Document J3jeKp3dpmRk4Nm7BkmmE5ZrZ

FILE NAME Cape Asbestos CAPE DATE 1981 Apr 7 DOC CAPE113 DOCUMENT DESCRIPTION Legal - Examination of Edward George Rudland Legal - Tibbs Case Exhibit 11 a 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 10 11 11 12 12 13 13 14 14 15 15 IN THE COURT OF COMMON PLEAS OF ALLEGHENY COUNTY PENNSYLVNIA DIVISION 3218972 ELECTRONICA ELCTRONIAY ANTHONY A BARBER ET AL Mave Ange Plaintiffs Orerat Oya! vs PITTSBURGH CORNING CORPORATION One al General Docket no GD79-21544 FILED - Seeel 2023 Sewtet CHARTER CONSOLIDATED LTO ET AL ) Meer Oct Defendants Cam? 18 Newel 10:48 taken bytEXthAheMeINPAlTaIiOnNtiOfFf EDpWuArRsDuanGtEORtGoEaRRgUUrDDeLLeAAmNNeDDnt on AM - RICHLAND Tuesday 7 April 1981 at the offices of Linklaters & Paines Barrington House 59-67 Gresham Street London England RICHLAND - Before Irene Last ACR and COMON Jacqueline Roper ACR Verbatim Reporters of Tennyson & Company 198 Epsom Road PLEAS Merrow Guildford PLEAS Surrey England - CASE 16 16 APPEARANCES ~ WERNER L POLAK ESQ 17 17 Attorney for the Defendant Charter Consolidated 2023CP401759 ce, ae 18 18 203CP401759 Shearman & Sterling 53 Wall Street New York NY 10005 19 DAVID ] ARMSTRONG ESQ and GEORGE MCGRANN 203CP401759 PPG Industries 2222 ADtitcokrineeysMcCfaormeythe& CChhiillccootteeChilcote PPG Industries InIdnduusstrtiersies Industries 3180 US Steel Building 22 22 Pittsburgh Pennsylvania 15219 22 22 THORP REED & ARMSTRONG 2900 Grant Building Pittsburgh Pennsylvania 1521 BY WILLIAM M WYCOFF ESQ of Counsel 24 25| 26 27 28 ALSO PRESENT BREDHOFF GOTTESMAN COHEN & WEINBERG Suite 1300 1000 Connecticut AvenuNeW Washington DC 20036 BY FRANK PETRAMALO JR ESQ of Counsel PlaintiPflainftiff MR P P TRINCA Freshfields MR COD STYLE Linklaters & Paines ~ aw : : ws oo io . - E [ 2 ia RUDLAND 6 ELCTRONICALY 4 A When I was in Zimbabwe American in Africa is a household ELECTRONICALLY 2 When I worked for Syfrets I did do the tax returns fora director of Anglo ELECTRONICALY 3 0 American 4] Q As part of your duties at Syfrets FILED - 5 A It was a service they provided for clients 2023 6 7 | 8 9 10 11 Q Is this what led to a reference to Anglo American Oct 18 A applied I did not get a reference to several companies which I came back to the operated in Africa 20:48 United Kingdom a I secured a job AM - with Anglo American Corporation I had no recommendation Q Anglo American Corporation of South Africa Limited the top RICH company, AND you said is located in its principal office in Johannasburg AND COMMON 12 A That is right COMON 13 Q In South Africa COMON 14 A Yes PLEAS PLEAS 15 Is that an operating company or strictly a holding company CASE 16 A A holding company CASE 17 Q Are you familiar with any of its subsidiaries 203CP401759 18 A I am not 203CP401759 19 Q Do you know the name of any of its subsidiaries 203CP401759 20 A Rand Selection Corporation African and European Investments Company 21 Limited Purlined Limited I think I cannot recall any others at the 22 moment , 23 24 MR POLAK For clarification are these the ones you know at the present time or were they at that time 25 BY THE WITNESS 26 A Ones I know at this time 27 BY MR ARMSTRONG 28 Q When you use the term subsidiary what definition do you give to it - i ad ca ad a - - } 4 . i [ -: ~ on | - es nT 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 10 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 A 50 per cent plus RUDLAND 7 ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALY ELCTRONICALY ELCTRONICALY Q You would not say 51 par cant plus but 50 per cent plus ELECTRONICALY ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICAL Y A 50 per cent plus FILED FILED FILED Q Do you use the term associated companies FILED A We use the term in this country to mean a cent investment Oct Q Using that definitior Oct 18 A Up to 50 per cent 10:48 10:48 0 At which point then it would become a subsidiary AM A Yes -- Mr Rudland using that companies of Anglo American definition can you identify any RICHLAND RICHLAND associated RICHLAND COMMON A To the best of my knowledge and belief I am not familiar with COMMON the actual shareholdings that Anglo American hes but I would say Free State Geduld Freestate Saaiplass Holdings Botswana RST Limited Western Deep Levels I cannot recall details of the others CASE 0 Do you know the identity of any of the directors of Anglo American American A Yes 203CP401759 Q Tell us who they are 203CP401759 A HF Oppenheimer Sir Keith Acutt Relly Wardell BW Pain Carey Nicholson Philip Oppenheimer Ogilvie Thompson Neil Clarke Murray Hofmey Sydney Spiro N Oppenheimer and I cannot recall the others Q which of those persons is the managing director A I do not think Anglo American has a managing director Q which person is the chairman A HF Oppenheimer G Do you know whether he has any position with