Document 5bvRw37b7VJoVrq8JQxzK73O8

To: From: Sent: Subject: Jackson, RyanOackson.ryan@epa.gov Jay Kramer Fri 9/15/2017 12:32:01 PM Re: September 28 AOA Invitation Ryan, I wanted to follow up on this request. How do things stand? Also, if we wanted to bump him up in the day, would that be possible? We were thinking 11:15 AM - 12:00 PM. As I mentioned, we are flexible, so no problem if not. We will accommodate him. Thanks, Jay On 9/13/17, 1:56 PM, "Jay Kramer" <jay@opportunityus.org> wrote: We're pretty flexible, but would love to have him join between 12:00 PM - 2:00 PM. Thanks for helping on this. On 9/13/17, 1:40 PM, "Jackson, Ryan" <jackson,ryan@epa.gov> wrote: No, I've got it. No problem. I just need to run this through the scheduling because I think the Administrator would like to change his existing travel plans to accommodate this. Do you know when in the day he would speak? From: Jay Kramer [mailto:jay@opportunityus.org] Sent: Wednesday, September 13, 2017 12:55 PM To: Jackson, Ryan <jackson.ryan@epa.gov> Subject: Re: September 28 AOA Invitation Ryan, 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004476-00001 I'm sure you're slammed so I wanted to kick this to the top of your box. Let me know if you need anything else. Thanks, Jay On 9/12/17, 9:24 PM, "Jay Kramer" <jay@opportunityus.org> wrote: Ryan, Per my conversation with Samantha, I'd like to formally extend an invitation for Administrator Pruitt to speak at our upcoming American Opportunity Alliance meeting. The meeting will be on Thursday, September 28 in New York. We plan to gather from 8:30 AM - 4:00 PM and welcome him at any point during this window. We hope that the Administrator could address his role in the administration, the accomplishments to date, as well as his views on the current landscape. Look forward to hearing back from you. Best, Jay Jay Kramer Cell: 913.961.5988 Office: 703.260.7145 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004476-00002 NOTICE: This electronic message (and any other communications or files transmitted with it) are intended solely for the individual or entity to whom they are addressed and may contain proprietary information or information that is otherwise confidential. Accordingly, any unauthorized use, review, disclosure, or distribution of this material is prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error and are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately. Thank you. 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004476-00003 To: Jackson, RyanOackson.ryan@epa.gov] From: Peter Wright Sent: Wed 11/22/2017 2:44:55 PM Subject: Tittabawassee Matter Tittabawassee Dioxin Matter Chronology.docx AOC Public Comment Transcript ><d( dmdf factsheet 200912.pdf dowchemical fs 201007 timelineF 11 .pdf EPA AOC 2 iune-17-presentation-200906.pdf EPA Comments on Revised Dow R1WP Final ADR Confidential Version.pdf Gade Jan 11 Letter-smaller.pdf iune-17-presentation-200906.pdf Kepler March 4 2008 Bodine letter.pdf Letter to Susan Bodine-smaller file size.odf proposed-aoc-fact-shaeet-final.pdf Ryan Attached please find a chronology and and some key documents related to the Tittabawassee and Midland matters (the Tittabawassee River runs through the original Dow Chemical plant in Midland). This would be the most controversial matter and the single most publicly successful matter that I have worked on at Dow. As you will see the high point of the controversy and then the turn around comes at the end of the Bush Administration and beginning of the Obama Administration. I can provide additional details if you think it would be helpful. Separately I will send a list and copy of publications and presentations. Regards, Peter 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004478-00001 1 1 C.S, F1M VI RON M NT AL PROTECTION AGENCY ') REGION 5 4 5 RE: Proposed Seer lenient for the T i I: t a bo was see River & Saginaw River i~\ & Bav Cleanup " " / 7 - PROCEEDINGS HELD in the above-entitled matter on Thursday,- Novend.e i 1 th, 2009 at Saqinaw Valley State 11) University, Curtiss Hall Lagjn w, Michigan. 11 12 APPEARANCES: 1 2 EPA PRESENTERS: 12 RIC H AR D K A R I,, D i r e c t o r S u pe r f u n d D i v i s i o n, ROBERT KAPLAN, Regional Counsel EPA, 12 WEIJDY CARNEY, Program Manager Super fund Division, FRANK RUSWICK, Senior Policy .Advisor MDEQ 1 b 17 I Reported by: Robin Alvis Doan, CSR 56b0 Tri-C j. Ly Cou r t Reporter3, Inc . 1 9 222C IN ate Sire*.. I Saqinaw, Mi "L pan 48603 2 0 (989) 7 92-4712* 21 A 7 7 2? :m ', rj TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00001 "1 3 a g i n a w, H i c h i g a n Thursday, Movember !>?.h, 2009 - 7: G8 p.m. .3 MR. KARL: Welcome everybody and good evening. 4 My name is Rick Karl I'm the director for the Superfund 5 Division at USE?A Region 5. first off we are ail 6 pleased to be here to discuss the proposed settlement / between USEPA, Michigan Department of Environmental a Quality and Dow Chemical. 9 We have assembled a number of our key personnel 10 both from Michigan Department of Environmental Quality 11 and EPA to hear your comments, to outline what's in the 12 proposed settlement and also to answer any questions you 13 may have regarding the proposed settlement. 14 If I could just ask the folks from MDEQ and EPA to 1 5 stand up at; this time so you know who they are. And as 16 you can see there's strength in numbers. And also these 17 are the people that have been responsible to bring 16 forward this proposed set clement and they're here to 19 listen. And I think it's very important for them to be 2 0 here to hear your comments and so I'm very much 21 appreciative that they could ail be here tonight. I want to let you all know that we come here with "'7 '1; an open mind to listen to your thoughts because v/e want 24 to make certain that any pr opposed settlement becomes a "7 l big step forward in accelerating the clean-up here. The TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00002 -3 1 JLc clean-up of Live Tittabawassee River, the Saginaw River, Saginaw Bay and the floodplains. And it's important to us that the sooner we can :] begin r.his work the sooner we may be able to complete 5 this wort. And certainly that helps benefit the D environment, but we believe it's very important to all / the citizens here in the Tri-Cities area. So we're ail H for accelerating this work, moving it forward properly 0 and we1 re hoping this proposed settlement is a way to < o bring that forward and bring it to fruition. 11 Before I go toe far I do want to acknowledge that 12 we have thtee 21 -jt o Representatives here iri the i .J audience. Representative Jeff Kayes is here, Jeff. 14 {Applause.} 1 !:' MR. KARL: State Representative Ken Horn is 1 h here. IV (Applause.) 1 y MR. KARL: And also State Represencstive 19 J:m Stamas is here. 20 (Applause.} MR. KARL: Tonight's agenda is split into I o three different areas, initially you're going to get an o y overview of this proposed settlement. le have both 24 folks from USEPA and from Mi chi gar. Department of 2 5 Environmental Quality that will give you the highlights TRT-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00003 Bi'l/ Replan, I'm t. he '.(.night, j want to f lonal "oun^t-'J at. USE PA Reg i on . n ; t a * ->.j t11 ' things. First 1 . 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ~, j i ED 001523 00004479-00004 December 2008 is when we first announced that we wanted to engage in settlement discussions on what's called an adrnini stra l. Ive order on consent, an AOC. 4 I know that sounds Like a lot of jargon, but the i-i th i.ng to focus on there is the order aspect of it. I 6 think you'll hear throughout: the presentation a proposed -j clea 1, a proposed bargain, whatever else, but the thing B to focus on "here is it is actually an order. 9 And in December 2008 we came out with our proposed 1 0 proposal, it was a model that we intended to use. And 1.1 we shcir ed it W X 11~1 the community members, we s hared not only that but the documents that form the bas i s o f t h O model as 'well. 1A From thereafter fast for;'ward to about February of j. .j 2009. And in February 20C9 there's a new 1 h administration, the administrator wanted to make sure 17 that we're on the right track. Site wanted to do a 18 ready, aim, fire approach and make sure that we were 19 altogether and all doing the right thing. So there have 20 been a number of as she put it false starts, a number of interventions by various regulatory bodies, but we wanted to make sure we got it right this time. So she took a break and said before we go back into the negotiations let's instead take a step back and make n tr. sure we're on the right track. And in March, mid-March 'RI 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production COH FI >orte; ED 001523 00004479-00005 6 I of 2009 a number of us came to Saginaw, a number of us from headquarters as well on behalf of the; administrator *71. to get into discussions with major stakeholders to hear 4 points of view, have an exchange of information. it And that was very reipfut, to all of us to hear all b the points of view. And we took that bad: reported it to the administrator and that resulted in a May 26th, R 200 2 .letter from the administrater to all of you, all Cj community members. As far as the where vie, ore part, 10 that's how we got here and as far as where we are the 11 r is really our road map, those were our marching 12 s so to speak. 