S> 'f 1 2 3 ;v? ::A v-Yy V- * -5 *>'. 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 23 24 25 Q All right. And 162 being an exception, you, apparently, were at a meeting or are shown to have been sent a copy of a meeting, right? vy A I 'm not aware that this shows X was at a meeting. (* 162 Is dated inarch 21st, 1979? xA Yes. Q Do you know whether you were at that meeting? A From my Interpretation of this memo, I don't see anything about a meeting. Q. What would be the difference between being listed as "to" and, you know, on a document and being cc'd, carbon copied? A In my opinion, either one indicates you're supposed to read the nemo. Cl If it's designated "to," it doesn't mean you were there? A I think there's no clear-cut difference between -- I have r.y own personal difference, but I don't think there is any generally accepted difference between actually being sent to or carbon copied. Q Then, 168 does not show you as either being designated "to" or cc'd, does It? A Yes. Document 168 shows me as cc, upper JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 12  1 right. 2 Cl I'm sorry. 167. 3 A. Your question was, Mr. Pratt? 4 Q On 167 are you shown as being a person who 5 was designated to receive a document -- yes, on page eight 6 you were receiving a copy of that document. 7 A. That's correct. 8 Q Okay. Let me ask you this, how many people 9 -- and I'm talking about executives, not secretaries and 10 things like that -- does Monsanto have in its various public 11 relations departments? Do you have any idea? 12 A. In 1979 or today? 13 Q Well, '79, '80, soforth. 14 A. I would guess, fifty throughout the world, 15 plus or minus ten percent. I'm not sure of the actual 1 number. 17 Q And when they issue a press release, are 18 there certain categories that a release will be made -- by 19 that I mean, certain segments of the public, or do they have 20 any division on that? In other words, if they Issued a press release on a study, for example, who all would get */22 that? '23 A. When we issue an actual news release, we try 24 to give it as broad as possible dissemination throughout the 25 Corporation and throughout the media. That's the purpose of JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 1 a news release. 2 Q Right. So would AP, Associated Press, get 3 a copy? i '4 A That depends on what we anticipate their 5 level of interest is. In other words, we don't try ^to bore 6 certain national media with stories we don't think are 7 interesting. If an executive is promoted, for example, 8 that may be appropriate to the home-town press but not the 9 New York Tines or the Wall Street Journal. 10 Q I understand. What about when you're n talking about studies Involving dioxin where you had press 12 releases or news releases, what -is the dissemination or the 13 area that you're trying to inform? 14 A It would depend on what the specific subject 15 Is. If we are dealing with the work or health at NItro, I 16 did not make the distribution of those news releases. 17 Q, Okay. Well, would that type of release, 18 would that receive nationwide release to various members of 19 the press? 20 A Since I did not Issue those news releases, 21 I don't know what the target audience is. I could speak to ~ 22 other examples, but not to this one, 23 Q Give me some examples. , 24 A Well, in the event of a new product in the 25 Industrial Chemicals Company, we would probably direct the JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE # 1 2 3 t- :-> 4 .,,V '.5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 - .r;*21 . ; " 22 23 24 25 news release at the trade magazines and the plant cities where, perhaps, that new product was going to be made if it would add to employment. We would not direct that at the national press. If we had -- I've given you the example of an executive being moved. Certain media are only interested if it*s a vice-president level or above. Other people care if itfs any promotion. Usually an emergency type of news release is going to get broad dissemination because the wire services are going to be on th scene covering an emergency event. Q You have any other examples you can think of? A. Product publicity, emergencies and executive promotions would be the bulk of the work in public relations function. Q So, generally, anything of interest -- for example, in Exhibit 160, if you111 look at that, this deals -- this is a document dated February the 9th written by J. R. Condray to Mr. G. Young, and you received a copy of it, right? A. That's correct. Mr. Young worked for me at the time. Q . Okay. And this particular document deals with a hearing of the Air Pollution Control Commission of West Virginia, right? A. Yes. ' 'i J A M E S M A Y R E P O R T IN G S E R V IC E 15 09 1 Q Now, what type of dissemination of a press 2 release would be involved there? Would that be Just locally 3 in West Virginia, generally? / A. My reading of this document 160 does not 5 show any press release. It shows preparing a presentation 6 for the West Virginia Air Pollution Control Commission by 7 Mr. Condray, who worked in the environmental area, to docu 8 ment what steps the plant had taken to deal with their com 9 plaint, which was an odor complaint. 10 G Wouldn't necessarily be a press release, 11 right? 12 A. That's correct. 13 Q In Plaintiff's Exhibit l6l, page one Is a 14 memo from Dan R. Bishop to W. C. Campbell, dated February 15 16th, *79, which you received a copy of, right? 16 A. That's correct. 17 And It deals with twoversions of possible 18 press release for each of you to review, isn't that right, 19 sir? 20 A. .That's correct. 