Document QJk9B5OKBDDn1LRBwew50aG34

FILE NAME Manville JMA DATE 1967-1968 DOC JMA017 DOCUMENT DESCRIPTION Asbestos Cement Pipe Hazards - Letters Newspaper Articles & Memos 9117B TO The Board of Directors Report of Activity on HEALTH ASPECTS OF ASBESTOS June 1 1966 to January 1 1968 January 15 1968 January 15 1968 Report of Activity -- -- HEALTH ASPECTS OF ASBESTOS I. GENERAL BACKGROUND Attached for reference is the only prior report to the Board on this subject dated June 10 1966. Appendix A It traces the origin of the asbestos problem and activities undertaken by Manville between March and June 1966 This status report summarizes what has transpired since June 1966 and discusses current projects II DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONTROL In March 1967 Manville established a new Department of Environmental Control Its director Ed Fenner a mechanical engineer by training reports to A. C. Smith Senior Vice 4 President for Research Development and Engineering He directs a coordinated approach to the overall M environmental control situation dealing with both employee and general public covering all divisions plants and mines Every 60 days this group gives C. B. Burnett and the President's Staff a detailed briefing on environmental control activities backed up by a carefully documented written report ey esenece -2- As indicated by the attached extract from the November 1 1967 Report Appendix B priority attention is being given to locations where asbestos dust levels are higher than we consider acceptable Because Manville was one of the first industrial firms to take a total environment approach and set up a special department we have had favorable publicity in several trade publications including OCCUPATIONAL HAZARDS A reprint of the latter article is attached Appendix C One project to which the Environmental Control Department is giving high priority is the development of Codes of Practice for the guidance of contractors and customers who handle and work with containing products in the field Several of these booklets are presently being prepared by the EC working with the Public Relations Department III MEDICAL ADVISOR t In November C. B. Burnett announced the appointment of Dr. George W. Wright as consultant to the President on medical matters Dr. Wright Head of the Department of Medical Research at Saint Luke's Hospital Cleveland Ohio is a recognized authority on asbestos and human health A copy of his Curriculum Vitae is attached Appendix D IV ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH COMMITTEE To make certain that M takes a coordinated high priority approach to the asbestos problem C.B. Burnett early in 1967 designated Environmental Health Committee" under the chairmanship of F. J. Solon Jr. Vice President Advertising and Public Relations This Committee which meets monthly to review progress problems and plans is composed of the following personnel C. B. Burnett President H. M. Ball Senior Vice President General Counsel E. M. Fenner Director Environmental Control H. M. Jackson Manager and Development Industrial Relations K. V. Lindell Senior Vice President Asbestos Fiber Division A. B. Marchant Senior Vice President Industrial Relations W. P. Raines Director of Public Relations Ivan Sabourin Legal Counsel to the Quebec Asbestos Mining Association C. L. Sheckler Control Manager Occupational Environmental A. C. Smith Senior Vice President Research Development & Engineering F. J. Solon Jr. Public Relations Vice President Advertising and Dr. George W. Wright Medical Consultant to the President mor ee vee vase roe -4- V. PUBLIC RELATIONS ACTIVITIES Following are highlights of the public relations activities in connection with the asbestos problem that have been undertaken by the M Public Relations Department with the assistance of Hill & Knowlton our Public Relations Counsel during the past 18 months A. PUBLIC RELATIONS MATERIALS Attached is a precisely worded statement titled Asbestos and Human Health Appendix E which summarizes presently known scientific facts concerning the relationship between asbestos and human health It was developed by the Public Relations Industrial Relations Research and Environmental Control Departments and was reviewed and cleared by all members of the aforementioned Environmental Health Committee Quotes from this statement will be used as needed by the President Chairman of Canadian Manville Vice President for Finance Vice President and General Counsel Controller the Environmental Control Department and the Public Relations Department in handling inquiries from stockholders financial analysts public officials the press and other outside groups more eoveneasneer -5- In addition copies of Asbestos and Human Health have been distributed to senior officers Division General Managers Division Staff Managers District Sales Managers Plant and Mine Managers and Industrial Relations Managers at all M locations B. BACKGROUND PAPERS We contemplate that this basic statement will answer most questions on the asbestos problem However for those dealing with scientific writers the general press financial analysts etc. we decided it advisable to have greater detail available on a number of specific aspects of the asbestos question Therefore preparation is underway on seven background papers that will be in effect appendices to the basic position paper Subjects include asbestos pipe asbestosis mesothelioma lung cancer asbestos bodies types of asbestos asbestos and the general public + C. ACTION PROGRAM The development and use of the basic statement and the background papers are part of an overall public relations action program that has been developed and approved by the Environmental Health Committee A copy of this action program is attached Appendix F D. HANDLING PRESS RELATIONS IN THE MANVILLE NEW JERSEY AREA In August 1967 THE JOURNAL OF THE AMERICAN MEDICAL ASSOCIATION published an article by four doctors at Somerset Hospital Somerville New Jersey who said they had diagnosed 17 cases of mesothelioma a very rare form of ancer among patients living in the vicinity of the Manville Plant at Manville New Jersey They associated this frequency of mesothelioma with asbestos On Sunday September 10 1967 the NEWARK LEDGER ran a Page One article Appendix G reporting on this finding Subsequently every newspaper covering the general area of New Jersey where the Manville Plant is located ran articles on the subject Although the basic statement had not been finalized at that time the public relations Department worked with Legal Industrial Relations and Environmental Control in developing interim statements that were used to help answer the accusations In every case the company was successful in working with editors in the development of follow articles that while they did not absolve asbestos did present the matter in an objective and realistic light and removed it from the epidemic scare atmosphere that had been generated by the initial reports Attached -7- is a typical follow article from the SOMERSET MESSENGER GAZETTE Appendix H E. ASBESTOS PIPE ALLEGATIONS Late in November 1967 allegations about the possible hazard of drinking water supplied through asbestos pipe were introduced into a politically fight in the metropolitan government of Nashville Tennessee Briefly -- for many years only cast iron pipe supplied by one vendor has been used in the Nashville water