1 That' s what sez out wha t we ws re going to 14 late, w h a r. wc a re not going to n egotiate, what 15 stage we are going to engage in and what we are going to lb do. 1 7 So there were seven principles laid out in that ] 8 letter, in that yon know very key letter. And when we went back into the negotiations shortly after issuance 2 0 of that letter that's what we did, we adhered to those 2 3 principies. We came to you in June in this very room, had a 2 3 meeting where we said this is what: we intend to negotiate, this is what we are going to cover in our r. negot iat. ions. T'Rl-CTTY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00006 So one of the efforts was to be transparent and nake sure t:hat everyone knew that this was on ne laid*.', s wes off the tab-le and her g o. S o t h a c' s w h a t. we embarked on as of about Jun So the goals that we announced in the letter and that we t .d :ed about in June are fairly well known, I'll go over them very quickly. First: this is a CERCLA fund, a Superfund settlement using the very well established tools of Superfund when 1 say Superfund 1 mean the statute in CERCLA and all the things that go wish it including the penalty provisions, the stipulated penalty provisions, the enforce merit provisions, all that goes 1J w i t h S u p e i" t u n d . ' a That's what we chose to use. We find it's the most effective, best tool we 'nave in our ;nal in order' to tnahe sure that we hasten clean-ups, that we make sure 1'/ than it's not an undue delay and that we get id; right,. 1 P What did 11 cover? It covered evervtItinq. That1 s W ll 3 C W '3 3 8 i. Cl il was going to cio anq t.hst1 s exac11 y what f: 0 was laid out in the .letter. That this didn11 j us t focus 21 on T ; t tabawas see it. went all the way to the Bay. 2 2 And then the reds a long lengthy thing in thi s last bullet, that w e a 1: b i r " i. a z e .1 R / F S . A r. d basics 11 y that .2 2 ?apt urns what and we'll go or to th51 iater in Wendy Carney' s p t e s e n t a t i, o n . But you'll see that covers TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00007 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00008 9 to that listing, so that puts it ahead as well. And the n last thing is future oversight cost will be paid by Dow. '4 One thing that was very, very important to the 4 administrator, very important to all of us is that we C, had exactly what we're here for tonight, a public cu comment. And that means a full and fair chance for -71 everyone to participate in this. D `/`tj 0 did not sign this document. This is somewhat 9 o i. s t r a r:ae this is 'uneha rocterist i c that Dow would not 10 sign, that we wouldn't sign. This is a completely II unsigned proposal that came out of this negotiation and 12 T u n d e r s c o r e p r o po s a 1, Ire cause it' s s ome t hi .1 n g we're a .11 13 h e re c o c a 1 k a bo u t t o n 1. gh t. 1 A Something that Frank is going to talk about in much 15 greater detail is the RCRA corrective action. We 16 phrased it there that the proposed settlement does not 17 terminate RCPA corrective action. The way to say that 1 S more affirmatively is that those corrective action 19 obligations exist as a matter of law currently and 20 they're not extinguished at all by this agreement. 21 They're reconciled, dovetailed, synthesized and we'll out some neat on those bone s as we go into trie ^ 'k piesen La tions. But th>e original i cl e a was RCRA was going 24 backstop . So RCRA w i J 1. s oi11 exis t and TM D will not be te rminated by this pe r i-oci a n d t h a t1 s e >: a c c 1 y TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00009 10 1 whac1 s -- n the jju'pusa i.. Two things that were not on the table, that are not { at this stage of negotiations first clean-up options. We're at the sampling and array stage right now, array It of options. So we did not negotiate any of the clean-up 6 options in any way, shape or form, that was not on the table, didn't happen. Clean-up levels the same: thing. We heard a lot of controversy around what the appropriate clean~up levels should be, that's something that everyone's going to get: a chance to participate in. It's something that SPA will eventual ly decide: not Dow, But that was, and I u11derscote i:I*.is, not at th i s phase, this was not something that happened now. 15 And before I turn it over I'll just go very, very quickly through the last things that 'were in the 17 proposal. The first what work needs to be done, what 16 still is out there, how do we build on what we already 1 7 hi PA and MDBQ coordination, now that we have two regulators involved we want to make sure we carefully delineate who does what and when arid what sequence. And .> make sure as we talked about consistency in meeting both 24 the RCRA license ana the CERCLA obligations. We cover 2 h these costs uncler the who pays pri,nciple. TRi-ClTV COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00010 11 1 Legal provisions, all the standard provisions are in there that set out. mechanisms among the parties to 3 resolve disputes and so on. And I alluded to earlier 3 the enforcement issue, 1'h 1 s i.s I'll say it again an 5 order and it comes with all the enforcement options that 6 we have in the order under the statute and built into n the proposed agreement. So with that I'd like to turn 3 it over to Wendy who will ta.1 k about the, more in detail 9 aboitt the proposee) deal, 10 MS, CARNEY: I'm Wendy Carney I'm a program 11 manager at: Superfund Region 5. Where. 1 wanted to start v;as to give people a reorientation to some things we 1 3 halted about back in .June. And maybe you had an 19 opportunity to see this slide back then, but if you 15 didn't it would be helpful re kind of understand a 1 6 little bit how the Superfund process works and where we 17 actua 11y are at in the process. 18 For Superfund we are at the very start of the 1 9 taro cess to a certain extent. What that means is we're 2 0 way up here at the beginning of this timeline of 21 activities, that's when our negotiations occur. What we've been actually negotiating with. Dow is the 3 3 activities you see in the blue boxes, the remedial 24 in vestige tion and teasibi.li.ty study process as well as the remedial design component of the Superfund process. TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00011 12 1 There are other steps in the process including what you so(2 in the middle where EPA and DEQ select clean-up options I chink Boh mentioned that we haven't really, u that's not something that's covered in this agreement. 5 And the remedial act ion component is not covered as well O that would be something we wou 1 d need to neq> >ris' > ,, n a separate agreeirent as wo go 1 ei ward. 8 So what does cite settiement cover. One thing I 9 want to make sure peer, I <_ un lor stand is that even though! 10 we from a process standpoint are at the very beginning 11 of the Super fund process: we don't think that we need to start over here. 1 3 There's been a lot of data that's been collected, 1 4 there's been a number of project work that's been 15 o omp 1 e i e d i n t e rm s: o c 1 e a n - u p a c t i. v i t i e 3 t h a t h a v e taken place in the past as well as seine of those that 1 7 are ongoing. In tact if you were at the session before la this Ai talked about some of those projects. And we 1 9 t o 1:3 U i, 1 d on t h a f, t; a k e adva n t age o f the wor k that's 00 dote: and mo ve forv; ard f com th ci S opposed to 21 i ng corn pie t e1v ov6 r. -a T h e a g r eeme n t. v/e h. a ve in pi a c e a 1 s o covers bo t h s, t:ne T11 f aba votes ee R i ve r, t lie S a q innw Riv e r, d e s "he f]oodplain s a s well 3 s S aginaw Bay. So the 2 5 aphi i. c s cope i s t a i r 1 y 1 a r g e / i t1 s a large s ystem TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00012 it,: r. i . .v ,,? 1 ' ;' .'Hi-': r i l '} ; / V: ft . J'llIH. . U .. H d C L .1 V1. t y a jc < -it- i n - -, j 1 j ! ,! i ! j ' "r-riL-r:: rhei. 1 t; ar-<>uc addres.:: j i::j 'Is.'; : w-.- 3 i 1 i !V,:i jij :h j3 i 1 i :-s >i 1 one? the river. 'i IKr VOujci b>~ V"'1!! 1. > ; Op** t 3 1 'V I 'I, k! ' S i -.lent i fi 1 pi ope1 l Leri as well or. you know parks-, [properties that -i i used more- i rravenMy 11 j. n< .* !,e i i. 'Inara's './crt ~no in*. ve>e~nt or wo at we' r i: hiahly ror. rani i s.v, i ! ''"'iari 1 bird s as well a* *; i r ;- ,, !, !' 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00013 14 still do what we' re calling comprehensive clean-up from upstream to downstream in (.he river system itself. The timeline this was something that we had up in 4 June and I think what I want to try to emphasize here G, tor folks is that there's a number of activities that 6 are proposed in the settlement that, 1 talked about the ? critical work activities. And some of those activities 3 begin pretty much s irmulf aneousiy and immediately upon n wp '~J-seti.ve date of the proposed settlement. So v/hat would happen essential ly if this settlement: goes forward is work on addressing high use properties 1.3 a long the rivers and addressing highly contaminated 1 3 sediments will initiate 'within 60 days of the start of 14 the agreement. 