Document 2RLNvjyLM8M26pmQNnn8944r7

f ) l 1 1 STATE OF WEST VIRGINIA 2 CIRCUIT COURT OF MONONGALIA COUNTY 3 * ****************** + ********* 4 WITNESS: ANDREW R. TOTH . 5 DATE: June 20, 1997 e ***************************** 7 8 In Re: Mon Mass II, 9 10 11 12 DEPOSITION OF ANDREW R. TOTH was taken 13 at the instance of the Plaintiff under and pursuant to the 14 provisions of Section 804.05 of the Wisconsin Statutes, 15 and the acts amendatory thereof and supplementary thereto, 16 before me, Corinne Trawicki, Notary Public in and for the 17 State of Wisconsin, at 4747 South Howell Avenue, 18 Milwaukee, Wisconsin, on the 20th day of June, 1997, 19 commencing at 10:56 a.m. and concluding at 5:20 p.m. 20 ***************************** 21 22 23 ACCURATE REPORTING CO. 24 735 North Water Street, Milwaukee, WI 53202 25 (414) 272-3430 1-800-272-3430 ACCURATE REPORTING CO. SCF-P&H-3200 Toth 01981 2 1 APPEARANCES 2 GOLDBERG, PERSKY, JENNINGS & WHITE, P.C., 3 by MR. THOMAS W. WHITE, 1030 Fifth Avenue, Pittsburgh, 4 Pennsylvania 15219, appeared on behalf of the ..Plaintiff. 5 SPILMAN, THOMAS & BATTLE, by MR. ERIC M. 6 JAMES, Spilman Center, 300 Kanawha Boulevard, East, P.O. 7 Box 273, Charleston, West Virginia, 25321-0273, appeared 8 on behalf of the Defendant, Harnischfeger. 9 BAKER, LANCIANESE & SMITH, by MR. RICHARD 10 L. LANCIANESE, 1667 K Street, NW, Washington, D.C. 20006, 11 appeared on behalf of the Defendant, Borg-Warner 12 Automotive, Inc. 13 DAVIES, MCFARLAND & CARROLL, P.C., by MR. 14 ERIC K. FALK, The Tenth Floor, One Gateway Center, 15 Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania 15222-1416, appeared on behalf of 16 the Defendant, Allied Signal, Inc. 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01982 3 1 INDEX 2 WITNESS EXAMINATION 3 ANDREW R. TOTH By Mr. White 4 By Mr. Falk 5 . By Mr. James 6 By Mr. White 7 PAGE 4 150 153 187 8 9 10 EXHIBITS 11 EXHIBIT DESCRIPTION MARKED 12 NO. 1 Harnischfeger Instruction Manual 4 13 No. 2 List of Companies 4 14 No. 3 Drawing of Crane 49 15 No. 4 Sweet's Catalog 73 16 ID'D 28 83 50 73 17 18 19 (The original exhibits were attached to the original 20 transcript.) 21 (The original transcript was delivered to Mr. White.) 22 23 24 25 ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01983 4 1 TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS 2 (Exhibit Nos. 1 & 2 were marked for 3 identification.) 4 ANDREW R. TOTH, called as a witness, herein 5 by the Plaintiff, after having been first duly sworn, was 6 examined and testified as follows: 7 EXAMINATION 8 BY MR. WHITE: 9 Q. Sir, would you state your full name? 10 A. Andrew R. Toth, T-o-t-h. 11 Q. Are you employed? 12 A. No. 13 Q. You're retired? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. When did you retire? 16 A. August 1st, 1995. 17 Q. Where were you working prior to retirement? 18 A. For Harnischfeger Industries, Incorporated. 19 Q. How long had you worked for Harnischfeger? 20 A. I worked for Harnischfeger Industries for eight 21 years, and I worked for Harnischfeger Corporation for 22 seventeen years before that -- pardon me, twenty-five 23 years before that. 24 Q. Twenty-five years. So your total employment with 25 Harnischfeger is twenty-five plus eight? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01984 5 1 A. Yes. 2 MR. JAMES: As long as you're on that, let 3 me interject because of the corporate history and 4 relationships you may get into, we are offering Mr. 5 Toth pursuant to Rule 30B6 notice of deposition, as a 6 corporate representative for Harnischfeger 7 Corporation and its division, P&H Material Handling. 8 Not only is Harnischfeger Industries not an entity 9 that has been sued in this litigation, it would have 10 no relevance to Harnischfeger Corporation only that 11 we are offering Mr. Toth for. 12 In addition, as long as I have the 13 floor, we are also offering Mr. Toth as a corporate 14 representative pursuant to your notice relating to 15 the overhead cranes and hoists manufactured and 16 distributed by Harnischfeger Corporation or P&H and 17 on the subject matter of the friction materials 18 contained therein, and those are the only products 19 that he is familiar with or the component parts he is 20 prepared to testify and which we are offering Mr. 21 Toth. 22 MR. WHITE: If Harnischfeger made products 23 containing asbestos, I am going to ask him about 24 those products 25 MR. JAMES: He can testify to that general ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01985 6 1 knowledge in response to your question, but the only 2 products component parts to which plaintiffs have put 3 into issue in this case are friction issues. 4 BY MR. WHITE: ' 5 Q. Sir, when did Harnischfeger Corporation become 6 Harnischfeger Industries? 7 A. In 1986 there was a holding company or parent company 8 formed, and Harnischfeger Corporation became a 9 subsidiary of Harnischfeger Industries, Incorporated, 10 in 1986. 11 Q. Is Harnischfeger Industries the parent or holding 12 company? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. What is it, a parent or a holding, if you know? 15 A. Parent. 16 Q. Is Harnischfeger Industries a parent to Harnischfeger 17 Corporation? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Is Harnischfeger Corporation still in existence? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. As what in.relation to Harnischfeger Industries? 22 A. Harnischfeger Corporation Material Handling Division 23 is a manufacturer of overhead cranes and hoists, and 24 lifting equipment material handling equipment. 25 Q. Is that Harnischfeger Corporation though? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01986 7 1 A. Yes. 2 Q- What is the relationship between that corporation and 3 the parent Harnischfeger Industries? 4 A. Harnischfeger Corporation is a subsidiary of. 5 Harnischfeger Industries, Incorporated. 6 Q. Is it not a division? 7 A. It is - 8 Q. Only if you know. If you don't know, that's all 9 right. 10 A. It's a material handling products division. 11 Q. Of Harnischfeger Industries? 12 A. Of Harnischfeger Corporation and Harnischfeger 13 Corporation is a subsidiary of Harnischfeger 14 Industries. 15 Q. Why did all that occur in 1986, do you know? 16 A. Yes. The company, Harnischfeger, was acquiring other 17 manufacturing companies and decided at that time to 18 set themselves up as a parent company or a holding 19 company for various subsidiaries other than 20 Harnischfeger Corporation. 21 Q. In 1986 what other companies did Harnischfeger 22 Industry acquire or become the parent of? 23 A. Beloit Corporation, B-e-l-o-I-t. There was another 24 company that I can't think of the name of right now 25 that was in the systems business -- engineering ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01987 8 1 systems business, and there was a second company that 2 was set up as a subsidiary as a systems business that 3 was called Harnischfeger Engineers, Incorporated. 4 That's the companies that I remember in 1986. 5 Q. After 1986 did the parent company Harnischfeger 6 Industries acquire any other corporations? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Who did them acquire? 9 A. They acquired Joy Manufacturing Company. 10 Q. Excuse me. What year was that, Joy Manufacturing, if 11 you know? 12 A. I don't know. Approximately 1994. 13 Q. Go ahead. 14 A. They acquired a company called Morris Mechanical. 15 Let's see, they also acquired another company that is 16 in the underground mining, manufacturing equipment 17 business, and I don't know the name of that company. 18 Q. Where is that company from? 19 A. Great Britain. 20 Q. Anything else? 21 A. That's all I recall. 22 Q. When Harnischfeger Industries, the parent 23 corporation, acquired Joy Manufacturing, how did that 24 occur, do you know was it a merger acquisition, 25 assets if you know? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01988 9 1 A. I don't know. 2 Q. And Joy Manufacturing was from Pittsburgh? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. What was the business of Joy Manufacturing? 5 A. Joy Manufacturing manufactures underground mining 6 equipment. 7 Q. Does Joy Manufacturing manufacture any asbestos 8 products? 9 MR. JAMES: If you know. 10 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 11 BY MR. WHITE: 12 Q. Do you know what the relationship is between Joy 13 Manufacturing and T&L Supply? 14 A. No, I don't. 15 Q. Did the Harnischfeger Industries, the parent, also 16 acquire T&L Supply? 17 A. I don't know. 18 Q. Have you ever heard of T&L Supply? 19 A. No, I have not. 20 Q. What's the relationship now between Joy Manufacturing 21 and Harnischfeger Industries? 22 A. Joy Manufacturing is a subsidiary of Harnischfeger 23 Industries. 24 Q. What's the relationship between Joy Manufacturing and 25 Harnischfeger Corporation P&H Material Division? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01989 --m f 10 1 A. No relationship whatever. They are both subsidiaries 2 of Harnischfeger Industries. 3 Q. What does P&H mean? 4 A. Pawling and Harnischfeger. 5 Q. They were the original gentlemen that founded the 6 corporation? 7 A. They founded the corporation in 1884. 8 Q. When Harnischfeger Industries acquired Joy 9 Manufacturing, who was in charge of Joy 10 Manufacturing, who was the president? 11 A. I believe his name was Hansen. 12 Q. Do you have his first name please? 13 A. I don't know. 14 Q. Who was the vice president or second in command? 15 A. I don't know. .- 16 Q. Did you deal with anyone at JoyManufacturing at any 17 time? 18 A. Yes, I did. 19 Q. And who is that please? 20 A. I can't recall. 21 Q. Can you recall anybody's namefrom Joy 22 Manufacturing? 23 MR. JAMES: Before the '86 time period or 24 whenever -- when did -- 25 MR. WHITE: I have '94. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01990 11 1 MR. JAMES: After the relationship turned 2 into parent and subsidiaries or before? 3 BY MR. WHITE: 4 Q. Let's say in 1994 when Harnischfeger Industries was 5 looking to purchase Joy- Manufacturing or at the time 6 that the deal was in process, did you deal with 7 anyone at Joy Manufacturing? 8 A. Yes, I did. 9 Q. Was it Mr. Hansen? 10 A. No. 11 Q. Who did you deal with? 12 A. I can't recall the name of the gentleman. He was - 13 he had a position in the engineering department. 14 Q. Was that in Pittsburgh or elsewhere? .. 15 A. Franklin, Pennsylvania. 16 Q. Was the business of -- in 1994 -- the business of Joy 17 Manufacturing similar to the business of 18 Harnischfeger Corporation? 19 A. No. 20 Q. You said Joy Manufacturing manufactured mining 21 equipment I believe you said, is that correct, or am 22 I wrong? 23 A. Joy Manufacturing manufactured underground mining 24 equipment, yes. 25 Q. Okay. Did Harnischfeger manufacture underground ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01991 12 1 mining equipment? 2 A. No. 3 MR. JAMES: Can we assume for when we each 4 refer to Harnischfeger in the generic sense we're 5 referring to Harnischfeger Corporation unless 6 otherwise delineated? 7 MR. WHITE: Okay. 8 BY MR. WHITE: 9 Q. Did any of the officers from Joy Manufacturing become 10 officers of either Harnischfeger Industries or 11 Harnischfeger Corporation? 12 A. 13 Q. Who was that? 14 A. Mr. Hansen I believe is now an officer of 15 Harnischfeger Industries, Incorporated. 16 Q. The parent? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Do you know what his position is? 19 A. It's either senior vice president or president. 20 Q. Is he here in Milwaukee or is he elsewhere? 21 A. He's in Milwaukee. 22 Q. Anyone else from Joy Manufacturing who became an 23 officer or -- an officer of Harnischfeger Industries? 24 A. Not that I know of. 25 Q. Did anyone from Joy Manufacturing become an officer ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01992 13 1 of Harnischfeger Corporation? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Do you know of any other individuals that came over 4 from Joy.Manufacturing to Harnischfeger Industries in 5 any position? 6 A. No, I do not. 7 Q. Is there any other corporate structure of 8 Harnischfeger in existence other than Harnischfeger 9 Industries and its material handling division, P&H? 10 A. Yes. 11' Q. What's that name? 12 A. Harnischfeger Corporation of mining equipment 13 division. They manufacture above ground mining 14 equipment. 15 Q. Any other corporate structure in existence with the 16 name Harnischfeger? 17 A. No. 18 Q- Have you given a previous deposition or given 19 testimony at trial in an asbestos case? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Have you ever testified or given a deposition in any 22 litigation? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. How often did that occur? 25 A. As I recall, and I don't know exactly, I have not ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01993 14 1 kept track of them, approximately thirty times in 2 deposition and five or six appearances or testimony 3 in court at trial. 4 Q. None of these have dealt with allegations of a 5 product manufactured or sold by Harnischfeger that 6 contained asbestos or an asbestos component?. 7 A. Yes, that's true. 8 Q. Has anyone to your knowledge from Harnischf eger given 9 testimony in an asbestos related case? 10 A. No one that I'm aware of, no. 11 Q. Do you know other than in West Virginia whether 12 Harnischfeger has been sued in otherjurisdictions? 13 MR. JAMES: Relating to? 14 BY MR. WHITE: 15 Q. Asbestos. 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Where else have they been brought in as a defendant? 18 A. The one -- In asbestos? 