system The Purchasing Committee of the City Council introduced the idea of asbestos pipe as a possible alternate to cast iron Through means not entirely clear at present Dr. James Snell a medical professor at Vanderbilt University was inspired to write the head of the Nashville Metropolitan Water Department expressing concern about the safety of asbestos pipe in view of the publicity that asbestos had received as an alleged causing agent Dr. Snell's letter is attached Appendix I Publication of Dr. Snell's letter in the NASHVILLE BANNER Appendix J and announced plans by the Purchasing Committee of the City Council to visit M's Manville Plant more eece ces . - re -8- generated considerable publicity and attention in Nashville Working with the Pipe Division arrangements were made to host the city councilmen and Dr. George W. Wright talked with the group at length on asbestos He put the problem into perspective by emphasizing that asbestos appears to be at most an occupational hazard that is definitely related He stated that there is no evidence to support Dr. Snell's allegation that the use of asbestos water pipe might cause cancer Dr. Wright's comments were given prominence by the NASHVILLE TENNESSEEAN the city's largest circulation newspaper in its December 12 1967 issue clipping attached Appendix K Following their return the Nashville councilmen made further favorable comment about asbestos pipe to the newspapers . Appendix L Shortly after his talk with the Nashville group Dr. Wright put his verbal comments into written form in a letter addressed to F. J. Solon Jr. Appendix M A further outgrowth of the Nashville situation has been the stated intent based upon letters from Nashville officials by the U. S. Department of Health Education more .ceeee -6- and Welfare to investigate the alleged health hazards of asbestos pipe Photocopies of the damaging November 30th NASHVILLE BANNER article questioning asbestos pipe began turning up in various other parts of the country in the hands of officials charged with specification or purchase of water pipe We had sufficient evidence to indicate these clippings were being placed by people connected with the cast iron pipe industry So with legal counsel present and all proceedings tape recorded a meeting was held at M's invitation on January 3 1968 among the four principal manufacturers of asbestos pipe with the Director of the American Water Works Association also present These future courses of action were determined 1. The need to visit informally with personnel of the . Department of Health Education and Welfare to determine the future course of the proposed investigation of asbestos pipe and the feasibility of broadening such an investigation to include all types of pipe carrying potable water 2. The Director of Public Relations and Hill and Knowlton to proceed with a background paper on asbestos pipe -10- 3. The General Counsel of Manville as authorized by the other asbestos manufacturers to discuss with the Counsel for the Cast Iron Pipe Research Institute the poor advisability of using health hazard allegations as a device to promote the sale of any type of water pipe F. GOVERNMENTAL INTEREST In addition to the stated involvement of the Department of Health Education and Welfare with asbestos pipe several other indications of interest in asbestos and health at the government comments - level are worthy of note President Johnson's Me: to a group of labor editors and Surgeon General Stewart's remarks at a Senate hearing are contained in our June 10 1966 report to the Board In addition New Jersey Congressman Patten of Perth Amboy in September 1967 introduced a bill designed to set standards in \ ^ sbestosmanufacturing and transportation Attached is a copy of the newsletter Appendix N to his constituents in which Representative Patten explains his proposed legislation This Patten Bill received very little national publicity and the best information now that it is most unlikely that any action will be taken upon this proposed legislation Yy more eoennvnaseeaeee To date none of these actions has led to serious governmental interference with the asbestos industry but such interference as well as congressional investigation remain quite distinct possibilities G. INDUSTRIAL HYGIENE FOUNDATION ADDRESS In October 1967 F. J. Solon Jr. Vice President Advertising and Public Relations delivered a paper on the subject Communicating the Effectiveness of Industry's Hazard and Pollution Controls - Whose Job to the annual meeting of the Industrial Hygiene Foundation in Pittsburgh He stressed both the importance of positive communication by industry of the facts regarding its occupational and environmental control problems and the responsibility of medical and scientific people to challenge those of their colleagues who make sensational charges merely for the sake of publicity without backup proof The paper is Being printed and distributed by IHF H. Monitoring Evaluating and Circulating Medical Articles Newspaper and Magazine Clippings An important public relations activity is the continuous monitoring of medical journals both domestic and foreign as well as newspapers magazines and radio and television programs for scientific papers and articles relating to asbestos and health more eeenvove -12- Since these medical papers and publicity mentions are too voluminous to enable mention of each in a report of this length only the most significant ones are summarized as follows I. Medical Journal and Meeting Reports . Dr. Irving J. Selikoff Head of Medical Research at Mount Sinai Hospital New York and Dr. E.C. Hammond Chief Statistician of the American Cancer Society reported in June 1967 that the combined effects of exposure to asbestos dust along with cigarette smoking results in a greatly increased risk of lung cancer However they reported no lung cancer found among smoking asbestos workers in this particular study . Drs Selikoff and Hammond in another study reported October 1967 that 50 percent of the autopsied lungs of New York City residents exhibited called asbestos bodies although the finding was not related to any specific disease nor to the cause of death . Drs Demy and Adler of Somerset Hospital Somerville New Jersey reported July 1967 47 cases of lung cancer and mesothelioma cancer of the walls of the chest and abdominal cavity among residents of the -13- area This was attributed to asbestos exposure through previous employment at Manville Four other physicians from the same hospital Dr. Borow and associates, reported August 1967 that 17 cases of mesothelioma had been discovered within a three period among residents of the Manville area Two of these patients had not had occupational asbestos exposure They speculated on the relationship to asbestos in the area Researchers at the Industrial Hygiene Foundation Pittsburgh Dr. Gross and associates reported September 1967 producing lung cancer in rats exposed to asbestos dust These workers noted that the asbestos dust used was highly contaminated with trace metals which may have induced the cancers Dr. Gross and associates in another study reported November 1967 that growths similar to asbestos bodies can be produced by other substances leading to the suggestion that such bodies of unkown origin should be called ferruginous bodies iron bodies until their actual composition is known Researchers of the U. S. Public Health Service