15 3,imul tanecus with that work would begin at sort of: ,1 6 upsi:ream portions of the Tittabawassee River deve 1 oping clean~up options for moving that portion of the work forward at the same time. Two tilings to keep in mind the task that relates to 20 addressing high use properties and the movement of 21 contaminated sediments those are site wide tasks. So those occur throughout the river systems they're not ? 1 limited to particular areas of the river systems. 24 And they're designed specifically to try to get in there early in the process, evaluate those problems and Till-CITT C.OUR1 '.PORTE: 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00014 .n J I 1 i t i i -:i m . I : I !! Cl w river rv'M.ijns ut:v.t h-.-jii. in- v I ; \ a i 1 < i , ' i vpv > '11 l n-i : t s , Th ; ` i - I i -ti i - jiii t, i i vv ,u ; ] *; .r I ! I r i;> :'! ; I !>*; j is f i t.-n- :>!l Wrr V! ;;y iii -n '!*!>. tnv ::h:it way was thar "i ;i >.<-] ; n r i.w r r /; l : i .*( .i H : v/` V/ci! it k* 1 v Y.`'; ci O Vu J i L \i t i T V/ o l k j 1 11*.- upp'-t roftions >-i the before wv i theie. 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00015 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00016 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00017 18 1 decision maker in terms of what is appropriate, what ,i s necessary to meet those tederal legal obligations. But i) the hlDEQ retains the final authority to make fundamental decisions about what is necessary to meet the state Jt obligations. h What we1rs doing as T said integrating the license 1 obligat.loirs with the CERCI.A obligations. One of the n. ways to do that is to, we're going to propose a change, a modiftest,ion to the license which again sets forth the ].. 0 legal expectations that the state has with Dow. And li we're going to propose a change to that license which 12 w.i 11 reflect the same sort of arrangement, this 1 3 in tegration that ' s embedded into the AOC. 1 4 The license amendment also includes a very specific ] 5 provision that describes if the DEQ director decides 16 that an action that is going to be taken under the 1 7 Super fund lav; is not sufficient to meet the RCRA. '! 8 obligations. There's a specific description in there 1 H about what steps 'would then be taken to notify Dow of 2 0 the steps that they would need to take under thei.r RCRA 21 The r e a r e s orn e a d ditional p r o v i s i o n s t It a t a r e embedded in the agreement primari. 1 y because we got a 24 number: of act ions that have been going on under the RCRA 7 c, hazardous waste license, we talked about those at the TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00018 19 1 6:00 session for those of you who were there. How we1 re *-} going to transition from sort of a DEQ leading role in J m a k i n g t h o s e d '.a c i s i o n s t o an E PA 1 e a cl i n g role. "Ai And we went through that very specifically on a V sort of action by action basis how t:list was going to 6 occur. So we're looking for a smooth transition so that nf the work is not i rite erupted and we continue to make O progress. 9 We also retain as part of our hazardous waste 10 responsi.b 11 :i ty the authority to require what we cal 1 11 interim response actions. That is if an action is i ? ne certs ary to address an immediate! acute need to protect 1 3 public health and the environment there is authority M under the Hazardous Waste Law to require someone with 15 cortect ive act;ion ob 1 i gations to undet:take immediate 1 6 act ion. 17 The state retains the authority to require that; 18 however, again that same tool is available under the 19 Super fund 1 aw. And so we expect, that if there is an 20 limned s ate need to be me t; it: would be met through actions 21 being undertaken via EPA's role in the adminisr. ration of Superfund. So we retain our authority, but the 2 3 expectation is that that need would be met by EPA's 2 4 authority under die Super fund. 2 5 he have an additional agreement that's appended to TEI-C1TY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00019 20 1 the proposed order which we call, the State Memorandum ot n Agreerr.em or 5MOA. And that's just an agreement between "4 EPA and DEQ that again describes some of these ,1 e p e e l: a t i o n s, t h e p a r r. n e i: s h i p i f y o u w i 1,1 . W h a t o u r 0 roles and responsibilities are in working through this I'l process together. So we thought very hard about the 7 details of how to ma :c s ure that we work in a c o o r d i n a t e d f a s h i on and t h a t ' s described to some extent U In "tie 3 MO A. .1 0 And final! y we ha ve the abi1it y under the o r de r t r> i 1 respond to what? WG C all n cc w r g J g ct s g s * T !i 3 L i s w 0 i u j`i cl o r s t ci n cl z h cs I. a s t; i me qoes on work is going to be 1 3 moving on down the r iver , o k ay. The work to be done is 1 4 going i; rom an upstream to downsr.ream basis . 1 3 And at some point in time we? hope to be done witch 1 6 addressing the contamination on the upstream portions of 1 7 the site, which is a- ijn tent to the Dow Plant site. And 1 8 once the CERCLA process moves down rivci in effect 19 CERCLA is just not go i ng to have a continuing role over 3 0 time up near the plant site. :i ]. If there is a new release there and if there is a '? ? need to address chat release DEQ retains the authority 2 8 under the? order to come to Dow and say you need to 2 4 address chat release under your RCRft obligations. The order does spell out again one of these TRI-CITY COURT REPORTER D 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00020 2 i I1' f'O t.;! rr- it1 1.' .1 T| 1 ' > T !") i !! b' : {IO I O - f, I. f iC [ H't 1 C<i I 3 OV i SOf bv' :t f. too piinun it y to ho', p thorn In thin pro-: and v/i r. In too . 7 work that'a ; 11 ] i i . mm I umlor l.ho proposed I f I I; . In 11 o n a n r c a r ha1 ' ! i ' a 11 '.1' '> : n suppo r t 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00021 *'i n C. < 1 pcirticipate in the review and comment or. the deli vex ah J . that, come in or the documents and reports 3 that come in under this proposed settlement. 4 In addition the Natural Resource Trustees have j ensured that they are still able to continue to pursue 6 their assessment activities for purposes of defining 7 natural resource damages. And to enable themselves to c continue to held Dow accountable for any natural 9 resource damages that they feel is appropriate. 10 The settlement does have a requirement for Dow to 11 pay monetary fines if we find or determine that they are 12 not complying with the terms of the agreement. The 13 amount of the fines range from $500.00 per day to 14 $2,500.00 per day depending on the length arid the time lb of duration of what we call noncornpllance or not being 16 in sort of conforming with the terms of the agreement. 17 The other aspect of this is that Dew is being .18 required to provide financial assurance, financial 19 assurances. That is a monetary mechanism that ensures, 2 0 that ensures the EPA essentially chat they have- 21 sufficient financial resources to complete the work. M '1 The financial dssuiante amount that's in this particular *1 -T se111 ement, is $15 mi 11 ion . 24 So let's see, Frank's going to cover the last slide "5 C J I think. TR7-CTTY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00022 IT) SDLlte ms in in l,h' t >r is whn': o i i i -ns . .life r; f , 11 In i "i cii I i ' i I;.i n=-J ! >! i [.D'iCe.n iich yf iu Imvo in.- ii i ,!. n. ! j .V /i ! l! i /.-.l i`i t Ulj a !V l to. Oil 1 i.r m-hnc. I sm in vnn.k oat r f,(I i f fa no i <.:*;* f I int. w>-.- ; yf! >! .!_ V*- '.l* A 1 uucda 1' i /i h - nr>'.i. : .. uj orri s: i ' I't ' ' 1 i ! 1 ci ... `if 3 i1 i 1. it-' _ id the lity i:t,: ` a de - n i cl i s til v- 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00023 24 1 But we uo hove a process to go all the way up r.o > the RA, regional administrator, and DEQ director to try 3 to work these things out, so that the agencies can stay 4 b And finally another standard provision in orders 6 such as this that is in this order is the agencies are 7 going to be reimbursed Cor our costs. We will incur 3 costs in a dminis t ra tin g the order, in overseeing the 9 work and doing the reviews and. so on. And there are 1 0 provisions in the order by which Dow commits to pay the 11 costs that we incur, staff time and so on. 12 MR. KARL: So what happens next is what I'm 13 going to talk about: very nude fly, -first off tonight we 14 very much encourage public comment on this proposed 15 settlement. We will be accepting oral comments tonight, lb you wi1i have an opportunity to come and present your 17 oral comments. 