19 Q. Yes. 20 A. The one that I can recall I believe was in Maryland. 21 Q. Who was the plaintiff's attorney, do you know? 22 A. No. 23 Q. How many cases were involved in that litigation in 24 Maryland? 25 A. One case that I'm aware of. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01994 L. 15 1 Q. And do you know where the exposure was alleged to 2 have been of a Harnischfeger product? 3 A. The name of the company? 4 Q. The name of the job site or - . .. 5 A. Yes. It was Mack Trucks. 6 Q. Do you recall which Harnischfeger product was at i 7 issue? 8 A. Overhead cranes and hoists. ' 9 Q. Did you not give a deposition in that case? 10 A. No, I didn't. 11 Q. Is that case still pending? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Did anyone from Harnischfeger give a deposition in 14 that case? 15 A. No. 16 Q. Did anyone from Harnischfeger testify in trial? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Do you know who represented Harnischfeger in 19 Maryland? 20 A. No, I can't remember his name. 21 Q. Do you know what law firm he came from? 22 A. No, I don't. 23 Q. Was that the only jurisdiction -- Excuse me. Strike 24 that. 25 Are there any other jurisdictions in ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01995 16 1 which Harnischfeger has been sued in an asbestos 2 case? 3 MR. JAMES: I'm sorry. What was the 4 question? . 5 MR. WHITE: Any other jurisdictions in 6 which Harnischfeger has been sued in an asbestos 7 case. 8 THE WITNESS: Not that I recall. 9 MR. WHITE: Do you want to say something? 10 MR. JAMES: No, that's fine. To your 11 knowledge if you know. 12 BY MR. WHITE: 13 Q. Go ahead. Were you going to say something? 14 A. No. I'm trying to recall if there were any other, 15 and I can't recall any. 16 Q. Prior to your deposition today, did you speak with 17 anyone at Harnischfeger other than the attorneys in 18 terms of previous or prior asbestos cases where 19 Harnischfeger was a defendant? 20 A. No. 21 Q. What -- Just briefly tell us what your positions have 22 been with Harnischfeger since you started with the 23 company. 24 A. Okay. I started with the company in 1962 as an engineering trainee. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01996 17 1 Q. Where were you before that in terms of employment? 2 A. Before that I was in college at the University of 3 Wisconsin, and I worked part time for -- part time 4 and full time for a company called TL Schmidt Company 5 in Milwaukee. Following college I went to work for 6 Harnischfeger Corporation in 1962 as an engineering 7 trainee and-became a product designer and design 8 engineer and a project engineer and an assistant 9 chief engineer, a chief engineer and director of 10 engineering. 11 Q. I take it you're an engineer? 12 A. Yes, I am. 13 Q. Do you have a degree in engineering from the 14 University of Wisconsin? 15 A. Yes, I have a bachelor's of science in mechanical 16 engineer. 17 Q. Any advance degree? 18 A. No. A lot of on-the-job training though. 19 Q. Have you always worked in the Milwaukee area for 20 Harnischfeger? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. Harnischfeger manufacturers facility is located 23 where? 24 A. Material Handling? 25 Q. Yes. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01997 18 1 A. In the Milwaukee area. 2 Q. Where else are they located? 3 A. In terms of manufacturing facilities, that's it in 4 Milwaukee. 5 Q. Other than material handling, just so. I'm.not missing 6 something, what other manufacturing facilities are 7 there? 8 MR. JAMES: Of Harnischfeger - 9 MR. WHITE: Yes. 10 MR. JAMES: -- Corporation? 11 MR. WHITE: Yes. 12 THE WITNESS: The mining shovel 13 manufacturing facility located in Milwaukee and 14 electrical manufacturing facility located in 15 Milwaukee. That's it. 16 BY MR. WHITE: 17 Q. So Harnischfeger manufactures mining shovels, 18 electrical equipment, material handling products, is 19 that correct generally? 20 A. Yes, that's correct. ' 21 Q. Does Harnischfeger manufacture anything else? 22 A. No. 23 Q. No division, subsidiary, or other corporation related 24 to Harnischfeger Industries or Harnischfeger 25 Corporation that manufacture some other type of ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01998 19 1 product? 2 MR. JAMES: That's a broader question. 3 THE WITNESS: Yes. The Morris Mechanical 4 Systems is a subsidiary of Harnischfeger Corporation 5 I believe. I'm not familiar with all the more 6 current relationships between these companies, but 7 Morris manufactures material handling equipment in 8 Great Britain. 9 BY MR. WHITE: 10 Q. Does Morris -- M-o-r-r-I-s? 11 A. Yes, it is. 12 Q. Do they export their products to the United States? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. And is there a sales arm or a sales corporation here 15 in the United States that sells the Morris material 16 handling products? 17 A. I don't know. 18 Q. Does Harnischfeger sell the material handling 19 products manufactured by Morris in Great Britain? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Do any of those Morris products contain asbestos? 22 A. I don't know. 23 Q. Do the Morris products contain brake linings? 24 A. I know the Morris products have brakes. 25 Q. And do all brakes have linings? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 01999 20 1 A. No. 2 Q. Who would know about Morris from Harnischfeger? 3 MR. JAMES: Anything about Morris? 4 MR. WHITE: Well, about the asbestos.. 5 THE WITNESS: Probably -- I don't really 6 know. I can only assume that someone would know, but 7 I don't know a specific person that would know the 8 product -- a specific person at Harnischfeger 9 Corporation that would know the product. Like I say, 10 I would assume that someone does, but I don't know 11 who that would be. 12 BY MR. WHITE: 13 Q. How long has Morris been manufacturing material 14 handling products and selling them in the United 15 States? 16 MR. JAMES: As a subsidiary of 17 Harnischfeger Corporation? 18 MR. WHITE: No. 19 MR. JAMES: Previous? 20 MR. WHITE: Previous also. 21 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 22 BY MR. WHITE: 23 Q. 1950's? 24 A. I don't know when they were formed or how long 25 they've been in business. I just don't know. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02000 21 ' 1 Q. When do you recall first hearing of a company called 2 Morris? Was it the '50's -- Was it in the '60's when 3 you started with Harnischfeger? 4 A. I would say sometime during the 1970's I became aware 5 that there was hoist products that were manufactured 6 by Morris. 7 Q. What kind of product? 8 A. Hoist. ' 9 Q. Other than Morris, any other corporate structures 10 that are related to Harnischfeger that we haven't 11 discussed today? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Nothing on the west coast or down south or anything? 14 A. No. 15 Q. East coast? 16 A. No. 17 Q. No other foreign corporations other than Morris? 18 A. Not that I know of, no. As I say, there have been a 19 lot of changes in the structure of Harnischfeger 20 Corporation since I retired, and I'm not the best 21 person to ask those questions, and I don't know who 22 the best person is to get the relationships between 23 Harnischfeger Corporation and some of the 24 subsidiaries. 25 Q. You retired in 1995; is that correct? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02001 22 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. So over the past two years you're saying to your 3 knowledge that there have been a lot of changes in 4 . terms of- corporate structure? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Have there been changes in terms of who -- which 7 corporate structure manufactures what? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Other than the formation of the parent corporation in 10 terms of the material handling corporation, the 11 Harnischfeger.Corporation, has there been any changes 12 in what corporate structure manufactures the material 13 handling products? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Is Harnischfeger Corporation and P&H Material 16 Handling Division the only corporate division that 17 manufactures material handling products? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. To your knowledge, are the material handling products 20 of Harnischfeger the only products that contain 21 asbestos? 22 A. No. 23 Q. What other products contain asbestos as manufactured 24 by Harnischfeger? 25 A. Harnischfeger Corporation mining division mining ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02002 23 1 shovels contain asbestos. 2 Q. Anything else? 3 A. No. 4 Q. The electric manufacturing division, does that 5 division manufacture any products that contain 6 asbestos? . 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Which products? 9 A. Brakes -- electric brakes. 10 Q. Anything else? 11 A. No. 12 Q. The electric -- The corporate structure that makes 13 electrical products, is that a division of 14 Harnischfeger Corporation or a division of 15 Harnischfeger Industries? 16 A. It's a -- part of the material handling division of 17 Harnischfeger Corporation. 18 Q. Is there a name to it? 19 A. No, just electrical products manufacturing. 20 Q. Division? 21 A. I'm not sure if it's a division or if it's just part 22 of the P&H Material Handling Corporation. 23 Q. So are they products -- electrical products 24 manufactured by the Harnischfeger Corporation, P&H 25 Material Handling Division? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02003 24 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. And there's no further breakdown in terms of a 3 corporate name? 4 A. No. .. 5 Q. Is there further breakdown in terms of the corporate 6 name for the mining shovel manufacturing division? 7 A. No. .. 8 Q. Does Harnischfeger -- Strike that. 9 The electric products division, okay? 10 A. Okay. 11 Q. You say they manufacture a product that contains 12 asbestos? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. What is that product that contains asbestos? 15 A. The electric brake. 16 Q. I'm sorry, you told me that. Excuse me. Does 17 Harnischfeger manufacture that electric brake? 18 A. Yes. 19 MR. JAMES: The brake itself? 20 THE WITNESS: Yes. 21 BY MR. WHITE: . 22 Q. Does Harnischfeger -- Is there a brake lining 23 involved? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Does Harnischfeger manufacture the brake lining? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02004 1 A. NO. 25 2 Q. Does the brake lining contain asbestos? 3 A. It did at one time. 4 Q. When did it contain asbestos? .. 5 MR. JAMES: Let me reiterate my earlier 6 statement. We have not -- because of the products at 7 issue by plaintiffs arguably and testimony in 8 evidence and disclosure pursuant to pretrial orders, 9 the only product of Harnischfeger Corporation at 10 issue is the overhead cranes and hoists. And to his 11 knowledge or potential knowledge of the electrical 12 products that may have been manufactured in that - 13 calling it a division, but I don't think it is -- but 14 that part of P&H or what he knows about the mining 15 shovels division, but we have not investigated nor is 16 he prepared to testify nor preview any documents that 17 may or may not exist related to those other divisions 18 or sections 19 BY MR. WHITE: 20 Q. Are the -- The brake linings at some point in time 21 contained asbestos? 22 A. Yes, they did. 23 Q. From when to when did the brake lining contain 24 asbestos? 25 A. I don't know when they first did, but up until the ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02005 26 1 period of approximately the mid-1980's they contained 2 asbestos. 3 Q. And who was the manufacturer and supplier of the 4 . asbestos containing brake linings? 5 A. There were a number of manufacturers and suppliers of 6 that component. 7 Q. May I have those names? 8 MR. JAMES: Are we talk about the 9 electrical product section or - 10 MR. WHITE: I'm talking about the 11 electrical products division. 12 MR. JAMES: Again, I'll state that I think 13 the division is a misnomer and just give me a 14 continuing objection. 15 BY MR. WHITE: 16 Q. What do you call the electric product manufacturing? 17 A. It's a part of Harnischfeger Material Handling 18 Company Corporation. 19 Q. Is it a division? 20 A. I'm not sure. I don't think it is. It's just a part 21 of P&H Material Handling Company. ' 22 Q. Okay. Who made the brake -- the asbestos containing 23 brake linings that were used in the electric products 24 used by Harnischfeger? 25 A. H. K. Porter. Raybestos-Manhattan. A company called ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02006 27 1 Gatke, G-a-t-k-e. Johns-Manville. There may have 2 been others, but I don't recall who they all were. 3 Q. Who -- Were there any distributors in addition to the 4 manufacturers that supplied the asbestos containing 5 brake lines to Harnischfeger? 6 A. I don't know what you mean by distributors. 7 Q. Well, there is a manufacturer and a manufacturer may 8 sell to a distributor and a distributor may sell to 9 Harnischfeger, the end user. Is there some middle 10 type corporate structure involved? 11 A. Not that I'm aware of no. 12 Q. Was there ever, for instance, a local Milwaukee 13 distributor that handled asbestos products from the 14 manufacturer and then resold them to Harnischfeger? 15 A. To the best of my knowledge, we dealt with the 16 manufacturer of the product. I don't recall dealing 17 with any distributors. 18 Q. Is Gatke still in existence? 19 A. I don't know. 20 Q. Where was Gatke located? 21 A. I don't remember. 