De Beers A To the best of my knowledge and belief he is probably a director Q Is he chairman of the board of De Beers ian os ? or reer i . . fen: = 4 A cannot be sure He may be RUDLAND T ELECTRONICAL Y ELECTRONICAL Y 2 0 Turning to the directors identified for Anglo American has any Sof ELCTRONIALY 3 those directors ever been associated in any way with Charter Consolidated 4 Limited Limited Limited - 5 A Certain of those directors have been on the board of Charter 2023 6 Consolidated Oct 18 7 Q Which ones have been 10:48 8 A HF Oppenheimer still a current member Murray Hofmeyer SydneyAMSpirc -RICHLAND 9 Ogilvie Thompson Philip Oppenheimer Gavin Rally Sir Keith Acutt may hahveave -RICHLAND 10 been in the past I cannot ba suIe 11 Q Clarke - 12 13 14 15 whether COM O A Neil Clarke is on the board of Anglo American Q Do you know if that is the Clarke who is on that board PLEAS Charter PLEAS - A That is the same Clarke yes Carey Beville Pain 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 Q N Oppenheimer 203CP41759 A No. Q Does Mr Peter Burnell have any association known to you with Anglo American 203CP401759 A Peter Burnell is a director of Charter He is presently located in Brazil Q He gives as his business address Anglo American Corporation Brasil Limitada Do you know what his association with Anglo American Corporation is in Brazil 25 A am not sure of his exact title out there but he would be a senior man in that organisation 0 His business address translated I am told is Anglo American Corporation of Brazil Limited Do you know what the relationship is between j 4 s DS 3 4 5 6 7 8 WwW 10 10 11 121212 13 that company and Anglo American Corporation A Anglo American have an interest in that company extent of it RUDLAND 9 ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELCTRONICALY ELCTRONICALY ELECTRONICAL Y I do not know the ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICAL Y FILED FILED Q You do not know whether it is an associated company or a subsidiary A I cannot be sure 2023 Oct Q Another present member of the board of Charter is John Collins g 18 you know whether Mr Collins has any association with Anglo American 10:48 Corporation AM - A Not to my knowledge RICHLAND Q Another would be Mr Hambro - A Not to my knowledge COM ON -- Geoffrey Higham is also such a director of Charter Do you know ~ any association between him and Anglo American Corporation PLEAS A No. PLEAS - Q Francis John Adrian Howard is a director of Charten Do you know of of any association between him and Anglo American 203CP41759 18 A I believe he used to be employed at one stage by Anglo America Q He was also employed by Diamond Trading Company Have you ever 203CP401759 heard of that company A Yes Q What is its relationship with Anglo American Corporation A I do not know Q Do you know whether it has any A I do not know Q Another director is Anthony Owston a director of Charter Do you know whether there is any relationship between Mr Owston and Anglo American Corporation A I cannot recall whether he has an association with Anglo es ne e Cae . Dart PORN o ih 2 3 4 WH 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 a 18 Fs ak a! sat 27 28 | INNYSCOO N RUDLAND 20 ELECTRONICAL Y ELECTRONICALY ELCTRONIAY A Me is Q Is he presently the chairman A I believe he is FILED FILED Q That is a aubsidiary of Charter - A A 67.3 per cent subsidiary 2023 Oct Q Charter has owned approximately that interest since 19697 18 A 1969 was the date when Charter increased its interest as a res^> 10:48 of a bid for the proportionally outstanding shares not owned by Charte" I am not quite sure in 1969 what its interest was after that acquisition ROCHLAND It would be in that sort of area ROCHLAND - Q What does Anthony Owaton da What is his employment COMON A He is a director of Charter Q Is he employed by Charter or either of the service companies A He would be employed by one of the service companies PLEAS - Q What does he do A His specific responsibility is for mining operations CASE202304001759 Beville Pain is he also employed by Charter in addition to being being 2034 1759 a director or is he employed by either of the two service companies 2030401759 A To the best of my knowledge all Charter people are employed by service companies Q He is an employee of one of the service companies A To the best of my knowledge he would be but I think I should make it clear that I do not know the personal employment relationships with the directors in Charter This would not be discussed with me Q what is his specific area of interest7 A Finance 0 Does he work for Mr Howard A NO  . oo : nae ae - : an Doi a DG an - | | : : _ : - - ; : - i.