18 We also have written comments, where you can submit 19 your written comments, the formal comment period is 20 between October 19th and December 17th. The F.PA will 21 consider all the comments along with MDEQ, we will consider them and we will respond to those comments. "i There will be a response in a summary that we will put: 2 3 forward that will respond to the comments that we. do receive. TEi-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00024 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production s PF.P0F-7F ED 001523 00004479-00025 1 handout out at the desk also. We do have site 'd repos.i tor.ies at the libraries in Midland, Bay City and J Sag i.naw. And we have also opened our community information office here in Saginaw at the Saginaw County Courthouse 6 where we staff that office with a community involvement 7 individual. And also we are housing one of our project managers there to be further eyes here in the community, 9 but also to be ir: the community and have easier access .10 to looking over the sites. So we're almost at the question and answer period 12 and Don de Blasio one of our community involvement coordinators is going to go over how we're going to do the question and answer period for this evening. Thanks. MR. de BLASIO: Thank you. If you wouldn't; mind raising your hands we got a couple microphones and 18 we 111 pas s them to the audience. We're not taking 19 comments at t h i, s i .me this is in st for you to ask 20 questions. And we 11, before v/e get to the comment period we'll take a brief break and give you a chance to go out to the desk and sign up on one of these forms. I'm missing, a couple people took these and didn't 24 turn them in. So I'd like to have those back so v/e can keep track of who's going to be spearing because we'll TR]-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00026 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00027 28 I say this because many years ago we had a construction project and digging up Tarvy we found a lot of oil and stuff. And we removed this dirt and you know J got great new dirt coming in to make it, to clean it up. i. At id the new dirt was, it didn't look dirty, but it had 6 the same you know whatever content of poison substances as the old dirt. And when is clean clean enough, c have you decided this, is this taken into account? 9 MS. CARNEY: There's a couple things that I 1 0 would respond to to your question. 1 chink that part of 11 what this settlement does is it has a step in it which 1 .? is you know the development of Che actual clean-up 13 options. it would be at that point in our process vihere 1 4 we are looking at a variety, a number of different 1 5 app r o a c h e s t o clean-up. 1, fi And the purpose cf looking at: a number of different ll' approaches is exactly for the purpose that, where we can 16 look at you know how much the cost is associated with 19 clean-ups, what exactly we can achieve with the clean-up 3 0 options that we have on the table. When T showed you the timeline as well, one of the things that. Is built into the ides of having you know she river system broken down into segments is that as we 2 4 develop clean-up options and we actually implement those 2 5 actions we're able to get real data about how effective TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00028 29 1 our actions can actually be. And then we can work to improve our process and the kinds of clean-up options 3 that we car: bring forward for the site as a whole. 4 THE SPEAKER: And have you taken into account 5 that everybody who iives along the river plus anyone in O this community you know has been polluting, that's, taken n i n t o a c c o u r. 1; a s w e 1 i ? 8 MS. CAEKEY: 'dell, right now we are looking at 9 you know those steps that are needed for finishing the 10 data collection efforts and for developing those 1 clean-up options. There will be a point in time when we will have to consider whether there are other entities 13 or other parlies out there that may have helped 14 contribute to the contamination at the site. 15 THE SPEAKER: Thank you. 1 6 MR. de BLASIO: Had a question over here. 17 THE SPEAKER: This one's just a really simple 18 question. The documentation here as far: sis the comment 19 period it indicates by November 17th on your PowerPoint 2 0 it: said December 17th, so I'd just Jike to pubLicly :'? c1arify which day it is. MS. CARNEY: When we issued the fact sheet we "7) had originally opened the public, comment period for a 30 2 4 day period, so it was originally intended to end on the 2 5 mid November date. So that's why the fact sheet TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00029 30 1 indicates mj cl November. Subsequent to that public comment period opening we 3 did gel. a request from the community to extend the 4 public comment fieri od, which we granted a 30 day 5 extension to it. So the official close of the public fa comment period is December 17th. I believe we ran some / n e v/ s p a pe r a d s r i g hr., Je f f ? 8 MR. KELLEY: Yes. 9 MS. CARNEY: To try to notify folks. !is well ] 0 as 1 think we put it out on the web through our lister 1 ! tunction to try to get people aware that the public 1 4: comment period had been extended. i 3 THE SPEAKER; Yes. I would like to ask the 1 4 following question, 25 years ago I raised the spectra 1 5 (sic) of hazardous waste wel1s that used to dispose of 1 G thousands of tons of hazardous waste. I would like to ( 7 know if those are being monitored or being remediated so 1 8 not to contaminate our aquifers? Something like seven, 1 9 eight, nine of them that were established. 2 0 MR. TAYLOR: The question just to repeat it to make sure I understand it, what is the status of '7 n cl 1 s p o s a j. wells or; h a z a i: d o u s wa s t e i n j e c t i o n we 1 Is - - A**., n3. THE SPEAKER: Yes. 24 MR. TAYLOR: -- at the Dev; Plant site? Have 2 5 we had monitoring ongoing for those historic disposal . EPA - 6/22 Production HE-CITY COURT REPORTERS ED 001523 00004479-00030 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00031 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00032 I extension. MS. HURD-RIDDICK: Michelle Uurd-Riddick made 3 the request to the EPA. And I appreciate you granting 4 us that 30 day extension to review this after our years 3 of being involved in this process, I appreciate it very 6 much. 7 MR. de BLASIO: I ;:hink I saw a question over fi 9 THE SPEAKER: I just wanted to follow-up on 10 the question, I think the first question was asked about, 11 the technical assistance grant, technical assistance 12 grant funds. Apparently I knew that the Lone Tree Council had submitted a r.ews release last week 1 think 14 indicating that they received some funding to help 'with 1 5 the technical review of the settlement. 16 Mow, in the .slides it also showed as part of f i 7 g uess t h e po s t s e 11.1 ema n t a e t i v i. t i. e s t hi a t. ther e w e r e i o going to be additional dollars made available for 1,9 L e c 11 n i c a 1 a s s i s t a n c dan you tell me, I auess I'm a 20 little confused about what dollars a,re available Defers 21 the settlement and what dollars are available after and where those dollars come from? 2 3 MS. CARNEY: Okay. Let me kind of explain 2 2 what exactly is, sort of occurred. There is, there was I i; mads; through a program that EPA has which is called the TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00033 34 1 Technical Assistance Services for Communities Program Funding. For purposes or hiring an independent technical advisor for this time period while we're going 4 through this process doing public comment on this -j pa r r. i c u 1 a r a g r e erne n t, o ha y . When this process is over and ERA you know moves 7 forward or makes a decision on what it's doing with this K sett.1 emenc.. if the settlement goes into place there' s q an actual sort of somewhat different process that would i o then carry that technical assistance for the community i j program kind of forward, okay. 1 2 It `wouid be a little bit or a different process j 2? than the program we're using currently for this time 12 period. It would be direct funding that would come from 1 9 Dow Chemical for purposes of allowing the communitv to 1 6 engage in having an independent technical advisor. 17 THE 3 PEAKE 11: Those funds a re available to 1 7 whomever asks for them or - 1 9 MR. KELLEY: You mean the funds post 2 0 set tlement? 21 THE SPEAKER: Sure. MR. KELLEY: What we, 1 think we were h q discussing this earlier today actually. i mean - 2 4 THE SPEAKER: We didn't. 27 r MR. KELLEY: Not you and me, me and Merriurn TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00034  ; * 1 versus the E;L? Ttv- i r i s j1- f i xclthinp tan ! h v/ a i; ^ v shed super fun cl i ren, atm M:i !; j vii, 11 Prior i t i es List i and who benefits from e:o i t n i i iv.i it; from t.he list? o HP. PUSWIfT: Tin- t~ois. that t;he plant is nut I'-at. i v L the Super furrl at". La I'e- -.vase the plant, t;L. I 1 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00035 ! "'L .iii""* . i - 1 i( >i- w-r wakes rnosi i r ;:>u; I . r , r [PI, : l i. i'io ' :. i e \ IU c;OH:X1) 13 lI'uS 1 1 I 1 ? i /.,*>! know efore she I j'-n t er to th*. eo:tin;i;iJ l.y book ,tn tlay of o<`.` in listing [,ii O',e can bo u l;i:ne consuming it cat! take a i -- i a rime, Givor. where we , t h l 11s p a rk i e u ,, o i' * ~i n i t ;v~` p t e r. s v/e ittei iPt it v.v'.^e '>.Oj UP* U I ' I,a-, 1 4 napp.r ~ ' pr 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00036 . r Tiier i - ; i ns. .-.n: so ur ;R: s >' r j'j :. r z h -j t 1 at i. >_i 1 : >. hi!. t :: i; .s:"J t if swe i M.j . . /'V V'JU '.vci.'il - - ME. KELLEY: i ir;>i -1 n wv'r*s in the or. d s-. u'j'. s (* f i LAM I.eL.'ij convened ; n i. i In i" . / inci 1 think we'll i ;v .-,41 > r. <,,* u i > o' L 31 oi l:r;a i'Ao j dus. n week is ray > hi ; j >. (n n . Aui in ,-ys is ikof in i In- ! uh.'.fe t-chnissl U t ,,'i r `/our 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00037 38 1 months in good faith? "1 M R. KA P LAM: Abs o1u t eiy. 3 THE SPEAKER: Fair question, right? 