22 Q. Were there different manufacturers of brake linings 23 for the electric product division than were for the 24 material handling division? 25 A. No. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02007 28 1 MR. JAMES: Tom, let me also refer you to 2 the documents which were provided to you previously 3 and you marked as Deposition 1, and I think there are 4 other potential other manufacturers of friction 5 products. . 6 THE WITNESS: There probably are some, but 7 I don't recall who they all are. 8 BY MR. WHITE: 9 Q. Okay. But you don't recall any distributors who 10 supplied to Harnischfeger the asbestos brake lining? 11 A. Not that I can recall. 12 Q. Now, when I went through the documents on Exhibit 1, 13 there were some reference to electric con - 14 electrical control boards or control panels, okay? 15 A. Okay. 16 Q. And contained therein .were reference to contactors? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Okay. In reference to the electric control panels 19 and/or the contactors, were there any asbestos 20 products involved or utilized? 21 A. Yes, in some of them. 22 Q. What asbestos containing product was involved in the 23 contactors or electrical control panels? 24 A. Some of the very large direct current contactors used 25 arc shields which contained asbestos. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02008 29 1 Q. Would those arc shields be made by General Electric? 2 A. I don't know. 3 Q. Were they made by Westinghouse? 4 A. I know Harnischfeger purchased contactors from both 5 Westinghouse and General Electric, but I don't know 6 whether those contactors had arc shields or whether 7 they contained asbestos. 8 Q. Other than General Electric or Westinghouse who else 9 did Harnischfeger purchase the arc shields from? 10 A. Harnischfeger provided arc shields for Harnischfeger 11 manufactured contactors. 12 Q. Did Harnischfeger make asbestos containing arc 13 shields? 14 A. No, they were purchased. 15 Q. Other than General Electric and Westinghouse did 16 Harnischfeger purchase them from somebody else, the 17 arc shields? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. Who were those other companies? 20 A. I don't know. 21 Q. Was Westinghouse the largest supplier to your knowledge of the arc shields? A. No. Q. Who was the largest supplier of the arc shield? A. I believe that the contactors that were made by ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02009 30 1 Harnischfeger were the -- were the majority of the 2 contactors that used arc shields that contained 3 asbestos, but the arc shields themselves were not 4 manufactured by Harnischfeger. They were purchased 5 from someone who made arc shields, and I don't know 6 who that is. 7 Q. Did the contactors contain asbestos, or did the arc 8 shields contain asbestos or did they both? 9 A. The arc shields contained asbestos. 10 Q. Did the contactors contain asbestos? 11 A. No. 12 Q. Who is the major supplier or manufacturer or supplier 13 of the arc shields containing asbestos? 14 A. I don't know. 15 Q. I think you told me that GE and Westinghouse at some 16 point in time supplied the arc shields? 17 A. They didn't supply arc shields, they supplied 18 contactors which also included arc shields. 19 Q. Do all contactors include arc shields? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Did GE and Westinghouse supply the contactors that 22 contained the asbestos containing arc shields? 23 A. They supplied some of them, and others were all 24 Harnischfeger manufactured were purchased with arc 25 shields that were purchased from whoever manufactured ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02010 31 1 the arc shields, but I don't know who that is. 2 Q. Who would know that? 3 A. I don't know. 4 Q. Whose job was it to buy the asbestos containing arc 5 shields? 6 A. I don't recall. It could have been many people over 7 many years. 8 Q. Which department? 9 A. It was in the electrical manufacturing area of 10 Harnischfeger Corporation or Harnischfeger Material 11 Handling as it is now known. 12 Q. Did you ever look for records as to who -- from whom 13 Harnischfeger purchased the asbestos containing arc 14 shields? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. And did you find any records identifying who made the 17 asbestos containing arc shields? 18 A. I don't recall if I did or if I didn't. 19 Q. Were those records supplied to me, do you know? 20 A. I don't think there's any records supplied here for 21 that particular product. 22 Q. Where are the records as to the asbestos containing 23 arc shields? 24 A. With Harnischfeger Corporation. 25 Q. Still in existence? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02011 32 1 A. I think so. 2 Q. And the contactors and the arc shields were 3 incorporated into the materials handling product; is . 4 that correct? 5 A. Yes. 6 MR. WHITE; I think I would like to make a 7 request that we be supplied the Harnischfeger records 8 as to asbestos containing contactors and the asbestos 9 containing arc shields. 10 MR. JAMES: It's something we may have to 11 address. Again, we have provided you documents and 12 collected documents and are prepared to talk about 13 the main things that are at issue and that friction 14 and overhead crane. I think further testimony would 15 be elicited we don't know if any overhead crane that 16 was ever installed at a facility in West Virginia 17 contained asbestos containing arc shields or any 18 other asbestos containing component or highly 19 unlikely they did but other than friction material. 20 Without knowing the specific cranes at issue by 21 serial number, pictures, or walk throughs, or 22 whatever, we cannot determine if any overhead crane 23 or hoist that is located in West Virginia and there 24 by relevant contained any other asbestos containing 25 component. However, to the extent they exist and to ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02012 33 1 the extent it becomes at issue, we'll do our est 2 comply. 3 MR. WHITE: All right. Thank you. 4 BY MR. WHITE: .. 5 Q. I'll get off this subject in a moment. Did you tell 6 me that Harnischfeger made contactors or made arc 7 shields? 8 A. Harnischfeger manufactured contactors. 9 Q. Did Harnischfeger not manufacture arc shields? 10 A. They did not manufacture arc shields, no. 11 Q. Did Harnischfeger manufacture contactors that 12 contained asbestos arc shields? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. But they did not make the asbestos arc shield? 15 A. Yes, that's true. 16 Q. That's true. Okay. Other than the contactors 17 containing the asbestos as a component part, did 18 Harnischfeger manufacturer -- what other products 19 containing asbestos did Harnischfeger manufacturer? 20 A. Harnischfeger didn't manufacture any parts that 21 contained asbestos. 22 Q. Did Harnischfeger manufacture a product that 23 contained asbestos; is that correct? 24 A. Harnischfeger manufactured brakes -- does manufacture 25 brakes. Brakes at one time contained components that ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02013 34 X contained asbestos, but they were purchased by 2 Harnischfeger not manufactured by Harnischfeger. 3 Q. Which component contained asbestos? 4 A. The brake discs and brake shoes. 5 Q. What's a brake disc? . 6 A. It's a -- the friction element used in a disc type of 7 electric brake. 8 Q, What's a brake shoe? 9 A. It's the friction component that is used in a shoe 10 brake -- electric shoe brake. 11 Q. So there are two different types of brakes both of 12 which contained asbestos, one is a disc brake, and 13 one is a brake shoe; is that correct? 14 A. A disc brake and a shoe brake, yes. 15 Q. They're two different types of brakes? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. And both of these brakes at some point in time 18 contained asbestos friction products? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Other than the friction component for a disc brakes 21 and the friction component for the brake shoes and 22 the arc shields that we've previously talked about, 23 is there any other product or component part 24 manufactured and sold by Harnischfeger that contained 25 asbestos? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02014 35 1 A. No. 2 Q. All right. 3 MR. JAMES: You stated manufactured and 4 sold component part that may have contained the 5 asbestos manufactured and sold by Harnischfeger? 6 MR. WHITE: Right. 7 MR. JAMES: That's fine. 8 THE WITNESS: Could we have that question 9 repeated? 10 BY MR. WHITE: 11 Q. Well, I can't do it. Let me do it. We talked about 12 the asbestos containing arc shield, and now we talked 13 about asbestos containing friction element of a disc 14 brake and the asbestos containing friction element of 15 a brake shoe? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. Other than those three component parts I'll call 18 them -- if you want to correct me, correct me. Other 19 than those three component parts, did Harnischfeger 20 Corporation or Harnischfeger parent corporation or 21 any of the Harnischfeger structures at any time 22 manufacture or sell a product or a component part 23 containing asbestos other than those three? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. What was that or what were they? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02015 36 1 A. There are -- Although they're in the minority, there 2 are a few cranes that contained an insulation board 3 that contained asbestos. 4 Q. Tell me -- Describe the insulation board. 5 A. The insulation board was called transite board, and 6 it was used in a pan below the cab on a cab operated 7 crane as a heat shield for the cab and the operator 8 in the cab. 9 Q. What was that product used -- During what time 10 period? 11 A. As far as I know -- Well, it would have been before 12 approximately 1985, but when it started I don't 13 know. i4 Q. Was it last used in 19 -- was it the asbestos 15 containing transite last used in 1985? 16 A. Yes. 17 Q. For how many years had it been used? 18 A. I don't know. 19 Q. Was it being used as a transite -- was the asbestos 20 containing transite used when you started in the 21 early '60's? 22 A. I don't know that. It may have been. I would say my knowledge of it I became aware of its use possibly about 1970. MR. JAMES: Let me interpose, if you could ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02016 37 1 give me a continuing objection. Again, his statement 2 that very few cranes may have contained a transite 3 board or insulating board without further knowledge 4 of the actual overhead cranes there were the cab type 5 may be at issue in West Virginia or located in West 6 Virginia, the relevancy of this cross-examination is 7 questionable. 8 BY MR. WHITE: 9 Q. So as early -- Was it the early 1970's you recall 10 asbestos contained transite being used as a 11 floorboard in the cabs? 12 A. My recollection is approximately the year 1970 is 13 when I became aware that there was an insulating 14 panel beneath the floor of the operator's cab. 15 Q. How did you become so aware, can you recall? 16 A. I worked in overhead crane engineering where the 17 product was designed and engineered. 18 Q. Did you work in overhead crane engineering in the 19 '60's -- 1960? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Did you know in the 1960's that asbestos containing 22 transite was being used as you've described it today? 23 A. I don't recall the exact time when I became aware of 24 it. 25 Q. Who was your predecessor? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02017 38 1 MR. JAMES: In what position? 2 BY MR. WHITE: 3 Q. Who was your predecessor in the engineering aspect of 4 the overhead crane cabs? 5 A. There were many people involved in the engineering 6 department involved with overhead crane cabs. I 7 would say there was no such person as a predecessor. 8 Q. Who was your boss so to speak? Every one has a 9 boss. 10 A. Yes. I -- When I worked in overhead crane 11 engineering, I worked for an Edward M. Jagodzinski. 12 Q. Is he still living? 13 A. No, he's not. 14 Q. Can you give me the gentleman or ladies who are still 15 living? 16 MR. JAMES: The question was when he was in 17 overhead crane engineering who was your boss. 18 BY MR. WHITE: 19 Q. Or someone above you. It doesn't have to be one 20 person boss. 21 A. I don't understand the question. Can you repeat it? 22 Q. I want to find out if there is any one individual 23 still living that I can go to and ask him the 24 question did -- In the 1960's was Harnischfeger 25 making overhead cranes that contained asbestos ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02018 39 1 containing transite. Who would have been there in 2 the 1960's who is still living that I can ask that 3 question? 4 A. I don't know. 5 Q. No one comes to mind? 6 A. No. 7 Q- Have you ever seen any documentation as to when the 8 transite board was used in an overhead crane cab? 9 A. Yes. 10 Q. Have you seen documentation establishing how far back 11 in time the use of the transite containing asbestos 12 was? 13 A. No. 14 Q. When I looked through what has been marked as 15 Deposition Exhibit 1, I don't recall seeing any 16 reference to transite board. Was it a board? 17 A. That's what it was called, yes. 18 Q. A transite board being used in overhead cranes. Is 19 my recollection poor or was that your recollection 20 also? 21 A. That's my recollection also. 22 Q. But there are documents in existence showing the use 23 or showing the use of the asbestos containing 24 transite board in overhead crane cabs; is that 25 correct? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02019 40 1 A. Yes. 2 MR. WHITE: I would like to make a request 3 that we be supplied with those documents. 4 MR. JAMES: If you don't make me repeat my 5 previous statements, I?ll incorporate. But to the 6 extent it ever becomes at issue and the plaintiffs 7 are able to establish that an overhead crane that was 8 a cab type was shipped to or installed at a facility 9 in West Virginia, we will do our best to comply 10 BY MR. WHITE: . 11 Q. To your knowledge the -- who made the transite board 12 containing asbestos that was used by Harnischfeger? 13 A. I believe that was Johns-Manville. 14 Q. Was there any other manufacturing of the transite 15 board containing asbestos? 16 A. Not that I can recall. 17 Q. Was there a distributor from whom Harnischfeger 18 bought the transite board containing asbestos? 19 A. Not that I know of, no. 20 Q. Which overhead crane cabs utilized the Johns-Manville 21 transite board containing asbestos? 22 A. There were some cranes that were designed to be used 23 in atmospheres that were -- that was a lot of heat - 24 direct heat radiation from some source of heat. As I 25 say, they were in the minority, maybe one in five ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02020 41 1 hundred or one in a thousand of the cranes 2 manufactured. But the ones that were subjected to 3 radiation from a heat source contained an insulation 4 board for the cab -- the operator's cab. 5 Q. Were the cab numbers for the cab designations that 6 utilized the J. M. transite board asbestos containing 7 transite? 8 A. I don't understand your question. 9 Q. You said some of the overhead crane cabs contained a 10 transite board? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Okay. Those overhead crane cabs that contained a 13 transite board, were they designated with a specific 14 number or name or brand name like the M-16 or 15 something like that? 16 A. The cab had a part number. 17 Q, Okay. Which part number contained the transite 18 board? 19 A. I don't know. I don't recall. 20 Q. So the cab would have a part number? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. And if the cab contained the transite board, it would 23 have a particular number? ' 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Did it have a further name designation? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02021 42 1 A. No. 2 Q. Which overhead crane cab number contained the 3 asbestos transite board? 4 MR. JAMES: Object. Asked and answered. 5 THE WITNESS: I don't think there was only 6 one cab. Cranes are custom designed components, and 7 cabs are designed for each crane for its purpose. So 8 there were a number of cabs that were identified by a 9 part number that would have had insulating panels on 10 them. 11 BY MR. JAMES: 12 Q. Which cabs were they? 13 A. The ones that were used in high heat atmospheres. 14 Q. A steel mill? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. An aluminum plant? 17 A. Possibly. 18 Q. A chemical plant? 19 A. I don't know. 20 Q. Where else were the crane cabs used that had the 21 asbestos transite board other than steel mills and 22 possibly aluminum production facilities? 23 A. In areas where the cab was exposed to direct 24 radiation from a heat source. 25 Q. Such as? Do any come to mind other than steel mills ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02022 43 1 and aluminum facilities? 2 A. In general, molten material atmospheres. 3 Q- A foundry? 4 A. Yes. .5 Q- Anything else? 6 A. Generally in an area where there are molten materials 7 of any kind. 8 Q. Where would that be to your knowledge? 9 A. Refractories, foundries, steel mills, possibly 10 aluminum melting. That's all that comes to mind. 11 Q. What would be the size of the transite containing 12 asbestos width, length, and thickness? 13 A. Approximately six feet by six feet by three-eighths 14 of an inch or one-half inch thick. 15 Q. What was the percentage of asbestos in the transite? 16 A. I don't know. 17 Q. What was the type of asbestos fiber in the transite? 18 A. I believe it was chrysotile. 19 Q. What's the basis of your understanding it was 20 chrysotile? 21 A. My recollection of looking at specifications for the 22 material. 23 Q. Who wrote the specifications for the transite board? 24 A. The manufacturer of the transite board. 25 Q. Harnischfeger didn't write a specification spec on ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02023 44 1 asbestos --or documenting -- specifying an asbestos 2 containing transite board? 3 A. No, it did not. 4 Q. When Harnischfeger made the crane cab, they'd have . 5 specified -- or would Harnischfeger have specified 6 using an asbestos containing transite? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Who specified the use of the asbestos containing 9 transite? 10 A. The manufacturer of the transite. 11 Q. But in terms of the -- Harnischfeger was the 12 manufacturer of the crane cab? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. And Harnischfeger wrote specifications as to the 15 manufacture of the crane and the crane cab; is that 16 correct? 17 A. The specifications for the crane and the crane cab 18 and in terms of performance in particular for the 19 transite board has insulation value not the materials 20 that were used in it. 21 Q- I don't understand. What do you mean Harnischfeger 22 would write that specification for the use of a piece. 23 of insulation? 24 A.. In terms of performance. As far as the capability of 25 the board to provide an insulating value, that's the ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02024 45 1 kind of specifications that Harnischfeger wrote. 2 Q. What do you mean by that? Do you mean a heat range? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Now, what was the Harnischfeger specification for 5 heat range that would require the use of asbestos 6 containing transite? 7 A. I don't recall. 8 Q. Was it above five hundred degrees? 9 A. I really don't recall. 10 Q. As I recall now, that's the fourth product that we've 11 talked about today that contains asbestos, is that 12 correct, the manufacture of a product or utilized as 13 a component part by Harnischfeger? 14 MR. JAMES: I think that's a 15 mischaracterization. There's no testimony -- it's 16 contrary testimony that Harnischfeger ever 17 manufactured a part or component that contained 18 asbestos. 19 BY MR. WHITE: 20 Q. Well, I meant to say utilizing a component part. We 21 talked about four component parts, the arc shields, 22 the disc brake friction product, the brake shoe 23 friction product, and now transite board; is that 24 correct? 25 A. Yes. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02025 46 1 Q. Are there any other asbestos containing products that 2 were used as a component part in any product 3 manufactured by Harnischfeger? 4 A. Not that I can recall. 5 MR. WHITE: Okay. Let's take a break. 6 (Break taken.) 7 BY 1. WHITE: 8 Q. Sir, when Harnischfeger sold the crane cabs that 9 contained the asbestos transite, was there a warning 10 on the crane cab in any location that the crane cab H contained an asbestos transite board and asbestos as 12 a health hazard? . 13 A. No. 14 Q. The next product containing asbestos -- Let me ask 15 you this, was there a specific department within 16 Harnischfeger at any time that had to fabricate the 17 transite board? 18 A. In the manufacturing area there was a -- In the 19 manufacture and assembly of the cab, it was installed 20 in the heat shield, yes. 21. Q- Was the transite board containing asbestos sawed? 22 A. I don't know. 23 Q. Was the board hard? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. Did you ever see the board sawed? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02026 47 1 A. No. 2 Q. Did you ever see the board cut in any respect 3 utilizing any implement or tool? 4 A. No. . 5 Q. Did you ever see a used crane cab with a used piece 6 of transite after the crane cab had been in use for a 7 number of years for instance or forever how long? 8 A. I may have, but I don't recall. 9 Q. Did you ever receive -- Strike that. 10 Did Harnischfeger :receive back from a 11 customer for instance a crane cab for refurbishing or 12 any repairs? 13 MR. JAMES: At any time for any reason? 14 MR. WHITE: Yes. 15 THE WITNESS: Not that I can recall, no. 16 Not that I've seen. 17 BY MR. WHITE: 18 Q- Okay. Have you ever seen a crane cab that had been 19 in use for instance in a steel mill and do you 20 remember seeing the transite board and the condition 21 of the transite board? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. And what was the condition of the transite board? 24 A. It was covered with dirt. 25 Q. Anything else that you recall? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02027 48 1 A. No. 2 Q. Where was the transite board in relation to where the 3 operator would be? 4 A. Transite board was placed in sheet shield below the 5 operator and the cab. . . 6 Q. Did the operator step on the transite board? 7 A. No. 8 Q. What would prevent the operator from stepping on the 9 transite board? 10 A. It was put in a sheet metal panel or heat shield that 11 was located below the cab. 12 Q. Did the operator step on the sheet metal? 13 A. No. 14 Q. What did the operator step on? 15 A. The floor of the cab. 16 Q. Where was the floor of the cab in relation to sheet 17 metal? 18 A. Immediately above it. 19 Q. What was the floor of the cab made out? 20 A. Sheet steel. 21 Q. Sheet steel? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. What was outside in below -- or if you go from 24 outside in underneath the crane cab, was the transite 25 board exposed to the outside? :S: ACCURATE EXPORTING CO. Toth 02028 49 1 A. It was exposed on its top side but not on its bottom 2 side. 3 Q. What do you mean top side/bottom side? 4 A. Well, it was located inside a sheet metal -- heat . 5 shield on the.upper surface -- upper surface of that 6 heat shield below the cab of the crane, so it was not 7 visible from the bottom, but if you looked underneath 8 the cab, you could see the top surface of it from 9 above. 10 Q. Could you draw me a diagram? I don't understand what 11 you're talking about. 12 A. (Witness complies.) . 13 Q. Tell me where the heat would be coming from. Write 14 the word heat where the heat would be coming from. 15 A. (Witness complies.) 16 Q- Okay. Thank you. 17 A. If you look at this sketch, this represents an 18 operating cab of an overhead crane - 19 Q. Hold on. Let's mark this as an Exhibit. 20 (Exhibit No. 3 was marked for 21 identification.) 22 BY MR. WHITE: 23 Q. Sir, just showing what you have just drawn and what 24 we have marked as Exhibit 3, can you show me where 25 the asbestos transite would be or just explain what ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02029 1 2 3 4. . 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 50 you've drawn please? A. Yes. I've drawn what represents an outline of an operator cab on an overhead crane showing a window on the side of the cab and a door and.a window in the door and below the cab supported from the cab is a pan -- sheet metal pan, and inside of that pan is where the transite insulating board was located. Q. Now, if you look up -- Say for instance if an individual was standing in the area where the heat is coming from, would that be -- and look up at the bottom of the crane, is that accurate, I mean, is that possible? A Yes. Q Would that individual see the asbestos transite board? A No, he would not. Q From what angle looking at Exhibit 3 would the individual looking at the metal pan see the transite board? . A It's possible that it would -- that person in the cab or on the crane would not see it at all because it's located underneath the surface of the cab. On the other hand, it's possible that if you bent over or looked underneath the cab from above that you might see the insulating board in this heat shield panel. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02030 1 Q. The transite? 51 . 2 A. Well, it's an insulating board. 3 Q. But at some point in time the insulating board was 4 asbestos containing transite? - 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Is the pan underneath the cabin open at the top? 7 A. Yes. . 8 Q. Okay. I see. And how many pieces of transite board 9 would have been placed in that pan? 10 A. Enough pieces to fill the pan. It could be one 11 piece. 12 Q. How deep was the pan? 13 A. Inch and a half or two inches. 14 Q. So it could be more than one piece of asbestos 15 containing transite that was placed in that pan? 16 A. No, there would be only one thickness of insulating 17 board in the pan. 18 Q. What else would -- Would there be anything in the 19 panel other than the asbestos containing transite? 20 A. No. 21 MR. JAMES: Except for the sheet metal on 22 top that you previously described? - 23 THE WITNESS: Well, the sheet metal is 24 underneath, it's not on top. It supports the 25 insulating board. ACCURATE REPORTING CO Toth 02031 52 1 BY MR. WHITE: 2 Q. The sheet metal is not on top of the pan? 3 A. The pan itself is the sheet metal. The insulating 4 board is inside of the pan. 5 Q. The pan is like a frying pan open on top? 6 A. Yes. 7 Q. Okay. You also stated that the friction element of 8 the disc brake contained asbestos; is that correct? 9 A. Yes, it did at one time. 10 Q. During what time period did the friction element of 11 the disc brake contain asbestos? 12 A. From the time of its inception which I don't know 13 because it was prior to my time until approximately 14 the mid to late 1980's. 15 Q. On what product manufactured and sold by 16 Harnischfeger were the disc brakes containing the 17 asbestos friction element placed? 