Document ByQGR8pNZ5q4ynqROy2Bjem7L

ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 NO. 19785-BH02 2 3 4 KELLY-MOORE PAINT COMPANY, INC., Page 1 5 vs. Plaintiff, ) ) IN THE DISTRICT OF 6 DOW CHEMICAL COMPANY, et al., ) ) BRAZORIA COUNTY, TEXAS 7) Defendants. ) 23RD JUDICIAL DISTRICT 8 ) 9 10 11 12 13 DEPOSITION OF ARTHUR VALDEZ 14 15 The following deposition was given on the 10th 16 day of December, 2003, commencing at the hour of 9:21 a.m., 17 before Jenna Osborn, a Certified Shorthand Reporter, License 18 Number 8681. 19 The witness personally appeared at Community 20 Bank, 532 Broadway, King City, California. 21 22 23 24 25 Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 INDEX 2 EXAMINATION BY: 3 MR. DUBIN 4 MR. HAINES 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 NAVARRO: DEPOSITION EXHIBITS 13 1 Photograph 14 2 Photograph 15 3 Photograph 16 4 Photograph 17 5 Photograph 18 6 Photograph 19 20 21 22 23 Appearance Pages 24 Deponent's Signature Page 25 Reporter's Certificate Page Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO Page 2 PAGE 5, 68 50, 76 PAGE 57 58 59 62 62 64 3, 4 78 79 ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 APPEARANCES 2 3 For the Plaintiff: 4 LANIER LAW FIRM 5 Attorneys At Law 6 6810 FM 1960 West 7 Houston, TX 77069 8 (713) 659-5200 9 BY: PATRICK N. HAINES, ESQ. 10 AND 11 PHILLIP N. SANOV, ESQ. 12 13 14 For the Defendants: 15 ORRICK, HERRINGTON, & SUTCLIFFE, LLP 16 Attorneys At Law 17 666 Fifth Avenue 18 New York, NY 10103-0001 19 (212) 506-3764 20 BY: MORTON D. DUBIN, ESQ. 21 AND 22 GLENN JONES, ESQ. 23 24 25 Page 3 Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 4 1 APPEARANCES (CONTINUED) 2 3 For the Deponents: 4 KAZAN, MCCLAIN, EDISON, ABRAMS, FERNANDEZ, 5 LYONS & FARRISE 6 Attorneys At Law 7 171 12th Street, 3rd Floor 8 Oakland, CA 94607 9 (510) 465-7728 10 BY: FRANK FERNANDEZ, ESQ. 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 5 1 ARTHUR VALDEZ, 2 testified under penalty of perjury as follows: 3 EXAMINATION BY MR. DUBIN 4 MR. DUBIN: Q. Good morning, sir. 5 A. Good morning. 6 Q. Can you state your name and current address 7 for the record. 8 A. Arthur Valdez, 207 Pearl Street, King City, 9 California 93930. 10 Q. Mr. Valdez, have you ever had your deposition 11 taken before where lawyers were asking you questions and a 12 reporter was taking down the answers? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Let me just explain them briefly. Obviously 15 we are here to ask you some questions about what you 16 remember about your time at Union Carbide and KCAC. The 17 reporter is going to take down your answers. She can only 18 take down verbal answers. Whereas in normal conversations 19 we may shake our head yes or no, if you can verbalize your 20 responses, I would appreciate that. 21 A. Okay. 22 Q. I'm going to try to be as clear as I can in my 23 questions. If there is something you don't understand, ask 24 me to clarify it and I will do so. 25 Is it fair for me to assume if you don't ask me to Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 7 1 A. I can't really remember. I think it was in 2 April but I' m not sure. 3 Q. And have you paid Mr. Fernandez any money? 4 A. No. 5 Q. In addition to Mr. Fernandez, have you spoken 6 with any other lawyers regarding your time at King City, the 7 mill? 8 A. I spoke to one but I can't remember his name 9 but we didn' t get involved in it. I just -- just out there 10 looking for an attorney to protect us. 11 Q. Okay. Do you know who that was? 12 A. I can't remember who it was. 13 Q. Okay. Have you spoken to any attorneys 14 representing Kelly-Moore Company? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Who have you spoken to? 17 A. The gentleman over there in the corner. 18 Q. Mr. Sanov? 19 A. Uh-huh. 20 Q. Have you spoken to anybody else? 21 A. No. 22 Q. And when did you first speak to Mr. Sanov? 23 A. At our -- at my house. I can't remember the 24 date. 25 Q. Was it around April or was it more recently? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 A. More recently I think. Page 8 2 Q. Okay. Do you recall whether it was in the 3 last couple months or five or six months? 4 A. I think in the last couple months. 5 Q. And how did you meet Mr. Sanov? 6 A. Mr. Fernandez. 7 Q. So Mr. Fernandez put you in contact with 8 Mr. Sanov? 9 A. Right. 10 Q. And how many times have you met with 11 Mr. Sanov? 12 A. Once. 13 Q. And that was that one time at your house? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. And what did you discuss with Mr. Sanov? 16 A. Just the conditions at work. 17 Q. Did Mr. Sanov tell you anything about -- you 18 understand that you have been listed as a potential witness 19 in a case brought by Kelly-Moore Corporation against Union 20 Carbide, you understand that? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. What do you know about Kelly-Moore 23 Corporation? 24 25 them. A. I don't. That's the first time I heard about Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 A . Just attendant. Page 10 2 Q . And how about before that? 3 A . I worked for Basic Vegetable Plant. 4 Q . And how long were you there? 5 A . I can't really remember. I think three -- I 6 was there three years I think. Two or three years. 7 Q . And how about before that, do you recall? 8 A . I worked at a gasoline station. 9 Q . Were you an attendant there as well? 10 A . Yes. 11 Q . How long was that? 12 A . Not very long. A few months. 13 Q . Do you recall what you did before that? 14 A . No. 15 Q . Okay. Where did you grow up? 16 A . Mendota. I was born in Mendota. I grew up in 17 the valley by Five Points and then San Ardo. And then San 18 Lucas and then got married. 19 Q . Do you have a family around here? 20 A . Yes. 21 Q . Any kids? 22 A . Two. 23 Q . And how old are they? 24 A . One is 25, the other one is 28. 25 Q . Can you tell me what your job responsibilities Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 11 1 or job titles were over the time when you worked at Union 2 Carbide and then KCAC. 3 A. Okay. I was -- when I first started? 4 Q. Yeah, if you can tell me as it progressed. 5 A. I was in shipping. 6 Q. Okay. 7 A. And then I moved up to the bagging room. 8 Q. Was that the main bagging room? 9 A. The main bagging room. And then from there I 10 went up to rock fiber operator. 11 MR. FERNANDEZ: Was that rock or -12 THE WITNESS: Rock fiber operator. And then I 13 switched back and forth between rock fiber operator and RG 14 wet in operator. 15 MR. DUBIN: Q. And does that bring us up to pretty 16 much the end of -17 A. Yeah. 18 Q. And you worked -- when Union Carbide sold the 19 business in 1985 you continued to work -- you went over to 20 work for KCAC; is that correct? 21 A. Right. 22 Q. You stayed with KCAC until it shut its doors 23 in about what , was it 2002? 24 A. 2002. 25 Q. Have you had any jobs or employment since the Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 time you left KCAC? 2 A. No. Page 12 3 MR. FERNANDEZ: Let me just clarify something. I 4 think they actually -- he worked there through part of this 5 year. 6 MR. DUBIN: Okay. 7 Q. During sort of a wind down phase, is that -8 A. Right. 9 Q. Okay. When you joined Union Carbide at the 10 mill, were you told that there were certain areas of the 11 facility where you were supposed to wear a respirator? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. What areas do you recall being told to wear a 14 respirator in ? 15 A. Main bagging room. 16 Q. Other -- any other areas that you recall? 17 A. RG bagging room. 18 Q. Anything else? 19 A. No. 20 Q. What about the shipping area? 21 A. Just when we were loading containers. 22 Q. Were you told there was a need to do 23 housekeeping to keep dust off of areas in the mill? 24 A. At the end of the shift. 25 Q. And what did that involve? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 A. Washing down. Page 13 2 Q. What would you wash down? 3 A. The floor. 4 Q. Use hoses or -- 5 A. Water hoses. 6 Q. Okay. Did you understand that Union Carbide 7 was using something called a wet process in -- in the mill? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Okay. What was that? 10 A. Okay. To me that meant the wet process is -- 11 before they didn't have that. When it was Union Carbide we 12 had the ore pile right next to the building where we were -- 13 you know, where I worked. Okay. And then they started that 14 slurry pit. So to me that was considered the wet process 15 because it came from where the pit was, we'd throw the 16 product inside a hopper and then from there it would go in 17 rock fiber wet. So that's what I considered a wet product. 18 I mean, wet process right there. 19 Q. So it was a wet process until you got to 20 bagging and then it became -- 21 A. It was wet process, yeah, it went through the 22 dryers and all. 23 Q. Is it your recollection that they didn't have 24 a wet process when it was at Union Carbide? 25 A. You would consider rock fiber wet process. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 14 1 Because it came in dry and then it went in wet and it would 2 be processed. 3 Q. So when was it that -- your understanding that 4 they adopted a wet process at the mill? 5 A. Okay. If you are considering -- okay. To me 6 rock fiber was wet process because that's where it came in 7 wet. I mean, that's where I -- you know, it was wet. But 8 before it came in there it would be dry, and then it turned 9 into -- you know, because then we would mix it with water 10 and all this stuff. And other things. So that's when it 11 became a wet process. 12 Q. Let me make sure I understand. So there would 13 be an area where they would keep the ore, the raw fiber, 14 right? 15 A. When it was Union Carbide they used to -- like 16 that pile right there would be right by the mill -- right by 17 the -- or the building. 18 Q. Okay. 19 A. Almost by -- almost by where maintenance is. 20 The department. We used to have that pile there and I used 21 to drive a loader, 950 loader and dump it into a belt right 22 there. So it came in to rock fiber dry. And then as soon 23 as it came into the process and then the processing system, 24 you know, it was wet, it became wet. Wet circuit. 