4 MR. KAPLAN: Fair question. .And we did i; a to s o i u t e 1 y, a r in' s 1 en g fc h a n ci w e d i d n e g ot iat. e i n g ood 6 f: a i l: 11. 7 THE SPEAKER: They probably weren1t always n .smooth, but you had to fight some things out and you came to a .settlement agreement; correct? 13 IdR. K.AFLAM : Abso 1 utely. i 1 THE SPEAKER: So what you're saying today is 12 you got tlsis agreement you' re not going to sign it 1 3 b e e a u s e a r o u s e w i f s, a n u r s e o r h i s I:, o t y p r o f <? s s o i o r M somebody might obi- et to it th.at might have to change 13 t h e a g r e ern e i \ t ? 1 h MR. KAPLAN; We're riot saying exactly that. 1 7 What: we' re .saying is we want, to take public comment and 18 anyone j.r: the room, anyone in the community can give a 19 public comment. What we're saying is we want to make .1 \,i sure we get this right. You know forever and on we make 2 1 sure wed re on the right path, so we want to hear from '2 n everyone that's affected by this agreement. 2 3 THE SPEAKER: You used your professional 21 start, you have people that arc professionals in 2 9 Cleaning up these sites and I assume Dow Chemical TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00038 3 9 1 brought some professionals to it. What from the puhlic comment, I mean what could a housewife add to your discussion to make sure that you got it right? MR. KAPLAN: People are affected by the clean-up and you know we have excellent professional 6 judgment and we have excellent .staff on all of our, at Dow and in-house at EP/\ and DEQ. Sut there are people 8 that are affected directly by this, people that live :) along the river, we want to hear from them. And that's 10 very important to the administration, it's very 1 ",i important tc us. 12 THE SPEAKER; But it would take a precry 13 serious issue to derail this agreement 1 would hope? 14 MR. KAPLAK: I'm not going to prejudge 10 a n ytbin g we'll wait a 1i d s e e. 16 THE SPEAKER: Okay. 1? MS. HUED-RIDDICK: Michelle Hurd-Riddick with the Lone Tree: Council, I'm a housewife and a nurse. Has 19 this site, I know the potential for putting this site on .10 the HPL is there. lias this site been scored so that if, 21 for the N?L so that if you should decide time comes that n o you need to put this site on the I*J?L that we're not 23 going through that discovery phase process and scoring 2 4 and the whole thing? So has the site been scored for n t, the NRL? TRT-CTTY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00039 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00040 41 1 efforts includes the payment of reasonable sums of money' in consideration of access. Are we as property owners 3 then to understand that: we can ask Dow for money to come 4 on our property to do the remedial actions if that. * s required? 6 MB. CAHN: It may, yes it may. '7 MR. do. BLASIO: Jeff oahn, Region Five Office- b region a 1 c o u n s e 1 , c; THE SPEAKER: Well, my suggestion would be 1 0 then that all property owners be made aware of this. 1 1 And that seme sort of guidelines be set up, so that we 12 don't get divided and conquered and some person gets paid $10.00 another person gets paid $10,000.00. So if 14 it's in here 1 think it needs to be worked out a little 1 5 bit further. 16 Down the line here it talks about, says item 57 17 notwithstanding any provision of the settlement 18 agreement USEPA, MDEQ and MDEQ retain all of their 1 9 access authorities and rights. Mow, this document has 2 0 62 pages of rights and responsibilities for Dow Chemical, EPA and MDEQ and I'd like to know what the '6 '} riqhts of the property owners are in this situation? 2 3 Do we have any or are you folks going to come lie re 2 4 and just claim eminent: domain or some sort of Superfund .( powers and do what yon want on our property? TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00041 42 1 MR, CAHH: This statute does provide the feeler a: government or EPA with authority to request voluntary access. And in some situations depending on '5 the facts we can obtain a warrant from a court which C, provides the property owner with due process to object 6 to the wa r: t:a nt. We also nave statutory authority under Signer fund to compel access, to require someone to allow us on their property. And if they continue to refuse it allows us to go into court to enforce the order and potentially seek penalties against the properly owners. Some of these things are very unlikely. It's our 13 expectation that the property owners would corns to 13 agreements with the company to allow the company to do 1.5 whatever samp!ing or other work is agreed to in the 1 o future. So some of it is a little bit speculative. 17 T H E S R E A i\ t. k : X a cj r & & . 1 o MR. CAHN: And right now eminent, domain is not 1 9 on the table. What we're really looking at is sampling 2 0 not taking property from property owners. '1 ^ THE SPEAKER: All right. Moving down to the statement of work real quick. And we may be getting 2 3 ahead because I know a lot of these important things to property owners haven't boon development yet based on tiie b a s i s o f s t u d i e s. TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00042 r 1 f , if oo wo por" of toe- ri -'Oi:. my qu^idon on L. 1 i a \ ) z w n 11 r! a *v ij* *-r x<-m-.o i a i actions jro Oovolopeci ah loroioit ot the <:<"irri i nci i nvest iqations i\ v,r.-. rj,-> j np rr hai'o nvoi.v* ir.*"' <' It i ro.jn j ; Ko this whet e v;o r IS F, i : T hi-- i r vO i : , 0 0 , _ i. 1 0 -a to,' i . 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production i'Zi . r il': ED 001523 00004479-00043 1 preferrod option, the option that we think we should select out there. But there is an opportunity for the -V pub!ie to comment. 4 There's also something to keep in mind here which i; is that, you know as Jelf Kelley had mentioned - wave c Jeff - we're in tine end stages of develop! ng a comma n i l y advisory group. And one of the powerful parts of having H that particular group formed in this community is that 9 they can he]p with the process of developing those 10 oi r-rnatives and g i. ve input to Ur- ug-~rcy about what: the 1 1 c o n c 0 ir n s may foe by varicius segments or inhere St groups 19 n Lli0 comr.u n i r. y - -1 'i-i THE SP EAltF: Ercra a personal per speed. ive I'm 14 a lit;;! e skeptic a 1 of community involvement. I 1 11 give 3 b you one exampi eg I dro < `'ey miles to attend t h i s 1 6 m> *- ` . ' icj . When T w<ant to the Saginaw library it took me 17 1 5 m i 11 u t: e s t c> f i nd the proposal and as fax as t h ey were 18 concerned I was the first person that looked at. it. So 1 9 I'n! a little you know .skeptical when 1 hear the 2 0 communi t y1 s going to become invoived and give you ail 1 21 this he 1p . M y ]. a s 1: cj u e s f; i o n i s a g e n e r a 1 o n e a n d i t * s b a s e d o n -> 'it your experience, DEQ and EPA with these types of 2 4 remedialions how successful do you think that you really r. :i can be in cleaning up this river? It seems like an TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00044 45 1 impossible task with you know 50 years worth of pollution and the stuff so deep in the soil. o MS, CARNEY: This site is not, you know EFA |UA: htis been working on a number of sites that are of :) similar site and complexity across the country, EPA 6 Region 5 we currently 'work on the Fox River which is 7 actually in the latter stages of actual clean-up o activity. We are doing some work on the Kalamazoo 9 River, we had several actions taken up there. We've 10 also done extensive, a relatively extensive clean-up or: i the Pine River in the river system itself. 12 Id;'s not an easy task it takes time. The problems 1 3-n are comp-lex, it takes a lot of work to get; a clean-up to 1-1 happen, but 1 don't think it's impossible. I think 15 people need to stick with it and we need to basically 16 try and develop the best options that we can given the 17 ci rcurtistancss, the information that's avaliable and the 1B so.1 ence that.'s out there. 1 9 There are limitations to what you can do, but I 2 0 think we you know try to do the best, we can essentially 21 with the tools we have available to us. THE SPEAKER: Thank you. 2 3 MR. de BLASIO: We'll take two more questions, 2 4 one over here then get ready to Lake a break. 1 ~j THE SPEAKER.: Yes. I would like to know the TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00045 46 following, the site is unknown to me as to what you're cal Sing the site specifically. If you mean the river only or are you talking about those regions that: are 4 contaminated to the river. For example the Rockwell r-.j Landfill hazardous waste site which is known as AJ (ph) 6 over the years. 7 M3. CARNEY: The scope of this particular, the 0r't site that we're talking about tonight is the 9 Tittahawassee River, the Saginaw River and Saginaw Bay 10 and the floodplain areas that have been impacted by 1 1 those rivers. It does not include as I think we i mentioned earlj er it does not include the Midland plant 13 site itself which the state is continuing or the City of 14 Midland soils, that's a part of work that Dow is also 15 do i rig. 16 THE SPEAKER: Well, I'm talking about the 1.7 P o c kw e 11 L a n d f ill. 1 0 MR. TAYLOR: The Rockwel1 Landfill is 1 9 continuing to be addressed under the state, it's not 2 0 under the hazardous waste operating license it's under a i different program. It is not part of either the Midland site or the Midland soils issue or the super or CERCLA .'