18 A. The products were overhead hoists and overhead 19 cranes. 20 Q. Would the disc brakes containing asbestos placed on 21 anything else other than the overhead cranes and the 22 hoists? 23 A. No. 24 Q. How many different types of overhead cranes did 25 Harnischfeger manufacture? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02032 53 1 A. Each overhead crane is a custom-designed crane so as 2 many cranes as Harnischfeger manufactured. Each one 3 is unique. Each one would have its own particular 4 design as far as types are concerned. They weren't 5 classed for types, they were designed for years. 6 Q. In a good year -- a good manufacturing year -- how 7 many cranes would Harnischfeger manufacture just to 8 give me some idea? 9 A. I would estimate between 100 and 150. 10 Q. And Harnischfeger made other types of cranes other 11 than overhead cranes; is that correct? 12 A. At one time Harnischfeger did have a construction 13 crane manufacturing division. 14 Q. When was that? 15 A. Up until 1988, and I don't know when it began. 16 Q. Were there asbestos products utilized as a component 17 part on those cranes? 18 A. Yes. 19 Q. And what were those asbestos products? 20 A. Friction material. Brakes. Clutches. 21 Q. Would they be cranes that would run along the ground 22 on wheels or tracks? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Would these cranes have been used in steel mills? 25 A. No. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02033 54 1 Q. Aluminum plants or foundries? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Talking again about the asbestos containing friction 4 element on the. disc brakes on an overhead crane - 5 A. Yes.. 6 Q. -- how many -- what's the quantity of friction 7 element that would have been used on an overhead 8 crane? 9 MR. JAMES: Disc or clutch? 10 MR. WHITE: Disc. I'm just talking about 11 disc. 12 THE WITNESS: Well, most overhead cranes 13 have three motions, a bridge motion, a trolley 14 motion, and a hoist motion. And it's conceivable 15 that each of those motions would have a disc brake on 16 it. So there could be three disc brakes on that 17 crane and possibly each of the brakes have two 18 friction discs in it. 19 BY 1. WHITE: 20 Q. So the motions would be back and forth on an overhead 21 crane, up and down, and then something would go 22 sideways? . 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. And each of those three motions would be controlled 25 by a friction element that contained asbestos? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02034 55 1 A. They could be. 2 Q. Were they? 3 A. Each hoist motion certainly had a brake on it, and it 4 could have been a disc brake. . 5 Q- Containing asbestos? . 6 A. Yes. And each bridge motion usually most often - 7 put it that way -- had a brake on it that could have 8 been a disc brake, and the trolley motion may or may 9 not have had a brake that contained a disc brake. 10 Q- Okay. The trolley motion is what motion? 11 A. It is the motion traversing the width of a building 12 generally. A trolley rolls and moves along the 13 girder-s of the crane, and the girders of the crane 14 span the width of the building, and the girders run 15 the length of the building. The bridge runs through 16 the length of the building. 17 Q. Go ahead. 18 A. The trolley spans and the girders that span the width 19 of the building, so the trolley spans the width of 20 the building and the hoist is vertical motion. What 21 I stated earlier was that it's conceivable that all 22 three motions had a brake on it, and each of those . 23 brakes could be a disc brake. 24 Q. Did all the disc brakes up until the late 1980's 25 contain asbestos? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. ' Toth 02035 ml 56 1 A. Mid to late 1980's, yes. 2 MR. JAMES: To help you out, not to be 3 accused of helping, L00007 may be of assistance in 4 talking about girders and trollies and hoists and so 5 forth. 6 MR. WHITE: Okay. . 7 BY MR. WHITE: 8 Q. And then each one of these overhead cranes is 9 manufactured specifically for a particular customer? 10 A. For a particular purpose for a particular customer, 11 yes. 12 Q. I mean, the overhead crane would have to fit in a 13 customer's steel mill, foundry, or something and so 14 forth; is that right? 15 A. It would have to fit in the building it was intended 16 to be used in, yes. 17 Q. In talking about overhead cranes, is the hoist 18 something different than the overhead crane or is the 19 hoist part the overhead? 20 A. A hoist is one of the components of an overhead 21 crane. 22 Q. Is a hoist separate -- or can a hoist be separate 23 from an overhead crane? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. So the disc brakes could be used in a hoist that was ArrrmATK Bvr>m?Tn\rrz rn Toth 02036 57 1 part of an overhead crane, and the disc brakes 2 containing asbestos could be used on a hoist separate 3 from an overhead crane? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. I'll talk more about the hoist in a moment but 6 talking about the friction element of the brake 7 shoes, where were the brake shoes containing the 8 asbestos friction element used? 9 A. Brake shoes were used in the shoe brake that was used 10 in an overhead crane for any one -- could be used for 11 any one of those motions, hoist, trolley, or bridge. 12 Q. Were disc brakes and brake shoes used interchangeably 13 in an overhead crane? 14 A. Not interchangeably, but they could -- you could use 15 a disc brake and a shoe brake on the same overhead 16 crane, yes. 17 Q. What's the difference between the disc brake and a 18 friction element containing asbestos of disc brakes 19 and a friction element containing asbestos of a shoe 20 brake? 21 A. A disc brake uses a disc --a friction disc which is 22 compressed by a spring to provide a braking action to 23 the motion. A shoe brake consists of two shoes that 24 partially surround a brake drum that rotates and 25 provide spring action, a compressing braking action ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02037 58 1 to that rotating drum. 2 Q. Who would determine what type of braking system to 3 use whether it be a disc braking system or a shoe 4 braking system? 5 A. It would depend upon the size of the crane, the 6 requirement for the brake, and generally the size 7 and -- the duty that crane is going to perform. 8 Q. Did all the friction -- Did all the friction elements 9 of the shoe braking system up until the mid to late 10 1980's in products manufactured and sold by 11 Harnischfeger contain asbestos? 12 A. Yes. 13 Q. Describe for me the size of these disc brakes largest 14 to smallest if possible on all three of the different 15 motion elements -- I guess motions. 16 A. The disc brake I think the largest would have a disc 17 that was approximately twelve inches in diameter, and 18 the smallest would have a -- use a disc that was 19 approximately four inches in diameter. 20 Q. How thick would disc brakes -- or the disc friction 21 element be? . 22 A. The thickness was -- the thickness was either 23 three-eighths of an inch or half an inch thick. 24 Q. Now, what would be the size of the friction element 25 of the braking shoes -- shoe brakes? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02038 59 1 A. The brake shoes were used on a circumference of a 2 brake drum, and the brake drum varied in size from 3 five inches in diameter up to thirty inches in 4 diameter. 5 Q. Would the friction element of the brake shoe be as 6 large as thirty inches in diameter? 7 A. The brake shoe did not encompass the entire 8 circumference of the brake wheel but two segments of 9 the brake wheel approximately through a sixty degree 10 arc on each side of the drum and the radius of those 11 formed shoes would have been two-and-a-half inches to 12 fit the five inch diameter drum or fifteen inches in 13 radius to fit the thirty inch diameter drum. 14 Q. What was the shape of these -- the friction element 15 of the brake shoes? 16 A. Like a crescent. 17 Q. Curved? 18 A. Yes. Molded and formed to fit the circumference of 19 the brake wheel. 20 Q. And the largest friction element would be 21 approximately fifteen inches in length? 22 A. No. It would have a curved inter-radius of fifteen 23 inches such that if you had two of them it would form 24 the diameter of the thirty inch brake drum. 25 Q. If you straightened out the fifteen inch curvature of ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02039 60 1 the inter-radius, how long would that -- 2 A. I don't know right offhand. Perhaps there are some 3 documents that will show what that developed length 4 is. . 5 Q. And how wide would the friction element of the brake 6 shoe be? 7 A. Approximately six to seven inches wide. 8 Q- How heavy would they be? 1 9 A. Between a quarter inch thick and a half inch thick. 10 Q. How much would they weigh? 11 . MR. JAMES: Just the friction element of 12 the shoes or shoes themselves? 13 MR. WHITE: Friction element. 14 MR. JAMES: If you know. 15 THE WITNESS: I don't know exactly. Maybe 16 as little as a pound up to six or eight pounds 17 BY MR. WHITE: 18 Q. So the friction element could weigh as much as six to 19 eight pounds? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. What was the percentage of asbestos that was 22 contained within the friction element for the !brake 23 shoe? 24 A. As I recall, it was fifty-three percent. 25 Q. And what was the percentage of the asbestos fibers in ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02040 61 1 the disc braking friction element? 2 A. The same. 3 Q- Fifty-three percent asbestos? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. And these were two different types of friction 6 elements that were used on overhead cranes? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. Now, during the '60's, '70's, and the '80's, from 9 whom did Harnischfeger purchase the friction elements 10 for use -- the disc braking friction elements and the 11 shoe brake friction elements? 12 A. The sources would have been as the ones that I named 13 earlier, H. K. Porter, Johns-Manville, 14 Raybestos-Manhattan, and others who X can't 15 remember. 16 Q. You said Gatke also? 17 A. Okay. Gatke. 18 Q- Urn-hum. Looking at document 424 which is a part of 19 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 1, does that refresh your 20 recollection as to the manufacturers and suppliers of 21 the asbestos friction elements used as disc brakes 22 and brake shoes purchased by Harnischfeger? 23 A. Yes, it does. 24 Q- So you purchased asbestos friction products from 25 Abex, American Brakelok; is that correct? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02041 62 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Allen Friction? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Where was Allen Friction from? 5 A. Houston, Texas. 6 Q. Fenner American, where were they from? 7 A. I don't know. 8 Q. And you mentioned Gatke. H. K. Porter. National 9 Friction. Where was National Friction from? 10 A. Indiana. Where in Indiana, I'm not sure. I don't 11 recall, but they were located in Indiana. 12 Q. You mentioned Raybestos and then finally Standco; is 13 that correct? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Where was Standco from? 16 A. I believe they were in -- were or are in Houston, 17 Texas. 18 Q. Now, the hoists, were they the manufacturer also of 19 the friction products used in the hoist equipment - 20 the hoists I should say? 21 A. The hoists used disc brakes, and they were the - 22 some of them were the manufacturers of those disc 23 brakes, yes. 24 Q. Were there any other manufacturers or suppliers of 25 the disc brakes used not on the overhead cranes but ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02042 63 1 on the hoists? 2 A. Not any others that I can recall beyond the names 3' that are listed on this sheet, no. 4 Q. The hoists that were not used as a part of the . 5 overhead crane, were they also -- did they also 6 utilize friction disc type friction products? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q- And would the manufacturers and suppliers of those 9 disc type friction products be the same as you have 10 talked about today? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Nothing different? 13 A. Not that I can recall, no. 14 Q. Is H. K. Porter still in existence to your knowledge? 15 A. I don't know. 16 Q. To whom did -- Let me ask it this way. Did 17 Harnischfeger sell the hoists to steel mills, not the 18 hoists that were part of the overhead cranes but the 19 stand alone hoists? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Did they sell the hoist to aluminum facilities - 22 aluminum manufacturing facilities? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. Did they sell the hoist to chemical facilities? 25 A. Yes. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02043 64 1 Q. Did they sell the hoist to power houses? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Were overhead cranes sold to power generation 4 facilities? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Were overhead cranes and hoists sold to chemical 7 manufacturing facilities? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Did these friction elements wear out with use? 10 A. I don't think wear out is a correct term. They did 11 wear with use, yes. 12 Q. Would they disintegrate? 13 A. No, not disintegrate. Wear would take place on the 14 surface of the friction material. 