25 Q. So it would come into the rock fiber operator, Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 15 1 the rock fiber operator would put it into a wet process? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. And it would stay in a wet process until it 4 went into the bagging room -5 A. Yes. 6 Q. And some point you are saying they changed it 7 to be more of a wet process so even when it came into the 8 rock fiber operator it was already wet? 9 A. I think when KCAC took over, I'm not sure 10 though, then they put that slurry pit up and moved the ore 11 pile further back to the side and had a slurry pit there. 12 Q. You don't -- you don't recall a year when that 13 occurred? 14 A. I don't have a year. I wouldn't know. 15 Q. Okay. Do you ever recall dust counts being 16 taken at the -17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Do you recall if that was being done when you 19 first started at the mill? 20 A. I don't think so. 21 Q. Okay. When do you recall the dust counts 22 began to be done? 23 A. I really don't know when it started. I 24 remember them taking it but I can't remember when it was, 25 what year. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 16 1 Q. Okay. Were you ever fitted with a personal 2 monitoring device to see how much dust was around you? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Okay. Do you recall about how often that 5 would occur? 6 A. Sometimes when MSHA came, because they took 7 their own tests. 8 Q. And then sometimes -9 A. And then sometimes they'll just do it, just do 10 it. 11 Q. You mean sometimes Union Carbide would do it 12 even though there were no government regulators there? 13 A. Right. 14 Q. And do you recall ever seeing any -- receiving 15 any notifications regarding dust levels to which you were 16 exposed? In other words, they would say, you know, you have 17 been exposed in excess of five fibers per CC or two fibers 18 per CC, anything like that? 19 A. Occasionally they would put it on the bulletin 20 board. 21 Q. Do you recall anybody else receiving any 22 letters like that? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Did they sometimes tell you that they would 25 take certain corrective actions to make sure that you Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 17 1 weren't above whatever -- whatever was set by government 2 agencies? 3 A. They would move us around to certain spots if 4 we got a high test somewhere. 5 Q. Did they ever tell you they were going to 6 improve ventilation in a certain area? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Are you aware of any times in which they would 9 improve ventilation or dust control measures in certain 10 areas of the mill? 11 A. I think they might have done some changes 12 inside the bagging room but I wasn't working in the bagging 13 room so I don 't know a lot of the changes they made in 14 there. 15 Q. You mentioned government inspectors. How 16 often would government inspectors be on the facility? 17 A. I don't have no idea how often they would be 18 there. Sometimes I would see them two to three times a 19 year. 20 Q. And did you ever talk to any of the 21 inspectors? 22 A. No. 23 Q. When the inspectors came on the plant were 24 there any changes in the regular working conditions? 25 A. Yes. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 18 1 Q And what were those? 2 A. If we were bagging a certain open product, 3 especially if it is dusty, we'd stop and switch over to a -4 instead of powder, pellets, because it doesn't create as 5 much dust. And sometimes if we are working in a certain 6 spot, especially a dusty -- dusty area, we would completely 7 stop that. We'd do clean up. 8 Q. You mentioned there was a large ore pile 9 outside of the facility. 10 A. Right. 11 Q. Was that moved when -- when the OSHA 12 inspectors came or did that stay in the same place? 13 A That stayed in the same place. 14 Q. Other than changing the process, what you 15 maybe have been making when the regulators were coming, was 16 there anything else -- anything else done? 17 MR. FERNANDEZ: Objection, misstates prior 18 testimony. 19 MR. DUBIN: Q. Okay. Other than the things you 20 already mentioned, was anything else done regarding when 21 government inspectors were there? 22 A. No. Just stopping what we were doing. 23 Q. Okay. Do you know whether or not when Union 24 Carbide conducted its own dust counts whether it ever 25 conducted dust counts when the dusty operations were Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 occurring? Page 19 2 A. No. 3 Q. You don't -- you don't know one way or the 4 other? 5 A. On that -- when we used -- when we did that, 6 usually it was the same conditions. We weren't working in 7 certain areas. 8 Q. So you wouldn't be making the dusty 9 products -- 10 A. Right. 11 Q. -- when those dust counts were taken? 12 A. Right. 13 Q. Just to be clear, what were the dusty 14 operations? 15 A. That was the RG circuit, the wet in, RG wet 16 in -- no, it wasn't wet in. That was my circuit. That was 17 RG bagging room. 18 Q. RG bagging room? 19 A. Right. 20 Q. So the dusty part of the operations, would 21 those occur in the bagging room? 22 A. Well, there was dust all over the place, it's 23 just those were the main ones. But like I say, when I was 24 working in the RG area, wet in, there is a dryer underneath 25 there. There is holes all over that dryer so there is leaks Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 all over the place. Dust all over the place Page 20 2 Q. Just focusing now on the types of operations 3 that you said they wouldn't do during the time when 4 government inspectors came by, where were those operations 5 occurring in the mill? 6 A. Okay. Be in the bagging room, the RG room, 7 then if we were working dust collectors or inside a dryer, 8 or if we are -- you know, any dusty area where -- or if we 9 are doing clean up and there is a pile of asbestos 10 somewhere, that would need to be cleaned up, we would avoid 11 that. 12 Q. Okay. The RG room, was that a bagging room 13 too, RG bagging room? 14 A. It's a bagging room. The RG wet in was above 15 that. 16 Q. And the inside dryer, what would occur there? 17 A. There is enclosures on both ends and they got 18 a seal around it but there is -- dryers are old. Especially 19 the RG circuit, and there was holes and then where the seals 20 were it would still be leaking dust and the dust would be 21 going up to our circuits and then around there also. 22 Q. Now how would -- how would the operation of 23 the inside dryer change when government inspectors would 24 come? What would change? 25 A. We wouldn't -- we wouldn't run that day on Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 21 1 that dryer or just wet down with -- if we were -- we were 2 running with wet down area. 3 Q. Was sometimes the inside dryer running when 4 government inspectors came? 5 A. Yeah. When they came in. 6 Q. So did they not wet -- ever wet down the 7 inside dryer area when government inspectors were not there? 8 A. We wouldn't wash down as often. 9 Q. What's the difference -- how often would you 10 wash down the inside -11 A. Usually it would be at the end of the shift. 12 Q. How often would you do it if a government 13 inspector was coming? 14 A. We would do it right as soon as they were 15 there, we would be cleaning up. Then at the end of the 16 shift also. 17 Q. So the end of the shift -- how often did 18 shifts last, at the end of the day? 19 A. Eight hours. 20 Q. Eight-hour shifts. And -21 A. And with Union Carbide sometimes we worked 22 over 12 hours . So it would be at the end of the shifts. 23 Q. So you would perform that operation one 24 additional time if the government inspector was coming in, 25 you would do it right before they came in, is that what you Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 22 1 are saying? 2 A. The whole plant. 3 Q. But in terms of the inside dryer? 4 A. Not inside the dryer. This is outside the 5 area. 6 Q. Okay. In terms of the inside dryer area. 7 Okay. Near the inside dryer. 8 A. Yeah. 9 MR. FERNANDEZ: I think you are misunderstanding. 10 MR. DUBIN: Okay. 11 MR. FERNANDEZ: When he said inside dryer -- he 12 didn't say inside dryer, he said inside the dryer they would 13 do things actually inside the dryer. Not that there was an 14 inside dryer and an outside dryer. 15 MR. DUBIN: Q. So you would work -- inside the 16 dryer you would wet that down? 17 A. No, we wouldn't be inside the dryer. We are 18 talking about the enclosures because there is doors right 19 there. 20 Q. Right. 21 A. But sometimes there is leaks and there would 22 be a pile like this of just fine powder. So sometimes that 23 would leak out the doors because they weren't sealed tight. 24 So some of that stuff was a pile like this, powder, it would 25 go out there . So sometimes we would wash that area out Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 before the inspectors came. 2 Q. Was there an inside dryer and an outside Page 23 3 dryer? 4 A. No. Just the enclosures. 5 Q. The dryer was inside an area? 6 A. No. It's out in the open. 7 Q. Out in the open in the mill? 8 A. Right. Like the RG circuit would be right 9 here, the dryer would be right -- would be right in the open 10 but right outside next door. Just right out of the door. 11 Q. Okay. Outside of the bag -12 A. Right. 13 Q. That would dry out the product and then the 14 product would be bagged inside the room? 15 A. Yeah. The RG. 16 Q. In both the bagging room and RG bagging room 17 were respirators required? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. And was the area around the dryer enclosed at 20 all? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Okay. When you got to Union Carbide, do you 23 recall what the respirators that were being used looked 24 like? 25 A. I think they were white. They were just ones Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 24 1 you put on and then shape it, you know, to your nose and 2 your mouth. 3 Q. Okay. Were they disposable? 4 A. They were disposable. 5 Q. The entire thing or just the filter? 6 A. Yeah, they were disposable. 7 Q. Okay. Do you recall there ever being 8 different types of respirators that were used in the bagging 9 area? 10 A. I just remember those when we first started. 