Cralley and associates analyzed samples of chrysotile used in the asbestos textile industry and reported October 1967 finding significant contamination with trace metals nickel chromium and manganese which should be considered in studies of cancer in asbestos people II Asbestos and Health Stories in the Lay Press The WASHINGTON POST ANGELES TIMES SYNDICATE distributed a story by science writer Harry Nelson based on the Demy and Adler cancer paper which was printed in many newspapers August 1967 Appendix 0 The same syndicate distributed a story in December 1967 by Thomas O'Toole of the WASHINGTON POST based on a review of several mesothelioma + * medical papers Appendix P A press conference held at the annual meeting of the American Medical Association resulted in extensive news coverage of the Selikoff and Hammond paper on asbestos and smoking June 1967 Appendix Q -15- . An erroneous scare story appeared in CHEMICAL WEEK This was prominently corrected in a later issue September and October 1966 Appendices R and S - A news release sent out by the American Medical Association resulted in many newspaper stories about asbestos bodies found in autopsied lungs June 1966 Appendix T . A news release issued by the U. S. Public Health Service resulted in stories about a Seminar on asbestos and health December 1966 Appendix U VI.COORDINATION VI.COORDINATION WITH BRITISH ASBESTOS INDUSTRY Close liaison is maintained with the British asbestos industry in connection with asbestos and human health Medical articles and publicity stories appearing in the United States and Great Britain are exchanged on a regular basis Upon several occasions representatives of the British Medical and Public Relations groups have visited New York and discussed strategies applicable to the two countries VII MEDICAL CONFERENCE AT ANTIQUA In November forty interested medical experts from all . on more -ee- _ -16- over the world attended a conference at Antiqua BWI designed to discuss the current thinking on the relation- ship of asbestos and health This was the second meeting of the group which was organized in 1965 by the Quebec Asbestos Mining Association under the leadership of M Senior Vice President Karl Lindell There was a good and free exchange of points of view and information at this second conference Karl Lindell reports that the biggest single benefit was the direct personal confrontation between various individuals pursuing diverse paths and theses in seeking answers to the medical and biological effects of asbestos There was good dialogue among these men which confirms the validity of the original idea of organizing the group and of holding periodic conferences VIII RESEARCH ACTIVITIES stated in the basic position paper research into the health effects of asbestos is being sponsored by Manville and in some instances other asbestos manufacturers at a number of locations The current status of the most important of these studies is summarized in the attached excerpt Appendix V from Environmental Control Report # more .... -17- And memorandum Appendix W from the Environmental Control Department outlines supplemental studies that have been initiated as a result of the mentioned accusation concerning asbestos pipe # # # # us ; 009063 009063 : ! January 9 1968 TO CC C. B. Burnett H. M. Ball E. M. Fenner H. M. Jackson K. V. Lindell A. B. Marchant C. L. Sheckler F. J. Solon A. C. Smith Dr. George W. Wright Ivan Sabourin Carl Thompson Hill & Knowlton G. H. Martens Jr. ; Yfb ChaterChater Chater Contamination Contamination ContaminationContamination Contamination Contamination Contamination Contamination Contamination Ran RE RESEARCH STUDIES ON ASBESTOS PIPE As promised at the December 19 meeting Ed Fenner has prepared a summation of the status of the various water contamination studies being planned or conducted at the Research Center I believe that we agreed that this should be distributed to the Committee so attached is a copy wpr eb att W. P. Raines CONFIDENTIAL WATERLY WATERLY wo! FILE WATERLY WATERLY o FILE FILE - Standr^'s Southern Region Headquarters Atlanta . ee April 4 1968 M. Harris - DHQ v ~~ . . SHAPIRO LETTER TO EDITOR 3/19/68 THE NASHVILLE TENNESSEAN RE ASBESTOS PIPE PUTE of A copy subject cerned the . letter is enclosed for the information of all con- . a a ' Dr. Snell and Dr. Shapiro appear to be using their knowledge of asbesto- sis to project the possibility of asbestos being a cancer producing agent in the digestive tract with sufficient danger to create a public health hazard even from the consumption of water transported through asbestoscement pipe _ . Even though we believe that their concern at best based on a very a relationship without direct scientific supporting data and as steumcuhousis an improper basis on which to the use of asbestos- challenge cement pipe I believe that a formal statement of M's position on the use of Transite pipe in potable water systems is needed now to allay the growth of suspicion that its use may be a health hazard - Such a position statement would be most useful is it includes background - information such as the present scientific knowledge of the affect of asbestos in the digestive tract the probability of significant quanti- ties of asbestos entering the digestive tract from human consumption of water from asbestos pipe in potable water systems plus the expe- asbestos rience of cities using . pipe as it may relate to the in- cidence of cancer or lack of it in their populations While the information presented by M to date has been helpful I be- J lieve that a more direct statement is to needed ariswer concerns such as those voiced by Dr. Shell and Dr. Shapiro on the use of Transite pipe in potable water systems = . lej E. H. Bailey Clark A. Bailey CAB ~ OR ara AY =" ~ Enclosure cc D. L. Hirmon - DHQ H. M. Ball - GHO F. J. Solon = CHC G. R. R. Wahl - GEG J. F. Baker - GEG +Geemmmen(Q M. V. Watson - RHQ File . ae . rn aaven ; ~ . x te Bboy vee AMA > cone ce pee ie Say tears eae er mn wom cre te me +27 0 fe ene od JM JM Manville 191 7 I 14 974 6455 Internal Correspondence To Dr. Kotin Date June 11 1974 ' Walt Cooper Copies Subject A PIPE PROTEST IN SAN DIEGO We are not sure why but for some reason the network TV stations citizens in San Diego decided protesting installation of A pipe even though they all went to a lot of trouble to get it Our hope of course is that our efforts to get city and state officials to talk to the media had the desired effect On the other hand they could be waiting for something else to occur Since there were no reports as far as I was able to determine before going to bed last night I have no further word on what statements about asbestos in water and cancer the media might be attributing to Dr. Michael Shimkin of the California at San Diego All I have at this KCST reporter told me that Shimkin told him University of point is what the there is a definite link between asbestos in water and cancer Since there wasn't much more I could do on this today I decided to attend the Environmental Committee meeting I am scheduled for this morning I hoped you would understand my reason for canceling canceling our planned meeting on this matter this morning since it no longer is as urgent as it might have been Of course I am trying to monitor the situation and I have more information including what Dr. Shimkin said to the media I will let you know as soon as might