.>. i.j site on the: river, but it is under a different program. And It lias active AJ (ph) col lection. And that material 2 5 is transferred over to Dow for treatment. TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00046 47 1 THE SPEAKER: Thank you, MR. do BLAS10: Last question over here. THE SPEAKER: Yes, it's about the advisory 4 group. Iky question is is when they're formed I'm r; .assuming it's going to be a good cross-section of the b community. And by being a cross-sectior: of the community and looking at some of these issues are they 8 going to have a chance to look at some of the requests C| of "commonity". 10 And see if they agree that this avenue is 11 worthwhile doing or because there's been some feelings that people under the community banner is got an agenda 13 and are trying to run, some of this stuff. 1A And T would think that the technical or your 15 commurd t; y action group would be the one if you did it 16 and I assume you did. To represent the whole community, 17 so it's not a relationship that you may or may not have 13 or the state may or may not have with a specific group. 1 9 MR. KELLEY: Well, I think part of your 20 question ox maybe all of your question Is will this 21 advisory group become sort of our main Interface with the community? 2 3 THE SPEAKER; Yes. 2 4 MR. KELLEY: And that's the goal is that this 7 n advisory group will represent all the different TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00047 n v i' ,, ! r a r/.) j l < iri.i fivi I nu<- , 1 [.< iinp:) ' IV: Iiz-Kt'i ' -' . r LI, l Ol !( 'll a r u! i .1. arid r r.s- -...) i r a k ~ - a >/ a v i s E 7 > did n c< t i l r . u ?: l ? '.it ai,.r !>> i i* w : 111 < , >..r, dif s v .'lit persprv; ive? i.h.-it id / I)' ,1 1 'UK. in : 11 -1 t-her. j >iV t-j-j.'- !. y i11.| I,'1 oo I t...> v r, <.u it ' li-y 1 t ''.-.i i i, ; : . 1 , S: ii.t . 1 : i a-' hope i r W'trki; and L1 j-- W8y I ; i.i i: I cl nop<",:i vc-il. it v/< v hr t '!>. ,td".i:-*r j1'/ p i - >,c 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00048 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA- 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00049 p r P - r.'rr p . - - , * - a i ii *1 \t t* H . , , j. .. ?t 1 .? t ` i i , 1 % , { ' i_, i / 1 i ............. ....... ,, i. ...... ' 1 ci re area * . 7~7 EE 7 : !7 " f" h #a- f*'"" H fZ T* -s::-: cc. roo old give toe Phi 5 i r ~ ; / o i - ,>: !' \Z L PrLPPPPP; i -- -h-:' no sente :r 1-iP . irEIlEY: ; . i * iPP . uo BLAB i (>: '1 i ;,) n ?. you, Wo1 11 memento- ri 1 y tv a Liny a fc tor ci k . i V.'Ctlit. L: < fji> 11 o i i 1: you want too 0 pUlT'] 0 e coiiHiio-iv. ! v.ouil you c o ud-in jp at the t a hi o ..ii iri.Mil. Ye ' i 1 1.-;. v cl I. L 1 r I L r 1 it, chey'r 2 nur^hcrod V. A: :,! liter r:i~m in nuro-iiv il iOvt-r. : t v; i 1 J DO ; i T 7 f ir.co , - i .f.-i ip if you hover: ' c .1: ... 1 i . I 1 l i 7/ 2. _ 2 2 2 1 *f. 1 ^ ed to thra r :fo; v* ** y~ - ; -j r p . , - ; ', ~ * 1' 2 l .. - p - /-* { - , -t - - 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00050 51 1 will be recording the comments and we will be posting these comments later on when we get the transcript. J We'1} need you to state your name and affiliation if 4 you're commenting on behalf of an organisation. I" We'll have a 10 minute break and then we'll do the 6 comment period. Please sign up if you're interested in 7 nia k ing cornments, it' s 8 : 30 . 8 (Whereupon a recess was taken.) 9 MR, de BI.ASIO: The first person I've get is 10 C a r o 1 C h i s h o ]. m. 11 MS. CHISHOLM: Pass. 12 MR. do BLAS10: Thank you. Eldon Graham. 13 MR. GRAHAM: My name is Eldon Graham and I'm a 14 !_ it c-voo t here at Saginaw Valley State University. And 15 I want: to talk about this provision of community groups 16 being able to get technical assistance to review the 17 Dcw/EPA ag teemeet. 18 I represent a group of area professionals and we 19 would like to formally request technical assistance- in 20 the form of a disinterested third party to review the :: i EPA/Dow agreement. And we third: that, technical assistance should be in the form of an examination of the EPA/Dow agreement from 2 A an environmental engineering standpoint. And clone by an r,. environmental engineering company or engineering Tp. 1-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00051 1 C O! l S U 1 r; a n . t h Zj -f' h a s n o preconceive n o r t h 3 o 11 ser. We' o 1 ike an indepe 2 arci m Y d tvX3p would fo rma i .1 y r i ke t 9 yoi S THE S PBAKER : We c ouldn' 6 MR. d e BLAS 10: He s aid, "7 go a h ead repe at i t b r i e f 1 y. K MR . o FLA HAM: Want me t o 9 t o th sin 1 * -t in fz t cl 1 X t. o you, okay. T tallied 1 0 E1 c Ion Gral '.am. i ' rn a p rofesso r here 11 S t, cite Uni' ^ers i t y a r; cl a membe r of a n 12 i: h i s top i t; o f 3 rea pr ofessIona1s. 0 Id c .us tl I'i 0 S U D c t o t tills te chnica conCTunxty groups. 15 And our group would 1ibe to formally request that lb another consultant be engaged to look at this from an environnental eng ineer:ng standpoint. Either a 18 consulting firm or an engineer with experience in that 19 field that is a disinterested third party. And has no biases on the issue on one si.de or the other and to giv* us an independent analysis of this agreement. MR. tie BLASIO: Thank von. Number three, Lori Franson. Till MR. cle BLASIO: Number four, Ruth Aver ill. TRI-CITY COURT REPORTER: 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00052 !! ;' c 1_ -1 1 I. i- I' , 1,, 1 1 1 v/Ish 1 i', i yon, for i.. i k i ti>;i cueh an acf _ vo i :tI, o res t in on r r r :ii* ec- z:a i . > i - i '.ii, n 'i i ft.j suppr, i i, i n r 1 .`i ! , , i I ' : i ecu roL :nyl .ri>ioy -j11 r-, 1 rnmu:'! i ;as. i .<!. wi t no '(' ir i 0 1. - 0; 11 ! ;01,C oxo. be T i-- i - I 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production f.'PT PEPOt-.TEP:- ED 001523 00004479-00053 54 -L followed. Participated in the process being set forth '-t by these EPA representatives and complied in accordance 3 with the ru 1 es presen Led. 3 It was only when I happen end to see a blurb on the 5 second page of he EPA ' s four page newsletter that my C faith in this process dwindled. The news1st ter ~1 i indicesced that technical assistance services would be o provided to the Lone Tree Council whose membership according to Terry Miller consists of approximately 60 1 0 persons. 1 I This was disheartening as a resource inquiry I had 12 made earlier was denied followed with information 1, 3 indicating that only the CkG once established was 1 4 eligible to receive resources. Additionally it 'was only 1 5 after 1 made a telephone call contact to express my 16 disappoint me n z that the following announcement -was made 1 7 clearly to those participating with the e-mail contact 1H program. 1 9 That announcemenl indicated that technical 2 0 assistance, the EPA is using its technical assistance 21 services for community programs to provide independent ;i > technical assistance to the Lone Tree Council and other community groups during review of the proposed 24 set l: .1 ement. 2 3 Environmental consultant Peter; Defur has been hired TFa-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00054 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00055 56 1 citizens including the minority groups found within the community and is the official disseminator of 3 communities in partnership with EPA. You are encouraged to avoid undermining the 6 authority of the CAO. by directing resources to minority 6 groups. Your department's actions will determine the 7 / level of confidence partfcipants will possess in this fj process. M My desi re a5 a new member of CAG is to support you 1 0 the EPA and help facilitate the clcari-up process on 11 behalf of the Saginaw Bay watershed environment. It is 12 r. ime to move the dioxin and furan clean-up issue forward 13 and to its end. Our region desires to have this issue 1 ) behind us to the final satisfaction of the USEPA, 1 5 M i o 11. i, u i KQ, :)N R anid a 11 o t he r pa r L i es ir:vo.1 ved . Tha n k 1.6 you. 13 MR. de BLASIO: State your name. IB MS. PUMMEL: My name is Annette Hummel and I'm 19 `die CEO of the Great Lakes Bay Regional Convention & 20 Visitors Bureau and I appt-r,,df , cur time, thank you. 21 MR. de BLAS.IO: Thank you. That did go a little bit long. MS. PUMMEL: Sorry. 24 MR, de BLASIO: Lumber six, Curt Tucker. ", rr. M R. TUCK E R: I'm ooing to yicid my time t o TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00056 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00057 tlia l - Over the years 1 don't think the home owners concerns have been addressed. I feel since this process has gone on it's only, in 4 all government the bureaucracy that goes with: it has n. only slowed it down even more. 6 We recently had our' property logged to pay off some 7 h i g n li e a.ting bi 11 s and the paths that: were t htf: tr when W Q nought t ho home were opened up. And we1ve B. 5 kftfl them t; o O, come back and take care of t:hem, cover them up Sris we c:an ] c use the lower land. Wow that my boys cite 1 5 and 1? 