11 Q. Do you ever recall using -- having respirators 12 used in the bag area where there was air supplied into the 13 respirator? 14 A. No. They showed us that but nobody ever -15 nothing ever became of it. 16 Q. Were you ever given training on the use of 17 respirators? 18 A. How to put them on, yes. 19 Q. Were you given that training when you first 20 arrived at Union Carbide? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. And who gave you that training? 23 A. Daryl Garcia. 24 Q. Were you ever shown any videos about 25 respirator use? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 25 1 A. I can't remember that. I know a lot of safety 2 about forklifts and lock out procedures and all these 3 things . I just can't remember about the respirators. 4 Q. When you arrived at Union Carbide were the 5 bagging rooms in separate areas? Were they walled off from 6 the main mill? 7 A. They weren't walled off. 8 Q. Okay. How -- were they separated at all? 9 A. Are you talking about the -- both bagging 10 rooms? 11 Q. The bagging rooms. Were they separate from 12 the main mill? 13 A. Okay. Yeah, the RG circuit was separated from 14 the other. 15 Q. The RG bagging room or RG -16 A. Okay. They had the main bagging room and then 17 the RG bagging room was in a different area. 18 Q. Was the main bagging room sealed off from the 19 mill? 20 A. Well sealed off. The only thing that was 21 separating that was just plastic -- just -- just plastic ! 22 that's all there was. 23 Q. Were there any hard walls? 24 A. Yeah, there was hard walls. 25 Q. And what -- where was the plastic? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 26 1 A. The plastic -- in the main entry when you go 2 in. 3 Q. So there were hard walls and the plastic, and 4 plastic sheathing for a door? 5 A. Well, the sheathings is around there, you 6 know. It wasn't hard wood because asbestos when it came out 7 when we washed down it would go to the other circuits 8 because you know, the -- I don't know what kind of metal 9 that is. It's sort of like sheet metal. It separates every 10 circuit. So when we washed down it would go underneath 11 because they had gaps in there. So it would go in the other 12 rooms, other circuits that were outside. And then that was 13 the entryway. The only thing they had was plastic, rubber 14 strips so the forklift could go in and out. But I can't 15 remember the first -- when I first started working there, I 16 think it was open at that time. 17 Q. So the -- when it was -- when it was sealed 18 off it was through metal, like sheet metal and then there 19 was plastic at the entryway? 20 A. Yeah. Entryway, and then we had another 21 entryway on the other side. But usually that was, you know, 22 when it was hot, that door was left open all the time for 23 the shipping to go in and out to get the pallets. 24 Q. Were there certain times when the bagging room 25 would be dustier than other times? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 A. Yes. Page 27 2 Q. When would it be dustier? 3 A. When we were doing certain products. 4 Q. Which products? 5 A. RG-144, Super-Vis. I can't remember some of 6 the -- HBO. HBO export. And I can't remember some of the 7 other products. Some product called T. That's all I can 8 remember. 9 Q. That would be less dusty when they were using 10 the pelletized product? 11 A. Yeah. It would still be dusty because the 12 bags break. 13 Q. Do you recall ever seeing doctors at the 14 request of Union Carbide during the time you worked there? 15 A. Company physicals. 16 Q. And when was the first time you went for a 17 company physical? 18 A. Can't remember. I just can't remember. 19 Q. Do you recall whether -- whether it was around 20 the time you joined the company? 21 A. I think we got a physical just to check our 22 condition before we went to work, if we were healthy enough 23 to go to work. 24 Q. Do you recall that you had a chest x-ray 25 taken? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 MR. FERNANDEZ: That first time? Page 28 2 MR. DUBIN: Yes. 3 THE WITNESS: I don't think so. 4 MR. DUBIN: Q. Do you recall ever having chest 5 x-rays taken as part of the company physicals? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Do you recall what frequency that you would 8 have those taken? 9 A. I can't remember when that started. I think 10 for the young guys it was every two or three years. It 11 might have been longer, I can't remember. And then the 12 older ones I think it might have been every year. 13 Q. And do you recall ever breathing into a tube, 14 taking a breathing test as part of the company physical? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. When is the first time you recall having that 17 done? 18 A. I can't recall. 19 Q. What doctors did you see as part of the -- of 20 that program, if you can recall? 21 A. Dr. Hostetter. I can't remember his name. 22 Dr. Kumar, I think. And then Dr. Tongsin. Did I say 23 Hostetter? 24 Q. Yes. 25 A. I can't remember the other ones. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 29 1 Q. Were any of the doctors that you saw that you 2 liked better than others? 3 A. No. 4 Q. During the time when you worked at Union 5 Carbide and KCAC, did you ever have a personal physician 6 other than the doctors you saw as part of the company 7 program? 8 A. Just a family doctor. 9 Q. And who was that? 10 A. Miranda. Frederick Miranda. 11 Q. Frederick did you say? 12 A. Yeah. 13 Q. Where is he based? 14 A. He was based here in King City. He is in 15 Salinas now. 16 Q. Have you ever had any major health problems 17 that you know of? 18 A. Well when I went to see -- my last visit the 19 company doctor thought I had a heart condition. 20 Q. Did he explain what kind of a heart condition? 21 A. Didn't pass the stress test so he thought I 22 might have a heart condition. 23 Q. Did he tell you that you have high cholesterol 24 or anything like that? 25 A. No. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 30 1 Q. Have you ever seen your own doctor for your 2 heart condition? 3 A. I think I went to him to just see, and then -4 but I don't think it was a heart condition. I think it was 5 something else . It was Tongsin that I -- that I talked to 6 and he recommended that I go see a doctor, Dr. Lee in 7 Salinas. 8 Q. Dr. Lee? 9 A. Yeah. And I had a where they shoot that dye 10 in your veins to check and see if there was any -- anything 11 clogged up or anything. 12 Q. Looking for clogged arteries? 13 A. Yeah. 14 Q. Dr. Tongsin recommended you to Dr. Lee? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Did they take any additional chest x-rays or 17 anything like that at the time? 18 A. Just normal x-rays. 19 Q. But did Dr. Lee take additional chest x-rays 20 down in Salinas? 21 A. Yes, I think he did take some x-rays down 22 there. 23 Q. Okay. Did they give you any other tests? Did 24 you go through a tube, did they take any scans of you? 25 A. You know, I can't remember. I think I had Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 31 1 that done here in King City. I think Tongsin had me do 2 that, go through that. 3 Q. Was that at Mee Memorial Hospital? 4 A. Yeah, I think it was at Mee Memorial. 5 Q. Okay. And did they tell you you had any 6 problems based on the scans or x-rays or anything like that? 7 A. They -- they didn't say anything to me. 8 Whatever information, they gave it to the doctor. They just 9 said my heart looked good. That's the only thing that they 10 said. 11 Q. To your knowledge, do you have any health 12 problems currently as a result of exposure to asbestos? 13 A. No. As far as I know. 14 Q. What information were you given, if any, about 15 the potential health risks of asbestos when you worked at 16 Union Carbide and KCAC? 17 A. When we went into Daryl Garcia, he was our 18 safety engineer, when we first -- I was first employed he 19 mentioned about that. 20 Q. What did he tell you? 21 A. That they were working with short fibers and 22 we didn't have nothing to worry about. The most dangerous 23 stuff was the long fibers. 24 Q. Okay. Did he say the most dangerous stuff was 25 the long fibers? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 32 1 A. That the dangerous stuff was long fibers. 2 Q. Did he tell you there was absolutely no danger 3 from short fibers? 4 A. No. 5 Q. I'm sorry? 6 A. No. He said that nobody ever had any health 7 conditions; that short fiber was fine. You know. 8 Q. Okay. Did he tell you that even if he 9 believed that, that you should take precautions to prevent 10 exposure, overexposure to dust? 11 A. In the dusty areas. 12 Q. He told you you should wear respirators? 13 A. It was mandatory because they had the signs 14 there . 15 Q. Were the signs about respirator use? 16 A. In the main bagging rooms. 17 Q. Were there other signs about -- about avoiding 18 overexposure to dust or keeping the place clean? 19 A. Can you say that again? 20 Q. Were there any other signs about asbestos, you 21 know, any warning signs, any signs about housekeeping? 22 A. Yeah. There were signs about housekeeping. 23 Q. Okay. And what were those -- what did those 24 signs say? 25 A. Just keep -- like the lunch area, keep the Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 area clean. Page 33 2 Q. Did they eventually make it a separate lunch 3 area so you would have lunch area away from the asbestos 4 operations? 5 A. When it was Union Carbide we used to have our 6 lunch area inside the mill. 7 Q. Okay. At some point did they make a separate 8 lunch area? 9 A. And then they made a separate lunch area. 10 Q. Do you recall when that was? 11 A. I can't remember when that was. Right after 12 KCAC I think it was. 13 Q. Were you ever given any written materials 14 about asbestos or asbestos health risks? 15 A. I can't remember that. I wouldn't remember 16 getting anything about that. Just usually it was about 17 forklift training, you know, lock out procedures and all 18 this stuff. 19 Q. Do you remember Mr. Larrison? Mr. Larrison? 20 A. I remember him. I just can't -- he was one of 21 the guys there I think. 22 Q. Do you ever recall getting a memo from 23 Mr. Larrison about the need to be careful about asbestos 24 health risks in the mill? 25 A. No. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 34 1 Q. Do you remember at some point that smoking was 2 banned in the King City facility? 