Document LvaMNx0dZ9kvrRXKVbMQReYQ

Monsanto R. - Walters April 2 7 1977 KOPPERS VISIT - 4/15/77 fP / I'*; R. G. Potter B-3-S-B M. E. Miller 3-3-S-B J. C. McPhillips B-3-S-C 29 1977: 1010 Attached is the call report on our visit with the Koppers Wood Treating Group regarding Pentachlorophenol. If you have any questions or comments, please call me. R. E. Walters jb Attachment : C19407 CALL REPORT CUSTOMER: HOPPERS COMPANY PITTSBURGH, PA. DATE: APRIL 15, 1977 PRESENT FOR HOPPERS; Dick Spatz - Vice President & General Manager - Forest Products Division John Hite - General Manager - Specialty Wood Treating Group Bob Arsenault - Manager of Technical Services Don Davies - Director of R & D Don Hallahan - Market Manager PRESENT FOR MONSANTO: Robert G. Potter Michael . Miller John C. McPhillips Ronald E . Walters The primary purpose of the meeting was to discuss with Hoppers Monsanto-1 3 planned efforts with regard to environmental and health safety questions on technical Pentachlorophenol. Below is a- summary of the discussion by subject(Initials indicate the source of the statement): I. CURRENT STATUS OF MICHIGAN & EPA STUDIES PCP and dioxins were found seven herds PCP was found, Reichhold toured all of the barns with Van Gelden as their con sultant. Tissue samples and wood borings were taken for test ing. 'To date the tests have not been run. Vulcan is assisting in this work although not on board initially. (BA) The real issue is not so much what happened to the cows but what standards should be used for using Penta in barns - how much, where, sheathed lumber? (BA) ibly turn out the winner in Michigan with low (BA) - EPA is looking at PCP residues in human and cattle blood. In 14 states, PCP shows up in low levels (PPB, 15% was PPT) in 96% of the blood tested. (BA) - EPA is preparing to run two year feeding studies on PCP and its residues. The protocol has been discussed with NCI and * will begin in mid-1977. Arsenault feels that technical penta will show a high probability of causing cancer. (BA) ^ 'TCP- 019408 PAGE II I. CURRENT STATUS OF MICHIGAN & EPA STUDIES (cont'd) - On 4/13 the Science Advisory Board was to submit a report with recommendations on PCP. Arsenault suspects that the report will be directed at the dioxins in penta. - There is a real commercial concern that even if dioxin standards are not set by the EPA there could be consider able backlash from farmers, utility pole unions, etc. II. MONSANTO STATUS & PLANNED EFFORTS - Penta is important because of its impact on the economics of a total manufacturing complex. (RGP) - Monsanto is commiting dollars and effort for AWPI tests, for AWPI membership, for a full-time Michigan lobbyist, and to attend state and federal hearings. (RGP) .III. LOW DIOXIN CAPABILITY - M^nsaato__i^^aajaj^g^to technical penta. At this time wo can't give a position on low dioxin material because we don't have a definite process, know its costs or capital. These unknowns should be resolved by mid-1977. (RGP) - Although Monsanto doesn't have a definite process several 0 routes have been developed on the lab bench. No pilot t plant has been done but this step could be- by-passed if felt unnecessary. CED is looking at the processes for a rough capital estimate. (JCMc) - Several years ago Spatz was told that Monsanto had a process to make low dioxin penta. He couldn't remember who from' Monsanto told him. - Prior to the Michigan situation, Monsanto talked to Dow about their process. We saw it as too expensive. (RGP) - Distillation is the current route to make purified penta. Dow uses a amine to control the distillation, Vulcan has another patented product. (BA) - Monsanto shouldn't necessarily look at the distillation route. Penta solution-(or concentrate) has shown a low dioxin content. The only problem is that you only have a 5-10% penta solution with resulting high freight costs. (BA) CONFIDENT! SUBJECT to protective order. PAGE III IV. KOPPEHS OVERVIEW - The Koppers/Monsanto relationship has always been at arms length.* (DS) Spatz wants Monsanto to see the penta pro blem from Kppers1 point of view. - Spatz wants Monsanto to become heavily involved in the fight to save technical penta. He feels Monsanto should take a leaderships role. He feels we should be involved because the problem is no longer one of product sales (Kppers* function) but one of product manufacture, R&D, and quality. - Spatz wanted confirmation that Monsanto would not walk away from the problem. (This was not given). - If Monsanto doesn't want to help or go to low dioxin penta, Koppers would want to sever our relationship and conceiv ably go to Dow for penta. (DS) - Some major customers are showing signs of moving to Dow's low dioxin penta as a precaution. (JH) The -luncheon discussion centered around the independent work being done by Reichhold/Vulcan. It was felt that Reichhold should be encouraged to turn this work over to the AWPI so that it would be an industry evaluation. Arsenault would pursue this point with Reichhold and Vulcan. R. E. Walters jb C19470 ^r t r