1 o` V 0 11 fishing, want: to hunt, want to be able to use the 12 property the way we envisioned it. 13 So 1 am concerned that all this bureaucracy and M 0 ^0 i: y thino1 t It a I..' s qon e on o ver h he last 10 year s has not. 1 f> J, oo ke j out for t he home o wn e r s i rite rest on the r x v e r . 1 6 I 1 ) Cl 1 i k you. 1 / HR. de pj p% C] 10: T i i a n k you. Numb ar ei ght, 13 Pa r y Col op>y * ] 9 . HR, rOLOPV; 1 ' 1.1 l S ? ,,`~j, (0',` MR. de BLAS 10: M timbe r nine, Dav id Ri del i. c k. 2 1 MR. RI DDICK : 1 P ri ,z f> . MR. de BLAS 10: N umbe t: 10, Hike k e 11 v. MR. KE IIY : Mik e K 0 X1 v , I ' rn a re si den r. o f 24 Fre ... and. And 1 use s g t h e re cor cl shows ih ct I am p ro h O U s o w i f e, pro n itrse, pro h i s tor y teacher and p i:o TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00058 anybody that wants to have an opportunity to make a e o mm e n t o n t h i s d o c u rr, e n t. You know I've been to, I don't know how long this process has been going on it scares me to think about, in. i bet I've been to 30 meetings. Terry, how many meet Lags have you attended, I've been to as many as you? THE SPKAKER: Many years of meetings. 11P.. KELI..Y: Many years of meet!nqs. And f rankly it's net a lot of fun a n y mo re . YOU k now they a,iways s oem to takev p j a c e d u r i r.g rh e week a n (j go 1 a t e i!to the e v e n 1 n cj s . And 1 w a n t. to I: ha nk the ii PA 1 n P'a i: L i.cul at and Dow r. i i errn c.a 1 t o o f s i r t hi e i r a bi - - V J t o cijine tog ether and fnut toge ther 1 Lhi j. n k what t hey fid V6 d* -r outlined at <. a.v at this point: is an agreement that is going to work out. 'well I think going t n ward. And I appreciato the time that they've expended in that px ocess And I think for the first time I think tlmio'i- a ! i ghi -it the; end of the ; i.tv I >'re and I would encourage- folks to not deiay at r.his point, 1 think we' re moving in the right: direction and let's keep that momentum going, so we can t;: orn e b a c k t o g e t In e r and calk a 1 u C 1e s s .In these rn eatings a)')o u t pro c e s s a n cl a 1o t more about act;J.on in tine f u sure.. a o that. % S ail 1 have to IF;I -CITY COURT REPORTERS - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00059 OO MR. cle BLASIO: Thank you. Number 11 , Bet: By Da mo re . MS. DA.HOEB: I pass. MR, cle BI.A3IO: Thank you. Number 12, ScoLB MaCnulley. MR. MaCAULLEY: Scott MaCsulley, I'm a property owner along the TiLtabawassee River, have been for years. I guess I agree with the gentleman that 1 n spoke earlier that the property ov/nors ra j! on aren't .1. i being ad'h- ou-d. 12 I see a 1ot of governmental organizations and 12 pi; i veto organizations all fighting over how this is 11 going to be clone and I don't think the input or the 1 2 property owners who are directly affected are being well ] (i address see!. 1'/ So I guess you know when you have your CAG I r.h.i nk 1P property owners should be;- represented in that crowd, you 1 know whatever agendas. I know there's pres and cor.s ") p a b o 1.11 w h a t:'s be e 1i g o i n g o n o n t h e r i ver, b u tit h i n k 2 1 that property owners should have a say in what's going on. Because it would, what they've done up at Dow 24 totally denuded rhe river it. would be a shame to have c, that, happen all the way up and down the river. So TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00060 61 chat's all I got to say. MR. de BLAS 10: Thank you. Number 13, 3 Ron Thurlow. 4 MR. T H U RLOW: I'll pass. o MR. de BLAB10; Passes. Muirber 14, 6 Peter Detur. 7 HR. DEFUR: My name is Peter Defur, 8 Environmental Stewardship Contact, I'm that technical b assistant: eve r ybo cl y 1 s b e e n t: a I k L n g about all n i g h t. A n d ] 0 ir: fact ray office is the one tha:: produced this fact 11 sheet under the previsions of the EPA 'Technical Services 12 f o r C oiriii (unities. U I was asked to prepare a fact sheet basically that 14 veent beyond what EPA because EPA did a good job about 15 suianiariting basically what1 s in the agreed order as 16 you've heard this evening, it's written out. f was 17 asked to identify areas that might be of concern for you l 8 the citizens that you might want to think about in your 19 c omme nt s to E PA. 20 i'm not promoting any of them, I'm not retracting - any of their, these are areas that you 'want to think about very carefully in writing your responses which I 2 3 hope you all respond to EP.A. And I'm not going to 2 4 repeat them. it includes some procedural elements, 2 5 instructional elements of the agreement, exactly who's TRI-CITY COURT REPORTER. . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00061 62 doing wlial and you want to know that, that's the way you want it to be done. It also has a very important issue and that is public involvement. T think it needs to be very clearly spe' ied our. in the agreement that the requirements of 6 Super fund, that is OT.RCLA are not the only way which 1 public invol ve-ment will occur. 6 That is quarterly meetings or monthly meetings with 9 you the public to give- you information about the nature 1 u or tiie pro iect;, t he next steps, do you want to have : i technical meetings with various l<-di esencatives, people i- in the community. These are not required under 13 Super fund, but they may be conducted. t: 'Ai i can tell you over the two dozen projects that i. I' ve 'worked on across the country some of them do that 1 b regularly. They lie Id quarterly update meetings at 1 7 3 u p e riund sites. Ifi And they have the stare and federal agencies, 1 9 because they ' re cooperating in some of these sd-^e, they 20 come in and talk about the technicalities of what 'O '] -- J_ they've been doing. Problems they're having, how they're trying to address those and what they're going e '} j. -3 to do next. Those car. be and 1 think they would be wise 2 4 to add them into the agreed order. There ore also various elements that I'm looking TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00062 63 1 at, I have four pages of technical comments that will go to the Lone Tree Council which is the recipient of this task funding at the present time. And they include such 1 questions as what is the intent of the Bio Data (ph) rj. Sampling Program. i think it's best if that's spelled b out not in a lengthy addition to the agreed order, but 7 in a sentence or two. o Second of a11 you want to make sure chat the agreed 9 order appropriately identifies sampling than will 10 address risks to children. find not just children who 11 are four and five years old, but: children who are 12 newborn and pregnant women, so those risks need to be 13 identified. M You also need to make sure that community risks 1 5 which are cumulative risks are identified and examined 16 in the investigation that goes on in the future and that 17 will be the next steps. 18 This cumulative risk for communities is one of the 19 areas chat 2PA has been working on for the last at least 2 0 five years. And they've developed initial guidance on 21 how to do it. And it accounts for such matters as the psychosocial impact of having contaminat'd on in your: hack .j yard or community. And the cumulative affects of not 2 4 just one or two or In this particular case a suite of ? r; chemicals, but a combination of more than 200 chemicals. IF. I - CITY COURT RE PORT BPS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00063 64 i These are not easy questions to address, bur. there are way3 that you can begin to address them. I want to 3 thank you and I will be around afterwards to have this -1 discussion with other members of the community. MR. de B1.AS10; Thank you. Before we go on I rO~ want to i* era in cl everybody that public comment is not the 7 only way to express your opinions on this. There are 8 sheets in the lobby where you can fill out, there are * s also sheets, there's information on the back of the 10 agenda where you can send your information by mail, fax i 1 or e-mail.. So some people don't like to stand up and 12 ta 1 k, so that's a way for you to make your opinions 13 heard. Humber 15, Leonard heiseman, 14 MR. HE15LMAM: I'm a property owner on the Id Tittabawassee River. Couple of these items have already 16 been covered during the question and answer period just 17 a couple of things for the record. Now that vie've moved i 8 into the public comment portion of this agreement coup'Ie 1 9 things that have been bothering me that I heard and 20 people nave made comments on. 21 And it's become more than apparent to a lot of people that the Lone Tree Council is in an advantageous position and able to direct the EPA towards decisions 24 favorable to their mindset on this issue. 2 b Couple of examples have surfaced lately such as the TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00064 65 1 inclusion of a Mr. Peter Bag ley, I believe, to the CA.G selection commit tee because Lone Tree objected to the J initial make-up of the comm. t I <>o. This after the EPA. 4 specifically stated the committee would be made up of b five members only. b hie if.* r item the issue of technical support: that 1 a *"/? been discussed repeatedly throughout this meeting. That H the EPA, was so willing to support and immediately granted funds to secure an expert to review the 10 agreement.. This wo s done for Lone Tree we're still 11 waiting to find our what ether community groups were 12 included. Tonight we find cut that there's probatiy 13 going to be more community groups trying to get 13 included. 