3 A. Yes. I don't know how it was in Union 4 Carbide. I think they were allowed to smoke at that time 5 when it first opened. And then they were allowed to smoke, 6 because I was a smoker at the time and we were allowed to 7 smoke outside the fence.But then they changed that, that 8 after awhile because it was -- we had that half hour for 9 lunch or hour for lunch, I can't remember what. So they 10 allowed us to go out and smoke. And then they changed that 11 after, you know, for years, and then we after awhile, after 12 a few years then they said, you know, if we wanted to get 13 off earlier. So they stopped us from -- instead of that 14 half hour or hour we used to have for lunch and they didn't 15 pay for it. Now we are getting off earlier but the -- you 16 know, we couldn't have smoke breaks because it was company 17 time. Because we weren't having that hour anymore. So we 18 couldn't go out and have any smokes, any of the smokers. 19 But the bosses could but we couldn't. The bosses even to 20 the last day they were still going out the fence to smoke, 21 but nobody else could. 22 Q. Did they explain to you why they were banning 23 smoking at the mill? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Do you ever recall getting information about Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 35 1 potential health hazards from the combination of smoking and 2 asbestos? 3 A. No. 4 Q. Do you ever recall having a doctor, 5 Dr. Sokomoto, come to the facility and talk about why -- you 6 know -- strike that. 7 Do you recall that as part of the medical 8 monitoring program part of what you needed to do was 9 sometimes spit in a cup and they would test that and see if 10 there were any abnormal cells? 11 A. I remember they did that but then they 12 stopped. 13 Q. Okay. Do you recall the doctor who was 14 running that program ever coming and talking to the workers 15 at King City? 16 A. No, I can't remember that. 17 Q. Do you ever recall people encouraging people 18 not to smoke because of the potential health risks it 19 imposed along with the asbestos? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Going back for a second to what would happen 22 when government regulators came on the facility. You said 23 one of the things that would change was what product was 24 being made? 25 A. Uh-huh. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 36 1 Q. Would that affect the dust anywhere other than 2 the bagging room? 3 A. It would affect everywhere. 4 Q. Why is that? 5 A. Because like I said, on the dryers, they would 6 be leaking so there would be dust. So -- and then there 7 is -- if we did any cleaning because there is always buildup 8 everywhere because of dust, so you would have dust on 9 equipment, you know, or all over the place. You know, it 10 would just be on the equipment. So we wouldn't -- we would 11 avoid creating dust, you know, just anything to stop from - 12 stop from making it dusty. 13 Q. Why would changing the product affect the dust 14 around the dryer? 15 A. Just the leaks. Just the leaks the dryers 16 have. 17 Q. Well all of the asbestos that went into the 18 dryer would be wet anyway, right? 19 A. It wouldn't be wet. It would be going in 20 there wet but it would come out on the other end dry. It 21 went in there -- because I would make the product and then 22 mix it with acid and silicate when I was working the RG wet 23 in, so when it got mixed in there then it would go into some 24 presses and you would make some cake there. But once that 25 cake -- you know, once you clean those presses, it still Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 37 1 it's like a cake, so you would smear it on the handles, 2 smear it all over the place. And sometimes you would have 3 press leaks, it would be too much pressure and then all of a 4 sudden they would blow up. So there would be a buildup of 5 asbestos on the ceilings, on the walls, even -- and you 6 couldn't wash everything down because then you would 7 short-circuit all kinds of equipment. So you would have to 8 go and clean it by hand. But there was always a buildup on 9 all the ceilings. 10 Q. Just trying to understand, when the -- when -11 for instance, when they were making a pelletized product 12 would it already be pelletized and dry when it went into the 13 dryer? 14 A. No. 15 Q. So basically they had the same asbestos, no 16 matter what products you were making? 17 A. Right. 18 Q. And the same amount of asbestos would 19 presumably leak out or not leak out no matter what you were 20 making? 21 A. Right. 22 Q. In your opinion was it possible to keep any 23 dust out of the King City mill? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Did you have a sense that people were trying Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 38 1 to do things to reduce the amount of dust that was there? 2 A. Well, they changed things around. Like I 3 said, they added some mist, but we hardly used them. I 4 think they caused problems with the equipment or something 5 so they stopped that, using the mists. 6 Q. Were there supervisors that you liked or 7 trusted more than others? 8 A. I got along with all of them. You know, I had 9 problems with one, yes, at one time. And that was it. Just 10 because of my smoking. 11 Q. Are there people that you had particularly 12 good memories about being honest or trustworthy people who 13 you worked with? 14 A. I didn't trust anybody that was salaried. I 15 got along with them. Some of them were friends of mine but 16 I just... 17 Q. Did you know John Myers? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. What's your opinion of John Myers? 20 A. As a friend? He's a good guy. At work, 21 that's a different story. My wife gets -- like I say, my 22 wife, she is a good friend of theirs. She works at a 23 restaurant and John Myers' wife hugs her all the time. I 24 invited him to my 25th anniversary instead of the company 25 party. He thought it was boring so he went to our party. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 39 1 Q. You said that somebody had indicated to you 2 that because the asbestos was short fiber it was safe; is 3 that correct? 4 A. Right. 5 Q. That was Daryl Garcia? 6 A. Daryl Garcia. All the way to the end. 7 Q. Is there anybody else that you remember 8 telling you that? 9 A. Ray Groggen. 10 Q. When was that? 11 A. I can't remember that. John Myers. Ed 12 Kleber. 13 Q. When do you recall John Myers telling you 14 that? 15 A. That was years ago. That was years ago. I 16 can't remember when it was. 17 Q. These people who were telling you that they 18 thought the short fiber asbestos was safe, would they also 19 go in areas of the plant or mill where there was dust? 20 A. Yes. They would wear the respirators in the 21 main bagging rooms. 22 Q. What about other areas where there was dust, 23 would they go in those areas? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. And those times were they not wearing Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 respirators? 2 A. No. Page 40 3 Q. Did some of them have kids who they had also 4 working in the mill? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Was it your impression that they believed what 7 they were telling you about the fact that short fiber 8 asbestos wasn't going to hurt you? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. During the time when you worked at -- just 11 Union Carbide. Let's talk about 1974 to 1985. Did you ever 12 see any information about asbestos on the news or TV or 13 anything like that? 14 A. I know they brought out something about the 15 school when they found asbestos outside the school. 16 Q. When did that occur? 17 A. I think it was sometime in the last couple of 18 years I think. But I'm not really sure. The precautions 19 the company took was they stopped hauling product at that 20 time. They didn't want the trucks coming over there so they 21 wouldn't be looking like it was their asbestos. 22 Q. Okay. That was KCAC? 23 A. That was KCAC. 24 Q. And the asbestos in the schools, that was 25 insulation material? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 41 1 A. I don't know what it was. I know they made a 2 big deal about it. 3 Q. Okay. Do you have an understanding that the 4 asbestos that was milled at King City wasn't used in the 5 insulation materials? 6 A. No. I really never knew what they were making 7 out of it. 8 Q. Okay. You don't know what types of products 9 were used in - were made with Union Carbide asbestos? 10 A. All I know is some kind of -- they showed us 11 some kind of material, something for walls or something like 12 that. That's all. 13 Q. And you understood that Union Carbide sold 14 raw -- sold basically raw asbestos, just the stuff that you 15 put in the bags, is that -16 A. Yes. 17 Q. And Union Carbide would sell that to other 18 companies that would make asbestos products? 19 A. Right. 20 Q. You know that Kelly-Moore was a company that 21 used asbestos in part from Union Carbide? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Let me ask you, what do you know about the 24 health of other people who worked in the facility? Is there 25 anybody who you believe has a condition that may have been Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 42 1 caused by exposure to asbestos? 2 A. Okay. I know some people that have died of 3 cancer. And I've known -- I know some guys, people, 4 co-workers that have had some scarring in their lungs. I 5 just talked to one employee just Sunday, Ed Sinclair, and I 6 just mentioned to him and he said that he went for a 7 physical and they found a lot of scarring in his lungs . And 8 doctor asked him if he worked with asbestos. 9 Q. Well let's take these in turn. First the 10 people who died of cancer. Are you aware of a cancer called 11 mesothelioma? Have you ever heard of that before? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Have you ever heard of anybody who you worked 14 with at Union Carbide or KCAC getting a cancer called 15 mesothelioma? 16 A. I don't know if that was the cancer that 17 somebody mentioned. That employee passed away -- I don't 18 know if he passed away by that but that he had some -19 something like that. That was Paul Whitlock. 