have Our Environmental Committee meeting should be over by lunch time One of our secretary's will be typing up a chronology of events as they occurred on this situation yesterday I will make sure you have a copy of this file memo as soon as it is ready Wit ERby university university LTH : , 2 ' . \ . , . el ~ 07044 December 22 1967 Mr. Leland J. McCabe Chief Disease Studies Water Supply & Sea Resources Program Department of Health Education & Welfare 222 East Central Parkway Cincinatti Ohio 45202 Dear Mr. McCabe I have received a copy of your letter of December 7 to me by Mr. H. M. Jackson 1967 forwarded Our Research Center has begun a comprehensive investigation into the wear characteristics of asbestos pipe when used in drinking water service We are attempting to include an examination of the Memphis Tennessee situation We will gladly furnish you with pertinent details developed from these studies Preliminary results from our research efforts should be available in about two months We will contact you as soon as significant data have been obtained Very truly yours E. M. Fenner Director Environmental Control EMF ems CC H. M. Jackson - DHQ bcc C. B. Burnett - GHQ A. C. Smith D. L. Hinmon - DHQ F. J. Solon - GHQ W. P. Raines - GHQ M. Harris - DHQ F. L. Pundsack G. W. Wright M.D. St. Luke Hospital 11311 Shaker Boulevard Cleveland Ohio 44104 arostchel AL AL10260102160206027446 1b02602746pore aTracyoayt A pipt TEST LOC RESULTS ryret First va 6.5 ~ 75 pal - RESULTS ** Fiber Content of | Content Fiber Content _ 125 ppm ppm - Hardness Srcond Series 7.5 Content Content of Fiber gallons gallons of Asb grams in Asb Fiber Fiber Content Micrograme /ges filrar grams 0.0224 im Ash is Aad Rup 106,110 Bu. 020 aid 10.0 1 97.500 0.0415 c.0% 8.0 3.2 2 93.440 0.0510 0.026 .1 1.9 5 69,190 69,190 0.0472 9,099 3 1-3 3.0 Slac Ali vater been * ement pipe sieros sieros asbestos all sttributable through the technique usb sttributable chrysetile and technique med used determine determine content valer loop tes i determine fiber is giiesburebie 68 pipe cae pipe 100P vaat. JPL 2 26 692 26 69seu coatent ef veter 1a i ve 2 26 fi6v9es 1 SPL (2-28- 4 Hy a - eee mee spicy hg DB DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH EDUCATION AND WELFARE PUBLIC HEALTH SERVICE Studies NATIONAL CENTER FOR URBAN AND INDUSTRIAL INDUSTRIAL HEALTH HEALTH 222 EAST CENTRAL PARKWAY PARKWAY CINCINNATI OHIO 41202 Wat Wat . out Wat Wat REFER TO December 7 1967 Manville Company 22 East 40th Street New York New York 10016 Gentlemen We have had an inquiry from a local the carcinogenic effect of asbestos drinking water health officer about from A pipe in We will decide about the effects of ingested asbestos but would like to know if you have any data about the amount of asbestos that might occur in drinking water How much is introduced during pipe repairs and tapping Does solution of the calcium out of the cement into the water release asbestos fiber Do you know anything about a report -that near Memphis Tennessee there was a pe- riod in one locality where the pH in the water was 10 or } 11 and this resulted in a solution in the cement compon- ent of the pipes to such an extent that milky- that we have been asked about the water became I will appreciate your comments on this problem Sincerely yours Leland J. McCabe Chief Disease Studies Water Supply and Sea Resources Program vat ae t aes prt es ee oo ay. oe . . ET OT ae. & .Sie Pa wo NS . age . aa TO . Ray BA a Ma, EI at TR cell OSS - ' re ow aes Peete TO : ee tO ee s . wa ety og . ; . es 4 . tote To BO ** a mye acid : : PRODUCED nd wan . - 83 - ; we eo . ne eye \s > : 6 DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH EDUCATION AND WELFARE NATIONAL CENTER FOR URBAN URBAN AND INDUSTRIAL HEALTH 722 EAST CENTRAL PARKWAY PARKWAY CINCINNATI OHIO 45202 PUBLIC HEALTH SERVICE ContWat Cont Wat Wat Studies Studies REFER TO December 7 1967 RESTRICTED INFORMATIONINFORMATION Manville Company 22 East 40th Street New York New York 10016 Gentlemen We have had an inquiry from a local the carcinogenic effect of asbestos drinking water health officer about from C pipe in We will decide about the effects of ingested asbestos but would like to know if you have any data about the amount of asbestos that might occur in drinking water . How much is introduced during pipe repairs and tapping Does solution of the calcium out of the cement into the water release asbestos fiber Do you know anything about a report -that near riod in one locality 11 and this resulted Memphis Tennessee there was a pewhere the pH in the water was 10 or in a solution in the cement compon- ent of the pipes to such an extent that milky- that we have been asked about the water became I will appreciate your comments on this problem . 1 . Sincerely yours labe file file = labe labe Leland J. McCabe Chief Disease Studies Water Supply and Sea Resources Program PMSBR eras, ere 16 teers esis . RESTRICTED INFORMATIONINFORMATION PRODUCED oe ees JM 00 1 ge ay sege er + eo its. a . PeOIee rt Ow tlie Sytet} oe le rCo 1 Cane e n OR FECRIN RIO 4 SpE, eno co cag oe rte ot ca ental} tit es Woe ceRed, Si'da~ r er end eeos - eat7 . or oyeVe ee te e eers Si ty Attachment to H. M. Jackson's to Leland J. McCabe Dept. of letter of 12/14/67 H. E. & W. Cincinnati Ohio Note to C. B. Burnett G. W. Wright M.D. E. M. Fenner A. C. Smith D. L. Hinmon F. J. Solon W. P. Raines M. Harris 12/14/67 RESTRICTED INFORMATION By phone contact was aware of the on December 13 Dr. Cralley advised me Nashville situation fact had been make comments for Dr. Murray Brown's use and signature that he asked to He indicated the essence of the comments were that the asbestos health hazard potential via the routes of inhalation and ingestion were two totally different situations Substantial dosages over long periods of time were necessary to produce ill effects by inhalation In his opinion it was inconceivable that sufficient fibre intake could be accomplished through the ingestion route alone and of humans attack the particularly so when related to the water intake capacity He also expressed an opinion that a pH which would cement would also attack and modify the fibre Dr. Cralley does not know whether the comments were forwarded Although Dr. Cralley does not know L. J. McCabe personally he will contact him and advise him of the current asbestos industry study and our relationship with the Department 4 H. M. Jackson P. S. N Copy of L. J. McCabe's letter of December 7 1967 is attached . ~ . RESTRICTED INFORMATION S _ - PRODUCED - JM - 83 aan File Environmental Control Department Research & Engineering Center May 16 1968 i, P. Zaines - QHQ Keeting with United States Public Health Service Water Contamination Studiar On Wednesday May 15 and Thursday May 16 1968 Dr. Graham Welten and Water Supply & tea tesources Program National Center for Urban & Industrial Health Department of Health Education & Welfare Cincinnati Ohio visited the Research Center to discuss the results of our of potable water from asbestos pipe Meeting with ware: studies on contamination them fron tonville F. L. Pundsact J. F. Laineveber 1. N. Jackson B. X. Fenner We completely reviewed with then phases 1 and 2 of our study 1 Study of Municipal Water System 9 cities 2 Bound Manville Comparisons After introductory remarks by K. M. Fenner J. P. Laineweber described in detail the techniques va used Data sheets giving complate