21 Q, And both of those possiblepressreleases ` 22 contain the following sentences, do they not: "Thirty-seven 23 employees were subsequently referred to Dr. Raymond Suskind, 24 a consulting dermatologist and currently Director of the 25 Kettering Laboratory at the University of Cincinnati." It '\ J A M E S M A Y R E P O R T I N G S E R V I C E fw 1 goes on to state, ''Other than dermatitis, no known long-term 2 health effects have been detected from the series of physical 3 examinations offered as part of Monsanto's ongoing health V. 4 ' ' 5 monitoring program." That's what both those tentative releases contained, that language. 6 A. I see that language, yes. 7 Q Do you know in fact whether this press 8 release was issued? 9 A. Mo, I do not. 10 Q Has it been, as far as you know, as part of 11 the corporate public relations, has that been their position 12 all through this business of dioxin? 13 A. Would you repeat the question? 14 Q Yeah. While you have been in public rela- 15 tions, has that been, the sentence that we Just read on page 16 two of Plaintiff's Exhibit 161 and on page four and five, 17 has that been the Company's position all the way through 18 that on those thirty-seven fellows who were subsequently 19 referred to Suskind, that there have been no long-term health 1 20 effects, adverse, long-term health effects? -,*21 . 22 *' V * 23 A. Since I was not on the task force, I do not know what the Company's position was on that. I'm aware there were two studies, one done by a Dr. Suskind at the 1 24 University of Cincinnati, to look at worker health since the 25 accident in 19*19. The task force, though, was working with '< J A M E S M AY R E P O R T IN G S E R V IC E 1' 1 2 3 ` "4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 v 21 \r22 23 24 25 the plant and Dr. Suskind, I guess, as well as Dr. Selikoff. Have I answered your question? v .*1 Q Well, let me put It a little clearer. Is It your position you don't know what other than reading this so-called press release, these two versions of it, you have no actual knowledge of what the Company's position was or Is ) is that right? A. These both state "draft" on It. I think you ought to ask Mr. Bishop If he issued that news release, and he would be the best person to ask about what the Company policy Is. I was not on the task force. Q You were not on It, you Just received a copy of it, right? A. That's correct. Q> On all these documents, 160 through 169, let me Just ask you some general questions. You do not recall going to any meetings, is that correct, concerning these documents? A. When somebody prepares a document, there's usually not one person you can go to in the Company to get answers, so you get opinions from various parts of the Company, you put together either a position statement or you try to anticipate typical questions you would receive from the press, and that's in the format of question-andanswer sheets and then you try to get the best possible JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 16 1 opinions of people. And as a courtesy when somebody prepares 2 a news release that deals with one of my plants, they would 3 expect me to review and give an affirmative to go ahead with .4 either question and answer or a news release or a position 5 statement dealing with my plant. So X would be involved in 6 discussions by telephone or stopping in people's offices to \ 7 review some of the documents in here. 8 Q You recall ever talking to anybody about 9 these documents, 160 through 169? 10 A. Yes, I do. I would have worked with Dan 11 Bishop who was in the corporate department who prepared the 12 questions and answers and draft new releases and I would 13 have discussed those with him. 14 Q, Would you have discussed, then, Plaintiff's 15 Exhibit 161? 16 A. To the best of my recollection, I probably 17 would have discussed those two drafts. 18 Q, Then would you have had any input into the 19 two sentences that we previously referred to? 20 A. I do not recall making any input into those 21 two sentences. 22 Q I guess primarily because you don't have 23 any knowledge, firsthand knowledge, that you can give him 24 on that? 25 A. That's correct. JA M E 5 MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 Q That would have to come probably from, what, 2 the Department of Medical and Environmental Health? 3 A. I would think that and the plant manager 4 and his staff. - 5 Ql I see. Like, Dr. Roush Is shown as copied 6 on Plaintiff's Exhibit 161. He's in the Medical Department 7 of your company, right? 8 A. He is. 9 Cl And you have no idea what type of dissemina 10 tion or what the dissemination would be of Plaintiff's 11 Exhibit 161, right? 12 A. I do not. 13 Q 14 right? Bishop would be the guy to ask on that, 15 A. Yes. l Q Look at Document 1611, sir. This is a 17 document, apparently, authored by James E. McKee, dated 18 May 1st, 1979. It's to Messrs. Nolan and Throdahl, and 19 you received a copy of that, isn't that correct? 20 A. That's correct. 21 Q, And on paragraph three of page one, would 22 you read that to the Jury, sir? 23 A. Paragraph three, "establish & task force to 24 be supervised by Messrs. Bishop and McCarviHe,which would 25 include the following people: Pierre Wilkins; Royce Scott, JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 20 1 Nitro Plant Manager; H. Max Galloway, Nitro Environmental 2 Manager; and a physician nominated by pr. Roush. Assign 3 Susan Xelly of the Corporate Public Relations group to work 4 with Mr. Wilkins. The entire task force would work in 5 close liaison with Messrs. Holzapfel, Stohr and Ishan." 