20 Q. Okay. Is it your understanding that 21 Mr. Whitlock died from cancer? 22 A. Heart disease. I thought it was heart 23 disease. 24 Q. Did you know that he died shortly after having 25 one of multiple heart surgeries? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 43 1 MR. HAINES: Object to the form of the question. 2 THE WITNESS: I can't remember. 3 MR. DUBIN: Q. Okay. What sorts of cancer do you 4 know of people having died from it? Who do you know who has 5 died from cancer? 6 A. As far as the company told us it was lung 7 cancer, they said it was -- I think it was Jim Stanford. 8 But they told us it was his smoking, lung cancer. 9 Q. You were aware that he was a heavy smoker? 10 A. He was a smoker, yeah. 11 Q. And you understand that smoking can cause lung 12 cancer, right ? 13 A. Yeah. 14 Q. Are there other -- and do you know anybody who 15 has ever gotten lung cancer that didn't work at the asbestos 16 mill or mine? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Are you aware that it occurs in people who are 19 not exposed to asbestos at all, lung cancer? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Any other types of cancer, anybody else that 22 you think has died of cancer? 23 A. There was Fred Olivos. 24 Q. Do you know what type of cancer he died of? 25 A. I have no idea. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 44 1 Q. Do you know whether he was a smoker? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Was he a smoker? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Let's talk about the lung scarring. How did 6 you talk to - - end up talking to Mr. Sinclair? 7 A. Somebody told me about him and I wanted to 8 talk to him. He was a co-worker of ours. 9 Q. Who told you about him? 10 A. George Larson. 11 Q. What did he tell you about him? 12 A. He just said you ought to talk to Jim Sinclair 13 because I talked to him awhile back and he said something 14 about a physical, that he went to doctors and mentioned 15 something about a lot of scarring in his lungs. 16 Q. Do you know where he lives currently? 17 A. San Ardo. 18 Q. Did you meet with him or spoke to him on the 19 phone? 20 A. I saw him in Paso Robles doing some Christmas 21 shopping . He just walked out and I haven't seen him for 22 years. 23 Q. So it was a coincidental event? 24 A. Right. 25 Q. And obviously you don't know what his medical Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 condition is or isn't? Page 45 2 A. No, just what he told me. 3 Q. And you don't know about any reviews of his 4 chest x-rays that have been done in the past either by -- 5 A. No. 6 Q. -- doctors who are affiliated with Union 7 Carbide or other doctors? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Anybody else who you believe has lung 10 scarring? 11 A. George Navarro. 12 Q. What do you know about that? 13 A. Just that he -- he had his physical done -- he 14 did his company physical and the company doctor mentioned 15 that they saw a spot on his lungs. So he recommended him to 16 go see a heart specialist -- I mean a lung specialist. So 17 he went over there and got an MRI and he thought that 18 nothing was wrong with him. And I said well, what did it 19 say? And he said well, I'll show you the thing. So he 20 showed it and I saw scarring and plaque. And I said I think 21 that's some kind of condition of -- some kind of asbestos 22 condition. And I know the company -- I mean, the company 23 got -- I hate to say the word but pissed off because they 24 mentioned -- the doctor mentioned him to go check an expert 25 on lung disease. Daryl Garcia. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 46 1 Q. Right. 2 And do you have a copy of that report? 3 MR. FERNANDEZ: Do you have a copy? Yes or no. 4 THE WITNESS: No, I don't have one. 5 MR. DUBIN: Q. Did you give a copy of it to 6 anybody else? 7 A. No. 8 Q. And have you been contacting other employees 9 who used to work at the King City mill and mine about their 10 experiences there to discuss issues about the working 11 conditions? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Okay. Who have you contacted? 14 A. Petra. What's her name now. I can't remember 15 her name right now. 16 Q. Formerly Petra Averly? 17 A. Yeah. Petra Averly. She is the one that got 18 me in contact with -- okay. There was another one, Gabriele 19 Acosta. She got -- she got me in contact with him because I 20 needed -- I wanted to talk to him because he had cancer, 21 some form of cancer. And so she contacted me and then we 22 got concerned after we talked to him about Union Carbide and 23 KCAC. 24 Q. Okay. Who else have you talked to? 25 A. I talked to Dolores Hernandez. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 47 1 Q Who else? 2 A James Flores. 3 Q. Why did you contact Ms. Hernandez? 4 A. Hernandez? 5 Q. Yes. 6 A. For the same concerns that I had about the 7 health -- health wise, that we needed to get some type of 8 protection and it was up to them if they wanted to or not. 9 If they wanted to seek legal advice. 10 Q. Why her specifically? 11 A. Not just her. 12 Q. Okay. Was there any particular reason that 13 you called her and -14 A. No. 15 Q. And James Flores. 16 A. Right. And his brother. 17 Q. What's his brother's name? 18 A. Named after his dad. I forgot about him too. 19 He died of some form of cancer -- I am not sure but I think 20 it was cancer. 21 Q. His brother's name is Isabel? 22 A. Isabel. 23 Q. Who else? 24 A. David Aquitas. 25 Q. Okay. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 A. John Gordino. Page 48 2 Q. Okay. 3 A. Trini Cruz. 4 Q. Anybody else? 5 A. Louie Flores. 6 Q. No relationship with James and Isabel? 7 A. No. It wasn't Louie Flores. It was Louie 8 Torres. Not Flores. Jimmy Vasquez. Then -- well okay, 9 some of us we already talked. Some of the other employees, 10 like Ernie and me, George, Roy Rodriguez, we talked about 11 this. 12 Q. Right. 13 A. So we're sort of like a group there. Who 14 else. I talked to Pedro. I didn't talk to Pedro. That's 15 John Gordino's brother also. John Gordino. And I talked to 16 George Larson. Like I said, Ed Sinclair. Who else was 17 there. Manual Zigobia. Let me see who else there was. I 18 think that's it. 19 Q. What period of time have you had these 20 conversations? 21 A. Through the months. 22 Q. Last couple months? 23 A. Weeks. Yeah. 24 Q. Have you given these people the name of your 25 lawyer? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 49 1 A. Yeah. They wanted to talk to him. It was - 2 I left them the option if they wanted to talk to him. If 3 they didn't want to. 4 Q. Mr. Fernandez? 5 A. Yes. 6 MR. DUBIN: I think we are pretty much done. Let's 7 take a five-minute break. 8 (Recess held.) 9 MR. DUBIN: Q. You talked to a variety of people. 10 Is there anything that stands out in your mind of a specific 11 thing that any of them told you? 12 MR. FERNANDEZ: You talking about co-workers? 13 MR. DUBIN: Right, the co-workers over the last 14 month or so. 15 THE WITNESS: You know, I really didn't get into 16 it. I just asked them, you know, the -- there was a group 17 of us that were protecting ourselves and our families. If 18 they wanted to be involved in it. 19 MR. DUBIN: Q. And of the people that you recall 20 speaking to, how many of them do you recall indicating yeah, 21 they did want to be involved in it? 22 A. All of them. Not all of them. There was some 23 that were thinking about it. 24 Q. And which ones were those? 25 A. George Larson, Pedro Gordino, Jim Plaskett, Ed Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 50 1 Sinclair. A lot of them didn't want to say much. 2 They -- they feel loyalty to the company I guess, for some 3 reason. 4 Q. How long did you smoke for? 5 A. I smoked probably for close to 20 years. 6 Q. When did you start and stop? 7 A. You know what, I shouldn't say 20 years. More 8 like about 15 years. I stopped -- God, it's been over ten 9 years. 10 Q. And when you smoked how much did you smoke? 11 A. Not even a pack a day. Probably just about a 12 half a pack. 13 Q. What brand? 14 A. Marlboro. 15 Q. Reds? 16 A. Yes. 17 MR. DUBIN: Okay. I think that's all I have for 18 you. 19 20 EXAMINATION BY MR. HAINES 21 MR. HAINES: Q. I didn't have a chance to 22 introduce myself before the deposition. I am Patrick 23 Haines, I represent Kelly-Moore in this case. I will have a 24 few questions for you. 25 I want to focus if I can, sir, on the time frame Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 51 1 while you worked for Union Carbide from 1977 to 1985. Okay? 2 A. Uh-huh. 3 Q. You said a little bit ago that John Myers was 4 different at work or he's a different story about what he 5 was like at work. What did you mean by that? 6 A. Because sometimes when we'd have a complaint 7 or something about work-related about the dust or something, 8 some of the bosses they normally usually said, you know, if 9 you don't like what's going on, there is the gate. It works 10 both ways. So that kind of gave me a hint to keep my mouth 11 shut. So we got the hint not to say very much. 12 Q. Were you really encouraged to make complaints 13 about the levels of dust? 14 A. Made a complaint one time when -- a few times 15 when we were -- I was working at the RG wet in because we 16 had to eat our lunch there and we were working around there, 17 there would be dust flying all over the place and you could 18 see particles all over. And we started complaining about 19 that. So we still worked like that without no respirators, 20 it's just that they changed -- they allowed us to go there 21 and eat in the lunch room. But that was almost the same 22 because we used to go in there with our coveralls anyway 23 with our powder. So basically about the same where we ate 24 anyway. 25 Q. What would you say from working out there all Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 those years were the areas what you thought were the Page 52 2 heaviest exposure to asbestos? 3 A. There was dust everywhere but the heaviest 4 concentration was the main bagging rooms. The RG bagging 5 room, plus the main bagging room. 6 Q. And that's where you are actually filling the 7 sacks full of the asbestos product? 8 A. Right. 9 Q. And you did that job yourself, didn't you? 10 A. I started there and off and on when somebody 11 went on vacation or somebody was sick, I would work also 12 there. 