results from these studies vere ressed out and DUCT Gur discusse discussions in detail wrepeatedly stressed two facts {lh}:ee wil sien of fibers - found sader 0.5 4/ in diameter (2) fiber levagrane fonat ^ g in say municipal per gallon syston was approximately Our visitors reaction was very favorable They stated they were impressed with the thoroughness and apparent AGEurosy of our study PRODUCED JM- 83 W. P. Bates - EQ -2- May 16 1968 Neither Dr. Walton or Mr. Cosse bes medical or toxicological training The data and impressions they obtained will be reviewed with undical people and toxicologists at Cincinnati Final determinations will be based on our results and results from a study presently being conducted by their Enviromental Activities Group Findings will not be published or presented as a paper They will be available to Manville and to any government official such as a Public Health Officer Findings may not be quoted by us in our advertising advertising However we are at liberty to refer inquiries to the Department of Wealth Education and welfare for answers My impression is that Dr. Walton and Mr. Conn's report of our activities will be highly favorable to us EMF os et; A. C. Smith 5. M. FanMeT a eS Le al tr Nahe PRODUCED JM - 83 FileFileFile Environmental Control Department Research & Engineering Center May 16 1968 F. L. Pundsack Water Contamination Studies The results of our studies to date were discussed at Health Task Force Meeting on Tuesday Night May 14 the Environmental After the discussion C. B. Burnett requested that we take these date and determine the effect of the fiber erosion upon the strength and life of the pipe We should use the data from Wichita as a basis for this determination Could you araange to have this information calculated EMF ems CC File C E. M. Fenner PRODUCED JM - 83  - 8 Wr aa0ndaodd Research & Engineering Center- October 14 1968 E. M. Fenner Water and Beer Tests A. C. Smith's Note to You of 9/26/68 I understand that Jim Leineweber has discussed this with you you and he will get together after the second municipality is and you can come up with a schedule for sampling and testing I assume selected I am returning herewith Mr. Smith's speed note SS / CONFIDENTIAL CONFIDENTIAL CONFIDENTIAL / CONFIDENTIAL COCONNFIFDENITIADL ENTIAL / en D. L. Himmon CC H. Ball - 11th Floor J. Solon - 12th Floor H. Jackson - 2nd Floor F. L. Pundsack - Finderne M. Harris - DHQ S. J. McDuff - P. E. Dix DHQ Return Return to Eng Division Headquarters February 13 1969 FILE studstiudiees stsudies Dr. S. Spail - Research E. Fenner " Research woo J. H. Swensen - Finderne B. H. 0. A. File Pronska - DHQ Wirsig - 270 Madison Chrono Dr. Herbert E. Stokinger's Presentation ASCE Meeting New Orleans 2/6/69 Attached you will find a resume of the paper by Dr. Stokinger presenteadt the ASCR Meeting in New Orleans Alan Wirsig attended this convention and was present Friday ation to hear the paper referenced above Alan contacted me by telephone on February 7th and related what occurred during Dr. Stokingar's present- I then contacted Bill Raines and Matt Swetonic in our Public Relations Department and we attempted to record Alan Wirsig's recollection of the present- ation by Dr. Stokinger Unfortunately we were unsuccessful in this recording and I then contacted Alan Wirsig and asked him to write up his recollection of what took place The attached comments by Alan were written Friday afternoon on the return flight to New York from New Orleans and represents his recollections ay while the facts were relatively fresh in his mind I have not attempted to edit or inject my own by Alan Wirsig and would remind everyone that without excessive detail due to his sense of opinions into the comments made Alan's comments were written urgency J. F. Baker PRODUCED JM - 83 AGENDA Meeting With United States Public Health Service Dr. Graham Mr. McCabe or Mr. Coene Studies of Water Contamination in Asbestos Pipe May 15 1968 - May 16 1968 Wednesday May 15 USPHS representatives arrive Newark Airport at 12:16 P.M. - met by H. M. Jackson Arrive Research Center " 1:15 P.M. Proceed to meeting in Executive Conference Room I. Opening Remarks - E. M. Fenner A. Introduction of Manville and USPHS personnel B. Brief description of our studies 1. Study in three phases a. Studies before and after comparison b Bound Brook Manville comparison c New Research test stand 2. Today's discussion will be on phases a and b II Description of Analysis Techniques - F. L. Pundsack and J. P. Leineweber A. Comments on phases a and b concerning 1. Sample taking 2 Chemical analysis procedure 3. Light and electron microscopic examination III Report on Study Phases a and b - E. M. Fenner and J. P. Leineweber A. Issue summary data sheets prepared by J. P. Leineweber 1 Discuss results as necessary PRODUCED JM - 83 AGENDA - Mtg - USPHS May 15 and May 16 1968 IV Tour of Laboratory Facilities A. Chemistry Laboratory 3 Microscopy Laboratory C. Others - as indicated by interest developed Wednesday May 15 1968 - 4:30 P.M. To Red Bull Motel - Transportation by E. M. Fenner Leave Research Center at 4:30 P.M. Dinner at Somerville Inn with E. M. Fenner and J. P. Leineweber Meet at Somerville Inn at 6:00 P.M. USPHS personnel will be driven to Somerville Inn by E. M. Fenner Thursday May 16 1968 USPHS will be picked up at Red Bull Motel at 8:15 A.M. by E. M. Fenner Resume meeting - Executive Conference Room - Research Center I. General Review - All II Tour of New Research Pipe Test Facilities - J. H. Swensen Lunch at 11:45 A.M. Leave for Newark Airport at approximately 1:00 P.M. to catch 2:40 P.M. Helicopter to LaGuardia - Transportation to Airport by E. M. Fenner - Company Car PRODUCED JM - 83 e: Sur 1f%4 Mat. Dr. fone Geaustion]Chesiatl, L. Ger J. Resotway tee Retdmiolgcs!Gate BrhacHealth&Cealy, 420 & Fietd fev. regs Givrest Health *tudies 17:13 no Cinetasr, Cavirentl wouldAstivo1614Mat.Field My, arivng ChieSroedvyCftoyr.studie J8ocen.i youand Urba 6528 6 Lyneh, : Fay. Ase. JM- 83 PRODUCED Resith Chie! April vould you we from ie at 1 way the han ler 277 Mr. avrieagleaving departs Dise April water ondeve nm 47:13 be April 17 1968 Rat 17 Chief conewd , Cisenaut, Tesartwn April , Chief fuply Leland McCabe McCabe Chief at uges Chief ws a7 ef J. Health Progam Kides atbe: Cancrel tieds se tesourse tesourse Iducation tesourse Iducation Program Program Ghie aad and Yeslth, meCab, Iducation welfare Concral 45202 Farkvey Farkvey tenIducationIducationyeu andwelfare ithne 6526 tea welfar Matabe 4520 vagrkvey Matabe 7.M, Bow conversation conversation conversation telphone sedconversation Cors you, invite National AunaldXarech conversation problem with invitethe youyouproblem problem othercome member interst Come contamination are by myself mebrmyselfare Mr. Come andet and Come May leav Flight you arrives Bewark Bewark retu arivesflight furthe arngemnts 9:30 A.X. further further at confirmed Bewark Center the flight Yorkfrom Newarkconfirmed Maltesr Ciesnati LeQuardia Airport York Thursday flight take York consent Maltester LeQuardia preseding pleasd the have presding at on this oprtuniy pleasd discusions have very on discusions tha on discuions eur fer Theo our ery Flight ery you te bestrewte ene heusfial.progams AicnseThuvedy, Centr. Invirometal if ap. step77 you Graley Field Thyredz, Tuesday,caeviw Direstor Kpidemolgica Health Diresto GraleyKpidemolgica Field Direstor Urban Urban