}. tle _ ) ) a. 4 "osama L 2 3 4 3H 6 7 8 9 30 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 RUDLAND 21 ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY Q Does Mr Howard work for him ELCTRONICALY ELCTRONICALY A I think they work independently ELECTRONICAL Y Q Do they work in different areas of finance FILED FILED FILED A Mr Pain works in the more general area Mr Howard works more 2023 2023 generally on the investment side 2023 Oct 0 Since Mr Stuke left the board has he any association with Charter at this time 10:48 A No. AM RICHLAND Q Since his departure are there now 16 members of the board of RICHLAND RICHLAND directors of Charter RICHLAND RICHLAND A I am slightly perplexed Reading that there are 16 " Reading Exhibit GG7 A Yes It was my understanding there were COMMON COMMON COM ON COMMON PLEAS PLEAS PLEAS CASE Q So of the present 16 directors eight ~ being Mr Clarke CASE Mr Hofmeyer Mr Thompson Harry Relly and Richardson - are also that correct A Yes that is correct Oppenheimer directors of Philip Oppenheimer Anglo American Do Pain 2023C4001759 2023C4001759 I 2023C4001759 203C401759 2023C40 1759 Q Of the other eight one - Mr Burnell ~ is an employee of Anglo American Corporation of Brazil Limited A I do not know exactly his employment arrangements Q You gave as his business address Anglo American Corporation of Brazil Limited Where did you get that information A Off our records The secretarial recordswould have the addresses recorded of the directors 0 Another - Mr Higham- is chairman of the board of directors and an employee of Cape Is that correct RUOLAND 22 : : ae : ie - - | , ! | . | | : - : ; : > . 7 - ; W 1 2 3 (| 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 ELECTRONICALLY A It is correct ELCTRONICALY Q And all of the others except Mr Collins and Mr Hambro such ELECTRONICAL Y Mr Howard Mr Owston are executive directors that is employees of FEED of the two service companies except for Mr Thomas Is that correct FE D A That is correct 2023 0 So that there are only three members of the board who are outs 18 directors with no apparent association with Anglo American 10:48 MR POLAK I do not understand that at all AM BY THE WITNESS RICHLAND A inside Could I look at GG please Exhibit GG handed tto he witness directors are Richardson Pain Buston Howard = Higham is an RICHLAND The COM ON executive director Clarke Dr Spinks is a executive chairman COM ON Sir Philip Oppenheimer is an outside director Burnell could be regarded as an outside director Collins is Hambro is Hofmeyer is an outside director Oppenheimer is an outside director So are Belly Thomas CASE Ogilvie Thompson 203CP40F759 BY MR ARMSTRONG 203CP40F759 Q When you speak of being executive director what does that 2023CP400F759 executive director A It means he is remunerated by Charter for services he performs for Charter He is a working director He is a time working director of Charter Q He works for Charter A Yes 0 which means he must be an employee of one of the two service companies 27 A No. I am not sure I do not know the arrangement for the 28 remuneration to Mr Higham but it would not necessarily follow ENNYSOoNe.: oo fn He is .! = : a ee of a a rs 4 | i 7 3 a 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 RUDLAND 23 23 ELECTRONICALLY ELECTRONICALLY ELCTRONICALY ELECTRONICALLY ELCTRONICALY primarily a Cape director but has some executive responsibility with Charte ELECTRONICAL Y Q What work does he do at Charter ELCTRONICALY ELECTRONICAL Y A He provides advice with our industrial companiebsut I do not know FICED any more than that 2023 Q The means he is asterisk on this exhibit and the a working director of Charter designation executive 2023 director Oct 18 A Executive means working director 10:48 AM Q Of Charter AM RICHLAND A Yes but he is a time working director RICHLAND RICHLAND Q For Charter RICHLAND : : : ; i a : a : : ; . as iz \ 7bow vo : 12 Q The question I was putting was that considering the entire board 13 there are only three persons who are outside directors who are not members o Mm > 14 the board of directors of Anglo American or Anglo American Corporatioonf CASE 15 Brazil Limited Those three are Collins Hambro and Thomas CASE CASE # 16 MR POLAK I have an objection to your question because I not 2023C400159 17 understand how you can define outside director in such a fashion 2023C400159 2023C400159 18 in fact the witness just indicated and read to you who are the inside 19 directors and the outside directors He has just indicated to you - an 20 maybe you were not listening CON that he considered the people on the 21 board of Anglo American as outside directors You are saying that 22 somehow or another they are not outside directors 23 MR ARMSTRONG Would you like to have the question read back 24 MR POLAK No. I have it clearly in m^nd 25 MR ARMSTRONG You don't 26 MR POLAK Yes I do 27 MR ARMSTRONG Then you are making an irrational comment MR POLAK What I would like you to do instead is to ask him to