13 Q. Okay. 14 A. Since I worked in almost all the circuits. 15 Q. Sir, how old are you today? 16 A. Fifty-one. 17 Q. Okay. Has anyone ever explained to you that 18 asbestos disease is what they call latent diseases, they 19 take a long time to occur from the time they are exposed? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Did anyone from Union Carbide ever explain to 22 you the different types of diseases that asbestos might 23 cause in a person? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Earlier today you were testifying that you Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 53 1 said that if you were wearing a personal monitor and there 2 were some high tests you would be instructed to move to a 3 different area. What did you mean, sir? 4 A. One time a co-worker and I, Manuel Gudia, had 5 a high count and he was working in the RG wet in. And when 6 that -- when that MSHA guy came he mentioned that there was 7 a high count so he wanted to retest it again. So instead of 8 me working in the RG circuit I went to a different circuit 9 because he was on vacation and I took over for him. So I 10 had to move in a different area that had less -- less of a 11 dust count. Not as much exposure to it. 12 Q. Who would give you the instructions when MSHA 13 or OSHA came to the plant to do your job differently than 14 you did when they weren't in the plant? 15 MR. DUBIN: Objection, form. 16 You can respond. 17 MR. HAINES: Q. You can answer. 18 A. Usually my shifter. After Daryl Garcia told 19 them or whoever was above him 20 Q. And your shifter would be your shift 21 supervisor? 22 A. Yeah, my shift supervisor. And sometimes 23 they'll personally come and tell us. Daryl Garcia or Ray 24 Groggen or one of them. 25 Q. Okay. You said earlier that you were shown a Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 54 1 respirator that has some type of air line hoses going into 2 it but it was never used. What was your understanding of 3 why it was never used? 4 A. I have no idea. I thought it was for 5 enclosures, you know, like some bins when we had to clean 6 them out or something like that. I thought it was for that. 7 Or in the bagging room. But never -- anything -- nothing 8 ever became of it. I remember seeing it but through the 9 years I have never seen anybody use it. 10 Q. The masks that you were provided when you 11 first started working with the company, were they just like 12 a paper kind of a dust mask? 13 A. Right. 14 MR. DUBIN: Objection, form. 15 MR. HAINES: Q. Did the mask you used when you 16 first started with the company have a -- one rubber band? 17 A. Yeah. 18 Q. Hung over your face like a filter like paper? 19 20 21 away? A. Yes. Q. It was disposable, meant to be used and thrown 22 A. Yes. But usually we didn't -- we used it a 23 lot more often. We didn't just use it one day and throw it 24 away. We wore it for awhile. 25 Q. Did the company encourage you to wear it more Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 than one day? Page 55 2 MR. DUBIN: Objection to form. 3 THE WITNESS: No. 4 MR. HAINES: Q. How come you used it that way? 5 A. Trying to save the company money I guess. 6 Q. Being a good employee? 7 A. Yeah, just try to keep it clean. You couldn't 8 keep it clean but if I wasn't working too much of a dusty 9 area, I would just have it sitting around there. 10 Q. And I think you said that the -- did the 11 company provide you with some type of coveralls? 12 A. Coveralls -- I -- to me the coveralls were so 13 paper thin that even when some areas where we used to go in, 14 once you dust it off like that, forget it. It would be 15 right through your pants. It would go right through your 16 pants. And when you went home you could see the white on 17 your Levis. 18 Q. Did you wear street clothes underneath the 19 coveralls while you were working? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. And you wore those clothes home? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Could you sometimes see there was asbestos on 24 the street clothes that you were going home with? 25 A. Well, I was the type that I always wanted to Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 56 1 keep myself clean. I didn't want -- you know, because you'd 2 see dust all over you so, of course, you would try to, you 3 know, not try to take some of that home. But you would 4 always take it home. 5 Q. You couldn't help it? 6 A. Yeah, you couldn't help it. You would have it 7 in your hair, you would -- especially if a bag busted on 8 you, you would have it packed in your ears or anywhere. The 9 respirator wouldn't help. Because that's -- that's -- once 10 those bags blew up, that pressure, that comingup to you and 11 hitting you in the face, isn't something nice. So you know, 12 you would be -- you could almost taste that stuff. 13 Q. Did you ever see lawyers come out to the plant 14 and go through files or clean out -- throw away documents? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Okay. 17 A. Personallythrowaway documents. I don't 18 know. I used to see them in the trash bin and Daryl Garcia 19 and some of the office people but I don't know what they 20 were throwing. 21 Q. Did they -- did you ever have an understanding 22 of what those folks were doing at the plant? 23 A. They said something about -- that was when we 24 found out that KCAC was going to shut down. I think 25 something about lawsuits or something. Union Carbide Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 lawsuits. That's what my understanding was. Page 57 2 Q. And you were -- they were seen going toward 3 the dumpsters with stuff? 4 A. Those paralegals. I -- because there was a 5 trailer out there and that's where they kept all the papers. 6 And there was a trash bin right in front. I know that they 7 would be taking the papers down to the office and from there 8 I would see people throwing stuff in the trash. But we 9 couldn't get near there because they kept an eye on 10 everybody. 11 Q. Sure. 12 Sir , I've got some photographs here that I'd like 13 to show you. I'm going to just kind of show them to you one 14 by one. And if you could tell me if you recognize what's in 15 the picture, tell me, if you don't, tell me you don't . 16 MR. HAINES: This first photograph I'm going to 17 mark as number 1. 18 (Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit 1, as 19 described in the index, was marked for 20 identification.) 21 MR. HAINES: Q. Can you tell me who this handsome 22 gentleman is ? 23 A. That's me. 24 Q. Is that a picture of you in the coveralls that 25 you werei describing earlier? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 A. Yes. Page 58 2 Q. And as I think the picture indicates these are 3 actually short-sleeved coveralls where you can see your arms 4 are bare. 5 A. Right. 6 Q. And it has a little dust here and there. Is 7 that what your uniform would look like at the end of a 8 workday usually? 9 A. Most of the time, and a lot worse than that. 10 It depended where we were at. 11 Q. This respirator that you are wearing here that 12 has the canister on each side, is that the type of 13 respirator that you were given in the later years? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. That's not what you wore when you first 16 started working? 17 A. No. 18 (Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit 2, as 19 described in the index, was marked for 20 identification.) 21 MR . HAINES: Q. Photograph number 2, is this 22 basically the backside of you? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Okay. What time frame are we looking at as 25 far as this -- is this what you wore for a number of years? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 59 1 A. Yeah. We wore those coveralls till, you 2 know -- some of them sometimes would have tears in them. So 3 the only time that we would get new ones is if it is really, 4 really torn apart. 5 Q. Okay. 6 A. Because we used to dry them. Wash them and 7 dry them at work if we didn't have enough. And sometimes 8 they would shrink. So -- well even when they took them down 9 to the cleaners they would shrink and they would be so -10 this off your feet. So that was right after MSHA, the 11 next -- the following day that's how we would have looked, 12 probably a lot worse if -- if we were doing this when MSHA 13 came. That' s the -- that's kind of how I would have looked 14 if they took an air sample but they didn't. That's when we 15 stopped doing that. 16 Q. Did you actually have washers and dryers there 17 at the plant you could clean clothes in? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. And the employees washed their own clothes? 20 A. If we were short on coveralls, if they didn't 21 bring enough coveralls for us. 22 (Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit 3, as 23 described in the index, was marked for 24 identification.) 25 MR. HAINES: Q. Tell me if you can, you see here Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 60 1 in picture number 3. What is that? 2 A. That's the RG wet in dryer. 3 Q. Is that the area that you actually worked in 4 at times? 5 A. Yes. When we had -- if it got plugged up we'd 6 have to go in there and unplug it. 7 Q. What are these little chunks? 8 A. Pellets. 9 Q. Okay. That's the actual pellets being formed? 10 A. Right. 11 Q. And this is the dryer, the metal part here? 12 A. Right. 13 Q. Did you testify earlier something about dryers 14 having holes in them? 15 A. Yeah. Okay. Right where they are standing -16 well, right here. 17 Q. Uh-huh. 18 A. Okay. There is a screw that will get this 19 feed in there and sometimes it will plug up. But there is a 20 seal right supposed to be around here, this ring here. And 21 lot of times it was worn out. So what you see right here, 22 some of this dust, it would be going in there. That's where 23 I said at the end of the enclosure -- at the start of the 24 enclosure you 'll have a lot of wet -- lot of cake, sometimes 25 it will plug up and it will spill over. But some of them -- Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 61 1 the screens had little holes like this. But sometimes it 2 will leak on the sides. So on the front of the enclosure 3 there would be like cake. So that would be there till 4 weeks, sometimes months, till they decided to clean them. 5 And then the other side of the dryer, on this end where the 6 seals are, there would be leaks around there. And then 7 that's where I was telling you there was really fine powder. 