oprtunity discusionsoprtuniy will 15 andpie. ery The K. Invironmetal dates vhs TO Jay Baker CC F.J. Solon Jr. E. M. Fenner Fenner ENVIRONMENTAL ENVIRONMENTAL ENVIRONMENTAL ENVIRONMENTAL wt | N April 19 1968-0 7 2,68 APR APR 2,68 2,68 2,68 ; |. Lo. : moe i et RE VISITS TO FINDERNE - ASBESTOS STUDIES Attached is a copy of a letter from Ed Fenner confirming that the Public Health Service people will visit Finderne on May 15 and 16 to review the results of the studies conducted to date on possible water contamination from asbestos pipe You had tatives felt that this might be an opportune of the Nashville Board of Health and time to invite represen- Vanderbilt University Since deal I will be directly out of town next week I would suggest possibility with Ed Fenner about this that you Among the points I am sure you will want to cover with Ed are 1 Whether or not PHS would object to having the other group of people invited at the same time as their visit 2 Just what kind of data we will have to show to PHS and the other group by May 15 3. Whether it might be possible for PHS to issue invitations to the Nashville Board of Health and Vanderbilt people Research Center to join them in visiting our The rationale behind such an approach would and the others PHS could have along and see be that Dr. Bistowich Dr. Snell have asked the PHS for advice ergo a reason for inviting them to come on May 15 and 16 4. While it would be nice to have the Nashville and Vanderbilt people present at the same time as the PHS representatives I know you would agree that the first obligation is to accede to the wishes of PRODUCED - JM 83 More .,. Jay Baker April 19,1968 the Public can always date Health invite Service on this subject the Tennessee folks at a You later , wpr att W. P. Raines PRODUCED JM - 83 Environmental Control Department Research & Engineering Center April 24 1968 J. F. Baker - GHO Water Contamination Studies Meeting with U.S.P.N.5 W. P. Raines latter of April 19 1968 I do not believe that having representatives of Health and Vanderbilt University present during United States Public Health Service on May 15th These discussions will be quite technical and a the Nashville Board of our discussions with the and 16th is advisable major portion of the time will be devoted to a review of the techniques used in obtaining our results I suggest that the Nashville Board of Health and Vanderbilt University visit be postponed until a later date I certainly believe that the new pipe erosion test stand should be in operation during their visit jax jax jax jax jax jax jax CQ jax C E. X. Fenner PRODUCED JM 83 THE NASHVILLE TENNESSEAN Thursday Feb. 22 1963 == Cancer Stirs TieTie StirsStirs FurorFuror . By FRANK RITTER Metro councilmen and a Vanderbilt University profes- sor clashed verbally yester- day over what prompted | the | professor to inter recently ) that asbestos cement pipe might cause cancer 3 Dr. James Snell assistant professor at the Vanderbilt school of medicine was ques- tioned at length by Council- man James Hamilton about * letter he wrote recently in which he raised the cancer question I THE IMPLICATION of your letter Hamilton told Snell during a council committee meeting was that Metro Council under the , guise of saving a few cents was going to place hundreds of thousands of people in danger of getting a dread disease We certainly don't want to do that And coming at the time it did and in the alar~-n- ing way it was written and distributed to the public it would seem to me the letter was unfair i The meeting a joint session of the finance and public works committees of Metro Council was called to con- sider whether the city should permit asbestos pipe companies to bid on Metro pipe contracts Cast iron pipe has been used exclusively although it 15 more expensive initially than asbestos pipe for at least 40 years in the Nashville water system HAMILTON asked Snell yes- terday if there have been any studies to determine if iron oxide from cast iron pipe might cause cancer Snell replied that there have been no such studies to his knowledge There has been no re- search Hamilton asked on whether asbestos cement pipe or cast iron pipe can cause cancer has there Snell said there has not been Hamilton said if Snell was sincere in raising the question about asbestos pipe he should have raised the same question about cast iron pipe think it is perfectly rea sonable to raise such a ques- tion about cast Snell replied iron pipe WOULD YOU ra.se the question doctor asked Councilman James LaPenna " would be very happy Turn to Page 12 Column 7 PRODUCED JM - 83 ~ Cancer Tie Stirs Forum ee en Continued From Page One to write the Public Health Service about " Snell an- swered The whole question . of contamination of food and water should be raised in my opinion Snell sent his letter last November to Robert L. Law- rence waterworks director supporting Lawrence's decision to prohibit asbestes cement pipe manufac turers from bidding on Metro waterpipe purchases The professor said he would consider the use of asbestos pipe a medical bazard of significant degree until the . Public Health Service has checked it out completely EXPLAINING TO the coun- cilmen yesterday that he had no ulterior motive in writing the letter Snell said " regret the vindictive at- titude that some people have against me merely as a result of my raising this ques- tion _ I'm not vindictive against \ you doctor Hamilton inter- rupted In fact I had never met you until now It just seems to me that a scientist is under a requirement to state all factors in a case don't think you under- ' stand how this came about Snell said " simply raised thought that before Nashville undertakes to buy large amounts of asbestos pipe this question should be raised IF YOU DESIRE to raise the same question about cast iron pipe then I think it is very reasonable I have no political motive I have no fi- nancial interest in these pipe companies I am not aligned politically with any group Hamilton reacted angrily at this statement by Snell and declared We're not inquiring docfor into your political alignments your religion or anything else The exchange between the councilmen and Snell followed presentations by representatives of both Clow Corp which has supplied all Metro : waterpipe the past four years and Manville Sales Corp. an asbestos pipe deal- er seeking to bid on pipe pul chases here , - K. RAYMOND Augst assis- tant district sales manager for Manville told the coun- cilmen that there are strong Indications Metro could save 34 on its pipe purchases if the city permitted the asbes- tos pipe firms to bid i Augst said Metro bought ; 1.3 million worth of cast iron pipe from July 1966 to September 1967. As- bestos pipe Augst added would have cost only 864,000 giving Metro a savings of| 459,000 ; Lawrence has defended buy- . ing the more expensive pipe on grounds it is better and has a greater factor of safety However Johns Manville; representatives insisted yesterday that their product will : as serve the city equally good : as cast iron pipe if it is in- stalled properly : _ i SHORTLY AFTER Snell ' wrote his letter last year to Lawrence raising the ques- : tion of whether asbestos pipe could cause cancer the Metro ; Health Board took a similar ; stand ry The board voted Jan. 17 to not approve the use of asbes tos pipe until sufficient in- formation could be obtained to prove if it is medically- safe . * Yesterday at an early morning meeting the board _ voted to reconsider its stand* on the basis of evidence suh- mitted by Manville Co. . 