6 C* And other than receiving documents and 7 talking to people, what type of liaison work did you do 8 with them? 9 A. Well, while the task force was formed and 10 working on these issues, I was responsible for all public n relations dealing with the Nitro Plant. 12 Q, And would that include the dioxin question 13 involved in the 2,^,5 T manufacturing units from '43 14 through T69? 15 A. It would not. That would have been dele 16 gated by me from my normal responsibilities to the task 17 force. 18 Q Okay. In other words, you did not get 19 involved in the formation of position papers to refute what 20 they thought Selikoff was going to say or anything like that J /I right? 22 A. That's correct, except as a review procedure 23 because it was my plant. %. 24 Cl Do you know why Suskind's study, which the 25 examinations were done in June of *79, has not come out as JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 21 1 2 3 v'v :. 4 * t5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 79 20 "T22 23 24 25 of yet? A. It's my recollection that Dr. Suskind reviewed his findings with us but has not published them because he has a large number of papers and he travels throughout the world. He is a very busy man. I thought that his final study had been brought out and was subject \ to peer review. Is that not so? Q I don't know. You have any information? A. I thought that it was published somewhere and had been subject to peer review, but I Tn not sure. Q Are you talking about the morbidity study or are you talking about the mortality study? A. Dr. Suskind was hired to study this group on both mortality and morbidity basis because he had done some Initial studies after an industrial accident in !iJ9 at the Nitro Plant, so he had knowledge of what went on then Okay, Would you be referring to the Suskind and Zack Mortality Study which appears In the Journal of Occupational Medicine In January of 1980? A. I 'm not familiar with the publishing of this study. Q Then Exhibit 167 which you're cc'd on on ,.4 page eight, which has a document on that page which Is a memo, apparently) from Dan Bishop -- A. Excuse me, Mr. Pratt. Apparently, JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 2; yj? i Document 167 consists of two separate memos, one dated 2 July 13th, 1979. 3 ft And you*re not shown on that? A. I*n not shown on that. There Is a second ;'t 5 6 7 part to It. ft \ A. Page eight you're shown on. With a date almost a month later. 8 ft And you received a copy of that? 9 A. I did. 10 ft And this was a preparedness study, re n Selikoff, Mount Sinai, right? 12 A. Yes. 13 ft And on page nine is a document to counter u Selikoff*s review, is it not, or report? 15 A. A preparedness statement would be to anti- 16 cipate the likely questions of press and so to put together 17 Monsanto's position from various places around the corpora- 18 tion. As I indicated before, there is no one person who 19 has in-depth knowledge of a situation and you have to talk 20 to different people that have to amalgamate those thoughts 'i*\M**;!*'2-i . 23 into one statement. So this is a preparedness statement .based on what we would anticipate would be questions of the L press. . ... 24 ft Well, on page nine of 167, again, we find 25 the statement, "First in regard to dioxin effects, a recent 4 JAM ES MAY REPO RTING SERVICE 23 1 analysis of mortality rates of 121 employees exposed to 2 dioxin and accidental release of that material in 19^9 3 indicates there is no statistical variance-between the 4 mortality rates of the plant workers and the American public 5 as a whole." I guess they are referring to the mortality 6 study of Suskind and Zack, isn't that correct? \ 7 A. The best of my recollection, that's based 8 upon the findings of Dr. Suskind. 9 * Q As to the authenticity of that study, you 10 have no actual knowledge yourself, right, sir? 11 A. It's an accurate study that was done by an 12 independent physician. I believe it. 13 Q Well, you didn't look at the raw data, that's 14 what I 'm getting at. 15 A. That's correct, 16 MR. PRATT: Okay. That's all. 17 18 19 20 21 Robert C. Isham 22 23 24 25 JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 1 2 3 '. 4 V"**' j *.. s / \ V 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 ' a 21 . ;\: i*'_--j2-2 23 24 25 STATE OF ILLINOIS COUNTY OF MADISON ) ) ss ) r.;- \ I, M. JOY SPRINGER, a Notary Public, duly commission and qualified In and for the County of Madison, State of Illinois, do hereby certify that pursuant to notice came before me on the 30th day of June, 1983, at the Radisson Hotel, Room. 215, 9th Street and Convention Plaza, St. Louis, Missouri, ROBERT C. ISHAM, who was by ne duly sworn to testify to the truth and nothing but the truth of - his knowledge touching and concerning the matters In contro- v e r s y in this case; that he was thereupon carefully examined upon oath, and his examination reduced to writing under my supervision; that the deposition is a true record of the testimony given by the witness; and signature of the wit- ness was not waived by agreement of counsel. I FURTHER CERTIFY that I am neither attorney n o r counsel for nor related to n o r employed ..by any of the parties to the action in which this deposition is taken; and further, that I am not a relative or employee of any attorney and counsel employed by the parties hereto, or financially interested in the action. 4l JAM ES MAY REPO RTING SERVICE 25 1 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set r.y 2 hand and affixed my notarial seal on this _______ day of 3 _________________ , i s 83. .4 5 6 7 8 Notary Public within and for the County of Madison, 9 in the State of Illinois. 10 11 12 13 14 15 15 17 18 19 20 23 24 25 JAM ES MAY REPORTING SERVICE 2