8 Sometimes it would be up to about five feet high and we 9 would have to be in there. But as soon as you use the water 10 hose, I mean that stuff would like fluff. It would just 11 shoot all over the place. Just like a couple times the dust 12 collectors blew up on us and it just filled up the whole 13 parking lot. 14 Q. How did the dust collectors end up blowing up? 15 A. Just dust -- either dust leak, if there is a 16 dust leak on one of the socks, it just throw dust all over. 17 And one time an employee thought the -- that was when we 18 were shutting down and the -- we were shutting down, turn on 19 all the equipment when we shut down and one of the 20 co-workers thought there was socks in the dust collector and 21 there wasn't. And as soon as he started that mill up and 22 the fans got that, I mean, it just -- just like it looked 23 right there, all that dirt. That's how it looked. They 24 were washing cars all day and we were with our water hoses 25 all over the place, washing every inch of that place. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 62 1 Q. Because without the socks it just basically is 2 a giant fan? 3 A. Right. There is nothing there. It goes right 4 out the fans, so... 5 (Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit 4, as 6 described in the index, was marked for 7 identification.) 8 MR. HAINES: Q. Okay. Number 4 here we have a 9 front end loader with a load of something. What is that 10 stuff in the front end loader? 11 A. That is -- that could be cake from one of the 12 dryers. That 's what it looks like to me. 13 Q. Okay. 14 A. Or it could have been from some spill that 15 they were cleaning up. 16 Q. Did y'all have to clean up the plant 17 yourselves as the employees? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. And did y'all sometimes have to sweep it up, 20 dry sweep it and -21 A. Yes. 22 (Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit 5, as 23 described in the index, was marked for 24 identification.) 25 MR. HAINES: Q. Tell me what we see here in Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 picture number 5, if you could. Page 63 2 A. That was John Gordino washing some of the 3 equipment we are getting ready to sell or give away. 4 Q. Would this be when the plant was shutting 5 down? 6 A. That's when it was shutting down. 7 Q. Were they pressure washing the stuff off the 8 equipment? 9 A. Pressure washing. 10 Q. After pressure washing had you been able to 11 get rid of all the asbestos that had been caked on for all 12 those years? 13 A. As you notice that was probably some of the 14 stuff that we cleaned. They kept -- to me I could tell it 15 was, you know, that was no calcium. They kept telling us - 16 Daryl Garcia even after the last, when we mentioned it to 17 him he said no, there is nothing leaving this yard because I 18 carry a pocket knife with me and I scrape it. I make sure 19 there is nothing leaving this yard with asbestos. That's 20 when it was leaving the yard. 21 Q. And Daryl Garcia, he was the gentleman that 22 had been working there since Union Carbide - 23 A. Right. As far as I know. 24 Q. Had been a Union Carbide employee? 25 A. He was my shifter at the end. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 64 1 (Whereupon, Deposition Exhibit 6, as 2 described in the index, was marked for 3 identification.) 4 MR. HAINES: Q. And picture 6, is that more of the 5 equipment that was being sold that y'all had tried to clean? 6 A. That is the cleaning product. 7 Q. The bottom picture. 8 A. This is also. I think we hadn't washed this 9 because to me it looks like almost if we was. But this was 10 equipment that we did. I think this might have been when we 11 were getting ready to clean. But they took some loads like 12 this without even being cleaned. 13 Q. Who did they sell that stuff to? 14 A. Some guy named The Junk Man. They called him 15 The Junk Man. When we had that last meeting because we 16 wanted to know about when the plant was shutting down and, 17 you know, and co-worker mentioned about -- about short 18 fibers, long fibers again. And he said -- because one 19 co-worker went over there and mentioned and said, you know, 20 you better have those attorneys on retainers because sooner 21 or later it's going to come back and bite you in the ass 22 because there is a lot of stuff leaving this yard with 23 asbestos. And you can't say it's not. Then he wanted to 24 know if they had permits, where were the inspectors that 25 were supposed to go there and check what we were doing. And Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 65 1 he says well, hey, if you don't like it, you can be our 2 inspector. Then they got into it a little bit right there. 3 That was Ray Groggen and Jeff Harris. And Jeff Harris went 4 over there and told them see, this is what kind of attitude 5 we have to put up with, that kind of bullshit, when we have 6 to say something. And Ed the boss was there, that's when 7 Daryl Garcia said there is nothing leaving this yard, it is 8 all calcium. I always go in with a knife and I scrape it 9 and if there is nothing there, I don't allow it to go out. 10 That's how it looked. The only thing he said that had long 11 fibers was the -- the insulation on the acid tank. That was 12 the only thing that had long fibers. Was the insulation of 13 the acid tank I think it was, that was it. 14 Q. And from 1977 throughout your whole career you 15 were told that short fiber asbestos was perfectly safe? 16 A. Right. And then on this, like I said about 17 this Junk Man, he got mad after the meeting when they 18 brought that up. They said okay, they started bringing the 19 hazardous waste containers to throw it, but the Junk Man 20 still took -- that day they said they weren't going to allow 21 it anymore. That following day I was on vacation but a 22 co-worker told me he came in and got a load -- half a load, 23 and he got pissed off because they didn't give him the 24 aluminum. So he left mad. So he took half the load. But 25 the following Monday he came back and took a load of Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 66 1 equipment, plus I think it might have been this load here of 2 aluminum without even being washed. And that was the last 3 time we saw him. That was the last load he ever took. I 4 think we only took -- I think hazardous waste wise after 5 that was only about three or four loads I think. That was 6 it. Everything else was buried. Either buried or sold. 7 Q. And the company, did they have a landfill 8 behind the plant where they buried the asbestos tailings and 9 scrap? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. Had they done that pretty much the whole time 12 you were out there at the plant? 13 A. Not till the end. We buried product out 14 there, tills, the tills, and certain products, bags and 15 stuff. Because one time one employee -- boss, shifter left 16 out I don't know how many tons of -- over 100 tons I think 17 of asbestos outside, bagged SG -- I think SG100 and it got 18 soaked and were wet and couldn't use it anymore so they 19 dumped everything over the hill. All of it. 20 MR. HAINES: I will have a few more questions for 21 you, sir. But let me take a break for a few minutes. 22 (Recess held.) 23 MR. HAINES: Q. Just two more sections of 24 questions I want to ask you about, sir. 25 One, were there certain operations that you did in Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 67 1 the plant that you look back on and you were never wearing a 2 monitor or - - a personal monitor for asbestos during certain 3 operations? 4 A. Yeah. When we were inside the bins or dust 5 collectors. Usually when we were cleaning anything that 6 would create a lot of amount of dust. We usually would -7 we never wore those. Never. Only when we were walking 8 around when they did the samples. The air samples. 9 Q. Would management determine when you wore a 10 monitor and when you didn't wear a monitor? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And even in the later years when you had 13 respirators with those kinds of filters on each side, when 14 you weren't wearing the respirator did you kind of hang it 15 around your neck? 16 A. All the time. If we weren't wearing it, we 17 just lay -- leave it right there hanging on our chest. 18 Q. No matter what you were doing within the 19 plant? 20 A. Doesn't make any difference. We just wore 21 them. 22 MR. HAINES: That's all I have for you. Thank you. 23 MR. DUBIN: I have some follow-up. 24 /// 25 /// Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 68 1 EXAMINATION BY MR. DUBIN 2 MR. DUBIN: Q. First let me ask you about these 3 first pictures, 1 and 2, which were you. Do you recall when 4 these were taken? 5 A. I just can't remember. It was sometime either 6 this year or early last year. I think it was this year 7 though. 8 Q. So it's not when Union Carbide ran the 9 facility? 10 A. No. We were shutting down I think then. 11 Q. Why were they taken, do you know? 12 A. To protect ourselves down the road. 13 Q. Okay. Who took them? 14 A. My shifter. 15 Q. And who -16 A. David Aquitas. 17 Q. Did he give those pictures to you? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Do you know -- who did you give the pictures 20 to? 21 A. Mr. Fernandez. 22 Q. Do you know how the lawyer for Kelly-Moore got 23 the pictures ? 24 A. No. I guess from Mr. Fernandez. 25 Q. And number 3 here, when was that taken? Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 69 1 A. I can't remember. That was a few years ago. 2 I just can't remember. 3 Q. During the period of time when KCAC ran the 4 facility? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. And what is this a picture of? 7 A. That is the wet in -- I shouldn't say wet in. 8 That's -- yeah, that's RG wet in, the dryer. 9 Q. Okay. And are the individuals who are working 10 in this area wearing respirators? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And pictures 4, 5 -- what's been marked as 4, 13 5 and 6, when were these taken? 