1 representatives PRODUCED PRODUCED JM - 0 Environmental Control Department Research & Engineering Center February 26 1968 CONFIDENTIAL CONFIDENTIAL W. P. Raines GHQ Water Contamination Studies Asbestos Pipe San Diego Attached are some and on inhalation of two fibers per figures on ingestion based on based on the proposed British cubic centimeter San Diego Threshold study Limit results Value As you can see we are dealing with very minute quantities quantity per day is well below inhalation at TLV per day Ingestion While this comparison is interesting We are comparing apples and oranges the TLV for ingestion is not I don't The TLV thinikt is quotable for inhalation is known EMF ems Attach CC F. L. Pundsack S. Speil Att J. P. Leineweber J. H. Swensen Act J. F. Herr File 4/17 4/17 E. M. Fenner TLV = the all in Kluz Kluz CONFIDENTIAL W. P. Raines - Attachment - Page 1 Feb. 26 1968 Water Contamination Studies San Diego California Potable water after two miles through a year old asbestos pipe system had a fiber content increase from .03 micrograms per gallon to 4.0 micrograms per gallon 1 microgram = 1 x 10-6 grams .000001 grams 1 microgram = 2.2 x 10-9 pounds .0000000022 lbs Assume average daily water consumption is eight glasses or 4 gallon per day Then daily ingestion of fiber could be 4.4 10-9 lb per day .0000000044 Proposed British TLV for inhalation of fiber is 2 fibers per cc or 5.6 x 104 56,000 fibers per cubic foot Assume average inhalation rate is 1 CFM Then TLV = 5.6 x 104 56,000 fibers per minute Assume average respirable fiber size is 1. 17 ^ 10 -- long ( one muc et wheat 2. x 2 3 20 A long 2 min min on Fiber 1 would weigh 2.2 ^ 10-14 lbs Fiber 2 would weigh 17.6 x 10-14 lbs desmiter desmiter b c mon mon ( pay " 2"0 seue-bee dene Lag ) Then fibers inhaled per day at TLV 1 5.8 x 10-7 lbs per day 48.00000058 2 x 10 lbs per day .0000048 theoritytheoritytheority theority t theoritytheority of ont ont ont of ~~ _ Apuer 6 fs be ree dun't partpart to 9 ofa er beer PRODUCED JM - 83 t he. c ys CONFIDENTIAL W. P. Raines - Attachment- Page 2 Feb. 1968 Water Contamination Studies Cont'd Comparison - inhalation vs. ingestion A. Inhalation Case 1 Case 2 5.8 X 10-7 lbs per day .00000058 48 10 lbs per day .0000048 B. Ingestion San Diego 4.4 x 10-9 lbs per day ( .0000000044 E. M. Fenner PRODUCED JM - 83 =e soe BANNER -THE NASHVILLE o_o Wed. Feb. 21 1963 ee me Health BoardToReview Asbestos Water Pipe Use The Metro Health Board on a causing agent when inhaled motion by Dr. David Strayhorn Dr. Bistowish said but added Sr. voted today to reconsider that sufficient information is not concrete its stand on the use of asbestos available concerning its use as pipe for water lines a water conducting material | ! The board voted Jan. 17 to The U.S. Public Health Ser not approve the use of the vice is initiating a study into pipe until sufficient informa- asbestos pipe probably as a re- tion could be obtained to prove suit of an inquiry to them from the pipe was medically safe the health department Metro health director Dr. Jos- The service told us we were eph Bistowish said the board's the first municipal health board action did not mean that it would change its position to con- raise the question concerning cerning the pipe but only that the it safety of the pipe Dr. Bis- towish said would reconsider any informa- Representatives of an asbes- tion concerning the safety of the pipe pipe cement pipe producer spoke to the board to explain their po- Asbestos is a known cancer_ sition The spokesmen said they objected to being guilty until proven innocent PRODUCED PRODUCED 83 THE NASHVILLE TENNESSEAR e ems em 8 Chuisday, Feb. 22. 1968 A am ee rer ae GEER Ae = ree nA e Fo heeheepag are Seer eee ser ene inl on ot, magve ye, Lepr epe . Ce an AaOR | ves SeRS Corn wn 36 3 Jack a) Ze Gy ss 4 E abate 3 ss ae ae =Stalt years, Wilson, THE 75 THE THE THE THE Squab le NASHVILLE NASHVILLE NASHVILLE NASHVILLE NASHVILLE NASHVILLE NASHVILE sa NASHVILLE TENNESszak TENNESszak FI TENNESszak | cogent Councilel TENNESszak TENNESszak TENNESszak TENNESszak aaa TENNESszak 1 ag eu a. in Thursday Thursday Thursday Thursday Thursday 3 Thursday 4 4 [ a wes ae Othe Nats mt ag ne Bites Pees weeig/aryes BET ae AE oe Bren Ett a oh 5 Ey 6 Fg Ragen, lal id PT ont"ata ee leet ve ae A . we weer meat gO an : ye, Sm em, KO Asbestos3 Fe- b.3 3 \ Feb. 22. 22. i ars vs. F i@ ra ; 1968 1968 1968 1968 azfi > >, z = te fron Sek es ewe a Z.5 a in Cast ; 26 7) mer 2 e = as = -jntently 2 i It s relative woe. on : cast & : he w - 7 . z ne: le min f beth ad meh A nee Lae aad 4 te, .3 ~~ te Fe sete ee 1 Oe re i a H me eee zy isten fs = .u ten a groundaA 4 counilmen -~oO =e = 2 ae 22 == Metro oe = ey a z sx cz Squabble nearly years Metro KOUNT THE MSM SINAI MSM MSM SCHOCK 2/19/68 - CC EM Fenner 2/22 - cc S. Speil MOUNT SINAI SCHOOL OF MEDICINE of The City University of New York FIFTH AVENUE AND 100TH STREET NEW YORK N.Y 10029 Department of Community Medicine February 16 1968 Dr. F. L. Pundsack Director Division and Corporate Research and Development Manville Research and Engineering Center P. O. Box 159 Manville New Jersey 08835 Dear Dr. Pundsack JM DEFENRICH DEFENRICH DEFENRICH JM DEFDE EFENRN ICH RDI EFEC NRIHCH RECTIVCD L. PUNGSACIPUNGSACI FEB 21 1963 1963 1963 I have been aware that inquiries have been made concerning the possible health hazard associated with the drinking of potable water circulated - through asbestos pipes I presume hazard of this concern is derived from asbestos While this hazard the recognition exists I would of the carcinogenic qualify such cate- gorization at this time by adding the phrase under certain industrial conditions Workmen occupationally exposed to asbestos have an increased risk in many instances of lung cancer pleural and peritoneal mesothelioma possibly gastrointestinal cancer asbestosis and possibly several causes of death not yet well defined We are on very much less secure ground in judging whether any health hazard exists with occupational asbestos exposure While there is evidence that environmental asbestos contamination occurs association of disease with the minimal levels involved has not been unequivocally demonstrated despite some suggestive evidence under special circumstances To compound the difficulties in answering the question you ask studies on environmental asbestos disease have been concerned with inhalation exposure There is no way to translate these experiences into exposure by ingestion Thus we cannot equate a priori the response of the respiratory mucosa with that of the mucosa of the gastrointestinal tract I am sure that these responses to asbestos are markedly different For example asbestos bodies are often formed in lung parenchyma following inhalation of asbestos fibers yet such bodies occur rarely if at all in the gastrointestinal mucosa following ingestion Moreover experimental work so far has not yielded evidence of significant adverse effects associated with ingestion For example Russian work with feeding experiments has demonstrated some mucosal changes but these were minor while in our own Laboratory feeding experiments in hamsters have produced very few mucosal asbestos bodies and an adenocarcinoma of the colon in only one animal very likely