15 Q. What would a three-eighths inch disc friction 16 material wear down to, a half inch friction material? 17 MR. JAMES: Three-eighths and a half inch. 18 MR. FALK: You have it growing. 19 THE WITNESS: That would be nice. 20 MR. FALK: Maybe you can answer it any 21 way. 22 BY MR. WHITE: 23 Q. Say if we had a three-quarter inch friction element, 24 would that wear down to a half inch? 25 A. Yes. ACCURATE EXPORTING CO. Toth 02044 65 1 Q. So there would be wear out through usage? 2 A. There would be wear taking place through usage, yes. 3 Q. And you would lose some of the asbestos fibers, 4 correct? 5 A. No. We don't believe that that's correct. 6 Q. Why is that not correct? 7 A. Because the wear debris or the product of wear does 8 not contain any asbestos fibers. 9 Q. How do you know that? 10 A. We had it tested and analyzed. 11 Q. . When was it tested? 12 A. In 1990. 13 Q. Who tested it? 14 A. The gentleman that wrote the report and did the 15 testing, his name is Bradt, B-r-a-d-t. 16 Q. What's his first name? 17 A. I don't remember. 18 Q. Who did Mr. Bradt work for? 19 A. I don't know. 20 Q. Did he work for Harnischfeger? 21 A. No. 22 Q. But this report was generated in 1991? 23 A. The testing was done in 1990. I don't know when the 24 report was generated. 25 Q. And through the wear what would happen to the ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02045 VWf'-i'i 66 1 asbestos fibers? . 2 A. They became transformed into wear debris of very fine 3 powder, wear debris that contained no asbestos fiber. 4 Q. When did you first learn that? 5 A. I guess, as I would say, I learned it as a result of 6 the test that was made in 1990, but we made a 7 considered decision prior to that time during 1980's 8 that this was -- that was the case that the debris 9 did not contain asbestos fibers. 10 Q. How did you know that before the test was performed? 11 A. By looking at the wear debris. 12 Q. Who looked at the wear debris before it was looked at 13 by Mr. Bradt? 14 A. A number of people did including myself. 15 Q. And when you looked at the wear debris, did you see 16 asbestos fibers? 17 A. No. 18 Q. How could you tell the difference between wear debris 19 that was asbestos and that was not asbestos? 20 A. It was such a fine dust that composed the wear 21 debris, it was not fibrous in nature. 22 Q- Asbestos fibers can be reduced to powder; is that 23 correct? 24 A. Apparently they can, yes. 25 Q. When did you first hear the term fosterite? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02046 67 1 A. I believe it was -- I heard the term as a result of 2 the testing that was done in 1990. 3 Q. And before 1990 you never heard the term fosterite? 4 A. No. 5 Q. And in 1990 Harnischfeger was no longer using 6 asbestos friction products; is that correct? 7 A. That's correct. 8 Q. Why was the test performed in 1990 if Harnischfeger 9 was.no longer using asbestos friction products? 10 A. To confirm what we already knew and as a result of 11 asbestos litigation. 12 Q. Did you in the 1980's have an expert look at the wear 13 debris under an electron microscope to determine 14 whether asbestos fibers were present? 15 A. No. 16 Q. What is -- What is your belief as to how asbestos 17 fibers are transformed into fosterite? 18 MR. JAMES: If you know. 19 THE WITNESS: I don't claim to be an expert 20 on asbestos and its formation and its change in 21 formation, but I would -- my opinion it would come 22 about as a result of friction, heat, and pressure. 23 BY MR. WHITE: 24 Q. Were you aware that Harnischfeger has advertised in 25 the past that there is low pressure and low heat in ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02047 68 1 utilizing the friction elements on the braking 2 systems in the products made by Harnischfeger? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. If there is low pressure and low heat, the wear 5 element would not -- the dust elements would not 6 transfer to fosterites? 7 A. No. 8 Q. No what? No, that's not correct? 9 A. Yes, that's not.correct. 10 Q. Why is that not correct? 11 A. Well, the term low heat and low pressure is relative 12 to high heat and high pressure. The type of brake 13 that's used on a crane and on a hoist is used in a 14 location in the machinery where low pressure and low 15 heat occur, but the term low heat is a total concept 16 of looking at the entire brake. It does not mean 17 that there are not very hot spots on the surface of 18 that brake. 19 Q. If there are not hot spots on the surface of the 20 brake and also at the same time a wear element, that 21 brake would not -- with the asbestos fiber at that 22 spot would not become fosterite; is that correct? 23 A. There couldn't be a brake that did not have these 24 individual isolated hot spots. 25 Q. But the spots that were not isolated as hot spots ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02048 69 1 would not transform the asbestos fibers to fosterite; 2 is that correct? 3 A. No. 4 Q. What temperature has to be applied to transfer an 5 asbestos fiber to fosterite? 6 A. I don't know. 7 Q. How many tests did Mr. Bradt perform? 8 A. To the best of my knowledge, one. 9 Q. Did you see the test performed? 10 A. No. 11 Q. Can you describe for me how the test was performed? 12 A. Well, I read his report, and I recall that there was 13 an analysis made of the material which the brake was 14 composed of, and there was also an analysis made of 15 , the wear debris that was collected from that same 16 brake. And in the brake material that was analyzed 17 there was asbestos fiber, and in the wear debris 18 there was no asbestos fibers. 19 Q. Who instructed Mr. Bradt to perform that test? 20 A. Harnischfeger. 21 Q. Who at Harnischfeger? 22 A. I don't recall. 23 Q. Which department instructed Mr. Bradt to perform that 24 test? 25 A. It would have been the hoist products group. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02049 70 1 Q. Who headed up the hoist products group? 2 A. In 1990 I don't recall. I was the responsible 3 engineer, and I was a part of that group, but I don't 4 recall who the general manager was in 1990. 5 Q. Did you instruct him to perform that test, Mr. Bradt? 6 A. I could have. It could have been me. 7 Q. Who asked you to have Mr. Bradt perform the test? 8 A. I don't remember. 9 Q. Where is Mr. Bradt today? 10 A. I don't know, 11 Q. Where was he at that time when he performed the test? 12 A. I know he was in our plant to gather the material. 13 Where he performed the test, I don't know. 14 Q. Who was he employed by? 15 A. I don't know. 16 Q. What was his first name? 17 A. I don't remember. 18 Q. Was he from Milwaukee? 19 A. No, I don't believe so. 20 MR. WHITE: Off the record. 21 (Discussion held off the record.) 22 MR. WHITE: Back on the record. 23 BY MR. WHITE: 24 Q. Who made the friction element that was tested by Mr. 25 Bradt? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02050 71 1 A. I don't know which one of the suppliers made it. It 2 would have been one of the ones we talked about. 3 Q. So a special effort had to be made to go back to a 4 supplier in 1990 to get a piece of friction material 5 for testing by Mr. Bradt; is that correct? . 6 A. No. The material that was analyzed was a friction 7 disc that had been in use in a hoist -- in an 8 overhead hoist in the Harnischfeger plant for quite a 9 few years. I don't know exactly how many years, but 10 at least fourteen to fifteen years. 11 Q. Someone took it out of that piece of equipment - 12 removed it from that piece of equipment? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. Did they test the element -- Was the dust debris 15 tested when the disc friction materials were removed 16 from that product or that crane? 17 MR. JAMES: Hoist? 18 MR. WHITE: Hoist. 19 THE WITNESS: The disc brake on that hoist 20 was totally enclosed by a cover as are most disc 21 brakes on hoists. 22 BY MR. WHITE: 23 Q. Is that where the friction material or the dust - 24 the dust debris was obtained from? 25 A. Yes. Both the friction material and the wear debris ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02051 72 1 that was obtained came from that hoist that was in 2 the Harnischfeger plant on the hoist that was totaled 3 with the brake that was totally enclosed. 4 Q. It was in an overhead crane -- It was a hoist of an 5 overhead crane? 6 A. No, it was a hoist on a jib crane. 1 Q. What type of crane? 8 A. Jib crane, j-i-b. 9 Q. Was it the same type of friction disc material that 10 would have been incorporated into a hoist or on an 11 overhead crane that would have been sold to a steel 12 mill? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. How do you know that? 15 A. The specifications for the friction material tell you 16 that it's the same composition. 17 Q. Was that the only test that was ever performed by 18 Harnischfeger to determine whether asbestos fibers 19 remained in the debris material? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Did Mr. Bradt test the transite board that was part 22 of the overhead crane cab? 23 A. No. 24 (Break taken.) 25 (Exhibit No. 4 was marked for ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02052 73 1 identification.) 2 BY MR. WHITE: . 3 Q. Sir, the test that Mr. Bradt performed, he performed 4, it on a friction element taken from where or from 5 what -- what was it? 6 A. From an overhead hoist. 7 Q. It was taken from a hoist? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Now, I want to show you what's been marked as . 10 Plaintiff's Exhibit 4, and I'll represent to you it's 11 a copy that we picked out of Sweet's catalog, and if 12 you'll turn to the second page, you'll see that 13 Exhibit 4 pertains to -- to Harnischfeger; is that 14 correct? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Okay. And if you turn to -- actually it's page two. 17 If you turn to page two of the Harnischfeger 18 Corporation, what would you call this whole 19 document? Is it a sales brochure? What would you 20 call it? 21 A. It looks like a document that exhibits the products 22 of Harnischfeger Material Handling, the products 23 being electric hoists and then overhead cranes also. 24 Q. Would it be a sales brochure or an advertisement? 25 A. Yes. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02053 74 1 Q. And if you look at page two of Exhibit 4, it speaks 2 of balanced design means less maintenance; is that 3 correct? 4 A. Yes. . 5 Q- And I believe they're talking about -- Harnischfeger 6 is talking about the hoist or a hoist that they 7 manufacture? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q- Okay. And they're talking about self-adjusting 10 brakes; is that correct? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And they say -- I'm going to ask you whether you 13 agree with this statement, "The self-adjusting brakes 14 needs no periodic tinkering, and brake lining 15 pressure is so low that it never heats up, wears 16 little, and needs no replacement for years." Did I 17 read that correct? 18 A. Yes, that's correct. 19 Q. And if the brake lining does not heat up, fosterite 20 can't be created; is that correct? 21 MR. JAMES: Objection. Asked and 22 answered. 23 THE WITNESS: I explained that I don't 24 claim to know the temperatures and pressures that are 25 involved in the transformation of material from one ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02054 75 1 form to another, and it's true that the pressure is 2 low -- relatively low compared to the application of 3 other brakes. 4 BY MR. WHITE: 5 Q. Well, in the advertisement represented by Exhibit 4, 6 they're not only speaking of the pressure but they're 7 speaking of the temperatures generated in brake 8 lining use; is that correct? 9 A. Yes. It relates to the entire braking system. 10 Q. Including the brake linings? 11 A. Yes. But it does not mean that where there are 12 points of contact between the friction disc and its 13 meeting surface that there are not hot spots where 14 that occurs. It just doesn't generate a lot of heat 15 to cause distortion or noticeable heat to the entire 16 brake system. 17 Q. So if the friction -- the friction element does not 18 hit a hot spot, fosterite will not be created and 19 asbestos fibers will be retained? 20 A. But there are hot spots. They're very small areas of 21 contact between the meeting surface and the brake. 22 Q. But there are also points of contact on the friction 23 product that are not hot spots, and fosterite is not 24 created; is that correct? 25 A. If the spots are not hot, they're not in contact. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02055 76 1 Q. And fosterite can't be created? 2 A. Nothing would be created. 3 Q. And asbestos fibers would be retained? 4 A. In the friction material. 5 Q. Okay. Let me ask you, did, to your knowledge, 6 Harnischfeger ever purchase any asbestos friction 7 products from any of the following named companies, 8 I'm going to read you a list, okay? 9 A. Okay. 10 Q. I'm going to quickly go through the following list of 11 companies and ask you, and the question's going to be 12 pertaining to each company's name that I read. Did 13 Harnischfeger, the corporation, the P&H Material 14 Handling Division or Harnischfeger Industries or any 15 Harnischfeger that you're aware of did any of those 16 corporate structures buy any asbestos containing 17 friction products from any of these companies? 18 A. Okay. 19 MR. JAMES: Let me interject and say, 20 again, he is prepared and we're presenting him only 21 as to knowledge relating to Harnischfeger 22 Corporation. Your question is much broader as to any 23 other entity that may have been raised here today. 