14 A. That was when we were operating. I just 15 can't -- this was. This was when we were down already. 16 Q. Are they all recently, within a year? 17 A. This was recently. I can't remember this. 18 Q. The one you can't remember is what's being 19 marked number 4? 20 A. Right. 21 Q. Five and six are both recent? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. There was some testimony about selling stuff 24 to The Junk Man. Do you recall that? 25 A. Yes. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 Q. That was KCAC selling those? 2 A. Yes. Page 70 3 Q. Was that within the last year or so? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Do you have any information that would lead 6 you to believe that Union Carbide was involved in that at 7 all? 8 A. As far as I know, no. Just what the company 9 says. To me I thought it was still union -- you know, Union 10 Carbide was in with KCAC. 11 Q. You understand Union Carbide and KCAC are 12 separate companies? 13 A. Yeah. 14 MR. HAINES: Object to the form of the question. 15 MR. DUBIN: Q. You talked about had -- you were 16 concerned because there was dust in the air and you -- when 17 you were required to eat lunch in certain areas. Do you 18 recall that? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. During the period of time you worked at Union 21 Carbide did you have concerns about asbestos dust? 22 A. Yes. During that -- during that time when we 23 were -- the RG wet in, when I used to eat lunch there. And 24 even our rock fiber, when it was more of a dry process, 25 come -- the product used to come in right there instead of Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 wet, I was concerned with eating my lunch out there. Page 71 2 Q. You indicated you took steps to avoid trying 3 to take asbestos home; is that correct? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. That was also because you had concerns about 6 asbestos dust? 7 A. Not just -- yeah, because of the buildup I had 8 on there. To me I -- I really wasn't concerned -- just 9 concerned because I -- like if I was in a dusty area, even 10 if I was outside doing my yard work I would get dust and I 11 would just dust it off. So that's the only concern I had. 12 Just that I had a large amount of, you know, dust on me. So 13 I was just dusting myself off. 14 Q. Was the reason you were concerned about eating 15 lunch near asbestos or how much asbestos you had on you was 16 because you understood that asbestos was a potential health 17 hazard? 18 A. You know, not really. I was just more 19 concerned because I could see it and they kept on saying 20 okay, there is nothing wrong with it, but I don't know, in 21 the back of my mind I was saying I don't think I want to eat 22 my lunch with particles flying all over the place. 23 Q. You are saying you were just concerned because 24 it was messy? 25 A. Yeah, just because it was messy. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 72 1 Q. You never had any understanding that it could 2 potentially cause a lung disease? 3 A. No. Not really. It's just to me I never - 4 never really crossed my mind. I never thought of things 5 like that. I was just going on what the opinion what the 6 company kept on telling me that I was fine. 7 Q. It never crossed your mind that asbestos was a 8 potential health hazard when they required you to wear a 9 respirator? 10 A. The only reason I wore a respirator was 11 because of the amount of dust and you could see, I mean, in 12 those areas, I mean, you would be coming out looking more 13 white than this cup. And I didn't feel like going in there 14 and breathing all of that. That was just too much. 15 Q. Because it would be a potential health hazard? 16 A. To me, anything would. If you swallowed as 17 much dust as that. 18 Q. Did it cross your mind that asbestos may be a 19 potential health hazard when the company made you take a 20 chest x-ray on a routine basis? 21 MR. HAINES: Object to form. 22 THE WITNESS: To me I just figured that x-rays was 23 just to see if anything was wrong with us or anything -- if 24 we had any other problems. To me I didn't even think - 25 back in my mind, I didn't even thought of things like that. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 73 1 I wasn't thinking about cancer or anything about it. I 2 didn't know hardly anything about that until I started 3 hearing about scarring and all of this other stuff. 4 Asbestosis. And then when I really got concerned was when I 5 heard about Paul Whitlock. 6 MR. DUBIN: Q. How about government inspectors, 7 the fact there was government officials coming in the 8 facility didn't suggest to you that asbestos could be a 9 potential health hazard? 10 MR. HAINES: Object to the form. 11 THE WITNESS: To me I was -- I didn't even think 12 much of it. I just -- to me it seemed like it was another 13 routine day. Only thing they were doing was taking samples. 14 To me it was just another day. Except that, you know, we 15 changed certain things. Then you started thinking why are 16 they telling us all this stuff. But we never -- I just said 17 well, it's the company. 18 MR. DUBIN:Q. Okay. So there was never 19 information, any information given to you that asbestos was 20 a potential health hazard while you worked at Union Carbide? 21 A. No. 22 MR. FERNANDEZ: You mean asbestos at the plant as 23 opposed to in general? 24 MR. DUBIN: At Union Carbide. 25 Q. No information that asbestos was any health Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 hazard? Page 74 2 A. No. 3 Q. Do you have any documents in your possession 4 regarding during the time you were at Union Carbide? 5 A. What do you mean? 6 Q. Any pamphlets, safety manuals. 7 A. No. 8 Q. Was it ever explained to you that other forms 9 of asbestos could be a health hazard? 10 A. The long fibers. 11 Q. What did they say that caused? 12 A. Cancer, asbestosis. 13 Q. Who told you that? 14 A. I think Daryl Garcia. When I first started 15 there. 16 Q. When did he tell you that? 17 A. When I started -- first started there in '77. 18 And then to the end too, I -- a co-worker asked me about 19 that. He said the same thing, that they -- only thing they 20 mentioned was about -- when he was hired, the same thing 21 that they just mentioned about short fibers and long fibers, 22 and we didn't work with long fiber. 23 Q. You said that you -- respirator -- the type of 24 respirator you used changed in the later years. Do you 25 recall when they changed the respirators with the filter on Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 it? Page 75 2 A. I know they changed it a few times. I can't 3 remember when they did change that. 4 Q. You talked about some areas that were very 5 dusty, inside the bins and the dust collection areas, do you 6 recall that? 7 A. Annually we'd clean the dust -- 8 MR. FERNANDEZ: He hasn't asked you anything yet. 9 MR. DUBIN: Q. You recall that? 10 A. Yes. 11 Q. When someone was working in those areas were 12 they required to wear a respirator? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Kelly-Moore lawyer -- the lawyer here from 15 Kelly-Moore asked you a series of questions. Have you 16 discussed any of the issues that you went through with him 17 with any lawyer from Kelly-Moore? 18 A. Only thing I talked to Mr. Fernandez. But 19 it -20 MR. FERNANDEZ: He asked you about Kelly-Moore. 21 THE WITNESS: No. 22 MR. DUBIN: Q. How about Mr. Sanov? 23 A. No. 24 Q. You were also asked some questions about when 25 they were shutting down, lawyers being present and taking Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 documents out. Page 76 2 A. Right. 3 Q. You have no information at all about what 4 documents were keep, what documents were thrown away or 5 anything like that about what went on in that process? 6 A. No. 7 MR. DUBIN: Let's go home. I'm done. 8 MR. HAINES: Two quick follow ups. 9 MR. DUBIN: I don't know if we are going to go back 10 and forth forever. 11 MR. HAINES: I am following up on what you asked 12 about. 13 14 EXAMINATION BY MR. HAINES 15 MR. HAINES: Q. Pictures 1, 2 and 3, sir. 16 MR. HAINES: You don't have to let me. The rules 17 say I can do it. 18 Q. Pictures 1, 2 and 3, all those pictures, do 19 they depict the working conditions as they existed or what 20 you looked like in your safety gear back when Union Carbide 21 ran the facility? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. Except for the fact that your respirator was 24 different in earlier years? 25 A. Yes. Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 MR. DUBIN: Objection, form. Page 77 2 MR. HAINES: Q. Was your respirator different in 3 the earlier years? 4 A. Yes. 5 MR. HAINES: That's all I have. 6 (Whereupon, the deposition concluded at 7 11:00 a.m.) 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ Page 78 1 Pursuant to Section 2025(q)(1) of the Code of 2 Civil Procedure of the State of California, I hereby certify 3 that I have read my deposition, made those changes and 4 corrections I deem necessary, and approve the same as now 5 written. 6 Dated thisday of,2003. 7 8 9 10 11 12 Under Penalty of Perjury 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO ARTHUR VALDEZ 1 STATE OF CALIFORNIA ) Page 79 2 COUNTY OF MONTEREY ) ss. ) 3 4 The witness in the foregoing deposition appeared 5 before me, JENNA OSBORN, Certified Shorthand Reporter No. 6 8681 for the State of California. 7 Said witness then and there at the time and place 8 previously stated testified under penalty of perjury given 9 on said day. 10 The testimony of the witness and all the questions 11 and remarks requested by counsel were taken by me in 12 shorthand at the time and place therein named and 13 thereafter, under my direction, transcribed into 14 longhand. 15 I further certify that I am not of counsel or 16 attorney for either or any of the parties to said 17 deposition, nor in any way interested in the outcome of the 18 cause named in said caption and that I am not related to 19 any party thereto. 20 IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand 21 this day of , 2003. 22 23 24 CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTER 25 FOR THE STATE OF CALIFORNIA Henjum Goucher Reporting Services 1-888-656-DEPO