coincidental since such are known to occur spontaneously in these animals Yet the exposure to ingested asbestos in this experimental work was very much larger indeed than might be anticipated in water obtained from asbestos pipes PRODUCED - JM - 83 Dr. F. L. Pundsack Page 2 - February 16 1968 This is not to say that the problem of ingested asbestos does not require further study it obviously does First such studies will be useful in determining whether any relationship exists between ingestion of such material and the occurrence of peritoneal mesothelioma or gastrointestinal carcinoma alternate routes of contact can be suggested in the pathogenesis of these tumors and second as part of wider necessary studies to define whether any health hazard exists with level exposures in general / Thus there is no evidence at this time that the presumably very level exposures by ingestion which might occur by intake of water supplied through asbestos pipes has resulted in a recognized health hazard Even if such a hazard could be defined it would be difficult to be sure that asbestos- cement pipe water were the only source since a number of foodstuffs and other substances are filtered through asbestos filters small numbers of the fibers including beer and may presumably contain The question of potential health hazards associated with level environ- mental asbestos exposure is under intensive study at this time As noted the potential hazard of asbestos pipes is part of this general problem I hope and trust that we will find that no hazard exists with level of exposure associated with environmental contamination the and very that low the problem will be found to be confined to the much heavier exposure in industry If I had to hazard a guess at this time will find I would suggest that this is what we I hope that this information will be of assistance to you in your research on this problem . Sincerely yours Selikog Selikog 2.J. 2.J. Irving J. M.D. Professor Professor and Chairman Division of Environmental Medicine IJS PRODUCED CONFIDENTIAL CONFIDENTIAL D. L. Hinmon Water Water Water Water Water contamination contamination contacmontaminiation nation contamination contamincatoionntamination Division Headquarters December 14 1967 fe The Cancer Scare Asbestos Pipe Today we had officials from Fairfax County Virginia visit our plant After we showed them our process and product they brought out a copy of the articles that appeared in the Nashville papers They asked what work JM had done to prove that asbestos was not harmful to public health in asbestos water pipe We are fairly sure that they received these articles from the Nashville papers from representatives of the cast iron pipe companies Therefore is our belief that these articles will be spread much further by our competition and that we will need to furnish as quickly as possible official statements to our District Managers in the field whenever and wherever this question is raised I therefore request a meeting of you and Mr. Solon as quickly as possible as to what information we can immediately send to the field We could keep this information date as we gain more information on the program that is now underway for the development of more information on this subject Hugh Jackson was notified by the Cincinnati Office of the U. 5 Public Health Service that they are going to completely investigate this problem and render an opinion They have asked Hugh what work we have done to help guide them in their work Therefore it will also be necessary to set up the best type of communications with these people in Cincinnati for the work that they will be doing develop their answer In addition I think that we should inform the Certainteed Company The Flintkote Company and the Cement Asbestos Pipe Company of the information that we have developed so far Also to keep them informed of additional information as we develop it I suggest we phone these companies and try to set up a date in carly January for them to come to New York and hear the story that we PRODUCED JM - 83 an D. L. Hinmon -2- -2- -2- December 14 1967 presented to the City of Nashville people Further to discuss their ideas for them to on how the problem share in any costs the necessary information should be attacked and possibly incurred on the development of I further recommend that I inform the Sales Managers of these companies Ed Kock of Flintkote James Reichel of Certainteed and Lee Taylor of Capco of our intentions of holding such meeting and try to arrive at a mutually satisfactory date the same time I would like to inform that we will have a At an attorney present and a court recorder that will record all of our deliberations this subject only and that we will confine our discussions to jc CC C. B. Burnett F. J. SolonH. Jackson J. F. Baker file M. HARRIS PRODUCED PRODUCED - 83 December 14 1367 Mr. Leland J. McCabe Chief Disease Studies Water Supply and Sea Resources Program Department of Health Education and Welfare 221 221 221 East Central Parkway Cincinnati Ohio 45202 45202 Dear Mr. McCabe I have forwarded your letter of December 7 to Mr. 2. M. Penner Director of Environmental Control at our Research Cen- ter Finderne New Jersey for reply to the specific questions you have raised A" you may know we have been and are cooperating with the U. S. Public Health Service through Dr. L. J. ralley's organization in a study of the asbestos industry This study is principally concerned with the biological effects of asbestos resulting from the inhalation exposures encountered in industry The recent opinions expressed by Dr. J. D. Snall J. as reported in the Nashville papers raised some serious questions you in of our Please be assured that we will collaborate your investigation and make the knowledge and Research organization available to you fully with resources Yours very truly 302 Director H. M. Jackson of Industrial Relations Copy to Mr. B. M. Penner C. B. Burnett Wright G. M.D. A. D. L.L. Hinmon F. J. Solon W. P. Raines M. Harris f Pincerne va ) ) Please ) to all ) ) L see attached note receiving copy of this letter PRODUCED JM - 83 Attachment to H. M. Jackson's to Leland J. McCabe Dept. of letter of 12/14/67 H. E. & W. Cincinnati Ohio Note to C. B. Burnett G. W. Wright M.D. E. M. Fenner A. C. Smith D. L. Hinmon F J. Solon W. P. Raines M. Harris 12/14/67 By phone contact was aware of the on December 13 Dr. Cralley advised me Nashville situation fact had been make comments for Dr. Murray Brown's use and signature that he asked to He indicated the essence of the comments were that the asbestos health hazard potential via the routes of inhalation and ingestion were two totally different situations Substantial dosages over long periods of time were necessary to produce ill effects by inhalation In his opinion it was inconceivable that sufficient fibre intake could be accomplished through the ingestion route alone and particularly so when related to the water intake capacity of humans He also expressed an opinion that a pH which would attack the cement would also attack and modify the fibre Dr. Cralley does not know whether the comments were forwarded Although Dr. Cralley does not know L. J. McCabe personally he will contact him and advise him of the current asbestos industry study and our relationship with the Department H. M. Jackson P. S. - Copy of L. J. McCabe's letter of December 7 1967 is attached PRODUCED JM - 83