15 Arid were any actual property owners or people 1 6 living j r. the :A Lee ted areas given i h i v type of support. 17 This was brought, up also why was the 30 day public 1.5 comment period lengthened to 60 days, v/e already know it 1 7 was at the request of Lone Tree. 2 0 And I say it. isn't that. Lone Tree folks shouldn' t 21 have your say into tints very divisive issue, but these three examples are just a small snapshot of the self .... ..j aggregation they bring to the table. 24 This issue must move along expediently, fairly and 25 open to all it.Lei .oi-.d part its, The EPA is not letting TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00065 1 t hi s ha ppe n wi~ an 6 _et t '.rig r t he Lor: e T r: e 0 Co 3 p ') 000 o I nvj b jest concern: this pt:ocess moves 5 1 n r w d rc t h a t t he {; i 1: s elf ben orn o ro a.? a comrriu n i t y mu s 1: put this i s s u e beh :i nica u , 1 only hope that the EPA is able to compose the is mission and remove themselves from our area and not leave us divided and wondering if we just via r, k ed money II e been better spen t i : Thank you. Hu rnb> ick Hay 14 MR, MAYES: I'1l1l1 paassss.. L '-J ' * P. 1l-k. I"1 cl V_ 0 S ,,On s s e Number 1Y 1b looks like Samuel Shokleeyy.. 1 7 DR. SHAKE Sti a been. I H MR. de BL. : Shaheon, o h, 1' m ] 0 Sainue 1 S ha been . ... S~ am Shaheen. 1- ' ve *.ved in this process sine 'he beg'inni'ng. 1'` ve ' ~ ?31 u *:i y , I' m a c h ert, i s t major, I'm a physic practiced in rlvis ax for over 50 .y. 'ea rs. we're going about tills completely wrong. The gentleman from the university that discussed putting in some TRT-CITY COURT REPORT; 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00066 67 1 unbiased consultation 1 agree with 100 percent. I have yet to find erne person that I can directly 5 pinpoint: any disease process specific Co furans or dioxins arid i ' ve practiced continually for 50 years. i; So I have one qust. ion, the question is geared J 6 0 w n m u ] r i p 1 e p r o p e r t i e s o i1 c. h e T i 11 a b a v: a s a e e R i v e r, A n <1 7 1 don't want that property diluted like they diluted the 8 property on the river down there. Nov;, is there any, 1 really need to know do 1 need 10 an attorney, do I need court action, what do I do to 11 prevent that from happening were it to happen? They're 12 not going to take trie trees, the soil and the beauty 1 3 away fron the river; that truly belongs there. 13 MR. de BLASIO: Number 18 card is missing, so 15 move or; to number 19, Vincent Castellanos. 16 MR. CASTELLANOS: My name is 17 Vincenr Castellanos I'm an adjunct professor here at I o Saginaw Valley as v/ell as at Delta College. I have: an 19 undergraduatc degree, bachelors of science degree from 2 0 Saginaw Valley as v/ell as a masters from Central Michigan. And so I've been in this process since 1984 -~i '"i and only recently because os some illness 1 haven't been abie to participut-, 1 hope you bear with me here. 2 4 I'd like to congratulate Dow Chemical and ERA on 2 b coming to this resolution, 1 know it's not finalized, TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00067 68 1 but it's getting there. It's very important that we do finaiize lhis agreement. Mow, I do have maps that show the contain!nation of Lhis area and will be wi 11,ing to shar:e those with Lhe 5 EPA as they should see tit and this community council to b be of interest: to those neaps. Because T feel that: if we 7 are going to have a site specific issue it should Q include all the sites that 'went into the river as we 11. 9 And I wo it .id like to share v/ith everyone that I 1 0 appreciate this opportunity. Right now I'm dealing with 1 1 Parkinson's it takes me awhile to move, but I will get *1 ? there. Thank you. HR. de BLASiO: Thank you. These are all the cards that 2 have for people who registered, is there anybody else who 'wants to make a comment? 1 fi MS. HENRY: My name is Kathy Henry, K-a-t-h-y, 1 7 H - e - n - r - y. 1 ' rr. a f o r rn e r r e s i cl one of t h e Tittaba w a s s e c -i p River also associated v/ith the Tittabawassee River watch 1 9 group. And I just wanted to address the concerns that a 2 0 couple of the property owners had about the EPA coming 21 in and denuding their properties of /ail the trees, vegeta t. ion. .. 'J I think if they were to take a drive over to 2 -I Riverside Boulevard and take a look at the clean-up that j. j EPA d id last tear they would find that EPA did leave TRI-CITY COURT REPORTER: 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00068 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00069 70 vii r.h you. But one of the things I think is really important to consider at all times is to look at the science, to look at the data and not respond purely 4 emotionally to the issue. 5 There certainly are emotional issues associated fa with people who have lived with this for a decade or 7 whatever. But we need to be very careful that vie look ac this rationally and objectively and consider the 9 science, the data and deal with the problem in a 10 so i err.. L f i.c, rational way. Thank you. i MB. de BLAS10: Thank you. Any other 12 nommen r. s ? 13 MR. TUCKER: I was going to yield, but I'd 1 ~i like to come up and speak. Curt Tucker, Curt C-u-r-t, 15 T-u-c-k-e-r. And J grew up in Section 19 of Saginaw 1 6 Township which is between State and Gratiot, about: midway 17 on Midland Road on the west: side, so it'd be the river 18 side of the road. 19 My grandparents bought their farm which I grew up: 2 0 on in 1919 after World War T. At which time of course ^ x-1 my aunts and uncles, grandparents, myself, my brothers o o and sisters we all grew up hunting and fishing and playing it: the water in the Tittabawassee. You know tney've all died at you know the ages that were expected 25 to, their seventies and eighties. Mo cancers, we happen IRI-Cir OU r\ a ; PORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00070 71 1 to be lucky L think. *> You know I do know that during that time our i grandparents always warned about spending too much time 4 in the water. It. was interesting that it never froze 5 over and we couldn't fish out of it. But today the 6 river freec.es over, there's a fishing tournament that is 7 just assume that takes place every year, you can eat the 8 fish oi.it or there. 9 You know Dow 1 think, 1 have to applaud them, 10 they are really giving it their all to get this 11 situation remedied. And I appreciate the SPA, MDEQ, the 12 Lone Tree and ail the residents. I mean this is America 13 other countries don't have this opportunity to go back 11 and forth they're just very one-sided. 15 So let's go further, let's get this resolved. And 16 do it in a, I tliink Doc Shaheen and the professor from 17 Saginaw Valley, an independent study, somebody that's 1 6 totally unrelated, not paid, have any interest ir; 11. 19 I wotted at a material test laboratory for nine 20 years of my career, I'm a business owner 20 years now in 21 Saginaw. But nonbias, independent laboratory is the way to go, so. But. thanks for, everybody here si lows that we really 2 4 care about Saginaw. I had lived in Florida, I lived in 2 5 Californio, but my heart was still in Saginaw. So I TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00071 1 1 1 Hi / !.' c 5 i Vi e ; 'f o r k ;. -- 1 > on t * lu . j so t tar - o o sot ' tt-y i.a `I to hnv-', a: - .-..o i to cool tr:e ju (onent at Leu, .-`.no tie v u ' i won no `onejor usca d Iren::: , y to coo) i. her, we 1.1, ii won uiuuJ but then it hod ( s i coo; o 11 Dot ore they pot it; into the river. So Lisah Bo t when v/c- t. i r rh. :uio'0',l hU'ip which is a 1 cncj tin-t i !, ' r ir ~ -,err. io--..I t ; t'.vs1 ; t t r ,, ver o j_ 1 t ne f. Lire . 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production i t ED 001523 00004479-00072 73 will not do things on their own unless they are supervised soiaetimes cr encouraged to make some of these changes. So 1 am happy that; the EPA is encouraging Dow 4 to make some more changes like they did on one thermal 5 pollution studies now we have to clean up these pollution studies. Thank you. MR. de BLAS10: Thank you. Any other comments? Mo more comments? I want to remind everyone S once more you still have the chance to mail In by 10 December 17th any comments that you have. 11 Having heard all comments from all those present 12 we'11 declare this meeting adjourned, thank you. 1 3 (Proceedings concluded at 9:15 p.m.) i-i Id 1 b "! 7 18 1 0 2 0 21 O TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS 17cv1906 Sierra Club v. EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00073 7 4 i STATE OF PITCH JGAH C.OUNTY OF SARIKMl 4 5 lo / h o 1 certify that this transcript, consisting of 10 73 pages, is a complete, true, and correct record of the 11 proceedings held on November 5th, 2009, 10 1 3 I also certify that. I am neither counsel for 14 nor related to any party to said action nor in any way 10 interestsd in the outcorne thereof. 16 1 7 13 j a ygo6v, a- 2 0 Robin Alvis Doan, CSR 5650 Notary Public, Saginaw County 2 1 by Commission Expires 2-20-13 7 '1 24 '-t r* TRI-CITY COURT REPORTERS . EPA - 6/22 Production ED 001523 00004479-00074