24 If he knows, he knows, and you're welcome to ask. 25 But I'm saying it's only related to friction products ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02056 77 1 purchased for friction products by Harnischfeger 2 Corporation - 3 THE WITNESS: That's the only one that I 4 would know. 5 MR. JAMES: -- and its division material 6 handling. 7 BY MR. WHITE: 8 Q- First company is Abex Corporation. Now, you already 9 stated that they bought asbestos friction products 10 from Abex? 11 A. Yes, they did. 12 Q. And that's known as American Brakelok? 13 A. I believe so, yes. 14 Q. Did you buy from Pnemo Abex? 15 A. I don't recognize the name. 16 Q. Bigelow-Liptak? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Allied Signal? 19 A. I don't recognize that as a name on a list that has 20 any of the sources. 21 Q. Bendix Corporation? 22 A. That's possible, but I don't know for sure. It isn't 23 one that stands out in my mind as a source. 24 Q. Why do you think it's possible that you bought 25 asbestos friction products from Bendix? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02057 78 1 A. It may have been listed in some of these 2 specifications, I just don't recall. 3 Q. Barritts? 4 A. No. . 5 Q. American Optical? 6 A. No. 7 Q. Coppers? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Beazer East? 10 A. No. 11 Q. B.F. Goodrich? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Bondex, B-o-n-d-e-x? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Borg-Warner? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Carborundum? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Cooper Industries? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Potomac Edison? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Wagner Electric? 24 A. We did not buy friction material from them, but we 25 did use Wagner brakes when specified. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02058 79 1 Q. Who would have specified Wagner brakes? 2 A. The purchaser of the crane. 3 Q. Your customer? 4 A. Yes. . 5 Q. If you used Wagner brakes, whose friction material 6 would you use? Whose asbestos friction material / 7 would you use? 8 A. Whatever friction material was used by Wagner in the 9 brake. I don't know what that would be. 10 Q. Well, you bought Wagner brakes, would the asbestos 11 friction material already have been affixed? 12 A. Yes, it would be a part of the Wagner brake. 13 Q. When do you recall purchasing Wagner brakes? 14 I don't know specifically what time frame, but I know 15 there were cranes on which we used Wagner brakes when 16 requested by the purchaser. 17 Q. During the '60's, the '70's, or the '80's, was 18 there -- were there any particular time periods or 19 years where you only bought the asbestos friction 20 materials from a particular manufacturer? For 21 instance, in 1975 did you only buy asbestos 22 containing friction material from one manufacturer? 23 A. I'm sure that was the case, but, you know, for what 24 period of time a particular supplier supplied it, I 25 don't know. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02059 80 1 Q. Who would know that? 2 A. As a matter of fact, I tried to find that out myself 3 and was not able to do that because the records that 4 would reflect that kind of information are no longer 5 available. 6 Q. What happened to those records? 7 A. They were destroyed. 8 Q. Do you know when they were destroyed? 9 A. No. 10 Q. Do you know under whose direction they were 11 destroyed? 12 A. No. 13 Q. How do you know they were destroyed? 14 A. I asked for the records, and I was not able to get 15 them. 16 Q. Who did you ask? What individual? 17 A. I asked people in the purchasing department who would 18 have been responsible for those records. 19 Q. Who was that individual? 20 A. Well a particular individual that I can think of is a 21 Dwight Shumway, S-h-u-m-w-a-y. 22 Q. How long has he been in purchasing? 23 A. I don't know. More than fifteen years. 24 Q. Who was his predecessor? 25 A. I don't recall. ACCAIRATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02060 81 1 Q. He still with Harnischfeger? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. In Milwaukee? 4 A. Yes. 5 Q. Crane Company? 6 A. No. 7 Q. John Crane? 8 A. No. 9 Q. There's reference to John Crane Company or Crane 10 Company in Plaintiff's Exhibit 1. Did you know that 11 A. No. 12 13 MR. JAMES: In regard. to what context? MR. WHITE: Friction material I believe. 14 MR. JAMES: In that regard, if documents 15 say something to what Mr. Toth recalls, then the 16 documents speak for themselves. 17 BY MR. WHITE: 18 Q. Durabla? 19 A. No. 20 Q. Durametallic? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Elof Hansson? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Garlock? 25 A. No. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02061 82 1 Q. Good Year? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Did I ask you Goodrich? 4 A. No, yes. 5 Q. No Goodrich? 6 A. No Goodrich. 7 Q. Grant Wilson? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Greene Tweed? 10 A. No. 11 Q. Palmetto? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Ingersoll-Rand? 14 A. No. . 15 Q. Did you ever hear of a company called Trimbow and 16 Lutz? 17 A. No, I have not. 18 Q. M.H. Detrick? 19 A. No. 20 Q. Norton, N-o-r-t-o-n? 21 A. No. 22 Q. Okonite? 23 A. No. 24 Q. Plibrico? 25 A. No. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02062 83 1 Q. Record Industrial? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Rockwell International? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Safety First? 6 A. No. 7 Q. Sepco? 8 A. No. 9 Q. Triangle? 10 A. No. 11 Q. Uniroyal? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Westinghouse? 14 A. No. 15 Q. I want you to take a look at what I marked as 16 Plaintiff's Exhibit 2 and tell me whether your 17 company, Harnischfeger, ever sold any product 18 containing asbestos to any of those job sites or 19 companies. 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. Yes what? 22 A. Yes, they did. 23 Q. Which ones, please? 24 A. I'll give you the ones I recognize. 25 Q. Okay. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02063 84 1 MR. JAMES: Do you understand? He wants to 2 know if you recall an overhead crane or hoist 3 specifically ever being sold to any of those 4 companies in general. 5 THE WITNESS: Yes. ' 6 MR. JAMES: And, therefore, this question 7 is any component parts were shipped or sold to those 8 companies that contained asbestos. 9 BY MR. WHITE: 10 Q. I want you to take a look at what's been marked as 11 Exhibit 2 and tell me whether Harnischfeger ever sold 12 any products containing asbestos to any of those 13 companies or any of those job sites. 14 A.. Okay. 15 Q. Okay. 16 A. DuPont. Dow Corporation. Union Carbide. PPG. U.S. 17 Steel. Jones & Laughlin/LTV Steel. 18 Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel. Weirton Steel. 19 Westinghouse. That's it. 20 Q. Did you ever sell to Ormet/Conalco in Ohio? 21 A. I don't recall. 22 Q. Or 01 in- Matheson? 23 A. Again, I don't recall seeing or -- I don't recall 24 that name as being a customer. Maybe they were. 25 Q- Did you ever sell to International Nickel or Inco in ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02064 1L 85 1 Huntington, West Virginia? 2 A. I don't recall specifically that name either. 3 Q. American Car Foundry in Huntington, West Virginia? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Conner Steel in Huntington, West Virginia? 6 A. I don't recall the name. 7 Q. What did you sell to Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel? 8 A. Overhead cranes and hoists. 9 Q. When? 10 A. Well, certainly during the period of time that I was 11 employed by Harnischfeger. Perhaps since then, 12 perhaps before then. 13 Q. During the '60's, the '70's, or '80's? 14 A. Yes. 15 Q. Okay. How many? 16 A. I don't know. 17 Q. How many overhead cranes? 18 A. I don't know. 19 Q. Can you estimate for me? 20 A. No, I can't. 21 Q. Did you ever go to Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel to 22 inspect the overhead crane? 23 A. Not that I can recall, no. 24 Q. Did you ever go out to the customer's location to 25 participate in the installation or the repair of an ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02065 86 1 overhead crane or hoist? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. Do you recall going to Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel? 4 A. No, I don't. Not to say I didn't, I just don't 5 recall. 6 Q. Do you know in which facility of Wheeling-Pittsburgh 7 Steel the overhead crane or the hoist was installed? 8 A. No. I don't remember. 9 Q. Do you remember -- Strike that. 10 Do you remember the 11 Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel in Stubenville, Ohio? 12 A. No. 13 Q. Follansbee, West Virginia? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel? 16 A. No. 17 Q. Yorkville, Ohio? 18 A. No. 19 Q. Mingo Junction, Ohio? 20 A. No. 21 Q. Martins Ferry, Ohio? 22 A. No. 23 Q. Did Harnischfeger have sales personnel to travel to 24 different job sites and customers seeking to sell 25 their overhead cranes and hoists? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02066 1 A. Yes. 87 2 Q. Do you know the individual in the '60's, '70's, and 3 '80's who had the responsibility to sell to 4 Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel? 5 A. There were a number of people that would have been 6 involved in the sales and in those areas over the 7 years. 8 Q. Which areas? Now are you talking about a customer or 9 a territory? 10 A. Well, both a customer and a territory, but I don't 11 recall who was there when. If we can identify the 12 cranes by serial number, that information could be 13 determined. 14 Q. Who had the sales responsibility for Harnischfeger to 15 seek to sell to eastern Ohio, West Virginia, and 16 western Pennsylvania? 17 A. The individual would have been a person located in 18 our Pittsburgh office, but over the years, that was a 19 number of different people. 20 Q. Can I have some of their names of the individuals who 21 are still living if possible? 22 A. One of them is James Mock, M-o-c-k. 23 Q. Is he still with Harnischfeger? 24 A. No. 25 Q. Who is he with now, do you know? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02067 88 1 A. He's retired. 2 Q. In Pittsburgh? 3 A. No, in Milwaukee. Another name that I can recall is 4 Koffman, but I can't remember his first name. 5 K-o-f-f-m-a-n. . 6 Q. Does he still work with Harnischfeger? 7 A. No. 8 Q. Is he retired? 9 A. Retired. And I'm not sure he's living any longer. 10 That's all I can remember that worked out of the 11 Pittsburgh office. There were others. I just can't 12 recall who they were. 13 Q. Do you recall any people who lived in Pittsburgh who 14 are still living in Pittsburgh who had the sales 15 responsibility in that area? 16 A. No. 17 Q. If the individuals working out of the Pittsburgh 18 office seek to sell into West Virginia? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Is the Pittsburgh office still in existence? 21 A. Yes. 22 Q. What's the address? 23 A. I don't know. 24 Q. Is it under Harnischfeger? ' 25 A. Harnischfeger or P&H, yes. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02068 89 1 Q. What did you sell to Union Carbide and when? 2 A. I know we sold them overhead cranes, and I don't 3 remember during any particular period or whether 4 there was any particular period during the selling of 5 cranes to them, and I believe they also bought 6 overhead hoists. 7 Q. What did you sell to DuPont and when? 8 A. The same things, overhead cranes and hoists. 9 Q. Which DuPont facility was that? 10 MR. JAMES: If you know. 11 BY MR. WHITE: 12 Q. If you know. 13 A. I don't know, and it may be that we don't know 14 because they were sold to DuPont for their own 15 location as to where they were going to go. 16 Q. But Harnischfeger people would go -- Harnischfeger 17 employees would go out to the location to install the 18 overhead crane; is that correct? 19 A. No, not always. Sometimes Harnischfeger people were 20 involved in the installation, sometimes they were 21 not. In the case of overhead hoists, we did not sell 22 them directly to the end user. They were sold 23 through distributors and being once removed, 24 Harnischfeger would not know a specific location that 25 a company like DuPont would use the equipment in. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02069 90 1 Q- Would Harnischfeger sell asbestos containing hoists 2 through distributors? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Which distributors did you sell through in eastern 5 Ohio, western Pennsylvania, and West Virginia? 6 A. Couple that I can remember in Pittsburgh are 7 Braunlich-Russle, B-r-a-u-n-l-I-c-h, dash, 8 R-e-e-s-l-e, I believe that's the way it's spelled. 9 I'm trying to think of the other one. It's on the 10 tip of my tongue, but I can't remember. It was our 11 most recent distributor in the Pittsburgh area. 12 Q- Is it McCullough? 13 A. No, I can't think of it. 14 Q. Did you ever visit the facilities in Pittsburgh? 15 A. Yes. 16 Q. Where in Pittsburgh was it located? 17 A. It was out of the city somewhere out among the hills 18 by the valley. 19 Q- That happens lot. 20 A. I was never able to keep track of where I was in 21 Pittsburgh, so I can't give you an accurate 22 location. 23 Q. Who would have better knowledge of that distributor 24 than you right now? 25 A. The home office here in Milwaukee. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02070 91 1 Q. That's a current distributor? 2 A. No. It's -- our most recent distributor but not a 3 distributor any longer. 4 Q. When were they last a distributor? 5 MR. JAMES: PDS, that's.the name of the 6 company. 7 BY MR. WHITE: 8 Q. Pittsburgh Design Services? 9 A. It's Pittsburgh Design Services. 10 Q. Any other distributors for eastern Ohio, western 11 Pennsylvania, or West Virginia? 12 A. At one time we had a number of distributor dealers - 13 distributors in the Cleveland area that covered Ohio, 14 but I can't remember what they all were -- their 15 names. 16 Q. Do you recall any of their names? Would these 17 Cleveland distributors cover Wheeling-Pittsburgh 18 Steel in southeastern Ohio? 19 A. I don't remember the extent of their territories 20 . whether that was covered out of Cleveland or 21 Pittsburgh. I don't remember or whether it was 22 always one way or the other. ' 23 Q. Were there any other distributors that you recall out 24 of Pittsburgh or West Virginia? 25 A. Not that I can remember the names of, no. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02071 92 1 C- These distributors would somewhere be in the records 2 of Harnischfeger? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. Would these distributors be distributors for overhead 5 cranes also? . 6 A. No. Hoists. ' 7 Q. Only hoists? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. Why did you utilize distributors for the hoists and 10 not utilize distributors for the overhead cranes? 11 A. There are far more overhead hoists than.there are 12 overhead cranes, and Harnischfeger dealt with three 13 dealers and distributors to cover the needs for those 14 hoists whereas overhead cranes were sold directly to 15 the end user. There were not as many cranes. They 16 required more knowledge and detail in their sale than 17 an overhead hoist did. Those are a couple of 18 reasons. 19 Q. If you were to sell, for instance, an overhead crane 20 to Wheeling-Pittsburgh Steel, would the Harnischfeger 21 people go to the job site to direct the installation 22 or to do the installation? 23 A. I can't answer directly for Wheeling-Pittsburgh 24 Steel, but there were times when Harnischfeger was 25 involved in the installation, and there was times ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02072 93 1 when they were not involved in the installation 2 depending on the customer and whether he wanted our 3 involvement in this. 4 Q. What would be the more likely scenario that 5 Harnischfeger would or would not be involved? 6 A. Harnischfeger would be involved. 7 Q. Would these be engineering people like yourself or 8 would these be like labor -- millwright type people, 9 iron type people, or ironworkers, or what would be 10 their expertise I should say? 11 A. It would typically be a person in our services 12 division for technical expertise in the installation 13 of the equipment. In the initial sale it could be 14 the sales person in that particular area. Depending 15 upon the complexity of the crane, it may be a 16 technical person such as myself to go help set up the 17 crane to get it to do what it's supposed to do. 18 Q. What would Harnischfeger charge for these cranes? 19 Can you give me a ball park figure? 20 A. A price for a crane? 21 Q. For the overhead crane. 22 A. The prices of a crane can vary anywhere from ten to 23 twelve thousand to a couple of million dollars. 24 Q. Okay. And the hoists, how much would a hoist cost? 25 A. Perhaps as little as $4,000 to $100,000. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02073 94 1 Q. What did you sell to Weirton Steel? 2 A. Overhead cranes and hoists. 3 Q. Westinghouse. What did you sell to Westinghouse? 4 A. Overhead cranes and hoist. 5 Q. Which Westinghouse facility? 6 A. I don't know. 7 Q. And what did you sell to J & L/LTV? 8 A. Overhead cranes and hoists. 9 Q. Which facilities? 10 A. I don't remember. 11 Q. What did you sell to U.S. Steel? 12 A. Overhead cranes and hoists. 13 Q. Which facilities? 14 A. I don't know. 15 Q. You don't recall? 16 A. I don't recall. 17 Q. And that's overhead cranes and hoists that contained 18 asbestos? 19 A. Yes. 20 Q. Would Harnischfeger sell replacement asbestos 21 components to these companies? 22 A. Yes. 23 Q. So, in other words, Harnischfeger would purchase from 24 the manufacturer asbestos containing friction 25 products and then sell it to the customer? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02074 95 1 A. Yes. Usually through a parts distributor for that 2 particular area where the equipment is being used. 3 Q. Who do you utilize as a parts distributor in eastern 4 Ohio, western Pennsylvania, and West Virginia? 5 A. Same companies I mentioned earlier. 6 Q. Braumlich-Reesle and Pittsburgh Design Services? 7 A. Yes. There may have been others, but I don't recall 8 who they were. 9 Q. Those two companies were in Pittsburgh. Who did you 10 utilize in eastern Ohio as a parts distributor and 11 West Virginia? 12 A. Well, again, we had dealers and distributors in the 13 Cleveland area whose names I can't you recall that 14 would have covered that area. I think that that 15 would be it as far as that area is concerned, western 16 Pennsylvania, West Virginia, and eastern Ohio. 17 Possibly Cincinnati we had dealers and distributors 18 in an office there at one time. 19 Q. Is Pittsburgh Design Services still in existence? 20 A. Yes. 21 Q. And you say they're in Pittsburgh? 22 A. Yes. And in the Pittsburgh area. 23 Q. Did you utilize Frick and Linsey as a parts 24 distributor? 25 A. I don't recognize the name. I would say no. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02075 96 1 Q. Do you recall selling hoists or overhead cranes to 2 power houses? 3 A. Yes. 4 Q. In eastern Ohio, West Virginia, and western 5 Pennsylvania? 6 A. I. don't recall. We dealt with power companies and 7 with the designer of power plants who actually bought 8 the equipment, and it may be that we have equipment 9 in that area. I don't recall. I know we have cranes 10 and hoists in power plants. 11 Q. Would you recognize -- If I were to give you a list 12 of power facilities, would you recognize any of those 13 power facilities as being locations where you 14 installed overhead cranes and/or hoists? 15 A. I would recognize some of them. 16 Q. Stratton, Ohio? 17 A. I don't recall. 18 Q. Toronto? 19 A. I don't recall. 20 Q. Brillian-Cardinal (phonetic)? 21 A. I don't recall. 22 Q, Berger? 23 A. I don't recall that. 24 Q. Mount Storm? 25 A. No. ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02076 97 1 Q. Fort Martin? 2 A. It's not a familiar name. 3 Q. Mitchell Power, West Virginia? 4 A. I don't recall that. . 5 Q. Do you recall selling to Edison -- excuse me------Ohio 6 Power? 7 A. No, not specifically. 8 Q. Monongahela Power? ' 9 A. No. 10 Q. AEP? 11 A. No. 12 Q. Virginia Electric Power Company? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Did you sell to Ravenswood or Kaiser and Ravenswood, 15 West Virginia? 16 A. Well, I know that Kaiser was a customer. I don't 17 know if it was specific at the Ravenswood facility. 18 Q. Have you ever heard of the Ravenswood facility? 19 A. I've heard of Ravenswood, yes. 20 Q. Do you recall in what context you heard of 21 Ravenswood? . 22 A. I think it's a street name in Wauwatosa. 23 Q. What's the name of the city? 24 A. Wauwatosa. 25 MR. JAMES: Let me ask a follow-up question ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02077 98 1 or I'll be doing it later. Mr. Toth, when you stated 2 that ycu believed that you sold overhead cranes and 3 Karnischfeger sold overhead cranes and hoists, you 4 mentioned several sounded familiar, 5 Wheeling-Pittsburgh, DuPont, and the others? 6 THE WITNESS: Yes. 7 MR. JAMES: You have no knowledge without 8 further information as to serial numbers or specific 9 information as to specific overhead cranes and hoists 10 specifically where any of those products were sold 11 to, correct? 12 THE WITNESS: Yes. I think I stated that, 13 and if we can identify the crane, we can identify 14 where it went and who sold it. 15 MR. JAMES: So you have no specific 16 knowledge whether or not any overhead crane or hoists 17 are located within these facilities that we've talked 18 about? 19 THE WITNESS: That's correct. 20 MR. JAMES: Thank you. 21 BY MR. WHITE: 22 Q. On the overhead cranes and the hoists that 23 Harnischfeger sold, the name Harnischfeger is affixed 24 in terms of a plate or an identification plate; is 25 that correct? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02078 99 1 A. P&H and Harnischfeger. 2 Q. It is affixed to an overhead crane or hoist via a 3 metal plate? 4 A. Yes, or a decal. 5 Q. Okay. When did you first become aware that asbestos 6 was a hazard? 7 A. Probably sometime during the 1970's. 8 Q. Did you receive that information from some individual 9 at Harnischfeger? 10 A. No, it was just general information known to the 11 public. 12 Q. When in 1970's? 13 A. I don't recall specifically. Perhaps between 1975 14 and 1980. . 15 Q. And how long had -- after that did Harnischfeger 16 continue to sell overhead cranes or hoists with 17 friction components containing asbestos? 18 A. Until approximately 1985. 19 Q. And you never saw any warning on any overhead crane 20 or hoist warning of the asbestos hazard danger? 21 A. That is correct. 22 MR. JAMES: If you know. 23 BY MR. WHITE: 24 Q. Thank you. When did you last work for 25 Harnischfeger? In 1995; is that correct? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02079 100 1 A. Yes. 2 Q. Okay. Do you recall in 1994 what the gross sales of 3 Harnischfeger totaled? 4 A. No, I don't. . 5 Q. Do you have any information as per any year in the 6 '80's or '90's in terms of the gross sales of the 7 products that Harnischfeger manufactured? 8 A. No. I don't recall what they are. They're a matter 9 of public record, but I don't recall what they were 10 for any given year. 11 Q. Do you have any information as to the insurance 12 coverage for product liability cases carried by 13 Harnischfeger in terms of asbestos litigation? 14 A. No, I do not. 15 Q. Do you have any information as to any medical 16 literature contained within any medical library or 17 within the facility of Harnischfeger on asbestos 18 disclosed disease? 19 A. No, I don't. 20 Q. Did Harnischfeger have a medical director? 21 A. No. . 22 Q. To your knowledge -- I'm sorry. Were you done? 23 A. Yes. 24 Q. I'm sorry. Did Harnischfeger have any industrial 25 hygienist? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02080 1 A. No. 101 2 Q. Do you know whether Harnischfeger ever had any 3 worker's compensation claims filed against for 4 asbestos caused disease? 5 A. Yes. I know that they did not. 6 Q. How do you know that? 7 A. It was one of the answers we gave to the 8 interrogatories, but that question was asked. 9 Q. And you researched it in answering the 10 interrogatories? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. Do you know whether any of the asbestos containing 13 components whether it be friction product for disc 14 brakes or friction products for the brake shoes or 15 the transite or whether it was sawed or drilled or 16 shaved or with a grinding wheel within the facilities 17 of Harnischfeger? 18 MR. JAMES: Objection. Asked and 19 answered. Go ahead and answer. 20 THE WITNESS: There were discs and brake 21 shoes that were drilled. 22 BY MR. WHITE: 23 Q. At Harnischfeger? 24 A. At Harnischfeger. 25 Q. During what time period? ACCURATE REPORTING CO. Toth 02081 102 1 A. Up until the time Harnischfeger stopped using 2 asbestos materials, approximately 1985, but I don't 3 remember at what time that process began. 4 Q. Do you know whether the individual who did this ' 5 fabrication, this drilling, grinding, and so forth 6 wore respirators? 7 MR. JAMES: Object. That's a 8 mischaracterization. The question incorporated 9 grinding other, but he's stated disc and brake shoes 10 were at times drilled only. 11 THE WITNESS: Right. 12 MR. JAMES: Rephrase the question. 13 THE WITNESS: I'm aware that at times - 14 Well, I'm not aware of every occasion upon which this 15 process took place, but I'm aware that at times when 16 it was done, workers were given protection to perform 17 that operation 18 BY MR. WHITE: 19 Q. What type of protection? 20 A. Masks. 21 Q. Do you know when they first began to wear masks? 22 A. No, I don't. 23 Q. Do you know why the workers were given masks when 24 they drilled the asbestos friction products? 25 A. To prevent the inhalation of dust. AC.C.TJRATF RKPCmTINO, CD Toth 02082 103 1 Q- Was it to prevent inhalation of the asbestos fibers? 2 A. Dust. 3 Q. Was the asbestos fiber one component of the dust? 4 MR. JAMES: If you know. 5 THE WITNESS: I don't know. 6 BY MR. WHITE : 7 Q. Were there any airborne samples taken within the 8 Harnischfeger facilities to determining the quantity, 9 if any, asbestos fibers had become airborne with the 10 drilling of the asbestos friction component? 11 A. I don't know. There could have been. I don't know 12 that there were. That is not something that was part 13 of my regular responsibilities. I don't know if it 14 was, but it possibly was. 15 Q. J Did you ever see the process or where the asbestos 16 friction products were drilled? 17 A. Yes. 18 Q. Did you see dust created? 19 A. No. 20 Q. What did you see? 21 A. I saw a work table -- arc worker operating a drill 22 press and drilling holes in asbestos discs. 23 Q. You saw this person wear a face mask or a respirator? 24 A. Yes. 25 Q. But you saw no dust? arrripatp nFPnnTThin rn Toth 02083